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Fighter Volk
2004-04-22, 10:00
Well I'm bored so I decided to translate the episode previews in NewType for a lark. Here they are.


The Tainted Child

Ed & gang had met a boy by chance on Yokku island.
He seems to have a loss of memory and Izumi quickly brought him to her home.
The fact that the boy can perform alchemy without using sigils weighs heavily on Ed's mind, and he creeps into the boy's room from the ceiling to spy.


So, it seems we'll learn some more about this child, which we all very obviously want. It also seems we get to see more Sneaky Ed (although I personally think Sneaky Al is much funnier :heh: ). I hope we see more of 'Roy and the Gang of Five', and perhaps Greed and his chimeras will finally re-enter the storyline? Agh, whatever, I want any and all sins to come back :D

This is going to be a great one.

sarcasteak
2004-04-22, 10:44
I'm really surprised the anime crew decided to bypass the whole Automail Valley short-arc (which was boring and pointless in my opinion) and went right with more plot movement with this mysterious kid and more conflicts (based on the rest of the previews Yebyosh translated). A decision I entirely support as we'll likely see more of Winry's interactions with Al and Ed!

This is going to be a great one.
FMA is one of the few series that I can proudly say anime > manga, /discussion.

This entire "tainted kid" arc is so intriguing to me not just because it's anime-exclusive but also the mystery it brings with his off-tone body parts that eerily resemble the ones Ed has lost and "happy" appearance beside Envy in the opening. Okay, I lie; I'm hooked because I can't spoilers for it from the manga! Nuuuuuuuuu!~

Fighter Volk
2004-04-22, 12:49
I'm really surprised the anime crew decided to bypass the whole Automail Valley short-arc (which was boring and pointless in my opinion) and went right with more plot movement with this mysterious kid and more conflicts (based on the rest of the previews Yebyosh translated). A decision I entirely support as we'll likely see more of Winry's interactions with Al and Ed!

What was the Rush Valley mini-arc? Can you provide me with some info on what happened? I'm just curious ^_^

This mini-arc is definitely intriguing. I think it'll lead in to something none of us saw coming, and explode viciously into the fight with Greed, and finally shock us with an amazing episode 38/39 to finish this OP/ED sequence-arc. I have really really high hopes for the next ten or so episodes, not to mention what will happen later :D

sarcasteak
2004-04-22, 13:35
What was the Rush Valley mini-arc? Can you provide me with some info on what happened? I'm just curious ^_^
I'm going to use PM, okay? I don't want to get yelled at again... :(

Edit: PM sent! The adventure of Mistress Winry and her two slaves, dum dum dum!

Fei-san
2004-04-22, 15:10
I'm going to use PM, okay? I don't want to get yelled at again... :(

Edit: PM sent! The adventure of Mistress Winry and her two slaves, dum dum dum!
You know that sounds really kinky :heh:
Well personally i dont give a rats ass about that kid, i just want some more Homonculus

Fighter Volk
2004-04-22, 17:10
I'm going to use PM, okay? I don't want to get yelled at again... :(

Edit: PM sent! The adventure of Mistress Winry and her two slaves, dum dum dum!

Thanks! :D Well, apparently it was pretty unnecessary for the anime since most of the scenes already happened in episodes 7, 17, and 26. I also liked it a lot more that Izumi found the Elrics rather than them actually seeking her out -- it seemed much closer to their personality to lie to the military about it and actually do things their own way :heh: Anyway, thanks a lot!

Lexander
2004-04-22, 17:28
That kid was freaky ... did anyone else notice how one of his hands was slightly different color?

ChainLegacy
2004-04-22, 20:00
This kid looks extremely interesting. I can't wait to find out what exactly he is.

sarcasteak
2004-04-22, 21:13
That kid was freaky ... did anyone else notice how one of his hands was slightly different color?
Lexander, check out the Episode 28 thread--it should almost be renamed to the "Uknown Kid Discussion" thread :heh:

Navi en Grey
2004-04-23, 00:48
Another "mysterious character" topic? ....

- Navi

OMchan
2004-04-23, 17:30
The Official Site (http://www.sonymusic.co.jp/Animation/hagaren/onair/index.html) has updated with the six screenshots from Episode 29.

This should be a very interesting episode. Can't wait.

sarcasteak
2004-04-23, 17:37
Another "mysterious character" topic? ....
Nah; if you were referring to the thread title, that's just the title of the episode from NewType that Yebyosh translated.

OMchan
2004-04-24, 07:02
Episode 29 screenshots (http://wgalland.hp.infoseek.co.jp/) are up.

Hehe.. like in the first OP, Winry is shown sleeping with a wrench. :heh: And Ed seems to notice the thing with kid's arm as well..

And the kid also seems to have Ed's leg as well.

Scrumhalf
2004-04-24, 08:23
Episode 29 screenshots (http://wgalland.hp.infoseek.co.jp/) are up.

Hehe.. like in the first OP, Winry is shown sleeping with a wrench. :heh: And Ed seems to notice the thing with kid's arm as well..

And the kid also seems to have Ed's leg as well.

Wooo~!~!
Even more Winry eyecandy for us :naughty:
However, I didn't like the Winry/new kid shots though :/

Yebyosh
2004-04-24, 09:10
And it looks like they are showing The Truth!

Fei-san
2004-04-24, 09:20
The series under FMA looks really strange :heh:
the episode is looking so sweet aswell :p
.....
And what series is that with the girl in the cage and all the holy sexyness? :naughty:

OMchan
2004-04-24, 10:11
I uploaded the screenshots from Episode 29 ... but they're not in order. ^^;; I had to lower the quality tremendously for Photobucket. XP

FMA 29 - 01 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s01.jpg)
FMA 29 - 02 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s02.jpg)
FMA 29 - 03 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s03.jpg)
FMA 29 - 04 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s04.jpg)
FMA 29 - 05 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s05.jpg)
FMA 29 - 06 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s06.jpg)

sarcasteak
2004-04-24, 10:26
More Winry...more Alycia-chan! :bow:

Fighter Volk
2004-04-24, 10:29
I uploaded the screenshots from Episode 29 ... but they're not in order. ^^;; I had to lower the quality tremendously for Photobucket. XP

FMA 29 - 01 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s01.jpg)
FMA 29 - 02 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s02.jpg)
FMA 29 - 03 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s03.jpg)
FMA 29 - 04 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s04.jpg)
FMA 29 - 05 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s05.jpg)
FMA 29 - 06 (http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/fma_29-s06.jpg)

WOW!!! Lust, Sloth, and Envy reappear! More of the Fuhrer! GREED IN THE NEXT EPISODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D

Zauren
2004-04-24, 14:59
WOW!!! Lust, Sloth, and Envy reappear! More of the Fuhrer! GREED IN THE NEXT EPISODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D

No Gluttony? Whatever happened to that delightful doughball?

Fighter Volk
2004-04-24, 19:37
No Gluttony? Whatever happened to that delightful doughball?

I really hope he's in there... still, Sins are great however you slice 'em. Although slicing them won't cause damage. Whatever, they're great :)

OMchan
2004-04-24, 19:51
I just watched Episode 29 and it was interesting.. The kid cries easily though. XO And Izumi seems to know something about him. And look! The cloaked guy!! XD
Anyway, can't wait for Episode 29 to be subbed and Episode 30 looks interesting. ^^;

Kouji
2004-04-24, 19:57
Where'd you see ep 29 at?

ArbalestAS
2004-04-24, 19:58
I really hope he's in there...

he is!!! he's just sleeping face down on a bed.....it's pretty funny

Lexander
2004-04-24, 20:13
No Gluttony? Whatever happened to that delightful doughball?
So many people to eat so little time.

inu-fma88fan
2004-04-24, 21:13
lucky...i don't know jap and i need subtitles...
u think anime keep will be the first one out for 29

Kouji
2004-04-24, 22:30
It's usually Sonchou fansubs followed by AKeep-ANBU in that order.

ChainLegacy
2004-04-25, 09:07
That's not always true, Akeep-ANBU has released faster than Sonchou numerous times before.

This episode looks to be extremely interesting. I can't wait.

nubby
2004-04-25, 12:38
about the kid
ok new spoiler. the kid seems to be Ed's clone, that explains why he looks so much like Ed. hair, eyes, face, body, height, etc. I'm not sure about this but I think the kid was cloned using the fox that bit Ed's arm while he was training on the island. he has characteristics of a fox like running on all 4, chasing mouses, etc. In the episode, they also showed a creepy old guy who kinda looks half man, half lizard. His lower body being the lizard part with the tail and the likes.

Yebyosh
2004-04-25, 12:48
Some tidbits garnered from this episode... (Chinese sub ktxp)

Anime Sloth is the youngest Sin.

