View Full Version : Higurashi Rei - (afterthoughts on C71 fan disk)
So, for those who have played Rei (one way or the other), any afterthoughts on Saikoroshi-hen?
My take:
Though Hanyuu said that it was just a dream, I take it that the world Rika was in was definitely there. But even if it were Hanyuu playing a trick on Rika, it was indeed a pivotal one for Rika, on making her understand the importance of how one life is. Yet still, that IF possibility was very interesting!
So we're hopefully off to "Umineko no Naku Koroni" (temp title) for summer 2007 Comike. We shall see what Ryu-chan has in store for us.
So, for those who have played Rei (one way or the other), any afterthoughts on Saikoroshi-hen?
My take:
Though Hanyuu said that it was just a dream, I take it that the world Rika was in was definitely there. But even if it were Hanyuu playing a trick on Rika, it was indeed a pivotal one for Rika, on making her understand the importance of how one life is. Yet still, that IF possibility was very interesting!
So we're hopefully off to "Umineko no Naku Koroni" (temp title) for summer 2007 Comike. We shall see what Ryu-chan has in store for us.
I feel the same way.
Actually, that view is also expressed in the Otukaresama-kai. I also get the feeling that Hanyuu did that to teach Rika a lesson about life, that she shouldn't have taken things for granted.
It was quite intresting to see the real identity of Frederica finally revealed. Actually, in the beginning when Frederica started to "take over", I was afraid that the story would end as "It was all Rika's imagination. In the "real world"(the one she's in) she is not happy while everyone else is, thus she created all these worlds in her mind, where everyone else is miserable...which is the real truth about Rika respawning"...maybe it could've went in that direction, but I probably would've been really disappointed if that really happened.
It was also very intresting with the contrast of Reina vs Rena. In both worlds, they both had very good reasons as to why Rika should stay in their respective worlds. For the people who have finishing reading Saikoroshi-hen, which world would you perfer?
I feel the same way.
Actually, that view is also expressed in the Otukaresama-kai. I also get the feeling that Hanyuu did that to teach Rika a lesson about life, that she shouldn't have taken things for granted.
It was quite intresting to see the real identity of Frederica finally revealed. Actually, in the beginning when Frederica started to "take over", I was afraid that the story would end as "It was all Rika's imagination. In the "real world"(the one she's in) she is not happy while everyone else is, thus she created all these worlds in her mind, where everyone else is miserable...which is the real truth about Rika respawning"...maybe it could've went in that direction, but I probably would've been really disappointed if that really happened.
It was also very intresting with the contrast of Reina vs Rena. In both worlds, they both had very good reasons as to why Rika should stay in their respective worlds. For the people who have finishing reading Saikoroshi-hen, which world would you perfer?
What IF what you said was true?
Let's think it from the other way. What IF what you said was true? That the "perfect world" was indeed the real world, and because Rika was unhappy with the real world, this triggered her L5 syndrome (or just phycological sickness), so she created hanyuu to be her dearest family/friend and in the end, under the words of hanyuu, she killed her mother? Afterwards she tries to escape the reality by creating alternative worlds in her mind. This will be an intersting interpretation, although not much supporting facts for it.
But it's interesting to note that in that "perfect" world, nobody has their "original percieved sin" in game.
K1 never assult the girl
Mion never switch place with her sister and taken her position
Rena didn't perceived that she's the reason her parents divorced
Satoko never pushed down and killed her parents
Takano is a happy girl that is not even in the chapter (This world is actually a part of the hidden piece #52? Maybe....)
In the end it was the "sinless" Rika that committed Sin in this chapter. (And I can always argue Rika was having mental instability like K1 did in the first chapter)
She herself destroyed that world and made that world imperfect, just to be back to the old world....
Like the story says, if Rika choose to stay in the "perfect world", then the previous worlds are just a dream. If she choose the old world, then the "perfect world" is just a dream.
What world would you have choosen? For me I would have choosen the perfect world. I think the major reason would be i can't bring myself to commit that "sin"...
Well even if all the worlds are not Rika's imagination, all these are just 07-san's creative imagination lol.
Anyway Higurashi is an entertaining series, and glad this chapter maintain that entertainment :)
I might missed a critical point in Saikoroshi-hen or something, but...
The reason why Hanyuu can't enter the world is that Rika's mother is still alive (and she being the real reincarnation of oyashirosama), right? However, recall that Rika has claimed that "everytime when the world starts again, Hanyuu is always there to tell me about the world". That might work for all the worlds, but what about Himatsubushi-hen? That took place while dam war was still going on, and her parents were still alive...
:confused:
imac2much
2007-01-03, 23:37
I haven't read Saikoroshihen, but to answer your question:
TIPs indicate that Rika has been able to see Hanyuu ever since she was born, so it can't be that she can't coexist with the physical existence of Rika's mother.
I might missed a critical point in Saikoroshi-hen or something, but...
The reason why Hanyuu can't enter the world is that Rika's mother is still alive (and she being the real reincarnation of oyashirosama), right? However, recall that Rika has claimed that "everytime when the world starts again, Hanyuu is always there to tell me about the world". That might work for all the worlds, but what about Himatsubushi-hen? That took place while dam war was still going on, and her parents were still alive...
:confused:
The reason that Hanyuu gave that she couldn't come into the Saikoroshi-hen world was not because Rika's parents were alive, but it was because in that world, Rika's mother was the eighth decendant - not Rika.
The reason that Hanyuu gave that she couldn't come into the Saikoroshi-hen world was not because Rika's parents were alive, but it was because in that world, Rika's mother was the eighth decendant - not Rika.
I guess it's just that world only then. I guess I was just confused
Finally got a chance to work my way though this.
Once again, hats off to Ryukishi-san and his amazing writing skill. I was honestly expecting nothing more than a light-hearted epilogue-ish story, but what I got was a truly engaging story that had me on the edge of my seat the entire way. The fact game players like us have gotten to know the characters and the world so well really helped. Personally, I was able to dive into the story right away, feeling everything at full impact.
For a IF world, Saikoroshi-hen is probably the most revealing of all. I think everything pretty much already speaks for itself when we realize the fact that the reverse of everything we have come to know and love is actually a sinless world. Just like the puzzle game in Matsuribayashi suggested, many sins are required in order for Rika to live on with all of her friends. The Saikoroshi-hen world showed us just how "miserable" things would be if no one ever commited any sins, but lived on "happily" instead.
As for the story itself... I almost bawled together with Rika in the beginning. :(
But the delinquent dark Rika was a little moe. :heh:
A personal highlight was the portrayal of the mental confusion going on between her Bernkastel personality and her role as Furude Rika in the Saikoroshi-hen world. I really felt Rika's fear here about losing her own self.
Personally, I think the climax of the story was that last long conversation between Rika and Hanyuu before Rika made her decision. A lot of what was said there really reflected deeply on the morality of Rika's own journey.
The final scene with everyone around Rika's bed was quite nice as well. It reminded me of just how much I love everyone in Higurashi.
Hanyuu is simply stunning. I love characters that normally acts childish, but is still capable of becoming deadly serious and philosophical when needed. The gap really makes them lovable for me.
