Shakugan no SHANA Anime Season 1 Discussion

[SeedFreedom]

thought this great (and one of my favortie) animes deserves its own thread again.

Im a little behind in the series, but i've been keeping up with the spoilers.

[LytHka]

Some info: (I would have liked to put this in the first or second post)

Shakugan no SHANA (灼眼のシャナ) is a novel thats published under the seinen(young men's) label Dengeki Bunko.
For now there are 13 volumes released of this novel (volumes 1-12 and volume 0 which was released after volume 9), here are the covers:

These are volumes 1-9 of the seinen novel:

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/6081/novel14uk.jpg http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/927/novel22st.jpg http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/3107/novel32jz.jpg http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/9650/novel41ks.jpg http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/602/novel53ul.jpg http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/2360/novel64gt.jpg http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/203/novel76vj.jpg http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/4684/novel88hp.jpg http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/5595/novel92uv.jpg

This is volume 0 of the seinen novel:

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4829/novel06sx.jpg

These are volumes 10, 11 and 12 of the seinen novel:

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/2185/novel109qy.jpg http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/424/novel117de.jpg http://img485.imageshack.us/img485/4786/vol129of.jpg

Author: Takahashi Yashichirou
Artist: Itou Noiji

A manga based on the novel is serialized in the seinen(young men's) manga magazine Dengeki Daioh.
For now there is one volume released of this manga.

Here is the cover of the seinen manga:

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/2537/manga13ji.jpg

Genre: Seinen, Fantasy, Comedy, Drama

Shakugan no SHANA is a seinen novel/manga/anime.

An artbook by Itou Noiji:

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/6213/itounoijiartbook9xr.jpg

Itou Noiji is the same illustrator of the seinen novel Suzumiya Haruhi which will also have an anime :)


Looks like Shana got a little lesson about kissing from Yuuji's mummie. Alastor in all his wisdom got owned badly by a woman.

/me roots more for Yuuji's mom.

6 facts that make this series own so far:


* Itou Noizhi's art
* The most moe'ish little sword swinger ever
* A protagonist that's not an idiotic ignoramus
* Loli
* Incest
* Philosophy of Existentialism and Ontology


I think this thread was revived successfully. :) Anyone care to add more to the ownage list?

[daemoness]

I just watched a few episodes in a row and was thinking about how nice it is liking all the characters, bad and good. And then episode 11 came along... ewww! I hope Shana and Margary team up for this.

[tun]

Looks like Shana got a little lesson about kissing from Yuuji's mummie. Alastor in all his wisdom got owned badly by a woman.

/me roots more for Yuuji's mom.

6 facts that make this series own so far:


* Itou Noizhi's art
* The most moe'ish little sword swinger ever
* A protagonist that's not an idiotic ignoramus
* Loli
* Incest
* Philosophy of Existentialism and Ontology


I think this thread was revived successfully. :) Anyone care to add more to the ownage list?
Baka Marco > *.books

[prince leon]

I finished episode 10 early this morning (around 3AM or so) and I must say that the ending was quite....interesting. o_o

[Mich666]

6 facts that make this series own so far:


* Itou Noizhi's art
* The most moe'ish little sword swinger ever
* A protagonist that's not an idiotic ignoramus
* Loli
* Incest
* Philosophy of Existentialism and Ontology

you forget great ending song ~_^

[ctrl-z]

OPs by Kawada Mami are win. SnS = good OP and ED.

[Tenson]

I actually can't wait to see what Cartoon network will do to the twin villian we have right now... LOL... I can hear the crappy Frech wannabe dub for those two already... LOL

[DryFire]

They're not british?

I fear funi's dubbing like no other.

[Alpha123]

Yes, my favorite thread on Anime Suki is finally back up!

Here are a quick few things that I’ve learned from this episode:

Chigusa is awesome.
Don’t play dodgeball with Shana!
Shana + showers = great episode :D

Overall, I really enjoyed this episode (like I can’t enjoy a SnS episode). Favorite part would have to be the little chat that Alastor and Chigusa had, really made me have a newfound liking for her character. A shocking point of this episode for me was when Shana gave away a piece of melon bread to Yuuji :twitch:!? Seeing that it came from Shana, it practically like shes giving Yuuji a bar of gold. But I guess that’s one way for Shana to one-up Kazumi. Next episode looks as if we’re going to see some action between Shana and the incestuous twins, looking forward to some fighting.

Some misc. thoughts, I was glad to see that the anime writers answered, or at least put forward, the question about Yuuji being immortal. (i.e. Yuuji has Reiji Maigo so he is immortal)

[prince leon]

I actually can't wait to see what Cartoon network will do to the twin villian we have right now... LOL... I can hear the crappy Frech wannabe dub for those two already... LOL

There's no way in hell they can edit out their special method of showing their love without it being quite noticable.

I wonder exactly what this challenge is that Shana goes to meet that involves Yuji? Maybe Yoshida said something to her?

[TougeSil80]

Yuuji's mom is pretty cool, even when confronted by Alastor, she even convinced Alastor to agree with her. Those brother/sister are just sick, but then most people on the street doesn't know they are brother/sister, so it might not seem as weird to them. And yes, the ED kicks ass.

[Itachikun]

LytHka: That part at the end of episode 10 made me kinda weird. Im surprised stuff like this isnt in a hentai, but I guess ecchi counts with it.

Shana cosplayer, we need one :)

[Forever]

Alastor X chigusa?! :heh:

Aww no kiss. Prefer that than the shower scene.

[Cereal]

chigusa owns ! l337 mum !

[justsomeguy]

I've found pages 25 and 34 of the original thread. Not in archive format.
page 25: http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:WrO5N3yavJ4J:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D37842%26page%3D25
page 34: http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:4bJ6wYJB5z4J:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Fp%3D795548

[Streetor]

Yes, my favorite thread on Anime Suki is finally back up!

Here are a quick few things that I’ve learned from this episode:

Chigusa is awesome.
Don’t play dodgeball with Shana!
Shana + showers = great episode :D

Overall, I really enjoyed this episode (like I can’t enjoy a SnS episode). Favorite part would have to be the little chat that Alastor and Chigusa had, really made me have a newfound liking for her character. A shocking point of this episode for me was when Shana gave away a piece of melon bread to Yuji :twitch:!? Seeing that it came from Shana, it practically like shes giving Yuji a bar of gold. But I guess that’s one way for Shana to one-up Kazumi. Next episode looks as if we’re going to see some action between Shana and the incestuous twins, looking forward to some fighting.

Some misc. thoughts, I was glad to see that the anime writers answered, or at least put forward, the question about Yuji being immortal. (i.e. Yuji has Reiji Maigo so he is immortal)

And Momiji from Furaba is still running out of control. This is what happens when you've been a bunny for so long! You go insane and start eating people.

[Itachikun]

justsomeguy: *thumbs up*. You need to notify them. Im going to search on my pc for some cache, there should be some.

[Kensuke]

6 facts that make this series own so far:


* Itou Noizhi's art
* The most moe'ish little sword swinger ever
* A protagonist that's not an idiotic ignoramus
* Loli
* Incest
* Philosophy of Existentialism and Ontology

Haha, I haven't watched a single episode, but I have seen a lot of screenshots, so maybe this is worth trying, and buying since it is licensed. Is there a release date yet?

[Itachikun]

Still, episode 9 is the best episode of mine. You should all know why, damn my lolicon habit >_>

[Shiroth]

Episode 11 had to be my fav' so far.. mainly for the Yuji's Mother & Shana part. <3

And i'm glad they shown the use of Shana's nickname, apart from just Yuji saying it.

[Xellos-_^]

Just a observation form 1-11. I think Yuuji's mom knows a lot more then she lets on. She accepted Shana with no question and do you really think you can get away with her a girl in your room every night and your parents not finding out about it :eyebrow: And those eyes all glaze over just give me some very wierd vibes.

And yes Yuuji's mom is one hot MILF

[Streetor]

I'm surprised that Alasor yielded so easily. I thought he would be a stubborn one caring only about duty of a flame haze. Maybe he really is like a father-figure.

[LytHka]

I'm surprised that Alasor yielded so easily. I thought he would be a stubborn one caring only about duty of a flame haze. Maybe he really is like a father-figure.He is intelligent, wise, but not all-knowing. Especially when it comes to human interaction.
He wanted to "destroy" Yuuji for Christ's sake ~o~

[Shiroth]

And yes Yuuji's mom is one hot MILF
And not only that, just listening to her talk makes me fall in love! >.<

On that note, anyone got any avatars of Yuji's mother? ^^;;

Edit, its alright - found one in my folders. ^^

[prince leon]

And yes Yuuji's mom is one hot MILF

Testify. :p

[blitz1/2]

Episode 10 was very touching. The brother-sister Tomogara are just strange.

[prince leon]

Episode 10 was very touching. The brother-sister Tomogara are just strange.

I don't know if 'strange' really is the word for it. XD

[Alpha123]

Just a observation form 1-11. I think Yuuji's mom knows a lot more then she lets on. She accepted Shana with no question and do you really think you can get away with her a girl in your room every night and your parents not finding out about it :eyebrow:
Wonder if Shana sleeps in the bed with Yuuji like she did in ep 4? :D

[blitz1/2]

No, I think she still sleeps on the roof. But if she does sleep in the house, she might sleep on the floor.

[Cyz]

Aaaw! Shana is all jealous when Yuji pays attention to...what's that girl's name again...

[blitz1/2]

Aaaw! Shana is all jealous when Yuji pays attention to...what's that girl's name again...

The girl's name is Kazumi Yoshida.

[athos]

No, I think she still sleeps on the roof. But if she does sleep in the house, she might sleep on the floor.

I think the one who sleeps on the floor would be Yuji. :heh:
Doesn't Yuji keep telling Shana not to let his mom know that she sleeps in his room?

[kira_lacusXX]

can someone tell me when it usually airs? anyways i finished watching up to 10 a few weeks ago because i thought i needed something new after shuffle is gone...so anyone else loving the shana and the melon bread?

[Owaranai Destiny]

I think it airs on either Wednesday or Thursday...But as far is it is concerned, the fansubs are usually out on Saturday/Sunday, though the impending Christmas might give them a well-deserved break yet.

episode 11 was nothing too exciting, but fruitful. Finally an interaction of the concerned 'parents'. :p I'm rather impressed that Chigusa could take the bluntness of Alastor so calmly though. She definitely stole the show in this one. ^^

[Guido]

episode 11 was nothing too exciting, but fruitful. Finally an interaction of the concerned 'parents'. I'm rather impressed that Chigusa could take the bluntness of Alastor so calmly though. She definitely stole the show in this one. ^^

Actually, both of them stole the show for this episode. It quite pleased me that Alastor too asimilated matter of factly and with calm Chigusa's words about Shana being a loyal, mature girl in further development of her emotions.

Shana's attachment is made more evident the more time spending on relying of his company.

Outwardly speaking to Yuuji that she'll never do the 'kiss' thing on him, after learning from Chigusa's conversation about kissing meaning an 'oath' engaged by two people who trust in each other; watching the drama soap opera on TV about the couple kissing added some funny effects too.

Zealously, Shana watches that Yuuji accepts openly Kazumi's bento and interferes by handing a pack of melon bread to him, without turning her gaze.


As for the twins, Sorato is comparable to Gluttony of FMA; just asking his sister, 'Can I eat them?' all the time.

His mannerisms are remarkably infant, and he seemed very comparable to Gluttony when he put on that creepy smile and opening the mouth to eat all of the torches.


And why nobody mention that for this episode the twins do not give a damn about kissing all over in public without shame??

[DryFire]

And why nobody mention that for this episode the twins do not give a damn about kissing all over in public without shame??

Would you feel ashmed if a bunch of chickens watched you make out?

I think they see humans as no more then food, so why be ashmed?

[Owaranai Destiny]

That's quite true in a sense. Besides, Tiriel did say something akin to not minding the others around them when they do make out....

On another note, Sorath seemed more appropriate to be a little brother than an 'Onii-sama', considering how childlike his behaviour is...:)

[Itachikun]

I wish she was my mom. :p someone who doesnt judge and let things go through.

[Shiroth]

Would you feel ashmed if a bunch of chickens watched you make out?

I think they see humans as no more then food, so why be ashmed?
Thats a brilliant way to put it, but i think even if they seen the humans as well humans.. they still wouldn't mind.

[AvatarST]

Something that some people might find interesting, but probably full of spoilers:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b93/arkanos/sns_charrela_trans.jpg

A relationship chart. In English.

Credits: translated by Deranged/Arkanos, a friend of mine. The original pic was posted by Fencedude, both of them are users from GameFAQs.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Well now, that's quite some huge spoilers there. Nevertheless, it clears up some doubts I had a little while ago about certain characters.

[Shiroth]

Its good to check it out, but i think you should show some information that the link leads to spoilers.

[AvatarST]

There, I made the message from "maybe spoilerific" into "probably full of spoilers".

I don't think there'd be much of a point in putting the link in spoiler tags though, or you think I should do it? The warning is there.

[blitz1/2]

No! Too many spoilers, can't resist!

[athos]

The titles for characters from Guze sound pretty funny in English, like "Seat of Reception" or "Thousand Curiosities". Do they sound more serious in Japanese?

[Owaranai Destiny]

The titles for characters from Guze sound pretty funny in English, like "Seat of Reception" or "Thousand Curiosities". Do they sound more serious in Japanese?

Well, I think that's pretty obvious. The translations aren't really that 100% accurate, so I think the Japanese names should sound more 'serious', if you put it that way...^^'''

[CarpeDiem]

I started watching Shakugan no Shana yesterday (well, two days ago since it's morning right now, technically) and finished catching up with it today. I have to say that this series has far more depth than I initially gave it credit for. This particularly lies in Shana's development. The following is my analysis, for those who would like my view on this. Beware of the spoilers.


Shana: I can honestly say that, at first, I didn't really like her character too much. She was very arrogant that I almost couldn't handle it. However, I learned later that she doesn't have much experience with human interaction, as made clear from her initial idea of what a kiss is and what it signifies. Another example is that she didn't even use a name to refer to herself as a person. She didn't even consider herself a person ("I'm just a Flame Haze"). She seemed to be okay with shielding herself from others and to just do her duty as a Flame Haze. This explains her haughty attitude and insecurities when she does interact in a social environment. A truly lonely soul, and she didn't seem to mind that fact up until she met Yuji. Only then did she realize the pain of being alone, as expressed in episode 10 with her line: "It hurts, Yuji. Being alone hurts.." She is only now truly beginning to understand what it means to be a girl. This is quite a change, and she doesn't know how to handle her situation at times. Often, this ends up with her shouting "Shut up, shut up, shut up!" in an attempt to distance herself away from her problem. She can't interact well with other people. In that scene in episode 11 where she gave a loaf of melon bread to Yuji, she was clearly jealous of Kazumi giving a boxed lunch to Yuji. I can't say for sure that she is in love with Yuji at this point - I say "at this point" because it'll probably develop into romantic love later on - because, as I see it, she is confused with her emotions. Prior to meeting Yuji, she didn't seem to have experienced human relationships of any kind. One thing I can say for sure is that Shana was jealous because of her desire for companionship. Yuji is the closest person to Shana - except for maybe Alastor, but I don't think he is enough to fill that void of loneliness that Shana now feels - and she clearly doesn't want her closest friend to be taken from her. We, or at least the anime-watchers, don't know much about Shana's past other than that she, at one point, chose to become a Flame Haze. Prior to that event, we are oblivious as to what kind of environment she was raised in, but we can infer that she's led a lonely and isolated life. At any rate, I really like her as a character now because of how much depth she has as well as the realism of her personality and behavior as a result of how she grew up. She is perhaps my favorite character of the series now. Oh, and she can really kick some butt while looking extremely cute when doing so!

