View Full Version : Death Note Episode 3 Discussion / Poll
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Omniscient
2006-10-17, 14:13
Episode 03 Screencaps and Summary (http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2006/10/17/death-note-03/)
Lots of maneuvering by all sides this episode. L is investigating the police, including Light's father, while Light proves that he can kill whenever by killing people on the hour every hour. They also introduce the Shinigami Eyes, which is what I consider to be one of the more interesting aspects of the story.
How are the visuals compared to, say, episode 2? There are definitely some glaring "off" shots, but is the animation in general jerky or still solid?
Itachikun
2006-10-17, 15:35
Nop, still solid. It's not like the first episode when Light was writing in the Death Note.
Overall, it was a nice episode. Not 10 material, but still great to watch. The tension between L and Light.
Great Episode, next episode introduces Ray!!!! >_< The whole Light v Ray thing will be sweet, not to mention the bus incident.
MrProphet
2006-10-17, 16:07
The episode wasn't as exciting as the first two, but still good.
By the way, I just noticed this thing. In the OP and ED, Light is always associated with the color red, while L is associated with the color blue.
Now, in our Western tradition, Light might seem (and does seem) a bit demonic with those red glowing eyes, but I thought about it from a different perspective.
In the old traditions of the Japanese kabuki theater, red is the color of courage and justice. Actors who played the protagonist and other "good" characters used red make-up. On the other hand, blue is the color of the supernatural beings, of immorality and of equanimity. Actors who played the antagonist and demons used blue make-up.
Do you think there is something here? For some reason, I really dislike both L and Light. Both are sociopathic nutcases, in my opinion, so I am a bit surprised that the authors would try to differentiate between good and evil like that.
In other news, L uses a PowerMac. I guess that explains why he's such a freak. 8)
I don't think the author is trying to make a statement about good and evil, she's just trying to tell a good story...
MrProphet
2006-10-17, 16:31
Then how do you explain the colors?
NoSanninWa
2006-10-17, 16:31
I don't think the author is trying to make a statement about good and evil, she's just trying to tell a good story...
I rather disagree. The mangaka addresses too many issues about the border between good and evil for this to be a coincidence. The colors might be a coincidence, but the story about the nature of good and evil.
Then how do you explain the colors?The colors might have been chosen for purely cosmetic effect.
Well, to clarify, I don't think she is trying to embody the concepts of good and evil in L and Light respectively. Rather than good or evil, I think Death Note is more about society VS the individual...
Itachikun
2006-10-17, 16:41
Lol, people need to realize that the OP is not very "meaningful". It depicts stuff, yes, but this is just too much....
MrProphet
2006-10-17, 16:47
Sure.
Next time you'll say that the apple in Light's hand also doesn't mean anything and there is absolutely no symbolism involved there.
Sure, that's just "stuff" being "depicted". 8)
NoSanninWa
2006-10-17, 16:55
Well obviously apples are too well known a symbol to have been included in the manga for purely coincidental reasons. Though you need to understand that apples are used in the OP because they are used as a symbol in the anime. By contrast the OP was just pulled out of an art director's head. Since the OP was not created by the writer of the manga, you need to realize that anything that only exists in the OP might really only exist for artistic reasons.
MrProphet
2006-10-17, 17:06
I've never read the whole manga (tried to, but got bored very soon, to be honest), so I don't know if it's purely symbolic imagery or it features somehow in the plot.
Even if it's the second, then I don't see why it can't be both.
I don't really view the OP as being particularily separate from the main plot of the anime, so the inclusion of various allusions in the OP is only a sneak peak into the overall symbolism of the entire show.
It's not like the OP is telling a separate story. It's not a music video based on the anime, it's part of the anime, thus the imagery offered to us in the OP is part of the anime director's message.
The apple, the allusion to Michelangelo's Sistine Chapel fresco (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam) (with Light and Ryuk instead of Adam and God), the contrast between the extremes of L and Light, the allusion to Sandro Botticelli's "Birth of Venus" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Birth_of_Venus_(Botticelli)) with Light as Venus. It's all part of the symbolism that DEATH NOTE is chanelling at the viewer. They are basic messages that tell the viewer something about the authors intensions for this show, what he wants us to see the characters as, etc.
MrProphet: In the How to Read volume of the manga, Ohba did say that she wasn't interested in telling a story "about" good and evil. Personally I'm more inclined to think that the colors are a stylistic choice as well, since if the story hasn't already made it apparent...
L could in many ways be considered "evil"--just not as evil as Light. The author also mentioned this, saying that she thinks of L as being somewhat evil.
Speaking of the OP... am I just crazy, or were there some small visual changes made to it?
Hrm, rumors of episode 3-6 being handled by subcontract seemed to be true.
The far pans of episode 3 was consierably less quality than the previous two,
and A part had some cuts that were very off-character designs.
Of course, the upclose shots and bust shots didn't suffer much though.
However, I still enjoyed it, and considering this is a three season long anime, for a full gross work it was acceptable IMO.
I do hope that the main Madhouse team returns soon though.
The scheduling in Black Lagoon apparantly is pretty tough right now, (from reading the staff's blogs) and I have a feeling large portion of the core team is working on it right now.
I think Dr. Movie's standard has gotten quite a bit better, probably due to in-house training of Madhouse. This episode was average work, but some of the other Madhouse anime episode with Dr. Movie was pretty excellent.
