View Full Version : Death Note Episode 7 Discussion / Poll
Welcome to the discussion thread for Death Note, Episode 7!
Thread Guidelines
Keep spoilers from the Manga out of the anime thread. You may not even post manga spoilers in spoiler tags!
No telling or asking for RAWs.
If you need to in reply to someone with a reference to the Manga, either PM them or post in the Manga thread. Please be considerate of anime only watchers, too many manga spoilers are being posted, so please, no more!
Discuss your expectations of the episode if not aired.
Be polite to your fellow forum members.
Try to keep the discussion on topic and future episode spoilers out of the thread whenever possible.
Spoiler Tag Usage
Using Spoiler Tags is easy. Using this...
Don't forget to use the spoiler title
....will get you this...
Don't forget to use the spoiler title
Please remember, no manga spoilers are allowed in this thread!
*Link Deleted*
RAW 7 IMAGES
This is the episode i've been waiting for. :3
Judging from the preview, the animation looks to be 100% perfect - we shall see.
This is the episode i've been waiting for. :3
Judging from the preview, the animation looks to be 100% perfect - we shall see.
I just watched this, and you're in for a major treat. Best episode yet IMO. It's not that the animation is flashy, per se (although they use some nice tricks here and there), but the art is spot-on throughout. I don't want to talk too much about it until more people have seen it, but the anime staff did some really, really good work here.
Cai Calamigarde
2006-11-15, 00:45
my gooood
this is amazing!!!!
Although the story does not improve much, the animation and spirit was incredible...
go Kira go
10 points
Oh ... my ... god ... The episode literally had me white-knuckled the whole time. I was fighting temptation to skip to the end and see what happened.
My only beef with the episode is ... did Light really have to gloat at the very end? His ego was really taking over there when he revealed that he was Kira. Even though he was pretty sure he got her real name this time, that was really risky.
And that was a real stroke of good luck with the snow just starting to fall right then.
Now I wonder ... when she dies, will it come to the investigators' attention that she had important information concerning the Kira case and was last seen with Light? I guess most wouldn't be thinking about death through means other than heart attacks, but perhaps L would grab on to it.
Deathkillz
2006-11-15, 01:54
hoho the truth shall be revealed...grab your tissues!
Itachikun
2006-11-15, 04:43
Wow oh wow. Definitly one of my favorite episodes, full 10.
This episode covers Chapter 13 and 14 only.
With the great animation at the final 2 minutes, really emotional and the whole of Naomi going up the imaginative stairs to go hang herself and the whole snowing thing was insane.
Still the music gave me the chills, really want to check out the OST when it comes out. You kinda feel sorry for her, she comes up with the perfect theory and was close on capturing Kira only to find herself die.
Then again, her death is to be seen, since she lost Ray and now she has nothing.
I just watched this, and you're in for a major treat.
Indeed i was, just watched it. :3
This was the episode i was waiting for to see animated, and i was not disappointed at all. The animation for episode 07 was ultra amazing.. they seriously went over the top to show just what they can do with Death Note, i was amazed beyond belief with this episode. I've gotta give it to them for showing some pretty amazing evil looks from Light:
http://img382.imageshack.us/img382/6508/bscap0006xm5.th.jpg (http://img382.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bscap0006xm5.jpg)http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/9546/bscap0007np1.th.jpg (http://img244.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bscap0007np1.jpg)http://img292.imageshack.us/img292/7924/bscap0008mn5.th.jpg (http://img292.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bscap0008mn5.jpg)http://img382.imageshack.us/img382/5297/bscap0011fx3.th.jpg (http://img382.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bscap0011fx3.jpg)
Watching 'Her' walk of was a lot more emotional for this version.. its probably thanks to the music helping a lot. Also, the snow appearing just at the right time as the card was passed over - genius.
Deathkillz
2006-11-15, 12:50
light is such a bastard!
the ep centered around how light deals with the situation with ray's fiancee...he tries to bump her off half wat though the ep but fails...suspiciously ryuk laughing his head off in the background...his laugh is soo dam annoying! >.<
finally after much probing she reveales her name as Naomi...
the end got me all emotional...her face when light told her his true identity and the split second to when the deathnote started acting upon her made me feel that the whole world was crashing down...when i read the manga i couldnt believe what had happened and not its has replayed in front of me again...i ask myself why?...it not fair that this happened to her >.<
it not fair that this happened to her >.<
You could say its not fair, but then again - everyone who has died up until now including the FBI agents was not fair... its not just with Death Note, the world we live in isn't a fair place. I agree what you're saying really - also on the fact that the ending to the episode did have one hell of an emotional impact that's very rare to see these days.
I love this episode. Everything about it is so awesome.
Cartoons can have an amazing advantage over Live Action, because you can create angles and shots in the former that you can't do in the latter.
Like when Light is looking at Maki over his watch. That just can't be done in Live Action.
ApathyEcstasy
2006-11-15, 23:16
light is godly
His actions are completely gone insane.
The absolute only thing that could be excused was if he only went after criminals. Well this is crazy hahaha... i can't believe it
Cai Calamigarde
2006-11-16, 02:57
You could say its not fair, but then again - everyone who has died up until now including the FBI agents was not fair... its not just with Death Note, the world we live in isn't a fair place. I agree what you're saying really - also on the fact that the ending to the episode did have one hell of an emotional impact that's very rare to see these days.
Don't worry, people... Justice WILL prevail... :)
In this case, after death, that shall be... :p
Li Jianliang
2006-11-16, 08:34
Episode 7 Screen Captures (http://atashi.animeblogger.net/2006/11/death-note-episode-7-clouded-sky/)
The only thing that bothered me about the episode was how pale/ashen Naomi was. Investigating Kira can't suck that much color out of a person, can it...? >_> Even Light had more saturated skin than she did.
Unlike the FBI agents, who were killed for no reason at all, Light actually had a reason for getting rid of Naomi.
Check out the look of evil glee as he taunts her right to her grave. He's just SO pleased that he can kill her. He even mocks mocks her.
How many of you can STILL say that he's not the villian of the story? I mean seriously guys.
How many of you can STILL say that he's not the villian of the story? I mean seriously guys.
Its easy to understand that he's the villian, but then again he's doing all this to make the world a better place - thats why i don't see him as a 100% villian.
White Manju Bun
2006-11-16, 11:03
This epi was sugoi! The whole thing, I think this epi really shows how freaking smart Light is since he had to come up a whole new plan...
After Naomi didnt die the first time. She was smart about orginally giving him a false name that does kinda freak him out for a while. But in the end Light works his evil magic and gets her to spill it. Gah the look on her face when Light says he's Kira was excellent
What an ending! Best epi so far! And Matsuda is as annoying in the anime as he is in the manga XD
I am disappointed in the fact she gaver her name like that. She is a super-cop in the sense that she understood all of what happened. I can't believe she made is as easy as that.
Something tells me she isn't going to die -- Light left some major loopholes open to keep her from comitting suicide, and she's in the OP, right? She's important.
But for being so smart, paranoid enough to not give out her real name and having such advacned knowledge of Kira's capabilities -- to think she would just hand out her name to a stranger like that. Just unbelievable.
---But for being so smart, paranoid enough to not give out her real name and having such advacned knowledge of Kira's capabilities -- to think she would just hand out her name to a stranger like that. Just unbelievable.---
I disagree.
Kira spent most of the episode gaining her trust. He was able to show himself to her as a detective. He acted very well.
After giving her reason to believe that he is not Kira by confirming her theories (one would think that if he was Kira, he would try to steer her wrong), he dangles a carrot in front of her. "If you tell this guy whom you trust to be a decent human being your name, than you can join L's team, and thus be closer to avenging your dead lover."
Also, he didn't pose the carrot to her like that, he posed in the form of: " I think you'd be a plus to the team, all you need to join is a team member's recommendation, an ID (so I can be sure that your not really Kira) , and L's personal approval. You already have my recommendation so..." Nice little Psy-Ops trick.
Also, I would like to state that the little flourish by Kira in the last half-second was also a very nice touch. I think Maki's (what was her real name?) oh-no look will stay in memory for a while.
Something tells me she isn't going to die -- Light left some major loopholes open to keep her from comitting suicide, and she's in the OP, right? She's important.
But for being so smart, paranoid enough to not give out her real name and having such advacned knowledge of Kira's capabilities -- to think she would just hand out her name to a stranger like that. Just unbelievable.
Well, yeah, light left loopholes in how she died, but he's already proven someone will die of a heart attack if the method of death cannot be followed through. So let's say there's some way she is unable to kill herself for whatever reason, her heart will give out. Let's face it, the girl's dead.
Now, as for the handing her name out to a stranger, I find this improbable, but not unbelievable. Remember, she says that she trust L fully (at least in the manga) and that Light reminds her of L. He's been talking to her graciously and in what she perceives as a helpful manner, and here he is, quite tactfully offering her a way to get her information straight to L, when it's already been proven he's the son of a high ranking police officer, and that he's already helped solve other cases. Top this off with her frustration at losing her fiance. Light played upon those grieving emotions perfectly to get to Naomi. It would be hard to do, but Light was obviously intended to be shown as someone who knows what he's doing.
Now, as for all the complaints of Light being too evil or bastard-ish, I have this to say. Good and evil are completely relative. All religious beliefs, all political philosophies, all morals you ever had ingrained upon you are subjects which are open to debate. Let's think of it this way for a moment: The world is already overcrowded, and some of those people crowding the world are making the world a worse place to live in than it already is. If one does not let one's emotional self interfere with judgment here, and leave your decision entirely up to logic, it makes complete sense to kill off these people. We just don't like it because we wouldn't want someone with a deathnote passing judgment on us, and because we begin to pity those who are killed. It's our (good) emotional side that doesn't like Light, not our logical side. The FBI agents Light killed because they were a hinderance to his mission, as he stated (at least in the manga) that if the investigation went on too long, he may come under suspicion. If Light came under suspicion, he would no longer be able to do his duty, and if he were to be placed under suspicion then, chances are there'd be a lot more people to kill if he were to get out of it and continue working towards his goal of ridding the world of evil. Naomi Misora was also, obviously, someone who could have prevented him from seeing the end of his "noble goal." These people are now just collateral damage who got in the way of trying to get rid of people who, in all reason, should probably be gotten rid of.
Don't get me wrong here. I'm not going to endorse the killing of anyone in real life, the afore mentioned (good) moral side that exists within (most) people prevents me from doing so with a clean conscience. However, in a work of fiction, I feel that it's alright to judge with logic and not emotions when it comes to death. Say what you will about Light being evil, it really makes no difference. Hero or villain, sympathetic villain or anti-hero, he is doing that which is (in the world of Death Note) logical.
...I will admit to him having a God complex, but that's what makes me love his character.
Killing the FBI agents was completely pointless -- he had a rational motive for killing Naomi, as she posed a real threat to him, but Ray was completely harmless and Light knew that Ray didn't suspect him. If he let Ray live all that would have happened is that Ray would have reported that Light wasn't suspicious and that would be that. But Light went out of his way and put himself in grave danger to just so that he could kill them, and boy was he mightly pleased with himself after the fact. He was just Evil Glee Boy when he wasted Naomi, no contrition, no conflicting emotions, he was so happy he could't help but mock her on her way to grave.
And was it mentioned that the victim will die of a heart attack if impossible conditions of death were mentioned? I only remember that impossible pre-death conditions wouldn't happen, and if no specific cause of death is speified it was heart attack. So if it was: "Die while standing in the middle of the Atlantic ocean", you would die of a heart attack, but not in the middle of the ocean. So, if it was: "Go to a place only she and Ray knows and comit suicide," you will go to such a place and comitt suicide -- but if you try and suicide and someone stops you, will you die of a heart attack anyway?
Killing the FBI agents was completely pointless -- he had a rational motive for killing Naomi, as she posed a real threat to him, but Ray was completely harmless and Light knew that Ray didn't suspect him. If he let Ray live all that would have happened is that Ray would have reported that Light wasn't suspicious and that would be that. But Light went out of his way and put himself in grave danger to just so that he could kill them, and boy was he mightly pleased with himself after the fact. He was just Evil Glee Boy when he wasted Naomi, no contrition, no conflicting emotions, he was so happy he could't help but mock her on her way to grave.
And was it mentioned that the victim will die of a heart attack if impossible conditions of death were mentioned? I only remember that impossible pre-death conditions wouldn't happen, and if no specific cause of death is speified it was heart attack. So if it was: "Die while standing in the middle of the Atlantic ocean", you would die of a heart attack, but not in the middle of the ocean. So, if it was: "Go to a place only she and Ray knows and comit suicide," you will go to such a place and comitt suicide -- but if you try and suicide and someone stops you, will you die of a heart attack anyway?
Yeah, you'd die of a heart attack anyways I think, 'cause the method of death specified would have become impossible. And yeah, Light's pleased with himself when Naomi goes off to die, but he just accomplished something that one can suspect he viewed as being difficult. He's probably proud of himself for it. I think he's already at the point where he views the human world as a battle among bugs: They can all be stepped on at any time, yet they all try to live despite their insignificance. He's just a bug that's found a way to step on all the others, and let's face it, if you see a spider eating a mosquito, d'you immediately think that's wrong? Nah, I have a tendancy to be pleased that there's one less little annoyance in the world to bite me and suck my blood. I'm pretty sure Light views himself as the spider. Take the hard focus off the world, that's all we really are, isn't it? Insignifcant specks fighting among eachother about equally pointless issues.
