Clannad - Spoilers & Speculation (for experienced Clannad gamers only) [Archive] - Page 2

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Kinny Riddle

2008-02-19, 12:26

I think that if a second season comes and Kyou route does kick in, they'll probably rewrite it so that the Kyou Epilogue doesn't happen. Instead, right after Tomoya apologizes to Ryou, there'll be a setup where Tomoya has to help out Kappei with Ryou; should follow the family theme a lot better.

Of course, to follow the theme better, they'll have to cut down a bit of the romance part and how long it extends for Kyou (though Tomoya getting with Kyou still has to happen in this scenario). This I'm willing to accept as KyoAni's version. ;)

If you're right in this prediction, that should hopefully appease and shut up *most* of the outraged moan-boys out there. :cool:

(Just to make myself very clear so that any overzealous mods may understand clearly: I'm NOT having a go at anyone here. I'm talking about people coming to their senses. )

I really hope Kyo-Ani has approached Shiraishi Ryoko to return as Kappei, even if just briefly for AfterStory, where it's still possible to slot in his sub-plot.

mandarb916

2008-02-19, 18:35

For the Kyou arc, I wonder if they were referring to Kyou's participation within the Nagisa/AS arc...in which case it's not difficult to include at all. Her appearance in AS was one of the more memorable/touching aspects of the game imho.

Reckoner

2008-02-19, 21:02

If you're right in this prediction, that should hopefully appease and shut up *most* of the outraged moan-boys out there. :cool:

(Just to make myself very clear so that any overzealous mods may understand clearly: I'm NOT having a go at anyone here. I'm talking about people coming to their senses. )

I really hope Kyo-Ani has approached Shiraishi Ryoko to return as Kappei, even if just briefly for AfterStory, where it's still possible to slot in his sub-plot.

I'd certainly shut up :D

Although I dislike Nagisa though, I'm still very interested in After Story being animated more than Tomoyo and Kyou's arcs, but I want to see those as well. So I'll remain hopeful for a second season + time warps.

AuditionEX

2008-02-20, 12:17

Hi guys.

Just finished Fuko and The Fujibayashi twins route.

Damn.. Kyou's route is the best ROUTE imo. Pure of Win!

Now i know how Ryou's personality and behavior changes here.

Kristen

2008-02-20, 16:20

Well, I just finished the Ryou/Kyou route, and I've had Tomoyo finished for a week or so now. And honestly, I don't see a time warp to show their routes in full. They showed as much of Tomoyo as they could without including the romance, and I feel that her romance story was kind of bland... I especially don't think her romance part of the story will be shown because they showed her bear costume so early and gave a reason for it. It was a surprise in the story, and it'd just dampen all of it here.

The Kyou/Ryou route to me is simply unadaptable, unless you want to actually have the series end with Tomoya with Kyou. I'm impressed that they managed to do what they did with it. If they do a time warp, then it would completely throw off the series, as people would really lean their heart towards Kyou instead. And to me, I don't think there's anything else they can do in canon with this route.

In other words, I think both the Tomoyo route and the Kyou route are finished. I still think there's a way to do the Sunohara, Misae, Yukine, and Koumura routes in canon with School life, and would like to see those adaptations. But I just think that any more Tomoyo or Kyou would be impossible and not really worth it.

mandarb916

2008-02-20, 21:18

Chrissie,

You're right about the Kyou/Ryou route being a dead end, atleast before the After Story. The only way, imho, to include Kyou, further, really, is to take Tomoya/Kyou reuniting after Nagisa's death, a few steps further before Ushio's death. Atleast develop on a platonic aspect of their relationship as Tomoya overcomes Nagisa's death...transition to a hint of romance, then end Ushio's arc with Ushio's death. This would still be canonical with the game since she DOES make a final appearance with an undertone of still existing romantic feelings towards Tomoya. It would be somewhat of a blend between the true Kyou arc and AS Ushio arc which I don't think would be doable imho.

The bear costume...well...it's one of the more touching aspets of Tomoyo After imho. I don't really want for KyoAni to do anything else with it within the realm of clannad ;)

Misae route in the game finishes during the founder's festival, which already has taken place in the anime (Fuko route). However, they're including a school festival in the anime (Fuko route was Souritsushasai, one of the titles for an upcoming episode contains Gakuensai which is school festival) to fit in Nagisa's story which in the game took place at the Founder's Festival. So it wouldn't be a stretch at all to include Misae during this time frame.

All the Koumura route requires is for Tomoya/Sunohara to graduate, really, so it would be easy to include as well.

AuditionEX

2008-02-22, 00:38

just finished all the routes except Nagisa Route...

velocity7

2008-02-22, 01:09

just finished all the routes except Nagisa Route...

the game hangs when Nagisa will tell the illusionary tale..

wtf.. need help here..

Wrong thread. Go see the Game Discussion Thread (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=10536)

Leo_Otaku

2008-02-22, 13:28

I'm guessing the march newtype may tell us what the remaining titles and small synopsis for the epiosdes left. Obviously Kyo-ani is hush hush so i doubt we will see any articles about it >.> maybe we will see a trailer at the end of 24 for 2nd season...

AuditionEX

2008-02-22, 13:44

Nagisa route was okay... not so sad imo... well im waiting for the trans of after story... :3

Proto

2008-02-22, 13:54

Well although the forte of Nagisa route isn't its sadness, the climax isn't reached till after story so look forward it :p

Klashikari

2008-02-22, 14:06

velocity7

2008-02-22, 14:27

And even without after story, Nagisa's finale scenes (with akio and the spring) are powerful enough to give her justice.
AS is rather the luxurous icing of the cake and the whole point of Clannad, not nagisa alone ^^

More like School Life is the icing on the cake, while After Story is the actual bread of the cake. :)

Zenemis

2008-02-22, 22:35

You'd have to flip it upside down to have an edible cake that way :<

The school life's about gathering the lights. So it's more like going shopping for ingredients.

o.o

Kristen

2008-02-22, 22:56

You'd have to flip it upside down to have an edible cake that way :<

The school life's about gathering the lights. So it's more like going shopping for ingredients.

o.o

I wouldn't say either is the cake, or the icing... I think it's more the crust and the tomato sauce of a pizza. One adds substance, and the other makes it something special.