Speaking of the OP... am I just crazy, or were there some small visual changes made to it?
I noticed it too:
- some scenes look brighter (in the end, when Light is standing on a bridge);
- the shot with the profiles of the policement are completely suffused with red unlike before;
- the Pieta-like tableau shows Light's face;
- in the beginning, when Light faces L, the screen closes in on L's left eye, whereas previously, it ended showing his full face;
- in the second face-off, Light's left eye is grey, when previously it was red;
- there's a ray of light on the table at the very end
As for Light being red, that's not too unusual. Many anime main characters are associated with the colour red/the element of fire. Sentai leaders are generally red too.
Nightengale
2006-10-17, 18:00
First of all, those who say that the OP doesn't hold the basis of general symbolism needs to look into it further. While the Petia scene may not hold that strong of a symbolism other than a need to pull off an artistic look, I'd say that most other scenes hold thier own symbolism from biting the apple atop the world which symbolises Light's imbued and self-absorbed vanity of power once he looks down to the world as God in a less literal sense.
However, Prophet-dono, while I agree the little symbolism of red/blue may seem a little off in the OP, I personally don't think the original author had anything to do with the colours or how the overall presentation of the OP in general is shown.
dxgarten
2006-10-17, 18:41
Episode 03 screencaps and impression (http://www.designchronicle.com/memento/archives/death_note_ep03.html)
It's not as exciting as last week's episode but it's a necessary one to establish next week's story. I just want to know if they'll keep the detective's story and last name like in the manga or if they'll change it into a Japanese name and gives him more scenes like in the live-action.
MrProphet
2006-10-17, 18:58
However, Prophet-dono, while I agree the little symbolism of red/blue may seem a little off in the OP, I personally don't think the original author had anything to do with the colours or how the overall presentation of the OP in general is shown.
I think I was misunderstood. By "author" I didn't mean the gensaku, but rather it was a general description of "anyone involved with the creation of this anime". You could substiture "director" or "screenwriter" or "animation director" there, if you wish.
I should have been making dinner, but instead...
http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/3530/dnopabay6.th.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dnopabay6.jpg)
It's not perfect; my timing was off in parts. (But not in the second frame, the difference really is that big) And I'm sure there are already three million swimming around elsewhere...
Nightengale
2006-10-17, 19:14
I see.
But I don't think your interpration is neccesarily correct either. If they're potraying the symbiance of blue vs red in the traditional Japanese concept of kabukis, it really feels disjointed with the rest of the OP which utilized the more substancial bright imagery + shady/blurry tones and the western artistic sense (( Creation of Adam...Petia )) to reflect the unexistance of black and white in the moral sense of issues, but rather just the power which dictates what is right and wrong. Besides, unlike the clear colours of black vs white, red vs blue can very well be interpreted in other subcultures as well, such as the use of blue and red traditionally in war simulations.
... rest of the OP which utilized the more substancial bright imagery + shady/blurry tones and the western artistic sense (( Creation of Adam...Petia )) to reflect the unexistance of black and white in the moral sense of issues, but rather just the power which dictates what is right and wrong.
Hmm, I'm not sure I correctly understand what you're saying ... I don't think the use of religious imagery is necessarily any suggestion of right or wrong. The creation mural reflects the temptation of man (Light), while the final scene shows a benevolent-looking Light in front of an Ascension/Resurrection of Christ-like or other angelic image, reflecting Light's aspirations to godhood.
Now the Pieta scene ... that's really interesting. I had assumed that the person lying horizontally might be Light in place of Christ, if it were meant to reflect his megalomania, even though it seemed like the one facing the screen looked more like him. However, the third episode OP suddenly shows the seated person's face clearly, and it seems that it is Light in Mary's position after all. And the person lying across his arms ...
looks like the man stalking Light. Their coats are the same colour. Pietas are the depiction of Mary grieving over the corpse of Christ ... I'm starting to feel sorry for that man :(
Besides, unlike the clear colours of black vs white, red vs blue can very well be interpreted in other subcultures as well, such as the use of blue and red traditionally in war simulations.
If I had to see the colours as symbolic, I would say that red and blue were used here to depict opposites, the same way it is generally used in most anime. Red is fire -- emotion, passion, and raw power; blue is water/ice -- logic, calm, detachment, control. They are incompatible, and each other's antithesis. Light has the burning desire to remake the world in the form of his imagined ideal, while L is simply trying to stop him.
Likewise, main characters in anime are often associated with red/fire because their passion is the most important characteristic. You can lump them all together, but in general, you can say that main characters (not necessarily all, but many enough) are often those that are striving to change the status quo. Their passion is why they're main characters in the first place, I guess, since you wouldn't have a story if things simply continued the way they always did before they burst on to the scene.
And as a follow-up to that, at the risk of taking symbolism just a bit too far, the new red tinge to the scene with the policemen ...
may be underlining how they are being played by Light and falling under his sway.
Yes, Blue and Red can mean only one thing....
1P and 2P of course. With the exception of certain plumber brothers.