...And here I am, on an anime message board saying this. oo;;; Hm. That makes me a hypocrite, doesn't it? :p
Li Jianliang
2006-11-16, 19:00
Something tells me she isn't going to die -- Light left some major loopholes open to keep her from comitting suicide, and she's in the OP, right? She's important.She's dead.
The rest of the instructions are along the lines of "thinks up the best way to commit suicide that she can without bothering other people so that her body won't be discovered, dies in 48 hours".http://atashi.animeblogger.net/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/death_07/death07_51.jpg
...And here I am, on an anime message board saying this. oo;;; Hm. That makes me a hypocrite, doesn't it? :p
Hah! :D
I'm eagerly waiting for a sub to enjoy the episode to its full extent.
She's dead.
The rest of the instructions are along the lines of "thinks up the best way to commit suicide that she can without bothering other people so that her body won't be discovered, dies in 48 hours".
Not only that, but they added the extra scene of 'Her' walking up the lil' stairs that appear at the end of the episode. Thats there just to show.. if you missed what Light wrote down, you'll know where she's heading.
TougeSil80
2006-11-17, 05:55
Damn, I really wished Naomi didn't have to die. Light is really killing more and more innocent people. Like someone said before, Light didn't even have to kill Ray at all, if he would've killed that busjacker in a more discrete way, then Ray or even L wouldn't be able to make that connection.
This episode disgusted me in ways I never thought possible. That woman was so absurdly gullible... I cannot believe it. I would have expected more from a former FBI agent. If or when she dies, good riddance. One less moronic buffoon is always a good thing. >o
On one hand, I can kinda understand that she got emotional and caved in, but on the other hand it just feels a little too convenient especially for a former FBI agent. She was determined to talk to L first but when Light came with that offer she suddenly changed her mind? Suuuuuuure.
Another fabulous ep. There was lots of tension building up there.
But still i prefer for this arc, I seem to prefer the movie one than the anime as it seems to be more realistic.
juri_miki
2006-11-17, 10:29
The episode just aired, but I'm not sure if it's still considered a spoiler though.
I still can not believe that she gave her name out to him just like that. No, how she even trusted him just like so.
She stinks as an FBI agent and I can see why she isn't one anymore.
First off, when Light mentioned that he was apart of the Kira investigation, even if the investigation wasn't being held there, the receptionists made note that they hadn't even seen in him in a hella long time. Also, Light kept checking his watch as soon as she told him his name the first time and seemed to have been stalling her as she was getting closer and closer to the NPA's building. You would think after having worked for the FBI for a while and having worked with L she would've been a lot more sharp than that.
Second, didn't she think it was suspicious IN THE FIRST PLACE that this random guy wanted to talk to her OUTSIDE and then just whisk her away out of the NPA bldg. THEN he tries to convince her NOT to go inside the building again. IRL that would have been hella' suspicious.
Yet the biggest problem was the incompetance of the receptionists. If you go the police and tell them that you have information that could lead the arrest of ANY suspect, ESPECIALLY homicide, they would never ever let you go just like that. They have to treat those people just like suspects as well. IRL those guys would have been fired if they found out that they let go of a possible lead just like so.
Also, even if what Light said was true, all Naomi had to do was to go back to the US and get her own job back. She could've just contacted L that way. She didn't need the Japanese police if that was the case.
So I guess it's obvious that I just don't believe how UNrealistic this episode was.
Vicequaizer
2006-11-17, 10:56
...Okay, I'm assuming that a lot of people haven't seen it with the subtitles, because a lot of the stuff that people are debating are answered if you knew what they were saying.
First of all, don't think that Naomi was just stupid and easily revealed her real name to Light, because it isn't like that.
People might have forgotten, but Light is one HECK of a genius, probably one of the smartest person in Japan...Naomi herself was very smart too, but in the end the smarter one one.
It wasn't that Naomi was dumb and Light got her easily.
As for the episode...man, I don't know what but Naoko Matsui totally got me.
I wasn't exactly a fan of Naomi in the manga, and probably disliked her in the movie...but in the anime, even knowing what is going to happen to her, I was praying for her to be fine.
Misa is going to have to do quite a lot win back her throne as my "personal favorite female Death Note character".
Vicequaizer
2006-11-17, 11:45
Second, didn't she think it was suspicious IN THE FIRST PLACE that this random guy wanted to talk to her OUTSIDE and then just whisk her away out of the NPA bldg. THEN he tries to convince her NOT to go inside the building again. IRL that would have been hella' suspicious.
Yet the biggest problem was the incompetance of the receptionists. If you go the police and tell them that you have information that could lead the arrest of ANY suspect, ESPECIALLY homicide, they would never ever let you go just like that. They have to treat those people just like suspects as well. IRL those guys would have been fired if they found out that they let go of a possible lead just like so.
Also, even if what Light said was true, all Naomi had to do was to go back to the US and get her own job back. She could've just contacted L that way. She didn't need the Japanese police if that was the case.
It wasn't a "random guy", but a guy who she was quite assured to be the son of the chief of Kira investigation group.
It isn't like he lured her outside, but was just taking a walk to kill some time so that when she returned, a member would've been back.
He also never tried to convince her NOT to go back there, but just told her that the investigation members won't be at NPA.
As for the receptionists...well, there is only so much they can do.
Someone tells them that s/he has info about a suspect, but the guys in charge are not responding to the call.
The receptionist offers to send a message to them, but she absolutely refuses, and only wants to tell it in person.
Receptionists aren't capable of forcing her to stay forever waiting for a member they aren't sure when they are coming back.
Lastly, returning to FBI wouldn't have necessarily helped the cause, as after the deaths I believe FBI told L that they won't be interfering with Kira anymore...so getting back her job wouldn't have done any good.
Also, no one except Watari knows how to contact L (atleast, I thought so), so she can't contact L herself no matter what.
Knowing for a fact that L is going to be sniffing around the Kanto area of Japan and the fact that the incident occurred in Japan as well makes it more efficient to attempt to contact L through the Japanese police.
Naomi is pretty isn't she? =D.
Anyway I like this episode. Really nicely pulled out.
The soundtrack is really good too, can't wait to hear the OST.
BTW, I don't get the significance of this, both in the manga when I read, and the anime..
Aizawa walking past...
Firstly when I read in the manga, I thought it could serve as some things against Light, but nothing surfaced.
Now in the anime, I kinda got more understanding of it...
Does it mean that due to the snow, Aizawa opened his umbrella and is unable to realise Light, and Naomi, are just right in front of him?
juri_miki
2006-11-17, 12:58
It wasn't a "random guy", but a guy who she was quite assured to be the son of the chief of Kira investigation group.
It isn't like he lured her outside, but was just taking a walk to kill some time so that when she returned, a member would've been back.
But knowing that KIRA was in that section of Japan and had a link to the police, EVERYONE is, automatically, considered a suspect. IRL, what Light had done, would have been hella' suspicous in itself. I'm surprised that Naomi didn't even think that he was trying to hit on her at first.
Also, even if he was the SON, she still didn't know that he was apart of the investigation. Even if she had retired from the FBI, it's only been 3 months. She should have known better than to tell all that to some random stranger, especially when any of those random strangers could have been Kira.
He also never tried to convince her NOT to go back there, but just told her that the investigation members won't be at NPA.
Umm...yes he did. He asked why is she going back to there even after he told her that she would have had no luck. Not only that, but he was, obviously stalling. The closer she got to the building, the more he was shooting off at the mouth until he finally revealed at the end that he was apart of the investigation. Any REAL investigator would have taken her upstairs. She should've known that much. She should've especially realized that when Light didn't even recognize the receptionist at the front.
As for the receptionists...well, there is only so much they can do.
Someone tells them that s/he has info about a suspect, but the guys in charge are not responding to the call.
Unless it's different in Japan, normally witnesses are considered suspects, well where I live they are. Even if no one from that department is not there, then I'm sure they're not the only people working in that building. Someone else from a different department would've brought her upstairs. There is someone working above Yagami, and even though most of the investigators have quit the investigation, there's still no way that someone would have let a potential witness/suspect just walk out of the building like so. At least they would've pressed for her information and/or had her wait somewhere else.
Lastly, returning to FBI wouldn't have necessarily helped the cause, as after the deaths I believe FBI told L that they won't be interfering with Kira anymore...so getting back her job wouldn't have done any good.
Also, no one except Watari knows how to contact L (atleast, I thought so), so she can't contact L herself no matter what.
Maybe she couldn't, but if she went back to the FBI, she would have had more resources at her disposal then she does as someone who isn't working for them. She may not be able to contact L, directly, but she would've had a better chance of contacting Watari considering that she HAD worked with L before. If she had given Watari that info, at least, I know that there's a way to get in contact with him, then she would've definitely gotten to L. Or, going back to the FBI, she could've told them what she had learned and had info that would've helped to catch the person who killed all 12 of those agents, plus their superior.
Knowing for a fact that L is going to be sniffing around the Kanto area of Japan and the fact that the incident occurred in Japan as well makes it more efficient to attempt to contact L through the Japanese police.
But being with the FBI, her getting in contact with them then, would have probably been a little bit more successful.
kauldron26
2006-11-17, 13:43
wow... wow... wow... wow... not since monster have i ever been in such suspense
EragonJeriel
2006-11-17, 14:18
He shoulda say keep quiet and i ll let u go..... she was hot too
FlareKnight
2006-11-17, 14:19
Wow I can't remember a show where I've wanted a character (Light) to get killed off this badly. Which would be hard since he's the main character. But seriously the guy is about as twisted and disturbing as you can get. I really don't think this is about justice anymore, more like being about covering his tail and having fun killing people.
The first time he thought she had given her name he was completely interested in seeing how she'd die. The guy just gets kicks out of killing people, he's way worst than any of the criminals that are in jail or dead now. He's just out to kill people for fun and become some sort of god. Going on to tell her who he was, is going overboard. He didn't need to do that for any justice reason, he just got a thrill out of seeing the horror in her eyes. It's just too depressing to see nice people getting killed off just so this guy can get a thrill.
IMSabbel
2006-11-17, 14:42
I think its funny how the kira fanboys (=fascists) find new ways to accept their führers behaviour.
Now that he does a crime almost to cruel to comprehend (compulse somebody to commit sucide without leaving tracks), they start spouting that she was some kind of undermensch not worth living. Maybe a jew, too?
Mindsets are so alike.
Wow this episode was great, suspense of this series is killin me.
I don't understand why people are saying Naomi is a bad FBI agent. She was the first person to realize that the busjacking had to do with Kira, not even L realized that (probably never even considered the fact). Not even Ray was smart enough to realize that. As someone mentioned before, Light totally played her and was smooth about it. He is the son of the police chief, helped solve numerous cases before, was even able to pull off saying he was part of the investigation. She wasn't stupid, she was very cautious in the beginning (fake name). Light made gaining her trust w/o looking suspicious easy. Only Light could of done this.
I will say, however that the snow falling at the end was such HUGE luck on Light's part, it's not even funny. If the investigator noticed Light talking to Naomi, and she was found dead, it would of been a red flag, especially if he is on the FBI investigation list. Although that isn't 100% sure, since he did write that she would never be found, so if she was never found it wouldn't have mattered much.
And yeah it was depressing to see such nice people getting killed off, especially since her fiancee is gone. :( However, anime speaking, if she wasn't killed, the series would end much quicker. I myself am rooting for Light, as the bad guy never wins in any anime, and would be an interesting twist. Can't wait to see how it plays out. Episode 8 please!
I still don't really understand why Light told her to kill herself in a way that wouldn't be found. It would have made more sense for him to write that she committed suicide and left a note detailing how depressed she was. That way even if someone remembered him talking to her, it wouldn't be suspicious. Naomi has family here. It's hard for me to imagine that they would just accept their daughter's disappearance.
Angel407
2006-11-17, 15:11
Light definitely has gone a bit crazy on power, and like someone before said he's got God Complex, I can understand him killing off criminals even if I don't support it, and as someone said from a logical point of view it's not completely wrong.
However I still feel really bad for Naomi, poor women didn't deserve to die. But now that he's gone this far if she lives then ultimately he will be executed.
I thought it was quite good, how he managed to come up with a way to convince her to give her name to him, given the circumstances. And even if it's slightly unrealistic her trusting him so blinding, he was still a very good liar.
Mashimaro
2006-11-17, 15:28
I still don't really understand why Light told her to kill herself in a way that wouldn't be found. It would have made more sense for him to write that she committed suicide and left a note detailing how depressed she was. That way even if someone remembered him talking to her, it wouldn't be suspicious. Naomi has family here. It's hard for me to imagine that they would just accept their daughter's disappearance.
I think L would've caught onto that. Now L knows that Kira can control the actions of the people before death and doing something like writing a suicide letter is a tad strange. Especially since Naomi use to work under L as a FBI agent
Oh and that last part about the family. We'll have to wait abit longer to see if they actually report the daughter missing.
The moment the music stopped and everything got silent <3 Kiras glare = Win
But L doesn't know that Kira can kill people in ways other than a heart attack, so at this point he has no cause to be suspicious of Naomi dying.
It's more suspicious if someone notes the fact that Naomi had information to give to the police, and the last person she was seen talking to was Light. But if her suicide is obvious and Light mentions that she talked to him, but says she wouldn't tell him what she wanted to tell the task force, then almost all suspicion is diverted.
