Nanoha - StrikerS - Episode 19 Discussion / Poll [Archive]

Skyfall

2007-08-05, 09:14

Welcome to the discussion thread for Nanoha, Episode 19.

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Kha

2007-08-05, 09:32

Vivio's scream is ringing in my head... :eyespin:

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 09:33

Vivio's scream is ringing in my head... :eyespin:

OMG I hope we don't hear much of it in future episodes :uhoh:

krisslanza

2007-08-05, 10:42

Yes my delicate mind cannot take much more of Vivio screaming ;_;

raidou

2007-08-05, 11:02

Who knows :uhoh:

Maybe from now on we would hear Vivio laughing/giggling like Precia or Jail instead after being transformed by the Relic :heh: which one is worse?

Kha

2007-08-05, 11:12

Maybe from now on we would hear Vivio laughing/giggling like Precia or Jail instead after being transformed by the Relic :heh: which one is worse?USO DA!!! :upset: :upset: :upset: :upset:

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 11:15

Who knows :uhoh:

Maybe from now on we would hear Vivio laughing/giggling like Precia or Jail instead after being transformed by the Relic :heh: which one is worse?

Huh? :twitch: Now I want to hear that :eyespin:

Thisguy

2007-08-05, 11:25

A Part done... Okay, this is officially the WORST connection I had so far.
I'll simply go to bed and watch nico tomorrow :frustrated:

aers

2007-08-05, 11:27

psh, I can't even get a connection. Friend says the audio on the peercast stream is all messed up for him too.

verossa and schach go to scag's base and we actually find out that verossa's capable of doing something other than materializing cake out of thin air.

ginga fighting for scag..which we saw coming.

Village Idiot

2007-08-05, 11:38

Thisguy

2007-08-05, 11:44

UNLIMITED CAKE WORKSFunny part is, his Rare Skill's name actually sounded something like "Infinity (something)" :heh:

Also, what I could make out from mangled audio is that RH seems to have one more mode; the Blaster Mode.
Now this mode IS the dangerously stressful mode, or so I think I heard, so Nanoha swears to Rein that she won't use it.
...Saying that out loud is more than enough to prove you will use it, Nanoha-san :heh:

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 11:51

Funny part is, his Rare Skill's name actually sounded something like "Infinity (something)" :heh:

Also, what I could make out from mangled audio is that RH seems to have one more mode; the Blaster Mode.
Now this mode IS the dangerously stressful mode, or so I think I heard, so Nanoha swears to Rein that she won't use it.
...Saying that out loud is more than enough to prove you will use it, Nanoha-san :heh:

Now that's some interesting info, hope the episode shows up on nico soon.

FlameSparkZ

2007-08-05, 11:52

Funny part is, his Rare Skill's name actually sounded something like "Infinity (something)" :heh:

Also, what I could make out from mangled audio is that RH seems to have one more mode; the Blaster Mode.
Now this mode IS the dangerously stressful mode, or so I think I heard, so Nanoha swears to Rein that she won't use it.
...Saying that out loud is more than enough to prove you will use it, Nanoha-san :heh:

Yep, a situation will emerge and Nanoha WILL have to use it...hey, it happened in A's, so why not happen here? :uhoh:

aers

2007-08-05, 11:54

Now that's some interesting info, hope the episode shows up on nico soon.

It's allready partially up.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 11:56

It's allready partially up.

Yeah, part A is there.

Deathkillz

2007-08-05, 12:00

Who knows :uhoh:

Maybe from now on we would hear Vivio laughing/giggling like Precia or Jail instead after being transformed by the Relic :heh: which one is worse?
Jail: "the daughter ive always wanted" *evil chuckle* :rolleyes:

yea its up...but loading slowly as always ~

Varion

2007-08-05, 12:01

Yes my delicate mind cannot take much more of Vivio screaming ;_;

No Vivio screaming this ep. She was completely unconscious in a load of blankets.

So, random bits. Apologies if there's any mistakes but when it wasn't lagging out the audio was going slow, and on top of that every few mins the peercast kept cutting to the streamer's desktop for some reason.
- Alto goes to visit Vice, who's still completely out, and tells him Storm Raider is fine. She then gets in it and takes off, while... Fate was it? on the Asura asks whether it's working okay.
- Some meeting where the peercast stream kept exploding.
- Subaru feels bad for going over the top with no regard for Mach Calibre, who of course responds that it's entirely to blame for not being able to keep up with her, and promises to do so next time.
- Nanoha's past her tears and is completely focused on getting Vivio back. Which is obviously a good thing.
- Bit about Blaster Mode thisguy mentioned already.
- Elio vs Signum is just a training battle. Shame.
- Wendi isn't too fond of Otto and Deed's seriousness. Can't blame her really.
- Ginga out in combat. She looks a little bit different and somewhat creepier... but that's no surprise.
- Scag walks down the coridoor with Vivio in the blankets, then goes into the main room where he talks to Uno (there was something interesting-looking on the screen but cue another lagout)
- ANyway, then there's some explosions back in the hallway, which turns out to be Acous and Schach standing outside the base with 3 shadowy dogs with green highlights. They looked to be under his control... guess that's how he's been finding out all his info.
- Then they get surrounded by drones, which distracts them while Scag activates the huge Cradle and it takes to the skies.

Preview:
- Carim with a mysterious parcel on her desk.
- Talking Scag.
- Zest and Agito flying.
- More Ginga at the head of the numbers.
- Everyone in lines ready, presumably, to go out and fight.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 12:08

The whole thing is up on nico now.

Kha

2007-08-05, 12:16

No Vivio screaming this ep. She was completely unconscious in a load of blankets.

So, random bits. Apologies if there's any mistakes but when it wasn't lagging out the audio was going slow, and on top of that every few mins the peercast kept cutting to the streamer's desktop for some reason.
- Alto goes to visit Vice, who's still completely out, and tells him Storm Raider is fine. She then gets in it and takes off, while... Fate was it? on the Asura asks whether it's working okay.
- Some meeting where the peercast stream kept exploding.
- Subaru feels bad for going over the top with no regard for Mach Calibre, who of course responds that it's entirely to blame for not being able to keep up with her, and promises to do so next time.
- Nanoha's past her tears and is completely focused on getting Vivio back. Which is obviously a good thing.
- Bit about Blaster Mode thisguy mentioned already.
- Elio vs Signum is just a training battle. Shame.
- Wendi isn't too fond of Otto and Deed's seriousness. Can't blame her really.
- Ginga out in combat. She looks a little bit different and somewhat creepier... but that's no surprise.
- Scag walks down the coridoor with Vivio in the blankets, then goes into the main room where he talks to Uno (there was something interesting-looking on the screen but cue another lagout)
- ANyway, then there's some explosions back in the hallway, which turns out to be Acous and Schach standing outside the base with 3 shadowy dogs with green highlights. They looked to be under his control... guess that's how he's been finding out all his info.
- Then they get surrounded by drones, which distracts them while Scag activates the huge Cradle and it takes to the skies.

Preview:
- Carim with a mysterious parcel on her desk.
- Talking Scag.
- Zest and Agito flying.
- More Ginga at the head of the numbers.
- Everyone in lines ready, presumably, to go out and fight.Nighty, you better pray hard; it does look like your worst fear regarding a GingLetti pairing is materializing fast... :uhoh:

Jabber00

2007-08-05, 12:18

The whole thing is up on nico now.

What's nico? Thx!

aers

2007-08-05, 12:22

Man, showing Nanoha a screaming, crying Vivio calling for mama is probably the worst thing you could have done, Scag. And you did it. How does it feel to have a death sentance.

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 12:32

Nighty, you better pray hard; it does look like your worst fear regarding a GingLetti pairing is materializing fast... :uhoh:

Maybe, but with Jail's "I'm so totally a crazy, evil bastard" points raking up like never before (( if he was mildly ambiguously crazy and evil before, he's totally now. )), looks like everything is pointing towards brainwashing. Doesn't help that she was silent all the way.

The Numbers uniform looks nice on her though.

Acous's Rare Skill is...err.... :heh:

And sigh... why must Vivio be THAT OF ALL THINGS!? And with that kind of presentation as well... Are you serious, Jail? I don't care how powerful Vivio's latent powers is to power a world-destroyer-ship, this isn't exactly what I'd thought you'd consider the best creation. And him showing Vivio being the core of the Cradle to the involved parties, (( Regius, Saint Church, etc ))...man, that's totally asking for a death sentence.

Overall, pretty boring until the later half of the episode. And you know...I'd like to know what's this dream of yours. You've been extremely ambiguous, Jail, but it's about time. You've already revealed your FINAL DUNGEON COMPLETE WITH A SUPER WEAPON after all. :rolleyes:

And they're STILL hiding Due... You know, if it turns out to be non-shocking, (( like Due = Jail or something )) I'll be mildly surprised.

Lutecia can summon a lot of Ji-rai-ohs...

Kha

2007-08-05, 12:38

Maybe, but with Jail's "I'm so totally a crazy, evil bastard" points raking up like never before (( if he was mildly ambiguously crazy and evil before, he's totally now. )), looks like everything is pointing towards brainwashing. Doesn't help that she was silent all the way.

The Numbers uniform looks nice on her though.

Acous's Rare Skill is...err.... :heh:

And sigh... why must Vivio be THAT OF ALL THINGS!? And with that kind of presentation as well... Are you serious, Jail? I don't care how powerful Vivio's latent powers is to power a world-destroyer-ship, this isn't exactly what I'd thought you'd consider the best creation. And him showing Vivio being the core of the Cradle to the involved parties, (( Regius, Saint Church, etc ))...man, that's totally asking for a death sentence.

Overall, pretty boring until the later half of the episode. And you know...I'd like to know what's this dream of yours. You've been extremely ambiguous, Jail, but it's about time. You've already revealed your FINAL DUNGEON COMPLETE WITH A SUPER WEAPON after all. :rolleyes:This certainly reminds me of those end game zones where Megaman has to go in clear all the bosses that he has defeated before again, before taking Dr W on for the #^%$^ing umpteenth time.

And we have our Reploids (Project F? Einherjar?), Mavericks (Numbers), and Evoluder Subaru the Maverick Relic Hunter. She's even blue in color! :uhoh:

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 12:43

Actually, scratch that dream part.

Jail clearly said he wants some...power and it's related to Ancient Belka...

Not clear though. Though Cradle is apparently just the beginning of his "happy dream."

Deathkillz

2007-08-05, 13:01

jail: "MUHAHAHAHAHA!"
wow...vivio battery works like a charm! :D

nanoha going emo mode...and the mention of her final trump card is sure to be her death flag! great! ^.^

erio getting his ass kicked...expected...

ginga nee...dam you jail!!! give me back my gentle kind ginga nee!! :sad:

and acous showing us what other magic tricks he has...

other than that just your standard cool down ep ~

oh and how mach caliber and raising heart seems to share the same VA :heh:

Varion

2007-08-05, 13:08

jail: "MUHAHAHAHAHA!"
the mention of her final trump card is sure to be her death flag! great! ^.^

Whatever you're drinking, you'd probably be better laying off it. It doesn't seem to be doing you much good.

Whatever else Jail has in mind though, we still haven't seen this King fellow. And I'm almost convinced Auris is Due. Mainly because she's somewhat suspicious and strategically placed to keep an eye on Regius too.

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 13:09

jail: "MUHAHAHAHAHA!"

Best thing in an otherwise average calm before the storm episode. :rolleyes:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/9962/jjjjqq6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

The animators must be really enjoying drawing Jail's frames. I can feel the enthusiasm and excitement behind it.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 13:10

Oh well, watched it:

- I'm afraid they're really going for 2D Jail ... whatever, I'll wait for the revelation of his ultimate goal, but it'll probably be something stupid ...

- Alto is taking the place of Vice, Shamal is already alright while Zafira is out cold - GG males in MGLN

- Though Acous was shown in action ... his skills were ... not impressive :uhoh: Seemed like Schach did most of the Drone cleaning (also Drones acted extremely stupid)

- Another bunch of TSAB gruns (and not the lowest-ranking it seems) is owned easily by Numbers ... and did I see tanks there?

- Erio vs Signum ... too brief ...

- Was that Due shown on one of the panels around Scaglietti? Didn't look like any known Number, but it may just be due to the low image quality.

- Ginga on the Scaglietti's side, as expected, dunno why everybody was so shocked :rolleyes:

- WTF is with such huge ... erm ... battleship I guess, hidden underground in MidChilda and remained unnoticed for ages? And Doc's hideout was there on top of that? N/C

- Vivio did cry again, OMG my ears, shut her up somebody ... And she's conscious sitting there as the weapon's core? What's her role there? Is it still considered non-magical weapon?

- Doc surely could do nothing better than showing probably the weakest spot of his battleship to everybody ... Way to go ...

(give me OC Jail instead of this abomination, please)

raidou

2007-08-05, 13:17

Subaru X MC moment is similar to S2 Fate/Nanoha X Bardiche/RH ^^ ...Shario and Marie are also upgrading MC so Subaru could use her maximum capability without worries, aren't they?

Acous ability is called Mugen no Ryo Ken (?) " Infinite hunting _____"

Whatever else Jail has in mind though, we still haven't seen this King fellow. And I'm almost convinced Auris is Due. Mainly because she's somewhat suspicious and strategically placed to keep an eye on Regius too.

Though Regius's moral seems to be pretty broke already looking at his brief shot..he is like going to cry or having another heart attack :heh:

Saint X

2007-08-05, 13:18

Hmmm...

Could it be that his true goal could be the total elimination of magic in Midchilda?

his raising of the Exile Mitoranum Cradle seems to support all out destruction... with conventionals

I sense a ship sacrifice in the process

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 13:22

Oh, and while this isn't really relevantly important, just a note... (( the first point more so to the OC thread. ))

The Wolkenritter are not immortal. They will die one day. They just don't age.

And the Cradle is an Ancient Belka weapon, which might be the reason why core!Vivio is called the Vessel of Saints.

That, and the speech Jail gave is specifically aforementioned first with regards his sponsors (( we don't know who )), TSAB Ground and the Saint Church.

Deathkillz

2007-08-05, 13:23

Whatever you're drinking, you'd probably be better laying off it. It doesn't seem to be doing you much good.

Whatever else Jail has in mind though, we still haven't seen this King fellow. And I'm almost convinced Auris is Due. Mainly because she's somewhat suspicious and strategically placed to keep an eye on Regius too.
i only speak the truth :3 i think its about time that it happens as well (death may or may not occur but near death is something im all up for ^.^)

speaking about regius...he knows he's screwed XD

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 13:27

aers

2007-08-05, 13:27

raidou

2007-08-05, 13:31

Oh well, watched it:

- Though Acous was shown in action ... his skills were ... not impressive :uhoh: Seemed like Schach did most of the Drone cleaning (also Drones acted extremely stupid)

- Was that Due shown on one of the panels around Scaglietti? Didn't look like any known Number, but it may just be due to the low image quality.

-Acous mentioned his abilities similar to Hayate/Carim and called those kitties his "spirit familiars" ...Wonder what would be Carim's since Wolkens could be considered Hayate's

-Those panels seems to be schematic of setoukijin instead of Due.It is like their template, bald heads :heh:

What's the purpose of Vivio in the battleship I wonder. She seemed to retain her own consciousness, so she's not controlling the ship herself? It all looks very ... strange. And lame, I have to say, unless there's a very good explanation.

