Claymore - Episode 16 Discussion / Poll [Archive]

Pellissier

2007-07-17, 10:32

Welcome to the discussion thread for Claymore, Episode 16.

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B-day

2007-07-17, 10:51

Ah, a few more hours, just a few more.....Clare & Galatea to kick some ass........feel like a century:mad:

xVxObliVioNxVx

2007-07-17, 11:12

What I want to find out is why that Yoma and that little girl are seeking powerful Claymores and awakening them. Possibly to generate a powerful Yoma organization of their own to battle the Claymore organization?

Xellos-_^

2007-07-17, 11:51

PGilis

2007-07-17, 11:51

The Duffman dude there with the creepy loli is not a Youma. It's an Awaked One, that's for sure. And a very powerful one, to boot. :P

Youmas don't have such powers, and surely can't beat a group of Claymores (with an one-digit included) all alone. Unless, of course, do exist a different kind of youma besides A.O. we don't know yet.

If they really want a powerful army of A.O., that leave us with the single question: Why? Maybe they're planning some kind of war?

Majek

2007-07-17, 11:56

If they really want a powerful army of A.O., that leave us with the single question: Why? Maybe they're planning some kind of war?
Probably. And someone just wants to be prepared. :)

mycen

2007-07-17, 12:03

Probably. And someone just wants to be prepared. :)

In that case, the organization had better activate more claymores... not just the current 47 active duty ones. What a slugfest it would be though!!

Negativedark

2007-07-17, 12:11

Well A few more hours and I will at last be able to say something I've wanted to say for a week.

Xellos-_^

2007-07-17, 12:13

Loli vs the Man In Black?

*tentacles raise on the side of the Loli.

Defiled one

2007-07-17, 13:26

Alright. I will post the spoiler images then. Wait a second please.

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/5857/18817156pr4.jpghttp://img518.imageshack.us/img518/6014/88236873um8.jpg
http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/2672/59990285mr1.jpghttp://img252.imageshack.us/img252/372/50659312zw8.jpg
http://img486.imageshack.us/img486/3018/95039604zj8.jpghttp://img518.imageshack.us/img518/2810/32584827no0.jpg

Riful

2007-07-17, 13:53

Wow@pics ... good job with Jean, very beautiful o.o;

B-day

2007-07-17, 13:57

Looks like we have another cry baby:heh:, Raki has some tough competition.:D

Big guy: wo wo, Mama, I want mama....wo wo
Little loli: Come, honey baby, let mama hug you.

Riful

2007-07-17, 14:16

absolutely love that cry baby though XD

Fenrir_valindri

2007-07-17, 14:19

Lol Raki atleast has an excuse to tear up most of the time, this guy is a powerful awakened being who can tear people limb from limb, he is just a big crybaby :D

Polaryzed_123

2007-07-17, 14:25

Is it just me, or did it feel like it took weeks for this ep to air? It feels like I watched ep 15 ages ago...Need my Clare fix!

Deathkillz

2007-07-17, 14:32

Fenrir_valindri

2007-07-17, 14:40

That last pic does not look like loli-chan at all, her arms seem to be caught in something, maybe our #9 has awakened? :(

Defiled one

2007-07-17, 14:44

May tomorrow never come :rolleyes: "Sings"

Negativedark

2007-07-17, 15:02

They had better do all the facial expressions a certain someone did in this part in the manga justice, or I will be very very cross. Incidently the cross look is one of the facial expresions I'm looking forward to. It always makes me smile. So yes, I wish I could see this episode.
edit- Oh and I see something else was teased that wasn't in the manga.

PGilis

2007-07-17, 15:28

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/372/50659312zw8.jpg
DAUFF: Boohooo... Sob... Sob... MOMMY!! (T_T)
GALATEA: .... :twitch:
RIFUL: BAD! Bad Galatea! You made Dauff-chan cry!! :nono:

:heh::heh::heh:

Now i can't badmouth Raki anymore...

NoSanninWa

2007-07-17, 16:00

Blablabla

2007-07-17, 16:09

May tomorrow never come :rolleyes: "Sings"
He he he... some fanboys will be quite disapointed. Loli-chan rulez !! :cool:

Seska

2007-07-17, 16:16

Link removed myself.

Negativedark

2007-07-17, 16:25

Yeah. While this was discussed in the manga, it is very interesting to see pictures to go with the words. And ominious too!

No kidding. If I can find a full size version of that picture, It's going to be my desktop background.

Mentar

2007-07-17, 16:27

*sigh*

Almost midnight in Europe.

Winny hits on Claymore 16: None

Share hits on Claymore 16: None

...

This does not bode well for this ep.

Seska

2007-07-17, 16:35

Think of the Earthquake there, in Nippon...

Btw, nice Butterfly like AB? in the Preview? How is she?...... *Puts some wood picks into the campfire*

in other words.... Happy speculation...

NoSanninWa

2007-07-17, 16:54

*sigh*

Almost midnight in Europe.

Winny hits on Claymore 16: None

Share hits on Claymore 16: None

...

This does not bode well for this ep.

Well hopefully we won't have to wait for Friday to see the ep. ;) Thanks for letting us know this won't be one of the faster subs.

wrex_japan

2007-07-17, 16:59

Ep. 16 screenshots and summary. (http://wrexgrafix.com/anime/blog/?p=555)

Yay! Galatea!

Seska

2007-07-17, 17:01

Ep. 16 screenshots and summary.

Fixed. (http://wrexgrafix.com/anime/blog/?p=560)

Yay! Galatea!

Psssttttt... Wrong Url... your pointing to a past episode...

Your half-awaken :)

Be warned. There are some future spoilers in the comments, try to avoid them. if you don't want get spoiled

B-day

2007-07-17, 17:19

Thanks Wrex japan, great blog. And Yeah, Clare and Galatea kick ass( also being kicked).:D This episode is freaking awesome.:heh:

ArmisaelXVIII

2007-07-17, 17:22

It feels as if time is going slower and slower each second :(

Riful

2007-07-17, 17:29

Armisael: You are so right. I think I'll just go to bed, then it won't feel as long and I'll have a Claymore-breakfast tomorrow :p

Seska is right, spoilers on that blog review page. But "Dafu (the big one's name) corresponds to the Japanese word for coward or weakling" ... lol

B-day

2007-07-17, 17:47

Dafu->懦夫(coward), great name for a man like him:heh:

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-17, 17:57

I predict this episode will be very fast paced.

Mentar

2007-07-17, 18:06

Dafu->懦夫(coward), great name for a man like him:heh:

Actually, it isn't. He's neither a coward nor a weakling. In fact, rather the opposite.

EasyPrey

2007-07-17, 18:14

Read the episode blog: check
watched the raw: <not yet>. I keep hitting F5. ;)
watched the sub: <not yet>. Impatiently waiting . . .

I would have to agree with ArmisaelXVIII, that time appears to be slowing down. . .

Well, it is not like I am addicted to Anime. I can quit anytime I want to. ;) :D :D

-EasyPrey

PS. This episode has one of my favorite quotes. I will change my signature, after the sub comes out.

EDIT: Raw is OUT!!!

Xellos-_^

2007-07-17, 18:16

Actually, it isn't. He's neither a coward nor a weakling. In fact, rather the opposite.

but he does cry a lot and he does let a little girl push him around as well.

Skyliner

2007-07-17, 18:25

I hope Raki dies. Let's face it, he'll never be able to make Clare feel like a real woman.

Xellos-_^

2007-07-17, 18:30

I hope Raki dies. Let's face it, he'll never be able to make Clare feel like a real woman.

We are bashing Dafu right now not Raki. We will get back to the regularly scheduel Raki bashing later.

B-day

2007-07-17, 18:31

but he does cry a lot and he does let a little girl push him around as well.

:D:D:D:D:D little loli has more than meet the eyes:p
Clare, Galatea, Teresa, etc are all westen names. I wonder why the big guy named Dauf or Duff. In anime it sounds more like "Dafu".

Riful

2007-07-17, 18:35

@Xellos: lol ;) No, we can't bash him, he is too funny.

Well, typing "Dafu" in Kanji gives you 懦夫 which means "coward, weakling", that, at least, is a fact. Poor him :heh:

@B-Day: You are right, his name IS Dafu in Katakana. But the pronunciation is close to "Duff", isn't it. Which gives his name a double bad meaning. Gosh...

Skyliner

2007-07-17, 18:38

We are bashing Dafu right now not Raki. We will get back to the regularly scheduel Raki bashing later.

Although I haven't read the manga, I'm fairly sure that Raki actually gets to live through the whole story. But I'm still hoping that some crazed producer decides to leave him dead in a gutter somewhere and replace him with a watermelon - or something equally exciting in contrast - for the remainder of the anime. :cool:

Westlo

2007-07-17, 18:44

Stills look very good but how's the animation raw viewers?

Kodea

2007-07-17, 19:15

This episode is totally awesome! 9\10 :)

NoSanninWa

2007-07-17, 19:23

Although I haven't read the manga, I'm fairly sure that Raki actually gets to live through the whole story. But I'm still hoping that some crazed producer decides to leave him dead in a gutter somewhere and replace him with a watermelon - or something equally exciting in contrast - for the remainder of the anime. :cool:

Raki isn't in this episode. Please stay on topic and save the unncessary attacks for episodes he actually appears in.

GundamZZ

2007-07-17, 19:39

You are lighter than you look, you should eat more.

hmm stay on topic

B-day

2007-07-17, 19:44

This episode has a lot of action, especially Miss Claymore Galatea swings her sword for the first time, cool:p:p. Lots of explaination as well. We know more about awakened beings. :eyespin: But the animation quality drops a bit compare to previous episodes, maybe some of the key animators are on summer vacation:D:D

Ronny

2007-07-17, 20:14

Judging by the preview, seems they're saving up for next week.. which looks pricey :x (but so pretty ; ; )

Xellos-_^

2007-07-17, 20:18

Not just next ep. This entire series if animated right is going to be pricey. Hopefully they save enough of the budget for the ending.

pomps

2007-07-17, 20:27

Their faces look horrible exept in close-up scenes, but I still gave this ep a 10.

SebaZ

2007-07-17, 20:36

But the animation quality drops a bit compare to previous episodes, maybe some of the key animators are on summer vacation:D:D
I find this episode animated better than many others

B-day

2007-07-17, 20:49

Their faces look horrible except in close-up scenes.

Exactly what I want to say:cool::cool:

omegastar

2007-07-17, 20:52

Looks like Rotton the Wizard has another picture to add to his avatar...

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/image/Claymore/Claymore%20-%2016%20-%20Large%2026.jpg

Man, this is getting hilarious :D

dutchman

2007-07-17, 21:12

Looks like Rotton the Wizard has another picture to add to his avatar...

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/image/Claymore/Claymore%20-%2016%20-%20Large%2026.jpg

Man, this is getting hilarious :D

Yeah it appears Clare's face is used in road work maintenance a lot lately.

Beautiful episode I really loved how they animated Galatea's yoki manipulating skill. In the manga you only see (in Viz version) some sound effects 'tingle, tingle' when she does her stuff. Seeing it animated really makes it even more awesome.

And seeing Miss Claymore in action is always a win :D
I also really like the VA for Riful she does a hell of a job. Gah... can't wait for next week lol

Negativedark

2007-07-17, 21:26

Well now that people are seeing the actual episode I can make a comment that I've wanted to make for a week.
First off, Kudos to all those who correctly figured out that Riful was an awakened. Double Kudos to anyone who figured out what her rank was.
Second. To those of you who after last weeks episode still thought she was just a cute innocent little girl, WHA?! She clearly called the shots during the tourture scenes. And you still thought she wasn't evil? Don't forget what the song says, "A pretty face can hide an evil mind."

As to why Dauf follows Riful, we now know its because A; she's way more powerful, and B; he loves her. Aww.

I just pray they kept Rifuls "cross face" when she threatens to leave Dauf.

Xellos-_^

2007-07-17, 21:38

Well now that people are seeing the actual episode I can make a comment that I've wanted to make for a week.
First off, Kudos to all those who correctly figured out that Riful was an awakened. Double Kudos to anyone who figured out what her rank was.
Second. To those of you who after last weeks episode still thought she was just a cute innocent little girl, WHA?! She clearly called the shots during the tourture scenes. And you still thought she wasn't evil? Don't forget what the song says, "A pretty face can hide an evil mind."