EragonJeriel
2006-11-17, 15:41
Its cool
Finally i got this to work xD, well kira would die anyway
Type it like Spoiler text.. You may really want to re-read the rules on the first post of this topic, at http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=738342&postcount=1 . Just in case you weren't aware, what occurs in the episode that the episode topic is for and all previous episode doesn't need to be put into spoilers, for instance.
The public doesn't know information such as that Kira kills people by obtaining information from the media, and that he needs either a name or face to kill, just that criminals die of heart attacks. So, neither does Naomi.
Just out of habit, she provided a fake name; it's reasonable for her to do so, since that way if someone found out that she was asking questions they couldn't trace those question back to her. However, I suspect that halfway into the conversation she already wished she had spoken her real name since as she became more comfortable around Light she probably came to realize that he wasn't just some stranger, but someone with whom she would do well to establish mutual trust. And whether or not Light seemed trustworty is entirely subjective, by the way, especially since his smallest actions take on a whole new meaning if you see him speaking to Naomi knowing he's Kira.
I have yet to watch this episode because for some reason no one on the hub has it yet and the server I torrent from is down, but I very much look forward to watching it. It seems to be really riling people up.
juri_miki
2006-11-17, 17:29
Wow I can't remember a show where I've wanted a character (Light) to get killed off this badly. Which would be hard since he's the main character. But seriously the guy is about as twisted and disturbing as you can get. I really don't think this is about justice anymore, more like being about covering his tail and having fun killing people.
I couldn't agree more. I commend you for seeing through Light's facade of 'justice.' He killed about 15 innocent people in the last 3 episodes not including all countless innocent people in jail. Light's a monster and while it was hella' entertaining to see him outsmart Naomi he's still an evil bastard.
Light being a 'evil bastard' is what makes the guy so amazingly to see in action. L might just be as smart - but nothing can beat watching Light in action. He was in full-swing for episode 07.
Deathkillz
2006-11-17, 18:21
But L doesn't know that Kira can kill people in ways other than a heart attack, so at this point he has no cause to be suspicious of Naomi dying.
It's more suspicious if someone notes the fact that Naomi had information to give to the police, and the last person she was seen talking to was Light. But if her suicide is obvious and Light mentions that she talked to him, but says she wouldn't tell him what she wanted to tell the task force, then almost all suspicion is diverted.
L isnt dumb...im sure he will find the connection to firstly ray's death and now the death of his fiancee naomi...
coincidences dont happen the often and having worked with naomi, L should have already known that she isnt the type to give up...let alone do something a irrational as commiting suicide...
and its the fact that the last person seen with her was light which makes him suspicious...hes going to get his hands full trying to figure a way out of this if L catches on...
This seires just keeps getting better, when Light kept going and going trying to get her name, i was like shut it, keep your mouth shut woman, but alas Light was to good, to think that Ray and Naomi were both killed in a flawless fashion, the moment when Ray looked through the train doors, and the moment when Naomi had 5 seconds to think about her mistake, Light has turned evil, killing anybody who gets in his way, innocent or not he shows no mercy, but its an art to see him in action.
michaelman90
2006-11-17, 18:55
I don't know why everyone is complaining that either Light did something wrong or Naomi was stupid to give him her identity. Remember that in the beginning she WAS cautious and didn't give him her real name. The only reason she gave Light her real name was because he had been chipping away at her suspicion the whole time he was with her and in the end, given the circumstances, I'm sure almost everyone here would have done the same thing as she did. Also, telling her to commit suicide where it won't be noticed for a long time is a lot better than doing it conspicuously. With L as your adversary, leaving the body around to be noticed would be foolish.
On a side note, I'm making Light's face when he told her that he was Kira my avy. Just can't get over it.."Kore wa desu ne...Kira dakara."
Light was obviously the villian of the story when he killed the fake L.
Making a utopia is just a "reason". What he's really all about is smiting those who dare challenge God.
1. "Killin' criminals, killin' criminals...everybody's talking about me bwuhahaha!"
2. "You want to catch me, L?!?! DIE!!!! A FAKE !%$!$! DARE YOU DEFY GOD I KILL KILL KILL YOU!!!"
3. "FBI agent FLLOWING ME A GOD?!?! FEEL TERROR AND DIE LIKE AN ANT!!!"
4. "Sorry, woman you know too much bwuhahaha...FAKE NAME?!?! GRRRR!!!! GOT YOU GOT YOU GOT YOU WHO'S THE BOSS, WHO IS THE GOD!!! ME!!!! NO GO DIE!!"
juri_miki
2006-11-17, 19:52
I don't know why everyone is complaining that either Light did something wrong or Naomi was stupid to give him her identity.
Well everyone is probably ragging on Naomi is because she should have known better as someone who worked in the FBI and had only been away from the force for like...how long? Three months was it?
My thing wasn't even just that she gave him her name, it's the fact that she let him on all that information in the first place. That was a lot she let a civilian on. This was way before he even lied to her. I think that she should've known better, but I guess not since she had the biggest idiot in the world for a fiance.
Finally saw this. This has to be 10x better than I believed it could be.
First, in how they showed Light's face. They really did capture the deceptive side of him well. In the previous episode he didn't come off very believable to me, but in this one, he really did. My only dislike was that Ryuk laughed way too much.
Excellent animation. The scene in the snow was brilliant. The soundlessness of that moment, and the beautiful animation. "I'm Kira."... I'd believed that line, as I'd read people report it, would be melodramatic, but it wasn't. It was perfect. It captured that terrible truth perfectly.
I hadn't felt much empathy for Naomi before this, since we barely know her, but as I saw this scene, I surprised myself in that regard. At first I interpreted that Aizawa passing by them was just indicating the irony of the situation, that there were so many close calls, but as I watched it, it seemed to me to just emphasize how abandoned and without hope Naomi was.
Yes, when they draw it out like that, no wonder everyone hates Light. Well, I suppose he is a bastard, to deceive someone who is only his enemy under certain circumstances in order to kill them and then gloat about it.
My thing wasn't even just that she gave him her name, it's the fact that she let him on all that information in the first place. That was a lot she let a civilian on. This was way before he even lied to her. I think that she should've known better, but I guess not since she had the biggest idiot in the world for a fiance.
That's a good point. Why would she even talk about that information with someone she doesn't know, even if it is the Chief's son. That makes me think everything happened even more conveniently and renders the storyline a bit unlikely.
Sorrow-K
2006-11-17, 20:58
That's a good point. Why would she even talk about that information with someone she doesn't know, even if it is the Chief's son. That makes me think everything happened even more conveniently and renders the storyline a bit unlikely.Well, Light has been a bit conveniently lucky on more than a few occassions, but I suppose his luck adds another (if unbelievable) element to his character and his role as a god-like figure.
But, I disagree with those that say that Light had no reason to kill Ray Penbar and the other FBI agents. His reason was simple: he wanted to get closer to L. It's pretty obvious that Light is a sociopath and he's willing to use people's lives as pawns in his game against L (L also being someone who's willing to throw away people's lives to find Kira, eg Lind L Tailor, ep 2). I wouldn't say he's justified in doing it, but he has reasoned it out and it isn't just an act of revenge for inconveniencing him. Killing Naomi was a necessary move for Light, though. And the tension and suspence that they managed to generate in this episode was incredible.
Personally I'm of the opinion that Light's greatest motive at the moment isn't his ideal criminal-free utopia or even to kill those who oppose him: it's to beat L. I think that's what drives him more than anything else to do what he's done in most recent eps (ie, FBI agents, Naomi, etc etc).
A point about Naomi's gullibility. Firstly, we watch the episode with the benefit of hindsight. Thus we already know that Light is Kira, and is actively plotting to kill her as soon as he knows she has a lead. Naomi has no idea that Light is Kira, as she just sees a high school student, a son of the police chief. There's no special reason for suspecting Light is Kira as she does not know that Light was on that bus where the busjacking occurred.
You know, Naomi is still behaving rationally in the episode. The reason that she was a trained FBI agent is being used by some posters to rationalise why she shouldnt have given away her name to strangers so freely, but that is faulty logic.
1) Naomi is sad at Ray's death, but not paranoid. Why should Naomi go around giving fake names to random 'normal' people they meet?
2) Naomi has no idea Kira kills with a name and face; L hasn't told the world yet.
I would also agree with some posters with their post-modern definition of good and evil. Good and evil, are basically stereotypes that we accept and live by. So when measuring life by the yardstick of rationality and biological impulses (to do what that makes us feels good, considering both short and long term consequences), it is hard to argue that Kira is the incarnation of absolute evil or "Hitler" reincarnated, when you compare it to L's actions.
1) Light will kill people who get into the way of his plan to remake the world. (FBI, Ray, Naomi, L, criminals)
2) L has no qualms about sacrificing people too. (Lind L. Taylor, and if you argue that Lind's already on death row, then just what exactly makes L better than Light? That L is a selective killer? In that case, L is just what Light was on episode 1.)
3)The "Light's father's police squad" is clearly the most ethical group here, but they're forced to break rules too. (Working outside laws and regulations with L, what they did in episode 7, etc.) If they don't break these rules, they'll be unable to achieve their ethical goal of stopping Kira.
Therefore the common strand: Rules and regulations are being broken by all 3 parties to achieve their goals. Would Light's father (most moral in the story, as said by author) sacrifice an innocent to catch Kira, if the consequence of not doing so was that Kira would never be caught? We don't know, and we won't know. Just because he hasn't had to make the choice doesn't mean that he will make the ethical choice.
L and Light has had to make such a decision already, and we all knew what they chose, which was to further their progress in reaching their respective goals. (Yes, Light is a few steps ahead of L in terms of a lack of morality.)
Great episode! It sure was a close call for Light, I didnt think Naomi would fall for Lights tricks. I understand why Ruyko follows him around, Light is evil awesomeness :D
Spastic_Hobo
2006-11-17, 21:40
HAHAHAHA this episode reminded me why I used to like the manga. I seriously got chills down my spine when
Light looked Naomi in the eyes and said "Because I'm Kira"
He shoulda say keep quiet and i ll let u go..... she was hot too
Well he always could add one more line before the suicide parts to his deathnote. "Suddenly she felt horny and she dragged kira all the way to a secluded area and she gave kira the best time of his life." :heh:
Spastic_Hobo
2006-11-17, 22:02
Well he always could add one more line before the suicide parts to his deathnote. "Suddenly she felt horny and she dragged kira all the way to a secluded area and she gave kira the best time of his life." :heh:
Light's too much of a pimp with the younger girls now to be chasing after older women. He can have any girl he wants, why would he settle for the depressed old lady :P
L and Light has had to make such a decision already, and we all knew what they chose, which was to further their progress in reaching their respective goals.
It's not that black and white. L has already said he's not willing to allow innocent people to die. If L was as sociopathic as Light (or close to as sociopathic) as some people say then he would have done a media blackout to put pressure on Kira, damn the consequences to innocent people. Yes, he allowed Lind to die, but the circumstances behind it are murkier than Light's killings. We don't know if Lind was informed of the danger or not; L doesn't have a Death Note, he can't control other people's actions.
I know L is not a saint, but he's certainly more than a few steps up from Light. (I don't want to get into spoilers.)
juri_miki
2006-11-17, 22:48
A point about Naomi's gullibility. Firstly, we watch the episode with the benefit of hindsight. Thus we already know that Light is Kira, and is actively plotting to kill her as soon as he knows she has a lead. Naomi has no idea that Light is Kira, as she just sees a high school student, a son of the police chief. There's no special reason for suspecting Light is Kira as she does not know that Light was on that bus where the busjacking occurred.
You know, Naomi is still behaving rationally in the episode. The reason that she was a trained FBI agent is being used by some posters to rationalise why she shouldnt have given away her name to strangers so freely, but that is faulty logic.
Even if she had give out her name to this 'random' person, the point is that she gave away TOO much of what she knew. How many detectives do you know would just walk to random strangers and just blurt out vital information to a huge case? Only her, because she's an idiot and probably why she doesn't work for the FBI anymore.
Secondly, even if she just saw a normal high school student did she not forget the profile that L put out in the beginning?
Kira is supposed to be:
- a student
- living in the Kantou region of Japan
- has an inside leak within the NPA, which is why she went with Raye there, because he was investigating them in the first place
This is general information, seeming how L announced to everyone and their mamas and I'm sure that information got around internationally as well. She must've known considering that's WHY she was in Japan in first place with Raye.
So, even if we knew that he was Kira or not, the point is that she was not supposed to be giving out that information anyways. As a detective, or a FBI agent, former at that, she is to already assume that everyone is a suspect. Son of the police chief of the NPA or not. She might've been consumed with grief, but she still should've known better than to have told him all that information. She did not know Light from a can of paint and should've refrained from letting out all that information, even before he lied to her and told her that he was apart of the investigation.
Darklightz
2006-11-18, 00:24
You gotta give Naomi more credit than that.She did give a false name at first,but Light worked her real good.He knew she was still on raw emotion for losing Raye and when he handed her a chance for revenge by joining the investigation,he pretty much had her in his pocket.
Also it was interesting to see Aizawa walking by.Had the timing been off by just a few seconds he might have caught Light admitting he's Kira.
What made it for me though was Ryuk's maniacal laughter.He must be having the time of his life!I would like to follow Light around like that too!
Lollerpants
2006-11-18, 00:36
I thought the whole Ryuk laughter thing sorta ruined it since originally Ryuk said he was impartial and what not to the game between Light and L; which was obviously not as unbiased as it seems.
But I'd wonder what'd happen if Ryuk just never informed Light of anything or gave away anything that obvious.
Oh well. Good ep, I like the small-twist from Manga (at least I think they made changes right?)