You seem to be assigning a somewhat negative label towards the act, which is something i can not agree with. I don't get why you are trying to build some sort of a wall between "family love" and "making love" ... the two are not mutually exclusive and can very easily coexist. Especially given the nature of Tomoya's and Nagisa's relationship ... can you really argue that is some form of lustful or "impure" love ? You say "Kyoani won't want to show that "sex is good" ... so you are saying it is necessarily "bad" ? Though given the context i would find it hard pressed to find any message about nature of sex at all. Never mind the fact that everything tied to the theme is highly subjective anyway, as is your take on sex, which i don't necessarily agree with.
The fact that familial love and making love are two completely seperate words means that they do not mix together. Basically, making love is not part of familial love, just as familial love is not part of making love. They definately do coexist, yes. After all, nobody would be born into a happy family if they didn't coexist together. However, they are not the same kind of love at all. That's the reason why prostitutes exist. There's no love between the two people, they just have sex for selfish reasons.
Tomoya and Nagisa, granted, it's not like that. They love each other. However, if you show that they had sex, it kind of tarnishes the relationship. "Did Tomoya really love Nagisa, or did he just want to have sex with her?" While that question has an obvious answer of no, showing sex would still let that question rise up.
Showing a child is implied sex. However, it cleverly disguises it to make the family seem more like a family.

I fail to see how doing a classic "kiss before night-fade to morning" (or other classic implication device) would cheapen the theme or their relationship at all, never mind to some great lengths you suggest. (This is where Ushio and the "family" comes from anyway). You are pushing it to the extreme end of the argument as if we are in danger of seeing a full-blown sex scene with all details up front. Now that possibly could "cheapen" the theme, (though even then i would say not as much as you would imply, as i don't see how it would somehow portray family as a less important social entity). Never the less that is not the case.
As I explained before in this post, it cheapens the family theme because it would make the question arise as to whether there love was true or hormonal. Even if the answer is obvious, it still raises the question. When I played through the Kappei route, it made me think the same thing. Is their bond because they love each other, or because they wanted sex? Further, it made me think about the alternative Ryou-Tomoya arc, making me suspect her in that arc as well.
It cheapens it like that.

Kinny Riddle

2008-02-29, 12:24

Time to bump this up again.

All I'll say is: Where's our Meganekko (bespectacled) Tomoyo? By the time she really settles down, all the administrative work will mean she'll be wearing glasses even more than before as she's near-sighted.

velocity7

2008-02-29, 14:27

We can pretty much guarantee After Story ain't happening within this season. It'll have to be another one.

Leo_Otaku

2008-02-29, 14:32

Which is a good thing >.> IMO and should be too others as well. I think they could do time warp or switch it up by putting in Yukine and Misae to add to some of the after story.

velocity7

2008-02-29, 14:42

It's also a good thing because After Story would have to lose too much to be crammed into three episodes.

Sinestra

2008-03-03, 12:23

Well after finally breaking down and reading all 14 pages in here Im a little worried. When Clannad started I only possessed limited knowledge about the story which i got from others, but i was rather excited. It never dawned on me that there could be a possibility of sad ending. Im truly hoping that it does come to this. I plan on playing the game after the anime series is done. But now im dwelling on this possible sad ending with Nagisa since she is my 2nd favorite character

sobaro

2008-03-03, 16:11

ep 23 call the summer event according to the game what is this ep about ist after scholl ? travel? beach? what kind of event

Ice Block

2008-03-04, 03:29

Is Ep23 going to be an anime-original episode?

If not, then my fingers are crossed for Baseball/Laser Tag route :heh:.

Skyfall

2008-03-04, 06:29

Summer event ? Hm .. i am not sure. How about the "picnic" of the Furukawa family when Tomoya and Nagisa share their first kiss ? :)

Kristen

2008-03-04, 08:24

Summer event ? Hm .. i am not sure. How about the "picnic" of the Furukawa family when Tomoya and Nagisa share their first kiss ? :)

Or even better, a preview episode saying "We will have an event in the summer - a second season!" :)

I think Picnic too.

Deathscyther

2008-03-04, 09:52

Or even better, a preview episode saying "We will have an event in the summer - a second season!" :)

I think Picnic too.

I'd say both:p

But yeah, I think the picnic as well.

velvet

2008-03-05, 09:42

Summer event ? Hm .. i am not sure. How about the "picnic" of the Furukawa family when Tomoya and Nagisa share their first kiss ? :)

What do you think will happen if Akio caught them? :heh: It might turn out interesting, though.

ZhangKhaiEn

2008-03-06, 00:46

What do you think will happen if Akio caught them? :heh: It might turn out interesting, though.

Akio will congratulate Tomoya and Nagisa first, then beat him up with his metal bat, and finally make fun of Sanae's bread.

ALL WITHIN 5 MINUTES.

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-06, 00:48

Akio will congratulate Tomoya and Nagisa first, then beat him up with his metal bat, and finally make fun of Sanae's bread.

ALL WITHIN 5 MINUTES.

God I love Akio. Best dad ever.

Kristen

2008-03-06, 07:39

Akio will congratulate Tomoya and Nagisa first, then beat him up with his metal bat, and finally make fun of Sanae's bread.

ALL WITHIN 5 MINUTES.