In the end, I think Hanyuu probably just wanted Rika to learn about the importance of her own choices, as well as her own life, probably as some kind of redemption. Whether or not the whole thing was just a dream, well, that's probably not important. After all, it's just like Rika said, she was practically sacrificing the lives of many people, including her parents, evertime she chooses to "restart" her own life into another world where their death is predetermined.
I guess it's just that world only then. I guess I was just confused
Yeah, in all the other worlds, the fact that "Rika is the reincarnation of Oyashirosama" remained unchanged. That's why Rika was always able to communicate with Hanyuu. But in Saikoroshi-hen's world, Rika's mother was the 8th decendant, not Rika. And like Hanyuu said to Rika through the crystal, the Hanyuu in Saikoroshi-hen's world has already completed her existence after living out a full life with Rika's mother.
The only way to allow Rika's Hanyuu into Saikoroshi-hen's world is to erase the fact that "a reincarnation of Oyashirosama already exists". By killing Rika's mom, the fact that "Rika's mom was the reincarnation" will disappear (since nobody but Rika's mom knows about it).
For the people who have finishing reading Saikoroshi-hen, which world would you perfer?
The original world, no doubt about it.
Of course, I'll admit a part of it is because there's no way a sudden parallel world can win against the years of affection I have developed for the Higurashi world and characters. :heh:
But Rena's metaphor in the end about the greenhouse flower vs wild flower is very true as well. If having lived through a harsh past has made you a wiser and stronger person in the end, then there's no reason to think of that history as shameful or regrettable.
In the end, it's all down to this though:
Original Satoko = Awesome moe moe loli tsundere who's truly mature on the inside *love*
Saikoroshi-hen's Satoko = I cheered when Rika socked her, 'nuff said. :heh:
kingsky123
2007-10-26, 15:37
from what i am getting from you guys... i think hanyuu is trying to show rika the importance of life and not get into any more car accidents :P . (and also not take it for granted )
like a harsh but cool punishment for making everyone worry bout her
(they should so OVA this)
Altima of the Gates
2007-11-01, 11:50
Finally got a chance to work my way though this.
Once again, hats off to Ryukishi-san and his amazing writing skill. I was honestly expecting nothing more than a light-hearted epilogue-ish story, but what I got was a truly engaging story that had me on the edge of my seat the entire way. The fact game players like us have gotten to know the characters and the world so well really helped. Personally, I was able to dive into the story right away, feeling everything at full impact.
For a IF world, Saikoroshi-hen is probably the most revealing of all. I think everything pretty much already speaks for itself when we realize the fact that the reverse of everything we have come to know and love is actually a sinless world. Just like the puzzle game in Matsuribayashi suggested, many sins are required in order for Rika to live on with all of her friends. The Saikoroshi-hen world showed us just how "miserable" things would be if no one ever commited any sins, but lived on "happily" instead.
As for the story itself... I almost bawled together with Rika in the beginning. :(
But the delinquent dark Rika was a little moe. :heh:
A personal highlight was the portrayal of the mental confusion going on between her Bernkastel personality and her role as Furude Rika in the Saikoroshi-hen world. I really felt Rika's fear here about losing her own self.
Personally, I think the climax of the story was that last long conversation between Rika and Hanyuu before Rika made her decision. A lot of what was said there really reflected deeply on the morality of Rika's own journey.
The final scene with everyone around Rika's bed was quite nice as well. It reminded me of just how much I love everyone in Higurashi.
Hanyuu is simply stunning. I love characters that normally acts childish, but is still capable of becoming deadly serious and philosophical when needed. The gap really makes them lovable for me.
In the end, I think Hanyuu probably just wanted Rika to learn about the importance of her own choices, as well as her own life, probably as some kind of redemption. Whether or not the whole thing was just a dream, well, that's probably not important. After all, it's just like Rika said, she was practically sacrificing the lives of many people, including her parents, evertime she chooses to "restart" her own life into another world where their death is predetermined.
Yeah, in all the other worlds, the fact that "Rika is the reincarnation of Oyashirosama" remained unchanged. That's why Rika was always able to communicate with Hanyuu. But in Saikoroshi-hen's world, Rika's mother was the 8th decendant, not Rika. And like Hanyuu said to Rika through the crystal, the Hanyuu in Saikoroshi-hen's world has already completed her existence after living out a full life with Rika's mother.
The only way to allow Rika's Hanyuu into Saikoroshi-hen's world is to erase the fact that "a reincarnation of Oyashirosama already exists". By killing Rika's mom, the fact that "Rika's mom was the reincarnation" will disappear (since nobody but Rika's mom knows about it).
The original world, no doubt about it.
Of course, I'll admit a part of it is because there's no way a sudden parallel world can win against the years of affection I have developed for the Higurashi world and characters. :heh:
But Rena's metaphor in the end about the greenhouse flower vs wild flower is very true as well. If having lived through a harsh past has made you a wiser and stronger person in the end, then there's no reason to think of that history as shameful or regrettable.
In the end, it's all down to this though:
Original Satoko = Awesome moe moe loli tsundere who's truly mature on the inside *love*
Saikoroshi-hen's Satoko = I cheered when Rika socked her, 'nuff said. :heh:
Interesting viewpoint there. although from what I've gathered here you're going by bias then from what Rena actually meant about greenhouse flowers (something sheltered from the harshness of the world) and wild flowers (something who has experienced the pain/cruelty/harshness of reality and retains their vitality). I for one beleive that not regretting the past is very important, because it shapes you as a person. However, here we have the main characters who have gone about there lives and not gone through those painful times. I really find it funny though how some people cheer for the happiness of the characters, but it must be under a certain criteria for the audience to feel fulfilled.
Mind you, this is not an attack on you, but a statement I'm trying to make. when you wish for someone else's happiness, if they are happy then your wish is fulfilled. So technically, if you scoff at this world then you aren't really wishing for the happiness of the characters in this world, you'd be saying, "as long as they went through all of the pain they went through in the past, I'll cheer them on, and if not, then they don't matter to me." Also, if you believe that all the characters, no matter what crimes they committed or how they acted in each arc in the storyline are the same, then it should be the same about these characters in this world. Otherwise its kinda a half-hearted wish.
Its not really regretting the past by accepting a world like this but accepting that the "wish for happiness came true."
All that said, I'm really enjoying the storyline so far and I Do like the characters as they are, but if my friends were truly happy why would I find the need to change that just to fulfill my own desires?
Sorry about the long post here. :heh:
k//eternal
2007-11-09, 13:16
Do Rika's parents have known names? I imagine if any arc contains them, it's got to be in here.
I don't know japanese, so I had to play with the Anime Games Text Hooker, And the feeling was not the same, as I didn't understood many things, for example:
I read through all Saikogoroshi-hen and I didn't know Rika finished killing her mother! That ****ing translator sucks D=< Could someone tell me how Rika killed her mother, and when? I did read the part when she realized the "Kakera" was inside her mother's chest, though
theacefrehley
2007-11-30, 19:15
I don't know japanese, so I had to play with the Anime Games Text Hooker, And the feeling was not the same, as I didn't understood many things, for example:
I read through all Saikogoroshi-hen and I didn't know Rika finished killing her mother! That ****ing translator sucks D=< Could someone tell me how Rika killed her mother, and when? I did read the part when she realized the "Kakera" was inside her mother's chest, though
There's a part where Hanyuu says:
"あなたはその手を母の血に染めてなんかいない。
あれは全部、……梨花に意地悪したかった僕の見せた、「夢」なのですから。"
Roughly:
"You didn't dye your hands in your mother's blood.