Izumi knows a lot more about Homunculus and could be the source of information later in the future.

Shigu sleeps with his eyes open & snores :p

Greed's Chimeras have started to appear.

dreamless
2004-04-25, 16:00
I think that kid could be Pride. Sloth was the youngest before, so Pride is just born. Also judging from how Izumi said "do you know how a homunculus is made?" and then goes to the island and shocked at the "site of birth", maybe hinting that kid is indeed a homunculus... maybe the perfect homunculus spawned from the Truth?

Yoshi31
2004-04-25, 16:03
or!
he is ed and al's father's transmutation! it makes sense doesnt it?

terky
2004-04-25, 16:36
about the kid
ok new spoiler. the kid seems to be Ed's clone, that explains why he looks so much like Ed. hair, eyes, face, body, height, etc. I'm not sure about this but I think the kid was cloned using the fox that bit Ed's arm while he was training on the island. he has characteristics of a fox like running on all 4, chasing mouses, etc. In the episode, they also showed a creepy old guy who kinda looks half man, half lizard. His lower body being the lizard part with the tail and the likes.

Just from reading that and not having seen the ep yet some speculation comes into mind. And i ahve a question. Can none of the Homonculus perform alchemy or could the PERFECT one perform it? cuz isnt the perfect one supposed to be a human?

sarcasteak
2004-04-25, 16:52
Just from reading that and not having seen the ep yet some speculation comes into mind. And i ahve a question. Can none of the Homonculus perform alchemy or could the PERFECT one perform it? cuz isnt the perfect one supposed to be a human?
As far we are told and shown, the homonculi cannot perform alchemy though they do have their special abilities. And yes, your theory about the perfect homonculus is valid, although if someone did succeed in making a perfect homonculus, wouldn't Lust and co. become true human as well and no longer need the Philosopher's Stone?


Anime Sloth is the youngest Sin.

Izumi knows a lot more about Homunculus and could be the source of information later in the future.
Yaaaaaaaay so the secretary IS Sloth...awesome! The more Sins the merrier! :D

ZeroKun
2004-04-25, 17:14
The kid has ed's arm and leg from when he lost them, where they went after he lost them, noone knows, but now theyre on the kid.

Sonhex
2004-04-25, 17:24
I'm totally confused now...good episode though.

I'm wondering why was the US flag in the montage during Ed's 'truth' retelling. In fact that whole montage of 'real world' images just didn't make sense to me as I thought FMA was set in its own 'world'.

Does the 'truth' transcend time, space and parallel universes or something?

Sonhex

sarcasteak
2004-04-25, 17:58
Does the 'truth' transcend time, space and parallel universes or something?
To clarify my view on the whole topic and concept of Truth will involve heavy manga spoilers that don't belong in this thread...:(

Here (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=172291&postcount=10) is what I said about the Truth based on what I've read; click on the second spoiler if you don't mind the manga spoiler.

OMchan
2004-04-25, 18:14
Just something interesting that was shown in The Truth. :p

http://img26.photobucket.com/albums/v78/omchan/fma/plate.jpg

ElvenPath
2004-04-25, 20:48
Remember that from now on, manga spoilers (even within [spoiler] tags) aren't allowed in episode threads.

Technovia_EX
2004-04-26, 03:02
This was the most confusing episode I've ever saw, it almost rivaled Evangelion... There was so many new characters, new details, new mysteries... Episode 29 boggled my mind... And at the end of it, I liked what I saw :).

A/A is out with 29.


Ha! Now we know the background behind why people saw Ed with two arms and one leg in the beginning of the series... There was a reason, not an animation error

Scrumhalf
2004-04-26, 04:13
Yes, a very confusing, yet another magnificant episode of FMA as usual. :)

Now that Ed finds out about the kid having his arms and legs; what do you guys think? Will Ed even think about killing him off to get his parts back? Or will he stick to being 'Edward the man' & eventually letting him off with sympathy and sticking to his automail?

Winry seems to be great with kids we've seen so far in the series (ie. Elysia, Manny, that new kid), apart from her 1337 mechanical skills. Winry > Roze. Mmmm bedshot Winry :naughty:

Scrum
PS. About that kid; is he the same age as Ed/Winry or Al? Or is he younger? Just wondering.

threepac3
2004-04-26, 04:24
Damn do i love FMA, every episode seems to answer old questions, then throws a whole lot of new ones at u.

My theory about the boys existence:
It seems that from what i gater from the previews that the boy might be sensai's son or some thing. Maybe she tryed to transmute him and failed(or thought she did).


This episode explains why the boy is able to transmute things with out an alchimy circle.

Yondaime
2004-04-26, 04:48
what were those weird black/shadow creatures that were attacking Ed?

- Yondaime

Spooky-Electric
2004-04-26, 04:59
Something I noticed, when Ed was seeing "The Truth" there were some images from the future in there with Ed, Al, and Nina. Also I think there was an image of what looked to be Ed and Al's dad. Not sure though.

Scrumhalf
2004-04-26, 05:09
Also; I'd like to point out:

Who the hell was that lizard-like guy with the sakkat & glasses on the rooftop watching Ed chasing the kid?

Ooh...lots of mind-bendin' ;)

Seta
2004-04-26, 05:29
The guy in the cloak at the end might be Envy or some random chimera. Envy said he would go investigate the Elric Brothers or Greed could have sent one of his chimeras. And I have a small feeling that the new military guy could be Wrath based on his similarity to the "samurai" guy in the intro and his love of war. There is a good chance I could be wrong though since their hair color is different despite their similar faces.

Yondaime
2004-04-26, 05:36
this image here http://img36.photobucket.com/albums/v110/halcloud/hagarenscans/animage02.jpg shows the mystery boy's name starts with an "R" and has some kanji/kana for his name/description, Izumi has an "I" as well as her name in kana and a description (the other pages do the same with "E" and a name and description for Envy, a "S" with a name and description for Sloth, a "G" and the same for Greed etc. So I wonder what the "R" for the boy stands for :o and also are those black shadow people/creatures grabbing at Ed, minions of the Truth? or sumthin? the mysteries!!! ;)

- Yondaime

Spooky-Electric
2004-04-26, 05:36
The guy in the cloak at the end might be Envy or some random chimera. Envy said he would go investigate the Elric Brothers or Greed could have sent one of his chimeras. And I have a small feeling that the new military guy could be Wrath based on his similarity to the "samurai" guy in the intro and his love of war. There is a good chance I could be wrong though since their hair color is different despite their similar faces.

Actually that new military guy being Wrath makes sense because didn't he send someone after the Elric brothers? He said he didn't want them running around like Mustang let them do. Hmmm..

Maybe not though, it could just be another one of those Homunculus or chimera as you said.

Maro-chan
2004-04-26, 09:26
Whoo, when i first saw the "truth" i got really interested of it, so i checked through all the pictures (or atleast most of them, as they flashed really fast and some were really blurry) and saved 'em to my comp.
I love history so it was nice recognizing the places and events. I hope someone else finds these pics interesting too. ^^
(i'm really pondering what the anime makers were thinking while doing ep29, because just how is our "real world" connected to the fantasy world of full metal alchemist.... o.- )

Anyways, here they are:
http://img58.photobucket.com/albums/v177/marowak/ed_dream1.jpg
all the way to
http://img58.photobucket.com/albums/v177/marowak/ed_dream55.jpg

(ignore the filename.. it should be "truth" not "dream")

DutchReloader
2004-04-26, 10:09
I also checked the pictures in the "truth". There was one picture of Churchill and Stalin o_O, but I forgot to capture it.

oasis
2004-04-26, 10:32
The Truth rocks =) Dinosaurs and apes! Shouldve been some 2001 Monolith in there too.

Though it puzzles me why knowing technology/evolution/genetics/totalitarianism/US flags and jap cars would help anyone do alchemy without an array. (or alchemy in the first place)
Maybe its enlightenment or sth. "Whoa. I know kung fu."

Nine Devil
2004-04-26, 10:38
damn this episode was nice, can't wait to see 30.

avmoghe
2004-04-26, 12:44
Ok... thats more like it! Very kick-ass episode... glad they got the plot moving again! Last couple of episodes have been a bit too slow.

I really hope they handle this "truth" business appropriately... when anime tries to mess with "god" or philosophy.. it ususally ends in disaster.. (bad memories from evangelion). I pray that this show handles it properly... because an otherwise fantastic series would be thoroughly ruined.

other random thoughts -

Izumi knows how to transmute without using a circle as well.... which would mean that she herself has tried to transmute a human, and has seen the truth. Is that right? She seems to have all her limbs intact though... maybe she lost her child this way? (random guess)

Mustang seems to be settling into Central city with his group. Now that he has some books Hughes was reading.. he should be set on a similar trail as Hughes. It remains to be seen whether he suffers the same fate as Hughes...

