View Full Version : Licensed Aku No Hana (Flowers of Evil)
http://natalie.mu/comic/news/74136
I vaguely remember reading about the manga and it looked interesting...looking forward to the anime.
Plot (from MAL)
Kasuga Takao is a boy who loves reading books, particularly Baudelaire's Les Fleurs du Mal. A girl at his school, Saeki Nanako, is his muse and his Venus, and he admires her from a distance. One day, he forgets his copy of Les Fleurs du Mal in the classroom and runs back alone to pick it up. In the classroom, he finds not only his book, but Saeki's gym uniform. On a mad impulse, he steals it.
Now everyone knows 'some pervert' stole Saeki's uniform, and Kasuga is dying with shame and guilt. Furthermore, the weird, creepy, and friendless girl of the class, Nakamura, saw him take the uniform. Instead of revealing it was him, she recognizes his kindred deviant spirit and uses her knowledge to take control of his life. Will it be possible for Kasuga to get closer to Saeki, despite Nakamura's meddling and his dark secret? What exactly does Nakamura intend to do with him?
MakubeX2
2012-08-05, 05:20
http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/7209/newsthumbakunohana.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/newsthumbakunohana.jpg/)
Synopsis:
Takao Kasuga receives an F on a math test. But he doesn’t even seem to notice because he’s too engrossed in surreptitiously reading Beaudelaire’s The Flowers of Evil. And the day goes downhill from there. In a moment of weakness, he finds and takes home the gym clothes belonging to sweet, pretty Nanako Saeki on whom he has a major crush. Unfortunately for Takao, there’s a witness to the theft: Nakamura, who has a huge chip on her shoulder and a sadistic streak. As the saga unfolds, we see Takao struggling to decide whether to confess or cover up his misdeeds at the same time that he tries to win over the girl of his dreams, and avoid the blackmail attempts of Nakamura, his new BFF.
The manga did well to portray the awkward period of one's early teenage years, but sometimes things just goes way beyond the edge.
In any case, I don't see them replicate things faithfully and I can't see the anime becoming a hit at all. But it will make for a great peek into the human psyche.
MisaoFan
2012-08-05, 06:31
Wow, sounds like it'll be the third Bessatsu Magazine manga to get an anime, after Sankarea and Joshiraku.
GenjiChan
2012-08-05, 07:02
The guy just made it complicated....
Looks like a lot of manipulative behaviors will be seen in this on... I give it a shot.
This gives me an Another feeling... hehehe
MakubeX2
2012-08-05, 07:15
This anime will not attract much of a following because none of the characters are likeable and it might strike too close to home for some people.
But if you are looking for something that focus on the human psyche and wants to go into topics about dissecting and discussing on it, here's the anime for you.
GenjiChan
2012-08-05, 08:11
Censored Everywhere.
I know what you mean... reminds me of Elfin Lied then...
MakubeX2
2012-08-05, 08:17
Nothing really objectional to be censored apart from one certain scene in the later part of the manga anyway. No gore, no sex. Unless you consider the stupidity and immaturity of youth to be a crime.
GenjiChan
2012-08-05, 08:24
Nothing really objectional to be censored apart from one certain scene in the later part of the manga anyway. No gore, no sex. Unless you consider the stupidity and immaturity of youth to be a crime.
Thanks for clearing it.... I'll still watch it anyway.:D
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-05, 09:30
Wow, I was just reading the latest (English) volume last night and wondering if this could ever get an anime.
This anime will not attract much of a following because none of the characters are likeable and it might strike too close to home for some people.
I don't expect it to be super-popular, but it should appeal to the same people who liked Sankarea and Mysterious Girlfriend X -- it's meaner than either of those, but it has the same kind of weird vibe.
Nothing really objectional to be censored apart from one certain scene in the later part of the manga anyway. No gore, no sex. Unless you consider the stupidity and immaturity of youth to be a crime.
Nothing specific, but the overall tone might cause problems. Vertical says they're having trouble getting some bookstores to carry the series (https://www.facebook.com/Vertical.Inc/posts/10150966600019613):
I got word from our Canadian seller that some stores in Canada are not happy with the title. They feel it's too "adult" for their stores. Mainly chain stores, but there might be some trickle down.
Well I consider Nazo no Kanojo X to be quite a sweet story so I have no hard time believing this could be meaner!
Just wondering,how much is Les Fleurs du Mal referenced in the manga,are specific poems brought up?
Also we don't have a studio but Nagahama Hiroshi (Mushishi) will be directing.
HELL YEAH! The Flowers of Evil - School Days edition. Should be awesome >=03! I actually had one qualm with the manga, but I left that reason in the manga thread if you want to know. Plus, the next volume should be out in the next couple of months, finishing the story. Perfect time for an anime.I don't expect it to be super-popular, but it should appeal to the same people who liked Sankarea and Mysterious Girlfriend X -- it's meaner than either of those, but it has the same kind of weird vibe.
I dunno. With an MC the way he is, I'd hardly compare it to Sankarea or MGX.
Well I consider Nazo no Kanojo X to be quite a sweet story so I have no hard time believing this could be meaner!
Just wondering,how much is Les Fleurs du Mal referenced in the manga,are specific poems brought up?
There are no specific poems brought up, but the book's ideology(or at least the main char's interpretation of it) is.
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-05, 10:01
Just wondering,how much is Les Fleurs du Mal referenced in the manga,are specific poems brought up?
Don't expect this to be Chihayafuru for Baudelaire. You can tell the main character is the sort of kid who thinks Fleurs du Mal is the best thing ever, and the story is definitely influenced by Baudelaire, but the main character doesn't break out direct quotes that often.
Well I consider Nazo no Kanojo X to be quite a sweet story so I have no hard time believing this could be meaner!
Just wondering,how much is Les Fleurs du Mal referenced in the manga,are specific poems brought up?
Also we don't have a studio but Nagahama Hiroshi (Mushishi) will be directing.
Les Fleurs du Mal is the mc's favourite book. As far as I remember the wasn't any particular referenced to the poems
Iron Maw
2012-08-05, 11:05
Never expected this would ever get an airing. It should be... interesting. hahahaha
Thanks everyone for the replies
Don't expect this to be Chihayafuru for Baudelaire. You can tell the main character is the sort of kid who thinks Fleurs du Mal is the best thing ever, and the story is definitely influenced by Baudelaire, but the main character doesn't break out direct quotes that often.
I would have appreciated a "Chihayafuru for Baudelaire" but wasn't holding my hopes up,still the fact that the MC thinks "Fleurs du Mal is the best thing ever" tells me quite a bit about him and the tone of the story,should be interesting!
Guardian Enzo
2012-08-05, 12:09
I've read some of the manga recently as well, and wondered if this might get an adaptation. It's very, very dark - MGX and Chihayafuru are not good comps at all - a less explicit "Sundome" is closer to the mark.
Dark, twisted, crazy story incoming. I was missing those :eyespin:
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-05, 12:41
I've read some of the manga recently as well, and wondered if this might get an adaptation. It's very, very dark - MGX and Chihayafuru are not good comps at all - a less explicit "Sundome" is closer to the mark.
I did say it's not Chihayafuru for Baudelaire.
As for MGX -- it's a twisted love story with the same basic set-up of a weird girl discovering a loser guy doing something embarrassing and taking him under her wing. It's just that if Urabe was 6 on the weirdness meter, Nakamura's 11.
Whatever you compare AnH to, the reactions in this thread should be as entertaining as the show itself.
As for MGX -- it's a twisted love story with the same basic set-up of a weird girl discovering a loser guy doing something embarrassing and taking him under her wing. It's just that if Urabe was 6 on the weirdness meter, Nakamura's 11.
I get what you're trying to say, but in Tsubaki's defense, I hardly believe he is a "loser". He's not even ostracized by his peers or anything.
MakubeX2
2012-08-05, 18:00
Without giving away the plot too much, the concept of this series is based on the personal experience of the original author. So there is some realism here which I can relate to.
I'm sure that during our early formative years, we encountered emotions such as being rebellious and anti-establishment in which one think that he is right and everyone else is wrong and being untruthful and hypocritical. Or he is in awe of somebody else and inspired enough to do anything to gain that person's acceptance. And of course we all have at some point in life trying to go out in trying to win an argument, no matter the cost even if it's something trivial in the end.
The series is about those emotions but amplified for dramatic effects.
I've read some of the manga recently as well, and wondered if this might get an adaptation. It's very, very dark - MGX and Chihayafuru are not good comps at all - a less explicit "Sundome" is closer to the mark.
It's extremely dark, and while I don't usually shy away from stuff like this, Sundome almost feels optimistic in comparison. Truth is, I'm less worried about the adaptation doing "justice" to the source material so much as the wider community that will develop as a result of the anime. Nice boat and all that.
The manga is so very twisted and messed in the head, but i love it. I easily imagine myself to be one of the few though, and i can only see this causing people to become more aware of it, but absolutely not even a little popular. I just hope it isn't forced to be taken off the air halfway through or something.
I am very much looking forward to watching this...
MakubeX2
2012-08-06, 10:26
If you ask me, the scene can use more of this type of dark, realistic, thought provoking series.
So more exposure might be good, even if the manga might be offensive to those sensitive lots with it's touchy realistic take on those early emo adolescent years. But I can understand why some people don't want to look back on those young foolish days.
Speaking of which, why doesn't the American release of the manga replicate faithfully what Nakamura is saying on the Japanese cover and opt to put the title in the bubble ?
FYI, she's suppose to say "You piece of useless maggot" and that's what attract me to pick the manga up to read in the first place. Even the official Taiwan Chinese edition translate it faithfully on the cover. Are the American crowds really that sensitive ?
Guardian Enzo
2012-08-06, 14:44
I certainly agree that more dark and edgy series are a good thing - hell, any series that aren't formulaic or generic is progress. But this one, boy... It's well-written, but I'm just not sure it's something I could actually enjoy. I can't say more in this thread, but I won't hold it against anyone who decides this is not their cup of tea.
maximilianjenus
2012-08-15, 13:09
sounds a lot like fapnote, is the manga/ln over ?
The manga is still on-going, with 6 volumes being released. No news on the seventh one yet.
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-15, 17:14
sounds a lot like fapnote,
No. Just no. I don't want to spoil anything, but this isn't an ecchi comedy.
The manga is still on-going, with 7 volumes being released. No news on the eighth one yet.
I thought the manga was ending with Vol. 7? There certainly doesn't seem to be much story left after Vol. 6.
I thought the manga was ending with Vol. 7? There certainly doesn't seem to be much story left after Vol. 6.
Sorry, my mistake, there's six volumes currently released with the seventh and possible final one on the way. Sorry, I typed my previous comment on my phone and didn't edit properly. Sorry about that...:eyespin::heh:
No. Just no. I don't want to spoil anything, but this isn't an ecchi comedy.
Fapnote refers to Onani Master Kurosawa. One could say it has a similar tone to the story, but for Aku No Hana, it's a bit darker.
webkid94
2012-08-15, 19:23
I just read 32 chapters of this manga in about an hour...and yeah it's really hard to talk about it without outright spoiling it. It is however, extremely addicting to read even though the content is nothing but depressing, and you can't help but notice some similarities to a certain BOAT-like anime. Am surprised to see this getting an anime.