There are no such things as evil lolis :p

As to why Dauf follows Riful, we now know its because A; she's way more powerful, and B; he loves her. Aww.

I just pray they kept Rifuls "cross face" when she threatens to leave Dauf.He is a Lolicon

B-day

2007-07-17, 21:42

As to why Dauf follows Riful, we now know its because A; she's way more powerful, and B; he loves her. Aww.

I just pray they kept Rifuls "cross face" when she threatens to leave Dauf.

She is way smarter too, Dauf can't do a thing without her.;)

dxanato

2007-07-17, 21:48

I had to laugh at every scene in which Duff is in. He is just to funny.

Kinematics

2007-07-17, 22:33

Second. To those of you who after last weeks episode still thought she was just a cute innocent little girl, WHA?!

What? You're saying she's not a cute, lovable Tomoyo-clone? Awwwww....

And yes, I've read the manga, so know what she is. Just too much fun to think of her that way, though :)

Also of note, this episode now catches the anime up with the English Viz manga release. From now on I get to be as in the dark as all the other first-time viewers. Whee! Manga vol. 9 should be out in 3 weeks, which will basicly put them even again, then all new stuffs...

Lendial

2007-07-17, 23:19

oh my galatea unprettied her ultra pretty face. i could never resist reading the summary before watching the ep days later.

t3ck

2007-07-17, 23:23

dutchman

2007-07-17, 23:38

Nice episode. The animations alittle off but at least the close up is nice.

Galatea... seems like it's her yoki sensing ability that get her to no.3. Without releasing yoki, aka golden eye mode, she seems to be just on par with Clare :heh:

And poor clare... crushed legs.. ouch.

She is above Clare both in yoki reading skill (Clare did not notice Riful until later when she was very close by). Also Galatea can actually manipulate yoki. And she cut off Daufs hand while Clare's flashsword could not even scratch him.

And this was all without ' golden eye mode'. But I admit that the difference between her and Clare isn't as huge anymore as it used to be.

Mentar

2007-07-17, 23:55

Aaaaaah.

*deeeep sigh*

again, an episode right between two grades, namely 8.5. With a heavy heart I decided to round down again to an 8, because a really critical sequence for the story was cut out compared to the manga, namely where Riful logically disseminated the whole Claymore business for Jeane:

(from memory, paraphrased, Riful to Jeane) By the way, the whole Claymore business is totally idiotic. You fight your whole life until you die or turn into a Yoma, and for what? You receive no thanks at all from the humans you protect, you're always hated and reviled.

Once you accept that as an Awakened you're an entirely different species, alot of things become much easier. Do humans cry for the birds, cows and pigs they kill to eat? Of course not, since they're a different species. The same is true for Awakened Ones. That's how nature really is.

This is when Riful had won with me, because she was mirroring my own thoughts 100%. And this is why I love her character: She's opening up yet another independent faction, those of the Awakened Ones. Until now, Yomas and Awakened Ones seemed one-track mind monsters to be slain. Here we see that they're having their own way of things, and Riful is a particularly interesting person.

Second. To those of you who after last weeks episode still thought she was just a cute innocent little girl, WHA?! She clearly called the shots during the tourture scenes. And you still thought she wasn't evil? Don't forget what the song says, "A pretty face can hide an evil mind."

I still say she's not evil per se. She doesn't particularly enjoy the cruelty aspect of the torture. She's trying to awaken Claymores for a very good reason, that's it. If awakening them would require to tickle them or serve them tea, that's what she'd do instead.

Keep her own perspective in mind. Also keep in mind that these Claymores were sent out to kill her. You CAN make a case for her being evil, but it would be hard based on what she's been doing till now, IMHO.

NoSanninWa

2007-07-17, 23:59

They left out Riful's attack on the whole Claymore raison d'etre? OMG, How could they!? That was a wonderful monologue!

herbert

2007-07-18, 00:03

Galatea... seems like it's her yoki sensing ability that get her to no.3. Without releasing yoki, aka golden eye mode, she seems to be just on par with Clare :heh:You get to remember whose arm Clare is using to hold sword. Even only as about half powerful as Irene was, Clare's strong enough, in my opinion, to fight lower digitals in equal ground. And we haven't see Galatea's true power. If she is offensive type, she must have some other tricks up her sleeve; if she is defensive style, it is all right for her to be on par with an offensive type Clare in a glance but still considered as the stronger because she is superior in regeneration.

Nightengale

2007-07-18, 00:20

They left out Riful's attack on the whole Claymore raison d'etre? OMG, How could they!? That was a wonderful monologue!

They removed THAT of all things!? Blasphemy!

EoT

2007-07-18, 00:25

Here's a proper screencap of the episode:

http://wrexgrafix.com/anime/blog/?p=560

Flora20709

2007-07-18, 00:34

Yea I just Wayched The Raw ANd I only Understood like 30% of it
Why Did Galatea Stop Clare From Cutting Ritful

toxic_trance

2007-07-18, 00:42

I m closing my eyes and typing this almost...i m not gonna see any screenshots for this one...just hoping this part is as brilliant as the manga

Westlo

2007-07-18, 00:45

Finally I can say it, Miss Claymore is vain!

herbert

2007-07-18, 00:58

Yea I just Wayched The Raw ANd I only Understood like 30% of it
Why Did Galatea Stop Clare From Cutting Ritful
Ritful did all talking just for luring Clare. So you remember:

1). Ritful is one of the strongest so Clare can't hit her if she don't want to be hit.

2). She wants Clare awakened

3). Clare react in an impulse, she will not stop to increase youki until she cut Ritful.

Outcome, Clare can't hit Ritful even if Galatea didn't stop her, and she will increase her youki output without thinking where her limit is. That would lead her awake.

Riful

2007-07-18, 01:35

How do you guys feel about Riful's name actually being "Riffle" (as mentioned in the comments on that blog)?

edit: might indeed be better to leave this until next week, but it looks very interesting to me.

PS: I can put my user title back now, can't I?

astrallionheart

2007-07-18, 02:21

Lol, the Eclipse sub that everyone has been seeding is a video of 9/11 conspiracy theory.

Deathkillz

2007-07-18, 04:04

well so i was wrong O.O
the butterfly like creature is indeed Jeane ~ i get the feeling that she is going to die next ep but yet i am still holding onto fate :3
galatea's ability was interesting but like everything it has it's limits...ie she cant control number 2 and 1 thats for sure XD
reading what was missed out from the manga i feel that they did make a wrong choice...i wonder why they did it besides of time constraints hmm...

the fighting was awesome again (as expected from this series) ~ cant wait to see what happens next...i think that this whole business with lol chan can last for another 2 episodes :/

edit: oh and clare got her face shoved into the ground yet again :heh:

killer3000ad

2007-07-18, 04:52

Well that's the third high rank Claymore to slam Clare's face down. So far, Ophelia, Irene and now Galatea have all had a go at it. Man....

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 04:54

One day this anime will be know as "Face Slam" in jest.

Blablabla

2007-07-18, 04:56

Deathkillz about Galatea vs Dafu:

Galatea's gimmick only works on weak minded or distracted characters. When Riful appeared and "talked"(:heh:), Dafu's motivation went stronger and his attacks held no more hesitation. No more way for Galatea to control him... and she got owned. :cool:

All that to say that she can't even hold Dafu... so Dafu+Riful = :heh:

Deathkillz

2007-07-18, 04:58

Well that's the third high rank Claymore to slam Clare's face down. So far, Ophelia, Irene and now Galatea have all had a go at it. Man....
its like a dam curse!
you slam clare's face...you will die later...(happened to ophelia and irene ~ lets see if the curse can bump off galatea :heh:)

Deathkillz about Galatea vs Dafu:

Galatea's gimmick only works on weak minded or distracted characters. When Riful appeared and "talked"(:heh:), Dafu's motivation went stronger and his attacks held no more hesitation. No more way for Galatea to control him... and she got owned. :cool:
ahh...misconception on my part :rolleyes: i thought she was able to control yoki and therefore affect Dafu's movements ~ but due to loli chan coming in he released his full power which is too much for galatea to effect :/

Ninja of Darkness

2007-07-18, 06:29

it hasnt been subbed yet right brcause if it has id like to know where i can find it

Blablabla

2007-07-18, 08:11

Something is bothering me about Clare in this ep'

When she first "awoke" to cure her leg and to save Galatea. Galatea using her "Yoki control" managed to bring her back. But in the manga I felt like it was Irene's arm which broke the awaken processus by puting the blade under Clare's neck.

So... Anyone felt the same or am I smoking too much tea leaves ? :heh:

cors8

2007-07-18, 08:24

Negativedark

2007-07-18, 08:37

If they cut Riful's speech, then they must have cut Jeans response. Shame, that was one of the most beautiful lines in the series.

cors8

2007-07-18, 08:48

Yeah. That monologue really brought a new perspective to the Claymore world.

It also showed just how intelligent Riful was and that she was not an average Awakened Being.

Trax

2007-07-18, 08:49

Hm no wonder that chat between Riful and Jean seemed kinda short (watched RAW but my japanese stinks but that's ok since I know the general banter from the manga). Shame they left that part out.

Blablabla

2007-07-18, 08:50

You're smoking too much tea leaves. Even Clare mentions how Galatea brought her back.

Yeah but when she mentioned that, I thought that she was talking about the "head on the ground" time.

Trax

2007-07-18, 08:55

Yeah but when she mentioned that, I thought that she was talking about the "head on the ground" time.

Nah, Galatea brought her back the first time and Clare comments on that (checked manga since I remembered it wrong as well), and perhaps a second time (either that or interrupting her before it actually got to that point, not sure).

Btw. also noticed they left out that little bit about Dauf's rods in the tunnel obstructing her sword. Ohwell, it's not that important I guess.

zato_1one

2007-07-18, 09:04

PGilis

2007-07-18, 09:06

More and more Clare is improving her newest and deadliest atack, the "Slam Face". :heh: The next time she meets Priscilla, she will surely kill her beating her head against Priscilla over and over, like Woody Woodpecker. :p

The problem with this new tecnic is, the next time Clare kisses Raki, he will feel like he's kissing an iron wall. :eyespin: :D

HinaThePrince

2007-07-18, 09:12

If they cut Riful's speech, then they must have cut Jeans response. Shame, that was one of the most beautiful lines in the series.

Mind quoting that part from the manga? My memory isn't all what it used to be. D:

B-day

2007-07-18, 09:22

Lol, the Eclipse sub that everyone has been seeding is a video of 9/11 conspiracy theory.

Why on earth would someone do this???? April fool:confused::confused::confused:

I'm waiting the real one, anytime now.:D

KiNA

2007-07-18, 09:23

I think they reshuffling the dialogue for next week.. Its too beautiful to be left out..

Seska

2007-07-18, 09:45

Please, this thread is for the Anime viewers... Please Manga Wisdom Users. Hold your Horses... We are in the middle of the Fight... Don't spoil thing. The Anime Time line is not so fast as the Manga Time line....

Restrict yourself, bite in your fingers or so... But don't spoil the beens...

silix

2007-07-18, 10:08

Also of note, this episode now catches the anime up with the English Viz manga release. From now on I get to be as in the dark as all the other first-time viewers. Whee! Manga vol. 9 should be out in 3 weeks, which will basicly put them even again, then all new stuffs...in italy, we're stuck with volume 11 since last march , with 12 due next december ... as far as release schedule regularity is concerned, you're way luckier ;)
even more so if we consider the awful and sometimes even misleading translation one has to be content with here... :uhoh:
Please, this thread is for the Anime viewers... Please Manga Wisdom Users. Hold your Horses... We are in the middle of the Fight... Don't spoil thing. The Anime Time line is not so fast as the Manga Time line....

Restrict yourself, bite in your fingers or so... But don't spoil the beens...but one shall discuss what has been omitted in a certain dialogue, from the manga version of the same scene ;)
like (apparently) the line Riful sais in the manga about the past of the Northern Abyssal One's woman, by which Clare unmistakeably recognizes her as Priscilla...

btw , got the feeling Vbulletin "loses" some posts on excessive DB activity... :eyebrow:

Seska

2007-07-18, 10:10

Did they say the names of the others "Top three" ABs out there in the Anime yet? (One point of many...)

B-day

2007-07-18, 10:19

Did they say the names of the others "Top three" ABs out there in the Anime yet? (One point of many...)