It means they have the same attributes, same power-ups, and same speed...
just a slightly diffrent sprite and of course, the color. :upset: :uhoh:
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/6304909896.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg
Li Jianliang
2006-10-17, 19:43
Oh, so it wasn't just me who thought the OP sequence for episode 3 suddenly looked a little brighter/clearer? ^^;;
Well, too bad that the animation quality for this episode dropped slightly. There wasn't much in terms of actions, either... I'd personally like to see Light kill off the obligatory top 10 criminals of week at the beginning of each episode just to start things off. XD
Nightengale
2006-10-17, 20:03
^
There was something amissly disjointed about how I phrased my words on the religious imagery context. My stagnant point was more of a reference to the idea that blue vs red in the kabuki context that solely refers to Light vs L in the OP feels out of place with the traditional generic use of black/white/gray in undertoned shades that don't reflect the standard idealogism of simple black vs white in reference to who is good and who is evil in the story context of Death Note. The religious imagery plays a different story context than the good and evil part, though I still found the Creation of Adam's DN potrayal with Light and Ryuk somewhat funny and ironic in a different context.
LOL at aohige-dono's Double Dragon referencing. Honestly, the first thing that came into my mind the second the colour of blue and red appeared was the sentai references.
I think we need a thread solely of OP symbolism/references.
Srin Tuar
2006-10-17, 20:40
Hrm, a nice episode
I'm glad it got back onto a believable track. The whole thing about L giving away so much information to his quarry was a bit disturbing, I cannot imagine anyone giving that much information away by spiling their guts on live TV. He should have simply pretended that he actually died there, and maybe Raito would have forgotten the whole thing. Instead, by dumbly threatening to find him, he risked that a smarter Raito could have simply decided things were getting too hot and taken a 3 year hiatus, the investigation would have been down the drain at that point. Also, they seem only to be focussed on heart failure, but he is free to write down any sort of death he wants, perhaps mixing them up to confuse the investigation. (Lol, I wonder why he doest write down supernatural deaths, such as 神隠し, or vampire bites, etc really test out the death note's power hehe)
If its power he wants, he could go after politicians he doesnt agree with or something. Far fewer names to write, and far more bang for the buck.
Raito just seems dumb and unimaginitive to me. Especially for wanting to kill the investigator on his tail. There is almost no more sure fire way to get caught than that. (gee, only one investigator died, shortly after tailing one of our 140 odd prime suspects... hrm, coincidence much ?)
I really liked the temptation scene at the end. I dont know what Ryuku has to gain from getting some of raito's lifespan, but he certainly seems interested in selling shinigami-vision.... It seems Raito is norinori, so cheers to half his life span :)
Oh, so it wasn't just me who thought the OP sequence for episode 3 suddenly looked a little brighter/clearer? ^^;;
Yeah, i noticed it a lil' bit.. probably 'cause i read it on here before watching the episode.
Episode 03 went as smoothly as the first two, not going to fast with the story teling which is a good sign when thinking about just how long the anime plans to last. Ryuk talk about the Shinigami eyes was also one of my fav' scenes from the manga.. and i'm glad yet again the anime was able to show even more of the stories true dark nature with it. Light's evil smile was seriously one for the record books. :3
As for next episode..
Time for Light to go on a lil' date, shall be good to see how they handle the bus journey and to hear what BGM's they'll add.
Hrm, a nice episode
I'm glad it got back onto a believable track. The whole thing about L giving away so much information to his quarry was a bit disturbing, I cannot imagine anyone giving that much information away by spiling their guts on live TV. He should have simply pretended that he actually did there, and maybe Raito would have forgotten the whole thing. Instead, by dumbly threatening to find him, he risked that a smarter Raito could have simply decided things were getting too hot and taken a 3 year hiatus, the investigation would have been down the drain at that point. Also, they seem only to be focussed on heart failure, but he is free to write down any sort of death he wants, perhaps mixing them up to confuse the investigation. (Lol, I wonder why he doest write down supernatural deaths, such as 神隠し, or vampire bites, etc really test out the death note's power hehe)
I agree that both of them are making some rather risky and illogical moves (without which, there may be no story, sadly). However, I guess we can sort of wave away the questions by convincing ourselves that this is just the nature of genius. L probably takes pride in his investigative ability and couldn't resist the opportunity to gloat a bit at his prey - not unlike Light flaunting his own power in that scene. Furthermore, it is often the case that people in panic make more mistakes, so L may have been trying to get Light to act rashly. Both are also deriving a sense of challenge from this.
Also, my understanding is that his choice of death is deliberate. Light wants people to connect the killings and realise that someone is passing judgement. He wants to become "god".
ShikaShika
2006-10-18, 12:40
Not as exciting as the first episodes, but that's because it simply lacked that one awsome scene the other two had. It was still stellar overall imo.
Deathkillz
2006-10-18, 12:58
yep animation was down this ep...especially on ryuk...
the story is starting to find a slower pace but i hope it picks up next ep...
i cnt get enough of the OP/Ed song >.< loved the way light throws that apple to ryuk in the end song ^__^ cool as hell imo
Pepperidge
2006-10-18, 13:16
So, what point in the manga does this episode cover up to?
. (Lol, I wonder why he doest write down supernatural deaths, such as 神隠し, or vampire bites, etc really test out the death note's power hehe)
The Rules of Death Note Deaths are govern by Natular laws, ERGO, if Vampires or any other supernatural being does not exist in the Death Note universe, those people would not die because of this type of deaths.
if Im not mistaken when Light writes an Imposible or improbable type of death, The person ends up dying of a Heart Attack. The Vampire example is something simlar to wirte a death of a Guy in Paris while his location is in USA-
So, what point in the manga does this episode cover up to?
I've yet to watch the raw, but based on what I saw from dxgarten, it more or less covers chapter 4 to chapter 6. But one thing was shifted in terms of the course of events when going from the manga to the anime.