Other than Shana, there isn't much to say about the other characters. Yuji is a very typical character that we see a lot of nowadays. However, he does have a redeeming quality in the aspect that he does try to help Shana in her battles in any way that he can. I also admire his desire to become stronger for Shana's sake. Other than that, he's a pretty bland character, but I do like him better than... Kouta from Elfen Lied. Alastor plays a fairly interesting "father" figure to Shana. His logic clearly does not take human values into account, since he did say he would kill Yuji because he was an obstacle. I really like Yuji's mom, Chigusa, because of her wisdom and the fact that she successfully reasoned with Alastor in a very mature fashion. She's also very cute. Kazumi is your shy girl who has a crush on the male lead - reminds me of Honoka from Suzuka too, in this sense. Ike, another minor character, doesn't get much depth, but we can see that he does mean well in his attempts to help Kazumi with her efforts to get together with Yuji.

I'm really liking the series thus far. The animation and character designs are awesome. I love the music, and the story is original. I like how it dives into the concept of existence and being. It's a philosophy I enjoy thinking about and debating with other people. It's one of the better series of 2005, I'd say.

[Village Idiot]

Ep12 raw is out

Ep13 won't air until Jan 4th?

[Shiroth]

Ep13 won't air until Jan 4th?
Ah well, i thought something like this might happen.

Gives me even more reason to watch all the episode's upto now again. ^^

[tun]

I must say that I loved the little picnic scene and the subsequent talks between the guys and the girls. There's just something about Ike and Shana being in denial about their feelings that I like. I hadn't even thought about Ike liking Kazumi until Yuji blurted it out right at the end of their conversation. And I couldn't really believe the sudden confidence that Kazumi found within herself. It was cute to see Shana being defensive and confused by her feelings. This should definitely make things interesting.

[Srin Tuar]

I must say that I loved the little picnic scene and the subsequent talks between the guys and the girls. There's just something about Ike and Shana being in denial about their feelings that I like. I hadn't even thought about Ike liking Kazumi until Yuji blurted it out right at the end of their conversation.


Hehe, you couldnt tell?
Not to brag, but I thought they telegraphed it well- he's just a lot smoother
than Yuuji is, and well, most anime males in general. He's doing his best
to be kazumi's friend, and she is clearly willing to confide in him and spend time
with him.

If he wouldnt have forced the issue so quickly at the picnic, he could have spent
more time with her. Maybe offering to help her shop for things or Yuuji or whatever,
then once on the date with her, only talking about her and interesting things, and basically being charming and friendly in general....

Hehe During the part when Kazumi ran off I felt like turning to hayato and saying 追え。:heh: I do like how yuuji saw through him though- remember he doesnt have
all the 3rd person viewpoints we get as an audience, so im impressed that he
figured him out like that...

[ludacris10]

Any1 might know where i could get SnS avvies?

[Owaranai Destiny]

Hehe, you couldnt tell?
Not to brag, but I thought they telegraphed it well- he's just a lot smoother
than Yuuji is, and well, most anime males in general. He's doing his best
to be kazumi's friend, and she is clearly willing to confide in him and spend time
with him.

If he wouldnt have forced the issue so quickly at the picnic, he could have spent
more time with her. Maybe offering to help her shop for things or Yuuji or whatever,
then once on the date with her, only talking about her and interesting things, and basically being charming and friendly in general....

Hehe During the part when Kazumi ran off I felt like turning to hayato and saying 追え。:heh: I do like how yuuji saw through him though- remember he doesnt have
all the 3rd person viewpoints we get as an audience, so im impressed that he
figured him out like that...


Indeed, considering how clueless he might be, due to the fact that he was oblivious to the reasons behind Shana's 'weird' actions as well as Kazumi's behaviour towards him.:p

[tun]

You can't talk about who subs liscenced anime. And regarding your question, I didn't notice any difference. But intros usually do get edited when new villans appear and disappear, so it might have happened for SnS as well.

[blitz1/2]

I'm still lost why the Raw has a different opening.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Depends on which opening(s) you are talking about. Some of them have the same as the RAW, but let's not go into detail about them.

episode 12:

Shana didn't really think things through and blurted out her reply to the challenge by Kazumi, did she? :p

The twins are really scary. Seems that twincest is not the only thing that makes them 'frightening', but their coordination as well as their combat abilities, causing Shana to lose terribly. One thing puzzles me though...Where's Sydonay gone to?

From the preview, seems like our favorite busty blonde is back in action, and this time with Yuuji in tow. Looks like Shana's sword is taken by Sorath as well. Whatever it is, I look forward to an action-packed episode 13. :D

[blitz1/2]

Shana's going to have a hard time against the Twins. I mean she is almost die.

[Simon]

Ep13 won't air until Jan 4th?
Broadcast schedule (http://cal.syoboi.jp/tid/667)

It says 13 will be available online on the 2nd, but I thought the online version was supposed to be a week after TV broadcast so this must be out of date. Has anyone actually tried the official streaming version? What's the quality/cost like?

On a different note, can anyone translate the announcement of SnS Comiket 69 merchandise (http://www.shakugan.com/project/index.html#1229)? Looks like Rondo Robe are doing a new telephone card + booklet, but I'm intrigued by the ななついろ★ドロップス (http://www.softpal.co.jp/unisonshift/products/project13/top.html) ("Nanatsuiro Drops") tie-in. Itō Noiji is providing art for the game (some of the character designs (http://www.softpal.co.jp/unisonshift/products/project13/chara.html) look familiar...), but I'm curious whether the Comiket offering has other links to SnS than just the artist.

Shana's going to have a hard time against the Twins. I mean she is almost die.
I sometimes wonder if we've been too quick to write off the light-heartedness of ep9+ as "filler". Yes there's been lots of typical high-school romo-comedy, but I wonder if they're softening us up for some emotional brutality in episodes ahead - you know, show the characters enjoying some normal adolescent hopes, dreams and fears, then just when we're daring to hope things might work out for them their world gets shattered by the power of Guze (which after all has always been there).

Because let's face it, every Torch is living on borrowed time...

[LytHka]

Looks like Rondo Robe are doing a new telephone card + booklet, but I'm intrigued by the ななついろ★ドロップス (http://www.softpal.co.jp/unisonshift/products/project13/top.html) ("Nanatsuiro Drops") tie-in. Itō Noiji is providing art for the game (some of the character designs (http://www.softpal.co.jp/unisonshift/products/project13/chara.html) look familiar...), but I'm curious whether the Comiket offering has other links to SnS than just the artist.I'm not sure what you're getting at here. Original Comiket merchandise will hardly be accessible to the otakus of the west except through auction services and Nanatsuiro Drops will be purchasable through amazon.co.jp or Himeya shop. Not sure why would the new game be relevant to the Shakugan no Shana anime discussion. BTW, some Shakugan no Shana telephone cards (which are useless to westerners anyway :heh: ) were already available since the dawn of time.

[Shiroth]

I knew it would end like that.. with the nexted episode being aired on the 4th!

*shakes fists*

[Simon]

Not sure why would the new game be relevant to the Shakugan no Shana anime discussion.
That's precisely what I'm curious about - the blurb on the official site talks about an Itō Noiji "dream collaboration" involving Shana and Sumomo from the game, but I can't see any connection beyond Itō-san himself. If a translation of said blurb reveals a deeper connection (e.g. a Shana cameo in the game) then it would be an interesting bit of trivia to know.

BTW, some Shakugan no Shana telephone cards (which are useless to westerners anyway :heh: ) were already available since the dawn of time.
I know, I have the Comiket 68 one - it ranks as my least justifiable purchase ever from YJ auctions :)

[blitz1/2]

Does anybody have more Shakugan no Shana avatars that they like to share please.

[Riker]

Does anybody have more Shakugan no Shana avatars that they like to share please.
I posted a couple over here. :)
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=26329

Merry Christmas everyone.
Here's a little Shana present for you people. ^^
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=419319&posted=1#post419319

[Owaranai Destiny]

I posted a couple over here. :)
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=26329

Merry Christmas everyone.
Here's a little Shana present for you people. ^^
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=419319&posted=1#post419319

Those are great, Riker! Thanks very much for sharing it with everyone, and Merry Christmas to you and everyone here too.:D

[LytHka]

That's precisely what I'm curious about - the blurb on the official site talks about an Itō Noiji "dream collaboration" involving Shana and Sumomo from the game, but I can't see any connection beyond Itō-san himself. If a translation of said blurb reveals a deeper connection (e.g. a Shana cameo in the game) then it would be an interesting bit of trivia to know.
She's just trying to whore her game IMO. That's not an uncommon practice anyway. Yes, Noizhi-sama is a she.

@Riker: Now, I feel robbed. I bought the artbook too. :(

[Riker]

@Riker: Now, I feel robbed. I bought the artbook too. :(
Eh? But it's not like I posted everything in the artbook. :(

[Tenson]

Riker is incredible in any anime series!!! *worships!*

[blitz1/2]

I like the avatars and the wallpapers! Thanks Riker, merry christmas to you too.

[stonedzombie]

i love how....

at the beginning, Shana treated Yuji like a "thing" since thats all he is......a torch just temporarily replacing the real Yuji.......but now, as the episodes progress, we can see that slowly, but surely, she is starting to care more and more about Yuji and the fact that all he is, is a "tourch" is meaning less and less to her.........

[blitz1/2]

For people who want to read fanfictions. This is my Shakugan no Shana fanfiction for everyone to read.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2687097/1/
(I copied some parts of the anime because I needed it to explain to readers and to the main character)

[Owaranai Destiny]

Just read up a few more things, and I came across a little information about the anime.

As most animes at episode 12 or 13 have a little 'way-point', it might be indicated as such by the appearance of a second ending song sung by Yoko Ishida, called Aka no Seijaku. She was also the singer who did White Destiny, the opening song for the Pretear anime.

[Shinji103]

Just read up a few more things, and I came across a little information about the anime.

As most animes at episode 12 or 13 have a little 'way-point', it might be indicated as such by the appearance of a second ending song sung by Yoko Ishida, called Aka no Seijaku. She was also the singer who did White Destiny, the opening song for the Pretear anime.Fyi, I posted about this in the old thread before the hack, that the CD for the new ED was scheduled for a February 2006 release.

[Shinji103]

Shows I gave up on:
Shakugan no Shana. I think I stopped after the first episode, thinking "Is this some loli-con action game adaptation?"I can understand and accept this show not being some people's absolute favorite as not everybody loves/likes shows that put more emphasis on tragedy/drama then on action, but normally, I'd smack somebody for such a shallow, short, so-incredibly-far-off observation. :mad: But I'll hold off on that...for now. ;) To answer your question in a single word:

NO!!!!!!!!

It's based on a freaking novel, boy. :frustrated: You didn't even get that part right.

[monir]

I can understand and accept this show not being some people's absolute favorite as not everybody loves/likes shows that put more emphasis on tragedy/drama then on action, but normally, I'd smack somebody for such a shallow, short, so-incredibly-far-off observation. :mad: But I'll hold off on that...for now. ;) To answer your question in a single word:

NO!!!!!!!!

It's based on a freaking novel, boy. :frustrated: You didn't even get that part right. http://img7.picsplace.to/img7/5/Ranma-04.gif

Smack yourself first and then try to realize that in threads such as this the responses and replies are tend to be based on personal preferences. If there is any disagreeable replies then why not take your discontent over PM. As long as you like a series is all that matters in a thread such as this. No one else's opinion/preference matters. :cool:

[Shinji103]

http://img7.picsplace.to/img7/5/Ranma-04.gif

Smack yourself first and then try to realize that in threads such as this the responses and replies are tend to be based on personal preferences. If there is any disagreeable replies then why not take your discontent over PM. As long as you like a series is all that matters in a thread such as this. No one else's opinion/preference matters. :cool:Errr, no I won't smack myself first cause personal preference or not, it doesn't change the fact he totally misjudged the series and its theme by wathing only 1 episode.

Is SnS a former loli-action game? No.

Is it centered on action? No.

Is it centered on loli? No.

Does it even have a ton of loli-fanservice every episode like a true loli show? No.

My point still stands. He completely misjudged the series, saying it's loli-action. Is this true? Nope. Frankly I don't know how he got this idea in the first place as the end of the first episode makes it crystal clear that this was by no means a mere action series. Episode 2 makes this point even more clear. It's not about disagreeing with him, it's about him not being correct about what SnS is and what it's about. If it was personal preference, i.e. he said "I don't like shows centered on younger girls" or " I don't like shows that have a younger girl for the main character" or something like that, I wouldn't have said anything. Did he say that? No.

And even I gave Gunparade Orchestra, a series I abhor, more than one episode before I gave up on it.

[DaFool]

My point still stands. He completely misjudged the series. It's not about disagreeing, it's about him not being correct about what SnS is and what it's about. If it was personal preference, i.e. he said "I don't like shows centered on younger girls" or something, I wouldn't have said anything. Did he say that? No. Even I gave Gunparade March, a series I abhor, more than one episode before I gave up on it.

Dude, chill. Many of my personal favorite shows have been outrightly bashed, some by staff at animenewsnetwork even, who treated titles such as Aria, My Otome in an outright condescending fashion. If anything, it sucks for them, because they would have missed things such as the excellent ep 12 of My Otome which I feel is much deeper than some themes of "less crappy" shows. These people don't bother to acknowledge what the exact genre of a show is. For example, Aria is iyashi-kei or healing genre of seinen anime--yes, it sounds too happy precisely because it is supposed to combat depression--its lightheartedness is actually mature, not childish.

And I think, looking at the preferences of the person you rebutted regarding Shana, is probable a she, not a he.

Though frankly it would be better if people just stated their favorite animes and leave out the 'Worst Anime for 2005' thread. Furthermore, and the person merely stated what s/he gave up on, not say "Worst anime" specifically.

[Shinji103]

Dude, chill. Many of my personal favorite shows have been outrightly bashed, some by staff at animenewsnetwork even, who treated titles such as Aria, My Otome in an outright condescending fashion. If anything, it sucks for them, because they would have missed things such as the excellent ep 12 of My Otome which I feel is much deeper than some themes of "less crappy" shows. These people don't bother to acknowledge what the exact genre of a show is. For example, Aria is iyashi-kei or healing genre of seinen anime--yes, it sounds too happy precisely because it is supposed to combat depression--its lightheartedness is actually mature, not childish.