Galatea reveals Riful is one of them, but the other two remains nameless.

Skyfall

2007-07-18, 10:23

btw , got the feeling Vbulletin "loses" some posts on excessive DB activity... :eyebrow:

It loses some posts when it is being tinkered around with ;)

Since i am lagging behind with Claymore myself i can not give a good judgment on the situation here, so i "hid" some of the posts that looked out of place for me. I am sure NSW will have fun picking them apart later.

As a reminder - absolutely no manga spoilers are allowed in the weekly episode discussion threads, however small they might be.

Edit by NSW: Most of those posts have been revealed now. The other was deleted and a warning issued.

cf18

2007-07-18, 10:44

I thought Irene's arm was a main reason which made Clare couldn't control her Yoki liked before. I believed that Irene's arm still has some of remaining Yoki from Irene. So it was harder for Clare to stop the awakening process, IMO.

Yeah. This is the forth time Clare went into "blue flame limit-break" mode - in holy city, glue legs + rescue Raki, glue new arm, and now fix legs and rescue #3. Irene's arm is probably has more "yoma-ness" then the rest of Clare's body. It gives her a big offensive advantage, but also make her limit-break trump card a more risky move.

May be #3 can help her with some limit-break training later.

B-day

2007-07-18, 11:40

Yeah, the sub is finally out:D:D

Flora20709

2007-07-18, 12:13

Ritful did all talking just for luring Clare. So you remember:

1). Ritful is one of the strongest so Clare can't hit her if she don't want to be hit.

2). She wants Clare awakened

3). Clare react in an impulse, she will not stop to increase youki until she cut Ritful.

Outcome, Clare can't hit Ritful even if Galatea didn't stop her, and she will increase her youki output without thinking where her limit is. That would lead her awake.

Oh *smack head* fell like a doo doo head

Goofus Maximus

2007-07-18, 13:38

Now that the sub is out all you non-manga folks will now know why Duff/Dauf/Dafu follows her! :D

Negativedark

2007-07-18, 13:39

I think they reshuffling the dialogue for next week.. Its too beautiful to be left out..

The only thing is I don't know how that would work. It really needed to be said while Jean was hanging in the dungion. And Jeans line, really makes her charecter clear.

Shinen

2007-07-18, 13:48

The only thing is I don't know how that would work. It really needed to be said while Jean was hanging in the dungion. And Jeans line, really makes her charecter clear.

The line from Jean you are talking about (or the one I think you mean) is used, only Riful's part is indeed shorter. Therefore I don't believe they'll put it in next week either. Since Jean's line kinda finished the whole conversation. Or they'll make her say it to all 3 of them once they fight together - at least that's the only point where I can imagine it to be included, doesn't really fit elsewhere

Same goes for the missing part in the in the conversation between Riful and Clare, they actually already left that out back in episode 9, eventhough it was only a really small sentence back then. So not sure at all if they plan to include it next week ... in the anime Riful says "that one-horned", in the manga she doesn't say that - so if they added something different for Clare to recognize Priscilla, it's maybe because they removed the "doesn't kill girls" part?

EasyPrey

2007-07-18, 13:56

Subs are out.

So what are you doing reading this? Go and watch the subbed episode. :)

If you have not watched the subs, anything below this line could be a spoiler for you.

-----------------------------------------------

Ha! You clicked this without watching the subbed episode. ;)

Go and watch the subs. :D

-EasyPrey

Anh_Minh

2007-07-18, 13:58

Riful's voice is perfect. So playful.

I'm not totally sold on Jean's voice, but maybe that'll change if we ever get to hear her without, you know, all those rod in her stomach.

Rotton the Wizard

2007-07-18, 14:07

Looks like Rotton the Wizard has another picture to add to his avatar...

http://randomc.animeblogger.net/image/Claymore/Claymore%20-%2016%20-%20Large%2026.jpg

Man, this is getting hilarious :D

I sure do! At the rate clare is getting her head slammed, it's going to be impossible to fit everything into 50k! :(

Poor Clare! The amount of pain she has received at this point is exponentially higher compared to many other shounen protagonists combined by the end of a show. Impaled chest - check, severed legs - check, severed AND destroyed arm - check, severed hand check, and now broken legs after having a giant pole flung at her at ridiculous velocity.

The best "hell yeah!" moment of this episode was definitely when Clare batted back a giant Duff rod and hit him directly in the face. That was perfect.

And the Awakened being of the north now has Priscilla, but the way Riful said it (or the way it was translated) somehow almost makes it sound like they're dating.:uhoh: Imagine being neighbors with a couple of annoying ABs when they're having arguments about really stupid crap. :uhoh:

And what are Galatea's policies regarding beauty? I DEMAND someone tell me, even if it is a manga spoiler that would end up getting you banned! She needs to be NUMBAH WAN of her very own Elite Vain Claymore Squad, who do all Claymore duties beautifully and elegantly in accordance to Galatea's beauty policy.:naughty:

Nesty

2007-07-18, 14:07

"dwellers of the deep" or "abyssal one" hmmm lol

miroku2192

2007-07-18, 14:15

man i can't wait for this subbed version to come out!
im refraining myself from looking at spoilers + the raw...how much longer guys >.<!!!

i hope the "girl" sent from the organization won't have to fight with Clare

and why is her name a spoiler? it's obvious who she is ( i haven' tread the manga) + if you look at her suit, u can see her symbol. Anyway if you looked at the preview in the last episode..it clearly shows that she is here to help/ hurt clare :P

Anh_Minh

2007-07-18, 14:28

The sub is out.

As for Galatea's policy, I guess she'd have liked to be "Galatea of the Faint Smile", but she just wasn't strong enough.

Azure King

2007-07-18, 14:35

Claymore should be released once a day and not once a week, i can't get enough of claymore!! :bow:

B-day

2007-07-18, 14:39

"Abyss" is a better translation for 深淵 than "deep", I prefer Abyssal ones or persons of the abyss.Plus they sound real cool, some mysterious, powerful beings. While Dwellers of the deep is like a group of coal miners:p

Galatea the "Beauty Queen". her beauty policy, haha, too funny.

toxic_trance

2007-07-18, 14:41

saravis

2007-07-18, 15:12

Dwellers of the Deep, lol, sounds like the name of a Dwarven Clan.

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 15:22

Anyway, great episode and Galatea sounded like I imagined, a matured, pretty if slightly vain female warrior. And I was glad she did not have a hint of high pitch Japanese schoolgirl voice. Her style of fighting struck me as standoffish, preferred to avoid any bloody mess in close range as possible.

I see they already running out of budget. Maybe less action in next ep? Action wise, it has less impact compared to episode 7.

And I do agree with most people here that leaving out the monologue somewhat lessens the pathos of Jean has go thru in this story arc. Riful is manipulative and wise beyond her looks. Great combination for an adversary.

Seska

2007-07-18, 15:37

Hmm..kind of dissappointed because the manga kept me much more excited..plus Galatea didnt look very good in this episode. Animation and pacing both fell short of my expectations..all i am hoping is that next week satisfies my appetite for some action :)

Give the Young Animators a change, will ya? :)

Well, in Close Up, that faces was good drawn. And for some VirtualDub users there... Take the RAW and add Filter (Sharpen 46) and the quali rise a bit...

cors8

2007-07-18, 15:55

I'm sad they left out the line about Priscilla's actions. They kept Jean's response to Riful but it just wasn't the same without the full monologue.

Still a good episode though.

Goofus Maximus

2007-07-18, 16:17

Claymore should be released once a day and not once a week, i can't get enough of claymore!! :bow:

If they did that, the animation would be stick-figures...

NoSanninWa

2007-07-18, 16:24

And what are Galatea's policies regarding beauty? I DEMAND someone tell me, even if it is a manga spoiler that would end up getting you banned! She needs to be NUMBAH WAN of her very own Elite Vain Claymore Squad, who do all Claymore duties beautifully and elegantly in accordance to Galatea's beauty policy.:naughty:

It's not a manga spoiler, pretty much exactly the same thing was said in the manga. It just needs a little thought. What she means is that when she releases her youki her face gets veiny and her body becomes more muscular. She simply finds this unattractive and it offends her vanity.

She's just vain.

Dwellers of the Deep, lol, sounds like the name of a Dwarven Clan.I am a little curious why Eclipse chose this translation instead of Viz's Abyssal Ones. "Dwellers of the Deep" calls up connotations of Lord of the Rings or HP Lovecraft to me.

I'm sad they left out the line about Priscilla's actions. They kept Jean's response to Riful but it just wasn't the same without the full monologue.

Still a good episode though.These may appear in the next episodes, so please lets not get into details. Yeah, both these dialogues were simplied... a bit too much. Though I can see serious reasons to save the discussion of Priscilla for next episode.

Mentar

2007-07-18, 16:32

I am a little curious why Eclipse chose this translation instead of Viz's Abyssal Ones. "Dwellers of the Deep" calls up connotations of Lord of the Rings or HP Lovecraft to me.

Have any Viz translations come so far? I think those were only scanlations, not 100% sure though.

Anyway, the translator said that he didn't like the idea to use "abyss" in adjective form. So he decided to go with this version.

Kinematics

2007-07-18, 16:36

"Dwellers of the Deep" calls up connotations of Lord of the Rings or HP Lovecraft to me.

Yep, I was thinking "deep ones" as well. Should be a "Deep One of the East" named Watley. Hmm.. Wonder what the name of the head of the Organization is? :)

Kinematics

2007-07-18, 16:39

Have any Viz translations come so far? I think those were only scanlations, not 100% sure though.

Yes. Volume 8, pages 181-184, Galatea's explanation and description of Riful included "Ever since, the three have not appeared openly, and have come to be called the Creatures of the Abyss". Other references continued to use that phrase.

NoSanninWa

2007-07-18, 16:43

Have any Viz translations come so far? I think those were only scanlations, not 100% sure though.

Anyway, the translator said that he didn't like the idea to use "abyss" in adjective form. So he decided to go with this version.

Actually Viz has released volume 8. I suspect that their editor had the same problem about using Abyss as an adjective. As a result they use the term "Creature of the Abyss." So Riful's full title in chapter 45 is "Creature of the Abyss, Riful of the West."

As an editor I can certainly understand the reluctance to turn a noun into an adjective, but when it sounds best, that is sufficient reason for me. That is part of language also. I suspect your translator also despises colloquialisms, eh?

Mentar

2007-07-18, 16:51

*shrug*

Well, I'm not going to debate this issue. It's been the translator's decision, it was a conscious one, I can understand the reasoning behind it, and it's his prerogative to make the call. Whoever doesn't like it can easily adjust the mkv softsubs to suit his taste. Or fansub his own version :)

Shinen

2007-07-18, 17:03

Yep, I was thinking "deep ones" as well. Should be a "Deep One of the East" named Watley. Hmm.. Wonder what the name of the head of the Organization is? :)

His name is Limt or Rimuto in Katakana, possibly named after Gustav "Klimt", whose paintings were used in the Elfenlied OP. He just appeared in last week's episode (the credits list him as "head of the organization").

Deathkillz

2007-07-18, 17:13

moving away from the "whats right and whats wrong" subject i did like this line ~ a rather creative gag methinks ;)

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/4717/snapshot20070718231655av3.th.jpg (http://img444.imageshack.us/my.php?image=snapshot20070718231655av3.jpg)

sometimes "big guy" just doesnt have enough dramatic impact...i hope to see "big foot" next XD

Sordes Pilosus

2007-07-18, 17:17

I noticed also they corrected the only "FLAW/Mistake" about Clare in this episode also that was present in the manga (That i noticed). Im not sure if it can be considered actualy a spoiler or not so ill put it in a spoiler tag. Its something Clare said when seaing Riful's Youki strenght. In the manga she said something that dident make sense. It being removed like this is for the better.

She mentioned she had seen sutch a powerfull Youki signature once before. And Galatea replied that she was surprised Clare was even alive after encountering once. And she said it was something she hoped to boast about if she gets out of this alive herself.

But when Clare saw Pricilla she was stil a child and not a Claymore. There was no way for her to be able to see Pricilla's streanght at the time. So it never made any sense to me. The way its been redone here regarding how Clare attacks Riful and the parts that was removed was for the better. But the conversation between Jeane and Riful being cut i dident like :(

Also as a whole i loved the episode. We finaly get to see more of Galatea and Riful. Cant wait til next week :)

Nightbat®

2007-07-18, 17:58

Well, what was wrong with todays episode?:

Absolutely nothing!