The course of events went like:
- L gets Light to kill Lind L. Tailor
- Those in the Shinigami realm wonder where Ryuk is and what he's up to
- Sayu asks for help with homework
- Light's father comes home for dinner
- Light makes his special drawer
After that the manga syncs up with the rest of episode 3. I omitted certain things because they were minor points (like Sayu finding a "dirty" magazine in Light's room, which he had for the articles on L vs Kira). The only major change is that Light made his hidden drawer compartment thing earlier in the anime compared to the manga.
ShikaShika
2006-10-18, 14:28
I've yet to watch the raw, but based on what I saw from dxgarten, it more or less covers chapter 4 to chapter 6. But one thing was shifted in terms of the course of events when going from the manga to the anime.
I've flipped through the manga after having seen the raw and I'm pretty sure the episode concludes with chapter 5.
I've flipped through the manga after having seen the raw and I'm pretty sure the episode concludes with chapter 5.
Sorry, my wording was off. I meant that it covered up to the start of chapter 6...which in other words means the end of chapter 5. That's what I meant to say, but you're right, my choice of words was a bit misleading.
Itachikun
2006-10-19, 11:48
ToriyamaWorld released episode 3, hopefully this will help boost our recent bad comments T_T.
Darklightz
2006-10-19, 16:15
Hmm,the change in animation is obvious in episode 3.Light looked a bit less mature and serious,wich is not good.
I did however like the scene where they contrasted Light's every school life with prisoners dying,as if to re-affirm how Light has no guilt or shame about killing other human beings.
Does anyone else think that Light's "get police after L" scheme is kind of lame..
And yes L is more evil then Light.. L "sacrifices" people.. Light just kills them..
BTW Does anyone have any idea why Light's eye is gray in the opening.. isn't that suppose to mean zomby or brain-dead. (in some cases maybe blind)
I did however like the scene where they contrasted Light's every school life with prisoners dying,as if to re-affirm how Light has no guilt or shame about killing other human beings.
I thought it was just to proves his alibi ....
Which should be explained sometime next episode .. I hope/think =x .. I kinda forgot details for the earlier chapters.
The movie explained it .. because Raito killing pattern was distinguished during certain time.
Shabazza
2006-10-19, 17:23
Likewise, main characters in anime are often associated with red/fire because their passion is the most important characteristic. You can lump them all together, but in general, you can say that main characters (not necessarily all, but many enough) are often those that are striving to change the status quo. Their passion is why they're main characters in the first place, I guess, since you wouldn't have a story if things simply continued the way they always did before they burst on to the scene.
That scheme remembers me of the german literary movement "Sturm und Drang" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturm_und_Drang) vs "Aufklärung" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aufkl%C3%A4rung).
Wonderful series, too bad Toriyama uses that ugly font for Ryuks' dialog.
Says you.. I love that font.. :D
Darklightz
2006-10-19, 19:59
I thought it was just to proves his alibi ....
Which should be explained sometime next episode .. I hope/think =x .. I kinda forgot details for the earlier chapters.
The movie explained it .. because Raito killing pattern was distinguished during certain time.
True,it was partly to show L he could kill people whenever he wanted.But it also makes a strange contrast between quiet student and mass murderer.
Well, this episode was very decent!
There were no scenes where I just thought, "Oh yeah, they're completely mischaracterizing Light" or "They're overdoing it". In spite of the fact that in general 90% of the time Madhouse is overdramatic (e.g. cut to: inmates falling through windows) ... in this episode, they actually were underdramatic when they should've been more dramatic, in one instance, IMO:
They could have taken time to transition and justify the stalker's presence, by showing some small part of the events that lead that person to arrive at where they were, instead of just cutting directly to Ryuk noticing some guy hanging outside the school. Of course, they didn't in the manga, but it would have made things clearer, and wouldn't have broken away from canon hardly at all, really.
I'm not sure if it's clear to everyone that L deployed that guy (I hope it ISN'T in fact, so that people will enjoy the suspense more), but what I mean is, if they had showed that man getting handed a file on Light (e.g. cut to: Light's photo) from his superiors, or L making a call to the FBI.
However, I did like that they took the time to show Light clearly stating why he wouldn't want to be followed for a long period of time; I don't remember it being that clear in the manga, though someone who has some time on their hands could possibly prove me wrong.
Without it, somebody might wonder why he's bothering to target the guy. Of course, the main function what he does serves is to isolate L, but it's good to say clearly. Actually, I think they could've been even more clear if they'd had Light say, "If I discovered I needed to move around freely in the future, it would be troublesome if I didn't have time to deal with this man by the time it became necessary that I act". Anyway, I just hope everybody's following all this okay.
So yes. As has been said, they're mixing up events slightly so they can pace things how they want to. The eyes deal actually happened in chapter 3 of the manga, so if this wasn't jumping around at all, then this episode would be covering almost nothing but the eyes deal. But of course they could never hope to pad out the episode if it was covered only that event, so it's natural that they would rearrange events. The only other possibility was placing certain events (of whose existence we only discover later) at the same time as the events in this chapter, which were never actually depicted in the manga.
That is, the event of Misa obtaining her Death Note, and accepting the eyes deal which Light rejects, shown in parallel.
Personally I wish I hadn't thought of it because now I'm disappointed they didn't do it like that...