MakubeX2
2012-08-15, 19:42
and you can't help but notice some similarities to a certain BOAT-like anime. Am surprised to see this getting an anime.
School Days is just an soapy teen drama made out of anst. This production, in contrast, has an intelligient angle to it giving us a peek into the human psyche.
maximilianjenus
2012-08-16, 10:24
Fapnote refers to Onani Master Kurosawa. One could say it has a similar tone to the story, but for Aku No Hana, it's a bit darker.
Thanks, now i will just have to evaluate whether to wait for the anime or just read the manga.
an air date would be definitive.
Pocari_Sweat
2012-08-16, 10:33
Fapnote lol... More like Fapper in the Rye :p.
Anyways the encouragement in this thread has me interested so I'll keep an eye out for this.
Reckoner
2012-08-16, 20:29
Hahahaha what have I just read. The depravity of it all is just extremely amusing.
MakubeX2
2012-08-16, 22:15
Hahahaha what have I just read. The depravity of it all is just extremely amusing.
Amusing, yes. But how many of us can truly say that we had never gone down through the alley before ?
Reckoner
2012-08-16, 22:22
Amusing, yes. But how many of us can truly say that we had never gone down through the alley before ?
The large difference is that while most of us have these sort of thoughts, we don't actually act on it. The mindset is intriguing and disturbingly relatable, but it's definitely still the depravity of youth.
MakubeX2
2012-08-16, 23:03
The large difference is that while most of us have these sort of thoughts, we don't actually act on it.
The characters had to do that for the drama. Else everything will be too boring.
The mindset is intriguing and disturbingly relatable, but it's definitely still the depravity of youth.
That is why I say this show might not sit well with people. It is just too darkly realistic, uncommon for the anime scene.
It's more about adolescent delusions than the supposed depravity. Everything they do has a sad, pathetic edge to it, because it's all they're capable of.
If this show done right, it will be one of the best heavy and dark drama show.
However, its plot will turn some people off for sure.
Kaioshin Sama
2012-08-18, 12:48
More dark anime that makes people uncomfortable and angry for the dark anime gods. :D It's almost as if the industry is challenging viewers to develop a thicker skin again after that huge wave of feel good moe anime. I for one am totally down for this shift of gears as long as it doesn't eventually end up going overboard into the world of outright exploitation like with OVA's in the 80's.
Guardian Enzo
2012-08-18, 14:01
More dark anime that makes people uncomfortable and angry for the dark anime gods. :D It's almost as if the industry is challenging viewers to develop a thicker skin again after that huge wave of feel good moe anime. I for one am totally down for this shift of gears as long as it doesn't eventually end up going overboard into the world of outright exploitation like with OVA's in the 80's.
I'll go along with that, for the most part. More dark and challenging anime with complex characters is a good thing, on the whole. I will say, though, that in this specific instance I feel better about the trend it might represent than the show itself - I wouldn't want to watch series as... as this one very often.
Kirarakim
2012-08-18, 14:15
I personally don't think the problem with anime is that there wasn't enough dark shows. There were a lot of badly written "dark" shows in the 90's.
I think the problem is the reliance on archetypes and stock characters and situations, instead of telling a genuine good story.
That being said I heard good things about this manga so I will at least give it a shot.
Kaioshin Sama
2012-08-18, 17:27
I'll go along with that, for the most part. More dark and challenging anime with complex characters is a good thing, on the whole. I will say, though, that in this specific instance I feel better about the trend it might represent than the show itself - I wouldn't want to watch series as... as this one very often.
Lol well I built my fandom on dark and depressing anime that are outright cruel towards it's characters so I doubt much will phase me at this point.
After reading a volume of this though I see what you mean. If people already feel challenged to accept someone like Kiritsugu or Haruyuki as main characters I'm not sure what they'll think if more stuff like this gets made. This isn't even really grey morality, it's out and out lack of it on display. Brings to mind those 80's OVA's I mentioned.
That is why I say this show might not sit well with people. It is just too darkly realistic, uncommon for the anime scene.
You know, I never understand why that is. A lot of people say that about It's Not My Fault That I'm Not Popular (http://www.mangaupdates.com/series.html?id=68820) as well(well, it's not really dark in the same sense as this). Even if you can relate to the events in the story, I don't see how exactly it turns people off. This may be a bit unsympathetic to some, but in the end, it's just a story.
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-18, 22:48
I don't want to see anime that's dark for the sake of darkness. Look at what's happened to American fantasy since the success of A Song of Ice and Fire -- now the genre's full of hack writers who think that being rapey, stabby grimdark makes their books inherently mature when in fact their stories are a mess of cliches papered over by a veneer of cynicism. Getting rid of the K-on knockoffs only to replace them with Fate/Zero and School Days knock-offs would just mean we're stuck with different cliches. What makes AnH exciting isn't that it's dark, but that it's original -- even when it delves into cliches, it questions how the cliches work.
Of course, if the show's a success, I'm sure producers will conclude that dark sells and churn out knock-offs until we long for moe comedies.
You know, I never understand why that is. A lot of people say that about It's Not My Fault That I'm Not Popular (http://www.mangaupdates.com/series.html?id=68820) as well(well, it's not really dark in the same sense as this). Even if you can relate to the events in the story, I don't see how exactly it turns people off. This may be a bit unsympathetic to some, but in the end, it's just a story.
It's Not My Fault ... is kinda like The Office (especially the British version) in that it's simultaneously hilarious and pathetic. I'd love to see an anime version just for how slice-of-life fans would react. (Imagine an SOL series about a younger, gender-flipped version of Satou from Welcome to the NHK.)
LOL, for me the manga isn't dark at all (well apart from that really messed up scene)
Its just friggin crazy :heh:
What so dark with teenager going emo anyway?
LOL, for me the manga isn't dark at all (well apart from that really messed up scene)
Its just friggin crazy :heh:
What so dark with teenager going emo anyway?
There are many messed up scenes in the manga :heh:
And, there's a difference between teenagers who have dark thoughts as they live out their lives, or teenagers who lock themselves up in their rooms to slash their wrists, to teenagers who steal the gym clothes of their crush in a fit of madness only to have their full pathetic side come to light as he gets blackmailed because of it.
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-19, 07:32
There are many messed up scenes in the manga :heh:
And, there's a difference between teenagers who have dark thoughts as they live out their lives, or teenagers who lock themselves up in their rooms to slash their wrists, to teenagers who steal the gym clothes of their crush in a fit of madness only to have their full pathetic side come to light as he gets blackmailed because of it.
Notice that this is the set-up for a lame ecchi comedy. What makes the story dark is that the author realizes that in real life the situation wouldn't be remotely funny.
maximilianjenus
2012-08-22, 18:15
from what I read this is not particularly dark compared to a regular seinen; but just like fapnote (and this si aobut as dark as that one) it is likely to get compared to echi romcoms and harem shows as seinen does get get animated that often; that beign said this might be a very interesting show to watch.
Utsuro no Hako
2012-08-22, 22:27
from what I read this is not particularly dark compared to a regular seinen; but just like fapnote (and this si aobut as dark as that one) it is likely to get compared to echi romcoms and harem shows as seinen does get get animated that often; that beign said this might be a very interesting show to watch.
Depends how it all ends, which is a discussion for the manga thread, but the direction its heading looks plenty dark.
http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2012/10/13/the-flowers-of-evil-anime-adaptation-to-be-handled-by-studio-zexcs
So we meet again.....zexcs.
Utsuro no Hako
2012-10-13, 21:20
Really don't like the sound of that. It's a seven volume manga, so there's no need for a liberal adaptation -- at worst, a couple points might need to be glossed over for TV standards -- and the character designs are one of the things that stand out about the series.
I think im going to read the manga instead...i hate it when anime do that kinda crap but i'll wait till episode 1 airs.
So we meet again.....zexcs.
Honestly after the premiere of Sukitte Ii na yo i'm willing to say that it seems zexcs has turned a page and won't be doing just echi comedies (they've got another couple interesting projects coming up as well).
The director also did Mushishi , so he gets my benifit of the doubt for now.
Kirarakim
2012-10-14, 09:21
Did I read that wrong? Did Nagahama say this will be his last anime as a director? I hope I got that wrong.
Anyways not only was Mushishi one of the most faithful adaptions, it actually showed how animation, music, voice work can add to the work.
So I do find it odd that Nagahama would right off the bat say it will be a liberal/unfaithful adaption. Perhaps he has a good reason though.
I'm really surprised this manga is getting animated, it's not the usual sort of thing that gets an anime.
It is understandable it won't be faithful, that manga is buttshit insane. But not in the very-dark-comedy sense or in the out right horror sense, but a really serious exploitation manga bout good children gone, horribly, horribly wrong.
Did I read that wrong? Did Nagahama say this will be his last anime as a director? I hope I got that wrong.
CR corrected that,he said this was his latest anime not his last!
Kirarakim
2012-10-14, 10:37
CR corrected that,he said this was his latest anime not his last!
Thanks...that line made my heart skip a beat. Glad it was just an error.
winhlp32
2012-11-08, 05:33
Studio announced: ZEXCS (http://twitter.com/manganewsjapon/status/266411728793894912/photo/1)
Utsuro no Hako
2012-11-08, 13:00
Studio announced: ZEXCS (http://twitter.com/manganewsjapon/status/266411728793894912/photo/1)
I really hope those illustrations aren't indicative of the style they're going for. But there's also this news (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2012-11-08/the-flowers-of-evil-anime-slated-for-2013-from-zexcs):
According to the anime studio ZEXCS, it is using a production "process that is completely different from the traditional one."
I really hope those illustrations aren't indicative of the style they're going for.
Nah, that's just how the author/mangaka draws himself when making those end-of-the-chapter excerpts.
Yessireebob ... this is indeed an ... unnerving series....
I wonder how it will come across in visual adaptation? http://circvsmaximvs.com/images/smilies/expressive/scratch.gif
Crazy plot this manga has, I think i stopped reading it cause it was too weird
Hope the anime lives up to the manga too
Forsaken_Infinity
2012-11-10, 04:32
This sounds right up my alley. Hopefully they don't mess this up.
First visual , no characters though
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A9p8u9CCEAAPcY7.jpg
Also......
Aku no Hana staff listing:
Director: Hiroshi Nagahama
Assistant Director: Tetsuo Hirakawa
Character Design: Hidekazu Shimamura
Series Composition/Script: Aki Itami
Director of Photography: Yoshihisa Oyama
Sound Director: Kazuya Tanaka
Art Director: Kentaro Akiyama
Color Setting: Hiroko Umezaki
Editing: Daisuke Hiraki
Source: https://twitter.com/manganewsjapon/status/277671473131425793
Utsuro no Hako
2012-12-09, 10:39
First visual , no characters though
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A9p8u9CCEAAPcY7.jpg
First reaction: They're turning it into a Zetsuen no Tempest spinoff?
Coldlight
2012-12-09, 19:25
sounds a lot like fapnote, is the manga/ln over ? I'm with you. The plot reminds me of Onani Master Kurosawa (not an ecchi/comedy/H story for those who don't know). If this story, which is supposedly much darker despite what I perceive to be a few similarities, then it gives me hope that Onamas could also get animated someday.