Next episode seems like its going to be an all out war, if the preview is to be any indication... I can't wait... seems like Izumi is going to be in action. We should be able to see if she's any decent at combat..(all we've seen her do so far is make that wall I think).

roudy000
2004-04-26, 13:03
maybye Izumi is bound to Ishbal case....and that maybye she's not the only one who have seen the "truth" ...I could think about a lot of thing but its really confusing..

Sparkie
2004-04-26, 13:25
Izumi knows how to transmute without using a circle as well.... which would mean that she herself has tried to transmute a human, and has seen the truth. Is that right? She seems to have all her limbs intact though... maybe she lost her child this way?

hum her limbs are intact but wasn't there something about her organs? :twitch: dunno remember reading something about that. And I saw something in the truth, who is this, is it who I think it is?

http://www.clubs.nl/ClubsData/231605/incoming/001.jpg

The Elric Bro' Father?!

Sonhex
2004-04-26, 13:36
hum her limbs are intact but wasn't there something about her organs? :twitch: dunno remember reading something about that. And I saw something in the truth, who is this, is it who I think it is?

http://www.clubs.nl/ClubsData/231605/incoming/001.jpg

The Elric Bro' Father?!

Hmm don't think so... that's a character from ep 16 - one who lost his limbs and his daughter nicked Ed's leg to give it to him...

Sonhex

Sparkie
2004-04-26, 13:45
Hmm don't think so... that's a character from ep 16 - one who lost his limbs and his daughter nicked Ed's leg to give it to him...

Sonhex


aah yeah I remember now :heh: sorry minor details like that are stuff I easily forget -_-

Joe Dalton
2004-04-26, 15:43
What was hinted in this ep...

Homonculus are created when someone attempts human transmutation and this kid is 1 seeing as envy was also able 2 change her body form.
The shadows you saw in the truth are people that died... since I only saw young people perhaps only childs.
This kid is as old as ed and al minus the years before they tried 2 transmute their mother since he was created when they did it.

A Lamer
2004-04-26, 15:55
Also the elric brothers father is blonde like ed.

Anyway, VERY VERY good episode, it proved ALOT of the speculation I had, even that the truth involved him transmuting his mother, and losing his limbs. Al isnt able to perform alchemy without a circle because he seemingly cant remember.

And now for some speculation.
The kid is most definatly comprised from ed and al's parts, theres just too much evidence to deny it. Equivilent trade is such a tricky thing as it is, I could see it as being the powers that be can ignore it, and hence gain everything while losing nothing (ed and al lost parts/all of their bodies, and gained their "mother", and the shadow creatures gained the body parts, and lost nothing. Leading to the speculation that the kid is definatly a shadow creature, even if he acts otherwise (maybe his memory was wiped?)

As for Izumi and the truth, shes always coughing up blood, even now after.. how many years has it been? I think the big guy isnt her original husband, and her original husband died while she was pregnant, so she tried to transmute him but lost her baby in return, and fucked up her internals. Then she meets and falls in love with the big guy.

Edit: and judging by the previews, I am thinking

Izumi will die :( If she does, that means no explanations for ed and al...

Sonhex
2004-04-26, 16:06
Edit: and judging by the previews, I am thinking

Izumi will die :( If she does, that means no explanations for ed and al...


You know, I was thinking the exact same thing. I really hope she doesn't as she's a great and intriguing character. But, with FMA sometimes you get the impression somethings going to happen... :(

Sonhex

Zhaxra
2004-04-26, 16:16
Now this is purly speculation on my part,

but if the child is a Homonculus and uses body parts for equivalant trade, then I believe that may explain why Sloth looks and sounds like Ed and Al's mother.
All in all a wonderful series so far, and finally a message board for FMA where the anime isn't spoiled by manga readers. Thank you.

Yoshi31
2004-04-26, 16:29
no no no remember in the episode he was at the gate right? ok then all the souls of the transumted were there trying to stop him. right? so then may be he got free druing the trade off

Grona
2004-04-26, 16:30
Thoughts on the kid and Izumi


Ahhh, well I know the sins can use alchemy, but the reaction that the kid had looked like it. That means nothing because can we all rember envy when he changes form, it has that llight and geometric look. So I'd say he is the next sin, possibly not even knowing what he is because of somthing that happend.Who knows, he might turn out to be a good guy, like the brothers pet homo :p Most likely the kid wasnt created by taking physical parts from Ed but looking at his memories, thats why he has the limbs that are missiing. Maybe he has a tendency to reflect a persons deepest desires in himself, therefor he has the limbs that Ed wants so bad

Next ep it looks like Izumi goes after the state alchemits branch or somthing. Maybe she knows more than shes letting on about the kid, she did visit the stone circle on the island, and the state alchemists are involved.

Another thing that just came to me is that Izumi lost her ability to have children before the brothers reach the island for the first time. Maybe the fox that bit Ed was the boy in a different form or somthing trying to get Ed's blood.



EDIT: more thoughts on Izumi
Rember back when the red water was in the process of being crystalized by the fake eric brothers? One method was to crystalize the water in preggy women. That sounds like what happened to Izumi since she seems to not be able to have kids. Maybe that failed and created the kid, only Izumi thought it was dead or never knew he was born

Zauren
2004-04-26, 16:55
Thoughts on the kid and Izumi


Ahhh, well I know the sins can use alchemy, but the reaction that the kid had looked like it. That means nothing because can we all rember envy when he changes form, it has that llight and geometric look. So I'd say he is the next sin, possibly not even knowing what he is because of somthing that happend.Who knows, he might turn out to be a good guy, like the brothers pet homo :p Most likely the kid wasnt created by taking physical parts from Ed but looking at his memories, thats why he has the limbs that are missiing. Maybe he has a tendency to reflect a persons deepest desires in himself, therefor he has the limbs that Ed wants so bad

Next ep it looks like Izumi goes after the state alchemits branch or somthing. Maybe she knows more than shes letting on about the kid, she did visit the stone circle on the island, and the state alchemists are involved.

Another thing that just came to me is that Izumi lost her ability to have children before the brothers reach the island for the first time. Maybe the fox that bit Ed was the boy in a different form or somthing trying to get Ed's blood.
]

I was thinking it didn't look that much like Alchemy. It seemed to only be a self-manifestation of items; Merging a rock with his hand, a bed with his body, or merging leaves into clothing. Notice when he was tackled by Ed, his clothing fell apart. Real Alchemy is permanent, not sustained like that. But if he was a perfect Homonculus, he could use Alchemy mayhaps. And also. it seems that Homunculus are those dark child-like things, that are born into the world after failed Transmutation within the form of the person that was wanted.


EDIT: more thoughts on Izumi
Rember back when the red water was in the process of being crystalized by the fake eric brothers? One method was to crystalize the water in preggy women. That sounds like what happened to Izumi since she seems to not be able to have kids. Maybe that failed and created the kid, only Izumi thought it was dead or never knew he was born

I was thinking the exact same thing, actually...

And another thing about Scar's brother...

Wouldn't that mean that he saw the Truth also? Maybe if one can see that grand equation, they can make the Philosopher's Stone...

A Lamer
2004-04-26, 16:58
EDIT: more thoughts on Izumi
Rember back when the red water was in the process of being crystalized by the fake eric brothers? One method was to crystalize the water in preggy women. That sounds like what happened to Izumi since she seems to not be able to have kids. Maybe that failed and created the kid, only Izumi thought it was dead or never knew he was born
Ah, thats a very possible explanation. I forgot all about that. That means she could definatly be linked to the philosphers stone as well as ishbal.

GrapeSoda
2004-04-26, 17:45
ok heres what i get from this

homonculus are the result at an attempt at human transmutation and they appear on that island at thealter. So the kid is the result of ed's attempt to do human alchemy. And the reason that the kid can use alchemy is because he has ed's arm and leg therefore he is part human.

Balbados
2004-04-26, 18:12
I also noticed that the kid's face look almost exactly like Al when he still has his body intact. Does this means he stole Al's whole body (and face) and add Ed's right hand and left leg?

Rrilltrae
2004-04-26, 19:16
NM, found out who is was, stupid similar character designs

NM, figured out who that guy people thought might be Ed's dad is... its the soldier who lost his leg in the war. Stupid red herrings...