You forgot that after he beat Nagisa with the metal bat, he'd shift the blame to Tomoya. :p

Proto

2008-03-06, 09:58

duh, he won't beat Nagisa, he will only beat Tomoya only to later scream apologies when Nagisa scolds him. Who on his right mind would beat a girl with a metal bat anyway :p

Klashikari

2008-03-06, 10:05

Kristen

2008-03-06, 12:32

duh, he won't beat Nagisa, he will only beat Tomoya only to later scream apologies when Nagisa scolds him. Who on his right mind would beat a girl with a metal bat anyway :p

Key word: "his right mind". :p

I'm kind of curious to see how they're going to do the Nagisa confession... They are at the point now where it's extremely hard to continue the story without it, and have to deviate a lot to make ends meet...

Proto

2008-03-06, 12:36

Hmm... somehow I see it happening after the school play. I don't think it's possible to do it at any other time because Nagisa has to be depressed enough before and during the play itself :p

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-06, 14:50

Episode 20

(Pardon the poor quality screencap)

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4434/akionagisasnowvb2.th.jpg (http://img135.imageshack.us/my.php?image=akionagisasnowvb2.jpg)
Akio embracing an ailing Nagisa in the snow directly reflects the image of Tomoya embracing Ushio. What are the writers suggesting here? That Akio too has gone collecting orbs in the Illusionary World to save his daughter?

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-06, 14:54

Klashikari

2008-03-06, 15:34

The thing is the game hinted strongly that Akio "found" an orb to save Nagisa. Without this one, Nagisa would be probably dead.

I guess it is a coincidence/cameo considering that both situations were pretty much similar in fact.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-06, 19:33

I was thinking that tehyw ould have Tomoya yell the confession at the play, when Nagisa can't start

Kristen

2008-03-06, 19:44

Especially Akio, who will obviously try to conquer literally her heart back (though not as effective as Tomoya's deceiving "I love you" remarks :heh:)

I'm eagerly waiting for the "sake" and "bear toy" scenes for AS.

Bear toy? Do you mean Ushio's Gundam, the stuffed Dango, or what? I just finished AS and didn't see a bear toy at all...

Chaotic_Reign

2008-03-06, 20:10

番外編　夏休みの出来事

学園祭も終わり、朋也は高校生活最後の夏を迎えていた。
夏休みに入ってからも3年生は補修の続く毎日で、朋也は
渚の手前サボることもできない。そんな中、春原の妹の
芽衣が、再び寮へ遊びに来る。

"The School Festival has ended, and the last summer of his high school life has arrived for Tomoya. For third years supplementary classes continue into the summer vacation, and Tomoya is unable to skip them because of Nagisa['s insistence]. Sunohara's sister chose this time to come back to the dorm to play."

Mei returns wwwwwwwwwwwww

Mei's presence opens up about 3 Mei-related events that they can play around with,

1) Sunohara's search for a girlfriend
2) Nagisa's cinnamon event
3) Baseball route

There might be other non-Mei events as well, but it'll be a travesty not to make full use of Mei while she's around.

velocity7

2008-03-07, 01:45

Klashikari

2008-03-07, 05:21

Bear toy? Do you mean Ushio's Gundam, the stuffed Dango, or what? I just finished AS and didn't see a bear toy at all...
it is either bear or spider toy: the thing Tomoya was forced to put in sanae's clothing while Akio was distracting her. Obviously, the result was a mad chase :heh:

Kristen

2008-03-07, 08:40

it is either bear or spider toy: the thing Tomoya was forced to put in sanae's clothing while Akio was distracting her. Obviously, the result was a mad chase :heh:

Oh, that! :p I guess I was thinking Kotomi too much.

Looking at episode 20, I noticed a little bit of a mux of the After Story with the School life, and that disheartens me a lot. They left out the park as well, so it real makes me fear that they may try to wrap this up in the School life section.
And unfortunately, I know a way it's possible. Show at least 1 illusionary world in the last 2 episodes. One has the playground, the other has them starting on their journey. Finish the Nagisa route in School life, but don't let her fall ill. Have Okazaki come to terms with his father, thanks to the seperation. And then do a time jump to show Nagisa, Okazaki, and Ushio together in the flower field.

Is it a good way? No. Will people try to burn Kyoani to the ground? Yes. Is it less meaningful? Yes. However, if Kyoani wants a way out, this is it.

velocity7

2008-03-07, 11:53

Oh, that! :p I guess I was thinking Kotomi too much.

Looking at episode 20, I noticed a little bit of a mux of the After Story with the School life, and that disheartens me a lot. They left out the park as well, so it real makes me fear that they may try to wrap this up in the School life section.
And unfortunately, I know a way it's possible. Show at least 1 illusionary world in the last 2 episodes. One has the playground, the other has them starting on their journey. Finish the Nagisa route in School life, but don't let her fall ill. Have Okazaki come to terms with his father, thanks to the seperation. And then do a time jump to show Nagisa, Okazaki, and Ushio together in the flower field.

Is it a good way? No. Will people try to burn Kyoani to the ground? Yes. Is it less meaningful? Yes. However, if Kyoani wants a way out, this is it.

There was zero mux with After Story in any way, shape or form. They're not going there; all they did was play a very, very nasty irony for us game players. If they go through with a second season, this irony will become much more apparent.

And my current speculation of how they will wrap it up is that they're just going to finish Nagisa's route, period. Nothing more, nothing less.

I'm not sure how they are going to work out Mei's route as an extra episode, to be honest. I'm going to assume they won't, because her route needs two episodes to cover altogether.

Baseball route requires a bit of an oomph; one episode is pushing it, two otherwise.

I'm inclined to guess this will be the cinnamon stuff, plus some extra fun. It is an extra episode, and won't have any bearing on the storyline. If Mei does stay by the end of the episode, saying she'll be around for a week... it opens up the possibility of Baseball and Mei routes for a second season.