Anyway, this is one dark title I probably should look out for.
vansonbee
2012-12-10, 03:00
Still waiting for the magna to finish releasing, but found out ITS GONNA HAVE A ADAPTATION?
This is the LAST expected series to have an adaptation... :3
LOL@ the haters of the manga!
duckroll
2013-01-09, 03:01
So, regarding the unique production process they were teasing previously. It seems it has been revealed in this month's Betsu Shounen Magazine. Aku no Hana will use rotoscoping for the animation, with the scenes first being acted out and filmed in live action, before animators use that to animate via rotoscope. It's going to be pretty weird. Hope it works out for them. :P
maximilianjenus
2013-01-09, 09:45
well, at least it will be interesting to watch.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-01-09, 10:40
I wonder if they're going to do actual hand-drawn rotoscoping like in the old Richard Fleischer Superman cartoons, or the computerized kind Richard Linklater uses?
ukulelembo
2013-01-11, 12:32
...It seems it has been revealed in this month's Betsu Shounen Magazine. Aku no Hana will use rotoscoping for the animation...
Any credible source for that?
ukulelembo
2013-01-16, 15:20
http://akunohana-anime.jp/
duckroll
2013-01-17, 13:59
Any credible source for that?
The source was the magazine itself. Several people bought the magazine and provided the information. Now the same information can be found on the official site which has finally opened.
Homepage look dirty for me.Background are all dark,even Character Intro look...weird.
Rosalena
2013-01-24, 00:46
Hmm. I'm not a manga reader (I know, shame on me!) so I'm not very familiar with this title. I am, however, working on my Master's degree in 19th Century Literature so I'm well acquainted with the works of Charles Baudelaire. Incidentally, that's what led me here :heh:
I like the design of the official website. The look and feel is very appealing to me. I'll definitely keep an eye on this thread in the coming months.
Forgive me if this has already been covered in one of the earlier pages (I haven't had the chance to read through them all yet), but has it been confirmed when this will air?
duckroll
2013-01-24, 08:13
It will start broadcasting in April. There is no specific date or channel announced yet.
Rotoscope animation? They're gonna film everything first then draw everything afterwards? I mean Aku no Hana is unique beyond belief already (in ways only people who've experienced reading it will understand) and with an amazing director and passion involved, Aku no Hana is really looking to be a masterpiece (the twisted kind).
Rosalena
2013-01-24, 23:01
It will start broadcasting in April. There is no specific date or channel announced yet.
Thank you for that information, duckroll. I'm assuming you're familiar with the source material when I ask if you (or anyone else) have any thoughts as to what channel it might air on?
Now that I've read through this thread I can't wait to begin the manga this weekend :D
vansonbee
2013-02-06, 13:24
April, can't wait, cuz the translation came out with a bunch and too attempted to read XD
Utsuro no Hako
2013-02-07, 10:21
Cast announced. (http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2013/02/07/flowers-of-evil-anime-voice-cast-revealed)
Shin'ichirō Ueda as Takao Kasuga
Mariya Ise as Sawa Nakamura
Yōko Hikasa as Nanako Saeki
articuzwolf
2013-02-07, 14:05
I love Mariya Ise's voice as Loni in Unicorn #4
her screaming voice will definitely fit Sawa's antique
RollingPenguin
2013-03-12, 02:53
Oh I found this on official twitter of this show 華がどんどん増えて行きます。 PVもうすぐ公開します。 お楽しみに。I believe this is saying we will be getting a PV soon?At least Google Translate tells me that could be wrong.
articuzwolf
2013-03-14, 11:55
agNACZm_J7U
and here it goes the rumoured PV
it basically tell us nothing -___-
agNACZm_J7U
and here it goes the rumoured PV
it basically tell us nothing -___-
Pretty much any trailer will tell you nothing, untill you're manga reader :heh:
I loved the sound in this preview.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-03-14, 12:19
Seems like an awfully bare-bones PV for a show that's premiering in a couple weeks. I was hoping we'd get a better look at the rotoscoping. Still, the quality of the still shots is fantastic and the music is great.
RollingPenguin
2013-03-14, 13:48
Seems like an awfully bare-bones PV for a show that's premiering in a couple weeks. I was hoping we'd get a better look at the rotoscoping.
Could there be any reason why they wouldnt want to show us rotoscoping ,that doesnt involve production problems?
MisaoFan
2013-03-14, 13:55
The PV does not show anything besides the backgrounds but I like some shots. Too bad the production staff never want to show the anime character designs to us for some reason, but still I'll watch it when it premieres !
Could there be any reason why they wouldnt want to show us rotoscoping ,that doesnt involve production problems?
To keep us curious and try and build hype?
duckroll tweeted this a couple weeks ago
More weird Aku no Hana anime news. The character visuals will not be revealed until the show starts airing in April:
That said I do really like the backrounds
duckroll
2013-03-14, 18:10
The backgrounds are by Studio Pablo. They should be fine. The studio handled the backgrounds for Penguindrum and Sengoku Collection, and they're very good at their job. :)
articuzwolf
2013-03-15, 11:07
Pretty much any trailer will tell you nothing, untill you're manga reader :heh:
I loved the sound in this preview.
I read the manga and still not sure what did I just watch in that PV
nothing seems important other than grimdark vibe and the "EYE"
non-manga reader will find it even more confusing
not sure whether it is a good marketing/advertising strategy to keep almost everything secret until the anime airs, but we'll see
kinda hoping to hear Mariya Ise's voice as Sawa in that PV though :(
Haiprbim
2013-03-15, 12:48
Genre: Drama, Psychological, Romance
I'm a bit disappointed it is not a Comedy as well, but will certainly check it out! :D
^ prepare for mental anxiety.The agony I felt reading the manga... I hope it's portrayed well in the anime
Haiprbim
2013-03-15, 13:52
^ prepare for mental anxiety.The agony I felt reading the manga... I hope it's portrayed well in the anime
Thanks for the warning. :D
Very atmospheric trailer. Have very high hopes for this, Hiroshi Nagahama is the boss.
I like the animation coloring also. The deep saturation reminds me of Hisoda Mamoru films ( like Summer Wars and Toki no kakeru shoujo )
^ prepare for mental anxiety.The agony I felt reading the manga... I hope it's portrayed well in the anime
If the music in that PV is any indication, it's well on its way to succeed giving that feeling :uhoh:.
Haiprbim
2013-03-17, 05:36
Just a question here, will the Anime start airing on 20th of March, 2013 or 6th of April, 2013?
Thanks in front!
romcom89
2013-03-17, 05:54
The first episode received a special pre-air at an event on 20.03.2013. Regular TV airing started on April 5.
Source: anidb
Haiprbim
2013-03-20, 01:03
The first episode received a special pre-air at an event on 20.03.2013. Regular TV airing started on April 5.
Source: anidb
I see, thank-you very much.
Anyone got any photos of the chars or anything from that event?
ukulelembo
2013-03-22, 13:06
u8jmKQmVfDw
They really don't want to show anything. :(
AbZeroNow
2013-04-04, 17:10
Crunchyroll get:
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2013-04-04/crunchyroll-to-stream-flowers-of-evil-tv-anime
In case anybody is curious about the delay, it's simulcasted with either the Sun TV or Gunma TV airing of it.
bastek66
2013-04-05, 08:40
Kill it with fire
http://i.imgur.com/BpFumNM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eyfj78r.jpg
Kill it with fire
http://i.imgur.com/BpFumNM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eyfj78r.jpg
You wouldn't get me to watch that even if you paid me.
You got to hand it to the producers though this just might be the first time the whole entire world agree that a series is actually terrible.
Kill it with fire
http://i.imgur.com/BpFumNM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eyfj78r.jpg
Haha oh my god I'm actually getting more excited because of that. It looks like they went too far with the rotoscope animation but damn I seriously want to watch this.
That... is exactly what I feared was the reason why they kept the character visuals a secret till the broadcast. I'll still check out the first episode but most likely that'll be it.
RollingPenguin
2013-04-05, 08:59
I too will watch first episode and hopefully I wont be repulsed by visuals.I dont think I will watch any subsequent episode though.
kuromitsu
2013-04-05, 09:00
O_____O
LOL
Okay, I need to check this out.
mistress_kisara
2013-04-05, 09:00
Kill it with fire
http://i.imgur.com/BpFumNM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eyfj78r.jpg
WTF!??? Is this what they meant by "different style of animation"?? :twitch:
...these character designs..are intriguing and repulsive at the same time..lol
...these character designs..are intriguing and repulsive at the same time..lol
This is how they plan on selling this. "It is so bad that you HAVE to check it out."
This is how they plan on selling this. "It is so bad that you HAVE to check it out."
lol no way they're get a dime from my wallet.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-04-05, 09:09
Please tell me those are just derpy inbetween frames and they really don't look that bad.
^ from the comments, I hear faces disappear a lot.
articuzwolf
2013-04-05, 09:18
O_____O
LOL
Okay, I need to check this out.
to run away asap you mean :heh:
damn from "cocktease" manga into "therapy for pervert" anime @__@
and I was kinda looking forward to it :(
Please tell me those are just derpy inbetween frames and they really don't look that bad.
The amount of NOPE is strong in this one.
Cold~as~Ice
2013-04-05, 09:24
they need remove this shit from crunchyroll
justsomeguy
2013-04-05, 09:30
I read through the first volume of the manga, and found it intriguing, but figured I'd settle for watching the show. I guess I'd better go back to reading.
Aku no Hana (anime) final score: 0/10. Totally unwatchable. What did they use for rotoscoping, male actors?
MisaoFan
2013-04-05, 09:38
I watched the first episode, but I can't say it was good. First of all, the character designs bother me the most, they're pretty mediocre but at the same time are rarely used in anime thanks to its half-decent rotoscoping animation, and seeing them in motion looks pretty nice and realistic. However, they could have used the manga artwork instead, which I didn't mind unlike the anime artwork, which takes for me a while to get used to it. It was not as half-bad, but still bother me. The pacing is very slow as well with some changes, despite not having read the manga at all, but the characters looks very interesting personality-wise. The most intricate aspects however are the detailed backgrounds and the nice music. The opening theme feels a little too lighthearted and unfitting, even though it looks good itself and I feel like I was watching a live-action drama, the ending looks quite creepy in a good way, and the book's mysterious black, flower-shaped with an eye-like thing creature looks great. Too bad I don't think I'll continue watching it after the first episode because it just felt awkward, but doesn't look too bad in most aspects other than the artwork.
Let's just say that for those fans of the manga, you'll be in for a big surprise.
It's pure art. I need something for my stomach
^ from the comments, I hear faces disappear a lot.
That's my main issue from watching the raw.Makes the whole thing seem unfinished.
That and the fact that if you're gonna go for a realistic art style, you really do need to put noses and lips on your characters, no noses or lips can work in stylized anime art but in something like this it just looks weird.
That being said,I never expected the characters to look attractive since I figured they must have used the avereage highschool student and your average high school girl doesn't look like an idol.
kuromitsu
2013-04-05, 10:46
Okay, I watched ep 1, and you know what, this isn't half bad. Not at all.