Because all that was...... a "dream" I mischievously showed to you."
Just another question:
In the end of Saikoroshi-hen, Hanyuu appears only in her spirit form
Didn't she turn into human in Matsuribayashi-hen?
Or can she switch between the two forms and decided to use her spirit form at the end?
Or there's something at the end of Matsuribayashi-hen that explains her being spirit only (I didn't read it) ?
One theory has it that there's a time limit, just like how Hanyuu's power is getting weaker per "reset".
The other theory, which seems that the anime might be supporting (?), is that Saikoroshi-hen is the real ending to Higurashi no Naku Koro ni, where Matsuribayashi-hen was only there to explain and fill in all the missing history. Theory suggests that for some unknown reason, Rika was killed (perhaps by Takano, who escaped the institute), and thus another "reset" was needed. Then we move to Saikoroshi-hen, which started from the end of Miotsukushi-hen (thus Hanyuu isn't physically there).
The way "adult Rika" shows up at the world where Miyoko got all her flags, which happened in Saikoroshi-hen world, (episode 24 part C) might be hinting that theory.
theacefrehley
2007-12-18, 13:22
One theory has it that there's a time limit, just like how Hanyuu's power is getting weaker per "reset".
The other theory, which seems that the anime might be supporting (?), is that Saikoroshi-hen is the real ending to Higurashi no Naku Koro ni, where Matsuribayashi-hen was only there to explain and fill in all the missing history. Theory suggests that for some unknown reason, Rika was killed (perhaps by Takano, who escaped the institute), and thus another "reset" was needed. Then we move to Saikoroshi-hen, which started from the end of Miotsukushi-hen (thus Hanyuu isn't physically there).
The way "adult Rika" shows up at the world where Miyoko got all her flags, which happened in Saikoroshi-hen world, (episode 24 part C) might be hinting that theory.
Well
it makes sense
but I'd rather go with the first theory
too much stuff guessed on this second one (rika killed, takano escaped)
besides
Takano getting all the flags only happened in the "ideal" world, the world where nothing goes wrong, the world where we don't have higurashi's story
Takano did escape in Matsuribayashi-hen's ending...
Takano did escape in Matsuribayashi-hen's ending...
How do you know? O_O Is it mentioned on the sound novel? (Sorry, but no, I haven't read Matsuribayashi-hen : P)
One theory has it that there's a time limit, just like how Hanyuu's power is getting weaker per "reset".
The other theory, which seems that the anime might be supporting (?), is that Saikoroshi-hen is the real ending to Higurashi no Naku Koro ni, where Matsuribayashi-hen was only there to explain and fill in all the missing history. Theory suggests that for some unknown reason, Rika was killed (perhaps by Takano, who escaped the institute), and thus another "reset" was needed. Then we move to Saikoroshi-hen, which started from the end of Miotsukushi-hen (thus Hanyuu isn't physically there).
The way "adult Rika" shows up at the world where Miyoko got all her flags, which happened in Saikoroshi-hen world, (episode 24 part C) might be hinting that theory.
Personally I hope that this isn't what takes place. After all, it would render the victory the characters achieved in Matsuribayashi-hen meaningless. And I don't think that the victories in Tsumihoboroshi-hen and Minagoroshi-hen should be considered meaningless, since they both taught Rika how to fight fate and allowed the other characters to unconsciously avoid repeating their previous mistakes.
I suppose that having Rika die and then appearing in Saikoroshi-hen, followed by Miotsukushi-hen would allow the third season to continue in the same vein as before, but I would find it rather unsatisfying.
Sterling01
2007-12-18, 19:39
That's also a reason some people consider Miotsukushi-hen to be bittersweet
How do you know? O_O Is it mentioned on the sound novel? (Sorry, but no, I haven't read Matsuribayashi-hen : P)
It's from the game.
Personally I hope that this isn't what takes place. After all, it would render the victory the characters achieved in Matsuribayashi-hen meaningless. And I don't think that the victories in Tsumihoboroshi-hen and Minagoroshi-hen should be considered meaningless, since they both taught Rika how to fight fate and allowed the other characters to unconsciously avoid repeating their previous mistakes.
I suppose that having Rika die and then appearing in Saikoroshi-hen, followed by Miotsukushi-hen would allow the third season to continue in the same vein as before, but I would find it rather unsatisfying
If you think that way, then the victory of Matsuribayashi-hen isn't meaningless. I personally didn't like Matsuribayashi-hen too much, as the core of the story was mainly only about Rika and friends fighting against Takano and Yamainu. It was a world that was nicely set up for Rika to only tackle on Rule Y, as Rule X was non-existent, and Rule Z was actually worked to the group's favor. Having a nice and happy setting for the world just isn't what Higurashi no Naku Koro ni has been about.
Thus there is Miotsukushi-hen, which address that "flaw" and introduces the "Trials of Hanyuu". Of course, Miotsukushi-hen wasn't that great itself, as it left out all the background details for some reason, had a controversial setting for Hanyuu, and cheesy OP music poping up all the time:heh:
So personally, Saikoroshi-hen is the real ending for me.
Sterling01
2007-12-18, 21:17
It's from the game.
cheesy OP music poping up all the time:heh:
Why did I think of Higurashi: The Musical :twitch::heh:
Saikoroshi-hen is an epilogue after all.
So maybe it goes like this
Matsuribayashi-hen then Rika Dies or is killed by Takano which leads to Miotsukushi-hen then Rika gets into a car accident which leads to the "Sinless world" AKA Saikoroshi-hen
Why did I think of Higurashi: The Musical :twitch::heh:
Saikoroshi-hen is an epilogue after all.
So maybe it goes like this
Matsuribayashi-hen then Rika Dies or is killed by Takano which leads to Miotsukushi-hen then Rika gets into a car accident which leads to the "Sinless world" AKA Saikoroshi-hen
Doesn't Hanyuu play a rather active part in Saikoroshi-hen (even if she doesn't enter that world) though? Wouldn't that be rather difficult for her to do after Miotsukushi-hen?
Maybe Hanyuu went back to her god form. I suppose that she materialized only to help Rika and her friends to cross the barrier of June 1983.
Maybe Hanyuu went back to her god form. I suppose that she materialized only to help Rika and her friends to cross the barrier of June 1983.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Rika say that Hanyuu is gone for good after her death in Miotsukushi-hen? Just as in Yoigoshi-hen, where Shion says that she can no longer sense Mion's presence after the latter's second death.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Rika say that Hanyuu is gone for good after her death in Miotsukushi-hen? Just as in Yoigoshi-hen, where Shion says that she can no longer sense Mion's presence after the latter's second death.