Zauren
2004-04-26, 19:40
Whose that guy in the freezeframe...

http://www.acsu.buffalo.edu/~elc4/pics/Man.jpg

Comparing shots of Ed and Al's dad from the opening photo sequences to that new man shown for a frame and a half in the blur on info sequence in 29. (and I know he's supposed to have gold hair, but he did look a bit older in that shot, so greying hair's not that far off) This mystery man has the right facial hair and structure to match the brothers' Dad in the photo. Raises more questions than it answers, though

They look familiar somehow... Interesting find though. I'm going to have to go through that sequence a frame at a time also now. =D

Rrilltrae
2004-04-26, 19:43
They look familiar somehow... Interesting find though. I'm going to have to go through that sequence a frame at a time also now. =D


found him, read my editted post. Some other people saw the similarity too... must be that whole war torn square jawed soldier thing.

Tsukiyomi
2004-04-26, 21:27
doesn't this mean, we'll solve all the mysteries once we find out what those lil black people humanoids things are ?

Grona
2004-04-26, 21:37
lol, I just gotta say, all the similarties in people looking alike, I think are just the animation style :p

-|(aGe-BuNsHiN-
2004-04-26, 21:46
doesn't this mean, we'll solve all the mysteries once we find out what those lil black people humanoids things are ?

i think there is more to it then that cuz there is still a long way to go before this series is going to end...

About Izumi

although the speculation about sensei being an experiment for the philosopher's stone is pretty interesting, i think we have to look at this at a simpler way. I think the reason she can't have any more babies is because something happened while giving birth and it destroyed her uterus...its a common thing cuz my aunt can't have any babies cuz she lost her first. Well newayz, i'm thinking she tried to revive her dead baby and failed at that.

about next episode

i dont think its Izumi attacking the military but the military coming after the boy and her. Theres gotta be something more about that boy than merely being a homununculus having Al's arms. Remember Hughes said that the real goal of the enemy is not the philosopher's stone but something else? Purely guessing here but i think it has something to do with getting those "black figures" out of the gate...who knows just wait and see

Grona
2004-04-26, 21:53
i think there is more to it then that cuz there is still a long way to go before this series is going to end...

about next episode

i dont think its Izumi attacking the military but the military coming after the boy and her. Theres gotta be something more about that boy than merely being a homununculus having Al's arms. Remember Hughes said that the real goal of the enemy is not the philosopher's stone but something else? Purely guessing here but i think it has something to do with getting those "black figures" out of the gate...who knows just wait and see


heh, yea apperently they do want the philosopher's sone made asap but that seems to be only the first step. Maybe Mr.homo maker (possibly the brothers father) did die during his research and left instructions for his creations to seek out the brothers and force him to make the stone. I am thinking way too much :/ [/

fenrihr
2004-04-26, 22:01
hmm. those black people-like thingies.
i think they're souls. after al,l right before the gate closes one kinda looks like Al. it would explain why he would need to use his arm to do the alchemy to re-open the gate, at least i think i'll probably be proven wrong.

and then about the homunculus...

they're probably created everytime someone sees "truth" and if in the form of a sin, based on the sin that the person was committing at the time. let's say it's pride would make sense, Ed and Al were pretty proud of their training and the idea that they could bring their mother back....

at least that's the theory, anyways.

NocturnalFerri
2004-04-26, 22:08
regarding izumi:
Just to combine a few ideas, I think izumi's son died, not necessarily at birth, but maybe at the age he appears as now. Then Izumi tried to transmute him back but failed, and the equivalent trade was to mess up her organs, thus the coughing up blood thing and also to take away her ability to have more children. That's when she saw "the truth." I think it failed cuz there wasn't enough body parts traded in available. So, she left the island and when ed and al had their body parts taken away, they were given to the kid and he appeared at that stone circle place.

regarding homunculus:
i guess the same applies to them as well. They need to be made using the body parts of dead ppl. But in response to what someone said before about being able to use alchemy b/c he has human body parts, I think you'd need more than just individual parts to do alchemy...if that were the case, why doesnt the homunculus just lop off someone's arms and graft them into their own?

eh, but's that's all just specuation.

hehe. doesn't the kid remind you of Ed from Cowboy Bebop?

Ke0
2004-04-26, 22:47
Ok here's what I think

Izumi had a child, and it died, so she tried to revive it, and as "equavilent trade, she lost her womb (coughing of blood).

As for the kid having Ed's arms and legs. I think its all part of equavilent trade. When he tried to bring back his mother, he got his leg taken. Affixing Al's soul to the armor, he got his arm taken. Done deal. Now when the next person tries to do human transmutation, they get something taken away. (Izumi and her womb) if the transmutation is succesful, the created person has parts from another person's equavilent trade. So it forms a circle)

ArbalestAS
2004-04-26, 23:14
wait, wait, wait. i thought that the kid can't be a homunculus?? didn't izumi say that he couldnt be? homunculi can't use alchemy, but didn't the kid use alchemy?

sarcasteak
2004-04-26, 23:18
All signs point to "no, the kid is not a homonculus" if you define homonculus as someone like the Sins, but if he's just some other artificially-made human, then he fits the standard definition.

-|(aGe-BuNsHiN-
2004-04-26, 23:19
well the fact is the supposedly "homunculus" boy has Ed's arms. So i guess that means since Ed was able to use alchemy, so can he...just my speculation

ArbalestAS
2004-04-26, 23:25
did anybody discuss what that rock formation and trail was when izumi visited the island was? could it be where she tried to transmute or have anything to do with that lizard-lookin dude?

what are your thoughts?

-|(aGe-BuNsHiN-
2004-04-26, 23:28
im guessing those were a form of a transmutation circle that Izumi made before when she was trying to revive her son/daughter. I think it sort of serves as a gate way and the drag mark im guessing is the boy coming out of the circle...

rorosama
2004-04-26, 23:31
i hope izumi doesn't die!!! She's my new favorite character! She's strong and hot.

sarcasteak
2004-04-26, 23:35
Besides, the Homonculi (Sins) work together and know of each others' existence; it just doesn't seem that the other existing Sins know of this kid.

bayoab
2004-04-27, 01:28
The lizard is a chimera or is envy posing as one, not sure which bones is going to make him.

You people said you didnt want manga spoilers, so i wont tempt myself but ...
So far, you are all wrong about why she coughs up blood... well... she did see the truth obviously. (If you were paying attention to the last 2 episodes, this should be obvious by her wording of "you saw 'it' too".) This means she obviously tried to preform some sort of human transmutation. However, what she did, i wont say...

The rock alter is anime only. There is no answer to what that is yet.

Either bones will:
a) make it have something to do with what izumi did years ago
b) make it have something to do with the philosophers stone (the formation is similiar to that of the 5th library
c)some form of transmuation circle for bringing the kid to this world from the truth

sarcasteak
2004-04-27, 01:30
[bunch of spoilers]
Do NOT mention manga spoilers in episode threads please; you'll get the rest of us manga readers blamed again. :(

Always let other people speculate...that's part of the enjoyment of discussion on a forum. We should not rob them of that even if we know what happens next...

bayoab
2004-04-27, 01:37
Do NOT mention manga spoilers in episode threads please; you'll get the rest of us manga readers blamed again. :(

Always let other people speculate...that's part of the enjoyment of discussion on a forum. We should not rob them of that even if we know what happens next...
Blamed for what? Ive always labeled my spoilers properly. It is not my problem if people do not bother to read my warnings. Also, that is not a manga spoiler... the anime is completely off from the manga at this point. (Note I edited the spoiler for the lizard because i realized even if you read the manga it is a spoiler). <Resists anti-fanboy rant>. I actually purchased all of the japanese manga volumes myself and have been reading them and absorbing whatever i can. I dont always get the information right. People should be reading the manga as well to see how bad a butchering of the story line this is.... (waves volume 5 containing 3 full chapters of winry in tube top infront of the winry fanboys)...

sarcasteak
2004-04-27, 01:47
Blamed for what? Ive always labeled my spoilers properly. It is not my problem if people do not bother to read my warnings. Also, that is not a manga spoiler... the anime is completely off from the manga at this point. (Note I edited the spoiler for the lizard because i realized even if you read the manga it is a spoiler). <Resists anti-fanboy rant>
You are missing the point--the rule here is that in anime EPISODE threads you are not allowed to talk about manga spoilers, period. You may talk about them anywhere else, just not in here, not even if you label your spoiler tags properly. Yes, I know it's retarded...I've always marked my spoiler tags when referring to manga, but certain people don't read, click on them, and proceed to whine.

So please, just remove the manga spoilers altogether. <resists anti-fanboy rant>

bayoab
2004-04-27, 04:15
*points to sloth and greed
*points to vol 6 (where the anime technically is, right at the end of 6)
*blames the anime for spoiling the manga

tkcom
2004-04-27, 04:20
Now this is purly speculation on my part,
but if the child is a Homonculus and uses body parts for equivalant trade, then I believe that may explain why Sloth looks and sounds like Ed and Al's mother.


