View Full Version : (MFI) Zero no Tsukaima (second series) - Episode 10 Discussion / Poll
Pellissier
2007-09-08, 13:17
Welcome to the discussion thread for Zero no Tsukaima (second series), Episode 10.
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Darknemo2000
2007-09-09, 16:42
The first part of the episode was interesting, the second part was kind of meh....
I wonder how they will use Saito and Louises arguement though as they cant use Julio card now, and also many characters (like Guiche) are dumbed down...
Also it seems that a lot of scenes will be ignored to jump to arguement (which doesn't look so convincing). I would like to see those ignored Saito/Louise and Siesta/Saito scenes (or that WILL be ignored in the future due to fact that only two eps left).
Zero No tsukaima is seriously too short... Though its not like second season is a hit or something (actually its very far from that) its still painful to watch good scenes getting so utterly ignored just for the sake of some fillers...
Yeah, I was hoping that they would reach to the "big" fight...but at this rate, I wonder where/how they are gonna end the 2nd season...i mean theres only 2 eps left right? If so, wouldn't they only get to the saito x ____ part?
Deathkillz
2007-09-09, 17:00
being so late into the series its really quite disappointing to see a "filler" type ep :uhoh:
well i guess the development was good but not what I am looking for at this stage - time to get worried :heh:
Darknemo2000
2007-09-09, 18:31
I still like it more than Agnes sub-plot that was half season long. At least it has Louise and Saito as main characters again. In this season they don't play all that much importance just like their "relationship" (Louise explosion on Saito at every episode ending anyone?).
Still..it feels kind of weird for a 12 ep season to have 7-8 filler, sub-plot based episodes. And thats all just to give us a very rushed ending (which I am guessing will be rushed or at least skipping out A LOT of scenes).
mist2123
2007-09-09, 20:23
here i thought he had no ammunition for the guns.
I think this ep was on par on last week's one... I mean it's the first time any of our main leads get some development. The end of the ep seems like a really good plot point. Maybe just maybe, we may get the marriage scene next week. But from the previews it seems like Louise wants to wear a cat costume. Seriously, Louise should just drop her "noble" beliefs once and for all. The fact that in the end she said she would die for the queen was dumb. I mean she said so much on the mountains and then said that she will die for the queen. Saito was like WTF I was like WTF too... Sheesh..Oh well, at least they left sort of a cliffhanger at the end so I am looking forward to next week. This ep gets a 7 for character development
asdffdsa
2007-09-09, 22:25
Can anyone put up translated, spoiler-tagged text for the teaser?
Darknemo2000
2007-09-10, 01:50
Certainly for a filler it had quite a bit of development,and development is not a word that one would use to describe Louise/Saito relationship as its usually ignored or getting resets...
However, the whole setting up for an arguement which should be big, seems kind of out of place and rather forced. Its natural, as they could not use original material set up for an arguement as they don't have enough episodes left or used some parts of setting already (Julio, for example).
in novels the arguement seemed more natural. And in anime, at least the setting of it, looks bit too weird and too forced to me.
Though I guess they have to do it this way as they don't have time at all, as they filler,sub-plot games in previous episodes are starting to hit them,and hit them hard...
Next week Preview/ Novels" Judging from preview they will be cramping cat-costume setting and marriage scene into one episode. Isn't that bit too much? The emotional setting is quite bit too different in them. Both scenes are worth a seperate episodes really, and SHOULD be seperate ones, also there should be Saito/Siesta kiss scene as well but if they would to put THAT also in a next weeks episode which also has to deal with Henrietta sending Louise to certain death as well it would kill all those scenes together. I already think that putting cat-costume and marriege scene into a single episode is very close to being a FAILURE.
Its as if those guys were sleeping up until now, and now they are like "Holy sh***! We have to put this and this and this scene! And that scene cannot be avoided too! Oh oh and this one is too good to miss as well!" cramping it all in a few episodes without real regard to emotional setting of them.
They simply played with fillers and Agnes sub-plot way too long... If it would be longer series then it would not be a problem but now they are forced to cramp main story-line of few volumes into a few episodes while dedicating the bigger half of a season for a detailed sub-plot and fillers...