Yeah, but when I say "God Form" I mean a state where only Rika can see her. Maybe after supposely winning against Takano, Hanyuu dissappeared only to be seen by Rika again. But still, she has little power left. Saikoroshi-hen happens. When Miotsukushi-hen occurs, all of her power is gone, and is really considered to be the last world.
theacefrehley
2008-07-27, 18:58
With the lack of anything better to do...
http://www.mediafire.com/?7idb3mtnn07
With the lack of anything better to do...
http://www.mediafire.com/?7idb3mtnn07Oh... I still haven't play Rei, and since I was expecting Matsuri Kakera Asobi to include it, since voice acting helps me to play it (kanji -__-). I was depressed, you make hapiness come back to me, thaks *__*
With the lack of anything better to do...
http://www.mediafire.com/?7idb3mtnn07
Thanks for translating that.
Sterling01
2008-07-27, 21:12
With the lack of anything better to do...
http://www.mediafire.com/?7idb3mtnn07
Ace, would you mind if we edit it and make a patch for Rei
theacefrehley
2008-07-28, 05:46
Ace, would you mind if we edit it and make a patch for Rei
ok
it's short anyway, more 4 chapters
theacefrehley
2008-07-29, 11:28
Chapter 2
http://www.mediafire.com/?hgitz35yizr
theacefrehley
2008-07-31, 10:00
Chapter 3
http://www.mediafire.com/?se2rnlbdzyz
2 to go
Thanks soooo much for translate this *-* You just made my day!
kingsky123
2008-07-31, 15:17
kinda pity rika after reading rei... she goes crazy =/.
PS: WHAT I SAID CAME TRUE!! THEY REALLY ARE GONNA OVA THIS!!
theacefrehley
2008-08-01, 18:59
chapter 4
http://www.mediafire.com/?1yv4jwoltxb
one more to go
theacefrehley
2008-08-04, 10:55
chapter 5
http://www.mediafire.com/?2aolyxljyzr
It's over
And I just hope that the Higurashi universe ends up here. Milking things too much ends up ruining them.
Sterling01
2008-08-04, 11:24
chapter 5
http://www.mediafire.com/?2aolyxljyzr
It's over
And I just hope that the Higurashi universe ends up here. Milking things too much ends up ruining them.
Then I'll get to editing and making the patch
theacefrehley
2008-08-04, 11:33
Then I'll get to editing and making the patch
Well
Letting aside 'possible' (:heh:) translation mistakes, there are lots of typos I saw just by taking a quick look
it's stuff like:
'yo' instead of 'you'
'moe' instead of 'more'
and such
In other words, things you get for trying to type too fast
If possible try to take a look at this
GyroidFanatic
2008-08-04, 11:56
I just finished reading it. There are a few hard-to-understand sentences, but everything was fine overall.
And I laughed hard at the uguu~
theacefrehley
2008-08-04, 12:16
I just finished reading it. There are a few hard-to-understand sentences, but everything was fine overall.
And I laughed hard at the uguu~
I guess I know which are these sentences
Because I too had trouble to understand some of them
Let me guess
Are they among Rena's comparison of field/wild flowers and greenhouse flowers?
GyroidFanatic
2008-08-04, 12:20
I actually ended skimming over that part because it was too confusing. I got the general idea though.
kingsky123
2008-08-05, 01:00
Words cannot describe how much i appreciate you translators !! (but i shall try)
ORZ! THANK YOU
PS: i read one fanfiction article about rena being the batman... it seems like Rei is pushing it close =/
I thought that Saikoroshi-hen works really well as an epilogue. Also, it really helps explain the relationship between Rika & Bernkastel. Thanks for translating all of it theacefrehley.
I think it demonstrates that when Rika memories move to another world, they replace the resident Rika's memories, effectively replacing the local Rika with Frederika. That doesn't explain how Rika manages to act like Bernkastel (e.g. warning Akasaka in Minagoroshi-hen) before her arrival in a world. I must admit I don't really understand that.
It also explains how Bernkastel effectively diverges from Rika after Saikoroshi-hen. I was wondering whether the witch in Umineko was created after Rika's death from natural causes in the world of Matsuribayashi-hen, but the fact that she diverged at that point also explains why she appears as being approximately the same age as Rika.
I too think that the world was real. After all we see Bernkastel setting it up in the 52nd piece by saving Miyoko's parents and also mentioning some of the other features of Saikoroshi-hen's world. Plus, Rika is convinced that the world was real. And Hanyuu probably told Rika that it was a dream because she didn't want Rika to feel guilt for murdering her mother.
And I think that Rika probably does return to the original world. After all, Hanyuu tells Rika that this passage to the perfect world shouldn't have happened and may have been due to some other god, so if this transfer happened differently to all the previous ones, then perhaps it was also possible for Rika to go back to a previous world. And perhaps Hanyuu can switch from a corporeal to a non-corporeal body. After all she appears corporeally to Ichirou Maebara and doesn't show up in a physical body later on. Then again perhaps Rika ended up in a separate but identical world, but that would be for all intents and purposes the same. After all, even the worlds of Watanagashi-hen and Miotsukushi-hen are different (since Rika is tortured to death by Shion in the former and kills herself in the latter).
By the way, since people plan to turn this into a patch, I thought it might be helpful to look out for grammar or syntax errors in the translation. I've made a list of the ones I spotted while reading it:
Chapter 1
the cicadas/semi gets more and moe
to poke me bac
This is not how you apology
I wonder if the dice is showing
its thousand years curse.
I can explain only through the results of dices.
Then, get the textbooks youl'll bring tomorrow reay
appears when I'm all alone, .
... Not even a hundred years Witch can escape from a high altitude.
...... After all, in this world, even the sun sinking into the west could happen.
" Do gimme such absurd!
It's of no use to be in derangement.
With my whole body is exhaust
in the end, I must be payiugn
this is all my responsabilty
Chapter 2
... it seemed everyone hated
...... But, not results at all
The morals of the humans denies the parricide.
Inside there, murders are nothing different of
At leats you can search for hints and keep the morale
she was not able toslip out.
I was tolerant enough to just chose to surrender
Chapter 3
I've been getting irritated even with that shrilling voice
It's the Furude Shrine's most valuable asset of the ,
Chapter 4
ordered by my mother would be very annoying
Chapter 5
let's keep on figthing persistentlyfor
" ...... To soak in rejoice saving
I'm wondering if Rika wouldn't accept
Houjou Satoko too doesn't have the sin of parricide.
That fight will perdure
I wasted my own life feigning to shake dices
And since Rika-chan also believed she'd come back, both hands probably reachd
...... I didn't went back.
Which of those 2 world is happy?
look for a cheap supermarket and economize some coins!"
I, ... lived a hundred years, a wicth
I halfway walked in on the world of the gods but, becauseof
theacefrehley
2008-08-06, 05:26
Dude,
Really
I think you guys think too much over things
Hanyuu says in the end she created the dream with all the words and reasons
Why doubt she would be lying?
As for Rika behaving like bernkastel before her arrival,
I think this world doesn't work for comparisons because everything is upside down from the beginning
Maybe the stuff with Akasaka is one of those set facts (like Satoko's parents death), but that became set over the loops, whatever :)
kingsky123
2008-08-06, 09:00
i think it was really all planned by hanyuu when rika got into the accident, i think hanyuu felt that rika was too complacent with her life, and that she wasnt behaving normally.