A major giveaway at the end of episode 15:


22:02 min - Fuhrer's secretary/Sloth escorting Marco into the car

http://www.thedreamerskingdom.com/fullmetalalchemist/images/15/fma-15-2202.jpg

22:10 min - Al: "Brother, I just heard Mom's voice."

http://www.thedreamerskingdom.com/fullmetalalchemist/images/15/fma-15-2210.jpg

Anthias
2004-04-27, 04:57
Wow - that ep was very cool.

Ed's a bad boy - not listening to what sensei tells him to do/not to do :)

Here's a silly theory:
someone said a theory about izumi's husband not being her first husband? well, what if that was scar's brother? :hmm:

wiebbe
2004-04-27, 06:18
Yup very cool episode indeed.


to be honest, iam think you got something there.
Remember when Scar saw lustfor the first time?
you saw a flashback of him sitting next to a woman that looked like Greed,
and had a tatoo on her chest.

Now i dont quite remember what episode that was (i think with the library battle) but that might show your theory is true :P



[edit] Ok i actually found the episode on the first try :P
[edit2] thanks for the correct name ;)
i cant keep them apart


But i dont think i was right :(
take a look at the picture:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~wiebbe/teacher.jpg
she does look like it a bit, bit a completely different hair style and
a much softer look on her face.

tkcom
2004-04-27, 06:20
Yup very cool episode indeed.


to be honest, iam think you got something there.
Remember when Scar saw greed for the first time? (greed is the woman, right?)
you saw a flashback of him sitting next to a woman that looked like Greed,
and had a tatoo on her chest.

Now i dont quite remember what episode that was (i think with the library battle) but that might show your theory is true :P



That was Lust.

Nagare Ryouma
2004-04-27, 06:47
the anime is completely off from the manga at this point. I actually purchased all of the japanese manga volumes myself and have been reading them and absorbing whatever i can. People should be reading the manga as well to see how bad a butchering of the story line this is.... (waves volume 5 containing 3 full chapters of winry in tube top infront of the winry fanboys)...

Hey Bayoab, how many Volume does the manga consist in total anyways? I mean obviously the animes story is pretty much different from the manga.... From my point of view...
It's obvious that Izumi has come to contact with the so-calld 'Truth' that Ed has encountered when he tried to resurrect his mom. But interesting enough, if the hand and leg on the kid are Ed's, how did it end up there in the first place? Unless Izumi and Ed both attempted on human transmutaion at the same time thus the Gate was manifested..... Or? And the Elric Bro's have been in the island for 2 whole months, which I'm sure they have checked thoroughly of the island, but it seems like that rock pile trasumation circle wasn't there then..... If so, they should have at least mentioned it. Plus what Izumi's husband mentioned about how the Elric bro's dunno how Homoculus were born.... that might be what Izumi wanted to do to on her dead child? Since it seems like they know on how to make it happen. Btw, he's man sure is funny... he sleeps with his eyes open! :twitch: Plus how Ed lost his arm and leg and Al lost his body, Izumi probably or might have lost part of her internal organs or heavily damaged it through the process when performing human transmutation... after all equalivent trade... Just some speculation, but the story is becoming full of mysteries.....

BonBon
2004-04-27, 06:59
I think that speculation about Lust is probably on the right track - didn't Scar say something like 'Why have you got that woman's face?'

So...homonculus are perhaps created when there is an attempt to create a human through alchemy. Lust = whoever Scar's brother was trying to revive, the secretary = Ed and Al's mother etc.

This makes the new boy different, because no-one (as far as we know) tried to make him with alchemy; rather, he was made FROM pieces sacrificed during the process.

Unless Izumi tried to create a son or something, and this is the result! It's possible that a new homunculus can only come into being when the available 'parts' are sacrificed by others.

Of course, I'd rather believe that Izumi created Gluttony when trying to transmute her very own living Mr. Potato Head...

-BonBon

bayoab
2004-04-27, 08:23
Hey Bayoab, how many Volume does the manga consist in total anyways? I mean obviously the animes story is pretty much different from the manga....

The manga is currently 7 volumes and i believe the material that will make up the 8th volume has already been published as individual chapters. Vol 6 goes through ch 25, vol 7 is through ch 29, and there are ~34 chapters out.
<Mini rant about the anime and manga story lines>
The anime was actually pretty much following the manga with a few changes (mostly in story order) for the first 3 or maybe has far as volume 4. After Marcoh's note however, the anime has become more and more distant. Currently, the scene at the very end of ep 29 is ~6 pages from the end of volume 6. The anime of course had a few eps that were not from the manga but from other related works. Of course at this point in the anime, the story line has been butchered so far from the manga that you cant really compare the material.
If you were reading the manga, at this point, you would still not know who Greed or Sloth is, hense my comment above.

None of the below is in the manga.... so if I get it right, dont go bitching...
So that would mean:
Scar's brother's wife = Lust (Scars brother)
The prisoners of the 5th lab = Greed (remember, he was sealed there) (The military)
Ed/Al's Mom = Sloth (Ed/Al)
(Izumi's attempt) = ? (Possibly Envy, not likely Gluttony) (Izumi)
(Gluttony?)
This theory actually is not bad... just need a few holes filled in...
This would make sense when they said that "Sloth was the newest one". And it sounds not like the human parts sacrificed create the homonucleus, but the person they are trying to CREATE makes the homonucleus. However, there are some things that would contradict this, but it sounds like an idea of what bones is trying to do.

Joe Dalton
2004-04-27, 09:01
Most people seem 2 agree that the anime is better then the manga in this case...
I think that bones decided the manga wasnt complete and added 2 it.

its verry hard 2 exactly explain the homunculus however it seems that they are created whenever someone sees the truth... It may actualy be that since 2 people wanted 2 do human transmutation that they dragged out 2 of them.
however I somewhat doubt this still.... I think there are still 2 many open questions for us 2 give any answers

Yebyosh
2004-04-27, 10:32
Note: Anime companies have to produce the materials for broadcast way before the broadcast date (for editing, quality assurance, censorship, etc). Hence their storyline (for consistency) must be done way before hand as well. With an ongoing manga, this becomes a problem when their production date (not broadcast date) is ahead of the manga schedule (which is slower on release, monthy). Hence they have the decision to either faithfully follow (with help from the mangaka) and end up like Flame of Recca (sad decision by and to all) or adapt what the mangaka has currently on hand to form the anime storyline. Whether the latter method succeeds is another subjective matter altogether (Current best example of adaptation gone bad is Chrno Crusade).

Anyway bayoab, the premise of what they adapted is promising to me. However some of the things they did I felt is dangerous in the point that potential plot holes are looming here and there. I'm not so ready to condemn what the series has become because so far it is still interesting... (though tottering, and yes the manga is better but that is that).

There are quite a lot of people confusing some people out there...

Facts:
1) Izumi already had the 'accident' before the brothers were on the island. Remember how she saved the dam and its consequences?

2) The woman with Scar's brother was shown all the time in a side profile and covered up. You do not see her skin.

3) Advanced Chimeras are man-animal hybrids.

4) Kid Alphonse is blond, has light grey eyes and a skin tone darker than Kid Edward. Current Edward is definitely not different from his kiddy years.

5) Edward's ability is not unique and not due to some fricking symbols inscribed on his Automail or something.

Grona
2004-04-27, 10:54
Blah, smarten up, there is a thread for manga discussion. Theres no reason to post any spoilers here, and frankly its rude for us that enjoy the anime.

ZeroKun
2004-04-27, 11:19
aaah!

That guy Armstrong was talking to is pride! He has to be, if you catch a glimpse of him in the opening both of their skin color look the same, and the hair.

Joe Dalton
2004-04-27, 11:33
Note:

Facts:

3) Chimeras are man-animal hybrids.



is that a fact? :p

Yebyosh
2004-04-27, 12:22
3) Chimeras are man-animal hybrids.is that a fact? :p Yes it is a fact. The basic Chimera in FMA is a hybridization of animals using Alchemy. Did you watch Episode 1?

Your mythical Chimera is a combination of dragon, lion, goat and more.

The advanced Chimera is a man-animal hybrid (man is an animal after all) Nina-Alexander and Shou-"whatever he grafted with" are the prime examples.

Hmmm perhaps I didn't word it Fact 3) properly

3) Advanced Chimeras are man-animal hybrids.

Blah, smarten up, there is a thread for manga discussion. Theres no reason to post any spoilers here, and frankly its rude for us that enjoy the anime. Is that directed at my post? I hope not or that means you have not watched any of the episodes such that you actually think what I state as facts are from the manga. If you are referring to bayoab, I fail to see where he had spoilt anyone with manga spoilers (if any). Frankly, it would be rude to make baseless accusations.