Sorrow-K
2006-11-18, 06:59
I thought the whole Ryuk laughter thing sorta ruined it since originally Ryuk said he was impartial and what not to the game between Light and L; which was obviously not as unbiased as it seems.Ryuk's goal in all of this is to have fun. I find the best way to analyze DN's characters are by what their respective goals are. Ryuk is out of break the monotony of his shinigami lifestyle and if he finds something humourous, he's going to laugh, regardless of bias or the situation of Light and L's chess game.
Even if she had give out her name to this 'random' person, the point is that she gave away TOO much of what she knew. How many detectives do you know would just walk to random strangers and just blurt out vital information to a huge case? Only her, because she's an idiot and probably why she doesn't work for the FBI anymore.
Secondly, even if she just saw a normal high school student did she not forget the profile that L put out in the beginning?
Kira is supposed to be:
- a student
- living in the Kantou region of Japan
- has an inside leak within the NPA, which is why she went with Raye there, because he was investigating them in the first place
This is general information, seeming how L announced to everyone and their mamas and I'm sure that information got around internationally as well. She must've known considering that's WHY she was in Japan in first place with Raye.
So, even if we knew that he was Kira or not, the point is that she was not supposed to be giving out that information anyways. As a detective, or a FBI agent, former at that, she is to already assume that everyone is a suspect. Son of the police chief of the NPA or not. She might've been consumed with grief, but she still should've known better than to have told him all that information. She did not know Light from a can of paint and should've refrained from letting out all that information, even before he lied to her and told her that he was apart of the investigation.
L didn't put those 3 deductions out to the general public. It was only known within the Japanese police (never mentioned if the FBI agents knew).
So if you subtract that out from your analysis, Naomi has little reason not to tell Light her hypothesis, especially if he's capable of passing on the message to the police since she can't seem to find them in the building.
Secondly, Naomi was only harbouring a hypothesis, a theory. Quite different from being absolutely sure that Kira was the person on the bus that Ray talked to. Since she's an FBI agent and not a member of the general public, her training at crime solving (assuming she was a member of an investigation squad instead of something like, translations department) would have trained her to make deductions and follow up onto them, but not to jump at the first plausible idea and conclude that it's the absolute truth. Thus this helps to explain her normal behaviour at meeting strangers like Light instead of running around paranoid thinking that every person that talks to her is Kira. Now that'll be weird.
Although it would make sense for the viewer if Naomi was absolutely sure that the guy on the bus Ray talked to was Kira, it would be bad storytelling since Naomi was just simply making a good guess (that happened to be accurate). FBI or ex-FBI agents don't bust down people without concrete evidence, right?
I don't think Naomi knew why Ray was posted to Japan until the scene after the busjacking with Naomi and Ray in the hotel room. Naomi made a guess that Ray was in Japan for Kira investigations, and Ray acknowledged it without telling her anything more. I'm quite sure Ray told her not to interfere with the investigations since they were getting married and Naomi quit the FBI already. If that's Ray's attitude towards Naomi then, why would they suddenly discuss off-screen what happened on the bus in depth?
chiimack
2006-11-18, 10:27
At first, I couldn't understand the significance of the police officer walking by with an umbrella when it snowed but reading some of the comments, it was just a matter of timing only? Sure, he was sooo close to hearing Light confess but even when you walk by people, you still hear what they are talking about. Surely he would have heard the name Kira or L or some other word to trigger the fact that some strangers are talking about the case. If something piques your curiousity, don't you slow down and try to eavesdrop to find out what they might know? I'm thinking that even though he didn't, perhaps it has registered in his subconcious that they were talking. I wonder if he knows Light is the captains son too or even if someone in the princinct will mention to his father that he had dropped by to see him but left with a girl. I can't wait til the next ep. He is so deliciously evil and conniving.
I had forgotten that there was info not made public and known only to the group dealing with the kira case so Naomis actions do indeed make sense. I, too, had a beef regarding her discussing so freely any hypothesis she had regarding Kira to Light the way she was but thanks to someone mentioning that she would have had no idea that they were supposedly dealing with a kid, her actions do make sense now.
One thing i can fault this episode for:
Between the time he told her he was Kira and when he was overtaken by the Death Note. That single expression was not enough. I wanted to see tears and a dialogue between them. I wanted her to express her hatred for him and i wanted him to explain to her why he is doing all of this. I wanted to see some exchange of words.
Second she was acting completely rational. ALL of that info, before he told her he was part of the investigation, was justified because he was the son of the cop who headed the whole thing. Do NOT forget to add the fact she was under emotional-pain. She is just human and emotions get to you. Women are also as well more emotional than men AND she still has attachment to her FBI life.
I STILL WANTED TO SEE SOME TALKING BETWEEN THE TWO DAMN IT RIGHT AFTER HE TOLD HER HE WAS KIRA.
Also to the person who said he wouldn't go after her and that he could have any highschool girl he wanted... umm not to sound weird and believe me this will, but based on how other girls (we have seen pretty much one) look in that particular anime world i can surely say she was smoking hot.
Nice body.
Nice hair.
Good mind.
Pretty face.
Sexy eyes
When you add all of that up you get a grade A quality woman. Plus she is more mature, but she still is quite young. What is she? In her 30's? There isn't much of a difference in a womans body in her 20s and 30s if she hasn't had a kid and i don't think she has had one.
Darashinai
2006-11-18, 11:24
I think I'm the only one bored with Kira (and his oh-so-unlikely luck). It really just doesn't make any sense. With all this talk about how this story emphasizes how life's so unfair, how is it that the anti-hero has a pretty damn fair life? :uhoh:
Also, I'm pretty sure the "good and evil - it's all relative" argument is crap. People have a choice to do as they please as it is in reality. There are no Death Notes to control them. To say "the end justifies the means" even if the end means slavery seems a bit...dumb. At least to people who treasure freedom.
And I am kinda confouned as to why Naomi's in the op sequence if she's dead in 7 eps. It's 30+ eps, so I guess that means we get a new opening sequence some time soon.
hitokirigirl
2006-11-18, 12:13
Glad to see Raito sweating it...
Really, this is the first time he "seriously" deals with a threat, aka Naomi.
He somehow managed to get her trust, undoubtly Raito should start an actor carrier, he's so bluffing.
But seeing him all panicking was damn funny.
Now we can say with no doubt he's a genius, an evil one.
And it's like he's going to crush all the headquarter web : that guy with umbrella should normally be the next one, and so on.
Am I wrong, or is it the first time Raito comes up with the suicide menu ? I don't like it, because commiting suicide is still oneself decision : Death Note acting on it, rather on physical and/or external matters (heart attack, illness, traffic accident, etc), seriously annoys me.
Besides, I want to see Raito getting his balls...sorry I mean
the devil red eyes. Ryuk got me here, I really thought Raito would accept :heh:
Deathkillz
2006-11-18, 12:22
Light's too much of a pimp with the younger girls now to be chasing after older women. He can have any girl he wants, why would he settle for the depressed old lady :P
you should be shot for that :mad: firstly Naomi isnt depressed...she was out for revenge! its anger *roar*
secondly Naomi isnt an old lady...she is hot and very smart to boot ^_^
actually anyone here thinks that light is gay? :p
juri_miki
2006-11-18, 12:33
L didn't put those 3 deductions out to the general public. It was only known within the Japanese police (never mentioned if the FBI agents knew).
Yes he did. Rewatch episode 2/3. L clearly announced it on LIVE TV.
So if you subtract that out from your analysis, Naomi has little reason not to tell Light her hypothesis, especially if he's capable of passing on the message to the police since she can't seem to find them in the building.
Let's say that L hadn't of said anything about Kira, why is she telling this complete stranger all of this? No detective goes out there and tells random people about cases. Being a former FBI agent, she should KNOW this.
Secondly, Naomi was only harbouring a hypothesis, a theory. Quite different from being absolutely sure that Kira was the person on the bus that Ray talked to. Since she's an FBI agent and not a member of the general public, her training at crime solving (assuming she was a member of an investigation squad instead of something like, translations department) would have trained her to make deductions and follow up onto them, but not to jump at the first plausible idea and conclude that it's the absolute truth. Thus this helps to explain her normal behaviour at meeting strangers like Light instead of running around paranoid thinking that every person that talks to her is Kira. Now that'll be weird.
That I agree, but she was sure enough to go and find the police chief to talk to. There were other people, CLOSER, to her that she could've talked to. Her family or even her coworkers from her old job, but no, she decides that she would tell this random stranger instead instead of just waiting at the station for the police to return. Personally, for someone who had worked at the FBI, she was still way to trusting. I mean, why give out a FAKE name, only let out all that REAL information out? Doesn't that contradict each other? True, she may have though it was just a theory, but she was sure of it enough to head her ass to the station to report it.
Although it would make sense for the viewer if Naomi was absolutely sure that the guy on the bus Ray talked to was Kira, it would be bad storytelling since Naomi was just simply making a good guess (that happened to be accurate). FBI or ex-FBI agents don't bust down people without concrete evidence, right?
This has nothing to do with the fact that she knew that he was Kira or not. It's the fact that she's got a big mouth.
I don't think Naomi knew why Ray was posted to Japan until the scene after the busjacking with Naomi and Ray in the hotel room. Naomi made a guess that Ray was in Japan for Kira investigations, and Ray acknowledged it without telling her anything more. I'm quite sure Ray told her not to interfere with the investigations since they were getting married and Naomi quit the FBI already. If that's Ray's attitude towards Naomi then, why would they suddenly discuss off-screen what happened on the bus in depth?
She knew that they were in Japan to investigating possible Kira suspects. She didn't JUST guess that in the hotel room. She KNEW that. She also knew that he had been investigating someone for a while and that's why she said that it was suspicious that the incident happened when he was on the bus. So she's aware that Raye had been investigating a person. She didn't who exactly, but she was aware that Raye was.
The point is that while she was suspicious enough to give him a fake name, she wasn't wise enough to hold back REAL information. This is where she made her mistake AS A DETECTIVE. Whether or not this was theory she was holding, she was sure enough to head down to HQ to report it.
All in all, Naomi wasn't a very good FBI agent and neither was Raye.
lol the olgic ppl use here is totaly... stupid to put it at best
Let's see now:
He sweet talks her
She just lost her love
He is the son of the guy heading the police department
She has been offered a way to talk to the investigation squad
Light totaly presents to her in a logical way that she is right and that he trusts her
Then he TELLS her he is part of the team and offers a logical explanation for it
Then he sweet talks her more and shows her she can trust him
She gets the same feeling off of him that she gets off of L (they are both geniouses)
BAM she gets owned. As simple as that. Still if she had kids with Light they would be the worl's most evil/sexy looking ppl.
hitokirigirl
2006-11-18, 13:14
you should be shot for that :mad: firstly Naomi isnt depressed...she was out for revenge! its anger *roar*
secondly Naomi isnt an old lady...she is hot and very smart to boot ^_^
actually anyone here thinks that light is gay? :p
Hum, no, to a certain extent. And that impression might come from the countless Light x L doujinshi flourishing everywhere :D
guiltygearxt
2006-11-18, 13:46
lol the olgic ppl use here is totaly... stupid to put it at best
Let's see now:
He sweet talks her
She just lost her love
He is the son of the guy heading the police department
She has been offered a way to talk to the investigation squad
Light totaly presents to her in a logical way that she is right and that he trusts her
Then he TELLS her he is part of the team and offers a logical explanation for it
Then he sweet talks her more and shows her she can trust him
She gets the same feeling off of him that she gets off of L (they are both geniouses)
BAM she gets owned. As simple as that. Still if she had kids with Light they would be the worl's most evil/sexy looking ppl.
yes and + shes a WOMAN
how many women out there would go w/ their feelings or so called woman's intuition?? PLENTY, PPL, PLENTY!! AND SHES 1 OF THEM!! Which is why she trusted Light and gave him her identity
just like Ptolemi said, get over w/ it, almost all the anime out there have loop holes so stop being picky, there is NO PERFECT anime
hitokirigirl
2006-11-18, 13:57
yes and + shes a WOMAN
how many women out there would go w/ their feelings or so called woman's intuition?? PLENTY, PPL, PLENTY!! AND SHES 1 OF THEM!! Which is why she trusted Light and gave him her identity
just like Ptolemi said, get over w/ it, almost all the anime out there have loop holes so stop being picky, there is NO PERFECT anime
I don't think she trusted Raito out of his feminine intuition, but rather, as she said, he reminds her of L.
Raito is really emitting a (un)comforting aura pulling people to him. Ray penbar, who was a (skillful, I hope) FBI agent, trusted him too. And he was not a woman, if I'm correct.
Besides, she could have trusted him from the beginning when he told her he was the Police chief son, and given him her true name...
My only beef with the episode is ... did Light really have to gloat at the very end? His ego was really taking over there when he revealed that he was Kira. Even though he was pretty sure he got her real name this time, that was really risky.
The thing is the death only takes place in the way determined if it is realistically possible for the person to do so. People can't write facts they don't know and wont (without a reason) act massively different than they normally would. She was DETERMINED to help the comission find kira, or do so herself, a suicide at that moment in time was absoloutly out of question. The only way to truly make sure she was broken enough that her mind would really wander and continue to wander that way was to truly destroy her.. revealing to her that she just gave her name to kira herself would do that. The reason for the suicide in her mind now, aside from rays death, which was more of a force to move on and set things right.. would actually be the certainty that she failed because she IS now humiliated, broken and in the knowledge that if she isnt going to die right away, she is entirely at kiras mercy.. so she would rather finish what she wants to do(which wont interfere with his plans) and then die by her own hand. Her reasoning for the hiding of her body may be so kira cannot send a message through her after her(or with her death) or so she cannot be used by him before his death. All this of course unknowing that she is doing exactly what he wishes for her to do.