I haven't read the manga, but the anime is trying to be a live-action drama - with rotoscope because actual live-action is expensive. This whole episode played out like a movie, with the pacing, the general visuals and "camerawork" of a movie, even the voice acting was trying to be realistic instead of what you usually hear in anime (it's a mixed bag, though). In short, this show is a live-action movie disguised as an anime, and once I accepted that everything fell into place and I had no problem at all with how the characters looked and sounded. I don't think they could've achieved the effect they were going after with anime-esque character designs and voice acting.
So, this is enough to keep my attention for now, partly because of the novelty value, and partly because there's actually a very nice tension in the episode and I want to see how it plays out. I'm not sure I'll be able to take this for 12-13 episodes, but I'll keep watching it for now.
So all in all, I think it's pretty good so far. You just have to forget about everything you expected. xD;;
Also, TIL that Baudelaire sounds pretty okay in Japanese. (Unlike Shakespeare.)
Terrestrial Dream
2013-04-05, 10:51
kill it with fire
http://i.imgur.com/bpfumnm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/eyfj78r.jpg hahahahahahahahaha :D, omg this hilarious. The face of Nakamura, omg I am dying inside right now.
Oh boy, well if the anime looks this bad, I don't think I will watch the anime.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-04-05, 10:56
After watching the episode, I don't think it's near as bad as those screenshots make it out. The rotoscoping looks weird for the first few minutes because things move in real life that animators never bother to draw, but once you get used to it, it looks fine. The one big problem is faces. I didn't have a problem with Kasuga and his pals since they aren't supposed to be that good looking, but Saeki doesn't come across as nearly beautiful enough and Nakamura ... dear god. If they're going to use the faces of the rotoscoped actors, they should've cast someone better looking for the part.
Now where the show really works is in sound design. I love that most of the seiyuu don't sound like anime characters, and the dialogue was actually recorded on location, with lots of echoes and reverberations that you don't get from sound booths. The BGM is very effective at setting the mood for the series, and the ED is brilliant. My only complaint is the OP sounds so out of place.
One worry I have is the pacing. The slow development is fitting for the story, but this episode only made it twenty pages into the first chapter. From what I've heard this is only a one-cour series and I'm afraid they're going to make drastic changes to the story to fit it into thirteen episodes.
The author is currently of suicide watch.
hahahahahahahahaha :D, omg this hilarious. The face of Nakamura, omg I am dying inside right now.
Just want to say that the look in her eyes is because the screenshot is taken while she's blinking her eyes,anyone looks retartded when you take a picture of them while they're blinking
even the voice acting was trying to be realistic instead of what you usually hear in anime (it's a mixed bag, though).
That actually surprised me since most of the cast are seiyuus, generally shows that want to be realistic cast live action actors.
Oh god I really can't wait to watch this tomorrow. If they were to choose a series to be all weird and experimental on, honestly Aku no Hana is the perfect series for that.
Other than that cheerful(i.e. HORRIBLE) OP, this wasn't that bad at all. In fact, I think I prefer this way to tell the story. I'll admit, the faces are ugly except Saeki's, but the whole 'realism' feel of it really hits home.
The key thing about the way this anime(though I moreso agree with kuro in that it feels more like a live-action in anime clothing) is being told is the mood the sound presents. Well, Hako put it best. In comparison to the manga, you can really feel the tension. Because of the way the chars are drawn in the manga, in general, you get a sense of "oh, another lame MC", as you progress through the story, but the way this anime is being told, coupled with the dreary, foreboding music, even with the same events as the manga, the interpretation will be much more different. That feeling of dread is what will make this show hit or miss; I only hope they hit it out of the ballpark.
Count me in amongst those who didn't find the whole look of the animation that bad. The disappearing/reappearing faces though, were awful. Like, incredibly bad. Surely someone must've gone "We should probably do something about those vanishing faces" when the staff went over the completed episode.
http://i.imgur.com/TAMoImj.gif
Really, that's my biggest problem. It's already bad enough that their choice of rotoscoping has it seated deep within the uncanny valley, this strange quip along with other smaller issues do not help the anime at all.
Anyway contrary to what i said before, I might just check out one or two more episodes just to see how certain scenes will look. Then I'll drop the anime for good, since the manga isn't really for me. I've been interested in this solely because I was curious how they'd handle the rotoscoping, so there's no more need to stick around once I've satisfied myself.
Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
*cough*
Hang on, let me chug this Pina Colada.
......
Ok, resuming laughter.
Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
RollingPenguin
2013-04-05, 11:38
Not only does it not look bad I actually like it.Definitely am going to continue watching this.
DorkingtonPugsly
2013-04-05, 11:41
I don't know... I've yet to watch it so I don't have a final say as of now but... it's just creep that style, at least for me. I feel like I'm seeing some experimental trippy horror tale that's supposed to freak the viewer out with the visuals. I don't know man, this 'thing' is just... I just lunch and I'm feeling queasy. I'm gonna watch this tonight and I'll regret it, I know it.
DmonHiro
2013-04-05, 11:42
I once said that the character designs for the Aku No Hana manga were horrible. I take it back. Compared to the anime version, those designs are the equivalent of Belldandy and Lum. GODDAMN IS THE ANIME VERSION UGLY!!!
Oh god, this is hilarious. I seriously can't stop laughing :heh: :heh:
I've only seen screenshots so maybe this looks better animated (lol, "animated") but... no, just no. Do that for an original series if you want but not a manga adaptation. Does the main heroine really have that face on all the time?
Archon_Wing
2013-04-05, 11:47
Zecxs = The retarded brother of Deen
Zecxs = The retarded brother of Deen
It was probably the director who wanted to go with this style, considering who he is and what he's done he should get a pass, even if this fails. I'm sure this post won't stop people mindless bashing Zecxs and acting like the director of Mushishi is a hack.
Reckoner
2013-04-05, 11:53
Zexcs is on my shitlist now with DEEN. What the flying ****.
Way to ruin an interesting manga with complete shit designs. LOL.
It was probably the director who wanted to go with this style, considering who he is and what he's done he should get a pass, even if this fails. I'm sure this post won't stop people mindless bashing Zecxs and acting like the director of Mushishi is a hack.
Zecxs when they are the sole production studio behind a work have repeatedly churned out complete crap. That's not mindlessly bashing a studio, they soiled their own reputation.
As for the director, that's just disappointing to find out that he screwed up this hard. He doesn't get a free pass from me. Mushishi was great, but doesn't mean I forgive for this. Mushishi came out quite a few years ago now.
Archon_Wing
2013-04-05, 11:56
It was probably the director who wanted to go with this style, considering who he is and what he's done he should get a pass, even if this fails. I'm sure this post won't stop people mindless bashing Zecxs and acting like the director of Mushishi is a hack.
Of course not, the avalanche has already started.
Hey, their fault for allowing it. =p And the fact that he's the director of Mushishi makes it even worse.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-04-05, 12:01
I feel like I'm seeing some experimental trippy horror tale that's supposed to freak the viewer out with the visuals.
Since the manga is a freaky psychological horror story, I'd say the animators have succeeded brilliantly.
Zecxs when they are the sole production studio behind a work have repeatedly churned out complete crap. That's not mindlessly bashing a studio, they soiled their own reputation.
As for the director, that's just disappointing to find out that he screwed up this hard. He doesn't get a free pass from me. Mushishi was great, but doesn't mean I forgive for this. Mushishi came out quite a few years ago now.
You watched the show or are you actually basing all this on screencaps? Most of the people overreacting are just going off caps, the 4-5 people in this thread who actually watched the raw otoh aren't running around like chickens with no heads.
kuromitsu
2013-04-05, 12:04
Way to ruin an interesting manga with complete shit designs. LOL.
...
As for the director, that's just disappointing to find out that he screwed up this hard. He doesn't get a free pass from me. Mushishi was great, but doesn't mean I forgive for this. Mushishi came out quite a few years ago now.
The manga is not ruined, it's the same as it ever was.
The anime decided to go with an experimental, original concept that affects not only the visuals but the entire production down to pacing, music and sound. You don't have to like it, but to say it's crap, bash the studio and claim that director screwed up - just because you're disappointed that you don't get pretty, sexy ladies? That's hardly fair.
The manga is not ruined, it's the same as it ever was.
What! That's absolute rubbish, the entire story, dialogue, characters and pacing is ruined by this experimental animation technique! My proof? Well just look at the screencaps and you'll have to agree. *smirks*
Archon_Wing
2013-04-05, 12:11
Oh, an anti-criticism shield.
Alright,
my
post
is
experimental
and
thus
you
can't have anyknee jerk reactions to it
Reckoner
2013-04-05, 12:17
The manga is not ruined, it's the same as it ever was.
The anime decided to go with an experimental, original concept that affects not only the visuals but the entire production down to pacing, music and sound. You don't have to like it, but to say it's crap, bash the studio and claim that director screwed up - just because you're disappointed that you don't get pretty, sexy ladies? That's hardly fair.
Do not be ridiculous. This is a visual medium, so the visuals are in fact critical to a production. The rotoscoping looks highly distracting and quite ugly. It's a half-assed attempt to make this like a live action show, but without actually being live action. If I can't even stand to look at the visuals, I'm not going to last long.
I've also long been wary of Zexcs and hardly liked anything they did. This just seals it for me. What in the world possessed them to OK a project like this? HORRIBLE.
What! That's absolute rubbish, the entire story, dialogue, characters and pacing is ruined by this experimental animation technique! My proof? Well just look at the screencaps and you'll have to agree. *smirks*
Yep. I dropped this before even actually seeing it. I saw enough SS and .gif's to understand that this became complete shit. It looks repulsive and this is a visual medium, so I feel wholly justified in thinking that.
If I have any self-respect, I'll save myself the torture.
Did people ever learn from the horrible animated movie "Lord of the Rings (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kylnv0eTsGc)"? I guess they did not.
I like it, its look straightforward ugly but in most moment I actually enjoy the stickman animation.
Also the background and OST actually in very high quality in normal standard
The animation is great if you can take it.
Yep. I dropped this before even actually seeing it. I saw enough SS and .gif's to understand that this became complete shit.
God people watch the episode first.
Yep. I dropped this before even actually seeing it. I saw enough SS and .gif's to understand that this became complete shit. It looks repulsive and this is a visual medium, so I feel wholly justified in thinking that.
I know this isn't related, but there were so many people that had this mindset about Kaiba (http://myanimelist.net/anime/3701/Kaiba)(including myself for some time) and have no idea the great series they missed.
I mean, I can understand if you started to watch it and said "Don't like the animation style, I can't watch it", but to call this "complete shit" without having viewed all aspects of the episode is unfair and ridiculous =02.
So I hear the internet is devastated over this animu?
melina_putri
2013-04-05, 12:58
The manga is not ruined, it's the same as it ever was.
The anime decided to go with an experimental, original concept that affects not only the visuals but the entire production down to pacing, music and sound. You don't have to like it, but to say it's crap, bash the studio and claim that director screwed up - just because you're disappointed that you don't get pretty, sexy ladies? That's hardly fair.
I guess the director is a fan of old school seinen artworks.
The character visuals feels really similar to Danchi Tomoo.
Though I agree they need to smooth up some things, especially the faces. It looks like they tried to appear more seinen but failed miserably.