And I think, looking at the preferences of the person you rebutted regarding Shana, is probable a she, not a he.I am chilling, otherwise I would have filled my post with tons of angry emoticons to make it look like I was losing it. :p :D :cool:

Well she or he, at least bash a series using the correct genre. Not even knowing what the genre is shows that the person has no idea what he/she is talking about. :p :D :D :D :cool: :cool: :cool:

[LytHka]

http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000E0OIYU/qid=1135698284/sr=1-3/ref=sr_1_10_3/250-3569153-9589817

I guess this is something worth mentioning even though it's the regular edition. I hope a limited edition comes in too.

[dreamless]

Is it centered on loli?
Yes.

Does it even have a ton of loli-fanservice every episode like a true loli show?
It has a ton of loli-fanservice every other episode.

Episode 2 makes this point even more clear.
episode 2 is actually the strange one that now more or less stands out as an inconsistent sore thumb of the whole show.

It's not about disagreeing with him, it's about him not being correct about what SnS is and what it's about.
it is about loli fan-service and action, so he's quite correct.

It seems you are the one here who don't even know what you are talking about :rolleyes:

[Xephonia]

It has a ton of loli-fanservice every other episode.




Ok i need to disagree with you here. I don't think SnS is centered on loli and has a ton of loli-fanservice. There's only a few fanservice and its not CENTERED on loli.

[Shinji103]

Yes.Err, no. Yes Shana is physically about 11-12, but not mentally, unless you're talking about her relationships with other people. One of the strong points of this show is how Shana has no experience in long-term relationships with people other than two. (Alastor and one other who will be introduced later)


It has a ton of loli-fanservice every other episode.As Xe said earlier, no it doesn't, niether a ton nor loli-centered. We didn't even have any fanservice at all until episode 4.


episode 2 is actually the strange one that now more or less stands out as an inconsistent sore thumb of the whole show.Nnno, episode 2 is the nice episode that delves into the tragedy of having your existence completely wiped so none of the people you cared for or cared for you know you ever existed. It also showed Shana's initial cold-heartedness to the matter and showed how Yuji did care. Plus it gave us a lot of information on what the heck was going on. How the heck is that episode inconsistent? I can hardly bring myself to believe you actually watched the episode.


it is about loli fan-service and action, so he's quite correct.

It seems you are the one here who don't even know what you are talking about :rolleyes:Ummm, sorry, no it's not. Action yes, loli fanservice, no. Girls Bravo was about fanservice. (not centered) Shuffle is about fanservice. (not centered) And if Shana was so much about fanservice why does it not have more of it? The fanservice is abonus, but the drama is the main thing. This anime started as a novel, how would a novel succeed in fanservice? There are visuals like, every 30 pages. The novels were so good because they were about drama. And the anime is following the novels very closely with the exception of episode 2, which was an awesome episode for drama. And episode 9, which was part filler, but also served to show that Kazumi realizes how close Yuji and Shana are.

Sorry, you're the one who doesn't know what he's talking about. (as well) How much of the anime have you been watching recently, anyway? You're "knowledge" of the series makes me question this, especially how you somehow have come to think episode 2 is inconsistent...

I'm done now. :p


A couple of other anime I like(d) from 2005 and some lower-tier ones:

ZOIDS Genesis (I just love the flow and pacing of the story, it was a big sigh of relief and happiness while watching the later half of GSD :) )
School Rumble
FMP TSR
Erementar Gerad

[Shinji103]

I just really need an opinion on this: Who thinks episode 2 was inconsistent? I don't think it was but I just need opinions. I just want to know if you thought so or not and why.

[dreamless]

Err, no. Yes Shana is physically about 11-12, but not mentally, unless you're talking about her relationships with other people. One of the strong points of this show is how Shana has no experience in long-term relationships with people other than two. (Alastor and one other who will be introduced later)
You apparently don't even understand what the term "loli" means. Yes Shana is loli, and yes the show is a loli moe show.

As Xe said earlier, no it doesn't, niether a ton nor loli-centered. We didn't even have any fanservice at all until episode 4.
Shana fan-service = loli fan-service.

Nnno, episode 2 is the nice episode that delves into the tragedy of having your existence completely wiped so none of the people you cared for or cared for you know you ever existed. It also showed Shana's initial cold-heartedness to the matter and showed how Yuji did care. Plus it gave us a lot of information on what the heck was going on. How the heck is that episode inconsistent? I can hardly bring myself to believe you actually watched the episode.
Because later on it completely ignores any vestige of serious depth and drama brought about by episode 2 and becomes the standard loli moe fan-service show.

Ummm, sorry, no it's not. Action yes, loli fanservice, no. Girls Bravo was about fanservice. (not centered) Shuffle is about fanservice. (not centered) And if Shana was so much about fanservice why does it not have more of it? The fanservice is abonus, but the drama is the main thing. This anime started as a novel, how would a novel succeed in fanservice? There are visuals like, every 30 pages. The novels were so good because they were about drama. And the anime is following the novels very closely with the exception of episode 2, which was an awesome episode for drama. And episode 9, which was part filler, but also served to show that Kazumi realizes how close Yuji and Shana are.
Why does it no have more of it? Because it already has enough fan-service, there are already tentacles, anything more it'll become a hentai porn. And the novel is not so good, it's just a light novel targetted at young audience. And of course there are moe fan-service in novels, just like there are porn novels. It's not all about fan-service, so yes it is action AND loli fan-service. Like I said, it's a jack of all trade show, it does everything, but excels at none.

Sorry, you're the one who doesn't know what he's talking about. (as well) How much of the anime have you been watching recently, anyway? You're "knowledge" of the series makes me question this, especially how you somehow have come to think episode 2 is inconsistent...
Don't be so full of yourself, just because other people are not so shallow like you and don't take the show as something to worship. I've watched to ep12, and it's an okay 2nd grade show. You apparently don't even have any idea of what "loli" means, so indeed you have clearly shown that you have no idea of what you yourself are talking about :rolleyes:

[stonedzombie]

I just really need an opinion on this: Who thinks episode 2 was inconsistent? I don't think it was but I just need opinions. I just want to know if you thought so or not and why.

the only thing inconsistent to me was,

that most of the ep was Shinji trying to save Hirai-san from disappearing......yet, after she did, and Shana replaced her, he kinda stopped caring....i thought that was kinda sad.......

[Shinji103]

Hoo-boy. :heh:

You apparently don't even understand what the term "loli" means. Yes Shana is loli, and yes the show is a loli moe show.And yet, strangely enough, there seems to be a lot more focus on the drama of the show....


Shana fan-service = loli fan-service....and is this central to the show? Is the anime focusing on fanservice at all? No, thank you very much. Again, there wasn't even any fanservice at all until episode 4. Proof, not evidence but proof that this show does not focus and is not just about fanservice. It's there for as an omake. :D The meat is the drama, as with other anime.


Because later on it completely ignores any vestige of serious depth and drama brought about by episode 2 and becomes the standard loli moe fan-service show.Schuwhatum now? The series has shown plenty of depth. I don't really see any reasoning here on your part, I just see "The series has no depth" and that's it. Oh, and "It's loli-fanservice."


Why does it no have more of it? Because it already has enough fan-service, there are already tentacles, anything more it'll become a hentai porn. And the novel is not so good, it's just a light novel targetted at young audience. And of course there are moe fan-service in novels, just like there are porn novels. It's not all about fan-service, so yes it is action AND loli fan-service. Like I said, it's a jack of all trade show, it does everything, but excels at none.Are you kidding? This show can't even be considered a true fanservice-only series with what it currently has. We don't even have fanservice every episode. What about true fanservice series like Girls Bravo?

Dude, novels don't work as fanservice, because there are no visuals. If the readers can actually get off on fanservice given in words, then that means they're either on something or the writing was damn good.

Yeah, umm, and these tenetacles were serving fanservice in what respect, hmm? I saw them doing nothing more than restraining Shana, but maybe you were on something and saw some illusion?


Don't be so full of yourself, just because other people are not so shallow like you and don't take the show as something to worship. I've watched to ep12, and it's an okay 2nd grade show. You apparently don't even have any idea of what "loli" means, so indeed you have clearly shown that you have no idea of what you yourself are talking about :rolleyes:Errr, wow you really like to slap your opponents huh? And my repsonses to each quote were longer (and deeper :p ) than yours.... Just because you got smacked by me and several others about episode 6 back in the old Shana thread before the hack, doesn't mean you can go and act high and mighty here in a different thread.

But that has brought a great idea to me. Let's move this debate into the SnS thread where it belongs! :D Come on now, you haven't been there since you got smacked about episode 6 before the hack! :D (Come to think of it, why did you get into this anyway? I didn't say anything about you.... :P )

And before you go bonkers, that's not flaming, I like a good debate. :)

[Shinji103]

the only thing inconsistent to me was,

that most of the ep was Shinji trying to save Hirai-san from disappearing......yet, after she did, and Shana replaced her, he kinda stopped caring....i thought that was kinda sad.......
...you mean Yuji, not Shinji... :heh: Yuji couldn't just sulk forever and ever about Yukari, it's not like he could do anything to bring her back.

EDIT: Removed the quoted posts so this single post isn't taking so much space, due to NoSanninWa moving the posts from the Best Anime 2005 thread to here. Thanks, NSW. :)

[stonedzombie]

honestly, even though i love the series, theres TONS (to me) of fan service in the show. i mean, episode 9 was ONLY fan service.........and at times it does get a bit ecchi....i mean, these girls are supposed to be like 14 and yet, did you see yoshida-chan in that one ep?!!....yikes.........and various, very random shots of shana changing and they make sure to show her body up and down......oh, and ep 12......that was bordering hentai......lol


but still, i enjoy watching it! :heh:

[Shinji103]

honestly, even though i love the series, theres TONS (to me) of fan service in the show. i mean, episode 9 was ONLY fan service.........and at times it does get a bit ecchi....i mean, these girls are supposed to be like 14 and yet, did you see yoshida-chan in that one ep?!!....yikes.........and various, very random shots of shana changing and they make sure to show her body up and down......oh, and ep 12......that was bordering hentai......lol


but still, i enjoy watching it! :heh:True, very true. But what I dispute isn't that this series has lots of fanservice (although there are plenty of other series with more), but Dreamless' claim that "every other episode has fanservice," that this show centers on loli, and that there is no depth or drama and becomes a mere moe loli-fansevice show after episode 2. :eyebrow:

Come on, we didn't even have fanservice until episode 4 (as I pointed out), and the most fanservice we had for Shana in episode 9 is her in a very nonsexy swimsuit. (if anyone thinks that her swimsuit was sexy, you've got problems...) And the last comment, no depth after episode 2, is definitely something I must to dispute. :D :cool:

[dreamless]

Dude, novels don't work as fanservice, because there are no visuals. If the readers can actually get off on fanservice given in words, then that means they're either on something or the writing was damn good.
Nope, people can get off on porn novels doesn't mean the writing is damn good.

Yeah, umm, and these tenetacles were serving fanservice in what respect, hmm? I saw them doing nothing more than restraining Shana, but maybe you were on something and saw some illusion?
And you obviously have no idea what fan-service means. You need to go get some basic idea about anime terms.

Errr, wow you really like to slap your opponents huh? And my repsonses to each quote were longer (and deeper :p ) than yours.... Just because you got smacked by me and several others about episode 6 back in the old Shana thread before the hack, doesn't mean you can go and act high and mighty here in a different thread.

But that has brought a great idea to me. Let's move this debate into the SnS thread where it belongs! :D Come on now, you haven't been there since you got smacked about episode 6 before the hack! :D (Come to think of it, why did you get into this anyway? I didn't say anything about you.... :P )
LOL you are the one who starts the lame flaming, accusing others of not watching it out of your ass, and saying others "got smacked". Heh, actually I clearly remember back then it's you who gets smacked by many people for your fanatical crusade. But anyway that has nothing to do with the current discussion so another thing you pull out of your ass which doesn't help your argument at all. And I don't talk much about it because I don't find much to talk about those mediocre episodes. Why I'm here? because I'm here expressing my opinions.

And from what does the length of a reply shows anything? You can type two pages of garbage which I won't even care to reply to. And claiming your own posts to be "deeper" yourself is surely convincing... not :o

[stonedzombie]

no, its definetely NOT soley a fanservice show...........Tenjou Tenge is a show like that, and i HATED tenjou tenge (despite the huge hype and popularity) ........theres plenty of drama and character development in SnS, as well as a very deep storyline.....these things help keep my eyes glued to the screen :D .......yes, at time there is some loli-ness, but its definetely not centered around it.....

btw, opinions may differ, and debates are cool........ but there is no need to throw out insulting comments like a little kid (dreamless)

[Xephonia]

Well it is only dreamless's opinion, so please don't get too work up on it. It's a waste of time trying to fight over someone who assume SnS like that. As as long as we know SnS is the best, who cares what he said:D .

[NoSanninWa]

While Shakugan no Shana certainly has a bit of fanservice, that isn't what it is about. It is more like a spice, than the main course of this meal. I feel that when people focus on the fanservice in a show like this, it tells you more about them, than it tells you about the show.

As for the element of loli... for crying out loud, Shana may be a bit short and flat, but she clearly isn't younger than Yuuji. Anyone who thinks that she is only 12, just wants to see naked 12 year olds.

[stonedzombie]

おっしゃるとおりです！

[Shinji103]

Nope, people can get off on porn novels doesn't mean the writing is damn good....right. So how do they correctly imagine what's going on if they don't have good details?


And you obviously have no idea what fan-service means. You need to go get some basic idea about anime terms.Ummm...yes I do. Why don't you explain it to us if you think you know what it means, and how it makes SnS a fanservice centered show.


LOL you are the one who starts the lame flaming, accusing others of not watching it out of your ass, and saying others "got smacked". Heh, actually I clearly remember back then it's you who gets smacked by many people for your fanatical crusade. But anyway that has nothing to do with the current discussion so another thing you pull out of your ass which doesn't help your argument at all. And I don't talk much about it because I don't find much to talk about those mediocre episodes. Why I'm here? because I'm here expressing my opinions.Actually I didn't flame anybody, as I said, I'm chilling. And really, you did get "smacked" about episode 6 in the old thread by several other viewers. No changing that. It's not a flame, it's what happened. :heh:

Sure you're free to express opinions, but you're not just expressing an opinion, you're claiming false stuff about SnS.

And from what does the length of a reply shows anything? You can type two pages of garbage which I won't even care to reply to. And claiming your own posts to be "deeper" yourself is surely convincing... not :oShows I put more thought into my posts and have more evidence. :) :p

[apu]

Just in case you where wandering what loli meant check this website out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loli

So if you go by this then in a small way SNS MIGHT be considered Loli, but so would about all the other anime that is created. So if people make fun of this show because they think it's Loli. Well I am just wondering what shows they are watching recently that are not Loli.:cool:

[NoSanninWa]

Apparently Dreamless didn't realize the debate had been moved. Here's his latest reply copied from the Best Anime 2005 thread:
I've just moved the actual posts from that thread, to this one. Soo.... if anyone wonders why you were repeating posts that are actually in this thread, they'll now know why.