Certainly, they might still be able to make it look decent... But with the experience I had so far with this season... I don't have much hope for a miracle...
I am pretty sure at this point in time the anime is just using all other girls as plot devices to develop Louise and saito much like how Siesta was reduced to a schemeing B***h in ep 4. I watched through the episode again and I thought the development was quite alright, It was probably about the standard of the 1st season. I cannot stress how much I hate the production staff for concentrating so much on Agnes for so many episodes and cramp the more important stuff. I don't really see "the wedding" happening this season honestly. Unless J.C.Staff has decided to extend the show for another season that is another 12 eps. Imo the wedding must be done together with the 1 v 70k and 1 v 70k must be done together with Tiffania and Louise resummoning Saito. So unless they extend the series, there is no way to give a decent run for those plots.
Darknemo2000
2007-09-10, 04:30
I would have to agree with you (but I guess you allready figured it out) that concentration too much on Agnes sub-plot is killing such short series (it would be ok with something at least 24 episodes long).
As forthe seeming mix of two different settings that we see in preview of next ep
"Marriage scene" is bit too different from cat-costume scene in terms of emotions, and I dont think they can make a good shift between moods , not at least with the director of this level... I am happy that they decided to give louise fan-service, yet it should happen not on the last episodes. The cat-costume setting should have taken place right after Julio showed up, and it would have looked more natural, not breaking too much things... Here it seems just bit too weird for me...
Oh and I guess Siesta-fans wont see Seista/Saito moments after all which I held to be one of the more important parts of volume 6-7... They simply got themselves cornered due to time limits and scenes that would involve Sesita would butcher the edning even more as they have to do a full focus on Saito/Louise without looking TOO retarded.
And yes I dont see the wedding happening in this season either...Its too rushed.But I guess J.C Staff doesnt care about it, as they prefer sub-plots and fillers over the main story anyway.
I have the feeling that they will sperate Saito vs 70 K scene from Tiffania, thus cramping it and marriage scene into two last apisodes... Yet they will be ignoring too much scenes this way...
Still I have this bad feeling that this season ending would be poorly done and butchered, compared to first seasons ending which I held to be one of the best parts of season 1...
Kazuma77
2007-09-10, 10:41
the best part was:
when Louise got half undressed and lay on unconsious Saito:D
X10A_Freedom
2007-09-10, 14:29
Now...I wonder how the Zero fighter plane will be recovered deep into enemy land...
The first part was decent, Saito doing moves which reminds me of Kira in the latter parts of Gundam Seed. Second part...bottleneck. It's a cultural divide which cannot be crossed...
Entertaining but rushed as usual. Not good.
I rate this episode as average, since we do not get to see the cream of the war but rather a thin ice sheet.
I do welcome the drama used to describe and explore Henrys' feelings in concern about fearing death in the battlefield, which forced him to break up his engagement.
But I do think the writers should had focused on the issues of covering the whole mission and what effects would have had repercuted for either side if Louise and Saito had accomplished it.
Simply, I do not see the use of spending another episode for single character exploration while they could had better put it to expand upon the whole issue of the war and answer several other questions regarding, for example, Sheffield.
JagdPanther
2007-09-11, 21:01
the best part was:
when Louise got half undressed and lay on unconsious Saito:D
Gonna be totally honest; that WAS the best part of a rather paltry episode.
It seemed rather out of place and rushed. We came right out of the Anies story and dumped into this with little or no warning. It had it's moments, but it wasn't really the best of episodes.
Wonder how this'll all wrap up.
Now...I wonder how the Zero fighter plane will be recovered deep into enemy land...
Why stop there? Where did he get the new ammo from? The guns they use are a far cry from the advanced machine guns in a Zero.
But hey, the thing has survived three crashes already.
I'm not raising anymore hope for the ending, I'll just crawl back to my hole and continue to read the novel.