In intense episode all round, yes not to much plot or action but the tension is immense and so much is reavealed on both sides, yet again. I feel so sorry for naomi, for one second i thought that snowflake may be a tear but then i remembered that this IS kira, allothough maybe some part somewhere inside of light there may be a small chance that he felt something.. somehow in the tragedy around those two, just like he revealed to Ray penbar in the end that he is kira, for no real reason.
;743884']just like he revealed to Ray penbar in the end that he is kira, for no real reason.
In a way - its just like him saying "i've beaten you". L does mention that Light hates to lose.. and that shows it.
A lot of the time, i sometimes think that Light might just feel wrong about what he's doing - but then i look at his smile, and that idea goes away.
EragonJeriel
2006-11-18, 14:51
Light's too much of a pimp with the younger girls now to be chasing after older women. He can have any girl he wants, why would he settle for the depressed old lady :P
Exactly! He wants a change ya see :D he gets young girls 2 easily
By the way it was pretty scary when the face of noami changed, it shocked me more than any horrow show
Deathkillz
2006-11-18, 15:02
In a way - its just like him saying "i've beaten you". L does mention that Light hates to lose.. and that shows it.
A lot of the time, i sometimes think that Light might just feel wrong about what he's doing - but then i look at his smile, and that idea goes away.
or in other words hes "rubbing salt onto the wound" or hes "having the last laugh"...however you put it it shows that he is and imature brat (only smarter) that loves to tease his victims :heh:
;743884']The thing is the death only takes place in the way determined if it is realistically possible for the person to do so. People can't write facts they don't know and wont (without a reason) act massively different than they normally would. She was DETERMINED to help the comission find kira, or do so herself, a suicide at that moment in time was absoloutly out of question. The only way to truly make sure she was broken enough that her mind would really wander and continue to wander that way was to truly destroy her.. revealing to her that she just gave her name to kira herself would do that.
Light didn't feel the need to provide the source of her suicidal depression the first time he tried to kill nor, nor did he have any trouble with the random criminals he tested. Ray's death would have been sufficient for the Death Note. However, I agree that, with Light's declaration, that became the cause of her suicide instead.
What I'm saying is that it was completely unnecessary and very risky (if she somehow had another layer to her secrecy, or if Ryuk had been laughing about some other things as well), declaring his identity like that. It was mainly done, not out of cold calculation, but self-satisfaction, ego and cruelty.
Admittedly, the overwhelming sense of relief that he managed to defeat and outwit this very dangerous woman and the surging sense of triumph that came with it probably made him savour this moment in a much more unseemingly way than if the situation had been any less tense. Although this is perhaps too light of an analogy, it's like winning a sports match. If it were an easy victory, you'd probably shake hands in a dignified manner, say "Good game" and go your separate ways. However, if it were a rough, bitterly-fought game in which you only barely eked out a victory, your first reaction might be to yell/scream, pump your fists in the air, race madly around the court/field and drink in the adulation of your fans without any care for how depressed your opponent would be.
And although I complained in my first post about how lucky Light was with the snow, I think in the end, the police officer himself was a device to enhance the tension of the episode, and the snowfall merely the way to resolve it.
Damn this episode was good, show just keeps getting better and better each episode. I just love how dark this episode was and even though i kinda i feel bad that Naomi died, i kept thinking about how Light was going to kill her and was like oh snap pwned when he did haha.
If the anime follows the manga, this is prbably the high point, and from here on out it will start getting borning/stupid.
Pakxenon
2006-11-18, 16:23
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j148/audione/kiradesu.jpg
8/10. I loved Light's sweet talks and outright lies, but I couldn't stand for two things: the outright lies (extremely hard to watch) and Naomi's unbelievable/unreasonable actions. I couldn't believe that an EX-FBI AGENT could fall for such a trap. Aside from my own opinions/this community's giant debates, this is an excellent showcase of Light's inner evil.
juri_miki, in episodes 2 and 3, all that's announced is that Kira is in Kanto. That he's suspected to be a student was only communicated to the NPA by L in conference. Light finds out it by hacking into his dad's computer. Check out episode 3, it's from 07:35-08:05 in TW's sub. That he was suspected to have access to the NPA's information was only deduced by L (because he was able to anticipate how Kira thinks, as Kira knew he would), and was never realized by the NPA: see episode 3, 09:55-10:45. (I'm not citing this in an attempt to prove that it wasn't unreasonable for Naomi to be tricked, but just so you're aware of who knows what. It only gets more complex from here. x.x)
I think it was reasonable for Naomi to be tricked.
She did better than Ray, and they both did better than Lind L Taylor. :)
If Naomi had known about the profile L had on Kira, THEN it would be very unreasonable for her to be tricked.
I still can't believe people are going on with their stupid comments on how it was impossible for her to get tricked.
Plus i didn't like the LENGHT of her realization that he was Kira. I wanted her to shed a few tears and exchange a few words with him before she was taken over by the Death Note. Her expression didn't stay on the screen for long enough.
Plus i didn't like the LENGHT of her realization that he was Kira. I wanted her to shed a few tears and exchange a few words with him before she was taken over by the Death Note. Her expression didn't stay on the screen for long enough.
Hmm, it might be more satisfying for you, but I think it would reduce the overall impact of the scene. The intense emotions conveyed by her long, stunned, and absolutely terrified silence would have been ruined if she simply accepted that terrible declaration like it was a comment about the weather and had the composure to carry on a rational conversation.
I still can't believe people are going on with their stupid comments on how it was impossible for her to get tricked.
I agree. Which is precisely the reason why she wasn't a FBI agent anymore because she's too stupid.
She actually gave a piece important information to someone she doesn't even know. She told him her deductions and everything else. It is sure disturbing to find FBI agents spilling everything to a random stranger. It seems to me that the only thing she learn is to hide her identity and do deductions.
I would say she deserved to die because she made Light want to kill her by not shutting her mouth.
Sinestra
2006-11-19, 00:35
Another kick ass episode everyone has already touched on the important part so there is no need to repeat them. But i will say this i kept a small space open for Light to have some redemption at least in my mind after this episode its gone.
Everyone keeps saying hes doing this for a better world well if i had to live in a world created by Light i would rather die. His ego and sick pleasuer in killing an innocent women made me angry more than sad. He already took something precious from her now he takes something else. I am convienced more than ever that he enjoys killing people no matter who they are. I dont know how it ended in the manga but if i had my way Lights death would go on for monthes slowly and very agonizing a quick death is no suitable for him. At least if what Ryuk said is true when he does die he better not be looking foward to the after life after what hes done
Edgewalker
2006-11-19, 00:59
Thats just the thing though, light wasnt a random stranger. Its revealed to Naomi that he's the son of one of the high ranking police officers involved and that hes helped with cases before in the police station.
Edge don't froget to factor in that she is under emotional stress, she was given a glimpse of hope to releave her anger, he reminded her of L, he totaly and completely logically let her know that he can't possibly be Kira. That adds up to a "yeah i can trust him"
Now the coincidence that he out of millions was Kira was so damn low that just luck isn't with her.
Also to the other guy who said her expression should not have been longer. I think if it stayed on a few seconds longer, she shed a tear, and said "I despise you with all of my being" and he said " Tell your fiance hi for me." NOW THAT would have been hardcore.
BrokenWingz
2006-11-19, 01:42
I am disappointed in the fact she gaver her name like that. She is a super-cop in the sense that she understood all of what happened. I can't believe she made is as easy as that.
episode rating- 10
I wouldn't call it easy, he gave her "hope" and when hope is given out it is also usually reached for :p, kinda like those i'll make you millionaires' kinda scam, people think it's true and get scammed.
Guys ... mark your manga spoilers!
chikkychappy
2006-11-19, 03:38
^No. There isn't supposed to be ANY manga spoiler.
U<3Anime
2006-11-19, 04:03
You could say its not fair, but then again - everyone who has died up until now including the FBI agents was not fair... its not just with Death Note, the world we live in isn't a fair place. I agree what you're saying really - also on the fact that the ending to the episode did have one hell of an emotional impact that's very rare to see these days.
Get used to it, there will be few more deaths up ahead. <edit by Mod (xris) possible manga spoiler removed>
Reminder
Thread Guidelines
Keep spoilers from the Manga out of the anime thread.
You may not even post manga spoilers in spoiler tags!
If you need to in reply to someone with a reference to the Manga, either PM them or post in the Manga thread. Please be considerate of anime only watchers, too many manga spoilers are being posted, so please, no more!
Try to keep the discussion on topic and future episode spoilers out of the thread whenever possible.
Kinny Riddle
2006-11-19, 06:28
Normally one wouldn't find an episode where most of the time is spent on just two people talking to each other exciting, but Madhouse handled it superbly.
There goes Naomi. Light shows his awesome evilness once again. He may be an evil bastard, but at least he's our evil bastard. While Naomi's tragic road to her death is to be lamented, in a perverse way, the audience is actually enjoying rooting for Light just as much as they're rooting for L.
Normally one wouldn't find an episode where most of the time is spent on just two people talking to each other exciting, but Madhouse handled it superbly.
They sure did, i thought it was was exiting the hole chat since it could take any turns.
Light is still too much of a smooth Criminal. I can't remember the last time I enjoyed rooting for the bad guy. Light strait mind raped her then tossed her away. This guy is just too briliant. Even Ryuk could hold hold back on how hard Light played her like nintendo.
There goes Naomi. Light shows his awesome evilness once again. He may be an evil bastard, but at least he's our evil bastard.
No, no, he's allll yours. <spoiler> and <spoiler> are the only bastards I need from this series. :p
Kisuke06
2006-11-19, 14:48
This episode was very good. As Kinny Riddle said, Madhouse did a great job with this episode, basicaly the whole ep was about 2 people talking, but it was just awesome. I felt so nervous when that guy from the Task Force was getting closer to Light and the girl(I forgot her name). Light is a lucky bastard. =P
And Ryuuku's laugh is very annoying. =P
This episode deserves a 10. Just perfect, IMO.
I honestly think that was the best 20 minutes of anime I have ever watched in my entire life...
(Blame it on the spliff? I don't care!) What I just watched was so awesome my jaw literally dropped.
Just out of curiosity, compared to the manga, how was this episode? I know as well as the next person how an anime can be lacking compared to its manga counterpart and sometimes I can even tell how an episode would have been better in the manga and that is what often spurs me to search it out. But with this example I couldn't help but think, "wow, this looks like it has been brought to life perfectly, if not more so…"
I know I'm sounding weird here as I have not read the manga but I'm sure some of you out there understand what I am trying to convey.
I also feel that if there is any negativity at all from manga followers that it can only be that you felt it was rushed?
Note: I Have NEVER Read the Manga!
Honestly, I disliked how Naomi was portrayed with little common sense on giving away her identity or not becoming wary of Light's nervous quirks when she sighted them.
I also disliked Light's sexist comment regarding his sticky situation that he was so sure to find out Naomi's real name under the alias, because she's just a woman.
Please!
First of all, someone like Naomi, who was a former member of the FBI and with a prodigious analytical mind, will inspect carefully and realize with discretion every tiny detail and quirk regarding to any people that suddenly approaches her in a gentle manner and tells her the elaborate story about the L investigation team, like Light did.
Naomi had plenty of chances to suspect Light, but the writers had her to either dismiss them or overlooked them. The most obvious was when she casually turn her eyes to look at Light watching his watch the first time; that moment and quirk should just had to ring any bells on her that something was cooking up.
Light may be a genius and smooth-talker, but Naomi in no way with a former career in the FBI would have fallen for that embellishing story-tale given the obvious fact that Light told her he's a HIGH-SCHOOL student employed for the case.
Please, do a top and confidential investigation team would use a teen or kid to help on a delicate, dangerous case of Kira's?
Hell, no! That was more than a second point for Naomi to immediately suspect Light but didn't.
The only reason I can think of that Naomi bought Light's tale was because the post-effects of her depression over Ray's death were still lingering on her, which was something that Light used on his advantage to literally disenmasquerade her.
Naomi's a late-20's/early-30's woman not a mid-teenager girl who would become smitten by the smooth talks of a gentle stranger; more reason to turn suspicious without becoming paranoid.
I greatly believe this reason was the DEUS-EX-MACHINA that allowed Light to pull out from danger of being found out.
On another note, the climax was just as dense and foggy for Light struggling for a way-out not to look suspicious or unnatural to give himself away. I truly loved the tension all the way until Naomi was finally convinced to give her name.
The OMEN soundtrack song heightened the climax, but kudos go to Ryuk's laughter that sent shivers all the way down my spine.
And what we have for the L's investigation team....
I can't believe it. The awesome gizmos and gadgets with the transmitters hidden inside the buckle belts.
L is Batman, and Watari is Alfred!!!:eyespin: :eyespin:
LonelyMachines
2006-11-19, 20:28
I haven't read the Manga, so I could be off-base on this, but this one felt like a real turning point. He's not just killing "evil" people anymore, but anyone who he deems a threat. We've come a long way from, "I am justice."
A guy this smart should have been able to misdirect Ray and Naomi. Heck, he could have just laid low for awhile, and that would have been enough. But no, he's got the taste of blood now...