As for Toriyama's World's sub style: stylizing L's name doesn't work, everything else is OK. Yeah, the shinigami font is actually kinda cool, in my opinion. ;)
However, I did like that they took the time to show Light clearly stating why he wouldn't want to be followed for a long period of time; I don't remember it being that clear in the manga, though someone who has some time on their hands could possibly prove me wrong.
Without it, somebody might wonder why he's bothering to target the guy. Of course, the main function what he does serves is to isolate L, but it's good to say clearly. Actually, I think they could've been even more clear if they'd had Light say, "If I discovered I needed to move around freely in the future, it would be troublesome if I didn't have time to deal with this man by the time it became necessary that I act". Anyway, I just hope everybody's following all this okay.
Why do I feel like I've been called out? lol. :heh: Light does in fact mention why he didn't want to be watched so long, though there was one thing he said in the episode that wasn't in the manga.
That line was "I appear as nothing more than a student."
As for the manga, where he contemplates what him being follow means are on pages 138 and 139. L realizing someone has access to what the task force knowss and now suspects the NPA, it only being 6 days since the leak and even he's being followed although he's only a family member, there must be quite a few people on the job, the likelihood of him being suspected as Kira is most likely zero since there are too many other suspects and how if the operation goes on for months, there is the chance that he might come under scrutiny. One thing they did kind of cut was Light entering his room and making note of the fact that his shadower has not gone into his room yet.
So yes. As has been said, they're mixing up events slightly so they can pace things how they want to. The eyes deal actually happened in chapter 3 of the manga, so if this wasn't jumping around at all, then this episode would be covering almost nothing but the eyes deal. But of course they could never hope to pad out the episode if it was covered only that event, so it's natural that they would rearrange events. The only other possibility was placing certain events (of whose existence we only discover later) at the same time as the events in this chapter, which were never actually depicted in the manga.
Actually, the eyes deal happened in chapter 5 of the manga, aptly named "Eyeballs." The only major changes I have noticed so far is that Sayu has asked Light for help with her homework twice and the timing of when Light made his super-hidden drawer thing.
jackstalk
2006-10-19, 20:59
So would Raito be able to see his own death date after he recieves shinigami eyes?
In the old traditions of the Japanese kabuki theater, red is the color of courage and justice. Actors who played the protagonist and other "good" characters used red make-up. On the other hand, blue is the color of the supernatural beings, of immorality and of equanimity. Actors who played the antagonist and demons used blue make-up.
Do you think there is something here? For some reason, I really dislike both L and Light. Both are sociopathic nutcases, in my opinion, so I am a bit surprised that the authors would try to differentiate between good and evil like that.
I thought the opposite of the color association with the characters in respect. L is impressing me as the good guy (by encasing "good" in plenty of quotation mark) while I have this distinct disliking for Light. The Kabuki style theatrics that can be seen in shows like Ayakashi and Bakumatsu are also lacking. Also, the interpretation of the color association might differ from person to person depending on their impression of the characters which, in turn, will trigger a brief rant if you will bear with me. :)
So far up to episode 3, Light hasn't impressed me as a genius of any sort, though, he is darn lucky. Just look at all the adavantages he is surrounded with, i.e. A notebook to kill people, an invisible shinigami who is keeping him company, a police chief for a dad, and if what Ryuk is offering near the end of the episode, Light's advantage is going to get even more ridiculously one sided.
L's, on the other hand, shown to be someone who is coming up with these obscure theories that aren't so obscure when he starts explaining via demonstration, i.e. live broadcasting of snuffing.:heh: We haven't been shown how exactly he is coming with these theories or what line of thoughts he is following to come up with any of his theories, but so far the indication is that he isn't relying on anything supernatural to churn up his theories. That, in my opinion, is what give L the edge over Light when it comes to utilizing the grey matter.
Light is horrible. After episode 2, no one should have any illusion that Light is killing criminals for the sake of justice. No. He is a sociopath. Actually, a very bored sociopath who was looking for an opportunity to do something. Episode 3 just reinforced that idea. Ryuk said it best in episode 1 when he asked, what Light will do when all the criminals' run out for killing? That said, L isn't any better. He had no qualm about letting someone die for his theories sake.
Both of them are indeed sociopaths, but if it is L vs. Light, then L is the better choice.
In other news, L uses a PowerMac. I guess that explains why he's such a freak. 8)
:heh:
White Manju Bun
2006-10-19, 21:53
So would Raito be able to see his own death date after he recieves shinigami eyes?
No even when human trade for the eyes they cannot see there own deathwhen you trade for the eyes you cant see other death note user deaths. ie: when Misa sees Raito for the first time she only sees his name
I like Ryuk's font as well :)
Good epi, I love hearing L talk, his voice is great! I cant wait til he starts working with the cops.
Man I will say they are moving through the manga quickly, which is good imo.
That said, L isn't any better. He had no qualm about letting someone die for his theories sake.
Ohh, all this talk about how L is as bad as Light is just killing me as an L fan. I'd love to post spoilers, but I'll just grit my teeth and bear it. :)
Dark, thanks for mentioning that, I now realize that for some reason I went from thinking that the eyes deal is 1 chapter long to thinking that it was the third chapter just as this is the third episode. Also on another note I just realized that putting in the disclaimer that "I could be proved wrong" is kind of bad of me, won't happen again (though aye, I do think the manga was less clear).
Btw, WMB, mentioning the existence of that character and what role they play is a major spoiler in my opinion, I would really recommend you rephrase the spoiler tag description.