:D

When Clare entered the cave/chasm the first thing that popped in my mind was
"How are the writers gonna torture her/what parts is she gonna lose this time" :D
What a 'joy' it was to this time see her get her leg crushed :heh:, not to mention she gets to inspect the
carpet up close AGAIN
(these girls could keep 10 bloodbanks running for a year if I see what they can do without btw)

It actually struck me as odd Galatea wanted to leave with just Clare, while Jean was still 'hanging around'
Yeah, yeah, that was her assignment and one could argue leaving Jean as Yomarecruit would be a better choice
than getting killed saving her

Dauff/Dafu/Duff wasn't a 'crybaby', He's 'sensitive'
I mean: it takes a lot more than candy and stuffed animals to win a loli's heart:D:D:p
Like the previous male AO he's also armored, to a better degree though
and litteraly a tough nut to crack
But it's too bad he lost his 'threat'-level when Riful appeared, and he was demoted to simple 'Muscle'
While when he was killing kathia, he was ominous and actually frightning

So Riful is an AO? An a early #1 claymore to boot
Her creating an army going to war with the other 'those-that-stay-where-the-sun-don't-shine' means
trouble for the Org
Sure, the 3 natural disasters will keep busy with eachother for a while, but it'll probably be surrounded
by death and destruction for the 'common people' (not to mention an army marches on it's stomach)
and to the victor go the spoils I believe is the saying

Galatea is taking a big risk thinking taking out Dauf will get a cease-fire with her
Riful is recruiting Claymores, taking out Dauff would mean she'd need a replacement
(and she has 3 potential candidates lined up)

Seems we can forget about Jean though, I must say with this that the Claymore's encountered are beginning
to look like '99 bottles of beer on the wall'

and then ofcourse, Galatea :naughty:
Some say she's vain, but unlike Theresa/Irene/Ophelia, she's somehow misses Arrogance
(I'm not saying she isn't arrogant though)
Cracked me up that she 'apologized' to Dauff for releasing her yoki and thereby altering her appearance
to a somewhat 'less than attractive' sight
(though many a fanboy would still fantasize of jumping her being like that, not to mention the Yuri Fanfics
her 'masculant body' will spawn:heh:)
Getting her a** rescued by Clare was cool to see, helping Clare to regain hersel was the least she could do

Well, the arc isn't over yet
very enthusiastic about what will happen in the next Ep

....it's gonna be a long wait :(

Goofus Maximus

2007-07-18, 18:19

I think Clare now leads the race, for main characters who get "assisted" face-plantings. We need to start keeping count.

I didn't find Galatea's "deformed" face all that unwatchable myself... but then, I prefer the molten gold cat's-eyes to those usually dull-lead silver eyes anyhow.

TigerII

2007-07-18, 18:25

Amirali

2007-07-18, 18:27

She is above Clare both in yoki reading skill (Clare did not notice Riful until later when she was very close by). Also Galatea can actually manipulate yoki. And she cut off Daufs hand while Clare's flashsword could not even scratch him.

And this was all without ' golden eye mode'. But I admit that the difference between her and Clare isn't as huge anymore as it used to be.

Galatea is definitely better at sensing macro-level yoki (things like long distance sensing, detecting presences, etc). When it comes to combat yoki reading, that is detection of enemy's finer movements, sword swings, attacks, etc......well we haven't seen any direct evidence, one way or the other.

She was able to cut off Dauf's hand because she could sense his vulnerable spots (as she herself says) rather than just a brute strength increase over Clare. But that ability to read weak spots suggests she might be able to read yoki movements in the same way Clare does? I guess we'll see soon.

Something is bothering me about Clare in this ep'

When she first "awoke" to cure her leg and to save Galatea. Galatea using her "Yoki control" managed to bring her back. But in the manga I felt like it was Irene's arm which broke the awaken processus by puting the blade under Clare's neck.

So... Anyone felt the same or am I smoking too much tea leaves ? :heh:
I thought Irene's arm was a main reason which made Clare couldn't control her Yoki liked before. I believed that Irene's arm still has some of remaining Yoki from Irene. So it was harder for Clare to stop the awakening process, IMO.

I thought u had a point blablabla. The animation suggested Irene's arm was reacting differently to her first near-awakening. Clare kept gripping it and looking at it during the process, and the camera was focused on the arm the whole time. Don't know if that means the arm was inhibiting her awakening, or instead hastening it, or what......hopefully we'll find out more later. Anyway, no denying Galatea played a big role in keeping Clare from turning. (btw, what happens when u smoke tea leaves? Really, I don't know)

but he does cry a lot and he does let a little girl push him around as well.

His crying is moe..........as for whether Riful is just a coldhearted bully who pushes him around.....I'd like to think that she was being mean and bluffing about breaking up only to motivate him. Reminds me how the heroine attacks the shounen hero whenever he starts feeling self-pity (Rukia and Ichigo in bleach, for example). Maybe she's not interfering with Dauf's fight because she values his pride, and wants him not to be reliant on her? (Again, classical shounen here).

Anh_Minh

2007-07-18, 18:32

Gsus

2007-07-18, 18:42

I have a new theory that this episode reinforced. Not all awakend beings are what you would consider 'evil'. While some do go on rampages, some actually settle down and try to keep to themselves. I believe the organization is probably the most corrupt and evil one out there. But of course all organizations who are shady are like that, lol.

Well, I don't think the organization is evil per se. Amoral, perhaps.

- Claymores on the verge of awakening are a liability. Develop a craving for guts and killing possible customers? Bad, mkay.
- Yoma aren't hunted to extinction by the Organization. They will of course accept payment to get rid of them, but destroying your job opportunities? Bad.
- Claymores are your workforce and merchandise. Keep them trained and up to date with the current Yoma threat. Research and development has to be done.
- Awakened ones and "Dwellers of the Deep" keep largely to themselves. No profit in going after them, losing your workforce is not good, considering how much effort went into them.

Anyway, very good episode. Duff was kind of funny. Awakened One, but still a man. How many times did he say he was going to rip their clothes off? And even the strongest Awakened One is putty in the hands of a loli.
Duff made this episode, too bad he'll probably be sliced and diced in the conclusion of this arc.

cors8

2007-07-18, 18:44

Settled down or not, they eat upwards of 30 people a year. Each.

Do they do that out of necessity for food or pleasure?

Humans are known to kill even when they don't need the food.

ArmisaelXVIII

2007-07-18, 18:45

Simply a Great Episode. Though there were some facial expression looked weird (In some parts Galatea seems as if she has an eyelid more closed than the other O.o)

I enjoyed a lot this Episode.

Clare and Galatea seem in a very bad situation. I can't see them getting out of it. And the awakening of Jean doesn't help. I wonder if she has some especial ability because Galatea said that they needed someone "who can strike a sword inta that rigid body of [Duff]".

I though Jean would be another case of turning out into a half-awakened claymore, but she seems completely awakened.

It'd be interesting if Clare tried to learn that trick of Galatea.

PS: I hope Clare doesn't get dismembered this time :P

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 18:54

Do they do that out of necessity for food or pleasure?

Humans are known to kill even when they don't need the food.

It is simply the fact they have humans for food makes them enemies of mankind straight away. Nothing more, nothing less.

Kinematics

2007-07-18, 18:54

His name is Limt or Rimuto in Katakana, possibly named after Gustav "Klimt", whose paintings were used in the Elfenlied OP.

Awww.. no Watleys, then? Dunno, though, I still think he had a bit of a deep one look. Probably too much of a history playing Call of Cthulu.

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 18:56

All Claymore top people named after artists. For some weird reason.

Amirali

2007-07-18, 18:56

Anyway, very good episode. Duff was kind of funny. Awakened One, but still a man. How many times did he say he was going to rip their clothes off? And even the strongest Awakened One is putty in the hands of a loli.
Duff made this episode, too bad he'll probably be sliced and diced in the conclusion of this arc.

Riful is pretty openminded.........most girls would be jealous if their man wanted to go out and "play" with other females. Maybe its just because she knows that after Dauf's had his fun, she's where his heart truly lies?

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 18:58

Don't think any human females can satisfy him like a rare, Awaken One can.

Anh_Minh

2007-07-18, 18:58

Do they do that out of necessity for food or pleasure?

Humans are known to kill even when they don't need the food.
Yeah, hm, call me close-minded, but I have trouble moving past the "they eat people" thing.

bullrogg

2007-07-18, 19:13

galatea is pretty cool ^_^

SeijiSensei

2007-07-18, 19:30

First off, Kudos to all those who correctly figured out that Riful was an awakened.
Double Kudos to anyone who figured out what her rank was

Frankly, I thought it was obvious they both were awakened. What else would keep the story alive? The whole saga got a lot more interesting at that point. It was obvious Riful was pretty strong, stronger probably than any other AO we've seen including Dafu and almost certainly intelligent and experienced. But I didn't see the "awakened-number-one" thread coming in advance.

To those of you who after last weeks episode still thought she was just a cute innocent little girl
I think we should just generalize Kaioshin_Sama's view from games to shounen stories in general (taken from WanderingKnight's sig):
"Seriously if an enemy in a Japanese game is a little girl, you want to run." ~ by Kaioshin_Sama

You are right, his name IS Dafu in Katakana. But the pronunciation is close to "Duff", isn't it. Which gives his name a double bad meaning. Gosh...

When I heard "Duff," my mind flashed immediately to Homer (http://www.xtreme-simpsons.de/epipics/DABF16.jpg) and Barney (http://www.xtreme-simpsons.de/pics/grabpics/big/barney01.gif) from the Simpsons ("Duff" is, of course, the preferred brand of beer in Springfield). The similarities were amusing.

She is above Clare ... in yoki reading skill.... Also Galatea can actually manipulate yoki. And she cut off Daufs hand while Clare's flashsword could not even scratch him..... But I admit that the difference between her and Clare isn't as huge anymore as it used to be.

Perhaps the gap has narrowed somewhat, but I thought this episode showed how far Clare still has to go before she's on par with Galatea or, perhaps, any other single-digit Claymore.

What sold me most on this episode was Galatea's (usually warranted) dismissive treatment of Clare, and the subtle humor used throughout. Clare's ready to chase her tail at the mere mention of Priscilla. Riful's way too perceptive not to notice and exploit that in Clare and does so immediately. Galatea ends up putting Clare down (again). Clare still has a lot to learn it seems; hope she manages to figure it out in ten episodes. Galatea, despite having lost her principal advantage, still has a lot of power. Holding Clare back from awakening, despite Clare's own abilities in this department, was pretty impressive.

I was most confused by Riful's indifference to Clare's search for Jeane. Must Riful remain with Dauf to control him? I don't think so, since she did send him on his own after Clare. Perhaps Dauf needs Riful's support to defeat Galatea? That also seems unlikely since Dauf has apparently learned the magic attack that destroys Galatea's defenses. Maybe Riful needs (loves?) Dauf? As an AO, her dance card's pretty short, and Dauf's probably on the list. Dauf presumably has the same needs as Riful (whatever they may be). So If Riful is attached to Dauf, perhaps she's not as invincible as she might at first appear? Or, perhaps she's so powerful that she doesn't care whether Clare brings Jeane back or not. That's a scary thought.

As for the animation, this show consistently gets a "B" from me like most Madhouse shows, technically above-average but lacking that certain creative spark that earns an "A." I think the animation is more than adequate to support an excellent story and appealing characters (Raki included). People who have already read the manga might have animated the show in their imaginations and have found the actual product less appealing. I don't carry that burden.

I gave this episode a nine; it's probably my favorite so far. The encounter with Riful enrichens the plot, and the writing has a sense of humor not often found in these scripts.

cors8

2007-07-18, 19:33

This is like a game for Riful. Also, she's also well aware of Jean's current situation, as implied at the end and the previews for next week.

Salamandra

2007-07-18, 19:35

Perhaps the gap has narrowed somewhat, but I thought this episode showed how far Clare still has to go before she's on par with Galatea or, perhaps, any other single-digit Claymore.

Remember what Miria said. There's a large gap between 6-9 and the top 5. Clare already killed #5 awakened Ophelia, although with Ophelia not exactly trying her best to kill Clare.

So, #9 (the lowest single digit Claymore... happens to be Jean) is by no means the same as Galatea, even though they're both single digits.