Deathscyther

2008-03-07, 12:02

Oh, that! :p I guess I was thinking Kotomi too much.
Looking at episode 20, I noticed a little bit of a mux of the After Story with the School life, and that disheartens me a lot. They left out the park as well, so it real makes me fear that they may try to wrap this up in the School life section.
And unfortunately, I know a way it's possible. Show at least 1 illusionary world in the last 2 episodes. One has the playground, the other has them starting on their journey. Finish the Nagisa route in School life, but don't let her fall ill. Have Okazaki come to terms with his father, thanks to the seperation. And then do a time jump to show Nagisa, Okazaki, and Ushio together in the flower field.

Is it a good way? No. Will people try to burn Kyoani to the ground? Yes. Is it less meaningful? Yes. However, if Kyoani wants a way out, this is it.

They seem to put some after story elements in these episodes, yeah.

This could mean that they want to wrap everything up, but this would be terrible. With only 2, 3 or 4 episodes left (I still don't know what to believe) it is impossible to do after story completely. They can't show the whole meaning behind the series without After story.

But if they do it, they'll probably fastforward in the last episode (not showing Nagisa dying) showing Nagisa, Tomoya and Ushio together while meeting Fuko. Or they'll save After story for season 2, while they keep the other girls in the story as well in stead of focusing on nagisa and tomoya completely. I'm all in for option 2 =)

I guess we'll see the practicing for the play next episode with some Nagisa x Tomoya moments, then the real play with maybe a confession, and then a mei related episode to show the relationship between Nagisa and Tomoya, while they focus on the humour with Sunohara and his sister (and maybe their light). And maybe Nagisa will sick again.

I still think that they'll end the season with showing that Nagisa has to repeat again, while Tomoya does make it. (Maybe some pieces of the Komura arc as well) and then a nice Nagisa x Tomoya moment, saying how he'll be there for her.

Kristen

2008-03-07, 12:51

There was zero mux with After Story in any way, shape or form. They're not going there; all they did was play a very, very nasty irony for us game players. If they go through with a second season, this irony will become much more apparent.

And my current speculation of how they will wrap it up is that they're just going to finish Nagisa's route, period. Nothing more, nothing less.

I'm not sure how they are going to work out Mei's route as an extra episode, to be honest. I'm going to assume they won't, because her route needs two episodes to cover altogether.

Baseball route requires a bit of an oomph; one episode is pushing it, two otherwise.

I'm inclined to guess this will be the cinnamon stuff, plus some extra fun. It is an extra episode, and won't have any bearing on the storyline. If Mei does stay by the end of the episode, saying she'll be around for a week... it opens up the possibility of Baseball and Mei routes for a second season.

The mux is by telling the second part of the Nagisa After Story. In the game, that was during the birth chapter, not the regular chapter. They just left off that Akio was an actor for obvious reasons.

Deathscyther: I'm all for option 2 as well. I want to see a second season really badly. But, I don't know. I've just had this nagging thought in my head since somewhere around 17 saying that they're going to try to end it. And, they can, unfortunately...

By the way, I'm not saying to try and squeeze After Story into 2, 3, or 4 episodes. I'm saying that they may unfortunately cut out anything in their and mux anything that solves an issue into the main story.

Like, looking at AS, there is:

1. Cohabilitation in the Bakery
2. Cohabilitation with Nagisa, new job
3. Sanae's Teaching Scenario
4. Yuuske's new music CD
5. Nagisa's engagement
6. Nagisa's pregnancy
7. Nagisa's death
8. Ushio's trip, coming to terms with Ushio
9. Okazaki coming to terms with his father
10. Ushio meeting Fuuko
11. Ushio's fever and death
12. Explanation of the Illusionary World
13. Akio's bus hijacking
14. The miracle.
The only things absolutely necessary as of now are the Naoyuki Okazaki part (Could make an anime original end there), the explanation of the illusionary world, and they need to show Ushio at some point of time due to the OP. Everything else really is not necessary to tell the story. However, that's serving a person bread without butter, it doesn't make sense.

Proto

2008-03-07, 12:54

Akio explained the first part of Nagisa's past during Nagisa's arc in school life though (including the part where Akio left out the fact that he was an actor during the first explanation), and, like you said, he finished the complete explanation during AS. Up to now that part has stayed cannon.

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-07, 13:35

If anime Tomoya says he senses something familiar about Nagisa's Illusionary World story, does this mean this Tomoya is actually Tomoya v2.0? Having returned from the Illusionary World and collected all the orbs and is now "replaying" his life to get it right this time?

Klashikari

2008-03-07, 14:41

Most likely. That said, I don't even think the game ever shew the "original" Tomoya anyway, as the illusionary world mentioned affected him.
This would make sense with the presence of the light orbs on the episode title.

Kristen

2008-03-07, 18:14

So, just speculating... If Kyoani goes with 2 seasons, what song will they use at the end of 22? Since 22 is the end of the main storyline, I guess that is what they would make a special ED for, if they wanted to make a special ED...

Dango Daikazoku?
Kage Futatsu?
Chiisana Terohina?

It's just an interesting thought for me... Because ending the series with Dango Daikazoku wouldn't exactly work in my mind...

Proto

2008-03-07, 18:37

If it's any indicator the title for episode 22 is kage futatsu.

NaweG

2008-03-07, 20:12

I'm just curious, with all the concern (and appropriately) about how will Kyo-Ani fit everything in, I'm a little curious how Toei handled it with a much shorter timeline? Did the movie even get into the After Story?

TIA!