Joe Dalton
2004-04-27, 12:27
in this anime any hybrid formed together by alchemy is a chimera ;)

sarcasteak
2004-04-27, 12:51
If you are referring to bayoab, I fail to see where he had spoilt anyone with manga spoilers (if any). Frankly, it would be rude to make baseless accusations.
He edited his post already, that's why.

hunterx
2004-04-27, 13:36
ugh, yea it's quickly turning into the naruto forums, spoiler minefield. Eventually I gave up and read the manga and I don't even bother watching the anime anymore. It's probably best to stay away now since I happen to like watching fma anime

Kaeta
2004-04-27, 13:47
um...sorry to be slow..but I just wanted to be sure, in the preview for ep 30...um...was the guy with his hair tied the crimson alchemist?
He looks a bit like him.....I'm still not sure.....

sarcasteak
2004-04-27, 13:54
None of the below is in the manga.... so if I get it right, dont go bitching...
Oh don't worry about that...the only problem occurs when an unidentified (anime-wise) person shows up, people speculate who he could be, and then some manga reader slams the truth (I've done it before unintentionally...:( )

um...sorry to be slow..but I just wanted to be sure, in the preview for ep 30...um...was the guy with his hair tied the crimson alchemist?
He looks a bit like him.....I'm still not sure.....
I believe you are correct; the guy with Major Armstrong looks similar but has short hair instead.

Ke0
2004-04-27, 14:19
I think there are two ways to make a person. Alchemey and revival. I think the sins were made purely out of alchemey. They just resemble someone that the person who made them knew. I think the kid was "Revived" through alchemey, meaing he use to be alive, and was just brought back. Explaining why he can use alchemey..............It makes no sense I know but eh.

bayoab
2004-04-27, 14:39
Is that directed at my post? I hope not or that means you have not watched any of the episodes such that you actually think what I state as facts are from the manga. If you are referring to bayoab, I fail to see where he had spoilt anyone with manga spoilers (if any). Frankly, it would be rude to make baseless accusations.

Read the reason for editing. It was not any major spoiler anyway (such as winry dying in.... *evil smirk*). It was partially said by lust in 29 and seen back in the 5th lab.
Something that wasnt a spoiler.
Where did you get pride from. Pride has not even been mentioned in the anime once. (The guy in the opening with the pale skin is Envy, the guy who he is fighting in the end of the opening is Greed).
...
Also, the manga discussion thread is chapters 26+ basically. There is almost no discussion of before vol 6.

Zauren
2004-04-27, 15:21
aaah!

That guy Armstrong was talking to is pride! He has to be, if you catch a glimpse of him in the opening both of their skin color look the same, and the hair.

I was thinking something like that. He definately has the skin tone and eyes of a homunculus. But my bet right now is that it's Envy. But that would conflict a bit given Envy wasn't around all that time to masquerade as them. One of Greed's chimeras? Someone who is going to turn out to just be a Military ass and surprise us all when he simply isn't in the sun much? :>

Ambush Commander
2004-04-27, 20:26
Considering the "Pride" idea:

The Pride idea, though has some basis in the idea that Homunculus is formed when the person commits a certain sin as they do a human transmutation, doesn't hold water when the concept his compared to the other ones. If indeed the mysterious boy is "Pride", then "Envy" would have had to have been created out of a transmutation from envy, lust, greed and gluttony alike (Gluttony is the hardest to imagine... why would anyone transmute a human for gluttony?) In addition, Gluttony exhibits properties of his sin (he is very gluttony). So if this pattern where to hold, then Envy would have envy, and so on and so forth. So far none of the other Homunculus seem to have exhibited these properties, but the most unlikely is Pride. The other possibility is that the Homunculus are not necessarily all similar to each other (And indeed they do seem to have many differences).

If the mysterious character indeed is not a Homunculus, then there would be a lot of speculation on exactly who he is. Is he a type of "alternative" Homunculus since the series seems to be alluding on to the fact that he was created artificially? Remember, he can perform alchemy, although it is unintentional. Perhaps the other Homunculus can perform alchemy even though it is unintentional, and creating the Philosopher's Stone requires a very deliberate action. Or they could just be lying (Why trust Homunculus?)

Another speculation is what happened to that town we were introduced to at the very first episode. It seems that the Homunculus aren't staying there anymore, but could it have any connection to the new war?

In addition, what is so special about this island? If it is the island that Izumi attempted her human transmutation, what would be so special about the altar? Homunculus could not have been created there, because Greed was created long before Izumi was alive.

The black people in the truth probably are the souls of the people who lost their lives to the truth (the truth is dangerous people!) But is it the truth? Izumi questions Edward's labeling of the gate as "truth".

We still don't know where Edward's father is. Could he be behind all this?

Ugh... too much speculation. I'll just have to wait til the next episode.

Yebyosh
2004-04-27, 21:24
He edited his post already, that's why.
Ahh... is that it?

mmmkay, sorite.


um...sorry to be slow..but I just wanted to be sure, in the preview for ep 30...um...was the guy with his hair tied the crimson alchemist?
He looks a bit like him.....I'm still not sure.....
Yep, that's him.

Also, the manga discussion thread is chapters 26+ basically. There is almost no discussion of before vol 6.
You could always start it up in there :p I had started a favourite manga moment thread as well but nobody seemed to care :heh:

sarcasteak
2004-04-28, 01:20
So now we are 100% certain that the secretary is Sloth, right?

As for the guy Armstrong is with...it could be a possibility that he is Pride, but he was with General Hankuro if I recall correctly; if he were a homonculus shouldn't he be at a much higher rank? *shrugs*

If the mysterious character indeed is not a Homunculus, then there would be a lot of speculation on exactly who he is. Is he a type of "alternative" Homunculus since the series seems to be alluding on to the fact that he was created artificially? Remember, he can perform alchemy, although it is unintentional.
*concurs*

Or they [homonculi] could just be lying (Why trust Homunculus?)
*nods*

jakeellis01
2004-04-28, 03:28
Here's a question that may be already asked but i'm lazy to read all the thread :p :

If the innocent child had ed's arm & leg, does that mean that there is somebody else with al's body??

ZeroKun
2004-04-28, 04:05
Well i thought furher would be pride cause come on he doesnt look wrathful enough to be wrath, which he is because of the 3rd opening and his uniform. Being at a low position isnt bad if you want to get info, the one talking to armstrong is surely pride, just on a note i think ill freeze that frame in the opening with pride and try to post a pic later.
Goddamn i love this anime!

sarcasteak
2004-04-28, 04:18
Here's a question that may be already asked but i'm lazy to read all the thread :p :

If the innocent child had ed's arm & leg, does that mean that there is somebody else with al's body??
We can only speculate...*shrugs*

neoko
2004-04-28, 05:47
this episode just unleashed 50 billion more questions, i hope it's all clicking back into the story, until we get to somewhere intense, then it might drop out for a few eps (fillerS!) anyways next ep looks promising, the end bit DOES look like what you call - izumi is about to die, when she laying on the ground with blood coming out of her mouth, looking all beat up with her husband touching her or something. (I THINK!!)
Any ways, we can only hope, as another week passes!

Sonhex
2004-04-28, 06:20
Some observations -

We've seen the kid naked, Winry has bathed him - there doesn't seem to be a Humonculus tattoo anywhere.

Humonculus each have the same tattoo- Gluttony on his tongue, Lust on her cleavage, Envy on 'its' left leg, Greed on his left hand, not sure about Sloth's though (she probably has one but can't be bothered to look :heh: ) and they also wear a black outfit with 'points' on them. I won't delve into a mega Manga spoiler about these 'points' but they are important.

I don't think the Kid is a Humonculus...

Sonhex

Gurei
2004-04-28, 09:07
Has evryone forgotten about scar? The arm he uses can also do instant alchemy and it isnt his original arm.

Ive got the feeling the mistery kid and scar have gone through the same proces

XtlDragon
2004-04-28, 15:17
It wouldn't surprise me if the mysteryous boy is "the kid who accidentily got shot during the isshiball war"...

Fighter Volk
2004-04-28, 16:28
Well, I finally found a moment to watch this fantastic episode...

A lot of the stuff you guys mentioned was running through my head as I watched this one. Some speculation:

1 - There is someone out there who looks exactly like Al, in a similar vein to the Innocent Child

2 - The war-loving dude with Armstrong is Pride (what was his name again?)

3 - The lizard dude is either one of Greed's chimeras or Pride (I doubt it's Envy, I don't think a form like that would help her in any way)

I think the South Headquarters Assault referred to in Episode 30 is Greed finally making a move... and I think Kimberly with his new hairstyle looks really really cool :D

I'm also pretty sure this episode has just elevated FMA to number 1 on my favorite anime list. :)

OMchan
2004-04-28, 16:37
2 - The war-loving dude with Armstrong is Pride (what was his name again?)