Negativedark

2007-07-18, 19:39

Don't think any human females can satisfy him like a rare, Awaken One can.

Actually after all the female generations their could now be more female Awakened than male. Or maybe she doesn't mind him playing around, heck she might like to watch. Oh no, this is getting a little too perverse.
And let it be known the one thing you cannot expect Claire to act rationally on is Priscilla.

guest

2007-07-18, 19:41

Why did Precilla team up with that north guy? I thought she was more like a free spirit, eat and kill as she liked, but not under someone's command.

Maybe....she is his girlfriend now, like Riful and Dauf? :confused: So awaken ones do desire romantic relationship, in other word, closer to humans than claymores? When was the last you see a claymore had a boyfriend? :eyebrow:

Thank you for your fast sub, ecplise. I am really happy now. :D

xVxObliVioNxVx

2007-07-18, 19:53

Remember what Miria said. There's a large gap between 6-9 and the top 5. Clare already killed #5 awakened Ophelia, although with Ophelia not exactly trying her best to kill Clare.

Well Ophelia is #4. Although #5 (Rafeal I think her name was?) is apparantly stronger, perhaps even the strongest, according to Irene's calculations.

Maybe....she is his girlfriend now, like Riful and Dauf? :confused: So awaken ones do desire romantic relationship, in other word, closer to humans than claymores? When was the last you see a claymore had a boyfriend? :eyebrow:

Raki and Clare seem pretty romatically close concedering the kiss they had before they got seperated.

TigerII

2007-07-18, 19:53

Even if they eat humans...they have to eat. I don't hold them against that. But I don't hold anything against the claymore for killing them. Besides the Awakends who just kill for fun(Same could be said for a few claymores), I don't see good and bad as black and white. But yeah, it would be stupid for humans to say, but they are eating humans when they turn around and eat animals. Maybe the animals should hire claymore type creatures, half animal..half human.....lol.

Garet Jax

2007-07-18, 19:57

Remember what Miria said. There's a large gap between 6-9 and the top 5. Clare already killed #5 awakened Ophelia, although with Ophelia not exactly trying her best to kill Clare.

So, #9 (the lowest single digit Claymore... happens to be Jean) is by no means the same as Galatea, even though they're both single digits.

I thought it was interesting at 19:10, though, when Galatea said (Eclipse sub) about beating Duff/Dafu "For that, we absolutely need one more force with us. One that can strike a sword into that rigid body of his." She seems to be saying pretty clearly that without Jeane, they aren't going to win, and not just for having an extra fighter. Even being #9, her special ability must be potent, at least in this situation. Armor-piercing strike specialist?

Kouvley

2007-07-18, 20:14

More interesting developments in this ep with the introduction of 3 new groups lead by former no.1 Awakened Ones. The important news being that Priscilla has been recruited by one of them.

Poor Clare's plans for revenge seems like it just got harder. :heh:

Galatea's skill was nice although a little too easy to bypass.

Becoming an AO doesn't seem so bad anymore. From the earlier eps I was under the impression that AO's had embraced their yoma side and just became overpowered yomas with eating humans their number one priority but the recent eps has shown us otherwise. Apart from a new appetite for human guts, they are still very much human themselves with the full range of emotions and the ability to think intelligently.
So with enough will power could an AO become...............vegetarian? :heh:

Or do they actually die if they don't eat humans?

TigerII

2007-07-18, 20:26

What I said..AOs are not..evil minded monster who kill for fun...well some are not. They are still very much in control. As I said, the good guys and bad guys are not in black in white.

Maybe they could survive eating beef?

xVxObliVioNxVx

2007-07-18, 20:51

Pork is the closest thing to human flesh. Perhaps Yoma and AO's can eat pork instead. But where is the fun in that?:p

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 20:54

It is specifically said that Awaken Ones eat only human insides. Nothing else.

There it automatically make them natural enemy of mankind, did not matter if they kill for food or fun.

TigerII

2007-07-18, 21:00

Did it say they have to eat only humans or they only eat. Maybe if they try with all their might they can eat something else...........lol.

Still does not mean they are 'bad' or 'evil'. Humans are enemies to everything living(Maybe not at this time era, but now we are).

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-18, 21:46

I am just quoting from the manga, my German tank friend. Did not matter. As long they eat human, they are enemy of humans. Simple mathematics.

Echoes

2007-07-18, 21:53

Negativedark

2007-07-18, 21:55

Does it have to be fresh? Because if not some cleaver mortician is about to make a fortune.

guest

2007-07-18, 22:02

Poor Clare's plans for revenge seems like it just got harder. :heh:

At this point, I don't even see how she can achieve her goal. :rolleyes:
Galatea's skill was nice although a little too easy to bypass.
Yeah, I was like, "and this is No. 3?" :( A no. 3 can only control her opponent's yoki to such a small extent?

I think this generation really can't compare to Teresa's generation.

Panzerklein

2007-07-18, 22:10

Salamandra

2007-07-18, 22:14

Well Ophelia is #4. Although #5 (Rafeal I think her name was?) is apparantly stronger, perhaps even the strongest, according to Irene's calculations.

Damn. Totally forgot. I never consider Raphaela as being #5, since it's obviously not at all relevant to her power. Since Ilena does say "No, I'd only have a chance with both arms, probably". Seeing as Ilena >>> Ophelia (very obviously), and Ilena still wouldn't stand a chance in the state she was when she owned Ophelia... Raphaela >>>> Ophelia.

Kinematics

2007-07-18, 22:19

Yeah, I was like, "and this is No. 3?" A no. 3 can only control her opponent's yoki to such a small extent?

The fact that she can control her opponent's yoki at all (even if only slight nudges) is devastating when used subtly. She was just showing off, here, and got called on it. Plus she said she had one other ace up her sleeve, which was that her power scaled up faster than any other Claymore. In other words, she's more efficient at converting raw yoki into raw power. She's certainly not one to be taken lightly.

Salamandra

2007-07-18, 22:22

The name Dwellers of the Deep is not good at all. I didn't even consider that they might change Abyssal One to something else... but that's much worse.

Yorae_paladin1

2007-07-18, 22:23

Awakened Ones seem to take pleasure in slaughtering and eating humans, though. And even if eating humans doesn't necessarily make them evil, it makes them the natural enemy of mankind, and fully justifies killing them under any circumstances.
And the point about humans eating other animals is sort of moot, we don't each other, and if there was another species which possessed the same level of intelligence or awareness as us (or even anything close to that), I doubt we would eat them in this day and age. (Yes, some people eat monkeys, but still.)

This was definitely a 10/10 episode for me, though. I watched with awestruck eyes and I can't wait for the next one.
Oh, and I loved, loved, loved Galatea, definitely looking forward of seeing more of her. And I don't mind her post-Yoki-release face one bit. ^__^

Well it seems awakened maybe intelligent but there mind set is pure monster in other words its overshadowed by bestial urges.Yoma mentality seems to be survivalist one peace with them is not a posibility so I guess if a human kills them they won't be sad its just survival so mankind has only one choice the complete and utter eradication of yoma. But we know the org won't do this but maybe clare decides to change the rules who knows.

Gavrielo

2007-07-18, 22:30

As for the animation, this show consistently gets a "B" from me like most Madhouse shows, technically above-average but lacking that certain creative spark that earns an "A." I think the animation is more than adequate to support an excellent story and appealing characters (Raki included). People who have already read the manga might have animated the show in their imaginations and have found the actual product less appealing. I don't carry that burden.

I gave this episode a nine; it's probably my favorite so far. The encounter with Riful enrichens the plot, and the writing has a sense of humor not often found in these scripts.

Tbh, The animation is amazing compared to Bleach, Naruto and even Death Note.
I'd give MADHOUSE an A* for the animation, since it's the best animation compared to other recent anime series today, and not to mention the amazingly touching storyline of Clare, Teresa and Raki. The characters seem to have more depth in this anime. :D

guest

2007-07-18, 22:33

Plus she said she had one other ace up her sleeve, which was that her power scaled up faster than any other Claymore. In other words, she's more efficient at converting raw yoki into raw power. She's certainly not one to be taken lightly.
Isn't that just to buy time for Clare to save Jean? Riful says so herself. I trust her judgement because she is one of the three power. She would misjudge Clare because she is the main character here :D, but not Galatea, I think.

dxanato

2007-07-18, 22:43

The name Dwellers of the Deep is not good at all. I didn't even consider that they might change Abyssal One to something else... but that's much worse.

I don't mind the name that much. It has Chtulhu kind influence to it I think.

The fact that she can control her opponent's yoki at all (even if only slight nudges) is devastating when used subtly. She was just showing off, here, and got called on it. Plus she said she had one other ace up her sleeve, which was that her power scaled up faster than any other Claymore. In other words, she's more efficient at converting raw yoki into raw power. She's certainly not one to be taken lightly.

Upon hearing those words in retrospect. I think she was saying that to make Duff confuse and for him to second guess himself which open up her chance of confusing even more. Rifu only further confirm that she was only buying time.

SebaZ

2007-07-18, 23:26

Tbh, The animation is amazing compared to Bleach, Naruto and even Death Note.
it isnt imho, I find Claymore's animation pretty mediocre. The art is really good though

Flora20709

2007-07-18, 23:36

Well I Think The ANimation Is Great Better THen Bleach And Naruto
But Cant Say Its Better Then Death Note

thundrakkon

2007-07-18, 23:38

Clare and Galatea seem in a very bad situation. I can't see them getting out of it. And the awakening of Jean doesn't help. I wonder if she has some especial ability because Galatea said that they needed someone "who can strike a sword inta that rigid body of [Duff]".

I though Jean would be another case of turning out into a half-awakened claymore, but she seems completely awakened.

It is not absolutely certain that Jean has awakened. For all we know, the awakened being could be the other claymore laying in an almost dead state. Or it could be Riful's form.

cors8

2007-07-18, 23:46

It is not absolutely certain that Jean has awakened. For all we know, the awakened being could be the other claymore laying in an almost dead state. Or it could be Riful's form.

It can't be Riful's form. We already get a glimpse of the Abyssal Ones' true forms when Galatea is talking about it and Riful's doesn't match.

The other Claymore laying on the ground is already dead.

The only logical conclusion would be Jean.

Kinematics

2007-07-18, 23:55

Isn't that just to buy time for Clare to save Jean? Riful says so herself. I trust her judgement because she is one of the three power. She would misjudge Clare because she is the main character here , but not Galatea, I think.

Certainly she's only buying time. But she's buying time against one of the Abyssals (who admittedly may not get too involved in the fight) and her associate, who's extremely powerful himself. The fact that she could even consider doing that solo speaks well of her abilities.

Upon hearing those words in retrospect. I think she was saying that to make Duff confuse and for him to second guess himself which open up her chance of confusing even more. Rifu only further confirm that she was only buying time.

Hmm.. There is that. Certainly the opening banter was to unbalance Dauf, and probably didn't worry too much about subtlety since the initial plan was to leave rather than fight, and to get out before Riful got involved. So yes, was probably a bit much to say she was "showing off". Still, with a tactical ability like that, plus a very strong power-up on her yoki release, it's unlikely that very many Awakened Ones could beat her in a one-on-one.

FlareKnight

2007-07-19, 00:25

I don't really mind the 'dwellers of the deep' bit, though I keep seeing them as an arm of dwarves. Some reason it just sounds like something from LOTR to me. :)

Well I can't blame Galatea for wanting to grab Clare and go. On one hand you've got Dauf who's pretty tough to take down because of that armored shell. Then you've got Riful below, so frankly going after Jean just isn't worth it. It was pretty much a suicide mission on Clare's part (not that I'm blaming her she had to try and help plus she didn't know how dangerous the situation was).

Kind've strange with Clare coming in all cool and confident, then suddenly she's down with broken legs. That mystique really got taken down pretty quickly I've got to say.

I knew Riful was AO but damn didn't expect her to be a former #1 Claymore. There goes my thinking (probably a bit naives) that Priscilla was the top one out there. Looks like she met her match while on her 'rampage' and now is dating? Knew Clare was going to snap after hearing about her.

Don't think we should knock the generation too badly. Noel and Sophia were both in the top 5 and didn't have mindblowing special abilities. Teresa, Priscilla, and Irene certainly had some really great skills. We haven't seen all that this generation has yet so maybe we should hold back a bit. Besides Galatea's ability is pretty useful if the opponent isn't smart enough to figure out how do get around it.