I believe that hanyuu already planned something like that for her BEFORE she got into the accident so that she is able to cope once hanyuu returns to godland.
Sterling01
2008-08-06, 11:29
Chapter 1 is done... only 4 more chapters to edit.
Dude,
Really
I think you guys think too much over things
Hanyuu says in the end she created the dream with all the words and reasons
Why doubt she would be lying?
Because Hanyuu has a good motive to lie: to assuage Rika's guilt over her act of matricide. That combined with Rika's conviction that the world was more than a dream and the fact that Bernkastel created it indicates to me that the world was real.
As for Rika behaving like bernkastel before her arrival,
I think this world doesn't work for comparisons because everything is upside down from the beginning
Maybe the stuff with Akasaka is one of those set facts (like Satoko's parents death), but that became set over the loops, whatever :)
Rika states that she isn't Rika Furude in Tsumihoboroshi-hen, but that since she had used that name for over a hundred years she might as well be called that. This indicates that the separation of identities between the world-skipping Rika (who in Saikoroshi-hen names herself Bernkastel) and the Rikas that exist in individual worlds before Bernkastel's arrival there has existed from the beginning of Higurashi.
theacefrehley
2008-08-06, 16:51
Because Hanyuu has a good motive to lie: to assuage Rika's guilt over her act of matricide. That combined with Rika's conviction that the world was more than a dream and the fact that Bernkastel created it indicates to me that the world was real.
Well,
Hanyuu's explanation convinced me well enough, along with the mood of the scene
It was all a dream she created to teach Rika a lesson
Beyond that is supposition :D
Rika states that she isn't Rika Furude in Tsumihoboroshi-hen, but that since she had used that name for over a hundred years she might as well be called that. This indicates that the separation of identities between the world-skipping Rika (who in Saikoroshi-hen names herself Bernkastel) and the Rikas that exist in individual worlds before Bernkastel's arrival there has existed from the beginning of Higurashi.
???? :confused:
I think you're thinking too much :D
I always thought of Higurashi as a videogame with a 'save mode'/'save points' option. Things of the past keep on preserved to some extent.
Otherwise Rika'd always suffer a huge transformation from being a little girl who knows nothing to the time traveler after a sudden load of memories. If I'm not mistaken, whenever she arrives back in time, she is already 'famous' for her past 'predictions' (I think Himatsubushi shows that, and the last arcs too).
Obviously, saikoroshi doesn't need to fit into this because, after all, I think it was just an 'artificial' dream.
Maho Momo
2008-08-06, 17:06
I agree with Eryops, I don't think Saikoroshi-hen was just a dream. Hanyuu has a pretty good motive to lie and even Rika/Bernkastel wasn't convinced that Hanyuu was being honest.
GyroidFanatic
2008-08-06, 19:24
I have to say, after reading Saikoroshi-hen, combined with what little I know about you-know-who's role in Umineko, this TIP: http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=694223&postcount=146 became a tad ironic.
(http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=694223&postcount=146)
kingsky123
2008-08-07, 02:39
?
I believe there are 3 rikas :
1 - furude rika, the cute little girl who has no clue what is going on
2 - frederica bernkastel at of the time; furude rika, who warps time for 100 years and has not defeated takano, has just defeated and went into rei
3- frederica benkastel; I mean since rika is a time traveller/dimension traveller, imagine rika living again after she has had a fufilling life, and then looping some. Therefore leading her to tell the tale of her fighting takano as if it was just an experience she had
???? :confused:
I think you're thinking too much :D
I always thought of Higurashi as a videogame with a 'save mode'/'save points' option. Things of the past keep on preserved to some extent.
Otherwise Rika'd always suffer a huge transformation from being a little girl who knows nothing to the time traveler after a sudden load of memories. If I'm not mistaken, whenever she arrives back in time, she is already 'famous' for her past 'predictions' (I think Himatsubushi shows that, and the last arcs too).
Obviously, saikoroshi doesn't need to fit into this because, after all, I think it was just an 'artificial' dream.
Rika doesn't seem confused by the fact that she doesn't have the memories of Saikoroshi-hen's Rika when she arrives there, which makes it appear natural for her to not have access to the memories of the local Rika when she enters a new world. That, combined with the fact that she doesn't realize that Akasaka's wife lived in Minagoroshi-hen's world (also, when she arrives in that world she has no idea what the date is, which you;d expect her to know if she had access to the local memories) indicates to me that Dark Rika/Bernkastel's memories and personality replace those of the local Rika.
I agree that the fact that Rika acting as Bernkastel before that point (e.g. warning Akasaka in Minagoroshi-hen) is the biggest problem with this theory, however perhaps this indicates that, just as there are many worlds, there are multiple Rikas moving around and "our" Rika is replacing them rather than the original Rika. Interestingly Rika does seem to transform from a little girl into a hundred-year old witch according to this TIP (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=615810&postcount=79): "But that child has changed ever since kindergarten."
The problem with Higurashi working as savepoints is that Rika clearly lacks memories from the world she's in from before her arrival. If it worked incrementally, then you'd expect her to know what happened in the world she arrives to. The reason Rika can adapt smoothly in every world other than Saikoroshi-hen despite lacking the local Rika's memories is that most worlds are extremely similar to ones she has already been to (though extremely unusual occurrences such as Akasaka's wife living still throw her off).
I wonder if we could send Ryukishi07 an email and have him give us an unambiguous explanation. :)
Klashikari
2008-08-07, 04:10
You should consider the "world traveling" as both a dimension AND time manipulation.
Personally, I used that view to have an idea how it happened:
Basically, I assume each time Frederica goes in a world with Hanyuu, both are actually "creating" that world, but not from scratch: from the "blueprint", the world they are from. However, as entering in that world they are not able to rewind a certain period of time. Also, the "copy" keeps its general settings though X events might give another outcome, "dice roll".
As shown before, Some events are unrelated to Rika/Frederica actions, and in rare "worlds", Keiichi didn't arrive in Hinamizawa, which means that some good time before, his father didn't visit hinamizawa or wasn't attracted by the village. The same goes how Akasaka can be convinced or not in the Himatsubushi period.
The thing is: any past actions done by Frederica becomes rock solid and transmigrated for the next worlds, whatever what Frederica does, since it is "in the past".
Actually, in all past worlds, Frederica actually "overwritten" herself over and over. Well, rather "Rika" first, but a certain number of occurance twisted her "soul" (as the amount of memories and the personality changes are notcieable) and unknown to herself, she became "Frederica", which she finally understood completely in Saikoroshi-hen (though she had already an idea of being "different" in Tsumihoroboshi and Minagoroshi).
theacefrehley
2008-08-07, 05:33
Rika doesn't seem confused by the fact that she doesn't have the memories of Saikoroshi-hen's Rika when she arrives there, which makes it appear natural for her to not have access to the memories of the local Rika when she enters a new world. That, combined with the fact that she doesn't realize that Akasaka's wife lived in Minagoroshi-hen's world (also, when she arrives in that world she has no idea what the date is, which you;d expect her to know if she had access to the local memories) indicates to me that Dark Rika/Bernkastel's memories and personality replace those of the local Rika.