Deathscyther

2008-03-08, 11:26

I thought the movie only did after story.

velocity7

2008-03-08, 11:28

Unfortunately I was wrong on the matter. You only get a glimpse of After Story here. :(

Deathscyther

2008-03-08, 11:41

Ah...then the movie will probably be quite rushed...
I'll probably watch it anyways, but I'm not expecting much.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-08, 11:45

The movie seemed odd even when Tomoya and Nagisa first met. The way she acts is so odd >.>

Second season being real....rising. I think they could put yukine's story in the 2nd series since she is a first year, as well Misae could be placed there too. Kappei could appear at any time really XD Yes still holding hope that Kappei will appear. Just to make some of the beginnning of the after story a bit more interesting.

Deathscyther

2008-03-08, 11:52

Yeah, they could use the second season to get the lights from side characters (yukine, misae, kappei and such...maybe Kyou in some way) while the main points are after story of course.

Proto

2008-03-08, 14:41

Yukine is a 2nd year though, he got a red coat of arms in her uniform.

dgreater1

2008-03-08, 21:32

They should! I mean, did the opening title have Kyou's light? It wouldn't have any justice if the opening title doesn't have their symbol of happiness, just like Fuuko, Kotomi, Mei, right? (checks the lights in each episode) Hmmm... it have 5 lights... which means Kyou is happy after losing the battle? Anyway, I wonder what could it be that event that made her happy? :heh:

By the way, as far as I remember:

*********************
Eps. 7 = Fuuko's light
Eps. 10 = Kotomi's light
Eps. 14 = A light (Probably for Mei x basketball route cross over)
Eps. 16 = Tomoyo's light
Eps. 19 = Unknown yet
*********************
Eps. 7 to 9 ====> 1 light (Fuuko?)
Eps. 10 to 13 ==> 2 lights (Kotomi?)
Eps. 14 to 15 ==> 3 lights (Basketball, Mei?)
Eps. 16 to 18 ==> 4 lights (Tomoyo?)
Eps. 19 ~ =====> 5 lights (I wonder whose light this is...)

This light distribution is starting to confuse me actually, you have do something to gain these lights, but here in anime, they use it to determine the start of a route :heh:

So, it could mean, Kyou hasn't completely given up her feelings? We'll probably see a Kyou in the rain? Ryou might be able to fish her Kappei next season, so probably, Eps. 19 and above might actually belong to Kyou?!?!?! (Dudududun! SFX) (Yeah... I hope... well, there's nothing wrong with hoping though :heh:)

Shinigami_Mello

2008-03-08, 23:31

Hmm, one light could be Ibuki Kouko's?
One for Fuuko, Kouko, Kotomi, Mei, and Tomoyo?

Ice Block

2008-03-09, 03:02

Hmmn... My thoughts on possible 2nd season:

They could run through normal After Story (including Akio's story) till the end, do a time warp/reset ala Endless Eight and return to school life. Then Tomoya could collect more lights (Misae->Yukine->Sunohara->Kyou->Kappei, with Kyou being the main heroine pls :p, and Akio's storage room screentime :heh:), time reset #2 after Kappei's epilogue, then a short summary episode for Nagisa's route and AS until birth scene (much like a certain episode in Air TV), and then proceed to the True End :eyespin:.

They could make one that's exclusively for After Story, and then make a 3rd[!] season for the other scenarios sans Tomoyo's, and then animate Tomoyo After (4th season lol) with Tomoyo's route (at least the latter part) being the 1st few episodes :heh:.

Deathscyther

2008-03-09, 06:27

Hehe, they might do a time warp, but I dunno. I think they'll handle it in another way. Getting all the lights in one run (at least in our eyes...who knows how many time warps there have been already) But yeah, they'll have to change some things and Tomoya will have to get more lights during AS.

Or in the worst case scenario...they won't bother with the lights...and the real meaning behind the story.

And Tomoyo after won't be animated in this anime.

Kristen

2008-03-09, 08:04

New/Old

2008-03-09, 11:33

And I would doubt that Tomoyo's Light has been gained simply by having accomplished what she came here to do. You received a light from her for a different reason. Or perhaps the game has too much influence on me. :heh:

Hmm... Most confusing. Sigh...

Deathscyther

2008-03-09, 15:04

She saved the Sakura trees by becoming president, right? Wouldn't that be enough for her light?

New/Old

2008-03-09, 15:52

Perhaps that is true... in the anime at least. :heh:

It's just that Tomoyo's speech near the end of her scenario on lost time nags at my conscious a bit. It hangs on me like ghosts from the past, truth be told. :heh:

Kristen

2008-03-13, 08:44

Deathscyther

2008-03-13, 09:01

I'm expecting something like that as well, although they might not include the nagisa getting sick this season yet. I think they will, but there is a good chance that they don't.

They could do a twelve episode second season. I think that would be best, but they could try to do a longer season as well. They might want to include side characters more than in the game (kyou, tomoyo, kotomi, fuko and such)

Anyways, as long as they do a second season (and don't screw up) I'm happy:p

velocity7

2008-03-13, 09:11

So, I'm already thinking of a second season. Something tells me 12 episodes, not 13, I don't know why... But, going with 12...

S1:
Episode 21 - Nagisa's Discovery and script work
Episode 22 - School Festival, Second Illness
Episode 23 - Mei's route
Episode 24 - OVA of the Baseball Game (What else could they make an OVA of?)