Let's not give up on Jean yet. Yes it appears she's fully awakened by the form we've seen. But clearly she's still not completely there since she does want to be killed still. Have to hope she can pull back since without her special power (whatever that is) Clare and Galatea aren't getting out of this in one piece. Riful I don't think is all that concerned since no force they can call upon can topple her. If Dauf is in a state to lose and she really cares about him she might intervene but let them go since they've done a good job.

TigerII

2007-07-19, 00:32

O, I never said that humans were not justified. I was just wondering if sort of..a treaty could be reached. Because the organization fights Yoma, but they create the most dangerous ones. It is a never ending cycle.

whitepearl

2007-07-19, 00:40

Not bad of an episode when you ignore the weird-looking faces.

My thoughts (http://thepottybox.wordpress.com/2007/07/19/claymore-episode-16%e2%80%94the-witchs-maw-part-2/#more-72)

FlareKnight

2007-07-19, 00:58

Well if the organization is evil (well about as evil as any capitalist organization is, which can be pretty evil) then they won't want a treaty. You kill some yoma, that brings in the cash. Kill all of them out and you lose your money and since these guys wouldn't want to transfer themselves to a new business sector they keep them around. AO pop up which can be an issue, but also that's a source of revenue since orders will of course come in to kill them too.

I was also curious if the AO could only eat human flesh. As in if they ate anything else they'd starve to death. Yes I'm sure humans taste better and we can all understand going for quality goods. But maybe if they could eat something else there could be some way to resolve things without massive conflict. Come on can't someone in that world invent condiments? Some ketchup can solve the issue :).

I can understand the yoma and AO eating humans since we also eat creatures it's how things are. But I just draw the line at eating sentient creatures.

Bloodseeker

2007-07-19, 01:25

Galatea seems cool.

And that guy up north has pretty crappy tastes in women.

Tom Bombadil

2007-07-19, 01:43

I was also curious if the AO could only eat human flesh. As in if they ate anything else they'd starve to death.

I think that's just how the story is set up. The AO eats human because the mangaka
wants them to. Just like in a vampire story you would have vampires drinking bloods.
Vampires don't need reason to suck blood, do they?

KiNA

2007-07-19, 01:47

Galatea seems cool.

And that guy up north has pretty crappy tastes in women.

I hit Pricilla.. She's cute, And if you consider that Riful returned to human form, its not far fetch that Pricilla might have a human form too when she's not out for dinner/lunch/breakfast :D

Bloodseeker

2007-07-19, 02:04

I hit Pricilla.. She's cute, And if you consider that Riful returned to human form, its not far fetch that Pricilla might have a human form too when she's not out for dinner/lunch/breakfast :D

Priscilla could trade bodies with Mikuru and she'd still suck ass.

Well, I might have to give her a little leniency then, but you get the idea. :uhoh:

Priscilla's problem is her personality and low fighting tactics. If Ophelia was any indication, they retain most of their personality after awakening. Priscilla might have grown up a little since then, but she's still going to be cheap.

KiNA

2007-07-19, 02:11

Vulcannis

2007-07-19, 02:47

It will be interesting to see what happens with #9 next episode. Either Clare gets her to help, or ends up fighting her. If Clare fights her, then nothing really changes--she'll have just wasted some time while Galatea tires out. So, baring a silly shounen power up from Clare after such a fight, I'm going to assume #9 somehow helps out. That'll be really interesting if she has indeed awakened, though I guess Clare might be able to bring her back. I wonder what's going to happen in the future now though, with Clare's awakening out of the bag. Unless Galatea keeps that fact to herself kinda like she did at the end of the Slashers.

It would seem that Abyssal North has had a change of behaviour since hooking up with Priscilla... maybe she's just rubbing off on him, but it would be cooler if she's quietly assumed power.

As for Galatea having the exact same power as Clare (and Theresa), I don't think so. If she did, wouldn't she be higher than 3? From the way Irena explained how it all worked, it sounded like that really was Theresa's only major ability and that it was more than sufficient to make her #1, with her high yoki level just being icing.

saravis

2007-07-19, 02:51

Most women assume power in a relationship, even I as a guy can admit that.

Bloodseeker

2007-07-19, 03:00

Priscilla is a naive girl.. Clare repeating the very same mistake as she did in this episode.. and if its wasn't for Galatea, she's an Awaken One now as well...

Would you mind explaining which part of her personality that bothers you? She hates Youma because her father was eaten by a youma who then eat her siblings (after shapeshifthing into the father's persona) in front of her, and her low fighting skill is due to her inexperience and young claymore status..

Priscilla was young, but she wasn't so young that she should still be seeing the world in black and white like that. I'm not saying the teenagers aren't usually somewhat naive, I know I was (despite thinking that I was some kind of exception to the rule and rolling my eyes at it at the time), but kids usually start thinking for themselves, viewing the world in different shades of gray somewhat, and realizing that authority and society is human too and therefor isn't always right and good right around the time that they hit puberty, at least when they're not sheltered and brought up in a protected environment that encourages that kind of thinking. Priscilla was old enough that she should have had the mental maturity to take the kind of hint that Teresa dropped and figure out that maybe there was more to the situation than she had been told. Its not like she was a loli. (of course, Teresa suffered from the common anime character issue of not being able to be straight forward and spell things out when she needs to... if she had told her the circumstances, Priscilla's stupid ideals would have been shaken up)

But my biggest problem with her is just how cheap she was. That was no way for Teresa to die.

KiNA

2007-07-19, 03:13

Naiveity(<- a word?) goes a long way, my friend :D

I think you just pissed off at her because of her cheap shot way to beat Theresa :D

Amirali

2007-07-19, 03:28

The fact that she can control her opponent's yoki at all (even if only slight nudges) is devastating when used subtly. She was just showing off, here, and got called on it. Plus she said she had one other ace up her sleeve, which was that her power scaled up faster than any other Claymore. In other words, she's more efficient at converting raw yoki into raw power. She's certainly not one to be taken lightly.

It reminds me of the fight between fab four and the male awakened being back in eps 10-11. Miria tried to save her power up (phantom mirage) for the killing blow, to maintain advantage of surprise. Given that Galatea's other combat skills are so high, that would probably be her best chance as well. Wear down enemy with other abilities as much as possible, and then use her manipulation at a crucial moment to get the kill. She gave away that ace in her sleeve early on (yoki manipulation seems pretty useless once the enemy catches onto it) , but maybe she has some other, even more powerful surprise?

As for a deal between awakened ones and the organization..........instead of convincing AOs to eat non-human flesh (fat chance), why not just feed them all the prisoners on death row for crimes like murder and rape? Would keep everyone happy.

Anh_Minh

2007-07-19, 03:35

Don't think we should knock the generation too badly. Noel and Sophia were both in the top 5 and didn't have mindblowing special abilities. Teresa, Priscilla, and Irene certainly had some really great skills. We haven't seen all that this generation has yet so maybe we should hold back a bit. Besides Galatea's ability is pretty useful if the opponent isn't smart enough to figure out how do get around it.

Agreed. Noelle probably wouldn't have been able to do much more than scratching Duff. And Sophia would be dead, since they're both the gorilla type, but Duff is much, much better at it.

And even if someone figures out Galatea's ability... It still means he has to go all out for each and every blow. That means a big mental strain, and no little feints, no quick jabs... Well, those don't seem to be Duff's style anyway, but it could be more annoying depending on the opponent type.

KiNA

2007-07-19, 03:45

Her other surprise is that she hold the youma capacity the highest among the claymores.. but she hates being ugly, so thats why she uses the manipulation instead.. I mean, if she was to face Dauf alone.. I dont think Dauf is capable of knowing the secret himself ^^

Anh_Minh

2007-07-19, 03:48

As for Galatea having the exact same power as Clare (and Theresa), I don't think so. If she did, wouldn't she be higher than 3? From the way Irena explained how it all worked, it sounded like that really was Theresa's only major ability and that it was more than sufficient to make her #1, with her high yoki level just being icing.

Yes and no. Her gimmick was her reading of yoki to predict moves. But she also had 99% of Irene's speed, 99% of Noelle's agility, and 99% of Sophia's strength. It's all that that gave her the Number 1 spot.

I agree that Galatea's ability work in different ways, though.

It reminds me of the fight between fab four and the male awakened being back in eps 10-11. Miria tried to save her power up (phantom mirage) for the killing blow, to maintain advantage of surprise. Given that Galatea's other combat skills are so high, that would probably be her best chance as well. Wear down enemy with other abilities as much as possible, and then use her manipulation at a crucial moment to get the kill. She gave away that ace in her sleeve early on (yoki manipulation seems pretty useless once the enemy catches onto it) , but maybe she has some other, even more powerful surprise?
Galatea used her ability early because it relies on the mental state of the opponent. He has to be unsure of himself for it to work most effectively. So first you start with taunts and attitude to make him doubt, then you make him miss to further confuse him. And by then he's dancing in the palm of your hand. The more he misses, the more you control him. The more you control him, the more he misses.

As for a deal between awakened ones and the organization..........instead of convincing AOs to eat non-human flesh (fat chance), why not just feed them all the prisoners on death row for crimes like murder and rape? Would keep everyone happy.
Not enough of them? Besides, if you start doing that, you'll soon have a rebellion on your hands, when you try to convince the populace that a spitting on the ground is a crime grave enough to deserve being fed to the youmas, but that being a nobleman exercising his "prerogatives" on peasant women isn't.

WarzoneCommand

2007-07-19, 03:52

Great episode and Galatea is realy cool :D

After I watched I continued reading the manga, there were 2 things that cought my attention though. One being that in the anime Galatea was a lot more condesending towards Clare; for example the part where she told clare about Riful being the true boss around there; "Even you should be able to sense it" in the manga a line alike "You are pretty good at sensing Yoma, aren't you ? You should be able to sense it" apeared. There was an other line like that which gave me the Idea the manga Galatea seemed to be more interesting in clare as a person. I'm wondering what will come of it. ( Or maybe I'm just nitpicking on this )

herbert

2007-07-19, 04:24

As for a deal between awakened ones and the organization..........instead of convincing AOs to eat non-human flesh (fat chance), why not just feed them all the prisoners on death row for crimes like murder and rape? Would keep everyone happy.
It is not that easy. First of all how can you convince AB only eat what you give to them? So far, ABs seem to be proud and believing in their power. Hard to believe they like to be fed as pets to make peace with mankind. As for the food preference, they like human's entails more than anything else, but it does not mean all human are same to them. It is safe to assume their preference is similiar to Yumo, so they prefer soft flesh to tough meat, prefer youth to elder, prefer female to male. If ABs believe they can wander freely and get their favorite food, why bother to eat those criminals who are most likely to be tasteless middle-aged men.

IMSabbel

2007-07-19, 04:28

Priscilla could trade bodies with Mikuru and she'd still suck ass.

Well, I might have to give her a little leniency then, but you get the idea. :uhoh:

Priscilla's problem is her personality and low fighting tactics. If Ophelia was any indication, they retain most of their personality after awakening. Priscilla might have grown up a little since then, but she's still going to be cheap.

Because of the singly cheap shot at theresa?
Arent you forgetting that she was more chivalric about the fight to begin with?

You could easily say the same (low tactics, cheap) about irene&co, because they planned her to backstab theresa out of "stealth mode".

Amirali

2007-07-19, 04:30

Galatea used her ability early because it relies on the mental state of the opponent. He has to be unsure of himself for it to work most effectively. So first you start with taunts and attitude to make him doubt, then you make him miss to further confuse him. And by then he's dancing in the palm of your hand. The more he misses, the more you control him. The more you control him, the more he misses.

Yeah, that makes sense when I think about it. In another context against a smarter enemy, I still think Galatea might try and hold the yoki manipulation back for a crucial moment. A smart Awakened Being would adjust to her techniques after some initial difficulty, rather than fall apart emotionally like Dauf did. Against a high level opponent (high level in terms of intellect, not necessarily power) , she won't get more than a few successful manipulations in, which is why she has to make them count.

Not enough of them? Besides, if you start doing that, you'll soon have a rebellion on your hands, when you try to convince the populace that a spitting on the ground is a crime grave enough to deserve being fed to the youmas, but that being a nobleman exercising his "prerogatives" on peasant women isn't.