Since everyone is quick to post screencaps of epic fails (and sure,there's a few to choose from)
Here's some parts that looked all right to me
http://i48.tinypic.com/fvwt20.png
http://i45.tinypic.com/23m4wo6.png
http://i46.tinypic.com/25ziezp.png
http://i46.tinypic.com/6pnb4o.jpg
Also all the backrounds are really really nice and help contribute to the athmosphere. Don't get me wrong though, that's doesn't make up for the faces missing half the time.
It's not the style I'm against,I find it quite intriguing actually,it's the execution that leaves me disapointed.
In the great words of Deion Sanders:
I created this image
This thing that you could imagine
You could love it or hate it but he was prime time
When you making a difference it's gone be haters
When you provoking change it's gone be nay sayers
People don't condone what they've never seen
And some of the stuff I tried to do they had never seen
Kismet-chan
2013-04-05, 13:06
I'm not sure if there's anything I can say that hasn't already been said repeatedly... All I can do is recommend the manga to those who are dropping it right off the bat who haven't already read it. It's quite good, imo. I understand what some are saying, but you obviously don't have to force yourself to watch something... No matter how good the story may be. Especially when you can just go to the source material instead. That's my two cents.
Also, I'm just going to leave this here:
http://i.imgur.com/eyfj78r.jpg
bastek66
2013-04-05, 13:06
http://i.imgur.com/iPzU302.jpg
Well, they've successfully drawn the attention of the entire anime-watching community with this. Time to check it out. :heh:
the problem is that the director sh*t on the character design in the hardest possible way he could.
Also, i couldn't stand that pop-up type of animation, i mean, they really need to be at less than 1 meter to see the characters actually got a mouth and eyes? Now i know what my 87 years old grandma feels with her cataracts and glaucoma.
Maybe this was just the wrong manga to use this on,even if done the way I would like it the final results would be far from the manga art,so people would be complaining regardless.Something like Soil (http://img.manga-sanctuary.com/big/soil-manga-volume-11-simple-62046.jpg) would have been a good candidate.
They should just done original anime IMO.
Urizithar
2013-04-05, 13:41
If I'd like to watch live action I would be watching it. No need to push it on me -> dropped. It may have awesome story but as an anime it's shit cause it actually isn't anime at all.
Kaoru Chujo
2013-04-05, 13:49
My own opinion is that this first episode was visually outstanding. I loved it. The realistic detail and tiny movements that rotoscoping made possible really worked for me. I liked the fact that so many of the girls were chunky -- just like in a real school. I even liked the way people's features only appeared as they walked closer to us.
The story is evolving slowly, but the feeling of this show is just excellent, so far. At a higher aesthetic level, patiently carrying us toward flowers of evil.
I dropped the manga after a few chapters, because it was so oppressively dark, but we'll see how this progresses. It will have served a purpose if we all read a bit of the poetry of Baudelaire:
"O Death, old captain, it is time. Let us raise anchor!
This country bores us, let us set sail!
Though the sky and sea are black as ink,
You know our hearts are filled with rays of light.
"Pour out your poison to comfort us!
This fire burns our brains. We want to
Plunge to the bottom of the gulf -- Hell or Heaven, it matters not.
To the depths of the Unknown, to find something new!"
Something like this anime.
EDIT: I also loved the BGM/sound effects. And the MC's lively dead eyes. This is one of those anime episodes that was over before I thought it was half done. Great sign. I think the "anime community" has totally missed the boat. For one episode, at least, lol.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-04-05, 13:53
Did people ever learn from the horrible animated movie "Lord of the Rings (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kylnv0eTsGc)"? I guess they did not.
But that wasn't horrible because of the animation -- it was horrible because they had terrible designs for the orcs and Balrog, a terrible script, and they ran out of money halfway through. The shots of the Fellowship in that clip look really good, and I'd go see a film in that style if all of it were that quality.
Well, they've successfully drawn the attention of the entire anime-watching community with this. Time to check it out. :heh:
On the plus side, you don't often get three pages of discussion just on a raw.
However I suspect most people are just coming in to trash the show without even watching it and will disappear by next episode.
I liked the fact that so many of the girls were chunky -- just like in a real school.
Too bad most people don't watch anime because they want realistic character designs. That's what the j-dramas are for.
And people wouldn't be complaining so much if it was not a highly anticipated adaptation of an actual story with set character designs.
If they wanted to try out new things, they should have done it in an Original Anime, and there wouldn't be such a fuss over it.
Take Panty and Stocking for example. Some people liked the PPG art, and those who did not just dropped it right there without losing a thing.
In this case, fans of the manga pretty much got screwed.
I actually don't remember the last time the whole anime community have collectively hated something. The first thing that pops into my head is Endless Eight. That expectation and let down can get to you.
I actually don't remember the last time the whole anime community have collectively hated something. The first thing that pops into my head is Endless Eight. That expectation and let down can get to you.
That's right, and in a global level btw. I'll see just few minutes, but I really think I won't follow this anime (just the manga that was like a bomb after the first part).
Truth be told, there is a small percentage of people that actually like it, but so far, the amount of rage I'm seeing is too big.
TooPurePureBoy
2013-04-05, 15:31
Gotta say this is perfect so far. A story about evil springing into the hearts of youngsters because they are forced to live in a routine life is literally shitting on what is routine for anime viewers!
Rejoice you shit eating anime viewers! This show will definitely push you out of your boring routine!
That said I fucking hate the character designs too lol :heh:
kuromitsu
2013-04-05, 15:53
Can someone gives a summary from this link? I think an it's interview between the mangaka/author and the anime director.
http://natalie.mu/comic/pp/akunohana
Edit: Using Google Translate, it seems the mangaka/author recognized that the character visuals is going to "murder" the readers of the manga.
And Google Translate is lying.
In short (note that this is a quick & dirty summary):
- At first Nagahama (the director) refused the offer to direct the adaptation, because he thought that simply turning this manga into a pretty, clean-looking anime would be pointless. He says that he believes that when the mangaka draws this story he's seeing something "else" which he expresses as a manga. So there would be no point in simply presenting it in animated form, at that rate you might as well just read the manga and be done with it.
- He thought if it was to be adapted at all, it should be done as a live drama. When he was offered the job the second time, he pitched the idea of using rotoscope. He was aware that the result would be different from the manga.
- Oshimi (the mangaka) says Nagahama is right about the way he creates the manga: the original story is something that exists in his head, and he draws what he sees in his mind. So basically the anime and the manga are two different versions of the story that exists in Oshimi's head. By the way, he was also aware that due to the rotoscope the anime would look different from his work, and he thought it was an interesting idea.
- Oshimi also says that he thinks Nagahama has a very deep insight into the story, and firmly believes that he's taking it in the right direction. He also very much approves of Nagahama's wish of the anime leaving the viewers with a scar.
- Oshimi was pretty much "in" on the whole thing, they tested the rotoscope method on him.
- The interviewer asks about the impact the visuals would have on viewers, and Nagahama says he's well aware that a lot of people will go "what the fuck" and "this is gross," "I hate this, I'm not watching this." But he's pretty much okay with that, too, because he thinks it's fine as long as it leaves an impact on people. Viewers may dismiss it right away, but some may check it out later and find it interesting, or they may come across the manga, recognize the title, and read that.
- Oshimi says that he once got a fan letter from a high school girl who wrote that when she read the manga in middle school she thought it was stupid, but she tried to read it again when she was older and she found it very good. Nagahama says that this is what he's going for, to leave an impact, even if it's negative. He's trying to create something that one can't just ignore or dismiss.
- Oshimi also says that the anime has many scenes that he wishes he would've drawn the way they are in the anime, for example a scene with Kasuga and Nakamura in the classroom.
- Also, he confesses he's writing the manga with the intention of murdering the readers with it (metaphorically, of course), thinks the anime is doing the same, and relishes the idea of the viewers getting slaughtered, jokingly of course. (lol #1)
They leave the following messages to the fans:
- Oshimi: He guarantees that those who feel very strongly about Aku no hana will enjoy the anime. However, chara-moe types, those who go "Nakamura-san, unf unf" will probably feel betrayed. (lol #2)
- Nagahama: Since it's so different from the usual anime, he can't say that everyone will love it. But those who watch the first episode and think "I want to see more" will not have their expectations betrayed.
If anything, this made me want to watch the show even more. :D I hope they're right and it's going to be interesting.
I freaking loved the Kubrick stare scene. The character designs are unorthodox, but I didn't find them so rage worthy as rest of the internet, it seems. It felt weird seeing faces appear out of nowhere, though :heh:
I'm actually looking forward to what this series has to offer next. Kaoru Chujo described the manga as "oppressively dark", which can only be a good thing.
edit: Super Hans' quote in my sig feels oddly on point...
I initially didn't intend to watch this but I at least had to check out the first episode after this shit storm. After a deep analysis and careful consideration... http://s24.postimg.org/c1f4e4jtd/1365189919203.png (http://postimage.org/)... I came to the conclusion the animation style is garbage. The chara design is stuck in some kind of uncanny valley. It's not as good as live action nor traditional animation. The movements of the characters are jerky. Characters in the background are sometimes frozen with a dumb smile on their face, killing any kind of immersion this style could have created. Reused footage is very obvious (not much in this ep but it'll probably get worse over time).
At the end you can only wonder why they didn't make this into a live action. This series doesn't have any added value compared to it, it in fact looks worse. If they didn't want to make this a traditional anime, they shouldn't have made this at all. I fail to see how the rotoscoping makes this any better than it would have been as a normal anime. To me, this style only detracts from the story. I laughed quite a few times while watching this, and I doubt it was their intention to make this funny.
It's a shame because it wasn't all bad. The backgrounds, the music, and the voice acting were excellent. Can't comment on the plot since nothing happened but I enjoyed the oppressing atmosphere.
kitten320
2013-04-05, 15:59
I like rotoscoping but that's just horrible... I won't be able to watch this kind of style for 12 or whatever number of episodes... even 20 minutes is too much!
DragoonKain3
2013-04-05, 16:03
Don't get me wrong, I think the manga's art is absolutely gorgeous. But I like the anime's art because it looks more realistic, or I what I think is the more 'average' Japanese schoolpeople looks. Sure it's still too early to tell, but this art direction might be more suited to the story they are going to tell.
But then again, I'm one of the few that had the slightly chubbier designs of Real Drive grow on me. I can just imagine the otaku fanbase not buying into this. :heh:
Viewers may dismiss it right away, but some may check it out later and find it interesting, or they may come across the manga, recognize the title, and read that.
:D
Why would they pick it up again when they already know the story from the manga?
The only thing the anime was supposed to do is to add some nice visuals and sound to the manga, thus making the experience more complete. Since it pretty much failed to do that, there really is no point in watching the anime once you had read the manga.
RollingPenguin
2013-04-05, 16:09
Reused footage is very obvious (not much in this ep but it'll probably get worse over time).
I think there was a thematic purpose to that actually.The reason why they only adapted 20 pages of first chapter and used same footage was to show monotony and repetitious activity of adolescent life.
kuromitsu
2013-04-05, 16:10
Why would they pick it up again when they already know the story from the manga?