S2:
3 Episodes: Tomoya's Bakery Work, then to moving out, then his start as an electrician, all the way to the school festival
1 Episode: Sanae
1 Episode: Akio
3 Episodes: Yuuske, Birth Chapter
3 Episodes: Ushio's Route, Tomoya's coming to terms with his father
1 Episode: Time Warp, Good End

Nice guesswork. Let's see if they decide to include other side characters for S2:

3 Episodes: Tomoya's Bakery Work, then to moving out, then his start as an electrician, all the way to the school festival
1 Episode: Sanae
1 Episode: Akio
3 Episodes: Yuusuke, Birth Chapter
3 Episodes: Ushio Route, Time Warp

2 Episodes: Yukine
5 Episodes: Kyou, Kappei
3 Episodes: Tomoyo, Misae
2 Episodes: Sunoharas'
1 Episode: After Story True End

Kristen

2008-03-13, 10:30

Nice guesswork. Let's see if they decide to include other side characters for S2:

3 Episodes: Tomoya's Bakery Work, then to moving out, then his start as an electrician, all the way to the school festival
1 Episode: Sanae
1 Episode: Akio
3 Episodes: Yuusuke, Birth Chapter
3 Episodes: Ushio Route, Time Warp

2 Episodes: Yukine
5 Episodes: Kyou, Kappei
3 Episodes: Tomoyo, Misae
2 Episodes: Sunoharas'
1 Episode: After Story True End

I know I personally would love to see the Yukine route animated... But I feel that Tomoyo at this part is impossible to animate. Like, they already covered her backstory, and showed her as the student council head. The only part left is how her student council position effects her relationship with Tomoya... And there really was no climax to that story, since her backstory was the climax to me.
Kyou and Kappei would be possible with a timewarp. But, it would be impossible to continue animating that through the after story, as such a deep relationship with Kyou cannot be countered by a Nagisa who rarely appears in that route.
And I don't think they'd want to do 2 time warps to get Tomoya back with Nagisa, since that would dampen the effect of that miracle. It'd be a lot like Higurashi, where the first was very "What"ish, and then the 2nd and 3rd was very "Ah, another new story". It just erased the effect that anything had happened.
They'd probably just want 1.

So, I think that if there'll be any side routes animated, it'll be OVA style... Unfortunately.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-13, 23:37

They can still have Kappei, Kyou can randomly hit him on her bike iut is really chanagble where they can add him.

As for Yukine it doesn't matter if she is in second or third year her route could be put in anyway. Misase's can be put in however .

I'm hoping 24 is not after story ffwd >.>

Jimmy C

2008-03-14, 02:42

From experience with other anime series, such additional episodes are almost always standalones. If there's an episode with a "feeling of conclusion" it'll be the final broadcast episode. If it wasn't, the airing stations would be... disappointed.

Klashikari

2008-03-14, 03:41

Technically, playing After Story does involve doing some sections again and looping through the game to see all the endings. Seeing as that would be absurd in an anime, you can consolidate all those events into a single timeline ans thus reduce the number of episodes. This leaves us with one critical question.

Which ending of Clannad are they going to give us?

Please dear God don't give me the normal ending. I almost couldn't deal with it the first time, and I'd hate KyoAni if they did it this time.

Considering the opening and what the scripters have done with everyone's route, chances they will give the true end after the normal end are extremely high.

There is already the almighty "illusionary ushio + Fuuko" in the OP, with Ushio running happily in the sunflowers field, while we got light orbs.
There is very little chance they would do something like the movie anyway.

Joachim

2008-03-14, 05:31

how about we have a bet, who here think that Kyoani will continue straight to the after story right after the 23rd/ last episode? i place my bet in this one :D

and who think that kyoani will continue the after story but after a 1 season break?

who else think that kyoani will not even continue with after story? (runs before being thrown out of clannad forum)

Joachim

2008-03-14, 06:38

We should probably discuss this on the Game Speculation Thread (For experienced player only). But anyway... I don't think it's a hope that can grant wish. Yukine described it as a sign of happiness, the girl in Illusionary World told the Robot that he was once a light as well, and she was also once a light as well but decided to be the representative of the Illusionary World. Therefore, it means that the lights are traveling back and forth to the Illusionary World and the other world that's connected to it. Which means, there's a Kyou, Tomoyo, Yukine, Kotomi, Nagisa, Sunohara, all the people in the town has a light in the Illusionary World much like Tomoya, the difference is, Tomoya has a body and is aware of the Illusionary World unlike the other lights.

but still i don't quite get what actually is the light? if that lights are indeed representative of a former living beings, then why tomoya get a light during one of the route while the "actual" living beings is still living? i think the lights are more.. a symbol of hope/happiness for a specific living beings, but then again, the illusionary girl did mention that she was once a light.. could it mean that that symbol of hope/happiness can manifest itself as an avatar? or it contains the memory of the living being in question, therefore it can manifest itself, and about tomoya's junk body in the illusionary world.. isn't it just like a light posses the junk that the girl assemble? and correct me if im wrong, one of the lights did grant kouko wish for fuuko, which means that the lights are gone after that? so if the lights are a specific individual, that means one of the individual is gone forever?

also the misae's cat light, which i suppose he carry the light from the real (i forgot the name of the boy who the cat disguised in) boy, but then the lights are gone afterwards.

based on that points i would have to say the lights are a collection of memories which contains hope and happiness of a specific individual but not necessarily the individual themselves, and it can actually grant wishes..and illusionary worlds is some kind of container for those lights, and an individual (i wont call it person, because a cat can get it too) can actually grab that lights and grant their wishes

lol the funny thing is.. can we say that kyou's route actually happen because kyou herself has been gathering lights :P and before she get the required amount of lights she get the alternate world where she didn't ended up with tomoya :heh:

same thing can be said with other girls route

dgreater1

2008-03-14, 07:30

if that lights are indeed representative of a former living beings, then why tomoya get a light during one of the route while the "actual" living beings is still living?

Imagine Fuuko. She's in the hospital, but she's also in school? Supernatural. But anyway, I have my theory as well, as I said, the lights represents happiness. Getting the light doesn't neccesarry collecting them, it probably means, sharing the happiness she/he feels. The light is probably something like a spirit that contains memories (the only difference is it doesn't neccessaryly mean that it's inside the body, just imagine Fuuko again XD).

and correct me if im wrong, one of the lights did grant kouko wish for fuuko, which means that the lights are gone after that? so if the lights are a specific individual, that means one of the individual is gone forever?

