Higurashi Question Arc Discussion

[kj1980]

I tried to merge all of the four question arc threads into one, but they all mysteriously disappeared.

If anyone has backups, please feel to post them here.

In any case, this thread will be dedicated for discussions pertaining to all the question arcs (Onikakushi, Watanagashi, Tatarigoroshi, and Himatsubushi).

[Amaranthine]

I actually thought I had these, but I don't... fortunately Google does. I don't think this is all of it though. And there wasn't one for Himatsubushi-hen, was there?

Onikakushi-hen Discussion: (1 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:N_D-fQShY78J:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D32546+site:forums.animesuki.c om+Onikakushi&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=1), 2 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:NnlyVN-q3JkJ:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Fp%3D598793+site:forums.animesuki. com+Onikakushi-hen+Discussion+page+2&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=1))

Watanagashi-hen Discussion: (1 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:DnCXB3tBJscJ:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D32547+site:forums.animesuki.c om+watanagashi&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=1), 2 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:DSBU7wkZGzcJ:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D32547%26page%3D2+site:forums. animesuki.com+watanagashi&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=3), 3 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:lPlcE7OSfxoJ:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D32547%26page%3D3+site:forums. animesuki.com+watanagashi&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=4))

Tatarigoroshi-hen Discussion: (1 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:q8EfHmrmiLAJ:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Ft%3D32548+site:forums.animesuki.c om+Tatarigoroshi&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=1), 2 (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:L6jjIOXsTIMJ:forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php%3Fp%3D606416+site:forums.animesuki. com+Tatarigoroshi&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=3))

I'll post some actual discussion when I've seen episode 15. ^^

[rexlunae]

Well, this is a repost of my theory about the events of Watanagashi-hen. It probably goes here in a combined thread anyway, as it incorporates elements from all question arcs. It has the important aspect that it sticks to my belief that the events are not supernatural, but it is also highly speculative.

After watching some older episodes, I have a new theory about Watanagashi-hen. In Tatorigoroshi-hen, we learn that Satoko broke the large statue of Oyashiro-sama at some point in the past (I don't exactly know when, but it was when Rika's parents were still alive). I allege that this was a big threat to the entire town's mythology, and so the knowledge was silenced, especially because they thought that Rika had done it. The three houses agreed that no one would find out about it, and they would protect Rika. The people involved in this conspiracy were Kimiyoshi, the Furudes, Rika included (although not by choice), and the major leaders of the Sonozakis, Oryuo and Mion. The peripheral branches of the Sonozaki household were not told, however this information did leak later on.

The main Sonozaki house was responsible for giving the orders to protect the town, but the branches carried out the orders, and many of them took that roll just as seriously as the main house. Eventually, a rumor within the house reached Shion, and she wanted to confirm it. The rumor said that the statue of Oyahsiro-sama had been defiled, and the main leadership was not punishing the people responsible. If it were true, the town's leadership had failed to enforce their strict laws, and they would be guilty of a sin against those very laws. Shion was a strong believer in the town's mythology, and she was also had a legitimate claim to power if her sister failed. Shion had become aware of that Mion recently had developed feelings for Keiichi, because Mion had needed her help to cover for the lie she told Keiichi at Angel Mort (I think that was really Mion the first time), and Shion wanted to use Keiichi to test and possibly punish Mion for not doing the job required of the Sonozaki heirs. She took Keiichi into the storehouse with her to see if Mion would be able to kill him. As Shion suspected, Mion was able to order the deaths of Takano and Tomitaki, but not Keiichi (Shion herself was allowed to go into the storehouse because of her status as a Sonozaki).

The following day, Shion began a covert takeover of the family. A groups of supporting Sonozakis, angry that the main family had neglected the towns rules killed Oryou, and captured Mion, allowing Shion to take Mion's place. Then they captured and killed Kimiyoshi, a conspirator in the coverup. Kimiyoshi, believing that Rika had broken the statue, informed them of his belief. The conspirators found out from Rika that the one who broke the statue was Satoko. They kidnapped Rika as bait to lure her to the Sonozaki house, and then when Satoko arrived, they killed her as punishment for her sins. Then, they forced Rika to kill herself, assuming that it would unleash Oyashiro-sama to set things right.

That only leaves Keiichi to deal with, but by this point, Oishi has gotten pretty close to being able to storm the Sonozaki main house, and, as we saw in episode 8, Keiichi goes in with the police watching and Rena at his side. Rena has committed no sin, so it would be wrong to punish her.