Perhaps because... wait for it... no, really, this may be surprising... not everyone reads the manga? I know, I know, I was shocked, too. (And I haven't even read the manga!)
The only thing the anime was supposed to do is to add some nice visuals and sound to the manga, thus making the experience more complete. Since it pretty much failed to do that, there really is no point in watching the anime once you had read the manga.
That's exactly why the director said that turning it into a traditional anime would be pointless.
FWIW, I'm no fan of rotoscope either, but if that's how this show wants to roll, fine, at least it's doing something interesting with it.
NinjaRealist
2013-04-05, 16:16
I'm actually looking forward to what this series has to offer next. Kaoru Chujo described the manga as "oppressively dark", which can only be a good thing.
As a connoisseur of grim/dark anime, I don't think oppressively dark is really the right word for it.
For me, it's not the darkness that's oppressive but the angst. I mean this might be the angstiest manga ever with the most hopeless cast of characters. It's kind of similar to Watamoto in the hopeless angsty feel that it gives you although this series is even more angsty, though slightly less dark, than Watamoto.
That being said the characters and relationships in this story are some of the most honest I've seen in a romance manga and that's what makes it impossible for me to stop reading the manga even though I hate most of the characters and find it nauseatingly angsty.
It's just so believable.
Anyways, about to watch the first episode. Interested to see how the roto-scoping looks.
Perhaps because... wait for it... no, really, this may be surprising... not everyone reads the manga? I know, I know, I was shocked, too. (And I haven't even read the manga!)
Still, take one look at the anime and another one at the manga. I don't see why anyone would want to watch the anime first instead of reading the manga.
Wel, maybe those who don't like to read or the manga is not translated to their language.
Sorry to say this and i apologize in advance but this adaption is a PURE SHIT. Is something so bad that i don't have more words to describe it, pure shit, unoriginal, not elegant, junk.
I think this is the first time drop an anime after the first episode but really, i can't stand this distort chara and animation, my body refuse, i feel like i want to throw up. Is like they raped a good plot.
I love anime because they have a original and beautyful style, far from the west stereotypes, this roto-crap seems an late 80 european cartoon. I hope the producer get fired along with the people who did this.
Why they don't make an dorama? An doarama like the author want...
Dropped. This not japan animation, this is an offense to all anime fans. Fuck you to the animation studio who make it from the bottom of my heart.
1/10 regardless the story can be a masterpiece or not.
That's exactly why the director said that turning it into a traditional anime would be pointless.
Even his untraditional approach is worthless when it looks like this :eyespin:
The director says it's fine that people don't like it as long as it leaves an impact on them. But does an impact that leads to the dropping of the series after a few minutes in really proves/worth something? And with 30shows coming out in every season, he's really stupid to believe that someone will pick it up later when they did not like it for the first time.
Even his untraditional approach is worthless when it looks like this :eyespin:
The director says it's fine that people don't like it as long as it leaves an impact on them.
When he will get fired (and i really hope they fired him) for awfull dvd sales i want to hear him speck again and i will laught hard.
Kaoru Chujo
2013-04-05, 16:47
As a connoisseur of grim/dark anime, I don't think oppressively dark is really the right word for it. For me, it's not the darkness that's oppressive but the angst. I mean this might be the angstiest manga ever with the most hopeless cast of characters....I think this is right. Not so much dark as locked in intense angst. That's probably a better way of putting the reason why an inveterate optimist like myself had trouble reading it. I like angst, but there are limits. I'm hoping that the thrilling stylishness of the anime will help me get into the story more than the manga did.
By the way, 2channel is at least as over-the-top against this show as people are here. Both quite wrong, in my opinion, but that's how it is. Aesthetically, the director's choices in ep1 all worked for me. This, Suisei no Gargantia and Red Data Girl are my favorite shows of the new season so far.
When he will get fired (and i really hope they fired him) for awfull dvd sales i want to hear him speck again and i will laught hard.
Why many manga / light novels are adapted for anime in every season ?
Because anime adaptation is an advertisement of manga / light novel.
Even if DVD sales are awful, the publisher win when the original is sold enough.
So far it seems this anime succeeded in selling its name.
If anything, my least favorite thing about this episode was the pacing, not the character designs. They really aren't that bad, when you get used to them, and it's sort of awesomely ballsy to basically screw over what the original author called the "chara-moe types." Looking forward to seeing how this'll turn out compared to the manga!
That's right, and in a global level btw. I'll see just few minutes, but I really think I won't follow this anime (just the manga that was like a bomb after the first part).
Truth be told, there is a small percentage of people that actually like it, but so far, the amount of rage I'm seeing is too big.
You really should judge by yourself. I don't know if it's the negative feedback lowering my expectations, but I thought the first episode was pretty good, visuals included.
Rotoscope done right, I can handle that.
Rotoscope done wrong, nope fuck that.
With the hideous character design as side dish, I don't think I'll be able to take this seriously.
For those who are defending this abomination, good luck watching the rest of the series.
SquirrelLuvsPnut
2013-04-05, 18:33
wow... I am really really pissed off right now... There was a chance to make something refreshingly different and by different I don't mean putting a turn in a urinal. Just why...
Let's back up a sec, there's stylizing and then there's warping things so horribly that you don't even recognize them anymore.
What did Sawa look like in the mange?
http://imageshack.us/a/img221/2999/613019.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/613019.jpg/)
Okay, now how does she look?
http://imageshack.us/a/img341/9057/43973130.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/341/43973130.jpg/)
???????????
Jerseykid
2013-04-05, 19:03
This was really tough for me, my eyes instantly hurt because stuff wasn't moving smoothly and I couldn't even keep watching to see if I was going to like it or not
vansonbee
2013-04-05, 19:11
OMG, it was digusting. I saw the spoiler shots u guys give, but watch the anime for a few minutes and quit. Time to finish my manga!
Marcus H.
2013-04-05, 19:15
Okay, now how does she look?
Keikaku doori.
Wilfriback
2013-04-05, 19:17
Keikaku doori.
http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/9057/43973130.jpg
???????????
http://i.imgur.com/eiDnI.jpg
What I find interesting in this whole discussion is how neatly it parallels some of the discussions in the manga (and I presume later in the anime) of Baudelaire's poetry.
Baudelaire was not writing sonnets. He was not writing "pretty" poems. He wanted to show you reality, grind your face in it, and then have you accept it for what it really was. Only then could you appreciate the real versus what you like to pretend what reality was.
I believe that is the effect the anime is going for, and I think it did a lovely job of being ugly in just the right ways.
When is the last time you saw a Japanese street in an anime that looked like real people lived there? When did you last see a classroom where the kids were kids - not actors reading lines that an adult wrote remembering what they wanted to of what school life was like, and throwing away the rest. Heck I've even seen anime where bullying happens where it seems that the classroom is still clean enough to eat off the floor, and you get the feeling the bully doesn't have any real problems to deal with.
I'm not going to say this is the greatest anime ever - goodness knows I hope that I never do that on the first episode of anything. But I do think this one tried to be art done as anime, and on that count I think it fully delivered.
I'll be waiting in the other room for the lynch mob...
Marcus H.
2013-04-05, 19:52
On a serious note, the "realistic" rendition of the characters and the overall feel of the setting reminds me of BECK. That said, I did not like BECK because it was too realistic and thus, too bland.
GenjiChan
2013-04-05, 19:54
Worst anime design ever!!!! Animatrix is way better!!!
Guys, with this designs and if this is a murder anime... I gonna wet myself at the first glimpse of impending doom....
Kirarakim
2013-04-05, 20:12
The rage in this thread is hilarious :heh:
The episode was a little slow but honestly I liked the realism of the episode.
Someone said watch live action if you want realism but even in live action you don't get true realism. This isn't really realism either but I do appreciate the effort at conveying something close to it.
I am not sure if I am going to like the story but this episode did make me pay attention.
vansonbee
2013-04-05, 20:18
The rage in this thread is hilarious :heh:
The episode was a little slow but honestly I liked the realism of the episode.
Someone said watch live action if you want realism but even in live action you don't get true realism. This isn't really realism either but I do appreciate the effort at conveying something close to it.
I am not sure if I am going to like the story but this episode did make me pay attention.I respect that and I can see the production team tried to make them look realistic in an anime sense, which was a bad decision on their part. Maybe I'm reaching for a series that has the same slow pacing where the characters go through everyday life problems like us.
I'm going to follow this for a few more episodes, I've been holding myself back on reading any further into the manga (good part atm :().
wow... I am really really pissed off right now... There was a chance to make something refreshingly different and by different I don't mean putting a turn in a urinal. Just why...
Let's back up a sec, there's stylizing and then there's warping things so horribly that you don't even recognize them anymore.
What did Sawa look like in the mange?
http://imageshack.us/a/img221/2999/613019.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/613019.jpg/)
Okay, now how does she look?
http://imageshack.us/a/img341/9057/43973130.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/341/43973130.jpg/)
???????????
I have to say, the manga design for that character really looks like generic manga/anime crap to me. Can't fault them for going with something more unusual with the anime.
We already have tons of series that go for the cookie-cutter, generic anime design every season, and I'm so sick of it. I'm glad there is still someone left that at least tries to do something different.
Marcus H.
2013-04-05, 20:22
Thank to Kanon's post on the previous thread, I finally discovered the term for my negative reaction to the character design: the uncanny valley.
serenade_beta
2013-04-05, 20:23
What did Sawa look like in the mange?
http://imageshack.us/a/img221/2999/613019.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/613019.jpg/)
Okay, now how does she look?
http://imageshack.us/a/img341/9057/43973130.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/341/43973130.jpg/)
???????????
Wa-wa-wa-wait! Le-le-le-lelelelet's calm ddddown!
........(( Д ) ﾟ ﾟ
FredFriendly
2013-04-05, 20:36
I watched the episode having only read the basic description (boy reads books, like certain girl, steals her panties, was witnessed by other creepy girl who uses knowledge to control him). Didn't know the source, hadn't read any comments in this forum, didn't know anything about the animation style.
I guess I was on the fence about watching another episode, that is, until I read all the comments about the episode in this forum from people who had, and many [most?] who apparently hadn't, watched the episode.
But, unlike all the haters here who think the visuals are the worst thing to happen since the Lumière brothers created the whole moving picture industry, my concern was whether this was, at its core, going to be another "girl controls guy through blackmail because guy would be embarrassed if truth were told" kinda story, of which there seems to be a growing number lately. And it looks like it will be, albeit dressed up in darker clothes than the most recent series that just finished airing.
Fortunately, among the rage and filth being cast at this episode here in this forum, there are actually a few intelligent and insightful comments about the episode itself. It reminds me of the old saying, "can't see the forest for the trees." Many here don't seem able to "see the episode for the animation style." Hopefully, all those haters really will drop the series so the rest of us (there's gotta be at least a half-dozen, right?) won't have to wade through so much hate here in the forum after the next episode.
I am not bothered by the animation style at all. In fact, I rather liked it; it was a welcome change from the typical rainbow hair-colored moe and Western looking characters. If this is supposed to be a psychological drama centered a Japanese high school, then the more realistic-looking the characters are (meaning less cartoon-like), the better. It adds more realism to the story being told. Not like the source material artwork, you say? I don't care since I have no intentions of reading the source material (unless the anime series inspires me to do so).