We've had a lot of discussions on population of the Claymore world. If even a few thousand people are arrested for major crimes in that whole world every year , thats more than enough to bribe the Abyssals and highlevel AOs. In a whole continent, you could probably even find enough female and youth prisoners to satisfy the handful of AOs in existence. I am NOT suggesting they feed the yomas as well; that would be too much of a strain.......Claymores can easily handle those.

As far as a rebellion against feeding prisoners to yoma............well, its surprising how much injustice goes on in a medieval society. For instance, bonded labour still goes on in some societies today. A landlord gives a poor peasant a loan at exorbitant rates, cooks up some books and makes the guy work the whole of his life at slashed rates just to keep up with his debt servicing. Then when he dies, his children have to take up that bonded labour also. I could also give examples of honour killings, where women are executed in a few backward countries, for the mere suspicion of being friendly with a strange man. Right in the Claymore universe, you have the Org treating the Claymores like dirt. No rebellions have started against any of these miscarraiges of justice

Compared to that, I don't think its that offensive to feed highlevel criminals (murderers and rapists) to Awakened Ones.........I'm sure that a segment of population even in today's times would agree such people deserve to be eaten. The only problem I see with the idea is that the Awakened Ones have a inherently dismissive attitude of humanity , like herbert points out..........just giving them food as tribute wouldn't stop them from taking what they want, when they want.

IMSabbel

2007-07-19, 04:33

As for a deal between awakened ones and the organization..........instead of convincing AOs to eat non-human flesh (fat chance), why not just feed them all the prisoners on death row for crimes like murder and rape? Would keep everyone happy.

Well well, you can look at the early volumes of berserk for what happens in such a scenario (the snake-apostel baron did exactly the same, until they ran out of prisoners).

Not pretty, and definitivly more evil.

corkii

2007-07-19, 04:36

Wonderful episode, gave it a 10 (dont i always?)

btw, did anyone think that dauf/duff sounded more 'un-dumb' when galatea sliced the little jaw-joint on his face? well to me he sounded a tad smarter and a tiny bit faster

potchip

2007-07-19, 05:32

As for a deal between awakened ones and the organization..........instead of convincing AOs to eat non-human flesh (fat chance), why not just feed them all the prisoners on death row for crimes like murder and rape? Would keep everyone happy.

The main problem with that argument is: There's absolutely no point for the org to do that out of self interest.
That idea involves, mostly likely the org to admit 'oops, we made those claymores which in turn became bigger nastier AOs and sorry, you ordinary folks who used to pay us to kill smallfry yomas now gotta just cop it, tough!'

Not going to work...The org is powerful from the money it collects and the monopoly it controls in the perception that only they can deal with monsters. To say 'hey, let's negotiate' is like writing off the organisation's whole reason of existence.

Scep

2007-07-19, 05:36

EoT

2007-07-19, 05:40

Awesome episode.

Is the person who does Galatea's voice the same voice as the girl from Kiba who had red hair and was obsessed with Noa? it sounds alot like her :D

ArmisaelXVIII

2007-07-19, 05:43

May be Awakened Ones won't accept to be feed by humans. But that depends of the approach. They can make sacrifices to the Awakened Ones as if they were gods, but I don't think ABs in general were as vain as let their ego get high fot that. The other one is simply, send the sacrifice directly to the AB lair. As happened with the male AB that killed the claymores were sent to him, they'll just eat what is sent to them.

Probably AB would be able to eat anythin, at least they won't die poisoned for eating an apple. But It's organisms may reject to asimilate it, or may asimilate but since it don't cover their needs they would probable became weaker o ill. I'd be quite the same as trying to feed a crocodiles with vegetables.

Btw, The teacher of a friend of mine that is studying chemistry once said, referring to eating meat, that the closer that the proteins of that meat is to the proteins of your own flesh, it's better to assimilate. So they need flesh of a specie near to themselves and cannibalism would be an option too.

Anh_Minh
Noel's Ability was to have a lot of brute strength. It's said by Irene that Noel's strength is greater than Teresa's. Noel may be able to take on that skin by Brute Strength. And Galatea's Abilities doesn't seem specifically oriented to fight even though she is strong.

Still Teresa's Generation seems a bit "boring", comparing to new claymores. (As phamtom Miria, or what could be the ability of jean). But it seems that even if Teresa's Generation don't have special tricks they are more well rounded, but we didn't get to see it. Thanks Priscilla ¬¬

faustianideals

2007-07-19, 05:44

I gave it a 10, the fight scenes were very fun to watch, especially when Claire got too cocky and Duff messed her leg/ankle up. Did it look like Jeane awakened? I mean whatever was coming out of her body is proof enough, but what if she just goes back like Claire has been able to? I know Galatea could just take Jeane's yoki down to reasonable levels, but eh, they are away from one another. :(

Deathkillz

2007-07-19, 07:24

Interesting episode. Sadly from the episode preview jean has awakened, and i don't forsee an AO being clare's ally. Galatea seems a little weak if you ask me, but theres the possibility that her yoki powers also increase her ability to manipulate her opponent's yoki. When a number 3 and the main character can't take down a "grunt", though, i can't imagine the strength of riful. I dont see riful letting them leave the place easily.
that is what happens when your whole reputation kinda depends on your trump ability card ~ but she did say that when she releases her yoki that her powers are above the top seeds so her rank clearly isnt just for show...she doesnt use it often because it makes her look ugly (and i agree...dont use it! >_<) ~ loli chan is considered the strongest (or rather equal top strongest) awakened to have ever existed so she isnt going to be going down with mare tricks...unlike the big guy over there who has the brain size of a nut :rolleyes: and yea it seems like it is game over for jean :/ but maybe she can fight loli chan in her awakened form :O

HinaThePrince

2007-07-19, 07:45

Not a bad episode, I suppose. The art was terrible at times, but the pacing was good and it was fun to watch. But one thing that really irks me is the HUGE amount of dialogues they omitted - most of them were really important, too. The explanation about Galatea's power, the relationship between the man of the north and Priscilla, Riful explaining why humans suck - just a small section of the parts they omitted. What the hell. |:

http://img2.tapuz.co.il/forums/1_102444204.png

KiNA

2007-07-19, 07:52

^ Sigh.. so flat =_=

chrry370

2007-07-19, 08:31

grss1982

2007-07-19, 08:36

First of all, Let me just say it.

Galatea a.k.a Miss Claymore ROCKS the HOUSE!!! (well ok the CAVE!!!)

Love her this episode. :-)

B-day

2007-07-19, 08:38

Are we going to see more Galatea fanboys?

Echoes

2007-07-19, 08:42

I think the answer to that question is obviously, YES. I'm ready to sign up, for one.

ArmisaelXVIII

2007-07-19, 08:47

I'm glad to see that duff isn't completely dumb, when he couldn't hit Galatea the he just aimed else where.

I think Teresa could probably at least put up a fight agains an awakened priscilla. She could take down duff easily.

KiNA

2007-07-19, 08:53

First of all, Let me just say it.

Galatea a.k.a Miss Claymore ROCKS the HOUSE!!! (well ok the CAVE!!!)

Love her this episode. :-)
But but but.. it was Dauf that made the rock falls on (trapping Galatea and Clare).. So theorically, it should be Dauf that rock the cave!

:heh:

grss1982

2007-07-19, 09:18

But but but.. it was Dauf that made the rock falls on (trapping Galatea and Clare).. So theorically, it should be Dauf that rock the cave!

:heh:

:heh:

But still this episode really rocks. No wondetr I've forsaken Bleach for Claymore. :D

Seska

2007-07-19, 09:45

Argh, SMS-English... I hate it :) (o Rly Pic :))

FatPianoBoy

2007-07-19, 10:24

xVxObliVioNxVx

2007-07-19, 10:36

This marks the third time that someone has grabbed Clare by the back of the head and firmly planted her nose into a low, flat object such as the ground or a bed.
More than that, she never once protests. Is Clare becoming the new Shinji?

lol, I was about to post that. She apparantly is a problem child that needs looking over. She is way to arrogant and needs to be put in her place when she makes ignorant decisions. No wonder the organization wanted to dispose of her, with two failed attempts. At the current state she is mentally too weak and can't fully control her emotions.

Xellos-_^

2007-07-19, 10:46

^ Sigh.. so flat =_=

of course Riful is flat, she is a loli :eyebrow:

cf18

2007-07-19, 10:53

This marks the third time that someone has grabbed Clare by the back of the head and firmly planted her nose into a low, flat object such as the ground or a bed.
More than that, she never once protests. Is Clare becoming the new Shinji?

For all we know, all Claymore already went through hundreds of head smacking during their training, and it become a standard greeting for "let me teach you something" from the seniors.

Goofus Maximus

2007-07-19, 11:02

Do they do that out of necessity for food or pleasure?

Humans are known to kill even when they don't need the food.

From the way Ophelia acted, I think it's a sort of inborn craving or addiction. Human guts are the Cocaine or Catnip of Yoma and Awakened Beings.

Lendial

2007-07-19, 11:03

galatea holding clare in her arms was the highlight. also dauf crying like a baby because he couldnt impale galatea with his big veiny rods. i dont see why riful chose such a moron like dauf to be her "lover".

Goofus Maximus

2007-07-19, 11:04

Riful is pretty openminded.........most girls would be jealous if their man wanted to go out and "play" with other females. Maybe its just because she knows that after Dauf's had his fun, she's where his heart truly lies?

I can't wait to see the next episode. Hopefully they'll include the single chilling sentence that describes her attachment to Duff/Dauf/Dafu.

Defiled one

2007-07-19, 11:11

I doubt it. ^

KiNA

2007-07-19, 11:27

http://img2.tapuz.co.il/forums/1_102444204.png

^ Sigh.. so flat =_=

of course Riful is flat, she is a loli :eyebrow:

Does that look likes riful to you :eyebrow:

And I was refering how the drawing made her faces look soo flat =_=

Amirali

2007-07-19, 11:52

i dont see why riful chose such a moron like dauf to be her "lover".

It happens so often in shounen romances...........the hero falls in love with a clumsy, slightly dumb girl, partly because of the cuteness factor and also because such innocence and vulnerability triggers his protective instincts. Maybe its the same for Riful, and why she's attracted to Dauf?

Btw,is it just me or did anyone else find it sweet how Dauf powered up after Riful gave her pep talk? And how he got himself cut shielding Riful from Clare's blows (even though he knew Riful could handle herself). Maybe that loyalty and love is why she chose him.

And I was refering how the drawing made her faces look soo flat =_=

Lol. For some strange reason, that misunderstanding over choice of words just strikes me as hilarious.

Sinestra

2007-07-19, 11:58

Galatea definitely stole the limelight in this episode. Even Clare could not get a bit of it lol, though it was nice seeing her getting fiesty with the mention of priscilla. Wonder if Jeanne can make it? Will she be like the awesome foursome?

I would have to agree Galatea stole the show her calm exterior and her value on beauty made her seem like one of the untouchables. Not many Claymores can enter a fight with that amount of elegence and still whoop ass..

Clare again with the mention of Pricillia's name goes Berserk. She handled her self well in the fight but still got her face in the dirt and her ass in air AGAIN! but hey shes getting better.

Pieces about whats really going on are coming together. I was surpised at the fact that each awakend #1 from each point in the Organization's history were still around. At this point if Pricillia has joined forces with the very first #1 rank make awakended shit is going to hit the fan, the way it sounded it was almost like she has a relationship with the guy in the north either way seems like a 4 way war is coming. Galatea wouldnt even taken on Riful to me that means that her chances or any other claymore for that matter chances of survival are slim to none.

Watching Duff cry because his rods could not pierce Galatea was so so sad. What the hell does Riful see in him? or maybe hes more like a pet.

Sordes Pilosus

2007-07-19, 12:02

Well one reason Riful choose Duff might be quite simple. He is quite big afterall.. Pluss there are the tactical aspects. He is a tank, few can take hits as Duff, pluss he is a tank that aint locked to close range combat. While he seams not to have the clasic "finger pircers" his rods are more then enough considering his power and armour.

Super Ska Master

2007-07-19, 12:03

You guys know you're talking about monsters, right? o_o

xVxObliVioNxVx

2007-07-19, 12:06

You guys know you're talking about monsters, right? o_o

Nothing wrong with talking about the human characteristics these monsters have.