I agree that the fact that Rika acting as Bernkastel before that point (e.g. warning Akasaka in Minagoroshi-hen) is the biggest problem with this theory, however perhaps this indicates that, just as there are many worlds, there are multiple Rikas moving around and "our" Rika is replacing them rather than the original Rika. Interestingly Rika does seem to transform from a little girl into a hundred-year old witch according to this TIP (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=615810&postcount=79): "But that child has changed ever since kindergarten."
The problem with Higurashi working as savepoints is that Rika clearly lacks memories from the world she's in from before her arrival. If it worked incrementally, then you'd expect her to know what happened in the world she arrives to. The reason Rika can adapt smoothly in every world other than Saikoroshi-hen despite lacking the local Rika's memories is that most worlds are extremely similar to ones she has already been to (though extremely unusual occurrences such as Akasaka's wife living still throw her off).
I wonder if we could send Ryukishi07 an email and have him give us an unambiguous explanation. :)
My savepoints are from multiples game branchings :heh:
It's like she she has too much savegames on her PS2 card :heh:
That's why she doesn't know what was happening before added to some random events (ex: Mion's games, Teppei coming back...)
She doesn't know if she's in a watanagashi-hen type world or in a failed-himatsubushi world or in a success-himatsubushi world or in totally failed world (keiichi doesn't move) or... too many options
The thing is: any past actions done by Frederica becomes rock solid and transmigrated for the next worlds, whatever what Frederica does, since it is "in the past".
Yeah
That stuff of strong will becomes fate.
kingsky123
2008-08-07, 15:24
The stuff of strong will becomes fate, therefore leading himatsubushi hen's warning to become a reality for all worlds that rika is going through, that being said er ... doesnt that mean a 4 year old rika waited on the busstop for nobody without any explanation ??? or wha?? (in rei)
PS: does ryukishi07 speak english?
Dreamiel
2008-08-07, 18:21
PS: does ryukishi07 speak english?
Nope, that was disscussed before.
The stuff of strong will becomes fate, therefore leading himatsubushi hen's warning to become a reality for all worlds that rika is going through, that being said er ... doesnt that mean a 4 year old rika waited on the busstop for nobody without any explanation ??? or wha?? (in rei)
4 years old? She's at least 7 with the lower grade theory...nothing wrong with Rika-chama taking a rest in the bus station :heh: Maybe she gets to meet other people who came to tour the village...
theacefrehley
2008-08-08, 05:36
4 years old? She's at least 7 with the lower grade theory...nothing wrong with Rika-chama taking a rest in the bus station :heh: Maybe she gets to meet other people who came to tour the village...
If I'm not mistaken Rika's age is always shown as 1 digit (X), so she's 9 at most (while keiichi an rena are shown as XX). So, at Akasaka's time, she'd be 4, wouldn't she?:confused::confused:
kingsky123
2008-08-08, 05:37
if she was 7 then during the time akasaka came to visit she would be like 1 or 2 years old... that would be impossible. if she was 9 then she is 4 years old at of the time during the bus station.
If I'm not mistaken Rika's age is always shown as 1 digit (X), so she's 9 at most (while keiichi an rena are shown as XX). So, at Akasaka's time, she'd be 4, wouldn't she?:confused::confused:
My mistake...I kept remembing the lower grade means she was around gr5-6...you are right, she should be around 3-5 for lower grade theory, 7 for higher grade theory.
kingsky123
2008-08-10, 07:39
Question: didnt frederica already did the box A box B with the sweet thing in TIPS?
In rei, did rena do the exact same thing on rika?
Question: didnt frederica already did the box A box B with the sweet thing in TIPS?
In rei, did rena do the exact same thing on rika?
Not quite. The version in the TIPS had gum in one box and candy in the other. The one in Rei had one candy in one and two in the other. Unlike Frederica's scenario, one was clearly better than the other.
So, any word on the patch that was gonna happen?
And just for clarification, is this translation just for saikoroshi-hen or the other parts of Rei as well?
So, any word on the patch that was gonna happen?
And just for clarification, is this translation just for saikoroshi-hen or the other parts of Rei as well?
What has been posted here consisted solely of Saikoroshi-hen.
theacefrehley
2008-11-20, 16:29
The other parts are good but they are just comedy side stories (Higurashi Daybreak novel version and other chapter I forgot the name).
My intention was just to provide the epilogue of the story to those who liked the series and followed the 2 seasons anime.
I don't remember anymore but I think I decided to do it, before the OAV's were announced, because we didn't know if Rei would ever be animated.
As for the patch,
Forget it.
Just follow along with the txt files.
The translation is not worth of a patch anyway.
As for the patch,
Forget it.
Just follow along with the txt files.
The translation is not worth of a patch anyway.
I don't think so. At least you made the effort of translating it, and thanks to you, some people could read Saikoroshi-hen, a really interesting arc. I tried to read it with AGTH + Atlas, but that does not work for everyone, and I didn't understood it at all xP. So, thanks to your translation I know now a lot more about that arc. Actually, I was waiting for the patch too, it's always best to read it how it was meant to =)
Yeah it's still fine without the patch. Thank you very much for translating this I'm really looking forward to reading it! (y)
kaitoein
2009-03-27, 15:31
Just in case, someone want to play the saikoroshi chapter.
I made an english patch, using the translation script provided by theacefrehley.
Credits goes to him, for letting me using his works.
Here you go:
http://www.mediafire.com/?ydwdwtnwojn
ps: i did fixed some err, but there's still some works left to do.
confused_kitsune
2009-03-30, 06:20
^ Thanks a lot. I finished playing the patch, it was very enjoyable as an epilogue to the series.
Golden Witch Drugs
2009-03-31, 13:09
Myself, I still think of Miotsukushi-hen as the real ending. I just don't think that Saikoroshi-hen has a "right feeling" ending. And since Rika dies in the world after Matsuribayashi-hen and transfers to Saikoroshi-hen, then Miotsukushi-hen must occur after Saikoroshi-hen, right? But then all the words about Matsuribayashi-hen being the end is not true.
Myself, I still think of Miotsukushi-hen as the real ending. I just don't think that Saikoroshi-hen has a "right feeling" ending. And since Rika dies in the world after Matsuribayashi-hen and transfers to Saikoroshi-hen, then Miotsukushi-hen must occur after Saikoroshi-hen, right? But then all the words about Matsuribayashi-hen being the end is not true.
Well, Miostsuki-hen is the "True End" and I believe it is. I think this is one of those cases where the viewer is supposed to decide. Either way I'm happy.
Myself, I still think of Miotsukushi-hen as the real ending. I just don't think that Saikoroshi-hen has a "right feeling" ending. And since Rika dies in the world after Matsuribayashi-hen and transfers to Saikoroshi-hen, then Miotsukushi-hen must occur after Saikoroshi-hen, right? But then all the words about Matsuribayashi-hen being the end is not true.
You can't really place Miotsukushi-hen in the timeline of Higurashi since it's not even canon to begin with. Miotsukushi is an unofficial alternate ending made by the company Alchemist and is not written by Ryuukishi. The only reason why some fans claimed it was the real ending is because it was sadder than Matsuribayashi-hen.