Back to my initial issue. For now I'm hopping on the next episode side of the fence. Having read the initial description, I had doubts if I would want to watch more than the 1st episode. Having watched the first episode, it's clear that this isn't going to be the typical "girl controls boy" type of series, and it's because of the animation style's influence that I will continue to watch, at least for another episode.
ZODDGUTS
2013-04-05, 20:43
Don't remember the last time we got an anime that had asian looking character design, interesting.
I honestly couldn't sit through that. Wonder why they chose that kind of style.
GenjiChan
2013-04-05, 20:48
I honestly couldn't sit through that. Wonder why they chose that kind of style.
Well it has a creepy mood in it...
SquirrelLuvsPnut
2013-04-05, 20:56
I don't think there would be as much rage if the whole animation style hadn't been kept a secret for so long. There was this huge build up and then the let down. If we had seen what it was right away, then perhaps it wouldn't have been such a shock.
I don't think there would be as much rage if the whole animation style hadn't been kept a secret for so long. There was this huge build up and then the let down. If we had seen what it was right away, then perhaps it wouldn't have been such a shock.
Maybe they wanted the shock factor. You guys seemed really shocked and upset so I'd say the director definitely made an impact with you guys. :heh:
Maybe they wanted the shock factor. You guys seemed really shocked and upset so I'd say the director definitely made an impact with you guys. :heh:
Yeah,that what I get from the interview from a couple pages back:
The interviewer asks about the impact the visuals would have on viewers, and Nagahama says he's well aware that a lot of people will go "what the fuck" and "this is gross," "I hate this, I'm not watching this." But he's pretty much okay with that, too, because he thinks it's fine as long as it leaves an impact on people.
FredFriendly
2013-04-05, 21:33
Don't remember the last time we got an anime that had asian looking character design, interesting.
Some of the characters in Chihayafuru, for instance, have an "Asian" look to them. Indeed, at least one of the characters looks like a Westernized caricature of a Japanese teenager. It's becoming, in the typical anime, the only way to know if someone is a foreigner is if they have blonde hair (as opposed to pink, blue, green, and any other of those realistic hair colors).
One of the other things that intrigued me about the episode was, as NaweG pointed out, the realistic looking environment: streets that weren't spotless, a bent street sign, grubby and broken bits here and there. I don't know if that's a realistic look of a Japanese city, but it looks real to me.
I don't think there would be as much rage if the whole animation style hadn't been kept a secret for so long. There was this huge build up and then the let down. If we had seen what it was right away, then perhaps it wouldn't have been such a shock.
Or, haters would have had that much longer to rage and complain. Frankly, I just don't see what the big deal is. When the animation team used a rotoscope-like process for Kids on the Slope, people raved about it. But here it's worse than a thick layer of tar on burnt toast? I find it hard to believe it's such a BIG issue that the whole series is ruined. What about watching the series for the story? Reading some of the comments hear makes it sound like people are going blind just by watching the episode.
Reckoner
2013-04-05, 21:35
Yeah,that what I get from the interview from a couple pages back:
This is not directed at you but the comment by the mangaka.
Great, we're shocked. Now what?
That comment honestly strikes me as very weird. The impact of the story is already present in the manga. Why did he feel that changing anything so drastically was a good idea? I could understand if this different visual style was actually done well, but clearly from the episode (I have seen it now btw), is poor. This isn't even good rotoscoping.
Looks like we'll all be eating shit this season. We're all shit-eaters after all.
Xion Valkyrie
2013-04-05, 21:50
Yeah,that what I get from the interview from a couple pages back:
The problem is that only works if the viewer actually sits through the entire series. If people are watching the first episode then dropping, then the studio is failing to deliver the meaningful story to the audience. Something like that generally works better for movies or other performances where it's unlikely for most viewers to walk out in the middle. In the case of an anime, the negative impression has even prevented people from even checking it out.
The animation wasn't a total disaster, in my eyes, but I struggle to see what advantage the rotoscoping process used here carries over live action, which is clearly what the producers were going after — the execution is such that every potential positive is countered by a negative. The realism of the faces is frequently lost in inadequate shading and poorly detailed line work. Subtle shifts in expression are overwhelmed by jittery strokes and a low frame rate. (I jumped to a couple of spots in the episode to check, and all of them seem to have been drawn on threes, meaning about ten frames per second.) The backgrounds are great at setting atmosphere, but the reuse of major parts of the school commute scene was unnecessarily distracting. "At least it's not generic moe design" is a weak defense; the substitute needs to be competent in its own regard.
The sound design is pretty good. I suppose one of the advantages of actually having the locations set up with actors is that you can capture real ambient noise. That being said, the opening song just doesn't belong. Sorry.
they need remove this shit from crunchyroll
Yeah, seriously. Imagine what all their 13 years old subscribers would say if they saw this. Crunchyroll is supposed to be an anime channel, dammit!
vansonbee
2013-04-05, 22:05
It will be a week till the rants of ugly drawing will calm down. :D
I hope the one's that are following still, would keep me updated in this thread. If the performance is top notch and feels enticing, lmk ^^
Reincarnated
2013-04-05, 22:07
won't say it's ugly; it's creepy. Which is I'm curious whether it'll add the creepiness of the series....in unique way :heh:
The rotoscoping might have worked, but the execution is horrible. I don't think I've ever dropped an anime for art style reasons - I mean, I watched all of Kingdom even through the really poor CG animation in the early episodes but still enjoyed it. This? I don't think I can. Oh well, I can always pick up the manga.
This is uglier than 3D... good job, I think these people deserve an award for trolling.
Utsuro no Hako
2013-04-05, 22:27
I think there was a thematic purpose to that actually.The reason why they only adapted 20 pages of first chapter and used same footage was to show monotony and repetitious activity of adolescent life.
Yeah, in fact the manga uses the same technique.
When he will get fired (and i really hope they fired him) for awfull dvd sales i want to hear him speck again and i will laught hard.
This show was never going to be a hit -- no matter what animation style they use, the plot is too far removed from what otaku like. If there was ever a series to go crazy experimental with, this is it.
One of the other things that intrigued me about the episode was, as NaweG pointed out, the realistic looking environment: streets that weren't spotless, a bent street sign, grubby and broken bits here and there. I don't know if that's a realistic look of a Japanese city, but it looks real to me.
A number of studios these days (KyoAni and PA Works in particular) send people out to photograph locations, so the show isn't unique in that regard. In fact, I think Another had streets that were even grungier than this. But what made the locations seem real to me wasn't just how they were drawn, but how people moved about them. In most anime characters and backgrounds are animated separately, so there's some disconnect with how people move about their environment, but here we're watching people move about in a real environment even if it's not the exact environment that's animated.
GundamZZ
2013-04-05, 22:29
Don't remember the last time we got an anime that had asian looking character design, interesting.
Not another generic comment...
Japanese viewers actually made some satirical artwork based on this comment.
The manga story didn't attract me. So, the new anime style is quite refreshing. I still hope manga artist's other work will be animated. If they animated Drifting Netcafe(not animated) with this style. I'll probably be mad. It's fine they do it for Aku No Hana. So, I applaud them for taking bolder approach than Shaft. (Side note: Shaft likes to do experimental work, even at the cost of distorting original work. The fans still buy it.)
Guardian Enzo
2013-04-05, 22:32
The irony for me is that I was already torn on whether I wanted to follow this, because the manga is intentionally such an unpleasant experience. Now added to that is that the visuals in the anime are likewise an intentionally unpleasant experience. Doesn't make the decision any easier.
Aku no Hana is a grim and masochistic story to follow to begin with, and with the look of the anime... It's certainly like nothing else currently airing, that's for sure. I'll give the anime credit (it shares a director with the sublime Mushishi) - it does a very good job at creating a sinister and foreboding atmosphere. It also does a fine job painting just how dreary and unpleasant adolescent life usually is, which - like the ugly characters - makes a stark contrast with what's usually presented in anime.
I can definitely see why some fans are a bit upset (just not THAT level of upset). More realistic visuals aka "grittier" I can welcome, but the choppiness and weird dull expressions, aside from the one or two detailed closeups make me feel a bit disconnected from the people I'm watching. The "piece of shit" incident, which is the highlight of the manga's first chapter, is just kind of low-key and uninteresting here.
OJz2WB3dF10
There's always a shitstorm every season, isn't there?
Haven't watched tge episode yet but I am loving the character designs. Relax people, this is tame compared to other seinen character designs out there *laughs*. Anyway, if there's anything I hated about the manga, it was that godawful generic otaku designs. Glad Nagahama took control. ;)
Haven't watched tge episode yet but I am loving the character designs. Relax people, this is tame compared to other seinen character designs out there *laughs*.
If the characters actually had more defined lips and noses (or,you know, faces not only in close ups) like in plenty of seinen manga character design I wouldn't have an issue with the visuals.
Azuma Denton
2013-04-05, 23:24
Seriously ZEXCS??
You put some detail in background art but you couldn't put some detail on character design?
Even the OP is just some slide show?
Are you trying to be SHAFT??
Are you trying to be SHAFT??
No,Arve Rezzle (http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=8878) is zexcs trying to be shaft ;) I'm not even kidding.
I think that decided to animated it like that with reasons,being it intense storyline with psycho actions or unappropriate behaviours of characters.They used so called 'new innovation artistic' to release seriousness of story. This way makes only real fan continue watching it. Less criticism from society.
darkchibi07
2013-04-05, 23:46
Haven't watched tge episode yet but I am loving the character designs. Relax people, this is tame compared to other seinen character designs out there *laughs*. Anyway, if there's anything I hated about the manga, it was that godawful generic otaku designs. Glad Nagahama took control. ;)
Now the big question is will this style be able to carry along the intended story they want to tell. Nothing's worse than a disastrous experiment.
Marcus H.
2013-04-06, 00:02
Nothing's more hilarious than a disastrous experiment.
Fixed that for ya. ;)
The irony for me is that I was already torn on whether I wanted to follow this, because the manga is intentionally such an unpleasant experience. Now added to that is that the visuals in the anime are likewise an intentionally unpleasant experience. Doesn't make the decision any easier.
I haven't read the manga, but I hazard the difference here is that the unpleasantness of the thematic content isn't easily mistaken for incompetence, while the unpleasantness of the adaptation's animation is.
articuzwolf
2013-04-06, 00:05
Kinda hate myself from hating Magi or Kingdom in the past few seasons
they were actually not that bad...
If the characters actually had more defined lips and noses (or,you know, faces not only in close ups) like in plenty of seinen manga character design I wouldn't have an issue with the visuals.
Eh, didn't really bother me. Like I mentioned, I've seen worse (and by worse I mean bizarre/outlandish designs).
Now on to the first episode, I think I'm in. Really, that was quite an experience, such a pleasant surprise for me as I thought the manga was merely so-so (though it had an interesting story to tell, wasn't impressive visually for me). I love the attention to the little details here, the uneven roads, rusty steel pipes, decaying structures, the ripped posters, Kasuga's barely there smile as Saeki takes a glimpse of him... Voice acting is very different as well (or at least different from the typical seiyuu acting) which is something it has in common with Mushishi as well.