Frank Archer.


3 - The lizard dude is either one of Greed's chimeras or Pride (I doubt it's Envy, I don't think a form like that would help her in any way)

Probably, but I don't really remember. ^^;

Fighter Volk
2004-04-28, 16:52
Frank Archer.

Thanks! Even if he isn't associated with the Sins in any way, I hope we see more of him, because he looks pretty cool.

BTW, OMchan, I love the sig and avatar :D

XtlDragon
2004-04-29, 08:26
I rethought about this whole thing and found out that it probably isn't my first statement but i think it is.....

Envy's 'lost' original form. Judging that Envy can't remember her/his original form and the mystery boy can't either. AND, in the OP movie you see them stand next to each other!

Or it is just close to what is in the spoiler tag (note: just my opinion is inside the spoiler tag)

EDIT:

and i think the lizard guy is just Clutonny undercover.

sarcasteak
2004-04-29, 08:40
Envy's 'lost' original form. Judging that Envy can't remember her/his original form and the mystery boy can't either. AND, in the OP movie you see them stand next to each other!
A plausible theory, but then why can't Envy perform alchemy if they are of the same type? Is it just because the boy got Ed's arm? (I don't buy that...)


and i think the lizard guy is just Clutonny undercover.
But we have never seen Gluttony go anywhere on his own without Lust's supervision...has he, before? (I don't remember)

XtlDragon
2004-04-29, 08:46
Yeah, i know that Envy can't perform Alchemy, but i think Envy will at least be connected with the boy in some sort of way. Or maybe Something like.. they used Envy in order to create the boy, but now Envy can't remember his true form because certain things they took away from Envy? That seems logic to me. Only... for what reason would they do that?

Well, i don't think that there's a rule he follows not to do things without Lust's supervision. Look really good to the eyes.. Just Clutonny's.

Joe Dalton
2004-04-29, 10:58
A plausible theory, but then why can't Envy perform alchemy if they are of the same type? Is it just because the boy got Ed's arm? (I don't buy that...)



But we have never seen Gluttony go anywhere on his own without Lust's supervision...has he, before? (I don't remember)


You have not been paying enough atention :)
We have seen the sins perform the same type of "alchemy" as the boy on several ocations where they change their body structure.
It really looks like the boy and the sins are the same type (only different personalities) of .... creatures
But you cant be certain with this anime the plot is pretty unpredictable for the most part... dont think anyone saw it comming that there would be a boy with eds limbs before they saw the pics :)

sarcasteak
2004-04-29, 11:02
You have not been paying enough atention :)
We have seen the sins perform the same type of "alchemy" as the boy on several ocations where they change their body structure.
It really looks like the boy and the sins are the same type (only different personalities) of .... creatures
Negative.
The Sins' "alchemy" perform very specific functions using specific portions of their body (Envy is a shape-shifter so of course he can use his whole body); this kid, however, transmuted leaves to clothing and bed into a hybrid with his own body...how is that same type of alchemy? :confused:

Joe Dalton
2004-04-29, 11:26
Negative.
The Sins' "alchemy" perform very specific functions using specific portions of their body (Envy is a shape-shifter so of course he can use his whole body); this kid, however, transmuted leaves to clothing and bed into a hybrid with his own body...how is that same type of alchemy? :confused:

in the fight VS scar we see lust change her body as well so its not just envy. that can alter his body structure... also some other ocasions that
also you shouldnt forget. we have not seen the full extend of what they can do yet.
But so far all have very special bodily types of alchemy.. we have not seen the kid transmute anything besides into his arms and leg.
So in those ways I would say they are the same.. but I wouldnt dare 2 say 100% on this since this writer is verry good and hard 2 predict.

sarcasteak
2004-04-29, 11:53
in the fight VS scar we see lust change her body as well so its not just envy. that can alter his body structure... also some other ocasions that
also you shouldnt forget. we have not seen the full extend of what they can do yet.
Sigh, did I have to be even more specific?
[specific portion of their body] -> [specific function]
Lust extends her fingers -> to cut through anything like knife through butter
Gluttony uses his mouth -> to dissolve whatever he bites
Envy modifies his entire body (exception) -> to change the appearance of his body

[Note: Envy can alter his entire body because his main purpose is to shape-shift, not battle like Lust and Gluttony are for]

They can modify their own bodies (which is unique) but cannot do "alchemy" in the normal alchemist sense of performing a transmutation which the mysterious kid seemingly did.

But so far all have very special bodily types of alchemy.. we have not seen the kid transmute anything besides into his arms and leg.
So in those ways I would say they are the same.. but I wouldnt dare 2 say 100% on this since this writer is verry good and hard 2 predict.
The bolded part is true, which I agree to, but what about the leaves that the boy transmuted into clothing on the island? Unless you're going to argue that the clothing becomes a part of his body, that doesn't work.

And yes, the people who come up with this story are quite unpredictable... :)

Joe Dalton
2004-04-29, 12:27
Actualy I believe we have seen lust change her entire body structere as well... I cant remember the specific fight but she sends a large part of her body after her victim (i think she kills whoever it was)
But I cant check that since I dont have all episodes.. ill check the ones I do have but dont think its 1 of them.
What happened witht he clothes is something verry strange... since alchemy is usualy permanent not something that just poofs back into its original form when something happens.
I am also wondering if the fact that he coppied his clothes from edward (wich must have happened during their trial) has something else 2 it.. other then they are cool clothes :)
So I would actualy dare 2 argue about this...

But in all honesty I doubt argueing this will help since there are so many questions left unanswered in the power of the sins and where this boy came from. It can still go into many dirrections.
Ofcourse would you want 2 debate some more ill gladly go on... but then id rather do it in some instant messenge since I hate waiting for replies :)

sarcasteak
2004-04-29, 12:58
Actualy I believe we have seen lust change her entire body structere as well... I cant remember the specific fight but she sends a large part of her body after her victim (i think she kills whoever it was)
But I cant check that since I dont have all episodes.. ill check the ones I do have but dont think its 1 of them.
I don't recall an incident in which she changed her whole body, but the closest I can think of is the time Lust visited Marco in episode 16 starting at 9:00. So far Lust has attacked Marco, Scar, and Al, and only in the case with Marco did she extend her fingers dramatically.

What happened witht he clothes is something verry strange... since alchemy is usualy permanent not something that just poofs back into its original form when something happens.
Well, a skilled alchemist like Ed can probably reserve the transmutation and change it back to whatever the creation originally was, but yah the way the kid's clothing suddenly reverted to its original state as leaves was very strange.

But in all honesty I doubt argueing this will help since there are so many questions left unanswered in the power of the sins and where this boy came from. It can still go into many dirrections.
Indeed there are too many uncertainties. However, I believe each Sin's ability is very simplistic in nature and specific; clearly this is not the case for the mysterious kid, and thus I don't consider him as a Sin (but I did not rule out that he could be a homonculus by definition).

Ofcourse would you want 2 debate some more ill gladly go on... but then id rather do it in some instant messenge since I hate waiting for replies :)
Nah...I prefer discussions in coherently written instead of just tibits thrown out here and there.

p1tang
2004-04-29, 14:03
what's the ability for sloth?

sarcasteak
2004-04-29, 14:27
what's the ability for sloth?

Check my post in this thread: Confused About the Homonculus (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=12651)

Fighter Volk
2004-04-29, 14:40
This is pretty far-fetched, but maybe the only reason the Innocent Child can use alchemy is because of Ed's arm, but he cannot do it consciously because only one arm works and the other doesn't...

Yeah, it's wrong and all but with FMA it's a possiblity :)

Zauren
2004-04-29, 15:51
I still think that the Kid is a Homonculus. I don't think he uses Alchemy in the traditional sense, but instead can just form his body like a chimera with items. Turning his hand to stone, merging leaves with his body for clothing, becoming one with his bed... All of it reverted back to normal when he just /thought/ of his original form (Bed) or when he was startled (Clothing and stone-hand), something enormously different from Alchemy. Not to mention he doesn't clap his hands, it just happens in a manner similar to Envy's metamorph. The only point that seems to contradict my idea is at the end of Episode 29, where he seems to break the window with Scar-brand alchemy... Hmmm. I'll still stick to my idea until more tangible evidence is made. =)

Ambush Commander
2004-04-29, 17:47
So basically Homunculus can perform advanced alchemy that is normally forbidden but only a very small sample and not in conventional means...

But I noticed that all of the other Homunculis seem exceptionally evil... the new character is nothing like that.