Shion, still pretending to be Mion, lures Keiichi away from Rena, to a room where she plans to punish him for his crimes, in front of Mion. However, she finds that she cannot kill him either, and she ends up stunning herself instead, ending the attempt at a takeover.

Mion has gone a little crazy from this experience, and kills Shion so that she does not have any competition killing Keiichi. Then she attempts to kill Keiichi to prove she is still better at enforcing the rules then Shion.

The murders of the previous years were attempts to suppress knowledge of the statue being broken. The main statue of Oyashiro-sama was important enough that it could destroy the town to know it had been defiled. They were the result of Satoko telling people about it, and those people telling others, so all the victims are people around Satoko. This is the source of the leak, although it probably wasn't traced all the way back to Satoko right away. The killers were lining these murders up with Watanagashi to build belief in the town's myths.

The involvement of Tomitake and Takano in this chapter may be totally incidental. They may just be trying to discredit the town's mythology, or they may simply be interrested in the knowing truth. In my story, which may sometimes be called a theory, it doesn't matter. All that matters for them is that they were sufficiently curios to break in to the storehouse.

So, that's my theory. It's really more just a story, which seems belivable, and seems to fit what we have seen. Some of the details are embellished to make the whole more plausible, and may need to be adjusted. And, like most of the content here, it may be completely wrong.


So, thoughts, objections, comments? Am I totally out of my mind?

[DingoEnderZOE2]

[QUOTE=rexlunae]
Shion had become aware of that Mion recently had developed feelings for Keiichi, because Mion had needed her help to cover for the lie she told Keiichi at Angel Mort (I think that was really Mion the first time).


You got some questions in there that needs to be cleared up before that theory can be valid.....Who was the person who didn't know what the heck Keichi was talking about when he returned the lunch box to her? And why would she be confused about it if she was already aware of the plan ahead of time? As for Keichi's meeting with "Shion" at the Angel Mort maybe Shion was embarrassed about the outfit from the eyes of someone she's well aware of but not yet fully acquainted with. Plus in the look she gave Keichi out the window after he left just seemed to telling us the viewers that shes thinking "Hmmmm so that's Maebara Keichi.....my prey." As for the lunch scene, If that really was Shion why did she seem so flustered when she was handing over the lunch when we can obviously tell she's not the shy type at all(Apparently after she's well acquainted with a person.)

Your other theories sound nice though.

[Deku Kirby]

In any case, this thread will be dedicated for discussions pertaining to all the question arcs (Onikakushi, Watanagashi, Tatarigoroshi, and <B>Meakashi</b>).

Don't you mean Himatsubushi? :heh:

[Zekori]

Chapter 4 was a nice change of pace, which gladly removes the need of stingy dwelling into information to learn about the background. Not to mention Asakasa was a nice character.


After rewatching the first two question arcs, and finally moving onto the last two. Atleast what I expected that there is some kind of organization/military/government invoked (betting on Takano and Tomitake, but perhaps tomitake may be a police officer). It also explains the green-capped workers in chapter one that knocked Keichii out, since a medical worker wouldn't knock someone senseless with a club at first sight, and from what Oishii says- most likely that they are apart of some military or former military group.

But hmm, guess there is some kind of super-natural event going on (since only Rika is predicting events). With Rika being able to predict future events, but still doesn't merit much about her being a reincarnation of Oyashiro- my bet is her being the current shrine priestess and maybe something with genetics (Perhaps not since her parent’s don’t have a clue of what is what, but they get murdered eventually).

From the time skip of the fourth question chapter, it seems the gas disaster is inevitable and occurs when Rika dies. Which makes me wonder why Rika didn't die (unless I missed it) in the first chapter, from the people who were killed in the fifth year it points towards Takano/Tomitake however Takano disappeared while she was burned in the second and third chapters. Which means, Takano playing a nurse and changing her medical record and faking the autopsy, but some event in the chapter must have had her ditch and bail her plan (perhaps Keichii running into the two near the river). I think it was also mentioned that in the second chapter that Takano had died before going into the shed, meaning that it was someone else’s body. And the finale for Takano is during the third chapter where she questions Keichii about digging the body- I really doubt that’s common nurse knowledge, considering most military units had used blood hounds in variety of situations.

Tomitake is still an oddity, probably a victim from what I can gather. Option one is that he’s a police officer (like Asakasa) and gets his covered blown. Option two is that he himself is apart of the trained soldiers, in the guise of photographer- but has a change of heart of what is going on (Perhaps wiping out a whole village to chicken him out) making himself a target. Since according to the TIPs- he may not even be Tomitake Jirou, and I don’t see the reason or the ease of getting a fake identity as a normal civilian.