I also agreed on the mis-focus on Agnes, I've never been such big fan of hers anyway...
maybe i'm missing something but why do they have to do the marriage scene in the next episode? i don't think they mentioned it in the preview. from what i can guess the next episode will be something like...
saito and louise talk about her dieing for the queen, saito storms out.
louise has talk with derflinger about why saito's so angry, this leads into cat scene
add in saito/siesta and something to spark the louise powder-keg(all episodes seem to have at least one) and you've got an episode. then in the next ep you can have the big fight and tiffinia and resummoning and all that good stuff...eh, useless conjecture till next week comes around:p
anywho, gave the ep a 7/10. liked the fact we're back to the main characters, liked the romance twixt the two...second half couldn't keep up.
neutralizer
2007-09-12, 01:33
Now...I wonder how the Zero fighter plane will be recovered deep into enemy land...
The first part was decent, Saito doing moves which reminds me of Kira in the latter parts of Gundam Seed. Second part...bottleneck. It's a cultural divide which cannot be crossed...
Entertaining but rushed as usual. Not good.
It seemed like it crashed just past the city so it shouldn't be that far into enemy land.
Sorrow-K
2007-09-12, 05:46
I'm going to echo what Darknemo2000 and JagdPanther have said: too much of that felt forced and out of place. The whole thing surrounding the characters different justifications for fighting should make for some interesting drama and character analysis, but it's just handled so clumsily by this show. And, every little bit of potential for relationship development between Saito and Louise just continues to be hit on the head before anything can come of it: Saito conveniently forgetting that Louise got naked for him to keep him warm (and then her wanting him to forget as well), for example. The worst example of that in this ep was that bit where Henry asked about Saito's motivations to fight, and consequently who he was in love with and protecting, and rather than just flat out saying "Louise", Saito felt he needed to cover it up. That made no sense to me... they should be well past that. Is this relationship going backwards, because that's what it seems like at times.
We can complain about the botched drama all we want (as we are ;)... although, I wouldn't say all of it is bad, just most of it), but I think ultimately, the worst thing about this season is that there's been far too little relationship development between Louise and Saito. That was among the big highlights of the first series, and it's just been disappointing in this series. Hopefully the next ep will start turning things around on that front
Sun Shine
2007-09-12, 05:59
This episode was very average much like the rest of the second series, its just not living up to the first series in any aspects at all. The relationship between Saito and Louise isn't going anywhere at all at the moment and it won't do, every time it starts to develop it always goes back. The introduction of that enemy air rider was just boring and his character lacks interest, he just plays a boring stereotypical role. The only interesting thing was that they lost the plane, even the battle, if you can call it that was awfully panned out.
I really thought Saito was faking unconsciousness when Louise stripped, lol, too bad. :uhoh:
Sinestra
2007-09-12, 11:57
Decent episode the warming of Saito with Louise young body was quite interesting. I find it funny that she brings up that Saito confessed to her yet she has not answered him "WELL GET TO IT" even though it obvious how she feels. I found Saito very cool in this episode with sticking with morals and vowing to not kill and not to be killed. However even after everything they went through with the enemy soldier Louise just doesnt get it. Saito looked uber pissed off at the end and i cant blame him one bit.
Henreitta looks pretty hot in that battle garb with slits up the side. I noticed that made sure to show a lot of leg in the begining when she sends Louise and Saito on the mission. I think Louise is cute but I still think Herinetta is just freakin hot. Is it me or did Henrietta give Saito a weird look in the begining and the end of the episode?
I don't really see "the wedding" happening this season honestly.
I got myself a ZnT2 OST and theres "I SAY YES (wedding version)".
I dont know whoes wedding is it, but there will be one.
Darknemo2000
2007-09-12, 12:58
The last Louises words is what I call forced scene. In novels it came out in a heated discussion that aslo was kind of ironic as
We all remember how Louise was against Wales daying and tried to convince him that loving for ones loved ones is much better than just dying. More so she said that she didnt understand that way of thinking to which Saito agreed hugging her under the moonlight as she was crying (this scene was completely ignored by the anime). NOW Louise herself is acting Wales like.
Yet those words came in a heated discussion where guiche had his words too... Heated discussion that alcohol might have influence too (it happened in an inn) I find it to be MUCH more likely than just Louise waltzing in and saying those words like that with a calm expression on her face.
But again to make it not forced they would need more time and THATS something that they definately lack after their main plot of this series - Agnes story.