Sonhex
2004-04-29, 18:01
So basically Homunculus can perform advanced alchemy that is normally forbidden but only a very small sample and not in conventional means...

But I noticed that all of the other Homunculis seem exceptionally evil... the new character is nothing like that.

Remember how he seemed to enjoy inflicting pain on the rat he caught (which Ed steadfastly rebutted him for)...a hint of what might transpire perhaps?

He's innocent,unaware and has no concept of good and evil - under Envy's influence we could see him become a truely dispicable character.

Of course, from the OP, we're assuming it's the Kid who turns evil, not Envy who turns good - now that would be a plot twist and then some :heh:

Sonhex

-|(aGe-BuNsHiN-
2004-04-29, 18:02
well considering the fact that even a serial killer is nice when he/she is a baby may answer the question. It seems that the child was only formed recently since the drag mark is still at the island so i guess he still cannot grasp the concept of the world in which he is.

the thing about the homunculus using alchemy, although they can perform incredible alchemy, they are able to only do a certain kind of alchemy. For instance, lust with the claws, gluttony with the acidic teech, and envy with the transformation and this new kid with some kind of self-altering kind of thing.

Zauren
2004-04-29, 18:10
Remember how he seemed to enjoy inflicting pain on the rat he caught (which Ed steadfastly rebutted him for)...a hint of what might transpire perhaps?

He's innocent,unaware and has no concept of good and evil - under Envy's influence we could see him become a truely dispicable character.

Of course, from the OP, we're assuming it's the Kid who turns evil, not Envy who turns good - now that would be a plot twist and then some :heh:

Sonhex

Don't forget, there's nothing more pure and cruel then a child. =) What I found most disturbing about him was how casual he was saying 'Wanna play? Everyone else is dead.' Brrr! Creepy kid!

Zauren
2004-04-29, 18:12
well considering the fact that even a serial killer is nice when he/she is a baby may answer the question. It seems that the child was only formed recently since the drag mark is still at the island so i guess he still cannot grasp the concept of the world in which he is.

the thing about the homunculus using alchemy, although they can perform incredible alchemy, they are able to only do a certain kind of alchemy. For instance, lust with the claws, gluttony with the acidic teech, and envy with the transformation and this new kid with some kind of self-altering kind of thing.

All of the Homunculi use alchemy that is basically personal human transmutation more then anything. They all reform their bodies, or use it in a physical manner, including Gluttony's eating. Wouldn't the kid becoming a Chimera with physical objects be the same? And Izumi seems to think he is one.

By bet? Al and Ed are wrong. What they are seeing isn't Alchemy, but something else. Who knows what the tattoos really do in the Anime...

neoko
2004-04-30, 10:48
The kid can fuse things together ? Is that his special ability? But what happened to his clothing then? Didn't it turn into leaves or something?
Anyways, i can't believe the manga and anime vary so much, because sloth in the manga is some guy and in the anime it's a woman resembling ed/al's mother - this brings about major changes.
Any ways...i can't wait until the next episodes comes along :D

sarcasteak
2004-04-30, 11:58
Don't forget, there's nothing more pure and cruel then a child. =) What I found most disturbing about him was how casual he was saying 'Wanna play? Everyone else is dead.' Brrr! Creepy kid!
Hehe so innocent yet so creepy! I guess the lil' critter himself doesn't sleep...?

The kid can fuse things together ? Is that his special ability? But what happened to his clothing then? Didn't it turn into leaves or something?
Exactly. That's the main reason I don't buy the theory that he is a Sin-like homonculus.

Ambush Commander
2004-04-30, 16:01
...sloth in the manga is some guy and in the anime it's a woman resembling ed/al's mother...QUOTE]

I just realized something, could this sin have been formed because Edward's Father was too slow coming home (sloth)... just some wild speculation.

And it's also starting to look like this new kid is a Homunculus.


[QUOTE=neoko]
The kid can fuse things together ? Is that his special ability? But what happened to his clothing then? Didn't it turn into leaves or something?

Exactly. That's the main reason I don't buy the theory that he is a Sin-like homonculus.


Think about it. All of the homunculus activate their powers by thinking about it, and then, they revert back to their original forms (except maybe Gluttony, we have no proof that his teeth aren't acidic all the time). Since the newest kid is so new, he probably doesn't know how to control his powers (versus Envy or Lust), and thus the effect is short lived... he could probably transmute himself with another thing indefinitely if it was enough.

Another thing, if this kid is a Sin, and he comes from the gate, supposedly there would be a lot of sins, because there were a lot of people at the gate.

Zauren
2004-04-30, 16:16
Think about it. All of the homunculus activate their powers by thinking about it, and then, they revert back to their original forms (except maybe Gluttony, we have no proof that his teeth aren't acidic all the time). Since the newest kid is so new, he probably doesn't know how to control his powers (versus Envy or Lust), and thus the effect is short lived... he could probably transmute himself with another thing indefinitely if it was enough.

Another thing, if this kid is a Sin, and he comes from the gate, supposedly there would be a lot of sins, because there were a lot of people at the gate.

There's simple proof that Gluttony isn't always acidic-teethed. When Lust and Gluttony first visited Marco, Gluttony had a girl's head in his mouth as a threat to force him to cooperate. Imagine how painful that would be if his saliva was acid at the time. =)

Ambush Commander
2004-04-30, 16:18
There's simple proof that Gluttony isn't always acidic-teethed. When Lust and Gluttony first visited Marco, Gluttony had a girl's head in his mouth as a threat to force him to cooperate. Imagine how painful that would be if his saliva was acid at the time. =)

Exactly. More proof that the new kid is a sin.

tkcom
2004-04-30, 22:19
<- Like this?

I don't think Gluttony's saliva is the hazard part but his gluttonous habit of eating without regard of taste probably is.

Yebyosh
2004-04-30, 23:30
gyThere's simple proof that Gluttony isn't always acidic-teethed. When Lust and Gluttony first visited Marco, Gluttony had a girl's head in his mouth as a threat to force him to cooperate. Imagine how painful that would be if his saliva was acid at the time. =)Exactly. More proof that the new kid is a sin. And how is that proof that he is a Sin?

Just because Gluttony doesn't have acidic teeth?

If it is because the Sins can control their powers and this new kid seemingly can (he can't yet), in the same vein, you might as well call a Mage a Cleric just because both can throw magical effects around.

sarcasteak
2004-05-01, 00:29
Hey, who is that big buff guy? He could be a Sin, too! Oh wait, that's just Izumi's husband. Hmm, how about that mysterious looking military guy with Armstrong! He certianly looks pale...must be a Sin! How about the lizard in cloak? He a Sin too? And what about the glasses guy who found Black Hayate? He probably was a Sin sent to stalk Mustang...probably a Sin, too.

Zauren
2004-05-01, 00:50
gy And how is that proof that he is a Sin?

Just because Gluttony doesn't have acidic teeth?

If it is because the Sins can control their powers and this new kid seemingly can (he can't yet), in the same vein, you might as well call a Mage a Cleric just because both can throw magical effects around.


Hey, Clerics pray for 'miracles', it's different. :D It's still my opinion though. The Gluttony thing was in regards to another saying that Gluttony was always-acid thoug, not proof for it.

Ambush Commander
2004-05-01, 18:56
gy And how is that proof that he is a Sin?

Just because Gluttony doesn't have acidic teeth?

If it is because the Sins can control their powers and this new kid seemingly can (he can't yet), in the same vein, you might as well call a Mage a Cleric just because both can throw magical effects around.


Well, I'm not saying that it "prooves" he's a sin, it just adds additional evidence as there is a definitive correlation between the different sins. If he is a new sin, he could probably be one of the most powerful.

Yebyosh
2004-05-01, 23:55
Hey, Clerics pray for 'miracles', it's different. :D It's still my opinion though. The Gluttony thing was in regards to another saying that Gluttony was always-acid thoug, not proof for it. Yesterday 13:29 That's the point, you know as well as I do that Clerics pray for manifestation & Mages cast by bending the magical energies to their will. But to an ignorant fella who knows nothing of D&D, they just look like casting the same magic. So what's the difference to them?

Likewise you & I cannot profess to be experts on Homunculus biology & eldritch capability. So by simply saying that one can seemingly activate his powers by will, so the other guy by seemingly able to do so proves that they are the same, is a false statement.

Well, I'm not saying that it "prooves" he's a sin, it just adds additional evidence as there is a definitive correlation between the different sins. If he is a new sin, he could probably be one of the most powerful.
Eh... "more proof that he is a sin". I'll give it that you worded it badly.

Like I said, that is not a good evidence to say the kid is a sin. The Ouroborus symbol however is a piece of good evidence since no other characters in the FMA world has it besides the Sins.