Thanks.

[Mentar]

Shinji, there's always the ignore list feature :)

After the Animesuki crash, I just found out that I have to readd dreamless. You're not the only one who repeatedly has some dreamless experiences of this kind. When you're getting tired of it - that's what I did. And it helped alot.

*fixes his entries again*

[Shinji103]

Shinji, there's always the ignore list feature :)

After the Animesuki crash, I just found out that I have to readd dreamless. You're not the only one who repeatedly has some dreamless experiences of this kind. When you're getting tired of it - that's what I did. And it helped alot.

*fixes his entries again*Nah, I'm fine. Although I hope he doesn't seriously think I'm flaming him... :heh:

[dreamless]

Btw Dreamless, I think you better get over to the SnS thread quickly to defend your points. The others are having a bit of a field day with your replies. :heh:
whatever, you can have your field day or public orgy all you want wherever you want, I was just replying to your post that I see here, and currently I have no interest to talk much about the series, I'll have more interest to go to the series' thread to talk more about it when (and if) it can have something more than just mediocre pretentious 3rd rate "drama" and some shota/loli twin incest fan-service in the future :rolleyes:

whatever, you can have your field day or public orgy all you want wherever you want, I was just replying to your post that I see here, and currently I have no interest to talk much about the series, I'll have more interest to go to the series' thread to talk more about it when (and if) it can have something more than just mediocre pretentious 3rd rate "drama" and some shota/loli twin incest fan-service in the future
Well after I 've read dreamless's opinion , I'm sure that he is fool and idiot jerk who didn't understand what the great anime is .

Shinji it's great to see that fool smacked by you and several others about episode 6 back in the old Shana thread and even in this new thread . :D

And if he thinks Sns is 2nd grade anime , I'm so curious to know what the hell series is the 1st grade animes for him .:confused:
Just to add my comments. I don't know that you can actually foresee the future, O great Oracle. :heh: If you have no interest to talk much about the series, perhaps you might as well lay off commenting on it, since nothing clean comes from your mouth....hopefully nothing from your mind, of course. If all it takes is one or two episodes or several scenes of fanservice, you might well avoid most of the manga as well as anime nowadays, my friend.

heh, just got a bit curious to see what's the fuss with those recent private comments from a thread that I've never posted before :confused: so yea in case anyone is wondering, this is the first post I have ever posted in this thread. Any previous posts (including the part of this post above the three quotes above) were moved here by some mods, so if anyone has any problem about them being in this thread, you can blame the mods... but since the mods are like gods to the forum, it's not a good idea to blame them, so blame your own stupidity for not being competent enough to see that those posts were obviously not originally posted in this thread but moved here later by some mods, or your poor attempts at trying to sound smart but ends up a complete failure :rolleyes: or dwelling in some masturbating dreams of some non-existent fantasy and lies about smacking people with some non-existent sticks in some non-existent "old" or "new" threads, that in reality does nothing except smacking yourself stupid :D well, yea, keep your wet dreaming :thinker:

Anyway this post is nothing about Shakugan no Shana, just a reminder to those that you are welcome to comment on my posts in the thread where they have been posted by me and within that context, in this case a finger at some masturbating moron and liar with abysmal memory who keeps on pulling craps out of his mouth hallucinating about slapping people with some imaginery sticks and his moronic posts in another thread :D For those who are impotent enough to not able to find it, here :
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=26657

[Shinji103]

whatever, you can have your field day or public orgy all you want wherever you want, I was just replying to your post that I see here, and currently I have no interest to talk much about the series, I'll have more interest to go to the series' thread to talk more about it when (and if) it can have something more than just mediocre pretentious 3rd rate "drama" and some shota/loli twin incest fan-service in the future :rolleyes:*sigh* Well as they say in Japan fools can only be cured through death, and since nobody wants you to die, I guess you'll just be like that. :p

But a comment: now you see, that's why you're shallow Dreamless. You don't see the purpose that the twins' love serves in the story and character develpoment....okay I guess I can't blame you (for now) since it hasn't actually happened in the anime yet, but in tha novels, which the anime is following very closely,Shana looks at the twins' "love" for each other and establishes to herself that her feelings for Yuji are not the same, and this helps her solidify her feelings for Yuji.It's a lot more complicated then that in actuallity, but I don't think you can see deep enough to understand how deep it goes. :p

[Plant42]

Hoo-boy. :heh:

And yet, strangely enough, there seems to be a lot more focus on the drama of the show....


...and is this central to the show? Is the anime focusing on fanservice at all? No, thank you very much. Again, there wasn't even any fanservice at all until episode 4. Proof, not evidence but proof that this show does not focus and is not just about fanservice. It's there for as an omake. :D The meat is the drama, as with other anime.


Schuwhatum now? The series has shown plenty of depth. I don't really see any reasoning here on your part, I just see "The series has no depth" and that's it. Oh, and "It's loli-fanservice."


Are you kidding? This show can't even be considered a true fanservice-only series with what it currently has. We don't even have fanservice every episode. What about true fanservice series like Girls Bravo?

Dude, novels don't work as fanservice, because there are no visuals. If the readers can actually get off on fanservice given in words, then that means they're either on something or the writing was damn good.

Yeah, umm, and these tenetacles were serving fanservice in what respect, hmm? I saw them doing nothing more than restraining Shana, but maybe you were on something and saw some illusion?


Errr, wow you really like to slap your opponents huh? And my repsonses to each quote were longer (and deeper :p ) than yours.... Just because you got smacked by me and several others about episode 6 back in the old Shana thread before the hack, doesn't mean you can go and act high and mighty here in a different thread.

But that has brought a great idea to me. Let's move this debate into the SnS thread where it belongs! :D Come on now, you haven't been there since you got smacked about episode 6 before the hack! :D (Come to think of it, why did you get into this anyway? I didn't say anything about you.... :P )

And before you go bonkers, that's not flaming, I like a good debate. :)

Well after I 've read dreamless's opinion , I'm sure that he is fool and idiot jerk who didn't understand what the great anime is .

Shinji it's great to see that fool smacked by you and several others about episode 6 back in the old Shana thread and even in this new thread . :D

And if he thinks Sns is 2nd grade anime , I'm so curious to know what the hell series is the 1st grade animes for him .:confused:

[Plant42]

*sigh* Well as they say in Japan fools can only be cured through death, and since nobody wants you to die, I guess you'll just be like that. :p

But a comment: now you see, that's why you're shallow Dreamless. You don't see the purpose that the twins' love serves in the story and character develpoment....okay I guess I can't blame you (for now) since it hasn't actually happened in the anime yet, but in tha novels, which the anime is following very closely,Shana looks at the twins' "love" for each other and establishes to herself that her feelings for Yuji are not the same, and this helps her solidify her feelings for Yuji.It's a lot more complicated then that in actuallity, but I don't think you can see deep enough to understand how deep it goes. :p

You're right , I don't think this guy can understand that depth and complicate story . ;)

[Owaranai Destiny]

Now, now...We don't have to lower our levels to that, do we? We can't decide how small the dinosaur's brain is, and we definitely can't decide to change the shallowness of certain arguments. It won't get us anywhere. Apparently, if some people can't see the big picture, let them rave by themselves.

whatever, you can have your field day or public orgy all you want wherever you want, I was just replying to your post that I see here, and currently I have no interest to talk much about the series, I'll have more interest to go to the series' thread to talk more about it when (and if) it can have something more than just mediocre pretentious 3rd rate "drama" and some shota/loli twin incest fan-service in the future :rolleyes:

Just to add my comments. I don't know that you can actually foresee the future, O great Oracle. :heh: If you have no interest to talk much about the series, perhaps you might as well lay off commenting on it, since nothing clean comes from your mouth....hopefully nothing from your mind, of course. If all it takes is one or two episodes or several scenes of fanservice, you might well avoid most of the manga as well as anime nowadays, my friend.

I've said this before, and I'll say it again (even if it is in other forums): Shakugan no Shana started out with its main themes on fantasy as well as the supernatural, slowly moving to drama, romance and even humor. It may not have the 'best' in drama, but it warrants at the very least a 'good'. Drama aside, the development of plot as well as characters are good. It adopts a mostly 'the calm before the storm' episode for episodes 9, 10 and 11. These three show how they Yuuji and Shana live (or attempt to live) a normal life like normal kids. Aside from the fanservice, I would think these are rather normal episodes, but they provide character development for Shana, who had been coming to terms with her emotions as well as Yuuji, who, like any normal male teenager, feels that he is useless because he can't help Shana much.

Now...Other than those few scenes/episodes of fanservice, if you can't provide a concrete argument, dreamless, please stay out of the critics' corner in this thread. Thank you very much.:)

[Lambda]

I do have to say though, the show isn't nearly as interesting now as it was in its early episodes (minus episode 1). About the most I can say about the show in its current form is that it presents what is fundamentally uninspired material well enough that it seems worth continuing with, on the hope that it will become more like its early episodes again at some point.

In that respect, I'm actually continuing to watch it for much the same reasons as I was watching the early episodes of Shuffle, funnily enough.

[Owaranai Destiny]

I do have to say though, the show isn't nearly as interesting now as it was in its early episodes (minus episode 1). About the most I can say about the show in its current form is that it presents what is fundamentally uninspired material well enough that it seems worth continuing with, on the hope that it will become more like its early episodes again at some point.

In that respect, I'm actually continuing to watch it for much the same reasons as I was watching the early episodes of Shuffle, funnily enough.

...Well, people are entitled to their own opinions I suppose, though not without evidence why this 'sucks' or that 'is crap'. I'm jus curious to know that what interested you in the earlier episodes that the later ones don't.

[apu]

does that mean all the talk about loli is over noooooo!:D

but seriously when does eps 13 come out in japan, and if anybody has seen it is it a good eps. what happens spoil me please?:D

[TheFluff]

Episode 13 airs on 2005-01-04 (night between wednesday and thursday japanese time, as usual). Nothing this week because of new year's.

[monir]

While Shakugan no Shana certainly has a bit of fanservice, that isn't what it is about. It is more like a spice, than the main course of this meal. I feel that when people focus on the fanservice in a show like this, it tells you more about them, than it tells you about the show. How about the BGM? I think the show can get better simply by doing something about it. After the first couple of episode it was pretty evident that this show will try to maintain a serious undertone through out the series. The horrible BGM just seems to exaggerate the theme the show has tried to emphasize on. I also have to credit the music, coupled with the melancholy tone of the male lead, for making some of the preview at the end of an episode hilarious i.e. as the hero described what's the next episode is about while we saw Shana and couple of other girls in swimsuit borrowing the shoulders of a few lucky gentlemen. I choked on my shrimp fried rice as I was watching that preview. While the series like Bleach does it intentionally, this series is (most likely :heh: ) doing it unintentionally thanks to it's background music.

No problem here with fan service or the story the show is trying tell. Just that the music seems to be getting on the way of the effort of story telling.

[Lambda]

...Well, people are entitled to their own opinions I suppose, though not without evidence why this 'sucks' or that 'is crap'. I'm jus curious to know that what interested you in the earlier episodes that the later ones don't.

Basically, anything relating to the main characters not actually being real people, in the conventional sense at least.

[Pleroma]

Anyone know the planned episode lengh of the series? Also, how long were the novels?

I din't much care for the first episode but tuck with it and now this my other current favorite next to Mai-Otome. Excellent characterization and I find the whole action-drama-romance package is unusually well paced.

Anyone saying the show is loli is completely ignoring the matter of art style choice. Characters here are simply drawn in a generally more compact manner, I think the swimsuit episode makes it quite clear that they are all around 14-ish and Shana is just a bit underdeveloped.

Also, I have to say the introduction of the twins was one of the few things to shock me in the past couple of years worth of anime. Not due to the fact itself, but because of how the producers just decided to throw it out there instead of the usual "subtly implied" situations typical in such shows.

[Quajafrie]

I also have to credit the music, coupled with the melancholy tone of the male lead, for making some of the preview at the end of an episode hilarious i.e. as the hero described what's the next episode is about while we saw Shana and couple of other girls in swimsuit borrowing the shoulders of a few lucky gentlemen.

I have to agree here... It was simply hilarious, Yuuji was talking seriously and dramatically while the screen showed Kazumi's breasts :P

Anyone know the planned episode lengh of the series?

26 episodes.

[Shinova]

You're right , I don't think this guy can understand that depth and complicate story . ;)

dreamless' idea of "drama" must be the kind of stories where the characters constantly angst over oh how unfortunate they are and where no one seems to have a sense of humor and where the setting and mood are suffocatingly dark and emo.


On the series though, the novel is 11 volumes. So how far are we now into the novels? What volume is the anime approximately on? Is it conceivable that there will have to be a second season for SnS to go through all of the novel that's out now?

[ctrl-z]

I do have to say though, the show isn't nearly as interesting now as it was in its early episodes (minus episode 1). About the most I can say about the show in its current form is that it presents what is fundamentally uninspired material well enough that it seems worth continuing with, on the hope that it will become more like its early episodes again at some point.

In that respect, I'm actually continuing to watch it for much the same reasons as I was watching the early episodes of Shuffle, funnily enough.

I'm kind of in the same boat as you with respect to SnS - that is, I found it a lot more interesting at the start than now in the present. I chalk it up to the dramatic first episode in which a "story-shock" is employed by juxtaposing Yuji's quiet school life with Shana's fuzetsu-dominated perspective in which the destruction-riddled aftermath is the norm. Of course, there's also Yuji's startling revelation about his own.. 'status' among the living.

I can't think of anything that SnS is really doing wrong... But the battles, dialogues, and interactions between Shana and her enemies (guze no tomogara, etc.) were kind of bland. It's not so much that I was expecting big, flashy battles (although the battles are a bit goofy), but they didn't seem to contribute exceptionally to the plot (primarily character-driven) relative to the amount of time spent on them.

On the other hand, having too little focus on such clashes would cheapen Shana's role as a Flame Haze as well as reduce the audience's opinion of the viewpoint from which she is coming from. That said, I guess SnS is a bit more diluted than it should be, rather than having done any particular story element so poorly as to warrant heavy flaming.

With respect to the subject of loli...

Yes, Shana is undoubtedly in the loli category when they portray her in an abject or sexual way (slightly cyclical here, but better to get the point across through redundancy). Disregarding her age, she is clearly shorter than her 'class-mates' - Ep3, ~09:00 when she leaves the classroom; Ep.9 ~12:50 when walking in the water park; and official site lists her as more than 10cm shorter than Kazumi. She's flat/relatively hipless, and her features and expressions are depicted similarly to the rest of the characters that are Yuji's age (so she's unlikely older than them, although facial features aren't a good indication of age in anime, as we all know). Within the context of the show, she clearly possesses a body that is of lesser physical maturity than the rest of the school-going cast, and by logical inference, one that is of lesser age. Purely from observation, we can also speculate that her body is of a real-life equivalent to that of perhaps a 12 year old (maybe as old as 14, puberty and what not, I'm not expert).