Perhaps she is just like a battery :heh: nothing else

Edit:
From 2ch: unendlich jagd　= infinity hunt = 無限の猟犬ね, so yes, mugen no ryouken
Ahh ok,Thank you :)

FlameSparkZ

2007-08-05, 13:34

Best thing in an otherwise average calm before the storm episode. :rolleyes:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/9962/jjjjqq6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

The animators must be really enjoying drawing Jail's frames. I can feel the enthusiasm and excitement behind it.

Uhoh...Jail is getting carried away, he's slipping too :twitch:

- Doc surely could do nothing better than showing probably the weakest spot of his battleship to everybody ... Way to go ...

(give me OC Jail instead of this abomination, please)

Yeah, that's all he need to do...

Scaglietti: "Alright, I've sent you, the rules of the game, the schematics of the ship, location of the weak spot and where your precious Vivio is, now come and get us!!!" *laughs*
Hayate: "Uhhhh....Are you serious? This isn't a trap or anything, is it?"
Scaglietti: "Of course not! I'm not that sneaky..." *smirks*
Fate: You send us all this...why don't you just give up and surrender, instead of this nonsense?
Scaglietti: Because it's fun~

*Hayate and Fate sweatdrop*
Nanoha: I don't care about your game, just give me MY Vivio back!!!
Scaglietti: No! *pouts*
Fate: N-Nanoha don't make it more complicated that it already is... *sweatdrop*

At least he's not like that :heh:

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 13:36

What's the purpose of Vivio in the battleship I wonder. She seemed to retain her own consciousness, so she's not controlling the ship herself? It all looks very ... strange. And lame, I have to say, unless there's a very good explanation.

EDIT: the ship is Ancient Belkan? Is it still considered non-magical weapon?

Just because it's Mid-childan or Ancient Belkan doesn't necessarily make them magical.

I mean, even if we may be purely using solar/enviroment-friendly energy in the distant future, that doesn't mean different alternatives of energy doesn't exist for our Earthling culture.

Yeah, bad comparison, I know. But the idea is there.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 13:36

-Acous mentioned his abilities similar to Hayate/Carim and called those kitties his "spirit familiars" ...Wonder what would be Carim's since Wolkens could be considered Hayate's

-Those panels seems to be schematic of setoukijin instead of Due.It is like their template, bald heads :heh:

So he's capable of something more spectacular? Hope so. Also lol at 4chan mentioning Acous = Nero Chaos.

Ah, schematics ... that's possible.

Perhaps she is just like a battery :heh: nothing else

A humanoid battery? For a non-magical weapon? Is this some Matrix? :uhoh:

Varion

2007-08-05, 13:37

i only speak the truth :3 i think its about time that it happens as well (death may or may not occur but near death is something im all up for ^.^)
http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/8861/bangheadxz5.gif

And yeah, I thought that figure on the screen was a number until I got to go back and look at it. Definitely get the impression that, even if it isn't Auris (might've been a temporary measure, I suppose, but yep, he seems beyond broken now. I can't wait for him to come face to face with Zest.) we're supposed to be trying to work out who Due is like the masked men in A's. Either that or Due will suddenly appear out of nowhere to save their asses, but that's boring.

And those Jail screens are hilarious. I should hate him far more than I do, but I just can't take him seriously.

Jimmy C

2007-08-05, 13:40

WTF is with such huge ... erm ... battleship I guess, hidden underground in MidChilda and remained unnoticed for ages?

If it's in the middle of an uninhabited zone, I'd say it was "plausible". If it's within 100km of the capital, I'd say "no way". I'd bet the Doctor discovered it many years and built his lab on top of it for that very reason. By the way, were you able to see what, if any, number the Doctor gave Ginga?

Doc surely could do nothing better than showing probably the weakest spot of his battleship to everybody

In his defense, it's a very well defended weak spot. The ship probably has all kinds defensive guns to deter boarding attempts. If they do succeed in boarding the ship, he has his Numbers to deal with them. He probably thinks that's enough. Unfortunately for him, we know the boarding attempt will succeed and the Numbers will be defeated.

and the mention of her final trump card is sure to be her death flag! great!

Don't bet on it. When I was watching A's and saw Nanoha getting all worried when RH suggested using Excellion Mode, I was going, "Come on, show us RH cracking under the strain. Show us Nanoha begging RH to hold together." Did that happen? Nope. They might just "forget" to show the stress on RH again.

From 2ch: unendlich jagd　= infinity hunt = 無限の猟犬ね, so yes, mugen no ryouken

Not quite, 猟犬 is "hunting hound". So it could be "Infinite Hunting Hounds" No wonder he's such a good tracker. Kinda bad for Fate, she's been trying to find Scaglietti since ep6 and Accous finds him in just days.

octoberasian

2007-08-05, 13:41

Only one thing to say:
Gin-nee..... NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

(Damn you Dr. Spaghetti! Damn you!!)

(Will say more after I finish Part B. >_<)

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 13:44

Oh, I've come up with an excuse for Scaglietti showing Vivio as the core of the ship - it'll surely prevent the good guys from blasting him with Arc-en-Ciel right away. Though it's a lame reason.

asaqe

2007-08-05, 13:45

Look likes Ginga is number 2 all along...at least that will sort of bump up the survival rates of the Numbers in some funny way...

raidou

2007-08-05, 13:49

Err no, before they gotten Ginga in ep17 ...It is already mentioned that Due and Cinque was on a mission (Uno said that in Ep 15 I think)

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 13:51

Look likes Ginga is number 2 all along...at least that will sort of bump up the survival rates of the Numbers in some funny way...

Er...no. Her number wasn't shown, she wasn't addressed by the Numbers, and Due had been around as long as Uno and Tre, making her at the very least over 10 to 11 years old. 11 years ago, Ginga was just found and adopted as a child.

Not to mention Due was specifically said to be out on a mission on the exact moment when Ginga was with Subaru shopping.

And lol at 4chan's Ginga = Hokuto, Subaru = Ginga and Nove = Subaru analogies of GEAR Dendoh. As confusing as it sounds, it makes perfect sense.

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 13:55

Oh, I've come up with an excuse for Scaglietti showing Vivio as the core of the ship - it'll surely prevent the good guys from blasting him with Arc-en-Ciel right away. Though it's a lame reason.

"Can't touch this...
Can't touch this..."

Okay one, he's a nutbag to begin with. A 'genius' maybe, but they're usually nutbags anyway.

Don't read too much about it, it's probably a simple case of taunting.

Of course, unless that's a twist that Cradle would go Apocalypto if Vivio get yonk out or something...

asaqe

2007-08-05, 13:57

Er...no. Her number wasn't shown, she wasn't addressed by the Numbers, and Due had been around as long as Uno and Tre, making her at the very least over 10 to 11 years old. 11 years ago, Ginga was just found and adopted as a child.

Not to mention Due was specifically said to be out on a mission on the exact moment when Ginga was with Subaru shopping.

And lol at 4chan's Ginga = Hokuto, Subaru = Ginga and Nove = Subaru analogies of GEAR Dendoh. As confusing as it sounds, it makes perfect sense.

How so? And why is Nove Subaru?

raidou

2007-08-05, 13:58

Not quite, 猟犬 is "hunting hound". So it could be "Infinite Hunting Hounds" No wonder he's such a good tracker. Kinda bad for Fate, she's been trying to find Scaglietti since ep6 and Accous finds him in just days.

Lol,I just realised that those familiars are doggies instead of kitties (they look like panther in my memory) after reading your post :heh:

Not to mention Due was specifically said to be out on a mission on the exact moment when Ginga was with Subaru shopping.

Maybe shopping for Jail's groceries was her mission :p

Just kidding :heh:

krisslanza

2007-08-05, 13:58

Oh, I've come up with an excuse for Scaglietti showing Vivio as the core of the ship - it'll surely prevent the good guys from blasting him with Arc-en-Ciel right away. Though it's a lame reason.

If he keeps the Cradle above the city they wouldn't dare use the Arc-en-Ciel. It'd annihilate the city and kill countless innocent people. That weapon isn't meant to fired on a planet really...

Dark Wing

2007-08-05, 14:02

First off dose Jail want to die that bad...:heh: putting Vivio in the power core is one thing but showing her off to everybody is just going get him killed. Which I'm hoping for by the way. :rolleyes:

Man feel bad for Zifier he's been taken out of the series for good know. I ask you wheres the justice!:frustrated:

Well it's everyone getting ready for battle I was personally hoping for more of the old cast to come and help with the final battle but I guess not.:upset:

Yay we're going to get to see Subaru vs. re-programed Ginga. Get ready for epic-ness on an epically epic scale. Try saying that fast 5 time. :heh:

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 14:03

How so? And why is Nove Subaru?

GEAR Dendoh, a super robot anime by Mitsuo Fukuda (( the SEED guy )) had a similar plotline.

One of the 2 main characters (( Hokuto and Ginga )), Hokuto got kidnapped by the evil side, got brainwashed into becoming the friend of the the bad guy's...pseudo-price in a way, whose name is Subaru.

So, if we run analogies, Subaru = Ginga, Ginga = Hokuto and Nove = Subaru.

And yeah, it helps a lot that the mechas in Dendoh has a similar style to Revolver Knuckles, it's obvious Subaru/Ginga/Nove was mildly inspired from it, aside from GaoGaiGar,Jeeg, etc.

Yeah, you need to watch Dendoh to really grasp it. It's an in-line reference, harder to grasp due to the lack of Dendoh's popularity.

This is how Dendoh looks like. Dare say it doesn't look alike at all to Revolver Knuckle and Nove's IE.

http://img3.exs.cx/img3/8670/dendoh.jpg

krisslanza

2007-08-05, 14:04

Any screencaps of this 'Cradle' or has it even been shown? Curious on what it looks like. >.>

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 14:05

If he keeps the Cradle above the city they wouldn't dare use the Arc-en-Ciel. It'd annihilate the city and kill countless innocent people. That weapon isn't meant to fired on a planet really...

He's above some abandoned landscape right now. I wonder how fast the thing moves.

aers

2007-08-05, 14:05

Any screencaps of this 'Cradle' or has it even been shown? Curious on what it looks like. >.>

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/9829/1186340196472ds7.jpg

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 14:09

Any screencaps of this 'Cradle' or has it even been shown? Curious on what it looks like. >.>

*Cross fingers*

Come on... Protoss mothership...!
[/homer]

EDIT:

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/9829/1186340196472ds7.jpg

D'OH!!!

aers

2007-08-05, 14:10

Oh, when it was launching, I swear to god I thought it was a giant bug or something.

asaqe

2007-08-05, 14:16

GEAR Dendoh, a super robot anime by Mitsuo Fukuda (( the SEED guy )) had a similar plotline.

One of the 2 main characters (( Hokuto and Ginga )), Hokuto got kidnapped by the evil side, got brainwashed into becoming the friend of the the bad guy's...pseudo-price in a way, whose name is Subaru.

So, if we run analogies, Subaru = Ginga, Ginga = Hokuto and Nove = Subaru.

And yeah, it helps a lot that the mechas in Dendoh has a similar style to Revolver Knuckles, it's obvious Subaru/Ginga/Nove was mildly inspired from it, aside from GaoGaiGar,Jeeg, etc.

Yeah, you need to watch Dendoh to really grasp it. It's an in-line reference, harder to grasp due to the lack of Dendoh's popularity.

This is how Dendoh looks like. Dare say it doesn't look alike at all to Revolver Knuckle and Nove's IE.

http://img3.exs.cx/img3/8670/dendoh.jpg

I guess the rest of the numbers are sort of like Data weapons then...(And also a bit of an homage to Jail's former role as Calico.) And from my POV, there may be a small increase in survival rates for the numbers (Still not very high though)

krisslanza

2007-08-05, 14:17

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/9829/1186340196472ds7.jpg

Hmmmm... Wonder what it does. <_<

raidou

2007-08-05, 14:22

Oh, when it was launching, I swear to god I thought it was a giant bug or something.Probably because of the horn and similar design/color to Lutecia's Kabuto at glance.

I never expect her to summon that many Kabuto :heh:
Always thought that Kabuto is going to be Lutecia equivalent of Powered Friedrich for Caro (from the opening)

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 14:24

Hmmmm... Wonder what it does. <_<

Shoots Death Rays probably. Wait, it's non-magical weapon ... maybe it's stocked with nuclear missiles then.

Jimmy C

2007-08-05, 14:31

I'm still hoping for "Lulaby" Come on, what else would be more suitable for a ship named "cradle"?

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 14:34

Hmmmm... Wonder what it does. <_<

Well, it's called 'Cradle' for some reason I guess...

I never expect her to summon that many Kabuto :heh:
Always thought that Kabuto is going to be Lutecia version of Powered Friedrich for Caro (from the opening)

Neo vs The Smiths :p

Shoots Death Rays probably. Wait, it's non-magical weapon ... maybe it's stocked with nuclear missiles then.

Plasma Guns
Pulse Guns
Particle Beams
Railguns
Gauss Cannons
Tactical Cruise Missiles
Anti-Matter Shells
Ion Cannon
Positron Cannon
Dimensional Distortion Cannon

...And everyone's favorite, Strategic Nuclear warheads.

The possibilities are endless :)

FlameSparkZ

2007-08-05, 14:36

Shoots Death Rays probably. Wait, it's non-magical weapon ... maybe it's stocked with nuclear missiles then.

Let's hope they' haven't reached their expiration date yet... :heh:

Scaglietti: Take this!!! *press button*
....
Scaglietti: "Eh? Nothing happened..."
Uno: Doctor...did you check the expiration date?
Scaglietti: Huh.....:heh:

Well, if the cradle is somehow related to the Relics, then it must be liek a Lost Logia, built by an ancient civilization that used magic (or something smililar to that)...

We'll see, eventually...

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 14:39

Deathkillz

2007-08-05, 14:43

Plasma Guns
Pulse Guns
Particle Beams
Railguns
Gauss Cannons
Tactical Cruise Missiles
Anti-Matter Shells
Ion Cannon
Positron Cannon
Dimensional Distortion Cannon

...And everyone's favorite, Strategic Nuclear warheads.

The possibilities are endless :)
wait...arent all "beams" and the likes magical type power? :twitch:

though nukes FTW! instant triple S power destruction in a can...(nina must be giving some offscreen help :rolleyes:)

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 14:47

Oh yeah, add Inverse Tachyon Beam from me :rolleyes:

Why inverse :confused: ?

wait...arent all "beams" and the likes magical type power? :twitch:

Well, not exactly... But I'm not the one to give lectures about these kind of things... >.>

though nukes FTW! instant triple S power destruction in a can...(nina must be giving some offscreen help :rolleyes:)

Liquid Tiberium Bomb = Liquid Sakuradite Bomb :p

raidou

2007-08-05, 14:57

wait...arent all "beams" and the likes magical type power? :twitch:

though nukes FTW! instant triple S power destruction in a can...(nina must be giving some offscreen help :rolleyes:)

Not exactly :) particle beam weapons are pretty real and not magic ^^ ...there are some of this weapon developed in our reality :heh:

It is also clear now that the "dark shadow" facing Nanoha in the opening will be Vivio's battle ship :D
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/6043/face1xm1.th.png (http://img260.imageshack.us/my.php?image=face1xm1.png)
The same shape especially the tail on bottom part

Kha

2007-08-05, 14:59

Subaru X MC moment is similar to S2 Fate/Nanoha X Bardiche/RH ^^ ...Shario and Marie are also upgrading MC so Subaru could use her maximum capability without worries, aren't they?