As for Asakasa, he may be the dark horse of the events. I think in the tip’s it was mentioned that his wife’s (depending if it was an intention or unintentional death, but it’s similar to the reporter that Keichii “Cursed”) father was in the military and he constantly was standing to attention in front of him (or something similar)- so he’s probably the closest link in the event that there is some military screwing around. Though I don’t see why, unless there doing human experiment’s (thinking on the timeline, plausible since scientific knowledge wasn’t that far advanced) under the guise of “Angry God Wrath”- but it seems far fetched, and the nature of this series is twist after twist.

Though, they still haven't dwelled much into Rena or Keichii's importance (Keichii being targetted, maybe perhaps because he's wasn't a permenant local), but I'm guessing they'll shove that into our faces one way or another.


Edit: Oh~


After reading the poems of Frederica Bernkastel

I am who I am; Frederica Bernkastel.
Furude Rika and Frederica are different. Shame on you if you thought so.
My age? I've gotten bored with it, so I've quit counting.

Huh? Are you speculating that the real identity of the Oyashiro-sama is me?
Giggle giggle. You are so insolent.
The Oyashiro-sama is the Oyashiro-sama. You want me to introduce it to you? It's rather shy.
It gets frightened easily so don't scare it, okay? However, it seems that you are the one that's scared.

Giggle giggle giggle...

That attitude reminds me of Takano when she was freaking out Keichii in the.... well all chapters. Granted the poems don't show up in the anime, but is it plausible that she is Frederica Bernkastel- or was it said before that it's just food for thought for the readers?

[frad113]

I tried to merge all of the four question arc threads into one, but they all mysteriously disappeared.It's Oyashiro-sama's doing. :heh: One question that remains for me is what purpose did Rena's psycho-mode serve in Tatarigoroshi-hen 1? She wasn't around around for much of this arc.

[kj1980]

It's Oyashiro-sama's doing. :heh: One question that remains for me is what purpose did Rena's psycho-mode serve in Tatarigoroshi-hen 1? She wasn't around around for much of this arc.

I actually had a good laugh with that remark. Yes, it has to be it! The threads Onikakushi-ed themselves...

In response to your question, Rena's oyashiro-mode will be explained when we get to Tsumihoroboshi-hen; the last chapter that will be covered in the anime.

[FatPianoBoy]

It's Oyashiro-sama's doing. :heh: One question that remains for me is what purpose did Rena's psycho-mode serve in Tatarigoroshi-hen 1? She wasn't around around for much of this arc.

We must have been getting too close to the truth :heh:

[Implosion]

One thing that surprised me at the end of this arc was the gas explanation still was around. In the first two arcs Kei-chan doesn't stick around long enough for everything to go to hell, and in the third the announcer sounded as if they weren't sure what had happened and were just making a quick and reasonable sounding guess for the moment.

However, years later in the 4th arc they still claim it was due to the gas. Assuming no one was bribed or threatened into giving false answers, there really is poisonous gas in Hanamizawa! o_0

What could it be trigged by though? Rika's death occurred at the same time both arcs, so I can't judge if it really is due to her death, if the gas was time-released, or something else entirely. >_<

Also...sorry if this is a stupid question but how did they find out about the gas explosion in Hanamizawa? It's a pretty remote town, and if they got Kei-chan out before he drowned the ambulances must have arrived there pretty quickly. Perhaps someone was on the phone with a friend/relative in Hanamizawa before the gas took them, but then wouldn't they have interviewed them to find out what they could about the symptoms before death? Is something like this even important? :twitch:

[SpaceDrake]

People would have started choking to death and dying in the streets. Remember a few folks like Chie died during evacuation efforts (I suspect her lungs gave out trying to save the children :( ).

I am a bit fuzzy on this, though. The Disaster of Hinamizawa does not occur in Scenario 1 and 2, correct? Scenario 2's ending, in particular, would seem to take place in a timeframe well after the "gas bomb" went off in Scenarios 3 and 4.

[kj1980]

I am a bit fuzzy on this, though. The Disaster of Hinamizawa does not occur in Scenario 1 and 2, correct? Scenario 2's ending, in particular, would seem to take place in a timeframe well after the "gas bomb" went off in Scenarios 3 and 4.

I'll leave the answer to that open until AFTER you've seen Meakashi-hen (the first "answer" chapter).

[SpaceDrake]

Yearghdigible.

Well, on that note, to be absolutely, perfectly clear, Meakashi (Scenario 5) takes place in the same continuity as Scenario 2, yes?

[LostBlue]

I would take each chapter as its own possibility in the world of Higurashi