So they just have it easy. Louise come and say it like that, which to me look forced
and silly.
As for wedding scene... If not in next episode than when? Do you SERIOUSLY think that they can pull it off in last episode AND the fight?
Just look at the scenes in between..Wouldnt that be too much even for the crappy director of second series even taking his love for fillers and sub-plots into consideration....
Unless
They would not pull off the Saito vs 70 K fight at all, and it would end off with him running to them and them to him. OR they could really take Anime viewers for an idiots and make the whole scene end with 4-7 blows and voila Saito stops 70 000 poeple. But I dont think that fans would be THAT dumb to buy such crap. In reallity the fight alone is worth two episodes as it was kind of epic. One FULL episode is a minimum.
But hey since it doesnt have Agnes in it so I guess they might cut it down too... After all not having main character and having the filler in characters like Saito or Louise take her place can be counted as an disssapointment for the fans.
I really thought Saito was faking unconsciousness when Louise stripped, lol, too bad. :uhoh:
The way the camera closed to Saito's eyes made it look like that. I like the scene more the way it was done --- it makes Louise more sweet~
I got myself a ZnT2 OST and theres "I SAY YES (wedding version)".
I dont know whoes wedding is it, but there will be one.
Indeed, that was my first thought regarding the track list. I also mentioned it in the music thread.
X10A_Freedom
2007-09-12, 21:16
They would not pull off the Saito vs 70 K fight at all, and it would end off with him running to them and them to him. OR they could really take Anime viewers for an idiots and make the whole scene end with 4-7 blows and voila Saito stops 70 000 poeple. But I dont think that fans would be THAT dumb to buy such crap. In reallity the fight alone is worth two episodes as it was kind of epic. One FULL episode is a minimum.
Anything could happen with the anime of this series. The Ward fight in Albion itself in season 1 is worth one episode but it was concluded in all of 5 minutes.
ordnance11
2007-09-12, 21:56
I think it would be better to end it this way:
Saito incapacitates Louise.
Saito's version of 300 (his version is much cooler). Louise wakes up and finds Saito missing. last episode
So now we have reason for season 3!
mist2123
2007-09-12, 22:04
I think it would be better to end it this way:
Saito incapacitates Louise.
Saito's version of 300 (his version is much cooler). Louise wakes up and finds Saito missing. last episode
So now we have reason for season 3!
i doubt that they will be wasting more money on this series:heh:
neutralizer
2007-09-12, 22:21
Honestly, I don't see how they can end this on a decent note in anticipation for a possible Season 3. I gave the first season an 8/10, but this season started out at a 7/10 and has now dropped to 5/10 for me and still dropping.
Sun Shine
2007-09-13, 16:07
Honestly, I don't see how they can end this on a decent note in anticipation for a possible Season 3. I gave the first season an 8/10, but this season started out at a 7/10 and has now dropped to 5/10 for me and still dropping.
Completely agree. I have never seen an anime have a following season that tore the first one to shreds so badly. Everything that the first season was about has been totally disgarded and we've been left with a poor story with characters having personality transplants.
neutralizer
2007-09-13, 16:56
Completely agree. I have never seen an anime have a following season that tore the first one to shreds so badly. Everything that the first season was about has been totally disgarded and we've been left with a poor story with characters having personality transplants.
I suppose we should blame the director, but not the production studio, J.C. Staff, only because they brought us the ever-so awesome Shakugan no Shana and hopefully, Season 2 of that will make up for the failings of ZnT2.
The whole morality of war seems rather shallow, especially if you've seen a Gundam series (amongst others) recently.
Darknemo2000
2007-09-14, 09:47
I never watched a single Gudamn episode and never will as I totally hate anyhything mecha related, yet the morality of war in ZnT anime is poorly done.
I won't lie - novels aren't too great there as well, yet it is MUCH MUCH beteer than the stuff that I have displeasure to see in this season so far. Maybe they will change everything drastically in last two episodes, and maybe the seemingly a failure second season would at least turn out a decent one, and maybe pigs will start to fly?
There is a possiblity of them doing pretty good ending but again - based on how much scenes left and how much they have to do, and how little time they have... I don't see a lot of hope for satisfying final.
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