I STILL WANTED TO SEE SOME TALKING BETWEEN THE TWO DAMN IT
Actually, I think the silence, followed by the walk to the gallows was tragic in and of itself. Anymore dialogue would have been repetitive. We're given a wonderful recognition shot (http://lonelymachines.org/deathnote/naomi2.gif), and the stillness of the animation is quite poignant. Still, between Naomi and Ray, I find myself disgusted with Light.
Of course, that only seems to make him more fascinating :)
I also disliked Light's sexist comment regarding his sticky situation that he was so sure to find out Naomi's real name under the alias, because she's just a woman.
He meant that he believed he could overpower her.
Little did he know she's a very skilled capoiera user, so that wouldn't have worked.
I do have confidence he would have been able to, in that critical moment--after he realizes she can beat him and she realizes that he is either Kira (if he asked her what her name was before he tried to attack her, that would have tipped her off to that) or a Kira sympathizer, but before she is able to subdue him--pull of the eyes deal and save himself, however. He would've just had to take a look at her face once, write her name and the word "now" while running away or whenever he has the chance, and then control someone else so that he would act to hide both their bodies, before anyone noticed (if he had tried to attack her in the first place, I'm sure he would have taken the conflict somewhere they wouldn't be noticed, in the first place).
But since he was able to find another way to kill her, he didn't have to sacrifice half his lifespan; very fortunate for him.
LonelyMachines, nice avatar; that's a perfect moment to display, though it's too bad those snowflakes couldn't appear seamless.
I am really happy the anime interpretation. I like the director's use of colors. Like when Light goes into "kira-mode" and the visual effect is for his hair and eyes to turn red.
I also like the liberties they have taken to add things to produce a more pronounced effect. Like Ryuk laughing his ass off or Naomi walking up the stairs at the end. The best instance by far though is showing Naomi's face after the Death Note takes effect. That combined with that evil, smug look on Light's face.... it's just too powerful. Awesome stuff.
indicatoto101
2006-11-20, 01:23
This episode should remove any doubts that Light may be working for justice, that he's killed people to build a "better" world. That the means justify the ends. Well, he's only a sociopath who has better means to kill people than serial killers that use guns or knifes because he can remain anonymous.
Naomi, so pretty, yet oh so stupid. To think that she knew how her fiancee died, by revealing his name, and yet she does the same and ends up getting killed by the same method her fiancee did. Those two were a match made in heaven. Is the author trying to say that FBI agents are a bunch of dumbasses. I think so. I just don't think Light is that smart anymore, his subjects are just incredibly stupid at times.
s[H]sIkuA
2006-11-20, 02:14
True, for someone who u have just knew and talked for about 10 minutes or so, revealing her name is plain ... stupid, even though she knew Kira can't kill people if they don't know their name.
Zanzamar
2006-11-20, 10:41
Greetings all.
I've been a lurker for this forum for a long long time but this is my first (or perhaps second) post.
Did anyone else noticed that when kira looked at his watch the first time (using the name Maki) it was 1.25, and the time he looked at this watch again (using her real name) it was still 1.25?
This is a great series and overall a great ep, but that is a rather careless animation mistake.
I just got into the series recently. What a great anime!
I'm rather surprised by the Naomi discussion. According to quite a few people, the writer screwed up or made her really stupid. I disagree. I think people need to re-examine the facts she has to work with and eliminate their own biases.
1. Naomi doesn't know that Kira needs a name (and face). She could have seen the broadcast by L but all that tells her is that Kira can kill out of nowhere.
- Why would she deduce the name being a necessary component?
- L didn't even find out about the name thing until it was found that criminals that had their name incorrectly reported, survived (so a group of 6 robbers get targeted, 1 lives cause media screwed up name)
2. Ray made sure that Naomi gave up her life as an agent. She knows nothing about the case. You should not assume the information available to the investigators is known to her. This is faulty logic.
3. She knows Light is the police chief's son and has also worked on other police cases from a trustworthy 3rd party (the police receptionists).
4. She knows that Light can get her into contact with the police chief.
5. She is in revenge mode after her loss and is more inclined to suggestions that will further her goals.
6. Light reminds her of L (women's intuition or whatever). And she's right! They are remarkably similar in terms of their reasoning capabilities.
7. Her mental profile of Kira is probably different from L's and probably much less specific. L only came up with his profile because Light responded to L's prodding by killing only Japanese criminals and writing a secret message to L. This taunting gave L a personality profile. None of this is public information. Try to look at Light without seeing the psychopath. He's a bright high school student that's an aspiring detective.
In short, there is no reason for Naomi to suspect Light of anything. He's the closest she can get to the investigation at that point in time. He also seems to be a bit of a boy genius (to be trusted in 2 other police cases). Why would she close off on him, risk alienation on her one (albeit weak) contact to the investigation team, and go off on her own?
The FBI alternative proposed is unrealistic. The Kira investigation is in Japan. Why would Naomi go to the U.S. to rejoin the FBI (which I wouldn't think is a fast process, can anyone just join up after quitting?), have them put her on a team, and then go back to Japan without first doing all she can to get out what she knows? The fastest way to help her cause is through the investigation team already in place (and on location). Light is her only point of contact and in fact he offered to let her talk to his father.
The only reason Naomi gave a fake name in the first place is because of a reflexive instinct from being an agent. She is a civilian right now so there is no reason to continue hiding her identity especially since she's basically applying for a job right there in the street and Light is an impromptu interviewer. Why would Kira even be aware of her? That's what she's thinking much like most informants in criminal cases.
Light is playing on Naomi's need to be instrumental towards avenging Ray's death. He stroked her ego perfectly by complimenting her theory. He acts very serious about pursuing this angle and offers her a way to help, directly. Then he masterfully pulls back by saying she has her own life and should go back to the U.S. soon. Why would she distrust what he has to say?
1. Light is recognized on sight by the receptionists.
2. He was instrumental in 2 previous police cases
3. He is the son of the police chief
4. He is recognized as being very bright by Naomi (compared him to L)
5. He claims to be on the investigation team
- if this is a lie, it would be very easily found out... Naomi just doesn't know she's about to be killed soon (so she won't be finding out)... think about it... wouldn't you take this claim at face value coming from the chief's son?
6. The claim confirms Naomi's idea that Light is similar to L. L must have approved of Light in order for #5 to be true, so L respects Light's abilities in Naomi's mind.
7. He says Naomi can talk to his father as soon as it's possible
indicatoto101
2006-11-20, 15:34
I just got into the series recently. What a great anime!
I'm rather surprised by the Naomi discussion. According to quite a few people, the writer screwed up or made her really stupid. I disagree. I think people need to re-examine the facts she has to work with and eliminate their own biases.
1. Naomi doesn't know that Kira needs a name (and face). She could have seen the broadcast by L but all that tells her is that Kira can kill out of nowhere.
- Why would she deduce the name being a necessary component?
- L didn't even find out about the name thing until it was found that criminals that had their name incorrectly reported, survived (so a group of 6 robbers get targeted, 1 lives cause media screwed up name)
While I do agree with some of the points, I still think the writers screwed up when they basically forced Naomi to give her name for the sake of the story. During their conversation (where she did 95% of the talking), she had a theory that Ray met Kira on the bus AND that Ray gave Kira HIS NAME, which gave Kira a mechanism in which to kill. She then concludes (if I remember correctly:eyespin: ) that Ray is responsble for the deaths of 11 other FBI agents because he let the person he met on the bus, Kira, know his identity (or something like that, my memory is really murky).
Basically, she knows or at least has some indications that Ray died because he disclosed some rather imporant info such as his name and that he was an FBI agent. Naomi, knowing this, goes and blabs to a total stranger AND she tells him her name. How many of us meet a total stranger and in practically a minute, spills everything. The writers made her very smart by deducing blah blah blah, but when faced with Kira, she's suddenly stuipd. How could she have lost so many brain cells in a matter of minutes. It mus be a plot device where everyone must die by the hands of the villain and only the protaganist can save the day.
While I do agree with some of the points, I still think the writers screwed up when they basically forced Naomi to give her name for the sake of the story. During their conversation (where she did 95% of the talking), she had a theory that Ray met Kira on the bus AND that Ray gave Kira HIS NAME, which gave Kira a mechanism in which to kill. She then concludes (if I remember correctly:eyespin: ) that Ray is responsble for the deaths of 11 other FBI agents because he let the person he met on the bus, Kira, know his identity (or something like that, my memory is really murky).
Basically, she knows or at least has some indications that Ray died because he disclosed some rather imporant info such as his name and that he was an FBI agent. Naomi, knowing this, goes and blabs to a total stranger AND she tells him her name. How many of us meet a total stranger and in practically a minute, spills everything. The writers made her very smart by deducing blah blah blah, but when faced with Kira, she's suddenly stuipd. How could she have lost so many brain cells in a matter of minutes. It mus be a plot device where everyone must die by the hands of the villain and only the protaganist can save the day.
Oh, I see where you're coming from. I was rather confused about people's interpretations of that scene. I re-watched it just to make sure I didn't miss anything myself because I was pretty sure she didn't mention anything about Kira needing a name.
Watching it again, I still have to say she doesn't know anything about names. Her theory is that Kira found out someone was tailing him. Kira wanted to know who he was and who he works for. Kira used Ray to find out what other agents are after him. She probably thinks Kira can kill Ray at any time. Kira just kept Ray alive long enough to deal with the FBI.
I don't think she can decisively conclude anything about needing a name. In her situation, I would assume that Kira can kill on sight and would be able to kill Ray at any point in time, even before the bus-jacking. He didn't because he needed information from Ray. A name isn't just for killing you know. That's a Death Note specific idea. I would want to see someone's ID so that I can research them.
Naomi and Light met at the police station. Light overhears that she is an informant. In Naomi's mind, if Light is Kira, she should have been dead not long after they left the station. In fact, Light jokes: "You're going to have to trust that neither I nor my father are Kira if I let you talk to him about the case. Hahahah"
Light is a total stranger. Chief Yagami is a total stranger. Yet, Naomi is ready to blab to the Chief and none of us would call her stupid for doing so. There's mitigating circumstances here and I think those opposed to Naomi "blabbing" are over-downplaying the factors in play.
Light is Chief Yagami's son. Light worked for the police in the past. Light is recognized on sight by police receptionists. Naomi has been denied direct contact with the investigation team. Light has direct contact with the Chief who's a part of that team.
That's not all. Light reveals to Naomi that he's been investigating Kira as well. In fact, HE's the one who first presents the theory that Kira can control people's actions before they die. She immediately agrees and starts talking about her ideas. He starts "blabbing" first. It's a calculated blab to get her to share her own theories. She feels safer about doing that at this point. Plus, she probably thinks it's best that anyone investigating Kira should know her important info. This info will pass on to the Chief eventually. She would still like to blab in person, but this acts as a release for her and she feels that she's finally doing something of worth, sharing her knowledge.
I really think people's knowledge about Light needing a name is clouding their perception of the situation. I assert that Naomi knows nothing about Kira needing names at all.
White Manju Bun
2006-11-20, 17:29
While I do agree with some of the points, I still think the writers screwed up when they basically forced Naomi to give her name for the sake of the story. During their conversation (where she did 95% of the talking), she had a theory that Ray met Kira on the bus AND that Ray gave Kira HIS NAME, which gave Kira a mechanism in which to kill. She then concludes (if I remember correctly ) that Ray is responsble for the deaths of 11 other FBI agents because he let the person he met on the bus, Kira, know his identity (or something like that, my memory is really murky).
Basically, she knows or at least has some indications that Ray died because he disclosed some rather imporant info such as his name and that he was an FBI agent. Naomi, knowing this, goes and blabs to a total stranger AND she tells him her name. How many of us meet a total stranger and in practically a minute, spills everything. The writers made her very smart by deducing blah blah blah, but when faced with Kira, she's suddenly stuipd. How could she have lost so many brain cells in a matter of minutes. It mus be a plot device where everyone must die by the hands of the villain and only the protaganist can save the day.
The writers didnt screw anything up, its the way its done in the manga as well. So it wasnt for sake of story it was correctly following the manga.
Obviously Naomi giving out her name wasnt the best idea but see where she is coming from. Her fiance is dead and she wants to get Kira. Now she's been approach by someone who is telling her (even tho he's lying) that there is a chance she can join the task-force to catch Kira. If she wants to be true to Ray then obviously she's gonna do it. Sadly she gave her name and id to the wrong person but its easy to see why she did it finally at the end. She wanted to catch Kira, too bad he caught her first.
Rheinhard
2006-11-21, 14:00
Light is still too much of a smooth Criminal. I can't remember the last time I enjoyed rooting for the bad guy. Light strait mind raped her then tossed her away. This guy is just too briliant. Even Ryuk could hold hold back on how hard Light played her like nintendo.
A question for the various people on the forum that have made remarks like this:
Would you still be supportive of Light if her weren't so hot and smexy?
If he were, say, a balding overweight otaku doing exactly the same things, would you still feel the same way?
A question for the various people on the forum that have made remarks like this:
Would you still be supportive of Light if her weren't so hot and smexy?
If he were, say, a balding overweight otaku doing exactly the same things, would you still feel the same way?
No, probably not. :D
A lot of you are saying "Hey he isn't just killing bad people anymore." I don't really think he cares about that as much anymore. I think this is more like game for him now. A game between him and L with whoever kills who first wins, and he doesn't care anymore how he wins as long as he wins. Like L said Light is childish and never wants to lose. Light will do anything to win because if he does win that means he is the best and smartest, and only "God" can be the best. Well that is what I think anyways great eps I love rooting for evil main characters.