On the subject of fanservice...

In the water park episode, Shana in a swimsuit is fanservice to the extent that wearing a swimsuit is out of character for her -- acknowledged in-story when Yuji's mother picks a suit for her -- and thus there is some amusement garnered by the audience in seeing our cold and stoic (thus far) heroine suitably garbed and placed in a situation that is quite opposite to that of her personality. The swimsuit itself seems like a typical "cute" style for a younger girl.

On the other hand, Episode 4 constitutes loli fanservice.

As for Episode 12's tentacles, that could be considered fanservice, too, as far as being a nod to the niche of the hentai world that focuses on that type of appendage (and its commonly depicted use of restrainment and... err.. yeah).

[tun]

Beautiful response there ctrl-z. I agree with everything you've said. I've found that the reason why I continue to watch SnS has completely changed too. Right now, I'm watching purely for the romantic development of Shana and Yuji. :o

[Zappster]

.oh, and ep 12......that was bordering hentai......lol


I was expecting something bad in the show after reading that comment but it certainly wasn't that bad.

Aside from restraining her the tentacles/plant thing didn't do all that much. From the comments I was thinking there would be some weird groping and all sorts. The episode those was quite clean throughout, nothing that I think would constitute as fanservice and nothing really that would be deserving of the "bordering hentai" comment.

The only other (non hentai) show that I know of recently that had a similar scene with a tentacle monster was Mai Otome. Now in that particular episode I thought that scene was rather more deserving of such a comment as the monster in that scene was a lot more "active" should I say.

[ctrl-z]

Beautiful response there ctrl-z. I agree with everything you've said. I've found that the reason why I continue to watch SnS has completely changed too. Right now, I'm watching purely for the romantic development of Shana and Yuji. :o

You've just pointed out the exact thing I forgot to put in my previous (and convoluted) post -- that is, the character-driven plot revolves primarily around Shana and Yuji. Thanks! :D Indeed, it's the aspect of the show that keeps me watching right now.

[stonedzombie]

I was expecting something bad in the show after reading that comment but it certainly wasn't that bad.

heh, i was just being sarcastic/jokin around.........

[TrueKnight]

Not that it's bad. The show's okay, but a bit overhyped.

I do agree with the thoughts that this show is well.... loli-fanservice. I got the feeling that this show was meant to appease certain "otakus" with their fetishes, but maybe it's just me, because almost any animes does that, with an add spice of typical big-boobs Majorly into the picture, big-boobs and lolicon galore, ep 9 comes to mind. And I also agree that the musics were way overblown and some of them just doesn't fit.

They also seemed to try to make the story as angst as possible...

My 2 cents...

[Owaranai Destiny]

I'm kind of in the same boat as you with respect to SnS - that is, I found it a lot more interesting at the start than now in the present. I chalk it up to the dramatic first episode in which a "story-shock" is employed by juxtaposing Yuji's quiet school life with Shana's fuzetsu-dominated perspective in which the destruction-riddled aftermath is the norm. Of course, there's also Yuji's startling revelation about his own.. 'status' among the living.

Now that's really nice to hear someone say that the start of the story was good, considering the fact that many people felt that SnS was no good because of its confusing beginning.:p

I can't think of anything that SnS is really doing wrong... But the battles, dialogues, and interactions between Shana and her enemies (guze no tomogara, etc.) were kind of bland. It's not so much that I was expecting big, flashy battles (although the battles are a bit goofy), but they didn't seem to contribute exceptionally to the plot (primarily character-driven) relative to the amount of time spent on them.

On the other hand, having too little focus on such clashes would cheapen Shana's role as a Flame Haze as well as reduce the audience's opinion of the viewpoint from which she is coming from. That said, I guess SnS is a bit more diluted than it should be, rather than having done any particular story element so poorly as to warrant heavy flaming.

Admittingly, the battles were not anything to rave about, like perhaps the ones in Bleach. Interaction wasn't entirely good either, but I attributed it to the fact that Shana is a Flame Haze, who serves only to protect the balance of existence. There isn't really much to talk about when you know the other group's doing what you've been protecting against. Furthermore, aside from helping character development, the Tomogara appearing so far are what we would call 'side-dishes'. I believe that there will be a much more in-depth story on the world of the Guze later on.


Yes, Shana is undoubtedly in the loli category when they portray her in an abject or sexual way (slightly cyclical here, but better to get the point across through redundancy). Disregarding her age, she is clearly shorter than her 'class-mates' - Ep3, ~09:00 when she leaves the classroom; Ep.9 ~12:50 when walking in the water park; and official site lists her as more than 10cm shorter than Kazumi. She's flat/relatively hipless, and her features and expressions are depicted similarly to the rest of the characters that are Yuji's age (so she's unlikely older than them, although facial features aren't a good indication of age in anime, as we all know). Within the context of the show, she clearly possesses a body that is of lesser physical maturity than the rest of the school-going cast, and by logical inference, one that is of lesser age. Purely from observation, we can also speculate that her body is of a real-life equivalent to that of perhaps a 12 year old (maybe as old as 14, puberty and what not, I'm not expert).

Gah, you're right. At least the official side did state that she has a body of a 12 year-old or something like that, though she's probably no younger than the 15 year-old Yuji.

In the water park episode, Shana in a swimsuit is fanservice to the extent that wearing a swimsuit is out of character for her -- acknowledged in-story when Yuji's mother picks a suit for her -- and thus there is some amusement garnered by the audience in seeing our cold and stoic (thus far) heroine suitably garbed and placed in a situation that is quite opposite to that of her personality. The swimsuit itself seems like a typical "cute" style for a younger girl.

On the other hand, Episode 4 constitutes loli fanservice.

As for Episode 12's tentacles, that could be considered fanservice, too, as far as being a nod to the niche of the hentai world that focuses on that type of appendage (and its commonly depicted use of restrainment and... err.. yeah).

Hmm...well said. You have provided evidence as well as arguments, so there's definitely depth to your argument. But in depiction to the whole thing, those weren't really tentacles, come to think of it. They were more of tendrils of vines from a humongous flower we see in 0:21:47 of episode 12. But yeah, the basic idea is tentacles...:eyespin: :heh:

And you forgot something else: Episode 11 also does constitute of fanservice. Remember the 'subtly added' bathing scenes? :p

Still, I consider fanservice as a side-dish....nothing more. The most important aspect of the show would be character development, since the plot's moving a little slowly currently.

[Shinova]

To those who call this show loli fanservice, have we all suddenly forgotten Tsukuyomi Moon Phase? ;)

[NoSanninWa]

To those who call this show loli fanservice, have we all suddenly forgotten Tsukuyomi Moon Phase? ;)
The fact that Tsukuyomi Moon Phase was lolicon has no bearing on SnS's status as a lolicon show.

[Shinova]

The fact that Tsukuyomi Moon Phase was lolicon has no bearing on SnS's status as a lolicon show.

Hmm, since when?

[Quajafrie]

I'm kind of in the same boat as you with respect to SnS - that is, I found it a lot more interesting at the start than now in the present. I chalk it up to the dramatic first episode in which a "story-shock" is employed by juxtaposing Yuji's quiet school life with Shana's fuzetsu-dominated perspective in which the destruction-riddled aftermath is the norm. Of course, there's also Yuji's startling revelation about his own.. 'status' among the living.

I'll agree here. The second episode was the best for me. Really nice and depressing, and also philosophic. After that, I don't really know, but I didn't felt the same way. I'm really not interested in Yuuji & Shana romance.

[Shinji103]

On the series though, the novel is 11 volumes. So how far are we now into the novels? What volume is the anime approximately on? Is it conceivable that there will have to be a second season for SnS to go through all of the novel that's out now?We're just past the beginning of volume 4, and with 11 volumes, with the end of volume 11 seeming to be building up to final conflict (possibly), I personally think that we'd need a 2nd season to fully depict the story of the novels.

About the tentacles: In SnS, the tentacles are merely there to provide restraints. Hentai hinting would be having the tentacles "doing stuff" like groping and such, which doesn't happen. As said earlier, Mai Otomoe was a much more accurate depiction of hentai-hinting tentacles. :heh:

[relentlessflame]

Well, for what it's worth, count me among those still enjoying this show a lot. Really, I see the show as a metaphor for growing up - birth, childhood, teenage years... I expect adulthood is coming up next for Shana, eventually. Of course, the contrast with Yuuji starting dead is what makes things interesting and adds a lot of dynamic to the story (he's growing in a complimentary way to Shana). And the way it's played with the secondary characters too is very insightful - gives us a deeper look at what the author was trying to say on the theme. So, it's all well played, in my opinion; looking forward to seeing where things head next (although, how things will eventually end seems almost a foregone conclusion...).

Anyway, I guess I'm used to writing a lot more than this, but I just wanted to chime in; I continue to find the show enjoyable as it progresses through its phases, but I do tend to enjoy a good theme-based show. My resolve is weakening for the R2 DVDs...

[Lambda]

About the tentacles: In SnS, the tentacles are merely there to provide restraints. Hentai hinting would be having the tentacles "doing stuff" like groping and such, which doesn't happen.

It's all a question of how dirty one's mind is. To someone who watches a lot of tentacle porn, anything involving things which look vaguely like tentacles restraining a girl is going to bring back memories. On the other hand, someone who's never even heard of tentacle porn probably isn't going to figure out any intended hints even if there's loads of groping.

But that can be applied to a lot of fanservice. To a completely clean mind, there's no difference between two girls having a conversation in the shower and having one in a room (with their clothes off and on respectively).

I've obviously got at least a reasonably clean mind, because I didn't notice the idea until someone on this thread pointed it out.

[Trax]

I'm a simple soul it seems, I don't overanalyze the anime I watch. I either like it, or I don't. I like SnS, and hardly recall any fanservice except the pool episode which could have been left out. Those twins got some nasty habits though.

[Shinji103]

It's all a question of how dirty one's mind is. To someone who watches a lot of tentacle porn, anything involving things which look vaguely like tentacles restraining a girl is going to bring back memories. On the other hand, someone who's never even heard of tentacle porn probably isn't going to figure out any intended hints even if there's loads of groping.

But that can be applied to a lot of fanservice. To a completely clean mind, there's no difference between two girls having a conversation in the shower and having one in a room (with their clothes off and on respectively).

I've obviously got at least a reasonably clean mind, because I didn't notice the idea until someone on this thread pointed it out.Well I noticed a possible inference to tentacle hentai in Mai Otome, it was kinda obvious with all the gasping and blushing and stuff... :heh: But in SnS there isn't like any "tickling" or blushing etc. So I don't think there's any real connection between "restraining with tentacle-looking appendages" and tentacle hentai unless there's "tickling" and other hinted stuff, or unless the viewer really, really, really wants to see tentacle hentai. :heh:

[stonedzombie]

heh......lets see how the next 13 eps pan out :heh:

[Bahamut]

...well sometimes i overanalyze the anime i watch...but to the point where it doesnt matter anymore and just end up accepting it...

...when seeing the twins (...even in the opening...) and maybe everything else, i had to admit that it brought some discomfort at first...but now its whatever...

...and as of now...im really enjoying the series...its a good anime...im really interested in the "value of one's existence" or rather the "meaninglessness of one's existence"
...it brings back memories of nihilism...
...oh yeah...and everything else is a good bonus...lol...looking forward to ep 13 also...

[kira_lacusXX]

twins? i thought they were just siblings...isnt the guy older than the girl...i think i heard that somewhere...iunno XS or maybe your not talking about the blondes....hmmmm

[NoSanninWa]

twins? i thought they were just siblings...isnt the guy older than the girl...i think i heard that somewhere...iunno XS or maybe your not talking about the blondes....hmmmm
I beleive that they are twins. The boy is older than the girl, by a few minutes.

[LytHka]

To those who call this show loli fanservice, have we all suddenly forgotten Tsukuyomi Moon Phase? ;)I believe it IS "moe fanservice" on the first line and it also HAS "loli fanservice." The story is one part of the show but so is the fanservice. Why does the word "fanservice" have a negative connotation among western fans anyway? Fanservice is GREAT. That and a good romance/action story along with Itou Noizhi's originality has convinced me to buy R2 DVDs which is rarely the case for me.

[Owaranai Destiny]

I believe it IS "moe fanservice" on the first line and it also HAS "loli fanservice." The story is one part of the show but so is the fanservice. Why does the word "fanservice" have a negative connotation among western fans anyway? Fanservice is GREAT. That and a good romance/action story along with Itou Noizhi's originality has convinced me to buy R2 DVDs which is rarely the case for me.

Exactly. Sure, the discussion won't end about fanservice...But like I mentioned (or did I?:heh: ), so many shows have fanservice. The Full Metal Panic series, Shuffle, Canvas 2, even the Gundam Seed series have shown fanservice here and there. But is it the main theme for these animes? ( I don't know about Shuffle, since I don't really watch it)

As for why it has a negative connotation, certain people might equate 'fanservice' with things like 'panty shots', which they consider perverted. It just simply seems like a misconception.

[stonedzombie]

people reguard "fan-service" sometimes negative, because if a show is just made to be COMPLETELY for fan-service, then it makes it seem that the show is only made to cater for fans, and thats it........it doesnt care about a good story, or great development, etc......as long as the "fans" watching it are happy. I don't like shows catered just for fans, because it makes it seem like that is all they care about......i like shows where the people who make them do not care about the fans, but want to present the show how THEY want it to be presented, reguardless if it provides fan-service or not.

[Bahamut]

...lets just say that if SnS had no fan-service to begin with... (...if thats even possible in anime...) ...would we still be watching this series? ...i know i would...

....then if thats the case...then surely there is something more to SnS then just fan-service...

...there were moments when i was watching and i didnt even notice the shana fan-service...like the scene when shana was taking a bath...i was more in tune with the discussion between yuji and alastor...that i forgot she was taking a bath to begin with...i like it how there is still something else to focus on rather than fan-service alone... (...ep 9 was different story though...lol...)

[ctrl-z]

The fanservice in SnS isn't so bad that it takes away from the plot in the average episode; however, any fanservice involving Shana is that much more noticeable because she's a loli main character. ;D (Similar circumstances that come to mind are Episode 10 of MSLN-A's and Episode 1 of Futakoi Alternative.)

With respect to fanservice again: It's not so much dependent on the viewer's perception so much as the viewer's knowledge of a particular genre. For example, going back to the tendrils/tentacles in 12 (sorry, I know it's been beaten to death), although there was nothing overtly sexual about the scene with Shana being restrained/suspended by the tentacles, viewers with a passing (or greater) familiarity with "hentai" may know that there is a niche segment of that genre that focuses on that type of appendage (and its nefarious usages). Therefore, it constitutes fanservice because the aforementioned type of fan will take particular notice of that type of scene; it has nothing to do with how dirty your mind is, although it could if you're particularly imaginative. ;P

...lets just say that if SnS had no fan-service to begin with... (...if thats even possible in anime...) ...would we still be watching this series? ...i know i would...