I didn't really view the light as something that will grant wish, so I don't know :p

In the game, it is required that you finish all the route *aka as collecting the light* in order to advance to After Story. But in my view, collecting the light isn't really what will open After Story, but the requirement of the game in order for you to unlock the After Story. Don't forget that my theory is about CLANNAD is a story of stories (Alternate Story), which means, all the stories has been decided from the start, the only thing you must do is choose which one you like to read or witness, so that includes even the 1 direction story of the Illusionary World where the girl from the Illusionary World (Ushio) decides to reincarnate to the other world. You could compare it to Higurashi if you want, it's an endless cycle of story telling of an almost never ending story :3

Anyway, when Ushio died, you just got yourself the NORMAL USHIO END (BAD END) but instead of going back to the main menu... hmmm... wait I can't remember... did it went back to the main menu after that part? or did it continue itself as if telling an alternate story of safely delivering Ushio? Well, anyway... Nagisa/Ushio died in the After Story (After Story End) then Nagisa safely delivered Ushio (After Story True END - Intended ending). We just witnessed two stories, one ended with a suffering Tomoya and the other one ended with a future full of hope (since we didn't really witness what happened years after the true end, all we can do is hope that Ushio/Nagisa/Tomoya lives happily ever after).

Kristen

2008-03-14, 07:32

Takuto19

2008-03-14, 08:04

After Episode 21, I retract my statements that it is possible to end this in the school life route (albeit poorly.) Considering how much conflict they brought about in episode 21, I find their is no way to resolve not only the Nagisa problem, but also the Okazaki Naoyuki problem within 1 episode. There simply has to be a second season somewhere.

The talking of Okazaki's future daughter just solidified that claim.

So, Clannad fans, rejoice, for your time has come!

I agree, i see no way to finish this all up in the remaining episodes unless, although i'm really glad tbh as it proboly means another season of Clannad :)

Yeah the Naoyuki problem is pretty much impossible to be resolved with whats left, since a main part of his story is in the After Story.

It would be poor if it was ended in the School life route, i think if they were planning on doing it they would have had Nagisa and Tomoya going out rather than just close friends.

Joachim

2008-03-14, 09:26

Imagine Fuuko. She's in the hospital, but she's also in school? Supernatural. But anyway, I have my theory as well, as I said, the lights represents happiness. Getting the light doesn't neccesarry collecting them, it probably means, sharing the happiness she/he feels. The light is probably something like a spirit that contains memories (the only difference is it doesn't neccessaryly mean that it's inside the body, just imagine Fuuko again XD).

I didn't really view the light as something that will grant wish, so I don't know :p

In the game, it is required that you finish all the route *aka as collecting the light* in order to advance to After Story. But in my view, collecting the light isn't really what will open After Story, but the requirement of the game in order for you to unlock the After Story. Don't forget that my theory is about CLANNAD is a story of stories (Alternate Story), which means, all the stories has been decided from the start, the only thing you must do is choose which one you like to read or witness, so that includes even the 1 direction story of the Illusionary World where the girl from the Illusionary World (Ushio) decides to reincarnate to the other world. You could compare it to Higurashi if you want, it's an endless cycle of story telling of an almost never ending story :3

Anyway, when Ushio died, you just got yourself the NORMAL USHIO END (BAD END) but instead of going back to the main menu... hmmm... wait I can't remember... did it went back to the main menu after that part? or did it continue itself as if telling an alternate story of safely delivering Ushio? Well, anyway... Nagisa/Ushio died in the After Story (After Story End) then Nagisa safely delivered Ushio (After Story True END - Intended ending). We just witnessed two stories, one ended with a suffering Tomoya and the other one ended with a future full of hope (since we didn't really witness what happened years after the true end, all we can do is hope that Ushio/Nagisa/Tomoya lives happily ever after).

hmm...so is this feature of illusionary world exclusive to tomoya and ushio only? how about the other cast? did they get anything beneficial from illusionary world?i mean sure fuuko got healed, tomoyo get what her wished, and other also get what they wanted, but is it actually that or is this whole is just tomoya's story, the whole ushio is the representative of the illusionary world made me think that this whole world is moving around tomoya and ushio, where basically it is tomoya's world which means it is tomoya's story, not tomoyo's,kyou's or other people story, it basically revolve around tomoya's decision while other people is like... an add on if you want to say that.

But what i wanted to believe is that, tomoya is not the only one who travels in illusionary world to gather lights, other cast also do this, and therefore result in their happiness (lets just say their route), i know it is kinda funny, but what if when tomoya gets to lets say, yukine route, it is actually what yukine gets after she collects some lights, or when tomoya get tomoyo, it is actually tomoyo who have been collecting lights to get her ending (both preservation of sakura trees and getting together with tomoya). so it is not exclusively tomoya's illusionary world, but also others...

sorry if it sound confusing, i was confused myself :heh:

dgreater1

2008-03-14, 10:21

hmm...so is this feature of illusionary world exclusive to tomoya and ushio only? how about the other cast?

Pretty much, that's the case but I'm not saying the other cast is not in the Illusionary world, they are there, just in the form of a light, it just happens that Tomoya and Ushio are the ones that are aware of their surrounding. The game is kind of implying that the girl in the Illusionary World is Ushio, but we might be wrong as well, and it could be some child of Tomoya towards the girls. But if you'll remember, the girl in the Illusionary World knows a single song, and that song is Nagisa's favorite.