I did notice your post in the episode 1 topic about the notebook being filled up line. I took about 5 minutes to search for the Livejournal post from someone who was comparing translations (that person spoke Japanese) but since I couldn't find it I just gave up.
However, if you can believe my memory, the person said that the line's ambiguity was probably the reason why Viz apparently changed the meaning when they translated it. That LJ post also mentioned that Viz changed the meaning of all the God references... so yeah, when Viz did the translation they took the time to change around things slightly.
If I had to make a definite decision one way or the other, I would guess that Ohba unthinkingly wrote it to mean that the notebook would literally fill up, but then changed her mind and tried to amend this by adding a "Rule of the Death Note" contradicting it, and when the Viz translation came by, she advised that they translate it differently in light of that. However, since it's not clear who was behind the translation, or even if Ohba is aware of it (lol, I think we care way more about details than she does... we certainly care more about characterization than she did, according to 13) and there's no need to make that definite decision, I still consider the matter ambiguous.
(Note: when I say she or her I mean he/she and him/her, everybody assuming Ohba is female for some reason is rubbing off on me.)
kamikazex
2006-10-19, 23:08
damn awesome epsode...
L is sooo damn accurate
Dark, thanks for mentioning that, I now realize that for some reason I went from thinking that the eyes deal is 1 chapter long to thinking that it was the third chapter just as this is the third episode. Also on another note I just realized that putting in the disclaimer that "I could be proved wrong" is kind of bad of me, won't happen again (though aye, I do think the manga was less clear).
Btw, WMB, mentioning the existence of that character and what role they play is a major spoiler in my opinion, I would really recommend you rephrase the spoiler tag description.
Perhaps "prove otherwise" would've been a better choice of words, lol. ;p And while I might not think it's a _major_ spoiler, it is a fairly big one so rewording the second spoiler tag description would probably be a good idea.
I did notice your post in the episode 1 topic about the notebook being filled up line. I took about 5 minutes to search for the Livejournal post from someone who was comparing translations (that person spoke Japanese) but since I couldn't find it I just gave up.
However, if you can believe my memory, the person said that the line's ambiguity was probably the reason why Viz apparently changed the meaning when they translated it. That LJ post also mentioned that Viz changed the meaning of all the God references... so yeah, when Viz did the translation they took the time to change around things slightly.
If I had to make a definite decision one way or the other, I would guess that Ohba unthinkingly wrote it to mean that the notebook would literally fill up, but then changed her mind and tried to amend this by adding a "Rule of the Death Note" contradicting it, and when the Viz translation came by, she advised that they translate it differently in light of that. However, since it's not clear who was behind the translation, or even if Ohba is aware of it (lol, I think we care way more about details than she does... we certainly care more about characterization than she did, according to 13) and there's no need to make that definite decision, I still consider the matter ambiguous.
(Note: when I say she or her I mean he/she and him/her, everybody assuming Ohba is female for some reason is rubbing off on me.)
I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt about the LJ thing. The wording of the aforementioned lines are quite vague/ambiguous, not to mention the fact that things can and will get lost in translation, and it's not hard to believe that such a thing is possible. One thing though...is that if the Death Note were to literally never run out of pages, one should be able to flip through the notebook forever and never reach the back cover. :heh:
But considering its supernatural origins and whatnot, anything can be possible when it comes to this. In all honesty, whether or not the Death Note can run out of pages isn't all that big a deal to me personally, so I don't feel the need to engage in on-going discussions about it in an attempt to reach a consensus with other fans. I most certainly agree with you on the last point, the matter is quite ambiguous indeed.
This series is getting pretty damn interesting...
this series is bad ass. I just love the strategic mind games that both L and Light are playing on each other.
ShikaShika
2006-10-20, 09:36
The only major changes I have noticed so far is that Sayu has asked Light for help with her homework twice and the timing of when Light made his super-hidden drawer thing.
I think they probably only changed that because they wanted to end episode 2 with that scene, so they had to add some more material before it. Nice to know Madhouse won't use filler to fill gaps such as that.
Other than that, so far the anime is going steadily at a rate of two chapters per episode (keeping in mind that the first chapter is twice as long as the rest). Of course, three episodes in is a bit too early to make assumptions, but at the current rate, the whole manga would require about 54-55 episodes
Cooldude
2006-10-20, 09:54
Hrm, a nice episode
I'm glad it got back onto a believable track. The whole thing about L giving away so much information to his quarry was a bit disturbing, I cannot imagine anyone giving that much information away by spiling their guts on live TV. He should have simply pretended that he actually died there, and maybe Raito would have forgotten the whole thing. Instead, by dumbly threatening to find him, he risked that a smarter Raito could have simply decided things were getting too hot and taken a 3 year hiatus, the investigation would have been down the drain at that point. Also, they seem only to be focussed on heart failure, but he is free to write down any sort of death he wants, perhaps mixing them up to confuse the investigation. (Lol, I wonder why he doest write down supernatural deaths, such as 神隠し, or vampire bites, etc really test out the death note's power hehe)
If its power he wants, he could go after politicians he doesnt agree with or something. Far fewer names to write, and far more bang for the buck.
Raito just seems dumb and unimaginitive to me. Especially for wanting to kill the investigator on his tail. There is almost no more sure fire way to get caught than that. (gee, only one investigator died, shortly after tailing one of our 140 odd prime suspects... hrm, coincidence much ?)