Acous ability is called Mugen no Ryo Ken (?) " Infinite hunting _____" From 2ch: unendlich jagd　= infinity hunt = 無限の猟犬ね, so yes, mugen no ryoukenInfinite Hunting Hounds... What a weird Unlimited Reality Marble--

!!!

He's Ancient Belka right? :D

I'M VINDICATED AGAIN!!! IVORY!!! STOP RIPPING US OFF!!!

Not that I mind! :Dhttp://img53.imageshack.us/img53/9829/1186340196472ds7.jpg

I'm still hoping for "Lulaby" Come on, what else would be more suitable for a ship named "cradle"?Ever heard your grampa tell you stories of the times when "sirens sang the lullabys"? How about that? Unlimited Carpet Bombing? :p

Give me Endless Planet Cracker any day.Plasma Guns
Pulse Guns
Particle Beams
Railguns
Gauss Cannons
Tactical Cruise Missiles
Anti-Matter Shells
Ion Cannon
Positron Cannon
Dimensional Distortion Cannon

...And everyone's favorite, Strategic Nuclear warheads.

The possibilities are endless :)Add:

~~~~~~

"Oscillations of Desonance" - Supersized version of Subaru's IS

"Time Bomb" - It's a Protoss Mothership for God Empress' sake! :)

"Endless Planet Cracker" :eyespin:

"Thousand Black Holes" Exorcist pipe organ MLRS :p

Singularity Gatling-Projector :cool:

The Sunderer/Tsundere :uhoh:

Liquid Bluecheesium Bomb with Creator-san's signature. ;)

Scrin Catalyst Cannon :heh:

Gilgamesh's Endless Vault :nod:

Warlock "I-Win" button :frustrated:

Endless Harem Maker - Unleashes Siegels to summon every daemon-loli in Ancient Midchilda magic into one spot :twitch:

~~~~~~

4am madness FTW! :D

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 14:59

Why inverse :confused: ?

Because it consists of anti-tachyons :eyespin::eyespin::eyespin: and anti-tachyon beam doesn't sound right :p

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 15:07

Because it consists of anti-tachyons :eyespin::eyespin::eyespin: and anti-tachyon beam doesn't sound right :p

I have to confess, I haven't been around that word till today... :heh:

Infinite Hunting Hounds... What a weird Unlimited Reality Marble--

!!!

He's Ancient Belka right? :D

Well, his best friend has an "Eternal Coffin"

"Oscillations of Desonance" - Supersized version of Subaru's IS

What is it going to do? Ram into other ships :heh:

...Wait :twitch:

"Time Bomb" - It's a Protoss Mothership for God Empress' sake! :)

I was thinking of that as a defensive measure..

"Endless Planet Cracker" :eyespin:

Toss that along one of the beam weapons

"Thousand Black Holes" Exorcist pipe organ MLRS :p

Toss that along Dimensional distortion...

The Sunderer/Tsundere :uhoh:

Huh? :twitch:

Liquid Bluecheesium Bomb with Creator-san's signature. ;)

Oi oi...

Scrin Catalyst Cannon :heh:

Is that even useful? :heh:

raidou

2007-08-05, 15:15

Infinite Hunting Hounds... What a weird Unlimited Reality Marble--

!!!

He's Ancient Belka right? :D

I'M VINDICATED AGAIN!!! IVORY!!! STOP RIPPING US OFF!!!

Not that I mind! :D

Ever heard your grampa tell you stories of the times when "sirens sang the lullabys"? How about that? Unlimited Carpet Bombing? :p

Give me Endless Planet Cracker any day.Add:

~~~~~~

"Oscillations of Desonance" - Supersized version of Subaru's IS

"Time Bomb" - It's a Protoss Mothership for God Empress' sake! :)

"Endless Planet Cracker" :eyespin:

"Thousand Black Holes" Exorcist pipe organ MLRS :p

Singularity Gatling-Projector :cool:

The Sunderer/Tsundere :uhoh:

Liquid Bluecheesium Bomb with Creator-san's signature. ;)

Scrin Catalyst Cannon :heh:

Gilgamesh's Endless Vault :nod:

Warlock "I-Win" button :frustrated:

Endless Harem Maker - Unleashes Siegels to summon every daemon-loli in Ancient Midchilda magic into one spot :twitch:

~~~~~~

4am madness FTW! :D

Oii...Are you sure you're okay? :heh:

Ancient Velkas have weird hobbies/skill and guardians xD

Hayate(doing cosplay) --> human looking guardians/knight with colorful costume
Acous(Making cakes) --> Unlimited doggies .
Carim(Seducing married man) --> Chrono? :eyespin:

aroduc

2007-08-05, 15:24

Caps for the capless
http://blog.seiha.org/?p=241

Kind of a dull setup episode IMO. The Vivio and Ginga things were fairly obvious from the get go. I still want to see Due... who I'm sure will end up being Reg's secretary anyway... and the Einherjar, dammit.

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 15:34

Oii...Are you sure you're okay? :heh:

4am madness :heh:

Ancient Velkas have weird hobbies/skill and guardians xD

Hayate(doing cosplay) --> human looking guardians/knight with colorful costume
Acous(Making cakes) --> Unlimited doggies .
Carim(Seducing married man) --> Chrono? :eyespin:

You know in the end, it's all revolving around him :heh:

krisslanza

2007-08-05, 15:41

So it looks like the 2nd Number is shown but has like a mask on <_<
Wonder who it is.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 15:55

Deathkillz

2007-08-05, 16:03

So it's confirmed that Vivio's used as power source? Now that's completely retarded for a non-magical weapon imho. Unless they explain how exactly she's that special (which I doubt they'll do), I see no reason for a weapon's part other than its operator to be a conscious living being.
vivio's consciousness doesnt drive the ship ~ she is only there to provide power i think ~ how ironic that a non magical weapon/flying fortress is powered by magic :heh:

vivio: "it hurts!!" ;__;

krisslanza

2007-08-05, 16:07

Yes it does make you wonder why a non-magical ship needs a magical child to power it... Unless it has some anti-magic defenses powered by her? Hmmm...

And Deathkillz winz for having Tear in her sig :love:

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 16:14

vivio's consciousness doesnt drive the ship ~ she is only there to provide power i think ~ how ironic that a non magical weapon/flying fortress is powered by magic :heh:

vivio: "it hurts!!" ;__;

I mean why a conscious living being? If the consciousness is unnecessary (it's not the operator) then it can only bring possible troubles. Such technology is not good at all.

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 16:15

Yes it does make you wonder why a non-magical ship needs a magical child to power it... Unless it has some anti-magic defenses powered by her? Hmmm...

Vivio has superior brain power that could produce more juice than the Dark Energy generators that the Combine from HF2 uses...

Well that, or maybe her specific brain wave signature is the key to light up this tincan.

I mean why a conscious living being? If the consciousness is unnecessary (it's not the operator) then it can only bring possible troubles. Such technology is not good at all.

B-A-N-N-E-D

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 16:25

B-A-N-N-E-D

I'm talking about obvious drawbacks which normally wouldn't allow such technology to be developed at all before the moment it could be banned. Using a living being as a system's part which has absolutely no need for its consciousness is obviously inconvenient, unreliable and what not. Still waiting for a good explanation though, but I doubt there'll be one.

Skyfall

2007-08-05, 16:32

Perhaps Jail could not get whatever it was the ship was originally supposed to use as fuel (Nuclear powah! ...or something), thus he had to come up with an alternative.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 16:36

Perhaps Jail could not get whatever it was the ship was originally supposed to use as fuel (Nuclear powah! ...or something), thus he had to come up with an alternative.

Oh well, that's a possibility ...

Deathkillz

2007-08-05, 16:56

I mean why a conscious living being? If the consciousness is unnecessary (it's not the operator) then it can only bring possible troubles. Such technology is not good at all.
in that case then we will just have to wait and see but i do not believe that vivio has to be concious to be able to pump out the power...i think she is only awake and screaming because it gives pleasure to jail (goddam sadist! saite! >.>)

thx krisslanza :heh:

FlareKnight

2007-08-05, 16:57

Key Board

2007-08-05, 16:59

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 17:02

I'm talking about obvious drawbacks which normally wouldn't allow such technology to be developed at all before the moment it could be banned. Using a living being as a system's part which has absolutely no need for its consciousness is obviously inconvenient, unreliable and what not. Still waiting for a good explanation though, but I doubt there'll be one.

Everything in this universe has pros and cons.

Perhaps during that time it was conceived, possibly long long before the TSAB even comes to play, such a method was considered an advantage on the battlefield in terms of resources and function.

This is of course, depends on the situation and it's many factors of the war, which would obviously change over time.

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 17:16

FlameSparkZ

2007-08-05, 17:18

Geeze why doesn't Jail just send out a memo saying "I'm evil, please kill me." At least they are going the extra distance to assure us why he's not going to prison or being befriended, he's just dead. Talk about going the unnecessary route of showing Vivio crying out just to goad people.

Not a huge bit with Signum vs Erio. Though probably we shouldn't have expected much out of that. Guess she was just giving him lessons on how to cut opponents to ribbons and stop losing fights. Gotta win at some point.

Well seems like things are getting moved along. We have Acous and Schach busting up drones at the door to Jail's base. Asura is ready to go and everyone seems to be aboard now with Subaru healthy. I'd say Chrono is probably on the bridge, but knowing him so far he's probably still hanging with Carim. Lives may be at stake but why should he go and put himself at risk :heh:

Funny thing though, either it was the LQ of the raw...or Vivio wasn't restrained when sitting on that chair...::eyespin:
That scene reminds me of episode...hmm...whatever, from Chrno Crusade, where Azmaria was being used as a power source too :heh:

Schach, really cool when she loaded the cartriges :D:D
Her Device was nicely thought of :D

Either Verossa doesn't have a Barrier Jacket or he didn't bother to change...:uhoh:

And the Numbers sure kicked a lot of TSAB clerks in the rear and took out Einherjar too...so much for Regius' plans...hahahaha~

Signum vs Erio, awww, it had time limit, too bad, Erio was just about to lose too :heh:
He's getting along with Fried quite well :)

Gin-nee in Sentoukijin suit...niiiiiiiiice and sexy :D
Though, a vague expression on...brainwash ftw :heh:

Oh, and of course, someone forgot to give the script to Jail in this episode, so he had to improvise... :heh:
I like him better when he was calm...he's getting overly excited about this, so much that he's giving away his location, and where Vivio is being held...

Let's see what'll happen on ep 20, some fighting, hopefuly...and maybe another piece of prophecy from Carim?

Icarus

2007-08-05, 17:24

I sense a ship sacrifice in the process

"And the ship of law that sails the infinite seas will sink..."?

Vivio is called the Vessel of Saints.

I can see Vivio dying. Seriously. One of the Numbers mentioned wanting to find out who the "King" is and why he/she was fit to lead them. And lo and behold, we have the "King" sitting on the throne.

Also, prophecy regarding the "dead/dying King".

What's the purpose of Vivio in the battleship I wonder. She seemed to retain her own consciousness, so she's not controlling the ship herself? It all looks very ... strange. And lame, I have to say, unless there's a very good explanation.

Someone needs to go and play Homeworld and Homeworld 2.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/88/Fleet_command_returns.jpg

This is Fleet Command. Operational status is green.

P.S. She's not the only thing connected to the ship.

raidou

2007-08-05, 17:25

you know... with the amount of character death flags accumulated so far, I won't be surprised if a few characters end their mage careers by the end of this season

and nobody necessarily needs to die, although it could be injury or stress related

some of them being an eccentric officer with a desk job like Lindy seems possible too
Maybe the wolken would do something and perish by the end of this season...The talk between Vita/Shamal and the way both Signum/Vita looking at Nanoha/Fate(opening) feel grim >.<

- Tell me though, is he still in his suit? What kind of self-respecting Knight fights in a suit?! And it sounds like Schach is doing most of the work so at lest he got the game plan right .

- You know, if Chrono isn't with them, who exactly is flying that ship?

-Acous is so pro that he doesn't do the dirty work directly :heh: ...his doggies might be sentient and probably do all the fighting while he is eating cakes :p

-Lucino is flying the ship ....she seems to be in Amy's former work station

FlareKnight

2007-08-05, 17:33

Yeah Acous really doesn't seem to bother changing out of the suit. Guess he thinks its cool to show off. How he can get through a dangerous battle and still have a clean white suit after it. Helpful I suppose that he can use the dogs to fight and just sit back.

Maybe I was squinting too hard but I was sure I saw some horizontal magic circles over top of Vivio's hands which I would assume help lock her into place. Unless she is being held via invisible forcefields it's gotta be something. Maybe a good old if she moves it hurts even more than if she's just sitting there?

Might not be healthy to get fighting advice like that for Erio but he's low on options. The guys have shown a distinct ability to get owned so he's gotta try. Chrono doesn't use a bladed weapon so thats out, Acous using those dogs, Zafira is done and Vice is out (he wouldn't have fit anyways). Plus not like he can fly up to Zest and ask him to train him, besides he uses a self-damaging full-drive which you wouldn't want to mimic. Least in A's Signum showed the ability to get cut and bloodied up so that may be a good training fit. At least it seemed like she was helping him as I thought use the booster form in a melee situation.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 17:37

Someone needs to go and play Homeworld and Homeworld 2.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/88/Fleet_command_returns.jpg

This is Fleet Command. Operational status is green.

P.S. She's not the only thing connected to the ship.

Lawl, I played and finished both of them, and it's obvious that Vivio's absolutely different case - she does nothing to the ship consciously, so the question is - why the heck a living being is needed?

FlameSparkZ

2007-08-05, 17:50

Lawl, I played and finished both of them, and it's obvious that Vivio's absolutely different case - she does nothing to the ship consciously, so the question is - why the heck a living being is needed?

Well...she is the Vessel of the Saints after all...meaning she's the container, holding the power source of the ship...or something like that :heh:

Icarus

2007-08-05, 17:52

Lawl, I played and finished both of them, and it's obvious that Vivio's absolutely different case - she does nothing to the ship consciously, so the question is - why the heck a living being is needed?

P.S. She's not the only thing connected to the ship.

Maybe the Relic that's been stuffed inside her is controlling the ship, and she's being used as a conductor? Power source convertor? ¯\(°_o)/¯

Sounds pretty obvious to me. Relic (AI/Power) + Vessel (Conductor) = nice working Super Star Destroyer... with a REALLY GODAWFUL COLOURSCHEME. I mean, who in the heck decided that an interplanetary destroyer should be coloured PURPLE and YELLOW? The X-Men?

I take it Regius was working on the Second Great Hyperspace Core when the Numbers came to visit.

Estavali

2007-08-05, 18:13

For me, the name "Cradle" intrigues me. There has to be a reason why it's named so, and not something more... appropriate.

My take at the Cradle-Vivio connection is that the ship was created to protect a specific someone or someones. Possible someones would include the child(ren) of the ship's creator, someone important in Ancient Belkan society, etc. Perhaps also, someone who is linked to Relic VII.