Anyway, thanks for the patch kaitoein. ;)
You can't really place Miotsukushi-hen in the timeline of Higurashi since it's not even canon to begin with. Miotsukushi is an unofficial alternate ending made by the company Alchemist and is not written by Ryuukishi. The only reason why some fans claimed it was the real ending is because it was sadder than Matsuribayashi-hen.
Anyway, thanks for the patch kaitoein. ;)
It was also advertised as the "True Ending". You never know. Maybe Ryuukishi liked it so much he declared it true!
Golden Witch Drugs
2009-03-31, 14:26
You can't really place Miotsukushi-hen in the timeline of Higurashi since it's not even canon to begin with. Miotsukushi is an unofficial alternate ending made by the company Alchemist and is not written by Ryuukishi. The only reason why some fans claimed it was the real ending is because it was sadder than Matsuribayashi-hen.
Anyway, thanks for the patch kaitoein. ;)
But then would Saikoroshi-hen really be the right end? Seems kind of cliché to me :/
Rayneing
2009-03-31, 14:27
I have never seen it called the True End anywhere except here and on wikipedia.
I have never seen it called the True End anywhere except here and on wikipedia.
Fo rizzle Raynizzle? Do YOU consider it the "True End" ?
Dante of the Inferno
2009-03-31, 17:18
Fo rizzle Raynizzle? Do YOU consider it the "True End" ?
I consider it a more "realistic" conclusion, if that's what you mean.
theacefrehley
2009-04-01, 05:08
I've never seen any trustful source saying the PS2 ending was the real ending.
Regardless of which one is better, I don't see a reason for the PC version not to be the real one. It's the source for everthing else, and the author had plenty of freedom to do what he wanted (it's a doujin game after all).
Probably, some shop advertised it that way to sell a few more copies of the PS2 port.
I've never seen any trustful source saying the PS2 ending was the real ending.
Regardless of which one is better, I don't see a reason for the PC version not to be the real one. It's the source for everthing else, and the author had plenty of freedom to do what he wanted (it's a doujin game after all).
Probably, some shop advertised it that way to sell a few more copies of the PS2 port.
I think western fans called it the "true ending" because some other well-known VNs such as Tsukihime and Fate/Stay Night mostly have Good and True endings for each heroine. Since the Good ends are happier, people assumed that this applied to Higurashi and declared Miotsukushi-hen to be the "true end" because it's sadder.
Anyway, if it was the true ending why has it only been featured in the Matsuri version of Higurashi? The original, manga, anime and novelizations all used Matsuribayashi-hen. The reason Matsuri had a new ending was to give fans that owned the PC version an incentive to buy it.
theacefrehley
2009-04-02, 17:46
I think western fans called it the "true ending" because some other well-known VNs such as Tsukihime and Fate/Stay Night mostly have Good and True endings for each heroine. Since the Good ends are happier, people assumed that this applied to Higurashi and declared Miotsukushi-hen to be the "true end" because it's sadder.
Anyway, if it was the true ending why has it only been featured in the Matsuri version of Higurashi? The original, manga, anime and novelizations all used Matsuribayashi-hen. The reason Matsuri had a new ending was to give fans that owned the PC version an incentive to buy it.
Just a side note:
I've read in some blogs that the NDS version will feature both endings: Miotsukushi and Matsuribayashi. (in the last NDS game, that is)
Dante of the Inferno
2009-04-02, 17:48
I think western fans called it the "true ending" because some other well-known VNs such as Tsukihime and Fate/Stay Night mostly have Good and True endings for each heroine. Since the Good ends are happier, people assumed that this applied to Higurashi and declared Miotsukushi-hen to be the "true end" because it's sadder.
Anyway, if it was the true ending why has it only been featured in the Matsuri version of Higurashi? The original, manga, anime and novelizations all used Matsuribayashi-hen. The reason Matsuri had a new ending was to give fans that owned the PC version an incentive to buy it.
Eh, we've already had about 3 solid pages on this thread about why/why not people should consider Miotsukushi-hen as a "true" ending. Most people can decided for themselves, but otherwise just accept Matsuribayashi as the default conclusion.
If you REALLY wanted to, you could compare this situation to the conclusion of the Eva series and the Eva movie.
If you REALLY wanted to, you could compare this situation to the conclusion of the Eva series and the Eva movie.
Not really. Both were done by Anno and the events in both were the same. The only difference was the point of view.
Not true. That's the most accepted theory. I believe that both are two alternate endings. The only difference between the EVA case and the Higurashi case is that EoE is stated to be canon, that is until Rebuild 4.0 comes out.
Dante of the Inferno
2009-04-02, 18:39
Not really. Both were done by Anno and the events in both were the same. The only difference was the point of view.
I am damn sure the endings were different. The only contrast between our scenario and Eva's is that it has two official endings.
I am damn sure the endings were different. The only contrast between our scenario and Eva's is that it has two official endings.
I'm pretty sure that Anno said that the only difference between the two was that you only saw Shinji's complementation in the series, whereas the movie also shows the outside events surrounding it.
Dante of the Inferno
2009-04-03, 00:55
I'm pretty sure that Anno said that the only difference between the two was that you only saw Shinji's complementation in the series, whereas the movie also shows the outside events surrounding it.
You'll have to remind me of the parallels where he chokes Asuka....twice, where she's basically eaten by the other Evas, or where people are congratulating him.
You'll have to remind me of the parallels where he chokes Asuka....twice, where she's basically eaten by the other Evas, or where people are congratulating him.
The same events are meant to be happening in both, you just get to see a different fraction in each version.
With Higurashi...all the ends are "true"...from a certain point of view.
Just another roll of the dice, Hanyuu, if you please....
With Higurashi...all the ends are "true"...from a certain point of view.
Just another roll of the dice, Hanyuu, if you please....
Except for the fact that Miostukushi-hen is incompatible with Matsuribayashi-hen and Saikoroshi-hen, so they cannot both be 'true'.
Except for the fact that Miostukushi-hen is incompatible with Matsuribayashi-hen and Saikoroshi-hen, so they cannot both be 'true'.
But they can both be awesome. To bad Matsuribayashi-hen wasted that opportunity by villain decaying the big bad and not making Keiichi to badass things that he was destined to do.
With Higurashi...all the ends are "true"...from a certain point of view.
Just another roll of the dice, Hanyuu, if you please....
Like we said many times, you cannot deny the fact that Matsuribayashi-hen is the true ending. However, it's up to you to decide which one is the best.
But they can both be awesome. To bad Matsuribayashi-hen wasted that opportunity by villain decaying the big bad and not making Keiichi to badass things that he was destined to do.
Keiichi dodging a hail of bullets through sheer force of will is pretty ridiculous. I can tolerate this sort of thing in the Matrix, but Keiichi doing it does quite a number on my suspension of disbelief.By the way, why are you so much in favor of Miotsukushi-hen? I rather doubt that you have read it.
Keiichi dodging a hail of bullets through sheer force of will is pretty ridiculous. I can tolerate this sort of thing in the Matrix, but Keiichi doing it does quite a number on my suspension of disbelief.By the way, why are you so much in favor of Miotsukushi-hen? I rather doubt that you have read it.