And oh, that dark, ambient background music is eerily similar Atticus Ross' soundtrack for The Social Network. Interesting...
I don't have much to add to the rotoscoping debate, but my God the sound design is fantastic. Perhaps with the added visual task of reading subtitles our brains miss out on some of the audio information we are being presented, but if you close your eyes and just listen it's simply wonderful.
I don't have much to add to the rotoscoping debate, but my God the sound design is fantastic. Perhaps with the added visual task of reading subtitles our brains miss out on some of the audio information we are being presented, but if you close your eyes and just listen it's simply wonderful.
QFT
On the top of my head, I can only name three anime that delivers something similar audio-wise: Ghost Hound, Shigurui, and Lain.
taichi-kun
2013-04-06, 00:49
No No No
Bad very bad.I'll drop this right now...
Please no anime version of Tokiwa or I'll have nightmares :(
I feel like this series is better to listen to than to actually watch it
And oh, that dark, ambient background music is eerily similar Atticus Ross' soundtrack for The Social Network. Interesting...
You weren't the only one — the music in the trailer reminded me strongly of Reznor and Ross' work on Ghosts I-IV.
Dawnstorm
2013-04-06, 01:16
From the very start, when I heard "rotoscoping" I was worried. I'm surprised how much I actually like the visuals. Once I got used to it, it was nice to not have any more lines that necessary (line from the anime, probably Beaudlaire in Jpanese? "I despise all movement that displaces lines" - heh). Very slow pace, monotonous soundtrack, but there's a constant fading in and out (volume for sound, line details for visuals) and that makes for a very interesting effect (something, btw, that's probably harder to pull off in live-action films, since you'd have to work with filters or whatever - not an expert). Sometimes the back of a head might remind me of that strange flower...
I'm pretty happy with episode one, actually. I certainly don't think it's incompetence.
OJz2WB3dF10
Setting this to a-ha's "Take on Me" is a stroke of genius. You'll need to know the video to get the joke.
***
Oh, and I absolutely love the opening and ending. :D
Maybe I've just watched far too much anime to actually be bothered by animation quality. :heh:
As for the actual show itself, I realize it's supposed to be some psychological thriller/drama/etc, and that it's likely supposed to be a slow burn, and, yes, the ending, but gawd that was one boring 23 minutes and 59 seconds of my life.
I think painting my walls using my eyelashes as a paint brush would have been more exciting and rewarding.
Guardian Enzo
2013-04-06, 02:20
As to the visuals, I share the belief that many viewers are missing the larger point of these artistic choices. They're choices - mostly.
But here's the problem. Just as the show's attackers are missing that point, the staunchest defenders are swallowing a lot that seems like simply shoddy work as being all in the name of art. This isn't trying for photo-realism - in life people's movements aren't jerky because of low frame rates and their faces don't disappear more than 10 feet away from you. Some of this is being done simply because it's cheap, and frankly, it's not especially skillful use of rotoscoping as compared to some.
This reminds me of SHAFT, in a way, using tricks to make up for a lack of animation quality and chalking it all up to stylistic choice. Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't.
Marcus H.
2013-04-06, 02:26
^ The main difference is that SHAFT has shown to have pulled this off quite nicely with the Bakemonogatari series (which are monsters in itself when it comes to sales), while we only have the bold words of the director and the mangaka in our hands. Not to mention ZEXCS is quite a notorious animation studio for producing not-so-commercially-successful series.
If Aku no Hana will only push through for the sake of artistic recognition, I may not care anymore if they bomb spectacularly. I'm not sure if ZEXCS doesn't mind losing money from this audacious project, though.
As to the visuals, I share the belief that many viewers are missing the larger point of these artistic choices. They're choices - mostly.
But here's the problem. Just as the show's attackers are missing that point, the staunchest defenders are swallowing a lot that seems like simply shoddy work as being all in the name of art. This isn't trying for photo-realism - in life people's movements aren't jerky because of low frame rates and their faces don't disappear more than 10 feet away from you. Some of this is being done simply because it's cheap, and frankly, it's not especially skillful use of rotoscoping as compared to some.
This reminds me of SHAFT, in a way, using tricks to make up for a lack of animation quality and chalking it all up to stylistic choice. Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't.
I think one of the big things that Aku no Hana really brings up is: How far can you ride the "art style" train until it goes too far. Before I say anything, I admit to having only seen comparisons and clips of the first episode, and I've not read the manga or really heard of Aku no Hana prior to it appearing this season (it was on my plan to watch list, but I've removed it for the time begin. It's safe to say this is a permanent decision).
Call it a choice, call it an art style. You're technically correct by saying that. However, this is real life and we don't do any of that "everyone is beautiful for making their own choices" BS. The art in the anime is far from the look of the manga. The anime versions of the characters are bulbous, featureless, and flat, even strangely proportioned. If the characters looked more like the manga characters, I would accept it; and if the characters looked realistic, I would accept it. They don't fit either category.
As you say, it is cheap and it is not skillful. That's an issue. It's also an issue is people are accepting of what I can only call intentionally poor craftsmanship. At least in the case of studios like SHAFT, when quality suffers it tends to be more of a one-off instance. There was an issue with Psycho-Pass where people felt that a couple episodes (which were slower-paced, dialogue-heavy episodes) were poorly animated, while the rest of the show was (in my opinion) beautiful.
Reckoner
2013-04-06, 02:50
As to the visuals, I share the belief that many viewers are missing the larger point of these artistic choices. They're choices - mostly.
But here's the problem. Just as the show's attackers are missing that point, the staunchest defenders are swallowing a lot that seems like simply shoddy work as being all in the name of art. This isn't trying for photo-realism - in life people's movements aren't jerky because of low frame rates and their faces don't disappear more than 10 feet away from you. Some of this is being done simply because it's cheap, and frankly, it's not especially skillful use of rotoscoping as compared to some.
This reminds me of SHAFT, in a way, using tricks to make up for a lack of animation quality and chalking it all up to stylistic choice. Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't.
I think people could care less about what tricks they used or what choices they made so long as it looked good. As you said, there is just a lot of shoddy work done here and the aesthetic choices here are quite questionable. People give SHAFT the pass often enough because the visuals they do are genuinely interesting and aesthetically pleasing to a lot of people.
Was the idea itself fundamentally flawed? I'm not going to make that call, since I read the manga I of course prefer that they retain the manga's style. The simpler question here is whether or not they successfully implemented rotoscoping in the show and that would be a big resounding NO.
ScudFace
2013-04-06, 02:56
The character designs may not be pretty in the traditional sense but I think it suits the story, perhaps even more than the manga art style which is kind of generic. The story is twisted and should make you uncomfortable to watch so I think the fact that people found the visuals disturbing is what the director intended.
disturbing doesn't mean that it would have to be bland and flat though.
it's like defending a horror game for having atrocious gameplay mechanics "because it's a horror game"
It's not even the rotoscoping itself that makes me cringe, it's HOW half-assed the final result look like.
Compare it to the movie A Scanner Darkly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Scanner_Darkly_%28film%29) that also uses rotoscoping but manage to give a 2.5D feel. Objectively, I can't say A Scanner Darkly is one of the best movies ever made, but from a aesthetic pov, I fucking love it for the mood it manage to set.
Z2HP25bKztE
uh, is that "buttshit-insane" tag at the bottom intentional? shouldn't it be batshit-insane?
Master Assassin
2013-04-06, 03:51
I wasn't planning to watch the anime and stick to the manga to begin with, but hot damn what I'm seeing is quite... something.
In my point of view, while I can applaud them for trying, I can't give them credit because from what I'm seeing from screenshots, it looks cheap and shoddily done. Never mind the choice of "design" they chose to go with. Actually, I can't really call it "design" because while rotoscoping makes more frames, you don't just stop there and copy your "reference" film almost verbatim showing little to zero effort in actually making a "design." And you don't just skip out on the background scenes by skipping facial features and just giving them outlines filled with colors. Rotoscoping is much more than that. If that's the way they choose to do things, might as well go all out on it, and have it show on the end result. Right now it simply doesn't look like they did.
I understand their efforts, however it is simply not enough to appeal especially when you take the seat of an audience. Considering what the audience has seen before (and used to, even to the most welcoming of audiences), it wouldn't be a wonder why they'd put a "drivel" label on this.
Azuma Denton
2013-04-06, 03:51
As to the visuals, I share the belief that many viewers are missing the larger point of these artistic choices. They're choices - mostly.
But here's the problem. Just as the show's attackers are missing that point, the staunchest defenders are swallowing a lot that seems like simply shoddy work as being all in the name of art. This isn't trying for photo-realism - in life people's movements aren't jerky because of low frame rates and their faces don't disappear more than 10 feet away from you. Some of this is being done simply because it's cheap, and frankly, it's not especially skillful use of rotoscoping as compared to some.
This reminds me of SHAFT, in a way, using tricks to make up for a lack of animation quality and chalking it all up to stylistic choice. Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't.
If they try to imitate SHAFT, then they fail horribly...
SHAFT being no budget when animating SZS and Bakemonogatari, limit those close up face scene to avoid being so blatant about the animation quality. While in Aku no Hana case, i dunno why they have many focus on character faces.
Guardian Enzo
2013-04-06, 03:53
I don't think we can hold an anime from a notoriously low-quality studio up to the standard of a Hollywood film - even an indie one - but yes, whatever you think of the idea of using rotoscoping, the execution in Aku no Hana simply isn't very good. It's clumsy, bare-bones work.
To some extent I give Nagahama credit here for a courageous move - I would guess there was a calculation made that since this was Zexcs and probably had a very tight budget, since the animation was going to be crap anyway they might as well go for something completely unexpected and claim it was all on purpose. And it's worked - I don't think there's any way Aku no Hana would have gotten this kind of attention if it had been the usual Zexcs mediocrity when it came to visuals.
Again, I think there's a lot of parallel to a SHAFT release here, as people are falling all over themselves to sound edgy by embracing all this money-saving trickery as a bold artistic choice. But sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, and sometimes crap animation is just crap animation. SHAFT gets away with it partly because Shinbou has talent and sometimes manages to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, and partly on reputation. Plus, he has an innate ability to hook up with material that likewise substitutes flash and attention-grabbing trickery for substance.
Will it work in the case of Aku no Hana, which is about as challenging and genuinely hostile towards the audience as manga material gets? We'll see. There are times when Shinbou's flim-flammery doesn't work either artistically or commercially (last season has an example).
It's not even the rotoscoping itself that makes me cringe, it's HOW half-assed the final result look like.
Compare it to the movie A Scanner Darkly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Scanner_Darkly_%28film%29) that also uses rotoscoping but manage to give a 2.5D feel. Objectively, I can't say A Scanner Darkly is one of the best movies ever made, but from a aesthetic pov, I fucking love it for the mood it manage to set.
Z2HP25bKztE
I like the fact that even though it's animated, Keanu and RDJ is so easily distinguishable.
I didn't even know who was in it before I hit play. :heh:
Hmm guys? Sometimes when people like something, they're not trying to be hipster. I don't think anyone here has been applauding the budget because well I think the show itself is proof enough.. Cinematography and sound design though is another beast entirely which I place more credit to. To each his own. *shrugs*
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