....then if thats the case...then surely there is something more to SnS then just fan-service...

...there were moments when i was watching and i didnt even notice the shana fan-service...like the scene when shana was taking a bath...i was more in tune with the discussion between yuji and alastor...that i forgot she was taking a bath to begin with...i like it how there is still something else to focus on rather than fan-service alone... (...ep 9 was different story though...lol...)

No offense, but it'd be a lot easier to read your posts if you'd stop using so many ellipses. They should be used sparingly, and they don't serve any purpose I can see in your posts.

That said, I agree with your view on SnS fanservice -- indeed, if the fanservice scenes we've been exposed to so far were not present, would the series suffer greatly? Hardly. Good point.

[FeelLicks]

We're just past the beginning of volume 4, and with 11 volumes, with the end of volume 11 seeming to be building up to final conflict (possibly), I personally think that we'd need a 2nd season to fully depict the story of the novels.


I believe it is already announced that Shakugan no Shana will be 2 series with 26 episodes each.

[Bahamut]

...sorry ctrl-z...you're right though, it doesnt serve any purpose...maybe for me only...
...i guess its just something i tend to do...please dont hate me for it though...

...so a second season of SnS? ...cool...know when does the second season air?

[relentlessflame]

I believe it is already announced that Shakugan no Shana will be 2 series with 26 episodes each.Are you sure you aren't referring to the fact that the title of the new ED refers to "Shakugan no Shana Second Season", which is just reflecting the fact that TV seasons in Japan are (usually considered) three months long? I'm fairly sure it's been solicited as 26 episodes in total (at least for now). Unless there have been any other recent announcements...?

[FeelLicks]

No, I was referring to hearsay. But as I check fansub.andrewlb.com and www.anidb.net, I think you may be right in that it's two seasons but 26 eps total.

[blitz1/2]

I can't believe that they are making a second season so soon.

[relentlessflame]

I can't believe that they are making a second season so soon.It's not really a "second season", it's just a label they put on the CD (and now that I look at it, I'm not 100% convinced it isn't a mistranslation - 2ndクールED... how is that "season"?). You've probably noticed that a lot of TV shows change OP/ED after around 13 episodes, and that's really the same thing here. That's all, as far as I know... Basically, from (probably) episode 14 on, we'll have a new ED (and maybe a new OP too, but we'll see...)

[tun]

It's not really a "second season", it's just a label they put on the CD (and now that I look at it, I'm not 100% convinced it isn't a mistranslation - 2ndクールED... how is that "season"?). You've probably noticed that a lot of TV shows change OP/ED after around 13 episodes, and that's really the same thing here. That's all, as far as I know... Basically, from (probably) episode 14 on, we'll have a new ED (and maybe a new OP too, but we'll see...)
What a shame, I love the current OP and ED songs.

[Owaranai Destiny]

What a shame, I love the current OP and ED songs.

I love them too...But let's see how this all turns out. Might be better, might be worse, but that still doesn't stop me from liking the anime, considering that I view how good the anime is on many different aspects.

[Bahamut]

...theres a chance that the opening wont change...most 24-26 ep anime i've seen only changed the ending...

...for the ending...i wonder how it'll look like...perhaps pictures of shana like before but with melon bread rather than her sword? ...uh...or maybe something else...like something better...lol...
...to be honest though the ending is already really good...its gonna be hard to top that...

[TrueKnight]

They really should replace the OP, it's kinda outdated because the sissy doll-freak is gone now, replaced by the fucked up relationship of the blondies.

[Owaranai Destiny]

They really should replace the OP, it's kinda outdated because the sissy doll-freak is gone now, replaced by the fucked up relationship of the blondies.

Hey, hey. Don't cuss. The relationship is indeed quite eyebrow-raising, but using the word 'incest' should be enough, yes?:heh:

The opening is alright, I suppose. It's not like there aren't any animes who show characters that have already been killed. *cough*GSD*cough*. If their opening is that logical, I don't see why the opening should change even in animation or scenes.:rolleyes:

[LytHka]

And besides, you have both Sorath and Thiriel in the current OP and the rest of the characters from the show. I don't see how it can be outdated... :heh:

[stonedzombie]

i can almost say for sure that the current OP is staying until the end.........you can tell just from what is going on in the current OP.........

[Kamion]

It's a shame... I like the ending more than the Opening ;O;

I'm still liking the series and looking forward to Episode 13 ^_^

[FeelLicks]

I liked both songs, maybe the OP slightly more so than the ED but replacing any of those will be a challenge. hehe.

Nonetheless, I still like and most likely will continue to like this series (most of you seem to be expressing the same thoughts as well).

[Mephisto2k]

Hmm? who would stop liking and watching a serie because the OP/ED changes?...
makes no sense...

anyways, looking back now on 2005 i kinda realized that SnS is maybe my favourite serie of 2005. There were a lot good and funseries in 2005 but nothing really good somehow.

[tun]

Hmm? who would stop liking and watching a serie because the OP/ED changes?...
makes no sense...

anyways, looking back now on 2005 i kinda realized that SnS is maybe my favourite serie of 2005. There were a lot good and funseries in 2005 but nothing really good somehow.
lol I don't think anyone would stop watching a series just because of the OP/ED songs. I always skip over them once I've seen them the first time anyway.

[TougeSil80]

I usually skip the OP and ED too, but SnS's ED is really good, I always listen to it after an ep ends.

[Guido]

Thanks to Omniscient for the following:
http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2006/01/04/shakugan-no-shana-13/


The thirteenth episode kicked!!

Shana gets at last payback against the incestuous twins, kicking major butt.

Yuuji had a close shave against Shuudonai.

Shana got unwilling help from an unlikely (mis)ally.

Keisaku and Eita proved that they too can be of useful help.

Shana has declared all out war to Kazumi for Yuuji's love; she's not feeling guilt about it while Kazumi's left in tears, yet her resolve won't bend either.

[tun]

Am I the only one that thinks that these bad guys are getting owned too easily? They only appear for like 2 or 3 episodes and Shana destroys them like they're nothing. I liked the little scene after the battle with Shana and Yuuji. I got excited when Shana said she would give him a reward and then shoved the melon pan in his face. Anyway, I look forward to Shana's care taker appearing next episode.

[Shiroth]

it's kinda outdated because the sissy doll-freak is gone now
Nooo.. i wanna be reminded of Friagne, he was a brilliant character imo.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Am I the only one that thinks that these bad guys are getting owned too easily? They only appear for like 2 or 3 episodes and Shana destroys them like they're nothing. I liked the little scene after the battle with Shana and Yuuji. I got excited when Shana said she would give him a reward and then shoved the melon pan in his face. Anyway, I look forward to Shana's care taker appearing next episode.

Actually, I quite agree with you. Perhaps this is just a trend, and with 26 episodes as well as the vast amount of characters, I think them living more than 10 episodes or something like that might make the series a little rushed. It's like the story's centered around Shana and Yuuji's (more of Shana, probably) encounter with the Tomogara with them as a main theme, so certain characters might simply die off without being too important later.

[Omniscient]

It seems that we're not only getting a new ED, but also a new OP. Apparently it will be done by none other than KOTOKO!
Sources: animateWeb (https://www.animate-shop.jp/webshop70/commodity_param/ctc/cd/shc/0/cmc/4037697) and I've Sound (http://www.ivesound.jp/)

[Varion]

It seems that we're not only getting a new ED, but also a new OP. Apparently it will be done by none other than KOTOKO!
Sources: animateWeb (https://www.animate-shop.jp/webshop70/commodity_param/ctc/cd/shc/0/cmc/4037697) and I've Sound (http://www.ivesound.jp/)

*dances with joy*

Thanks for the news! Here's hoping it's up to standard :D

[Alpha123]

It seems that we're not only getting a new ED, but also a new OP. Apparently it will be done by none other than KOTOKO!
Sources: animateWeb (https://www.animate-shop.jp/webshop70/commodity_param/ctc/cd/shc/0/cmc/4037697) and I've Sound (http://www.ivesound.jp/)
Yah, lets hope that it is on par with Hishoku no Sora. KOTOKO did do "Shooting Star" for Onegai Teacher and I did rather enjoy that one, so I'm expecting this new opening to be a pretty good one. Although, I am sure gonna miss both of those opening and ending sound tracks. Anyone got a translation for the song title of the new opening?

[Omniscient]

Anyone got a translation for the song title of the new opening?
According to those sites, the song's title has not been decided.

[Guido]

KOTOKO!

This is something that should never ever be missed by any of us.

[Forever]

Am I the only one that thinks that these bad guys are getting owned too easily? They only appear for like 2 or 3 episodes and Shana destroys them like they're nothing. I liked the little scene after the battle with Shana and Yuuji. I got excited when Shana said she would give him a reward and then shoved the melon pan in his face. Anyway, I look forward to Shana's care taker appearing next episode.

I also agree with you. The sudden powerup nearly felt DBZish.

I was kinda expecting the melon bun. It is still too early for the kiss...

[Owaranai Destiny]

I also agree with you. The sudden powerup nearly felt DBZish.

I was kinda expecting the melon bun. It is still too early for the kiss...

Well...I did state my argument a little earlier...

Other than that, it could be Yuuji's presence that enabled the 'sudden power-up', possibly. I haven't really watched the episode yet, so I'm not taking any definite chances to fight that statement of a DBZish power up, except that there was no screaming as though they were constipating...:heh:

[Enternal]

Sorry, but I am going to get off track a bit here. This is what I think about SnS:

Personally, I dont see it as a lolicon or have lolifanservice. I definitly dont see the tentacles as bordering on hentai (I only see it as some plant constraining Shana, not some dirty tentacles that .... yea you get the idea, people who was thinking that either watched those hentai shows or just have a bit or too much of a dirty mind or they were influenced that tentacles = hentai. This is what I think about SnS only:

SnS is just a action/drama show talking about kids in highschool and their lives. I do however agree that this show has some bit of a sexual type fanservice like showing Shana's body or her taking a bath or shower. Otherwise it's just normal show about young teenages, whether you consider Shana 12 or 14 or whatever. (Acually I am a softmore and I have seen Juniors who basically are not developed at all.) Anyway, back on track.

Yeah I did not really expect a kiss from Shana either, what I thought might happen was that she was just going to say thank you but not kiss but I should have guess that she would give him melon bread. Also the "power up" does seem a bit like DBZ although I did not watch it much but at least the show is really good to me.

[relentlessflame]

According to those sites, the song's title has not been decided.I actually find this sort of funny, yet also incredibly bizarre. If the new OP is indeed airing next week, you'd think they'd have thought of a title by now. Well, at least you'd think they would have thought of a title before listing the CD on Amazon (http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000E40TLC/qid=1136628762/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_0_1/250-5328391-2961050)... It almost makes me wonder if the title of the song will in fact be "Undecided Title", but that's just way too weird... :heh:

[Shinji103]

It seems that we're not only getting a new ED, but also a new OP. Apparently it will be done by none other than KOTOKO!
Sources: animateWeb (https://www.animate-shop.jp/webshop70/commodity_param/ctc/cd/shc/0/cmc/4037697) and I've Sound (http://www.ivesound.jp/)Sweet! :D Can't wait! :D :D

[stonedzombie]

just reached the half-way point in the series......only 13 more to go :(

[Shinji103]

just reached the half-way point in the series......only 13 more to go :(I'm seriously hoping for an actual second season, I don't know how they're going to have 7 more novels volumes of material when it took them 13 episode to cover 4. :( Next episode is about Shana's past, i.e. novel volume 5. I'm hoping it's a two-parter so it takes it's time with the story.

[Shiroth]

Good news about the new OP by Kotoko. ^_^

Episode 13 has to be my fav' upto now.. the whole show in its self has never felt as good as it should have, up untill episode 13.

I to also hope for a second season, but its just only hope! >.<

[Firefly_7]

I hope that it is better than the first OP :) I like the 1st one

[SeedFreedom]

this show is only 26 eps. NOO. im really starting to like this show, and i do agree they replace villians too quick. im a little behind at ep 12 but im starting to become a kazumi fan and i dont know why.

[tun]

this show is only 26 eps. NOO. im really starting to like this show, and i do agree they replace villians too quick. im a little behind at ep 12 but im starting to become a kazumi fan and i dont know why.
Oh dear god no. :p She's the prototypical shy girl that has a crush on the main character.

[Enternal]

Hahaha, they should have never announce how long this series was because it is so true, it seems to us now that 26 episodes are too short because it's good. Now I wish the series was longer.

[LytHka]

26 episodes is more than enough IMO. We'll be seeing far more dangerous "squeeze ins" than this one (ex. Fate/stay night, Fate path).

And, omfg, yes, KOTOKO! Sweet.

[Guido]

A well earned conclusion for the first arc.

I'm also with the wave of nostalgia to witness how each villain is wasted in the shortest time possible, but the staff is doing the best to mature Shana.

When getting a prize, boys should not expect to receive a kiss from a girl if their heads are full with those fantasies for the start.

The twins could easily make their place on H-Doujinshi, an Ero-game, or H-movie for their incentuous clinging and wet kisses.

Marcosias cleanly screwed up with Marjorie, so that she could pull herself together; good thing that Eita did not cross the line when Marcosias warned him about Marjorie's mood.

Don't worry about Shudonai, he'll definitely be back along with the other Tomogara featured in the opening now that he's found that Yuuji conceals the Reiji Maigo within his torch.

Finally, Shana v.s. Kazumi in their all out declaration of war! The best to end the episode, but all happened so fast and sudden.

[FeelLicks]

Was just looking through AnimeNewsNetwork and I noticed a couple of interesting facts (to me at least).

1. Shana's voice actress is Rie Kugimiya who also was Alphonse Elric in FMA and Kurosaki Karin in Bleach.
2. Alastor's voice actor is Masashi Ebara who also was Hoenheim Elric in FMA.
3. Kazumi Yoshida's voice actress is Ayako Kawasumi who did tons of show (Hikari in This Ugly and Beautiful World for example) and is also in the much anticipated show Fate/Stay Night as Saber.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Hmm...Considering that this can be called the first arc, I wonder what the second arc's main theme would be...Will they delve more into the world of the Guze this time rather than the real world?

That being said, it seems that episode 14 would be a suitable 'change of things' for a switch in 'arcs', considering that it might seem to be a filler episode. :)

[Enternal]

Was just looking through AnimeNewsNetwork and I noticed a couple of interesting facts (to me at least).

1. Shana's voice actress is Rie Kugimiya who also was Alphonse Elric in FMA and Kurosaki Karin in Bleach.
2. Alastor's voice actor is Masashi Ebara who also was Hoenheim Elric in FMA.
3. Kazumi Yoshida's voice actress is Ayako Kawasumi who did tons of show (Hikari in This Ugly and Beautiful World for example) and is also in the much anticipated show Fate/Stay Night as Saber.

Wow, interesting. Shana's voice was done by a person who also did Alphonse in Full Metal Alchemist? That is pretty interesting. It's just like it was a woman who did Ashes voice in Pokemon. Anyway the second might be more about the tomogara world since the first so far was all about her interation with the world. And from what was seen from the preview from episode 13, it seems like we are going to know more about Shana and her past and stuff like that.