If so, it'll be possible that the ship was created to recognise only that/these someone(s) as it's master/pilot/commander/ward. Possibly through their genes, or something like that.

The only problem now to this theory is the purpose of the Relic. Why Vivio only, and not anyone else?

My take would be that the Relics are personnel-specific, aka they will only work for/on the right people only. This idea came from the fact that Lutecia can only revive her "mother" with Relic XI, and none other. Perhaps Relic VII, the key to awakening and operating the Cradle(?), can only work on the someone it was meant to protect? That may explain the reason for Vivio's creation. She may be a exact replica of the intended ward.

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 18:40

Perhaps Jail could not get whatever it was the ship was originally supposed to use as fuel (Nuclear powah! ...or something), thus he had to come up with an alternative.

Considering that the central system shapes like a throne to begin with, (( and the interior designs are clearly not Jail's style )), highly doubtful.

And since it's apparently the greatest of the greatest Ancient Belka conventional weapon, with a freaking throne and a purple-yellow color scheme...I wouldn't be surprised if it was designed to be less functional and more of a splendor... kinda like ceremonial weapons, only that this one has genuine power.

And yeah, like Estavali said, it may be because it works in correlation to Vivio's existence. But now that her purpose is shown...who created Vivio? Surely it can't be just randomly an Artificial Mage.

Frankly, I'm getting Xenosaga vibes out of this one...Cradle, Vessel of Saints, Relics, Kings... it reminds me of the Omega System, Abel, Abel's Ark, Zohar Emulators...

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 18:43

Oh, and of course, someone forgot to give the script to Jail in this episode, so he had to improvise... :heh:
I like him better when he was calm...he's getting overly excited about this, so much that he's giving away his location, and where Vivio is being held...

Reminds me of myself when I constructed an giant experimental unit and was mocking everyone in the game...

... Boy, they didn't take that too lightly...

Let's see what'll happen on ep 20, some fighting, hopefuly...and maybe another piece of prophecy from Carim?

Carim: "Oh yeah, I forgot to mention something!"

Chrono: "Not again... Sigh..."

Skane

2007-08-05, 19:40

Given the prophecy, things do not look good for the Asura.

Cheers.

Icarus

2007-08-05, 19:40

Let's see what'll happen on ep 20, some fighting, hopefuly...and maybe another piece of prophecy from Carim?

Carim: "Oh yeah, I forgot to mention something!"
Chrono: "Not again... Sigh..."

Given that in most cases, prophecies are usually fulfilled in some manner, I'd expect Carim's latest prophecy to be some kind of cryptic clue to how the prophecy in this case is resolved. She seemed to be reluctant to her skill in the episode 20 preview, so one can only guess if what would be learned in the scene after is bad news of some sort.

(As if "TSAB going down sometime in the next year, baby!" wasn't bad news enough.)

serenade_beta

2007-08-05, 19:59

Random notes (feels like this thread is moving 5cm per second...):

Yeah for Wendi (Otto and Deed ignored her...)

Yeah for Ginga (May she stay this way forever)

Yeah for Scaglietti (Go and destroy the "good" guys again)

Yeah for Quattro (Amused at her facial expression, she's enjoying this, definitely)

Yeah for shock from the "good" guys (Hahaha, Nanoha had a good one, so did the rest for the Ginga and Vivio scenes)

Yeah for Regius getting a second heart attack (he looked like it)

Yeah for the failure of a force (that was Einherjar... Weak!...)

Still waiting for Due...

Boo! Why did green hair and purple have to appear...

Burner of Anime

2007-08-05, 20:11

Lawl, I played and finished both of them, and it's obvious that Vivio's absolutely different case - she does nothing to the ship consciously, so the question is - why the heck a living being is needed?

Could be she's the equivalent of the control core of the Babylon 6 Shadow Battlecrab. They have no mind and are simply used to hold the ship's operating system. :uhoh:

With that said, these babies were notoriously easy to take out once they realised what was running them :heh:

Dark Wing

2007-08-05, 20:18

With that said, these babies were notoriously easy to take out once they realised what was running them :heh:

Oh Jail...I've got only one question now...What do you want on your tombstone?...:heh:

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 20:47

Am I the only one who notices that Cradle's ugly color scheme is an obvious nod to Mr. Black Hole Cluster?

I mean... blue/yellow + a purple haired genius scientist? Jail's not as cool as him though, but his facial expressions and DANCE all but makes up for his personality flaws.

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8981/masoud818e47ui8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Does that mean Jail will die in StrikerS and be revived in Season 4 lol? :p

StrikerS ending = this? :3

XLhvbKWRolM

Just replace you know who with you know who, of course.

LoweGear

2007-08-05, 20:50

But who's Masaki then? And shouldn't he have gotten the Granzon first? :heh:

*D/ling raw*

Aaron008R

2007-08-05, 20:54

LoweGear

2007-08-05, 21:04

WELCOME BACK, LOWE!!!:D:D:D:D:D:D

Anyway, you're right, Nightengale!:eek:
Does this mean that the Doc would later die with no regret and be revived later by a Volkrussa dark lord and and eventually join the good guys at the near end?:eyespin:

:)

Makes me think that Jail should really have been voiced by Takehito Koyasu... :heh: On the other hand, that would've made him COOL instead of creepy :uhoh::cool:

Julius Firefocht

2007-08-05, 21:49

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-05, 22:18

WELCOME BACK, LOWE!!!:D:D:D:D:D:D

Oh yeah... You're right... :)

Anyway, you're right, Nightengale!:eek:
Does this mean that the Doc would later die with no regret and be revived later by a Volkrussa dark lord and and eventually join the good guys at the near end?:eyespin:

Well, technically he IS Oran-ge... And we all know what happened to Oran-ge when he comes back onto the scene....

Nightengale

2007-08-05, 22:28

Well, technically he IS Oran-ge... And we all know what happened to Oran-ge when he comes back onto the scene....

If we go by seiyuu jokes...

He'll lose an arm (( Sesshoumaru )), get himself some sort of cyborg arm implant (( Sesshou and Orange )), die but actually not die (( SRW scientist-homage + Kazuya )), reappear, (( once again, SRW + Kazuya )), and gets crippled at the end, but with Uno forever by his side. (( Kazuya ))

Highlight to read above. :eyespin:

Fabien

2007-08-05, 22:29

it's obvious that Vivio's absolutely different case - she does nothing to the ship consciously, so the question is - why the heck a living being is needed?

Stupid Question of the Day: is Vivio really the ship's battery pack?
Or did Jail made up that little setup to annoy Nanoha?

Fabien

2007-08-05, 22:30

he's getting overly excited about this, so much that he's giving away his location,

How so? Verossa already knew it anyway.

Cloudy

2007-08-05, 22:50

How ironic is that while scaggy is an evil scientist that do experiments while orange-kun is being experimented.

The diabloical battleship setup is almost the same as the last few episodes of trinity blood.

Kha

2007-08-05, 22:59

P.S. She's not the only thing connected to the ship.

Maybe the Relic that's been stuffed inside her is controlling the ship, and she's being used as a conductor? Power source convertor? ¯\(°_o)/¯

Sounds pretty obvious to me. Relic (AI/Power) + Vessel (Conductor) = nice working Super Star Destroyer... with a REALLY GODAWFUL COLOURSCHEME. I mean, who in the heck decided that an interplanetary destroyer should be coloured PURPLE and YELLOW? The X-Men?

I take it Regius was working on the Second Great Hyperspace Core when the Numbers came to visit.The Protoss Mothership has that "godawful" color scheme too, if you play as the purple side. :heh:

Considering that the central system shapes like a throne to begin with, (( and the interior designs are clearly not Jail's style )), highly doubtful.

And since it's apparently the greatest of the greatest Ancient Belka conventional weapon, with a freaking throne and a purple-yellow color scheme...I wouldn't be surprised if it was designed to be less functional and more of a splendor... kinda like ceremonial weapons, only that this one has genuine power.

And yeah, like Estavali said, it may be because it works in correlation to Vivio's existence. But now that her purpose is shown...who created Vivio? Surely it can't be just randomly an Artificial Mage.

Frankly, I'm getting Xenosaga vibes out of this one...Cradle, Vessel of Saints, Relics, Kings... it reminds me of the Omega System, Abel, Abel's Ark, Zohar Emulators...Am I vindicated again, this time of the excessiveness of Ancient Belka design, with an example being that they build MLRS like a goth pipe organ on tracks?! :D

Prove me right, prove me right...

My dream... IS COMING TRUE!!!

MWAHAHAHAHAHA...!!!Am I the only one who notices that Cradle's ugly color scheme is an obvious nod to Mr. Black Hole Cluster?

I mean... blue/yellow + a purple haired genius scientist? Jail's not as cool as him though, but his facial expressions and DANCE all but makes up for his personality flaws.

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8981/masoud818e47ui8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Does that mean Jail will die in StrikerS and be revived in Season 4 lol? :p

StrikerS ending = this? :3

XLhvbKWRolM

Just replace you know who with you know who, of course.:eyespin:

Jimmy C

2007-08-05, 23:46

One thing that strikes me odd is that the ship is named "Cradle". I hope that's just Scag's name for it because he couldn't find its original name. Otherwise, you'd have to ask what kind of Emporer/General would be willing to go into battle on board a ship named "Cradle"?

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-05, 23:54

Well...she is the Vessel of the Saints after all...meaning she's the container, holding the power source of the ship...or something like that :heh:

Just who in the right mind makes a living being a container for the most important part of some weapon?

Unless it's like this:

For me, the name "Cradle" intrigues me. There has to be a reason why it's named so, and not something more... appropriate.

My take at the Cradle-Vivio connection is that the ship was created to protect a specific someone or someones. Possible someones would include the child(ren) of the ship's creator, someone important in Ancient Belkan society, etc. Perhaps also, someone who is linked to Relic VII.

If so, it'll be possible that the ship was created to recognise only that/these someone(s) as it's master/pilot/commander/ward. Possibly through their genes, or something like that.

The only problem now to this theory is the purpose of the Relic. Why Vivio only, and not anyone else?

My take would be that the Relics are personnel-specific, aka they will only work for/on the right people only. This idea came from the fact that Lutecia can only revive her "mother" with Relic XI, and none other. Perhaps Relic VII, the key to awakening and operating the Cradle(?), can only work on the someone it was meant to protect? That may explain the reason for Vivio's creation. She may be a exact replica of the intended ward.

But then Vivio doesn't feel herself very comfortable for someone meant to be protected.

Fabien

2007-08-06, 00:03

But then Vivio doesn't feel herself very comfortable for someone meant to be protected.

The Tome of the Night Sky was meant to protect its master. But it got corrupted, and began to destroy its own master instead.
Could be the same here...

Adr 00

2007-08-06, 00:07

Somehow i dont see how Zest is involed in the whole mess?

Jimmy C

2007-08-06, 00:11

My take at the Cradle-Vivio connection is that the ship was created to protect a specific someone or someones. Possible someones would include the child(ren) of the ship's creator, someone important in Ancient Belkan society, etc.

Estavali, there is an additional problem with your idea. Such a ship would not be a frontline combatant, hardly deserving of the title "most powerful ancient Belka warship". The mission specification you described is more that of an armed transport.
Though one could argue that it's merely the most powerful on record in modern times. Which brings a scary thought, what would a true frontline combatant based on the same level of technology be like?

arkhangelsk

2007-08-06, 00:14

Another idea is that while ceremonial, the importance of the ship is such that it is stuffed with enough power cores, guns and everything to make it the most powerful, despite the inefficiency caused by the luxurious spaces.

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-06, 00:15

If we go by seiyuu jokes...

He'll lose an arm (( Sesshoumaru )), get himself some sort of cyborg arm implant (( Sesshou and Orange )), die but actually not die (( SRW scientist-homage + Kazuya )), reappear, (( once again, SRW + Kazuya )), and gets crippled at the end, but with Uno forever by his side. (( Kazuya ))

Highlight to read above. :eyespin:

Hey, who knows? :)

I kinda like that trip through hell :p

Stupid Question of the Day: is Vivio really the ship's battery pack?
Or did Jail made up that little setup to annoy Nanoha?

Definately.

It's all because he overheard her commenting that Yuuno was the smartest mage ever...

One thing that strikes me odd is that the ship is named "Cradle". I hope that's just Scag's name for it because he couldn't find its original name. Otherwise, you'd have to ask what kind of Emporer/General would be willing to go into battle on board a ship named "Cradle"?

'Cradle' doesn't sound too bad.

I would honestly have no problem riding it... It wouldn't be the number one choice of course...

Burner of Anime

2007-08-06, 01:22

Estavali, there is an additional problem with your idea. Such a ship would not be a frontline combatant, hardly deserving of the title "most powerful ancient Belka warship". The mission specification you described is more that of an armed transport.
Though one could argue that it's merely the most powerful on record in modern times. Which brings a scary thought, what would a true frontline combatant based on the same level of technology be like?

Hmm, an weapon where the Emperor holds the "Destroy Planet" button :uhoh:. Where have we seen this before?

I always thought of the Death Star as some sort of glorified throne, whose only purpose was to taunt the opposition into the unlikely act of landing a proton torpedo into a seemingly convienient hole :heh:

Funny thing about long odds and the law of averages is if someone tries long and hard enough, it's going to come true :eyespin:

On the concept of a conventional weapon that does everything? IMO, an automated weapons and factory platform would be the best bet. It would have some very hard hitting weapons for gatecrashing [read: beamspamming] and just drone hordes to flatten the rest. The Numbers are essentially it's field commanders, giving directed control for specific missions. In fact, I suspect Lutecia was brought out specifically as a mobile drone controller for that mindless lot till she went rogue.

I have essentially described a Protoss Carrier, except someone in this instance decided to arm the damned thing with proper guns :heh:

Kha

2007-08-06, 01:26

Hmm, an weapon where the Emperor holds the "Destroy Planet" button :uhoh:. Where have we seen this before?

I always thought of the Death Star as some sort of glorified throne, whose only purpose was to taunt the opposition into the unlikely act of landing a proton torpedo into a seemingly convienient hole :heh:

Funny thing about long odds and the law of averages is if someone tries long and hard enough, it's going to come true :eyespin:

On the concept of a conventional weapon that does everything? IMO, an automated weapons and factory platform would be the best bet. It would have some very hard hitting weapons for gatecrashing [read: beamspamming] and just drone hordes to flatten the rest. The Numbers are essentially it's field commanders, giving directed control for specific missions. In fact, I suspect Lutecia was brought out specifically as a mobile drone controller for that mindless lot till she went rogue.

I have essentially described a Protoss Carrier, except someone in this instance decided to arm the damned thing with proper guns :heh:So if this is the Carrier... I wanna see the Mothership! :D

Burner of Anime

2007-08-06, 01:46

So if this is the Carrier... I wanna see the Mothership! :D

For that, I suppose I'd go for the Independence Day approach and say it's a planetoid eating, transdimensional factory that does nothing but build and gate in other carriers :heh:

A mothership is not something I'd be willing to commit into a fight [yes, I also play Homeworld :cool:}.

Fabien

2007-08-06, 01:47

Though one could argue that it's merely the most powerful on record in modern times. Which brings a scary thought, what would a true frontline combatant based on the same level of technology be like?