I've read a summary and I have a really big Higurashi fan friend who owns the game and told me about Miotsukushi-hen. And that is exactly why I like it so much. Keiichi is full of win and it has a better ending.
crimmy88
2009-04-30, 08:54
Can anyone here post what happens at the end of this chapter? My HDD failed right before I got the chance to know what happens :| ugh.
From reading the posts here, I understand that Rika killed her mother then Hanyuu said it was all a dream? If so, does Rika come back to the world of Matsuribayashi-hen?
EDIT: BTW, im not willing to wait for Rei to finish. Im seriously SERIOUSLY dying to know. thanks lol
Risa chan
2009-05-01, 09:43
I don't know which ending trust. I just base myself on the fact this an Expension , and so an OVA for the Anime. But if i'd have to chose an ending. I'd choose the original one. Even if this one is more realistic. There's many visions about these two arcs:
- Miotsukushi-hen is the real world , where rika had "nothing" (not such friends, hanyuu , ect.. a simple and boring life)
- The entire higurashi is just the perfect world that rika dreams of , and the moral of all the game would be , "You must work to have".
But i don't believe in this at all =O
Anyway as for Bernkastel
I think it demonstrates that when Rika memories move to another world, they replace the resident Rika's memories, effectively replacing the local Rika with Frederika. That doesn't explain how Rika manages to act like Bernkastel (e.g. warning Akasaka in Minagoroshi-hen) before her arrival in a world. I must admit I don't really understand that.
I think it's because Frederica is BErn.
" Frederica is Bern and Rika" I think there's a connection.
Rika always talks as bern , but if she lost every memories , she wouldn't have this such old voice. I think , Everytime a world is created, the Rika of this world is replaced by Frederica who is connected to Bern who cannot travel to the human world. But Frederica is Bern , or i should say Bern is every frederica.
It'll do something like this
-Frederica is Bern (that's why every of her poems are FRederica bernkastel)
-Rika from the fact she knows what is happening , what she's fighting ,she's not rika Furude .
-Bern is their accumulations who's sending a little of herself in every world she travels as frederica (The contraction of Furude rika )
I think Frederica is a Code that Bern uses to distingue herself who became a voyager and so cannot be a human. When she takes the resident furude rika's place she choose Frederica who is the contraction of the Human ( Furude Rika (Caus bern is Rika (or Every Rika)) but who's not totally human ,caus Bern is a part of her .
As Hanyuu is named "oyashiro-sama" for the god one , and just hanyuu as the spirit who travels next to her.
( That theory is for the fact " Frederica and bernkastel are differant) I don't believe in this so , for me
there's only 2 rikas.
Rika and Frederica Bernkastel
(and even in the 3 rikas theory , Frederica is Bernkastel)
some other theory:
I think Bernkastel is in Rika as Frederica . Bernkastel said " It's from this game , i'm born". Rika doesn't lose all of her memories. Hanyuu manages to make her remember the most thing she can. and as Bern is born from Rika , Rika acts like her. from the moment of the "Minimum memories she needs to remember" appears(Frederica). Rika talks like Bernkastel , to tell him to return to Tokio . Who knows , maybe her memories came back at this moment. But that's just a theory
After there's the Voyager thing. In the Anime , there were a huge blow of wind before Bern talks. I haven't played this game , so i don't know if the wind was mentioned .Maybe Bern entered her.
TheWitch0fDivinty
2009-05-24, 15:05
Do you know where i can download the Higurashi rei Patch?! D: I've look but i've found nothing.
Do you know where i can download the Higurashi rei Patch?! D: I've look but i've found nothing.
It's on page 4 of this very same thread.
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=2301967&postcount=68
Eleutheria
2009-05-26, 12:04
I finally played the REI game involving the love magatama. (Played Saigoroshi-hen last night)
Rena finally all but confessed to K1.
"Ke...K1-kun... this...um... may not be my actual feelings? It could be the magatama's power? Um, Ryuugu Rena...really loves K1-kun. ...the power's going to disappear soon, and I just wanted to say that"
and Rika is oddly muka muka :D
The mahjong scene was too long, even though I do play the game in real life. It's the scene I'd like most for DEEN to cut when the episode is animated.
Tenerezza
2009-05-28, 09:43
Got a few minor questions about this patch on page 4, this translate one of the chapters in the 9th game (Fan disc?) Is that what some mentioned here as the 'true end' ? to the story? I've pretty much only seen the game and played episode 1 as it was the only one translated since before.
In any event, is the chapter who was translated in that game coplete on it's own, and where does it kind of put itself if you have only watched the Anime will say. Is there more chapters in the 9th game?
Want to know before I decide to buy the game as well.
Klashikari
2009-05-28, 10:01
It isn't the "true end", it is basically an epilogue, a "sequel" of the end which is Matsuribayashi.
Yes, Saikoroshi-hen is fully translated, and there are also 2 other chapters in there, albeit they are side stories, for fun. Batsukoishi-hen (Soul Brothers one) and Hirukowashi-hen (Daybreak one).
Used Can
2009-10-27, 03:38
I'd like to know what's exactly the relationship between Bernkastel and Rika. Is Frederika Bernkastel some alter-ego created by Rika, or is the witch an actual independent existence?
SilverSyko
2009-10-27, 18:44
I'd like to know what's exactly the relationship between Bernkastel and Rika. Is Frederika Bernkastel some alter-ego created by Rika, or is the witch an actual independent existence?
As far as I know there has been no explanations on the connection Fredrica Bernkastel has with the Higurashi plotline, there are many assumptions on that though, and ecpecially on the overall plot of the When They Cry series now that a character with the exact same name has appeared in Umineko.
One favored theory of mine is that the When They Cry series is acctually a lot more close-knit then we think, and the ACTUAL main protagonist is Bernkastel. It's possible she's some supernatural being who finds entertainment by jumping between worlds and time periods looking for interesting situations which will result in a lot of time and thinking for the "actors" to solve. Also sometimes Bernkastel will take a form most suitable for interacting in that situation if she feels she can make things more interesting (i.e. An older woman in Higurashi, and a young-looking witch in Umineko), which gives the idea that MAYBE she doesn't acctually have a true physical form.
Anyway, if this is true, then you can expect to have a Fredrica Bernkastel character in When They Cry 5 and 6 as well.~
Used Can
2009-10-27, 21:05
Hmm... but didn't Rika say she was Bernkastel in Saikoroshi? Also, what about the whole deal about Bernkastel having been born from the memories of all the Rikas who had died?
This is basically what I don't get. Is Bernkastel just an alter-ego of Rika, or is she a separate entity (perhaps, she became one at some point)?
SilverSyko
2009-10-27, 21:22
Hmm... but didn't Rika say she was Bernkastel in Saikoroshi? Also, what about the whole deal about Bernkastel having been born from the memories of all the Rikas who had died?
This is basically what I don't get. Is Bernkastel just an alter-ego of Rika, or is she a separate entity (perhaps, she became one at some point)?
No I don't think so, I believe what was said is that Rika was the reincarnation of Hanyuu's daughter from years ago, which explains the connection Rika and Hanyuu have.
I might've missed that being born from memories part, but then again I've only watched the anime adaptation so I guess I'm not the best person for this. =/
Though I'm 100% positive that Bernkastel is a seperate entity from Rika.
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