I really liked the temptation scene at the end. I dont know what Ryuku has to gain from getting some of raito's lifespan, but he certainly seems interested in selling shinigami-vision.... It seems Raito is norinori, so cheers to half his life span :)
A lot of those points are incorrect:
1. L challenged Kira because he wants to test his method of killing by daring Kira to kill him. Kira couldn't kill him, which allowed L to eventually figure out the fact that Kira can't kill without a face and name. Which actually makes it quite logical and daring
2. You'll see why Light doesn't use supernatural deaths in the next couple of episodes.
3. Keep watching to see how Light covers himself while trying to kill the investigators.
4. There's also a reason why Light doesn't go after politicians, you have to watch on to know that
Thanks to L and Kira, they made everyone in this series looks stupid.
but at the current rate, the whole manga would require about 54-55 episodes
Yeah, thats what i've been thinking since watching the third episode, still - i'm sure there's a way to fit it all into 37 episodes. There must be if thats there plan~
DoReMiFaSo
2006-10-20, 11:42
A lot of those points are incorrect:
1. L challenged Kira because he wants to test his method of killing by daring Kira to kill him. Kira couldn't kill him, which allowed L to eventually figure out the fact that Kira can't kill without a face and name. Which actually makes it quite logical and daring
2. You'll see why Light doesn't use supernatural deaths in the next couple of episodes.
3. Keep watching to see how Light covers himself while trying to kill the investigators.
4. There's also a reason why Light doesn't go after politicians, you have to watch on to know that
Yeah, I really hope they would explain the stuff you mentioned. Because right now, Light seems pretty stupid to expose himself like that, and wanting to kill you-know-who.
I love this series. Just when you think L has the upper hand, you find out that Light is not as reckless as you thought. Sure Kira has now exposed himself a bit more, but the scene follows and Light explains how he was expecting L to pick up on those hints. What I want to say is that both sides have an edge in this duel and can really convince you that they'll be the one ending up on top.
But now with the death eyes... Even though it is a bit awkward to see a person's name and lifespan in the written form above the head, it introduces another exciting element to this fight. I want to see how L will react to that.
ImperialPanda
2006-10-20, 17:04
They need to work on cutting down on the amount of talking. Convert some dialogue to visual elements.
Kisuke06
2006-10-20, 20:00
L is a very smart guy. Just by looking at the time of the deaths he made that [right] theory that Kira is a student. L and Light are 2 very intelligent guys.
Another good episode. Not quite as exciting as the first too, and the animation slumped a bit. But it's still solid.
They need to work on cutting down on the amount of talking. Convert some dialogue to visual elements.
Err...it's meant to have this much talking. It's somewhat akin to a "thinking man's" anime...cutting down the amount of dialog would actually be detrimental to the series.
Yep, a duel between two masterminds, each side trying to solve the mystery before the other does. The dialogue then serves to provide us with an understanding of both sides' deductive thinking process, because a lot really goes through the minds of Light and L.
itzfurrball
2006-10-21, 06:38
L is Sherlock Holmes :heh:
Hopeful Death
2006-10-21, 13:38
Does that make Light Professor Moriarty?
indicatoto101
2006-10-21, 18:59
I haven't read the manga. Can someone answer why having Shinigami eyes would help Light? L sounds like a monicker, an alias. Until Light figures out L's real name, he can't kill him right?
Light is definitely the protagonist, so he couldn't be Moriarity in a literary sense, probably.
Can someone answer why having Shinigami eyes would help Light? L sounds like a monicker, an alias. Until Light figures out L's real name, he can't kill him right?
With the shinigami eyes, if you can see a person's face, then you can see their name, and those are the two requirements to kill a person using the death note. Did you mean to say that until Light figures out L's face, he can't kill him, then? Either way, yes, it's true that just having the shinigami eyes would not give Light the ability to kill L.
Amazing! Just I'm appalled by the screenwriting and the direction DEATH NOTE demonstrates to the audience.
Basically, Light would have an easier management to use the Death Note if he's willing to pay a little price to Ryuk, and that is the Shinigami's Eyes.
I continue to commend the writers for keeping Ryuk just as spectator witnessing on how Light's and L's pursuit will end up to; never stepping into the stage.
The deal is that Ryuk from time to time will intentionally slip some words of secret to Light in order to rise the stakes, and make the race more exciting. There are some secrets which by Shinigami's Laws, Ryuk can never disclose to Light. So, it's rest to Light how to make out his tactics while at the same time keeping his suspicion factor down to zero.
DEATH NOTE is telling how the characters are picking their jigsaw pieces to carefully solve the puzzle. Picking the wrong piece means being found out, and it's the end for either of both.
Light's tactics provoked aftereffects than those he calculated before. The police force is starting to waver and call back among its members, because their eyes are open to the possibility that Kira might kill them all anytime given that there identities are constantly exposed by the media coverage while L's remain incognito.
But I presume, that L's is working his mind to see through Light/Kira's ruse. He knows would be risky to expose himself once becoming public and most likely suspects that Kira's knows as well that L and the police are working together just for compromise, and sooner or later it will become inevitable for the police to attempt on investigating his identity giving chance to Light on exposing him.
I have NEVER seen the manga, so let me tell you all this:
- If L is planning to take the risk in order to reach and expose Kira, the most obvious solution for now would be holding a dual identity. Keeping a facade on public under a false identity and infiltrate the Japanese society from the people's view as an ordinary student, certainly to the truth that he suspects Kira's a student given the date and time rate when the killings continue to increase.