Enough to destroy that civilization. After all, it was mentioned that Alhazared was destoyed because of its too-powerful technology. And the most dangerous material of our time are the remnants of that civilization.

Kha

2007-08-06, 02:03

For that, I suppose I'd go for the Independence Day approach and say it's a planetoid eating, transdimensional factory that does nothing but build and gate in other carriers :heh:

A mothership is not something I'd be willing to commit into a fight [yes, I also play Homeworld :cool:}.Oh that kind of Mothership. It should at least have an annihilator weapon to fire and wipe out the battlefield if the Carriers are getting overwhelmed... :D

Enough to destroy that civilization. After all, it was mentioned that Alhazared was destoyed because of its too-powerful technology. And the most dangerous material of our time are the remnants of that civilization.Sore wa, Dark Age of Technology (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Strife), much? :D

Hypernova

2007-08-06, 03:14

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-06, 03:37

I conclude that the staff of this show can't design to save their own life. First the weird ass TSAB HQ, then the ROFLCOPTER and now this "thing" that even taking into account the poor quility of the caps is ugly as sin.

I really don't see why people don't like the Navy's HQ :confused: I thought it was pretty good.

Storm Raider I can understand though.

Well in the defense of 'Cradle', it was made a long-ass time ago...

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-06, 03:44

I really don't see why people don't like the Navy's HQ :confused: I thought it was pretty good.

I can't say that Navy HQ is bad, but every time I see it I can't associate it with TSAB somehow ... It just doesn't look right ...

Kha

2007-08-06, 04:01

Just seen the raw, most of my points have been covered here, but I have a couple of crack theories:1. If Quint is Due, Ginga might just be working for Scagletti willingly to awaken her mother, who now is nothing but a mindless cyborg. :uhoh:

Either that, or...

2. What we saw in the Athra display wasn't Ginga, but was Quint/Due, wearing one half of what was once her Device! I mean, we really can't tell Ginga and Quint apart much, can we?! :DLet the mindfuck begin! :D

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-06, 04:03

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-06, 04:12

Actually, there is a distinct difference between Quint and Ginga physically :heh:

The shade of their hair colour is different.

Nightengale

2007-08-06, 04:15

Wasn't Quint's body buried or something when she died?

Clones should be a cinch for Jail to create. At the very least, a lifeless clone shouldn't be a problem, even if he cannot completely emulate the peak of Project F.

I think Kha's theory run in line with...

Quint saw TSAB being involved in secret-experiments XXXX, discovered, makes a run for it, and was extremely severely injured, saved by Jail, but since she's already dug her own grave by seeing TSAB's secrets, going back is suicide, so Jail creates a lifeless clone of her, chocks that lifeless body somewhere to be found by TSAB while retrofitting the original with Sentoukijin implants.

However, the biggest problem with this is that Due is supposed to be as old as Uno and Tre, and even if we push the maximum... Quint's death cannot be more than 10 years ago, while Quattro and Cinque are already on active duty 10 years ago.

Anyway, the most simple is brainwash. As ridiculously unappealing that plot device would be...

But I agree, they should reveal Due already.

Estavali

2007-08-06, 04:24

But then Vivio doesn't feel herself very comfortable for someone meant to be protected.

Ah, yes, I admit her obvious discomfort makes it look more as if the Cradle is sucking her dry instead of protecting her. Fabien's comparison to the corrupted Tome of the Night Sky may resolve this conflict.

Alternatively I can also blame it on the Doc's restraints. Maybe they are the source of the pain? :p

Estavali, there is an additional problem with your idea. Such a ship would not be a frontline combatant, hardly deserving of the title "most powerful ancient Belka warship". The mission specification you described is more that of an armed transport.
Though one could argue that it's merely the most powerful on record in modern times. Which brings a scary thought, what would a true frontline combatant based on the same level of technology be like?

Once again, we don't know if any smart ancient fellow had been tinkering with Cradle, transforming it from what might be a mobile fortress/throne dedicated to protecting its contents to what could be a flying juggernaut of death. Once again, the Tome comparison.

I can't say that Navy HQ is bad, but every time I see it I can't associate it with TSAB somehow ... It just doesn't look right ...

One of the entropymax 4komas actually compares it to a villian's lair :D. You know, pointy and ominous-looking?

Wasn't Quint's body buried or something when she died?

She was shown in a coffin, and as far as we know, stayed in there when they buried her.

Unless, of course, the good Doktor does a John Smith and took up grave-robbing Mai-Otome style.

Kha

2007-08-06, 05:16

Wasn't Quint's body buried or something when she died?Unless, of course, the good Doktor does a John Smith and took up grave-robbing Mai-Otome style.Exactly. Nighty's theory can work as well.

The only problem to circumvent is the 10 year max, which to me seems pretty vague... Is there a reference as to why Quint couldn't have died earlier?

Nightengale

2007-08-06, 05:22

Exactly. Nighty's theory can work as well.

The only problem to circumvent is the 10 year max, which to me seems pretty vague... Is there a reference as to why Quint couldn't have died earlier?

Subaru and Ginga was found by Quint 11 years ago.

And while it was never stated how many years exactly after the adoption till Quint's death, (( I think )) but I believe it's said to be more than just a year. I say 10 years as a most ridiculous limit, really. A more rational assumption is that it's probably 6-8 years, and not 10.

Unless of course, Quint was already a Sentoukijin before or when she found Subaru/Ginga...but that makes ZERO sense, no pun intended. IF Ginga isn't brainwashed (( 80% unlikeliness )), I'd say a Relic Core ver. Quint seems much much more likely than the Due theory, which has more holes than a swiss cheese.

Darco_emp

2007-08-06, 05:37

Subaru and Ginga was found by Quint 11 years ago.

And while it was never stated how many years exactly after the adoption till Quint's death, (( I think )) but I believe it's said to be more than just a year. I say 10 years as a most ridiculous limit, really. A more rational assumption is that it's probably 6-8 years, and not 10.

About 8 or so years sounds right to me, Since Subaru and Ginga seems petty attached to her at time of her death and that come with sometime spent together.

I said this to Kha already and I'll say it again, Jail has dug his own grave by broadcasting Vivio in distress to Nanoha.

Since next ep's title is "Infinite Desires" I do hope they do answer more questions on all those blank spots still left. and I'm definitely expect big explosions :heh:

Key Board

2007-08-06, 05:39

I have no real basis to support this, but I think Due is the sentoukijin that injured Nanoha years ago

and that's probably why they are saving her for later

HayatexNanohaxFate

2007-08-06, 05:57

After watching ep.19 today i was terrified at what Spaghetti showed to the TSAB, Saint Church, RF6 & more importantly Nanoha. Now i can't erase this possibility happening to each of the Numbers if Nanoha breaks in one of the future episodes :heh:

http://www.bb.banban.jp/fukurou/
found it while i was browsing teh image thread:D

good thing Tea and Subaru didn't tick Nanoha during their mock battle, i fear they would've suffer the same thing :heh:

Estavali

2007-08-06, 05:59

I said this to Kha already and I'll say it again, Jail has dug his own grave by broadcasting Vivio in distress to Nanoha.

Perhaps, but if you look at it from a different angle, it can be considered as an anti-Nanoha or rather, anti-Hayate precaution. A hostage (a child and one that's dear to the Captains), and one of the primary targets of retrieval.

If the Doc can

a) make infiltration into the Cradle (and subsequently, Vivio's rescue) an impossibility (or at least, highly costly on the TSAB side),
b) prove that damage to the Cradle will also mean damage to Vivio, and
c) takes extra care to stay out of danger (aka a bloodthirsty Nanoha),

he has more or less secure the Cradle's immunity, at least from the Arthra's AeC (if it's still there) or Hayate's nuke-worthy spells.

Of course, other units would still have little qualms attacking it, with the appropriate justifications.

Darco_emp

2007-08-06, 06:07

Perhaps, but if you look at it from a different angle, it can be considered as an anti-Nanoha or rather, anti-Hayate precaution. A hostage (a child and one that's dear to the Captains), and one of the primary targets of retrieval.

If the Doc can

a) make infiltration into the Cradle (and subsequently, Vivio's rescue) an impossibility (or at least, highly costly on the TSAB side),
b) prove that damage to the Cradle will also mean damage to Vivio, and
c) takes extra care to stay out of danger (aka a bloodthirsty Nanoha),

he has more or less secure the Cradle's immunity, at least from the Arthra's AeC (if it's still there) or Hayate's nuke-worthy spells.

Of course, other units would still have little qualms attacking it, with the appropriate justifications.

However given the nature of these kind of things, that option a is almost impossible with the laws of anime. Which implies that Vivio will be rescued sooner or later, then option b will be an invalid target thus let the bloodletting begin :heh:

Fabien

2007-08-06, 06:10

I have no real basis to support this, but I think Due is the sentoukijin that injured Nanoha years ago

That wouldn't explain why she isn't shown.
Besides, Nanoha was victim of her body's weakness; her opponent wasn't strong. Couldn't have been a sentoukijin as strong as e.g. Tre.

But I agree, they should reveal Due already.

The most sensible theory (to me) is that she's Regius' assistant, Auris.

Nightengale

2007-08-06, 06:18

The most sensible theory (to me) is that she's Regius' assistant, Auris.

Well, first problem with that is that it retcons Auris's internal monologues on the Eihenjar being too powerful along with her mildly drawn-back expression on the Eihenjar, which is shown to be easily wiped out with the Numbers.

2ndly, since Auris was in charge or at least had a major role in overseeing Einhenjar's operations, she could've easily gotten Sein or whoever or even plant some bombs herself to blow Eihenjar sky high without even needing to sortie the Numbers out as a show of power and superiority over the Eihenjar. Then again, this is Jail we're talking about here. :heh:

Key Board

2007-08-06, 06:21

I have the impression that Einherjars are large scale mass destruction weapons given that they are built separately in massive complex

which is probably why they were targeted given their potential threat to Cradle

a WMD can't exactly fight back personnel

I have a feeling they'll be placed on a vessel and rammed into Cradle as a make shift bomb, though

Fabien

2007-08-06, 06:32

Well, first problem with that is that it retcons Auris's internal monologues on the Eihenjar being too powerful along with her mildly drawn-back expression on the Eihenjar, which is shown to be easily wiped out with the Numbers.

Surprise attack against a weapon not meant to fight individuals, and maybe not even completed.

2ndly, since Auris was in charge or at least had a major role in overseeing Einhenjar's operations, she could've easily gotten Sein or whoever or even plant some bombs herself to blow Eihenjar sky high without even needing to sortie the Numbers out as a show of power and superiority over the Eihenjar. Then again, this is Jail we're talking about here. :heh:

Yep, Jail wants to show off.

But did you notice that the Numbers had detailed information about the configuration of both Ground Central and the Einhenjar? Otherwise, the Numbers' attack wouldn't have been as smooth.

Oh, BTW, I just love Wendy. The other two are definitely too serious.

Jimmy C

2007-08-06, 07:51

I've always figured Due to be the Doctor's top spy. Whether she is Auris or not, I suspect she has shapeshifting abilitites that will let her infiltrate any opposing group.

Kha

2007-08-06, 08:54

I've always figured Due to be the Doctor's top spy. Whether she is Auris or not, I suspect she has shapeshifting abilitites that will let her infiltrate any opposing group.More X-men refs? Mystique much? :D

Loner

2007-08-06, 11:16

Kha

2007-08-06, 11:32

I just realized: Spaghetti has his own ship now, right? Well, with how his forces have been tearing apart the TSAB and the power trip he's going on, he could demand that Midchilda submit to his rule.

That would make SPAGHETTI the "King".

So the prophecy might end up having the Cradle being the ship that goes down, and Spaghetti himself being the King that gets killed.:D

Darco! Eat your words man! I said that in the clubroom this morning!!!

(turns back to Loner)

Yeap, totally agree. That's something how I thought the prophecy would fulfill itself. But I can't say the same for the "Ship of Law" unless the Cradle was a "Ship of Law" before it got buried in bedrock. That's what I felt.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-06, 11:43

Loner

2007-08-06, 12:20

Yeap, totally agree. That's something how I thought the prophecy would fulfill itself. But I can't say the same for the "Ship of Law" unless the Cradle was a "Ship of Law" before it got buried in bedrock. That's what I felt.

You forget: If Spaghetti is the King of Midchilda, he'll be making the laws. And he'll be using the Cradle to enforce those laws.

Thus, the Cradle would become the "Ship of Law". :D

And thusly, allowing Hayate to invoke Rule #33 (http://www.angelfire.com/anime/Slacker/girl.txt).

Jimmy C

2007-08-06, 12:23

Loner, interesting though you idea is, the show probably won't last long enough for such a demand to be met.

Edit: His base can hardly be considered a Tower either.

Kha

2007-08-06, 12:33

Loner, interesting though you idea is, the show probably won't last long enough for such a demand to be met.

Edit: His base can hardly be considered a Tower either.He does not really have to be King of MC. All he needs is to "Ascend" as he says in the anime (I think) and he'd pretty much be King, ready to be shot down.

Also, the poem didn't exactly link the tower and the ship together, apart from being consequential in sequence. That vagueness is just the right amount to be twisted in the girls' favor. :D

@Loner: Btw, Rule #38 seems to be describing Nanoha very well. :D... :uhoh:

Loner

2007-08-06, 12:40

His base can hardly be considered a Tower either.

The part of the prophecy about the Tower has already come true (I think), when the Numbers assaulted it two episodes ago.

Btw, Rule #38 seems to be describing Nanoha very well. :D... :uhoh:

...True. She's already enforced Rules 13, 24, 25, 30 & 32. And judging from this episode, I believe she'll be following #85 religiously from now until she gets Lilio back. :heh:

The Numbers, on the other hand, seem to subscribe to Rule #40.

krisslanza

2007-08-06, 12:42

What rules are these? :uhoh:

Loner

2007-08-06, 13:03

What rules are these? :uhoh:

The If I Were A Magical Girl... (http://www.angelfire.com/anime/Slacker/girl.txt) list.

Which was inspired by the Evil Overlord List (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Overlord_List).

Jimmy C

2007-08-06, 13:04

Loner, GC is still quite operational despite Jail's assault. Reguis' office, which one can assume is near the top of the tower is still safe to be occupied. That says a lot about how not-destroyed the Tower is.

Dark Wing

2007-08-06, 13:05

The part of the prophecy about the Tower has already come true (I think), when the Numbers assaulted it two episodes ago.

...True. She's already enforced Rules 13, 24, 25, 30 & 32. And judging from this episode, I believe she'll be following #85 religiously from now until she gets Lilio back. :heh:

The Numbers, on the other hand, seem to subscribe to Rule #40.

wow thats pretty close in description...:heh:

Edit: Vivio! please be alive at the poor Vivio! ;_; Save her Nanoha please save her!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oxs5lP151TI

Loner

2007-08-06, 13:15

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-06, 13:28

Edit: Vivio! please be alive at the poor Vivio! ;_; Save her Nanoha please save her!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oxs5lP151TI

Oh, come on, let at least some of the good guys die.

Jimmy C

2007-08-06, 13:34

Tell that to the poor TSAB accountants when the repair bill comes in...

Beats building a new Tower. Although, now that Scag has got his "wings", the destruction of the Tower can now happen in proper sequence as mentioned in the prophecy.

octoberasian

2007-08-06, 13:55

The part of the prophecy about the Tower has already come true (I think), when the Numbers assaulted it two episodes ago.