Teresa/Clare1415

2007-07-19, 12:07

This episode was a ten for me! I loved it.:love:

chucky

2007-07-19, 12:13

***sigh****
A potentially marvelous reunion of Sailormoon seiyuu dreamteam has turned sour by one single person, namely, Mizuki Nana who dubbed Riful.....

Not to mention the animation quality is getting more and more terrible as the series progresses -- I tried everytime to turn the contrast of my mon to max and I still couldnt see jack.

And close-up of the characters, particularly several of them including Ophelia and Galatea, has gone astray from the original manga by quite a bit.

A potentially enjoyable series has been ruined -- yes, the story itself looks all too familiar and you can pick out quite a number of blemishes in the manga like the way it is drawn bleh bleh -- but Claymore does have its enchanting quality set it apart from the likes of the procrastinating JUMP stuff. I wished before its animation would be a success.

And the hope was high at the beginning. The series is supported first by an array of first-rated seiyuu like Paku Romi and Kuwashima Houko, with all those in the rank of household names like Takeuchi Junko playing even some forgettable sidekicks. And then we are talking about Hisakawa Aya(Sailor Mercury as Priscilla), Shinohawa Emi(Sailor Jupiter as Ophelia) and Mitsuichi Kotono(Sailor Moon as Jean), all prime-time seiyuus of the last decade. But the fun is ruined by one single seiyuu who dubbed the most decorated character after Teresa: Mizuki is too young, hated by 2ch, and just cannot handle the complicated nature of Riful at all -- a mentor in a meandering way; an info leaker if she's in good mood; a cruel and yet playful loli-dominatrix. This cool character has been leveled and squeezed into a something worse than a backdrop of the darker-than-black mis-en-scene.

I wish Madhouse can find their excuse in the production of Gunslinger Girls 2. Or it will be a total disaster for the company. Oh, I have almost forgotten how terrible and repetitive the music pieces are.

Mentar

2007-07-19, 12:17

***sigh****
A potentially marvelous reunion of Sailormoon seiyuu dreamteam has turned sour by one single person, namely, Mizuki Nana who dubbed Riful.....

...who did an absolutely outstanding job imho.

Not to mention the animation quality is getting more and more terrible as the series progresses -- I tried everytime to turn the contrast of my mon to max and I still couldnt see jack.

Which means that your monitor equipment is broken. Get yourself a new one. There's details to see everywhere. Got an old CRT, maybe? On my work monitor, it's too dark, too - but this one is way too dark to begin with.

Xellos-_^

2007-07-19, 12:25

***sigh****
A potentially marvelous reunion of Sailormoon seiyuu dreamteam has turned sour by one single person, namely, Mizuki Nana who dubbed Riful.....

Who did a absolutely wonderful job.

chucky

2007-07-19, 12:28

Well I am not here to pick fights, but please look at elsewhere how she has been sneered at as Riful in other non-English forums....

And I rest my case.

Mentar

2007-07-19, 12:40

Well, of course there's no right or wrong. De gustibus non disputandam. All I'm saying is that in my opinion she's been doing an outstanding job voicing the whimsical-playful Riful so far.

I'd also say that Claymore is one of the extremely few manga conversions where I'm not sure whether overall the manga or anime is better. Which is an amazing feat IMHO. It certainly is the best manga adaption I can think of in the recent past.

Majek

2007-07-19, 12:44

You guys know you're talking about monsters, right? o_o
Humans are worse, that's why i like AB's.

Kouvley

2007-07-19, 12:49

***sigh****
A potentially marvelous reunion of Sailormoon seiyuu dreamteam has turned sour by one single person, namely, Mizuki Nana who dubbed Riful.....

Who I also think done an absolutely brilliant job.

I find your reasons for the show being "ruined" quite bizzare but if that's what you think so be it.

chucky

2007-07-19, 12:54

To give more an elaboration, riful is a difficult character for dubbing -- if you have seen Black Lagoon, in a certain way riful would remind you of the Romanian killer twins -- but at the same time she is an old and bored wench. That's why the seiyuu cannot dub riful in one single tone, but noticeable changes will be necessary when she jumps from one topic to another. Mizuku? Nah, she didnt do it.

And in terms of adaptation.... well there are inherited difficulties to adapt a monthly-based manga into a 26 episode animation series for sure. You know, a chapter encapsulation often means the author is to make a single point in each, and the rule of thumb usually is 2 chapters of weekly-based manga putting in one single anime episode usually makes the cutting off of the material looks a lot smoother..... but we all know that monthly-based manga usually has more pages and it makes adaptation a lot more difficult.

I wont deny that the first 7-8 episodes of the claymore animation did a very good job. It is not only "not bad", but it charmed me into reading the whole damn mangas from cover to cover more than 3 times. And their seiyuu team, as I mentioned, is the most scary one put together, in terms of numbers and the prestiges. Go to the claymore page in animenetwork, and randomly click on the names of any of the seiyuu -- except a couple amateurs prolly you cannot believe how far you have to scroll down to finish off reading each of their resume.

But the funny thing is: the production team suddenly chose to put someone not the same caliber (and fair or not, quite hated by many oldschoolers) to handle the second most important living character in the series. It is very mind boggling to many people including myself indeed.

Cococokie

2007-07-19, 13:00

This episode is disappointing. (http://cococokie.wordpress.com/2007/07/20/claymore-16/)

Mentar

2007-07-19, 13:35

To give more an elaboration, riful is a difficult character for dubbing -- if you have seen Black Lagoon, in a certain way riful would remind you of the Romanian killer twins --

Bad start if you go into a review with this - which means that you go into it with preconceived ideas with "how the VA is supposed to sound". Prime mistake in anime/manga consumption.

...but at the same time she is an old and bored wench.

Throughout the entire manga, there is not one scene in which Riful looks or sounds bored. Not a single one. She's always on the ball - the only comment of hers in this direction at all was her explanation that just being on her own and feeding felt boring for her. However, in all scenes she's depicted now she's aware and invested.

It's true that her overall age will be pretty high. However, her youthful form would forbid any "old" sound. Nope, what she takes with her due to her experience is an aura of authority and self-confidence. And that, Mizuki Nana provided in droves.

That's why the seiyuu cannot dub riful in one single tone, but noticeable changes will be necessary when she jumps from one topic to another. Mizuku? Nah, she didnt do it.

Okay, we have to agree to disagree here. Initially I had to adjust to her voice, since it sounded cuter and younger than I expected (initially, I pictured her with a slightly older and "harder" voice). However, exactly the mood swings from teasy-playful (her handling of Clare) to authoritative (Duff) to excited (awakening) to disappointed (aww, returned) to sober (about Galatea's explanation) were very well to follow to MY ear at least.

Oh, and one final thing: Please leave me alone with the so-called "Japanese worshippers". Many boards like 2chan are the absolute pits of wackos and weirdos. I wouldn't rate their expertise in fairly assessing a performance any higher than the members of this board.

Anh_Minh

2007-07-19, 13:41

I'm with Mentar, except that Riful's voice was pretty much exactly as I pictured it when reading the manga.

I'd like to add that Riful, for all her contradictions (old and loli, friendly and hostile, playful and ruthless...) doesn't have a split personality. There's no reason for her to have "several voices".

Matrim

2007-07-19, 13:45

..who did an absolutely outstanding job imho.

I totally agree with that.

Well I am not here to pick fights, but please look at elsewhere how she has been sneered at as Riful in other non-English forums....

So what? We should just accept these people's opinions and not our own? Oh, please... Using the same logic you shouldn't criticise Claymore, since most people on this forum love it.

And thanks for informing us that Claymore has an all star cast, I would just add that in other news the sun rises daily.

As for the episode itself, I liked it but I would have liked it even more if it wasn't for the all too familiar chit-chat during the fights, this time between Claire and Galatea. But it's good to see Claire being pwned and rescued once again and not becoming an unstoppable force of nature out of the blue.

Seska

2007-07-19, 13:48

But it's good to see Claire being pwned and rescued once again and not becoming an unstoppable force of nature out of the blue.

Jip, and thats is that. Why i love this Anime from the Start. A "hero" with Human mind/will and heart... (Raki Szene at the beginning...)

chucky

2007-07-19, 13:54

Bad start if you go into a review with this - which means that you go into it with preconceived ideas with "how the VA is supposed to sound". Prime mistake in anime/manga consumption. Well, no one can be a neutral observer in the first place, can they?
Throughout the entire manga, there is not one scene in which Riful looks or sounds bored. Not a single one. She's always on the ball - the only comment of hers in this direction at all was her explanation that just being on her own and feeding felt boring for her. However, in all scenes she's depicted now she's aware and invested.

It's true that her overall age will be pretty high. However, her youthful form would forbid any "old" sound. Nope, what she takes with her due to her experience is an aura of authority and self-confidence. And that, Mizuki Nana provided in droves.Can I say you now go into the manga with preconceived ideas on that? Is that a bad idea itself?
I think, well there is a dialogue in which she said, "yeah I just sleep and eat everyday and now the challenge makes me excited"......
Oh, and one final thing: Please leave me alone with the so-called "Japanese worshippers". Many boards like 2chan are the absolute pits of wackos and weirdos. I wouldn't rate their expertise in fairly assessing a performance any higher than the members of this board.Yes and no... yes, 2ch has a lot of idiots like everywhere else, but not everyone there is idiot. Nor is it only a 2ch thing. Nor the criticism on Mizuku only on 2ch....

chucky

2007-07-19, 13:56

I totally agree with that.

So what? We should just accept these people's opinions and not our own? Oh, please... Using the same logic you shouldn't criticise Claymore, since most people on this forum love it.

And thanks for informing us that Claymore has an all star cast, I would just add that in other news the sun rises daily.

As for the episode itself, I liked it but I would have liked it even more if it wasn't for the all too familiar chit-chat during the fights, this time between Claire and Galatea. But it's good to see Claire being pwned and rescued once again and not becoming an unstoppable force of nature out of the blue.
Sorry but I dont think you get the point here right.... no one is obliged to care about the other's feeling toward the works, nor should you care about how I feel toward Claymore in the first place. I am talking about arguments.

I would like to ask Skyfall on this: does this kind of post constitute a "flame bait"?

Xellos-_^

2007-07-19, 14:09

Yes and no... yes, 2ch has a lot of idiots like everywhere else, but not everyone there is idiot. Nor is it only a 2ch thing. Nor the criticism on Mizuku only on 2ch....

Do you have a link? I am on a few other forum and i don't see anyone having a problem with Mizuki Nana. If fact more then a few mention she did a pretty good job as Riful. Only compliants were about the animation.

PS. this is the forum over at AnimeOnDVD

Ronny

2007-07-19, 14:11

chucky

2007-07-19, 14:16

Do you have a link? I am on a few other forum and i don't see anyone having a problem with Mizuki Nana. If fact more then a few mention she did a pretty good job as Riful. Only compliants were about the animation.

PS. this is the forum over at AnimeOnDVD
Will try my best, but have to wait a bit....
sorry in advance

stormy001_M1A2

2007-07-19, 14:18

Hmmmmm,

Mizuki Nana has been given really crappy roles before RIful so her talent cannot be assessed fully. In this anime however, she did a good job, Riful sounds exactly what I imagine her to be, a slightly husky but high pitch loli-sque voice. Not to the point of cutesy high pitch that I found annoying though.

I suspected that our bethrens in Rising Sun expecting a voice similar to 2 X 2 Shinobu Ninja girl since it was done by same VA. Which a school girl, high pitchy and cutesy turn on/moe voice.

Unfortunately, that will ruin Riful as she is not that kind of caliber. She is different and darker undertones is required in order to give an idea what she is really about inside.

Just my 2 cents.

Riful

2007-07-19, 14:29

I also felt that Riful's voice was spot on. When reading the manga I imagined her just like that, she is talking with a lot of emotion, but never really loud which reflects her "status". I don't understand what you mean by Mizuki uses the "same tone" all the time. She expresses the different emotions for sure (as Mentar listed them before), but she doesn't raise her voice much and I think she did a good job with that.
How do you think her voice should have sounded? I don't see what you mean by "bored". Who would have been a better choice? I really can't imagine :confused:

chucky: I do agree with the rest of your criticism though, especially the character's faces and I have enjoyed the manga much more.

PS: I'm actually not happy with Kotono Mitsuishi as Jean, eventhough I was looking forward to the Sailor Moon reunion, she is using a quite boring standard voice for Jean.