And, you gotta admit...he is slick.
He may well be the smartest character in the series. And if he is not the smartest, than he is definitly the second smartest.
A question for the various people on the forum that have made remarks like this:
Would you still be supportive of Light if her weren't so hot and smexy?
If he were, say, a balding overweight otaku doing exactly the same things, would you still feel the same way?
Before it's too late to state this for the record (I would have posted this earlier if my mouse hadn't broke), this query is fallacious/unfair since it's implied that these two questions are the same but rephrased (or at least, people will see it that way) when they're really two different questions. I would ajust for second question to "If he were, say, an ordinary character in an anime", because otherwise people will read it and think, "Oh, that's true, if he were ugly I'd probably have a bad opinion of him". People may be biased against repulsatory characters just as they're biased toward hot ones, so somewhere in between should be what's focused on. Anyway, that's my few cents.
Shabazza
2006-11-23, 01:04
amazing episode.
I stopped breathing at the time the police officer walked by.
Ok..... let's get a few things straight
1. I loved this episode, masterful
2. Naomi gave Light "i know it's you" looks, if you payed close attention to her facial expression, but he didn't give away anything too suspicious; example: HE ASKED HER FOR THE BUS INCIDENT DATE AND INFO........even though at the end she should've suspected that he should've known this BECAUSE HE WAS PART OF THE "TEAM"
3. When he came into Headquarters, HE WAS CONTRAGULATED FOR HELPING SOLVE PREVIOUS CASES by both guys at the front desk and NAOMI WAS THERE
4. TOO MANY LITTLE DETAILS THAT GAVE AWAY EVERYTHING
5. Good/Evil..... I won't even comment on this, ALL that posted on this topic should already know the concept.... yes that means you are NOT stupid
6. As stated earlier THERE IS NO PERFECT ANIME/MANGA.......... we are all human after all
Misutaki
2006-11-23, 09:26
I loved this episode - they did the "whole episode of nothing but talking" extremely well...and when Naomi went off to die, it made me so sad *_* Tragicness.
And now is the point when everyone can say that Light isn't 100% "good natured"...personally I thought once he killed the fake L in one of the other episodes on TV, that he was done being the good guy. But...power ruins the best of minds...
Still, I can't wait for the next episode...I would watch it raw but my Japanese isn't 100% yet, although at this point I know the conversations...hmm...
But yeah, I am overall very pleased with the makers of this anime - they're doing a good job of keeping it close to the manga, and can pull off the endless talking well.
I don't see why you all are saying how he tricked Naomi isn't possible. He used her emotions to his advantage. You got to remember she was very emotional at this time her fiance just died and here comes a kid you is agreeing with everything she is saying, and then offers her to join the Team. Now, even if he was lying you got to remember if it is true this might be her only chance. With all her emotions flowing and then getting the only chance she will every have to join the team. The hope of it being true and the chance to get revenge was just overwhelming, and I assume most of you have experiences when your emotions have taken the better of you.
Cai Calamigarde
2006-11-23, 15:05
and she thought that Light was L... Taking any measures fore for their separate ultimate goals... Scary people both are...
hitokirigirl
2006-11-24, 13:46
A question for the various people on the forum that have made remarks like this:
Would you still be supportive of Light if her weren't so hot and smexy?
If he were, say, a balding overweight otaku doing exactly the same things, would you still feel the same way?
To tell you the truth, my fav character is Ryuk :heh: :heh: Seriously.
I think Raito is popular because he is such a badass jerk. And that kind of characters are trendy in animeverse, regardless of their physical appearance.
LOL Rheinhard. Regarding your question, I think I agree with myopius. I wouldn't like any of the characters I do if they were ugly. Would any of you like L if he was obese and bald man with diabetes? :p
Siegfried352
2006-11-30, 02:44
Killing the FBI agents was completely pointless -- he had a rational motive for killing Naomi, as she posed a real threat to him, but Ray was completely harmless and Light knew that Ray didn't suspect him. If he let Ray live all that would have happened is that Ray would have reported that Light wasn't suspicious and that would be that. But Light went out of his way and put himself in grave danger to just so that he could kill them, and boy was he mightly pleased with himself after the fact. He was just Evil Glee Boy when he wasted Naomi, no contrition, no conflicting emotions, he was so happy he could't help but mock her on her way to grave.
I think you fail to remember "L" is the BEST detective and would catch on if ONLY Ray Penbar was killed. He would've suspected Light off the back because Ray was following ONLY Light. Killing the other FBI Agents makes it possible that these other Agents could've came in contact with Kira. So thats why they haven't jumped to conclusions because they are not 100% sure.
TickTock
2006-12-01, 23:55
I think a lot of you guys need to get off your peddastools. Just as they said in the manga and the anime, on the surface we try to act just, but from the moment we see someone's face, we judge them. Truth be told, I have no problem with what Light is doing, and most likely, I would do much worse things than he. This anime is wonderfully twisted and tasty. I can't way to see where it goes.
FatPianoBoy
2006-12-02, 00:17
from the moment we see someone's face, we judge them.
While that may be true, people generally just judge whether or not they like the person, not whether or not they deserve to live.
Arkwright
2006-12-05, 03:31
LOL Rheinhard. Regarding your question, I think I agree with myopius. I wouldn't like any of the characters I do if they were ugly. Would any of you like L if he was obese and bald man with diabetes? :p
I would still like L. His character just intrigues me; physical appearance would not detract from my appreciation of his thinking process/actions. I'm not so sure about Light though.
One thing that got me thinking was Light's "lucky break" at the end of the episode where it starts snowing and Aizawa puts up his umbrella. I used to think of it as a pesky but needed plot contrivance, but after consideration I now think that this was actually most likely a tremendously bad break for Light.
I broke it down among possible scenarios, based on whether Light and Aizawa have ever met, and assuming they remember each other if they have met, considering that Aizawa has probably been trained as a detective in remembering names and faces, and Light can still check the police database for Aizawa's name (am I wrong on this?)
Also, I make some assumptions. If Aizawa sees the two, he either walks by, or stops to talk to them and notices Light's note. Unless he finds out that the name written there is Naomi's real name within the 40 seconds before the Death Note takes effect, he is likely to think Light is simply taking notes on a murder case or the like because he has no idea this is how Kira kills. After those 40 seconds, Naomi's instructions involve avoiding the police, so she wouldn't tell Aizawa anything after that time. So, onto the analysis.
If they never met: This is actually the worst case scenario for Light, but the least likely to be true because chances are they have met if Light visits the station often enough for the receptionist from a while ago to remember him. Aizawa sees Light and Naomi talking and either keeps walking or reads Light's note. If he reads light's note, he'd probably think Light was taking notes on a murder case or the like. He then moves on and does not reveal his real name to Light as he has just been instructed not to do so in his meeting with L. Aizawa suspects nothing yet, but when he later hears of Naomi going missing with the same cause of death that was written on the paper and sees Light brought in as a suspect, that's pretty much enough evidence to arrest him. On Light's end, he now has been witnessed committing murder, and Aizawa will never reveal his name to Light, especially since he knows Light is suspected, and the trick Light used on Naomi won't work on him as he actually is part of the task force. So, Light is forced to either make the eye trade and kill Aizawa, or let a witness go free who would eventually prove to provide the evidence necessary for arrest.
If they have met and Light remembers Aizawa but Aizawa doesn't remember Light: Light recognizes Aizawa and kills him in the same manner as Naomi, except without witnesses, after Aizawa leaves. Aizawa is dead and so can't provide the information to L's next-in-line that pointed the finger at Light later in the manga.
If they have met and Aizawa remembers Light but Light doesn't remember Aizawa: Aizawa greets Light, knowing him by name. Light figures that he must be from the police since he knows his name but Light doesn't know him, or finds it out from Aizawa directly, finds his name in the database and kills him in the same manner as Naomi. Aizawa is dead and so can't provide the information to L's next-in-line that pointed the finger at Light later in the manga.
Aizawa and Light know each other: Light recognizes Aizawa and kills him in the same manner as Naomi, except without witnesses. Aizawa is dead and so can't provide the information to L's next-in-line that pointed the finger at Light later in the manga.
So, 3 possibilites that were actually good for Light, and 1 unlikely possibility that would lead to Light needing to make the eye trade.
I am very late in this discussion but i just have to get this off my chest before continuing with this series.
The episode was mostly great but even after reading only several chapters of the manga I can't help but feel that as hyped as it is, the storyline of the manga falls short of what Madhouse have achieved, namely the amazing atmosphere of the anime. I think that's the reason I got bored by the manga quickly and yet I am enthralled by the anime. Too bad they didn't choose to make a 20th Century Boys anime but Death Note... The moment when the snow started falling was a moment of genius and beauty, even though I was screaming at the one who came up with the plotline of the manga at the very same moment.
And yes, Naomi's death totally felt like a plot device. As said, you cannot be both smart enough to figure so many things about Kira on your own and stupid enough to spill the beans to a total stranger. And I already hate Light with a passion, if anything can make me stop this series at some point it will be his god-complex and general annoyingness (is that a word?). :)
I've been lurking for a while, and finally I've decided to come out of my little corner and discuss this anime =P.
This episode was priceless. My favorite episode so far. The scene at the end was just flawless. When she handed over her drivers license to Kira, I almost thought something would go wrong. And when that police officer walked by..my heart skipped a beat. XD.
Also, that exprsesion on her face when he said "That's because...I'm Kira." was so sad.
I personally feel kind of sorry for Misora, but it's not really her fault for trusting Kira. She probably let her feelings overcome her senses and trusted him like that.
Also, that whole ep I was thinking of the shinigami eye deal. I really thought Kira was gonna make the deal =P.
just what is that song they played towards the end called anyway?
just what is that song they played towards the end called anyway?
Are you talking about the BGM that plays when Naomi walks away?
If so, its track 22 on the anime OST - titled Dirge.
I think this episode single handedly made me wanna keep wathcing the show.By far the best episode I've seen so far.
Does anyone know what's the name of theme playing right at the beginning of this episode?(after the opening of course)
I really like it.Is there any Death Note soundtrack yeat?Is that theme included?
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-02-12, 10:32
This is in fact the best episode. Seeing Light's true manipulation ability was awesome! He played it so well and was flawless. The ending was just as great, him saying " I am Kira," and seeing her face, be like 'owned' haha. Kira is god!
Dark Lord
2009-02-12, 13:48
This is in fact the best episode. Seeing Light's true manipulation ability was awesome! He played it so well and was flawless. The ending was just as great, him saying " I am Kira," and seeing her face, be like 'owned' haha. Kira is god!
The "I am Kira" part was the absolute best IMO! The episode kept you on the edge of your seat wondering how Light would pull it off especially when Naomi starts to walk away from him. Although Light is evil, I still noticed myself hoping he'd make it past this obstacle. That's probably because I wanted the series to continue, though. Naomi is such a smart person but when she heard she could get to L through Light she made the biggest mistake you could make.
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-02-12, 21:43
I agree, Light was quite "evil" in this episode. I do love when he said "I am Kira," it was such a dramatic slap in the face, seeing her face. But I did think it was reckless on his part, what if she created a fake ID as well, just incase. Maybe she passes that to him just until she knows nobody in the team is Kira, and him say that. Wow Light would have dropped and he wouldn't be able to use force because the detective walked by right when it happened. If only she was that smart ;) haha, also I thought it was cleaver of Light to use her ambition and vengeance's to her disadvantage, she got so caught up in joining the team she let down her guard, so well played!
Light, I have been following your posts very carefully.. you are a very intelligent person with deductive skills as to Light the character. Although, I will be the one to show your weakness and show your are not an elite as you portray yourself to be.
Be prepared, as I will refute your arguments with intentions; and you will not be able to fight back with your reason. Just for you can get a feel for what you are up against I will give your a piece of knowledge I have deducted watching you throughout the past few weeks. You stumbled upon this form not too long ago, although it seems you have watch this series a long time ago and just recently got back into it, possibly from a friend? I deduced this because on the same day you created this account you had someone else act as well.. a " Light-Yagami-Kira" Much like your username, and on the same day - too much of a coincidence for my likening. My first thought was that you and this other were of the same person, just two different accounts. But then it hit me that no, this is not the case, although both your reasoning skills are next to perfect, you both have very different methods - and points of reasoning. So I have deduced that you are much more than friends, more like brothers. You know each other very well, and have the same beliefs in Light. Although, Light number 1 in which I will call you - you my friend are more outspoken than the other. He, I noticed wrote a mighty good article back awhile, but deleted it for some reason - I question him on this. So, I issue to challenge you both :)Once of course I find out you both are together on this, then I am sure your respect will downfall fast on here, if you have gained any so far. Until then, enjoy. B
P.S I have to agree with your argument Light 1. I have nothing to come back with, this time. You are in fact correct.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-02-19, 23:00
Hmm.... odd. I suspected that Light1 and Light2 were the same person as well. And I thought the similarity in the names was a means to throw everybody off...
My question to you would be... How did you know that the article was good if it was written before you joined here? Even if you read it before you registered. Why would you wait until just now to come out and say something about it? Even after it was deleted.... Unless... you're telling us you joined here just for the sake of a debate with him... I find it a little odd for someone to take such interest in him...
At first I thought that even you would have been Light1 joining here to debate with himself for some odd reason, I don't know. Purposely leaving few flaws to continue the debate. Very few flaws.... very subtle as well. Your personality is different from that of his. He would never get so driven off of the main topic. Unless that's also a facade...