...True. She's already enforced Rules 13, 24, 25, 30 & 32. And judging from this episode, I believe she'll be following #85 religiously from now until she gets Lilio back. :heh:

The Numbers, on the other hand, seem to subscribe to Rule #40.

I just looked over that list, and practically every Mahou Shojou series follows almost all of them. XD

And, reading it through, I agree 100% Nanoha follows them to the dot. Rule 85 is probably written on the sleeve of her barrier jacket by now after seeing Vivio strapped in that chair.

Meophist

2007-08-06, 15:33

I just looked over that list, and practically every Mahou Shojou series follows almost all of them. XD

And, reading it through, I agree 100% Nanoha follows them to the dot. Rule 85 is probably written on the sleeve of her barrier jacket by now after seeing Vivio strapped in that chair.
Nanoha still hasn't killed anybody.

In any case, I'm not sure if killing Scagaletti will solve anything.

Guppy

2007-08-06, 22:52

In any case, I'm not sure if killing Scagaletti will solve anything."If brute force doesn't solve your problems, you aren't using enough."

I'd say that goes double for any series with Nanoha in it. :p

Fabien

2007-08-06, 22:57

In any case, I'm not sure if killing Scagaletti will solve anything.

If you kill Scaglietti before taking care of the Numbers first, you'll have twelve dangerous and angry girls loose, which is *not* a good thing.

Fabien

2007-08-06, 23:01

"If brute force doesn't solve your problems, you aren't using enough."

I'd say that goes double for any series with Nanoha in it. :p

Phil, Prince of Saillune, would tell you that you must avoid resorting to violence.

Nightengale

2007-08-07, 01:23

Is Vivio really strapped there? I don't see any cuffs on her legs (( can't see the hands though )), but at the very least, her legs isn't wailing in pain.

If you kill Scaglietti before taking care of the Numbers first, you'll have twelve dangerous and angry girls loose, which is *not* a good thing.

Well... I dunno. I can imagine Uno breaking down if Jail dies, and without their pseudo-leader/elder sister at helm, I can see the Number's united force and teamwork breaking down. It's not like they're individually extremely strong... without support from one another, I wouldn't be surprised if Fate and Nanoha are more than enough to defeat them.

Mow Yun

2007-08-07, 01:49

Her hands seem buckled down in some fashion because you don't see them moving even though she's squirming in pain. Though, her feet move from scene to scene so it's safe to say the legs aren't restrained.

serenade_beta

2007-08-07, 03:10

Can anyone see the number on Ginga?

I see XI and something after that... Looks like XIV (14).

Tormenk

2007-08-07, 04:14

First thought that came to me when i saw Ginga in this ep: Number XIII :rolleyes:
Her Number armour is quite similar to her BJ, on hindsight. And how the hell did the doctor roll out a blitz caliber and left revolver knuckle for Ginga so fast? :eyespin:

And of course his source of info is questionable.Pulling a well executed attack like that on GC, attacking RF6 to retrieve Vivio when there weren't any obvious indication s she was there. And now attacking all 3 Einharjar units at one go.

Seiryuu

2007-08-07, 07:20

All I know right now is that the look on Nanoha's face at the end was very, very frightening. This is the sort of strain that I thought might trigger a berserk mode and shatter the limiters. However things go, no one had better stand between Nanoha and Vivio, because Scaglietti just turned her into an unstoppable force.
Scag is now officially the dumbest criminal in the universe.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 07:29

Scag is now officially the dumbest criminal in the universe.

Well, I don't know.
Of course, for the viewer, Nanoha is the main character, so she will win in the end.
But for Jail, Nanoha and Fate are just TSAB dogs; he has the upper hand, and he's been scoffing at them for years (see ep 6).

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-07, 07:32

However things go, no one had better stand between Nanoha and Vivio, because Scaglietti just turned her into an unstoppable force.

You would think so huh...

But that kind of plot would be too predictable and dull (Not counting the action of course), and there's 7 more episodes, so there's plenty of room for something else to happen.

After all, I would like to think that Nanoha and Vivio not being able to reach each other in the Op actually means something.

Nightengale

2007-08-07, 07:34

Well, I just hope Nanoha actually suffers from some severe strained feedback on-screen when she uses Blaster Mode, because we all know she WILL use it.

I mean, A's had them talking about how cartridges and Full Drive may cause heavy strain blah blah stuff that are supposed to make us worry for them within those 13 episodes, and alas, we see nothing of such, other than a flashback in StrikerS that only showed it 2 years after A's.

Besides, I'm still hoping for...

Nanoha blast the way to the throne room.

Nanoha : VIVIO!
Vivio : MAMA!

Once she pulls her out of her seat...

Vivio :...Die.
Nanoha : Vivio?

Nanoha gets Saint King Breaker-ED.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 07:38

Freid's surprised look at 10:35 is priceless :D

http://perso.edulang.com/anime/Nanoha%20StrikerS%2019%2010.35a.jpg

http://perso.edulang.com/anime/Nanoha%20StrikerS%2019%2010.35b.jpg

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-07, 07:44

Besides, I'm still hoping for...

Nanoha blast the way to the throne room.

Nanoha : VIVIO!
Vivio : MAMA!

That could be potential comedy material... Especially if it turns out that nobody knows their way around 'Cradle' :heh:

Fabien

2007-08-07, 07:46

Vivio :...Die.
Nanoha : Vivio?

Nanoha gets Saint King Breaker-ED.

MGLN isn't an anime for you. Watch Excel Saga instead.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 07:49

That could be potential comedy material... Especially if it turns out that nobody knows their way around 'Cradle' :heh:

I think Nanoha will do the same as Lina in Slayers ep 26, and as Mizuki Kaho in Card Captor Sakura ep 26: "A labyrinth? What's that? Let's just blast those walls and go straight."

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-07, 07:55

I think Nanoha will do the same as Lina in Slayers ep 26, and as Mizuki Kaho in Card Captor Sakura ep 26: "A labyrinth? What's that? Let's just blast those walls and go straight."

Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight.

AND, wouldn't want to hit poor, little, innocent, mistreated Vivio.

AND, if "Black Cat" could end that plot in 2 episodes, I'm seriously expecting something else...

Preferably Nightengale's scenario or similar.

arkhangelsk

2007-08-07, 08:58

Well, I just hope Nanoha actually suffers from some severe strained feedback on-screen when she uses Blaster Mode, because we all know she WILL use it.

I mean, A's had them talking about how cartridges and Full Drive may cause heavy strain blah blah stuff that are supposed to make us worry for them within those 13 episodes, and alas, we see nothing of such, other than a flashback in StrikerS that only showed it 2 years after A's.

I agree. I'm looking forward to her linker core being completely fried. Of course, she'd survive, but it'd be the end of Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha because she burnt her magic up so badly she could never use magic again.

Kha

2007-08-07, 09:03

I agree. I'm looking forward to her linker core being completely fried. Of course, she'd survive, but it'd be the end of Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha because she burnt her magic up so badly she could never use magic again.If that is the case, why can't I wish for everyone to die along with Spagetti since it's the most epic and appropiately Tomino way to send everyone off? :(

Fabien

2007-08-07, 09:43

Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight.

What do you mean? When you can fly, you can blast floors and ceilings as well.
See episode 1.

AND, wouldn't want to hit poor, little, innocent, mistreated Vivio.

In episode 12, it's stated that Vivio can survive a direct blast from Dieci's cannon.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 09:54

Well, I just hope Nanoha actually suffers

Sigh... You're as low as Jail.

I mean, A's had them talking about how cartridges and Full Drive may cause heavy strain blah blah stuff that are supposed to make us worry for them within those 13 episodes

Nope, stuff that explains why Nanoha didn't use her big badass attacks before episode 11.
That way, she was at Vita's level during most of the series, and at Reinforce's level when needed.

A dangerous tool is not one that will surely harm you, but one that isn't to be used unless you have no choice and are ready to take the risk. This was explained by Signum in StrikerS ep 9.

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-07, 10:09

What do you mean? When you can fly, you can blast floors and ceilings as well.
See episode 1.

"Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight." By C2F.

A 3-dimensional maze is more complex than a 2-dimensional one. There would be alot more possibilities to the right answer. Going straight isn't the absolute answer.

See Logic.

In episode 12, it's stated that Vivio can survive a direct blast from Dieci's cannon.

Yes, and Nanoha knows this through divine intervention.

You have a habit of not looking from characters' point of view, haven't you.... With this, and back with Vivio strapped onto the table.

Nightengale

2007-08-07, 10:11

Sigh... You're as low as Jail.

Well, sorry for that. For your information, I LOVE seeing main characters going through an emotional and physical mind-fuckish hell before obtaining their happy ending.

I thrive in happiness obtained from suffering. For now, Nanoha's suffer-level hasn't filled my quota, though Vivio had contributed a lot. Much less needs to be said about some other characters, but since Nanoha is the title character and the one linked to "so-called strains", and a deeper emotional bond to the plot-device that ties StrikerS just like how S1 was Fate/Alicia/Precia and A's was Hayate/Reinforce, I want to be hopeful.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 10:39

Freid's surprised look at 10:35 is priceless :D

http://perso.edulang.com/anime/Nanoha%20StrikerS%2019%2010.35a.jpg

http://perso.edulang.com/anime/Nanoha%20StrikerS%2019%2010.35b.jpg

I demand a shop of the words "O RLY?" at the second pic!!!

Fabien

2007-08-07, 10:42

Well, sorry for that. For your information, I LOVE seeing main characters going through an emotional and physical mind-fuckish hell before obtaining their happy ending.

Yup, exactly like Jail, except that he might not have the same definition of "happy ending".

I'm completely the opposite: I really like it when nothing bad is happening. That's why Card Captor Sakura is the anime series I like the most.

The MGLN staff knows that, and created different episodes to fit our different needs :)

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 10:49

Jimmy C

2007-08-07, 10:59

"Well, that's the problem with a 3-dimensional maze, it's not always straight."

When you are at the starting point, know the direction of your destination, can fly and have the firepower to blow away all obstructions in your path, the problem is still reduced to a straight line.
Of course, that only works if they know exactly which room she's in, so they can avoid blowing it up. Otherwise, can't blow away multiple walls with one shot, too risky.

Deathkillz

2007-08-07, 11:01

Yup, exactly like Jail, except that he might not have the same definition of "happy ending".

I'm completely the opposite: I really like it when nothing bad is happening. That's why Card Captor Sakura is the anime series I like the most.

The MGLN staff knows that, and created different episodes to fit our different needs :)
a kind of "childish" way of thought but what the heck ~ we all like different things and i do admit that i would just love to see nanoha get beaten up (the girl has been haxx all her life >.> not counting that accident but that is all in the past...)

problem with this series is that it can hardly be called "mahou shoujo" while it was for S2 and S2 ~ i would just like it better if the producers realised that the girls have grown up enough to face some real disasters...so fars its going good but im not sure if they are willing to push it that much further...

Fabien

2007-08-07, 11:15

It's no fun when nothing really bad happens

Anybody can make an interesting anime by making characters suffer.
But making a good anime where nothing bad happens, requires real talent.

, I like the feeling when it's uncertain if any of the main characters sees the ending at all. So I completely support Nightengale's point of view.

It seems that there are two kind of viewers: those who are interested in the story, and those who are interested in the characters. You seem to be more in the first category; I'm definitely completely in the second one.

MGLN staff is overprotective imho. They're afraid to let even the minor characters die.

Yup, for guys like me, who care about the characters.

In a war anime, when the Good Side wins, all's fine, even if dozens of characters were killed in the process. If possible, the hero (if any) should be alive, but that's all.

But Riot Force 6 just doesn't feel like a military division. It's more like a family. So if anyone is dead, there can't be a happy ending. Everything's fine inbetween (characters too hurt to have an active part anymore, Fate being tortured by her own mother, Reinforce slowly killing Hayate from the inside and hating herself for it, Ginga brainwashed, Vivio in a not-so-comfortable position and Nanoha forced to watch, etc.), but you have to have a true happy end, with every Good Guy and every redeemable Bad Guy alive, happy and friendly.

johnjefferson3

2007-08-07, 11:23

appearly jail is so evil that it looks like he made, the creators of the strikers website forget to renew their domain name, it was working yeasterday but for at least the next 12 hours,it now leads to something totally differnet, but yes, it still is www.nanoha.com, i would like to get your opion on what in the hell is going on, but this is really dissapointing news to hear though, i hope at least someone copied all the numbers information in graphic form!!!!

p.s from looking from the prewiew and with the next fgew epsiodes allready named, it looks like the main battle is going to start alot eailer than people though, and will start to speed up dramatically right now!!!!!

arkhangelsk

2007-08-07, 11:31

A dangerous tool is not one that will surely harm you, but one that isn't to be used unless you have no choice and are ready to take the risk. This was explained by Signum in StrikerS ep 9.

Yeah, but the way it ended up, it made a real joke out of the whole proposition of danger, which is then crudely integrated in StrikerS Ep9. I'm not saying Nanoha has to puke blood in a forest like Zest, but at least do something that makes it clear it was close - a couple of cracks on Raising Heart, maybe Nanoha fainting like Hayate, even a brief spell of nausea would do.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 11:33

Anybody can make an interesting anime by making characters suffer.
But making a good anime where nothing bad happens, requires real talent.

You have a point, but StrikerS pretend to have a serious plot, so when the main villain, who is also portrayed like quite a mad freak, starts to make excuses for not killing anybody it just doesn't feel right.

It seems that there are two kind of viewers: those who are interested in the story, and those who are interested in the characters. You seem to be more in the first category; I'm definitely completely in the second one.

I'm interested in the characters too, but I think at least some of them could contribute to the whole picture better if they died dramatically.

Yup, for guys like me, who care about the characters.

In a war anime, when the Good Side wins, all's fine, even if dozens of characters were killed in the process. If possible, the hero (if any) should be alive, but that's all.

But Riot Force 6 just doesn't feel like a military division. It's more like a family. So if anyone is dead, there can't be a happy ending. Everything's fine inbetween (characters too hurt to have an active part anymore, Fate being tortured by her own mother, Reinforce slowly killing Hayate from the inside and hating herself for it, Ginga brainwashed, Vivio in a not-so-comfortable position and Nanoha forced to watch, etc.), but you have to have a true happy end, with every Good Guy and every redeemable Bad Guy alive, happy and friendly.

But it is a war anime (presumably), and RF6 is a military division. So they could've make the general mood more fitting to that.

True happy end isn't my thing I'm afraid. And it's quite unrealistic either. I don't ask for something like the endings of Saikano or Texhnolyze, just a bittersweet one would suffice.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 11:38

([Nanoha] has been haxx all her life

Well, if she wasn't exceptional, there would be no point in making an anime centered on her.