[TougeSil80]

Finally watched ep 13, the villians in this show is weak. I was expecting the twins putting up a better fight than this. The Margery vs Body guard guy fight was pretty good tho. I thought Yuuji was going to get luck at the end, but nope, just a melon bread. ^_^

[Apekatt]

This show is only getting better and better! The fight between Margery and the dude with the sun glasses was entertainging to watch. (Margery looks pretty stupid when she's "transformed" though. Fear the purple Wolf-bear of a thousand spells. >_>)
I lol'd in the end of the episode when Yuji got his prize. :p
Next episode looks promising. A girl with purple hair and a maid-outfit, finally some fanserivice for us who ain't lolicons yet! :heh:

[Owaranai Destiny]

Just more thoughts on episode 13...

I suddenly sympathise with the incest-loving Tiriel. Although her way of displaying her affection for her brother was...:uhoh: , I won't discount the fact that her love was very real, and she really did give everything to fulfill her brother's wishes to the extent of losing her life.

On the DBZish power-up comments...It seems that way probably because of the fact that Shana did not have her sword with her, and yet she could summon flames and even Blutsauger to her somehow. This didn't really show that DBZish power up, but more of the fact that Shana was stronger than we expected her to be due to several possible reasons; For example, her better handling of Alastor's powers vested in her (evidence from the flaming wings.) It's just that we did not know how much she could manage to control, resulting in most of us believing it to be a DBZish power up. Like I said, there was no screaming and no crappy dialogue between enemies. Just a quick recovery and surprise attack on the unsuspecting twins. Simple as that.

First time Yuji works with Marjorie...and the first time where I see the latter in a new light, probably because of the absence of vengeance in her now, as well as two particular humans.;)

[Trax]

Well she loved her brother, but boy was he stupid. Nietono no shana, nietono no shana, what a simple minded idiot. He was just a kid obsessed with obtaining a new toy. Perhaps that has something to do with how the sibling's relationship turned out, the sister probably had to take care of him because of his lack of braincells. Shame that the villains don't seem to last long after all, but at least there's one that might actually be back in a future episode. And Margery seems to have found another reason to fight other than revenge.

[FeelLicks]

Another thing I'd like to add is that before Yuuji's only usefulness it seems, was to be an adrenaline boost for Shana. In ep 13 we find out Yuuji has another "skill" that proves useful. (Some extremely smart ppl may have figured it out in previous eps when he "sensed" Shana on the roof but I guess most of us figured it out this ep =] )

[Bahamut]

...yeah...i like it how they didnt emphasise yuji's "tracking" abilities in the previous eps like you said sensing shana on the roof or even finding the real rammie......they made it flow naturally with the show so i didnt really think about it until i saw this ep...good work i must say...

...my only concern is what will Marjorie do with that weapon the twins left behind...because i hope she keeps it or atleast give to her henchmans or something...i always want to see the characters keeping anything that may be useful...like for example: dual-wielding shana? eh? ...exactly...

[AxE_EfFeCt]

Well that sword is a bit too big for dual weilding I would say :p .Anyway I want to see more development for Yuji and he should get some better abilities. That would be real fun. And yes its about time we finally get to see something related to Shana's past.

[Shinji103]

That being said, it seems that episode 14 would be a suitable 'change of things' for a switch in 'arcs', considering that it might seem to be a filler episode. :)I don't see how an episode revealing her past can be considered a filler. :eyebrow:

[Alpha123]

Shame that the villains don't seem to last long after all, but at least there's one that might actually be back in a future episode.
I think we can all pretty much agree on the fact that Sydonay going to be back, probably with some backup as well. Now that he knows that Yuji has Reiji Maigo inside of him, I don't think that he’s just going to let him get out of his grasp that easily.I was just wondering, were the reasons why the twins were so hell bent on getting the Nietono no Shana explained in the novel?

Also, what's up with Sydonay? I got the impression that he is like a mercenary tomogara that was just hired by the twins or something. If they explain his background/motives in the novel, could someone enlightening this for me?

One last thing that has been eating at me, how can Shana bleed if she is already dead? :heh: When Shana sliced up Yuji in episode 1 there was no blood or anything, yet when Shana got injured by Blutsauger and the her own sword blood was drawn.

[LytHka]

[spoiler]One last thing that has been eating at me, how can Shana bleed if she is already dead? :heh: When Shana sliced up Yuji in episode 1 there was no blood or anything, yet when Shana got injured by Blutsauger and the her own sword blood was drawn....
Yuuji is a Torch, that's why he's "hollow." Torches are just like that, I guess. Shana is *not* a torch and most likely not dead. Marjorie Daw's scene when she was offered revenge by Marcosius seemed like she was on the brink of dying though.

[PhoenixIce]

One last thing that has been eating at me, how can Shana bleed if she is already dead? :heh: When Shana sliced up Yuji in episode 1 there was no blood or anything, yet when Shana got injured by Blutsauger and the her own sword blood was drawn.

i dont remember them saying she was dead. They said that torches are dead people and that flame haze are "like" torches in a way, but not necessarily the same.

I think that ep 13 was...well...okay i suppose, but not wat i expected. I expected more of a fight from the twins...and Sydonay...he will certainly be back...who knows when tho...hopefully when he does, he comes back with stronger guys, and i hope they at least put up a better fight than the one with the twins.

[Alpha123]

Shana is *not* a torch and most likely not dead.
I guess I just figured she was a torch after she told Yuji that she was basically the same as a torch (at the end of episode 2). Oh well, this doesn’t really take away from the story or anything, so I guess it just a trivial matter.

Looking forward to episode 14 though, seems like we get to look at how Shana became a Flame Haze and her background, can't wait.

[Trax]

Torches aren't really dead either though, they're a residue until they simply cease to exist. Sort of a death, but not quite, especially since nobody will remember them. It's interesting to think about, what will someone's memory look like after someone they knew has ceased to exist? Perhaps similar to Sakura's memories of Syaoran in Tsubasa Chronicle, such as talking to an empty chair where that person used to sit when that memory took place? Or will everyone's past simply be rewritten as if that person was never born to begin with? As for Yuuji not bleeding, I'm not so sure if that's also the case when he's dealing with ordinary people. If it is, he might be able to do weird things like walk around carrying his his head in his arms. That would really freak people out, wouldn't it. :P

I think we can all pretty much agree on the fact that Sydonay going to be back, probably with some backup as well. Now that he knows that Yuji has Reiji Maigo inside of him, I don't think that he’s just going to let him get out of his grasp that easily.

Ah almost forgot about that, that will give him even more reason to make a future appearance.

[Owaranai Destiny]

I don't see how an episode revealing her past can be considered a filler. :eyebrow:

Okay, wrong choice of words. Maybe 'filler' wasn't appropriate in this case.:heh:

Hmm...I suppose the idea that Shana was "dead" came from the part where she said that Torches and Flame Hazes were similar, I suppose. The similarities are lost on me, though...:confused:

[PhoenixIce]

Well, there are similarities between the 2, they can both move during a futetzu, they both arent "known" in society (altho Yuji is an exception cuz he has the Lost Midnight inside him), no one really knows Shana as Shana (except for Yuji and Alastor and ne1 else besides the everyday human), everyone knows her as Hirai as she has "barged" into her existance.

[Shinji103]

Okay, wrong choice of words. Maybe 'filler' wasn't appropriate in this case.:heh:

Hmm...I suppose the idea that Shana was "dead" came from the part where she said that Torches and Flame Hazes were similar, I suppose. The similarities are lost on me, though...:confused:The similarity Shana is talking about is that Yuuji is just a Torch and Shana is just a Flame Haze, neither of them will ever get to have friends, both of them are easily forgotten, etc. (remember that at the time Shana didn't know that Yuuji had the reiji Maigo in him and that she'd be spending an extended amount of time interacting with hiim and other people)

[zalas]

Well she loved her brother, but boy was he stupid. Nietono no shana, nietono no shana, what a simple minded idiot. He was just a kid obsessed with obtaining a new toy. Perhaps that has something to do with how the sibling's relationship turned out, the sister probably had to take care of him because of his lack of braincells. Shame that the villains don't seem to last long after all, but at least there's one that might actually be back in a future episode. And Margery seems to have found another reason to fight other than revenge.

If you take a look at their true names, you'll figure it out. Aizen refers to Ragaraja, a Buddhist deity representing desire and passion. Tyreal's true name is Aizenta (ta being the kanji for others), while Sorato's true name is Aizenji (ji being the kanji for self). Thus, you can see that Sorato has selfish desires, while Tyreal cares the utmost for someone other than herself, e.g. Sorato.

[Owaranai Destiny]

If you take a look at their true names, you'll figure it out. Aizen refers to Ragaraja, a Buddhist deity representing desire and passion. Tyreal's true name is Aizenta (ta being the kanji for others), while Sorato's true name is Aizenji (ji being the kanji for self). Thus, you can see that Sorato has selfish desires, while Tyreal cares the utmost for someone other than herself, e.g. Sorato.


And so all those Buddhist reference comes into play, as do references from other mythology perhaps....

The green haired girl is apparently called Hecate, the Greek Goddess of Death, while Sydonay is said to be an alias of the demon Asmodeus. Alastor is said to be a demon of some sort as well.

@ PhoenixIce and Shinji103: Thanks for the help on clarifying my doubts. Very much appreciated.:)

[zalas]

The green haired girl is apparently called Hecate, the Greek Goddess of Death, while Sydonay is said to be an alias of the demon Asmodeus. Alastor is said to be a demon of some sort as well.
There are a LOT of references, some of which I've mentioned before...

Friagne is an angel
Margery Daw is from Mother Goose
Tiamat was the Mother God from Sumerian mythology, later turned into a monster in Babylonian mythology (I think)
Belpeol seems to be some conglomeration of a few demon's names, including Belphegor or something
Marchosias is a demon
Vairocana is a deity from Buddhism (of which the cana becomes Shana's name)
Behemot is an alternate spelling of Behemoth, mentioned in the Book of Job
etc. etc.

[NoSanninWa]

Tiamat was the Mother God from Sumerian mythology, later turned into a monster in Babylonian mythology (I think)
Close, but not quite right. She is in both Sumerian and Babylonian mythology because the Babylonians copied most Sumerian mythos and added on to them.

In Sumerian mythology, Tiamat was the goddess of the Sea and the consort of Apsu, god of the water table. These two gods gave birth to all life together.

Then the Sumerians died out, but the Babylonians continued the story: They tell of how Apsu decided that he disliked his children and decided to kill them. After Apsu was killed by Ea, Tiamat few into a rage and filled with Berserk fury nearly destroyed all the world before she was stopped by Marduk. For saving the world, Marduk was made the king of the gods.

The Babylonians created this story because Marduk was the god of a city that became particularly powerful. As his followers conquered their neighbors, they naturally created the story of why all other gods bowed down to Marduk

[Shinova]

...yeah...i like it how they didnt emphasise yuji's "tracking" abilities in the previous eps like you said sensing shana on the roof or even finding the real rammie......they made it flow naturally with the show so i didnt really think about it until i saw this ep...good work i must say...

He didn't sense Shana on the roof, it was the orgel he sensed.


EDIT: Whoops, wrong ep.

[LytHka]

He didn't sense Shana on the roof, it was the orgel he sensed.He did sense Shana on the roof in episode 03 or 04 or something like that. He said he felt something like a small fuuzetsu where she was.

On, I finally got my Torch t-shirt. : o
http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6514/lameasssnap9lz.jpg
I became a torch! Oh-noez! :) (sorry for the LQ res)

[Guido]

Infinite thanks to Omniscient for providing synopsis for episode 14.
http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2006/01/11/shakugan-no-shana-14/



- It seems that Belpeor is the next villain to succeed the Aizen twins just like they succeeded Friagné.

- No new op and ed in this time which makes me ponder that the change will be done after all characters, displayed in the current OP, are introduced into the TV series.

[darkchibi07]

Is that screencap of Shana covered in tomato sauce? I wonder what happened there. :rolleyes:

Hmm, maybe I shouldn't have covered that. Oh well!

[Shinji103]

Infinite thanks to Omniscient for providing synopsis for episode 14.
http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2006/01/11/shakugan-no-shana-14/



- It seems that Belpeor is the next villain to succeed the Aizen twins just like they succeeded Friagné.

- No new op and ed in this time which makes me ponder that the change will be done after all characters, displayed in the current OP, are introduced into the TV series.
I think Belpheor is one of the true bad guys of the series, as in one of the final ones, like Shudonai and Hecate. I think they're using the other Tomogara to secure their own plans, maybe by scouting out possible threats and such. But I believe in the novels the next bad guy is a mad scientist type guy, who uses mechanical Rinne.

Episode 14YAAAY, Shana's flashback episode is a two-parter! :D

[kira_lacusXX]

i cant wait to hear kotoko song once its out [damn it for not being out this episode] and watch shanas past!!!! and lmfao at that torch shirt lyt!!! amen to omni for the summary and screencaps! im loving shanas kimono and red summer dress...kawaii!!!

[Shinji103]

Hmmm, the illustration pics from novel volume 5 never gave us a good view, but that Chinese dress looks really good on Shana. :D

http://cynthia.bne.jp/newanime/img/1128505708_0134.jpg

[Riker]

...but that Chinese dress looks really good on Shana. :D

What about Kimonos?
Kimonos look great on Shana too.

Though I totally give my fullest support if Chigusa wants to wear them too. :x

http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/7979/200601071136620189420ya.th.jpg (http://img301.imageshack.us/my.php?image=200601071136620189420ya.jpg)

[Shiroth]

http://cynthia.bne.jp/newanime/img/1128505708_0134.jpg
Thats one hell of an amazing picture, shame its not a decent wallpaper size. =(

[Guido]

Maybe right, maybe wrong, however, I guess that the change among opening/ending themes is going to take place after all the characters, showcased in the current opening, are introduced into the anime.

-Belpeor and Hecate appeared at the start of the current episode, cloaked briefly in the shadows. Henceforth, their official introduction could take place at the end of next episode or be postponed until the following episode after fifteen.

-The only character missing from the cast is the (either)boy(or)girl cloaked with the brown-red tunic.


The order in which the cast appears in the current opening follows:
- Alastor (the Cocytus), - Shana, - Yuuji, - Friagne, - Marjorie & Marcosias,
- brown/red tunic character whose name I don't know, - Hecate,
- Shuudonai, - Belpeor, - Aizen & Tiriel Sorath, - Wilhemina, - Ramie,
- From right to left: Ike, Keisaku, Eita, and Kazumi.

Gathered some news about the ending song.
"Aka no seijaku" by Yoko Ishida. One of my other idol singers of preference.

[Shinova]

Brown/red tunic guy is Kamshin, IIRC.


EDIT


Wilhemma's funny. Shana: *Push*, Wilhemma: Aaaaaahh~. And how she ends everything with "-arimasu".