*sigh* Nevertheless, this is a thread for Death Note Episode 7, so I guess that it would be best to debate elsewhere.
Sinfully, I've been waiting for you to join in on this. As predicted you came out with what I was hoping you would: That is Light1 and Light2 being the same in one. I also was hoping you'd ask me this question in regards to suspicion; because the last thing I want is to be associated with an ego as of his. I have been of course checking up on this forum as of the last few weeks. Actually since Christmas, it was only recently that I was going to join this forum, until I noticed Light1. I then suggested on waiting just a little longer until I made my appearance, I am sure even you can see the logic behind this Sinful.
Your theory is correct that if I was Light1 I would in fact do as you said, and leave flaws in my arguments to be picked from. Nonetheless, Sinful, I ask you this, would work? It's taking a risk that someone else would find them flaws before I could reply to myself. If this is the case then I (Light 1) is so conceited that I don't think anyone can pick out my own flaws. Yet, of course you're right Light1, is very good at his reasoning and his arguments are very hard to find flaws in, in which is the reason I took so much interest in him because I am up for a challenge.
I am glad you deduced that our personalities are different, because I would almost have to be offended by a remark of such. Although, I guess some would look it as that's what he would say if he was trying to cover it up. Well I ask whoever if I was to play the role as both would I not facade away from this idea, to commit a red heron hoping people would be more interested in our argument.
I am sorry for being off topic I will go back on of course, it was just I had to say what needed to be said.
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-03-08, 16:52
Well I am glad you both have started a bond.. you both will be disappointed to know Light1 and Light2 are not the same person and I will not disclaim the fact we might no each other in person. Nonetheless, I accept your challenge B, to do whatever you want. You seem interesting but not in my league.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-03-09, 13:50
lol Light insulted you.[/immature]
This should be fun. *gets popcorn*
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-03-10, 19:53
Sinful, that was not immature at all, I just made an obvious statement. If B can't handle it or even reply *still waiting* then he should have never issued the challenge, but don't worry sweetie, I'll make sure you get your entertainment. "Smirks"
Sinfully Naomi
2009-03-10, 20:01
Awwww, and I was worried I wasn't your favorite anymore. :heh:
Light-Yagami-Kira
2009-06-07, 20:44
B, you obviously have no deductive skills or sense at all. First off, did you even compare Yamagi's writing style with mine? As a "Detective" I'm pretty sure that should have been the first thing you investigated. I wish I could say I'm impressed, but I would be lieing through my teeth. ;)
And secondly, you should have known better than to think one person acting as two people would use two forum names so closely associated with each other. *shakes his head disappointedly* Heh, I guess we can all be sure of one thing; and that is, if you were the one incharge of capturing Kira, he would be running circles around you.
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-06-07, 22:30
B, you obviously have no deductive skills or sense at all. First off, did you even compare Yamagi's writing style with mine? As a "Detective" I'm pretty sure that should have been the first thing you investigated. I wish I could say I'm impressed, but I would be lieing through my teeth. ;)
And secondly, you should have known better than to think one person acting as two people would use two forum names so closely associated with each other. *shakes his head disappointedly* Heh, I guess we can all be sure of one thing; and that is, if you were the one incharge of capturing Kira, he would be running circles around you.
Ah, the other Light Yagami. I believe your deductive reasoning is correct, unlike B's. It was a novice and bore conclusion. He will have to do better to become the top dog around here.
Nevflinn
2009-06-08, 07:57
D-did the two of you just come back, after a hiatus of several months, at the same time?
And post in the same thread with a small time gap between each other?
Complimenting each other with very similar behaviour to one another??
http://knowyourmeme.com/i/959/original/shock.png
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-06-08, 13:26
Hello Flinn, it's been awhile. Yes, because I, (not too sure about the other Light) but my job is to make you skeptical of this whole situation; that is my goal and it seems to be working well. On a lighter note, however, I love how your deductive reasoning, much like B's is so inconclusive and novice. Try and keep up with me tough guy... speaking clearly from Light1 because obviously it is evident that I am not Light2, and I will not speak for him.
Nevflinn
2009-06-08, 16:53
Hello Flinn, it's been awhile. Yes, because I, (not too sure about the other Light) but my job is to make you skeptical of this whole situation; that is my goal and it seems to be working well. On a lighter note, however, I love how your deductive reasoning, much like B's is so inconclusive and novice. Try and keep up with me tough guy... speaking clearly from Light1 because obviously it is evident that I am not Light2, and I will not speak for him.
What's with the trash-talk, Light? I thought we were friends. :(
So I'm not very good at making a point? If that's the case, then how come you didn't seem to have any rebuttal for our last argument, in the episode 37 thread? In a few more hours it'll have been precisely three months since I made that post; I thought it'd have been simple for someone as self-confident as you to continue on from.
Light-Yagami-Kira
2009-06-08, 17:10
Nev, it isn't very hard to unscramble a situation this seemingly coincidental.
Since Yamagi and I last posted here on the forums, there has been no activity at all.
I personally left the forums all this time, but that doesn't mean Yamagi wasn't avidly checking out the site on a daily bases. He simply noticed an updated post from me. A post that actually involved both him and I, seeing how B accused us both of being the same person. And then decided to comment.
It interests me how observant you are though.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-06-10, 00:17
Light1 left about a month an a half after you did Light2. He came on rarely.
Heheheheh, you'll all so entertaining keep it up now, keep it up. ^^
Also, notable differences. Light2 is slightly more harsh on words, or should I say, straightforward than Light1. Light1 has a slightly higher grammarical skill level than Light2(lol) Light1 doesn't seem to have fun, your posts are sooooooo boring sometimes. Light2 deletes a LOT of posts. Either he deletes them because he may have found a flaw in what he has said, or he deletes them because he doesn't want others to find flaws in what he has said. Ooooooooh, that's an interesting one. =D
Light-Yagami-Kira
2009-06-10, 11:50
Light1 left about a month an a half after you did Light2. He came on rarely.
Heheheheh, you'll all so entertaining keep it up now, keep it up. ^^
Also, notable differences. Light2 is slightly more harsh on words, or should I say, straightforward than Light1. Light1 has a slightly higher grammarical skill level than Light2(lol) Light1 doesn't seem to have fun, your posts are sooooooo boring sometimes. Light2 deletes a LOT of posts. Either he deletes them because he may have found a flaw in what he has said, or he deletes them because he doesn't want others to find flaws in what he has said. Ooooooooh, that's an interesting one. =D
Hi Naomi, I didn't appreciate any of that, but I did anticipate already that you would strike at me directly eventually, which is also why I never bothered argueing anything you said in the past. Having already read your movements like a book, I knew you would eventually find your way to me.
As for deleting any of my own posts. The reason has nothing to do with flaws in my arguement. That is why there is an "Edit" feature. Whenever I posted my message, it multiplied, so that there were three identical messages. I deleted two, kept one. I can't tell you how flattered I am that you would go out of your way to view every single one of my posts on the forums to compare, even the grammarical structure, with other people. You must seriously have no life at all!
And finally, as for me being noticed as the "harsher" one of the two. I could not agree with you more, and I'm sure anyone who reads my posts doesn't need you to bring up a fact that obvious. ;) I have always been a straightforward person who isn't afraid to speak his mind, especially when it concerns topics I know I have more intelligence in.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-06-10, 23:22
Well, it's not like it would be THAT hard to figure out seeing as there hasn't been any activity for about 3 months time...
No, I'm just a quick reader is all. Although I could get out more. ^^;; *gets sick fairly easily* So that's also a reason. but there were other times when there weren't duplicates that you deleted your posts.
Light-Yagami-Kira
2009-06-11, 10:22
Well, it's not like it would be THAT hard to figure out seeing as there hasn't been any activity for about 3 months time...
No, I'm just a quick reader is all. Although I could get out more. ^^;; *gets sick fairly easily* So that's also a reason. but there were other times when there weren't duplicates that you deleted your posts.
Hmm; right, I was saying Yamagi could have been viewing the forums as of recently, and from there, saw my updated post(s). He would have been "offline" at the time, so obviously no one would see that he was there. Just because he disappeared three or so months ago doesn't mean he wasn't there, it just means he wasn't online. That is what I'm saying. And I wasn't proving my intelligence based on that fact. I'm referring to my "harsh" bahaviour in general. I'm not always deliberately a straightforward person, but when I explain something, regarding a topic that I know and am interest in, I tend to stress the point without giving the reader any latitude to contradict anything I write. Which is why I don't ask questions in my arguements, like, "Shouldn't so and so have known about the . . . .?" - whatever. That only opens my arguements up to controversy, then it becomes circular, and the entire point vanishes. I avoid that by stessing my point(s) and being as straightforward as I possibly can about what I believe to be factual.
Naomi, I have no idea what you are talking about. I've posted no more than 11 times on the forums. (Including this one). Only two of my posts have been deleted. I spent a good hour looking through each of the forums on the main page, and I haven't found a single deleted post that I have deleted besides the two that I just explained about. Perhaps you are confusing me with somebody else on the forums who has a name in association with mine besides Yamagi. But whatever, believe what you want.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-06-12, 20:45
Eh, I said other times, I never said there were many other times. Also, I was refering to the activity of the topic, not Yagami.
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-06-12, 22:54
Light1 left about a month an a half after you did Light2. He came on rarely.
Heheheheh, you'll all so entertaining keep it up now, keep it up. ^^
Also, notable differences. Light2 is slightly more harsh on words, or should I say, straightforward than Light1. Light1 has a slightly higher grammarical skill level than Light2(lol) Light1 doesn't seem to have fun, your posts are sooooooo boring sometimes. Light2 deletes a LOT of posts. Either he deletes them because he may have found a flaw in what he has said, or he deletes them because he doesn't want others to find flaws in what he has said. Ooooooooh, that's an interesting one. =D
Uh huh, I guess I missed all the action... where to begin? Thanks for saying I am one of the entertaining ones?
Now, for the differences between Light1 (I) and Light2 (Light-Yagami-Kira). I also have to agree that Light2 is more harsh/blunt in his speech... although.... Sinful, I am very disappointed that you never mentioned or detected my hint of sarcasm, prestige and confidence behind my speech, compared to Light2. Now, for the grammar difference, I have no comment - "pleads the fifth," I am an English Major in University, I should have some minor skill in grammar, right? I am interested, however, that you brought that up, because I thought you would try comparing Light2 and I's difference in manipulation of words, huh, interesting. Now, I am curious of your logic behind me (Light1) not having any fun? Do you not think I am enjoying myself? What makes my posts "sooooo boring?" And finally about Light2 deleting his posts, meh, I have only seen a few deleted, without knowing the reason - I hardly think it is relevant to anything nonetheless. I do like your keen eye for detail, however, although I question your reasoning behind some.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-06-13, 06:39
There wasn't much action while you were gone anyway.
I never said anything, but I noticed it a "little later on" I should say. I guess that would be the best way to explain it. I good example are earlier posts in this topic I suppose.(Also, a lighter note, but I guess also an example was in the episode 37 disscussion) I was refering to earlier, and to be honest, not to sound full of myself or anything like that when you weren't dealing with me it seemed like that. Right now seems to be a bit.... extreme, though. I guess I could have brought up your manipulation of words, but like you, I, and even Light2 have agreed upon, he's very straightforward, so there isn't much manipulation to go on with him. As for you, I find you could simplyfy things at times. Not everything has to be explained into a thin fiber... of.... logic... Yagami.... stuffz.(Note the 'z' 8D) I got a sort of comical feel from when I read you post for some reason.[/not taking this nearly as seriously as I should, I suppose]
Then again I have been up all night.... again...
Light_Yamagi_Kira
2009-06-13, 18:09
After looking through some past posts and thinking about everything that has been said, as of late, I have some questions. First of all, Sinfully, I believe it is a fair statement to say that you agree that Light1 and Light2 are NOT the same person. After your compartment, I believe it is self-evident now. I agree that Light2 has a more straight-forward manner when in an argument than myself - we have two different ways of arguing, both successful. Now, on the grammar issue, thank you for the compliment, as I already stated I am an English Major, I enjoy English and always try to improve my grammar. However, I do not see your relevance behind this compartment, other than the fact that you were trying to get under Light2's skin. Which I believe you're now committing the Ad Homine fallacy -abusive, and irrational. I checked through Light2's big eleven posts and his grammar is pretty solid, minor mistakes, but everyone has them, so I am stumped by your intentions. Also, why am I not having fun again? Why am I such a bore? I know I'm much like Light Yamagi but how rude of you. ;)
Light-Yagami-Kira
2009-06-13, 19:51
I dun't undarstand wut tha issu is Nioma - - - - - - - - - - - my gramer skillz cul'd knot be enymoore perfict if I tride.
Sinfully Naomi
2009-06-13, 23:46
I gave up that notion a long time ago. What made me believe you weren't the same person even more is the fact that Light2 apparently know me from the past.
eyem sowwi in insalt yer grammur, Nayomee ish berry meen.(Either you tell me who you are because I forgot you, or I'll... die or something from the waiting... because everyone on TTFF with the exception of a few people all talked like that...)
How dare you figure out my intentions like that?! HOW DARE YOU, LIGHT?! :heh: I admit that is true. But it was more of a fun matter. I was implying that you seemed to be having fun, but this is more of an extreme level. I would even go so far as to say it's a little false.
vBulletin® v3.8.4, Copyright ©2000-2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.