I gasped in surprise never to have imagined that the Chief of the Tokyo Metropolitan Police Force resulted in being Light's dad. I mean I knew that Light's father was a member of the Police, explaining his easygoing access to the police file records, but that the Chief himself to be his pops never crossed my mind, until I saw the episode.
CarpeDiem
2006-10-21, 23:43
I haven't read the manga. Can someone answer why having Shinigami eyes would help Light? L sounds like a monicker, an alias. Until Light figures out L's real name, he can't kill him right?
Also, realize that, in this episode, Light also has some mysterious person following him around. Obviously, Light can't just ignore him, so he has to find a way to get rid of him. It'd be difficult to get his name, so with the Shinigami eyes, he'd be able to get his name just by getting a glance at him.
People who haven't read the manga, keep your eyes out for the next episode. It gets pretty interesting. ;)
SkyDragon
2006-10-22, 01:21
Wow, another excellent episode. Indee Light is a very bright person, but L is bright too...Two mastermind going at it = AWESOME!!!
Kikaifan
2006-10-22, 01:28
I have to agree. I don't think I've ever watched anything quite like this before. Heck, I don't think I've ever even read a novel where the setup creates such a well-portrayed and enthralling game of entrapment.
Still, Light is definitely handicapped by his ego. As a non-manga reader, it seems to me that his best defense against L would be to ignore him, but he just can't back down from a challenge to his moral position and intelligence.
Deathkillz
2006-10-22, 11:25
i dnt think just ignoring L would help as hes 100% hounding for the trace of Light...
L is trying to fistly search for where Light is right? then the best part to start serching and to find any clues would be the police force...this includes searching and spying even on the families of the police force just in case L can find a clue...if you think about it the criminals that are being killed arent just ones that you can look up on the web...they are ppl with personal secure records only held by the police...so with this fact the person who is able to grab this info is someone who is connected with the police force and knows how to access these files...
So far so Good, And how faithful the anime team is maintaning themselves wiht the series is what i have like the most.
Sinestra
2006-10-23, 09:20
Seems like both our guys have got a battle plan going on. Lights plan is excellent on luring L out. I just think its going to work L is too smart and if the police couldnt get him before whats makes Light think they can get him now even if they wanted too his on their side. But then again the 3 officers asking to be taken off the case might be a sign of things to come
evil-samurai
2006-10-24, 07:42
Fantastic episode.. even if there are little problems in the episodes the VA of the three main guys is so Dam good that it doesn't matter so much. The Story is
like the first two very well done =) I wonder for how long we will see L just in one place..
Death Note has become the most interesting show this season =) While I like Irohanihoheto I've only seen two episodes (with-out subs)I gasped in surprise never to have imagined that the Chief of the Tokyo Metropolitan Police Force resulted in being Light's dad.I never though that he'd be.. Great Suprize =)
Thanks Dark'
Sorry for Trouble, Delete this message please :(
Again... No thread for Episode 4... So this is the Images of RAW 4
Please for Modo , Delete this message after the Episode 4 Thread is created
http://dat.2chan.net/18/res/3812837.htm
Episode 4 discussion thread is here: http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=37815 It's been up for a good 14 hours or so... :eyebrow:
EvolutionXI
2006-10-24, 21:00
Finally got around to watching ep 3...good ep like the other two and nice development. I just have a question thats been bothering me. To clarify, Light needs both a person's face and real name to kill them right?...and can't if say L actually did appear but gave a fake name?
FatPianoBoy
2006-10-24, 21:56
Finally got around to watching ep 3...good ep like the other two and nice development. I just have a question thats been bothering me. To clarify, Light needs both a person's face and real name to kill them right?...and can't if say L actually did appear but gave a fake name?
Hence why he's all 'ZOMG!!' over the Shinigami eyes that Ryuk was talking about ;)
If Light took those shinigami eyes, it won't be a bother if he doesnt know the name, the problem is how could he knew if he doesnt seen him..
anyway..
I like the scene when Ryuk was creep out even thou Light is the one being watch by that detective like guy...
Well, to clarify, I don't think she is trying to embody the concepts of good and evil in L and Light respectively. Rather than good or evil, I think Death Note is more about society VS the individual...
wow...I just joined this site the other day....so many insightful replies.....but I can't help agreeing with musouka. I too believe that the series "is more about society vs. the individual."
I just finished watching episode 3 of Death Note....and I was wondering....if L and Light were to represent a political party...which one of them would be the Democratic party, and which one the Republican? :D
indicatoto101
2006-10-28, 01:15
Light is definitely the protagonist, so he couldn't be Moriarity in a literary sense, probably.
With the shinigami eyes, if you can see a person's face, then you can see their name, and those are the two requirements to kill a person using the death note. Did you mean to say that until Light figures out L's face, he can't kill him, then? Either way, yes, it's true that just having the shinigami eyes would not give Light the ability to kill L.
I meant that seeing L's face might not help Light figure out who he really is. Is the Shinigami eyes going to tell Light that the person he's seeing is L? If so, he clearly has an advantage and can use the death note to kill L. But really, what kind of name is L. It sounds like an alias, it doesn't like its his real name. If Light sees L's face, how would an arbitrary name like Shiro Kazawa:heh: help Light to determine that THAT person IS L?
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