(In fact, the most incredible thing about her is that she has a normal family: a father and a mother, and two siblings, all alive, healty, and who love her.)

problem with this series is that it can hardly be called "mahou shoujo" while it was for S2 and S2 ~ i would just like it better if the producers realised that the girls have grown up enough to face some real disasters

The girls did grow up, but the audience didn't.
The target audience for StrikerS is the people who liked A's. So, it's pretty normal to make an anime with roughly the same structure as A's, only twice as long.
1st phase: introducing the characters; everyday life, with a few little fights. 8.5 episodes in A's, 15 episodes in StrikerS.
2nd phase: now for a serious problem. 3 episodes in A's (middle of ep 8 -> middle of ep 11), at least 4 episodes (and probably more -- maybe two more or so) in StrikerS.
3rd phase: It's time to stop weeping and to kick ass instead. 1.5 episodes in A's (the second half of ep 11, and ep 12); length unknown in StrikerS (something like 3 or 4 episodes, probably).
4rd phase: epilogue, tying up loose ends. 1 episode in A's; 1 or 2 episodes in StrikerS I suppose.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 11:58

You have a point, but StrikerS pretend to have a serious plot,

You're right. It pretends to have a serious plot.
The real plot is "Nanoha gets new friends".

so when the main villain, who is also portrayed like quite a mad freak, starts to make excuses for not killing anybody it just doesn't feel right.

If he's a mad freak, how can you foresee what he'll be thinking?
Besides, the explanation that a creator of life is reluctant to destroy life, seems reasonable to me.

I'm interested in the characters too, but I think at least some of them could contribute to the whole picture better if they died dramatically.

It'd be nice if your parents (or your kids, your wife, whatever) died dramatically, it'd make your life more interesting :p
Yes, I know, MGLN is just an anime. But an anime where the viewer is meant to care for the characters.

But it is a war anime (presumably), and RF6 is a military division. So they could've make the general mood more fitting to that.

There are dozens of war animes. Why make yet another one?
The "military" thing has never been taken seriously in MGLN. Just look at Lindy in season 1. (Chrono is trying to create a "military mood", but he fails against Lindy and Amy. I can imagine his suffering when Lindy waves her handerchief at him in ep 8, or when Amy tells Nanoha to comes and play on the military ship in ep 13 :D)

True happy end isn't my thing I'm afraid.

I'm afraid MGLN isn't your thing.

And it's quite unrealistic either.

And I suppose you think magic is realistic?

I don't ask for something like the endings of Saikano or Texhnolyze, just a bittersweet one would suffice.

There's a hell of a lot of animes where that happens. I like MGLN because it's different from the crowd.

serenade_beta

2007-08-07, 12:18

appearly jail is so evil that it looks like he made, the creators of the strikers website forget to renew their domain name, it was working yeasterday but for at least the next 12 hours,it now leads to something totally differnet, but yes, it still is www.nanoha.com, i would like to get your opion on what in the hell is going on, but this is really dissapointing news to hear though, i hope at least someone copied all the numbers information in graphic form!!!!

Wow! This IS wierd. I got to a home selling thing... Well, I saved all of the Numbers profiles as well as Scaglietti and Lutecia, so oh well...

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 12:23

You're right. It pretends to have a serious plot.
The real plot is "Nanoha gets new friends".

I don't find it good.

If he's a mad freak, how can you foresee what he'll be thinking?
Besides, the explanation that a creator of life is reluctant to destroy life, seems reasonable to me.

I was protecting Jail in several threads earlier and everybody tried to convince me that he doesn't really care for human lives. Now I suggest him to be more cruel and meet opposition again. Oh irony :rolleyes:

It'd be nice if your parents (or your kids, your wife, whatever) died dramatically, it'd make your life more interesting :p
Yes, I know, MGLN is just an anime. But an anime where the viewer is meant to care for the characters.

Some people died (probably not dramatically enough though), more will follow, myself included, it's life.
MGLN is an anime where heroes are supposed to face quite serious threats. When nobody ends up dead or at least hurt noticably it just doesn't contribute to the mood. For example I don't consider Jail&Co as dangerous as I could if they acted a bit different. I'd like their characters much more in such case. I care for the characters but in a different way it seems. I don't think about them as some fragile cute dolls I should adore and protect from any troubles.

There are dozens of war animes. Why make yet another one?
The "military" thing has never been taken seriously in MGLN. Just look at Lindy in season 1. (Chrono is trying to create a "military mood", but he fails against Lindy and Amy. I can imagine his suffering when Lindy waves her handerchief at him in ep 8, or when Amy tells Nanoha to comes and play on the military ship in ep 13 :D)

Like we don't have enough anime filled with cute characters doing nothing.

Military not taken serious makes TSAB look incompetent and absolutely incapable of the achievements they claim to have reached. Not a good thing imho.

I'm afraid MGLN isn't your thing.

Yeah, sure, thanks for the enlightenment.

And I suppose you think magic is realistic?

They try to describe it as realistic as they can.

There's a hell of a lot of animes where that happens. I like MGLN because it's different from the crowd.

And twice as many where it doesn't. Anyway seasons 1 and 2 were really different from the crowd, StrikerS I wouldn't call that.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 13:00

I don't find it good.

I noticed that (I even wonder why you watch the series).
I was just trying to explain how the three seasons of MGLN work.

I was protecting Jail in several threads earlier and everybody tried to convince me that he doesn't really care for human lives. Now I suggest him to be more cruel and meet opposition again. Oh irony :rolleyes:

I kinda was in the "Jail's not a complete monster" side.
Besides, one can try to avoid needlessly killing, and still do what needs to be done to achieve his goals.

Some people died (probably not dramatically enough though), more will follow, myself included, it's life.

Yeah, it's life -- each one of us will die eventually. But you seem to have missed the "It'd be nice if..." part.
[I'm not sure I'm too clear here. If not, just read on...]

I care for the characters but in a different way it seems. I don't think about them as some fragile cute dolls I should adore and protect from any troubles.

You wanted some characters to die. Now, please name some characters you want to see dead, and tell me you care about them.

Military not taken serious makes TSAB look incompetent and absolutely incapable of the achievements they claim to have reached.

Well, compare Lindy who looks like a airhead but gets the job done, and Regius who's overly serious but completely incompetent.

Anyway seasons 1 and 2 were really different from the crowd, StrikerS I wouldn't call that.

Do you really think there's a big difference between the first two seasons and the third?

Fabien

2007-08-07, 13:24

the creators of the strikers website forget to renew their domain name

That's incredibly lame of them.
For now, just go to http://202.133.123.135/.

(Just in case someone is interested, here's how I got the address:

First, I went to the Nanoha page on animenfo. I clicked on "Studio: ivory", which brought me to http://www.ivory.co.jp/.
With a "nslookup -ty=NS ivory.co.jp", I got Ivory's nameserver: ns4.cpi.ad.jp.
Then I asked that server what the right address for www.nanoha.com was: "nslookup www.nanoha.com ns4.cpi.ad.jp".)

krisslanza

2007-08-07, 13:38

Hmmm... Saw the episode and I have one question really... What were the things the Numbers attacked and destroyed? Anyone know? They look like weapons.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 13:44

I noticed that (I even wonder why you watch the series).
I was just trying to explain how the three seasons of MGLN work.

Don't feel like explaining the reasons but looks like they're different from yours at least.
If it were really as simple as your explanation I'd feel bad for the series.

I kinda was in the "Jail's not a complete monster" side.
Besides, one can try to avoid needlessly killing, and still do what needs to be done to achieve his goals.

Oh well, it was kinda my point back then as well. I don't like how he's being continuously portrayed as a madman recently though, I'd prefer him as a calm and calculating type.

Yeah, it's life -- each one of us will die eventually. But you seem to have missed the "It'd be nice if..." part.
[I'm not sure I'm too clear here. If not, just read on...]

I didn't miss anything, just don't want to become personal here, though if you insist ...

You wanted some characters to die. Now, please name some characters you want to see dead, and tell me you care about them.

Maybe we use different definitions of caring, but whatever, here you go (I'll use a minor character as example for now): Zafira - he's unlikely to shine anywhere until the end of the season, so his existence now is simply pitiful; he could've had a dramatic last stand scene (a la Archer in F/SN) and die proudly, his death also having a major impact on the rest of the Knights; his character would've become something more than a target for jokes from the audience; that's the way I care about him.

Well, compare Lindy who looks like a airhead but gets the job done, and Regius who's overly serious but completely incompetent.

That's a point to needle the scenarists/producers, not me. Also seen in many anime, so MSLN isn't being original here.

Do you really think there's a big difference between the first two seasons and the third?

I don't think, I feel the difference. And it can't be changed by any visual similarities.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 13:50

Hmmm... Saw the episode and I have one question really... What were the things the Numbers attacked and destroyed? Anyone know? They look like weapons.

Apparently it was the Einharjars, Regius' little "secret" pet project.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 13:55

...dramatic last stand scene (a la XXX in XXX) and die proudly

I'll answer to your post later, but just a quick note: you might want to add a "spoiler" tag, for those who have yet to watch the series you mention.

Key Board

2007-08-07, 14:21

I really get the impression that this season will end "Lyrical Nanoha"

if there is a fourth season based on the same universe she won't be the titular character. And frankly, it's about time. You can argue that season one and two was more about Fate and Hayate

In other words, I subscribe to the Nanoha retires as a mage theory. It will make her family history full circle too. If she decides to run a cake shop in Midchilda afterwards, even better.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 14:22

I'll answer to your post later, but just a quick note: you might want to add a "spoiler" tag, for those who have yet to watch the series you mention.

I'll only do this for the currently running series, no sense in being overprotective regarding the older stuff.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 14:33

I'll only do this for the currently running series, no sense in being overprotective regarding the older stuff.

Well, you can be pretty sure that readers have watched seasons 1 and 2 of MGLN, but you don't know about unrelated series. For example, I watched a few episodes of FSN, and haven't yet reached the event you mention. So, you spoiled it.
(To be honest, I don't really think I'll continue watching FSN, but other readers might.)

Fabien

2007-08-07, 14:38

if there is a fourth season based on the same universe she won't be the titular character. And frankly, it's about time.

You can argue that season one and two was more about Fate and Hayate

And third season is more about Subaru.
I think she can stay the "'main" character, because she has a knack to bring other people into the spotlight.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 14:52

Oh well, it was kinda my point back then as well. I don't like how he's being continuously portrayed as a madman recently though, I'd prefer him as a calm and calculating type.

He's still calculating, and acting for his interests. That little show with Vivio is definitely calculated.
He has a madman's laugh, but it could be an act.

Maybe we use different definitions of caring, but whatever, here you go (I'll use a minor character as example for now): Zafira - he's unlikely to shine anywhere until the end of the season, so his existence now is simply pitiful; he could've had a dramatic last stand scene and die proudly, his death also having a major impact on the rest of the Knights; his character would've become something more than a target for jokes from the audience; that's the way I care about him.

OK. I think I understand now; I hadn't thought of that point of view. I think we have a completely different view of the notion of "character".
You kinda sound like Zafira is conscious of the viewer's existence. Or, said differently, you care about Zafira's image in the eye of the viewer.

I, OTOH, take what I see at face value. I treat Zafira as a real human being, who doesn't know I'm watching him live.
[Well, he's not exactly human, and I don't really care about him that much, but you see the point.]

Let's take another example: Ginga is a nice girl, so I'd feel bad if she died. Whether she's an actual living girl or an anime character, whether or not she'll have a lot of screen time in the remaining episodes of Nanoha StrikerS, changes nothing to that feeling (except of course it'll be far more intense and durable if it happened IRL).
MGLN/Nanohaverse is kinda unique in the sense that danger and the possibility of death exist, but God/the author cares about the people who live in that universe, and won't kill them just for the beauty of the show.

That's a point to needle the scenarists/producers, not me. Also seen in many anime

And in real life too. People who actually get the job done have better to do than caring about military status and decorum.

I don't think, I feel the difference.

I respect that, but of course we can't discuss the subject then.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 14:54

Well, you can be pretty sure that readers have watched seasons 1 and 2 of MGLN, but you don't know about unrelated series. For example, I watched a few episodes of FSN, and haven't yet reached the event you mention. So, you spoiled it.
(To be honest, I don't really think I'll continue watching FSN, but other readers might.)

Oh well, I got kinda used to constant spoilers for all kinds of unrelated series in OC thread :rolleyes: And I honestly don't consider information about the stuff that's more than a year old spoilers. Spike dies.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 15:16

And I honestly don't consider information about the stuff that's more than a year old spoilers.

So, you've never, ever, overlooked a series, and discovered it long after it was released. And you have no backlog of series to watch later.
I must say it's impressive.

Ah well, at least that gives me a(nother) reason not to watch FSN.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 15:20

He's still calculating, and acting for his interests. That little show with Vivio is definitely calculated.
He has a madman's laugh, but it could be an act.

If I said this during one of the discussions earlier I'd get a ton of counterarguments :rolleyes: Personally I'd like your words to be true and preserve an image of cool-headed Jail.

OK. I think I understand now; I hadn't thought of that point of view. I think we have a completely different view of the notion of "character".
You kinda sound like Zafira is conscious of the viewer's existence. Or, said differently, you care about Zafira's image in the eye of the viewer.

I, OTOH, take what I see at face value. I treat Zafira as a real human being, who doesn't know I'm watching him live.
[Well, he's not exactly human, and I don't really care about him that much, but you see the point.]

Let's take another example: Ginga is a nice girl, so I'd feel bad if she died. Whether she's an actual living girl or an anime character, whether or not she'll have a lot of screen time in the remaining episodes of Nanoha StrikerS, changes nothing to that feeling (except of course it'll be far more intense and durable if it happened IRL).
MGLN/Nanohaverse is kinda unique in the sense that danger and the possibility of death exist, but God/the author cares about the people who live in that universe, and won't kill them just for the beauty of the show.

Well, we understood each other it seems. There were times I cared about the charaters your way, Cowboy Bebop comes to mind for example. But seriously, the inflation of the characters' cast isn't going to end well. Seeing a character being shafted for no apparent reason makes me wonder if it was worthwhile to introduce him/her at all. It's not bad to care about characters' lives but everyone can be kept in absolute safety only when nothing happens; as soon as there's some threat it's perfectly realistic to expect deaths as well (IRL people die in far less dangerous situations than shown in StrikerS). The presence of some kind of guardian angel/plot armor becomes too obvious otherwise.

And in real life too. People who actually get the job done have better to do than caring about military status and decorum.

No RL military acts like TSAB; apparently their successful development so far is nothing else than a plot device. BTW show me a case which Lindy solved by herself without some convenient "miracle" happening?

I respect that, but of course we can't discuss the subject then.

Of course. And do you think there's a possibility of a non-subjective point of view? Unless we ask for an opinion of a professional aime-critic, probably :rolleyes: Still for me what I feel watching the series myself is the thing that matters.

EDIT:

So, you've never, ever, overlooked a series, and discovered it long after it was released. And you have no backlog of series to watch later.
I must say it's impressive.

Ah well, at least that gives me a(nother) reason not to watch FSN.

There is some backlog and overlooked series of course, but nothing of such importance I'd care about the spoilers.

Fabien

2007-08-07, 15:40

Seeing a character being shafted for no apparent reason

Zafira was Vivio's pet/guardian. Vivio has been abducted, so he became useless.
With the revival of the Asura, the action is now in space. So the helicopter isn't needed anymore, and as a consequence, Vice isn't either.
Besides, those two are males, so they don't really count.

Any other example?

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-07, 15:51

Zafira was Vivio's pet/guardian. Vivio has been abducted, so he became useless.
With the revival of the Asura, the action is now in space. So the helicopter isn't needed anymore, and as a consequence, Vice isn't either.
Besides, those two are males, so they don't really count.

Any other example?