[TougeSil80]

Anyone know when (what time period) is the flash back supposed to be? It looks like early 1900's in the 天道宮 but from the shopping and the microwave it means it's fairly recent. So does that mean Shana is a really new FlameHaze?

[giu_2]

What about Kimonos?
Kimonos look great on Shana too.

Though I totally give my fullest support if Chigusa wants to wear them too. :x

http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/7979/200601071136620189420ya.th.jpg (http://img301.imageshack.us/my.php?image=200601071136620189420ya.jpg)


hehe nice picture ^^

[Kurogane_Shiroikaze]

Anyone know when (what time period) is the flash back supposed to be? It looks like early 1900's in the 天道宮 but from the shopping and the microwave it means it's fairly recent. So does that mean Shana is a really new FlameHaze?

Probably set in recent times, maybe 2-3 years back? Shana is supposedly an orphan they picked up, and not to forget Flame Hazes, like Torches, do not age. I'd say judging on the setting it's quite recent.

Besides, Alastor and Wilhemina might just like the 1900's decor :).

[Morisato]

I think we can all pretty much agree on the fact that Sydonay going to be back, probably with some backup as well. Now that he knows that Yuji has Reiji Maigo inside of him, I don't think that he’s just going to let him get out of his grasp that easily.I was just wondering, were the reasons why the twins were so hell bent on getting the Nietono no Shana explained in the novel?

Also, what's up with Sydonay? I got the impression that he is like a mercenary tomogara that was just hired by the twins or something. If they explain his background/motives in the novel, could someone enlightening this for me?

One last thing that has been eating at me, how can Shana bleed if she is already dead? :heh: When Shana sliced up Yuji in episode 1 there was no blood or anything, yet when Shana got injured by Blutsauger and the her own sword blood was drawn.
The same damn reason she needs to eat and why theres damn microwaves in heaven. It's anime.

And the part where skeleton went psycho cause of Shana's prank is hilarious

[TougeSil80]

Probably set in recent times, maybe 2-3 years back? Shana is supposedly an orphan they picked up, and not to forget Flame Hazes, like Torches, do not age. I'd say judging on the setting it's quite recent.

Besides, Alastor and Wilhemina might just like the 1900's decor :).

The microwave looks pretty new, so it's probably just 10-20 years ago. I was expecting Shana to be like over 100 years old (actual age), but I guess he appearance still match her actual age.

[Apekatt]

Mwarr! This episode was good. I like flashback episodes! Didn't understand why that skeleton went bonkers because of the ketchup-trap but I suppose there will be some good explaination in the next episode.
Shana teaching Yuji how to eat melon-bread was really cute! Due to this anime I've been trying to find melon-bread in my local supermarket. I failed...:p
By the way, what does "de arimasu" mean?

[ayyo]

The skeleton is most likely someone who have died before brought back for some reason. So being covered in ketchup and seeing it drip must've brought back a past memory/tramua when he/she/it was alive involving blood whether it was itself dying or whoever it was protecting/etc. It certainly didn't go berserk just because Shana hitted him with a stick like some people are suggesting.

I wonder what Carmel (the meido)'s real job is. What did she do before finding Shana? I doubt she donned the meido outfit back then. Did she just hunt Tomogaras? Was she a scout for Alastor to find a new Flame Haze? How long was Alastor without a Flame Haze since his last one? And it seems despite being stationary at Tendoukyuu, she gets some action whenever shes in city, or else her contractor (Tiamat) would be complaining.

Another interesting thing besides who was the previous Enpatsu Shakugan, since it seems the Nietono no Shana doesn't come with the whole package, there obviously has to be some other power that Alastor has that Shana haven't mastered/learned yet, as commented by Friagne. That seems to be the only way Shana will be the big bosses and my money says Yuji being in danger triggers them.

And lastly, since Shana never had a name until Yuji named her or a Flame Haze handle, what did Carmel and Alastor call her back then? Shana was fine with having no name and identity even before being the Enpatsu Shakugan?

[Shinji103]

The skeletonIs the most powerful Guze no Ou, Merihim. The ketchup reminded him of blood and released his sealed memories.The rest is for you to see. :P

[Paracelsus]

The skeletonIs the most powerful Guze no Ou, Merihim. The ketchup reminded him of blood and released his sealed memories.The rest is for you to see. :P


tell me who is the evil samurai with the nietono no shana

_|^|o please

[Shinji103]

tell me who is the evil samurai with the nietono no shana

_|^|o pleaseThe Mistess, Tenmoku Ikko.

[Alpha123]

The microwave looks pretty new, so it's probably just 10-20 years ago. I was expecting Shana to be like over 100 years old (actual age), but I guess he appearance still match her actual age.

I was expecting the same exact thing. I though Shana was over 100-200 years old, but I guess I was wrong in assuming that. Glad that these flashback episodes are answering questions that I have.

I love how Tenmoku Ikko got the cool samurai thing going, can't wait to see him fighting next episode with the Nietono no Shana. Taking a guess here, but I think that Tenmoku Ikko has Reiji Maigo inside him. Just a hunch though.

[zalas]

I was expecting the same exact thing. I though Shana was over 100-200 years old, but I guess I was wrong in assuming that. Glad that these flashback episodes are answering questions that I have.

I love how Tenmoku Ikko got the cool samurai thing going, can't wait to see him fighting next episode with the Nietono no Shana. Taking a guess here, but I think that Tenmoku Ikko has Reiji Maigo inside him. Just a hunch though.
If Tenmoku Ikko were to have had the Reiji Maigo inside him, then it would have to be very coincidental that upon his fall, the Reiji Maigo transferred over to Yuuji while the Nietono no Shana transferred over to Shana.

[Owaranai Destiny]

If Tenmoku Ikko were to have had the Reiji Maigo inside him, then it would have to be very coincidental that upon his fall, the Reiji Maigo transferred over to Yuuji while the Nietono no Shana transferred over to Shana.

Sounds almost like a twist of fate to me. :D

Hmm...If Shiro is what he is said to be, I wonder how he got up to the Tendou-kyu in the first place. So many unanswered questions again...But a good episode nonetheless.
I was amused by Wilhelmina's formality though. Reminded me greatly of Sagara Sousuke, even the deadpan expression too...:heh:

Tenmoku Ikko looks to have combat abilities as well...Unlike Yuji. It will be interesting to see how he fares against Orogon, since he was seen approaching the Legion in the preview.

[diekirai]

Here is a wallpaper I made to share with the Shana fans here -
... Hopefully I'm allowed to post this here, haha. Eeto, I'm not so sure.

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/4883/shanawp3vi.th.jpg (http://img18.imageshack.us/my.php?image=shanawp3vi.jpg)

I submitted this at Animepaper too (user: milkpetal). I hope you guys like it!
Oh, this is a given, but please don't redistribute or claim it as your own elsewhere -
Strictly for desktop use only ^_^;;

[Proto]

--> off topic comment <--
Even though in this case it is more or less obvious, please remember to clearly mark novel spoilers as such, that will save you and your child and granchilds from being cursed and whatnot.

--> end of the off topic comment <--

[Morisato]

Here is a wallpaper I made to share with the Shana fans here -
... Hopefully I'm allowed to post this here, haha. Eeto, I'm not so sure.

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/4883/shanawp3vi.th.jpg (http://img18.imageshack.us/my.php?image=shanawp3vi.jpg)

I submitted this at Animepaper too (user: milkpetal). I hope you guys like it!
Oh, this is a given, but please don't redistribute or claim it as your own elsewhere -
Strictly for desktop use only ^_^;;
Whats that style of dress called? I've heard it somewhere but can't remember.

[Owaranai Destiny]

Here is a wallpaper I made to share with the Shana fans here -
... Hopefully I'm allowed to post this here, haha. Eeto, I'm not so sure.

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/4883/shanawp3vi.th.jpg (http://img18.imageshack.us/my.php?image=shanawp3vi.jpg)

I submitted this at Animepaper too (user: milkpetal). I hope you guys like it!
Oh, this is a given, but please don't redistribute or claim it as your own elsewhere -
Strictly for desktop use only ^_^;;

Nice! The style of dressing somehow suits the city background. I like the fonts you used as well for the words. Of course, the main important thing is that Shana is the focus of the wallpaper...;)

[NeoSam]

Some info: (I would have liked to put this in the first or second post)

Shakugan no SHANA (灼眼のシャナ) is a novel thats published under the seinen(young men's) label Dengeki Bunko.
For now there are 13 volumes released of this novel (volumes 1-12 and volume 0 which was released after volume 9), here are the covers:

These are volumes 1-9 of the seinen novel:

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/6081/novel14uk.jpg http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/927/novel22st.jpg http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/3107/novel32jz.jpg http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/9650/novel41ks.jpg http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/602/novel53ul.jpg http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/2360/novel64gt.jpg http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/203/novel76vj.jpg http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/4684/novel88hp.jpg http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/5595/novel92uv.jpg

This is volume 0 of the seinen novel:

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4829/novel06sx.jpg

These are volumes 10, 11 and 12 of the seinen novel:

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/2185/novel109qy.jpg http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/424/novel117de.jpg http://img485.imageshack.us/img485/4786/vol129of.jpg

Author: Takahashi Yashichirou
Artist: Itou Noiji

A manga based on the novel is serialized in the seinen(young men's) manga magazine Dengeki Daioh.
For now there is one volume released of this manga.

Here is the cover of the seinen manga:

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/2537/manga13ji.jpg

Genre: Seinen, Fantasy, Comedy, Drama

Shakugan no SHANA is a seinen novel/manga/anime.

An artbook by Itou Noiji:

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/6213/itounoijiartbook9xr.jpg

Itou Noiji is the same illustrator of the seinen novel Suzumiya Haruhi which will also have an anime :)

[Melchiorus]

but I think that Tenmoku Ikko has Reiji Maigo inside him. Just a hunch though.
Well i think that his flame is in his left eye and that the mask is what keep him "alive"
http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/8635/tenmoku7ao.jpg

[LytHka]

@NeoSam: I'll copy it to my post which was second (with credits, of course ;)). If you don't want that I'll just remove it later.

[NeoSam]

@NeoSam: I'll copy it to my post which was second (with credits, of course ;)). If you don't want that I'll just remove it later.

Thanks :)

Now the thread looks better :)

[Guido]

This week's episode synopsis by Omniscient

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2006/01/18/shakugan-no-shana-15/
A new ending premiered in this one!

[blitz1/2]

That is a good synopsis.

[Paracelsus]

Yeah, that's one of the best blogs in the net.

However, Shana 15 was win....I loved this episode, and really can't wait for the subs....luckily all that bondage consoled me from the fact the the new ED is kinda plain...the old one was ten thousand times better -_-

Well, let's hope for the new OP....*crosses fingers*

[Shinova]

Ep 15 was quite awesome, but the new ED was definetly 'meh'. And Wilhemina's mask totally freaks me out. :eek:

[ruchik]

hey guys-i searched through this thread, but i couldnt find what i was looking for. whats the opening song for the first few eps called?

[Riker]

hey guys-i searched through this thread, but i couldnt find what i was looking for. whats the opening song for the first few eps called?

That would be "Hishoku no Sora" by Mami Kawada.
You can find out more information at Anime News Network (http://animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=5943).

[LytHka]

Ep 15 was quite awesome, but the new ED was definetly 'meh'. And Wilhemina's mask totally freaks me out. :eek:I thought it was pretty OK. It's definitely something better for those that aren't just looking for vocal qualities in a song which the first ED has, but with that it lacks instrumental value.
I think the vocal+instrumentals cover each other quite well in the new ED. BTW, the single of the new ED, Aka no Seijaku by Ishida Yoko will be out on 2006/02/08. Amazon.co.jp link (http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000CNDI04/qid%3D1137668711/503-4973904-1606349), CDJapan.co.jp link (http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/(one_line,mint,simple)/detailview.html?KEY=GNCA-23)

BTW, has anyone got the newest Fujitsubo Machine (http://www.fujitsubo-machine.jp/) Comiket 69, Shakugan no Shana Lineart by Itou Noizhi? I won mine through Yahoo! Auctions. Still waiting for it to get shipped.
http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/7402/lineart5sx.th.jpg (http://img14.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lineart5sx.jpg)

[Owaranai Destiny]

I thought it was pretty OK. It's definitely something better for those that aren't just looking for vocal qualities in a song which the first ED has, but with that it lacks instrumental value.
I think the vocal+instrumentals cover each other quite well in the new ED. BTW, the single of the new ED, Aka no Seijaku by Ishida Yoko will be out on 2006/02/08. Amazon.co.jp link (http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000CNDI04/qid%3D1137668711/503-4973904-1606349), CDJapan.co.jp link (http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/(one_line,mint,simple)/detailview.html?KEY=GNCA-23)

BTW, has anyone got the newest Fujitsubo Machine (http://www.fujitsubo-machine.jp/) Comiket 69, Shakugan no Shana Lineart by Itou Noizhi? I won mine through Yahoo! Auctions. Still waiting for it to get shipped.
http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/7402/lineart5sx.th.jpg (http://img14.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lineart5sx.jpg)

Gah...I envy you people. I can't order anything online since I can't apply for it.

What makes the ED so nice is not just the screens we see of the characters, I guess. I'd agree that good music sometimes also needs good complements of both instruments and vocals.

[Shinji103]

The new ED theme rocks. :D It just works. :D :D I loved the way it sounded as they did the musical lead-into as Shana became the Enpatsu Shakugan no Uchite. :D Reminded me of how they had the musical lead-intos in GS and GSD. (the only thing they did right in GSD, besides the music and BGMs themselves >.> )

[blitz1/2]

Wilhemina's mask is very scary. Too bad that the fight is too short.

[LytHka]

The First Limited Edition Shakugan no Shana DVD vol.2 is out for preorder! Get it while you still can! As far as I can understand it will come with a DVD box with a special illustration along with a special calendar card and a case for it.

http://www.shakugan.com/item/index.html
http://www.amazon.co.jp/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000BQVDHM/503-4973904-1606349

[blitz1/2]

I don't think I can get it. Too bad for me.

[Shiroth]

The new ED suits Shakugan no Shana in my eyes - and episode 15 rocked.. glad this past story hasen't finished yet.

Seeing the previous Flame Haze before Shana was really good, it amazed me that she looked like an older version of Shana.. maybe her Mother? =O

I don't think its true, but it was going through my mind when she appeared in that flash back. ^^;

Anyway, the OST's out this week, i hope you people have ordered a copy like i have. ^^

[LytHka]

@Angelsama: Oh, indeed I am anticipating it. Ordered it too.

But as far as ep. 15 is concerned, the story is truly amazing but animation could've been better at some parts. For example, Shiro was poorly animated.

[Shiroth]

I noticed that juring his fight, it wasen't bothering me as much as i know it would some people - but it could have been a lil' better.

And about the OST.. i can't wait! >.<

[Apekatt]

Wooo! New episode!:bow:
Flashback Shana seems to be much more emotional than her current self. Maybe it is due to some kind of sideeffect when she became a Flame Haze.
Good episode as usual, this show is really growing on me. The new ED was not as good as the last one though.