Oh, they're not as shafted as Arf, Arisa, Suzuka, Amy, who else ... Lindy herself, well, I wouldn't say Chrono gets enough time, ah yes, there's also Yuuno; I don't know why new characters like Acous and Schach were introduced to be shown just in a couple of scenes.
The action isn't in space if my eyes don't fail me, and the failcopter is still there with a new pilot (another candidate for showing up once or twice episodically). Vice could've had quite a decent development BTW.
N/C on Zafira becoming useless, he's the same Wolkenritter as Signum or Vita.
Males, duh? N/C (good thing we have OC and Fanfic threads here).

Meophist

2007-08-07, 16:39

There is some backlog and overlooked series of course, but nothing of such importance I'd care about the spoilers.That reminds me, I need to finish watching Figure 17. It's my favourite anime ever and yet I still haven't got past much more than half-way.

Skane

2007-08-07, 17:09

That reminds me, I need to finish watching Figure 17. It's my favourite anime ever and yet I still haven't got past much more than half-way.
You should. The 2nd Half of Figure 17 is REALLY good, in a emotional heart-tugging sort of way. Seen Ep10 yet?

Cheers.

narmi

2007-08-07, 18:43

Wow.... I can't wait for the final episodes, I hope they make the ending as great as A's.

Why did they have to put a scene where Vivio is screaming and crying. Now it's stuck in my head and I can't get it out. Hmm don't you think Nanoha is going to turn back into the White devil? Hehe I hope she does with that I can't wait the a fight scene between Subaru and Ginga, its going to be a blast (hope Ginga doesn't get "killed") now that would be sad.

Hmmm in my opinion I think Vivio will die including Ginga and there will be a battle (a small scene) between the Asura and the new ship Jail is using. Zafira will put his life at risk to save Vivio, Chrono will have his screen time in a fight.

S_K

2007-08-07, 18:58

Chrono better get some show time, so does that mean Ginga is the unknown number 2?
NOO! I actually liked Vice

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-07, 19:01

Why did they have to put a scene where Vivio is screaming and crying. Now it's stuck in my head and I can't get it out.

You'll get used to it.

Hmm don't you think Nanoha is going to turn back into the White devil? Hehe I hope she does with that I can't wait the a fight scene between Subaru and Ginga, its going to be a blast (hope Ginga doesn't get "killed") now that would be sad.

Now that you're mention it, who is Nanoha going to fight? Every other Number?

She's the only one I don't recall having an opponent in the OP.

And I seriously doubt it's the WHOLE 'Cradle'.

Hmmm in my opinion I think Vivio will die including Ginga and there will be a battle (a small scene) between the Asura and the new ship Jail is using. Zafira will put his life at risk to save Vivio, Chrono will have his screen time in a fight.

While I won't denial the possibility of one or both, of the two girls dying (Despite the odds stack against that), I don't think Zafira is up to it just yet :heh:

Chrono is troubling though...

Chrono better get some show time, so does that mean Ginga is the unknown number 2?
NOO! I actually liked Vice

No, Number II is already in active duty long before they captured Ginga.

Meophist

2007-08-07, 19:23

You should. The 2nd Half of Figure 17 is REALLY good, in a emotional heart-tugging sort of way. Seen Ep10 yet?

Cheers.No, I don't think so, so don't spoil it for me. I think I'll go watch it soon, although I'm somewhat surprised that you know of it. It seemed to have been one of those hidden gem type of series.

Fabien

2007-08-08, 00:11

Chrono better get some show time, so does that mean Ginga is the unknown number 2?

Nope. If you look at the preview for next episode, you'll see see's Number XIII.

Fabien

2007-08-08, 00:14

Oh, they're not as shafted as Arf, Arisa, Suzuka, Amy, who else ...

I suppose the idea is to keep the universe and the main character, but renew the cast to avoid boredom.

Fabien

2007-08-08, 00:18

Why did they have to put a scene where Vivio is screaming and crying. [...] Hmmm in my opinion I think Vivio will die including Ginga

MGLN authors love to torture little girls (e.g. Fate in season 1), but don't like to kill them.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-08, 04:15

Nope. If you look at the preview for next episode, you'll see see's Number XIII.

Any screencap of decent quality with that?

Miles Teg

2007-08-08, 04:50

Any screencap of decent quality with that?

The Mie TV raw is too blurry to clearly see the number, we will have to wait for a better raw or for next week episode ;)

But I think it's possible to see the "X" and the first "I" on this screencap.

http://img455.imageshack.us/img455/4655/capture0du6.th.png (http://img455.imageshack.us/my.php?image=capture0du6.png)

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-08, 04:59

The Mie TV raw is too blurry to clearly see the number, we will have to wait for a better raw or for next week episode ;)

But I think it's possible to see the "X" and the first "I" on this screencap.

http://img455.imageshack.us/img455/4655/capture0du6.th.png (http://img455.imageshack.us/my.php?image=capture0du6.png)

It could be XIV as well, hard to see exactly.

Tokkan

2007-08-08, 05:09

It could be XIV as well, hard to see exactly.

Why would it be a FOURTEEN when there was only 12 Numbers prior to Ginga being turned into a Number?

Fabien

2007-08-08, 05:09

It could be XIV as well, hard to see exactly.

Since there were twelve Numbers before they captured Ginga, it's highly possible for her number to be XIII...

Estavali

2007-08-08, 06:03

Urgh, no matter how I look at it, Ginga's number looks like a "II". I doubt it's XIII unless that image is really that garbled, but it looks like 2 Roman numerals to me instead of 4.

This brings a thought to mind though. What if Due really is a shape-shifter (as some of our friends here have suggested), and this Ginga is really her taking Gin-nee's form (and if her abilities allow, maybe skills as well)?

I really need flsnow's HQ subs now.

Key Board

2007-08-08, 06:14

It's clearly X followed by several I numerals

she's not Due

please accept it

Fabien

2007-08-08, 06:28

Urgh, no matter how I look at it, Ginga's number looks like a "II".

You definitely should have your eyes checked.
There are at least three Roman numerals: a "I" in the middle, one on the left ("X" I think), one or more on the right. That definitely can't make "II".

Fabien

2007-08-08, 06:39

she's not Due

please accept it

Hey, now I've got it!
Eight years ago, Nanoha was badly hurt and... didn't survive. Duo secretly took her place, and has been acting as Nanoha all this time.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-08, 08:13

Why would it be a FOURTEEN when there was only 12 Numbers prior to Ginga being turned into a Number?

Because XIII is taken already :heh: And as there're Ivory spies in OC thread they surely know about it :heh:

- - -

Hey, now I've got it!
Eight years ago, Nanoha was badly hurt and... didn't survive. Duo secretly took her place, and has been acting as Nanoha all this time.

That'd be fun. But I thought you didn't want to see any major characters dead :rolleyes:

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-08, 08:22

Because XIII is taken already :heh: And as there're Ivory spies in OC thread they surely know about it :heh:

Or perhaps they're saving that spot for Subaru.

After all the doctor spotted her before he could possibly know about Ginga.

Fabien

2007-08-08, 08:39

That'd be fun. But I thought you didn't want to see any major characters dead :rolleyes:

I don't want any character to die, major or not.

But it's different if a character is already dead (e.g. Chrono's father or Tiana's brother).

narmi

2007-08-08, 09:46

Hey, now I've got it!
Eight years ago, Nanoha was badly hurt and... didn't survive. Duo secretly took her place, and has been acting as Nanoha all this time.

Lol, what a twist!

Anyway someone earlier called out that Ginga would be turned into a number and was right. I salute you for making a good call :heh:. Hmm now lets wait and see if Ginga get destroyed or saved before it's too late.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-08, 10:02

I don't want any character to die, major or not.

But it's different if a character is already dead (e.g. Chrono's father or Tiana's brother).

So off-screen deaths are alright? Why is it different? All people are equal. The characters you named were killed by the scenarists for the sake of the plot, following your previous logic wouldn't it be nicer for their families if they stayed alive?

Fabien

2007-08-08, 10:41

So off-screen deaths are alright? Why is it different? All people are equal. The characters you named were killed by the scenarists for the sake of the plot, following your previous logic wouldn't it be nicer for their families if they stayed alive?

I've never known my great-grandfather. So I don't care for his death, I don't weep for him.
OTOH, if my father died now, that would be an entirely different story.

Chrono's father has been dead for a long time. As far as the viewer is concerned, he's never really been alive. I've never known him, so I can't really care for him. His death is not really an event, it's a state: Chrono's a fatherless guy, and has always been so, since the beginning of the series.
OTOH, if Lindy was to die now, that would be an event, a change of state ; and I would be kinda saddened, because I know her, and care for her. And that would be quite a shock for Chrono too.

All people are equal.

... but some people are more equal than others.

An Hero in Disguise

2007-08-08, 12:27

I've never known my great-grandfather. So I don't care for his death, I don't weep for him.
OTOH, if my father died now, that would be an entirely different story.

Chrono's father has been dead for a long time. As far as the viewer is concerned, he's never really been alive. I've never known him, so I can't really care for him. His death is not really an event, it's a state: Chrono's a fatherless guy, and has always been so, since the beginning of the series.
OTOH, if Lindy was to die now, that would be an event, a change of state ; and I would be kinda saddened, because I know her, and care for her. And that would be quite a shock for Chrono too.

... but some people are more equal than others.

Oh well, I see. As it's not exactly on the thread's topic anymore I'll be satisfied with that.

Jimmy C

2007-08-08, 14:09

To those worried about the Knights' mortality, you can relax. It sounds like they'll last as long as a regular human. And they're rather glad to be able to live and die as people instead of spending an eternity as unchanging programs. If they last until Hayate peacefully passes away, they will consider it a life well spent.
Accous recognises Scag's ship as the Cradle of the Saints. Scaglietti says it destroyed the ancient world (one of them anyway) I am so disappointed, what kind of warlord considers "Cradle" to be a suitable name for a super warship?

Estavali

2007-08-08, 16:24

You definitely should have your eyes checked.
There are at least three Roman numerals: a "I" in the middle, one on the left ("X" I think), one or more on the right. That definitely can't make "II".

Well, I double-checked the image and the flsnow sub I mentioned, and.... you guys are right. It's XIII. Shucks, there goes my "Due-in-disguise" theory.

Well, looks like I really need to change my spectacles :P.

To those worried about the Knights' mortality, you can relax. It sounds like they'll last as long as a regular human. And they're rather glad to be able to live and die as people instead of spending an eternity as unchanging programs. If they last until Hayate peacefully passes away, they will consider it a life well spent.

I wondered if they can heal themselves in the case of very severe damage by returning to the Tome and rebuilding themselves in it.

But then again, IIRC, after the last battle in A's, they were permanently separated from it, no?

Accous recognises Scag's ship as the Cradle of the Saints. Scaglietti says it destroyed the ancient world (one of them anyway) I am so disappointed, what kind of warlord considers "Cradle" to be a suitable name for a super warship?

Someone with a strange/twisted sense of humor perhaps. Imagine losting everything you hold precious to a Cradle. It's like a very bad joke, even a cruel one.

FlameSparkZ

2007-08-08, 17:46

Accous recognises Scag's ship as the Cradle of the Saints. Scaglietti says it destroyed the ancient world (one of them anyway) I am so disappointed, what kind of warlord considers "Cradle" to be a suitable name for a super warship?
Since Vivio is the Vessel of the Saints, it makes sense that the ship is called Cradle...in a way...:heh:

I guess 'Throne of the Saints' wouldn't be a suitable name...:uhoh:

Ultima_Rasengan05

2007-08-08, 18:50

I guess since Vivio is a little girl and cries like a little baby, "cradle" would be a suitable name for someone who fits that description...think of it as a real "cradle" to carry a little child while powering some kind of large ship that can cause huge amounts of damage.

I'm starting to think that the way how the final battle will go, it will be similar to something that I've watched before and its called "Black Cat", but hopefully it won't feel rushed though...only 7 more episodes left.
But seriously a giant ship...why couldn't Scaglietti do to what he did to Ginga...make Vivio go against RF6 all brainwashed and stuff and with barrier jacket and device.

Jimmy C

2007-08-08, 22:25

I wondered if they can heal themselves in the case of very severe damage by returning to the Tome and rebuilding themselves in it.

They can't do that because they are not only seperated from the Book, but the Book itself has been seal away for good. What Hayate currently carries is a replica, not the original Book.

make Vivio go against RF6 all brainwashed and stuff and with barrier jacket and device.

You're not thinking big enough. To him, RF6 is just another set of obstacles in his way. He needs Vivio and the ship to reach his real goals. The first of which is the destruction of GC it seems.

I'm betting the Cradle is headed for GC too. If RF6 can penetrate its defenses quickly enough, there should only be Uno, Clinque and maybe Due onboard as defenders. Plus a horde of Drones of course, but those should be managable. As for any internal defenses built into the ship, it shouldn't be too heavy. After all, you wouldn't want them to blast holes through the ship's hull, right?

Estavali

2007-08-09, 00:59

It raises a thought. Could the ship also have its own guardians, which would be activated once the ship is operational?

Chaos2Frozen

2007-08-09, 01:04

It raises a thought. Could the ship also have its own guardians, which would be activated once the ship is operational?

Maybe, but I think that role would most likely fall to Drones... Seeing how Fate was busting them upside down in the Op.

Fabien

2007-08-09, 01:40

I wondered if they can heal themselves in the case of very severe damage by returning to the Tome and rebuilding themselves in it.

But then again, IIRC, after the last battle in A's, they were permanently separated from it, no?

They were indeed separated from it, and the Tome itself was destroyed.

(EDIT)
If there's no error in episode 10's subtitles, there are four devices around Hayate: Reinforce II, the Tome of the Azure Sky Rein carries, the Tome of the Night Sky (is that the original one?) Hayate carries, and Schwertkreuz (Hayate's staff I suppose).
Not sure how all those are related to each other and to the Wolkenritters. But the Knights are not completely separate, since they can unison with Rein.

Fabien

2007-08-09, 01:43

I'm betting the Cradle is headed for GC too.

GC is a joke, Scag doesn't need anything big to destroy it.
Nope, if anything, the Cradle is headed to TSAB main branch's headquarters, which are in space (or interdimentional space?), thus the need for a ship.

Fabien

2007-08-09, 01:49

Could the ship also have its own guardians, which would be activated once the ship is operational?

I don't think so. The Wolkenritters were needed by the Tome to collect magical power and fill in its pages. There's no such need with the Cradle.

Jimmy C

2007-08-09, 02:17

GC is a joke, Scag doesn't need anything big to destroy it.

Well, he'd probably want the demolition done fast. Besides, the ship is on Mid-Childa anyway. Then he'll head for HQ.

Hayate's current Tome of the Night Sky is probably a replica instead of the original. In ep19, Shamal mentions that Hayate herself can provide emergency restoration and magic power to them, but that ability is gradually diminishing.

Could the ship also have its own guardians, which would be activated once the ship is operational?

I wouldn't be too surprised if the ship had internal defenses designed to repel boarders. However, they probably aren't too powerful. If their weapons were, say antitank for example, there's a risk of blowing holes in the main hull while attacking the intruders. It's like how Air Marshals carry those special bullets that can penetrate flesh but shatter if they hit the plane's skin. Of course, this only applies if they designers used common sense. If they were nuts, all bets are off.