[b]But what i wanted to believe is that, tomoya is not the only one who travels in illusionary world to gather lights, other cast also do this, and therefore result in their happiness (lets just say their route), i know it is kinda funny, but what if when tomoya gets to lets say, yukine route, it is actually what yukine gets after she collects some lights, or when tomoya get tomoyo, it is actually tomoyo who have been collecting lights to get her ending (both preservation of sakura trees and getting together with tomoya). so it is not exclusively tomoya's illusionary world, but also others...

sorry if it sound confusing, i was confused myself :heh:

I don't think they travel to collect some light, Tomoya is a special case that's why he can see those lights. Just like how he is a special case in the Illusionary World, having his awareness of his surrounding intact. Tomoya wasn't really collecting lights IMO, but taking a share of happiness with the light... Those lights are invisible to other's except Tomoya for some unknown reason (he might be a special case that appears once every hundred years XD). Anyway, if I remember correctly Yukine also said that those lights were visible to people long ago, but as time passed by, the people who could see it decreased, and became extinct.

Now for the END part where those lights descended from the sky. Remember how I described Ushio as the representative of the Illusionary World? When she was born without any problems, she probably subconsciously thought that everything will be okay now so she's happy. Since she is happy, and she's the representative of the other world, the lights from the other world which supports her was happy. So in short, the entire town was happy for her.

Proto

2008-03-14, 12:16

Joachim

2008-03-14, 12:22

Hmm... well we know for a fact that Akio used a light to save Nagisa himself, and that Katsuki Shima fully knew what were the lights for, and intended to use it.

In fact it always striked me as odd that Nagisa knew about the Illusionary world. Could it be that Akio and Nagisa shared a very similar experience to Tomoya and Ushio?

that is what i am wondering about, but from game narratives its just like what dgreater said, it is specially for tomoya and ushio.. maybe there is another illusionary world for other character, and because this game taken from okazaki perspective, therefore it was shown as him in the illusionary world

MeoTwister5

2008-03-14, 12:56

Considering the opening and what the scripters have done with everyone's route, chances they will give the true end after the normal end are extremely high.

There is already the almighty "illusionary ushio + Fuuko" in the OP, with Ushio running happily in the sunflowers field, while we got light orbs.
There is very little chance they would do something like the movie anyway.

I'm kinda wondering how the anime will give us the true ending after the normal ending, unless they resort to some magical or time-travelling deus ex machina to get it done. The game did not attempt to link the endings together by actually sending Tomoya back to Ushio's birth, but merely implied the possibility that he could do so and maybe did so. The scenes of the Illusionary World post-Ushio merely implied that her death catalyzed his return to the birthday to save the 2 people he loved the most, but does not directly give ebidence that the Tomoya of hte true end is, in fact, the Tomoya of the normal ending.

That said, unless we see something outlandish by KyoAni the only way I think they can make a the essence of both endings into one is to fuse them somehow.

My speculation suggests maybe Nagisa will fall into a coma instead of you-know-what after Ushio is born, and we get to see the remainder of the normal route in the light of a comatose Nagisa and a very distant Tomoya.

The True ending then would be that of Nagisa awakening from the light orb miracle, rather than having Tomoya experience Ushio's birth all over again...

Kristen

2008-03-14, 13:04

I'm kinda wondering how the anime will give us the true ending after the normal ending, unless they resort to some magical or time-travelling deus ex machina to get it done. The game did not attempt to link the endings together by actually sending Tomoya back to Ushio's birth, but merely implied the possibility that he could do so and maybe did so. The scenes of the Illusionary World post-Ushio merely implied that her death catalyzed his return to the birthday to save the 2 people he loved the most, but does not directly give ebidence that the Tomoya of hte true end is, in fact, the Tomoya of the normal ending.

That said, unless we see something outlandish by KyoAni the only way I think they can make a the essence of both endings into one is to fuse them somehow.

My speculation suggests maybe Nagisa will fall into a coma instead of you-know-what after Ushio is born, and we get to see the remainder of the normal route in the light of a comatose Nagisa and a very distant Tomoya.

The True ending then would be that of Nagisa awakening from the light orb miracle, rather than having Tomoya experience Ushio's birth all over again...

I don't know if that would happen. It has a very strong reference to another anime Kyoani animated, and it's the type of reference I think they really want to avoid as a main part of the story.

I think the only way to do the story without the time warp would be to make a story similar to the movie where Nagisa still dies, but Tomoya discovers a new family in Ushio. AKA, don't have Ushio die at the end. Of course, the illusionary world and the lights would be meaningless, but it is a way to end without a timewarp.

velocity7

2008-03-14, 21:48

I don't know if that would happen. It has a very strong reference to another anime Kyoani animated, and it's the type of reference I think they really want to avoid as a main part of the story.

I think the only way to do the story without the time warp would be to make a story similar to the movie where Nagisa still dies, but Tomoya discovers a new family in Ushio. AKA, don't have Ushio die at the end. Of course, the illusionary world and the lights would be meaningless, but it is a way to end without a timewarp.

This of course, would not be true to the original content of the game, and thus would mess up KyoAni's reputation for keeping true to source material. :)

Willcrusher

2008-03-14, 22:51

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-14, 22:54

Joachim

2008-03-14, 23:53

New/Old

2008-03-15, 03:57

I would be disappointed if they placed all that on one ova... Unless it was about a couple of hours or so. -_-

Ice Block

2008-03-15, 07:13

It'll be solved in Episode 24 OVA on the final DVD disc. The AS, True End etc etc. Ep 23 at the end of this month should be the bridge, so hang tight until July 22nd to August for the final episode. Next week's is the end of the "regular" episodes, followed by Special Ep. 23, and the Finale #24 in July.

What'll be solved by then will most likely be the schedule for when season 2 will air.

----------

So after playing through Nagisa's route again, I learned about the cinnamon roll incident you guys were pointing out a while back. Maybe they could expand that part to include Laser Tag route and the team members recruitment phase? Then we'll have BASEBALL for the OVA! :p

----------

Anyway, I'm leaning more towards a 24 episode AS season with School Life arcs sandwiched between Bad End and True End. I highly doubt that KyoAni will ignore the lights coz they even bothered to emphasize the importance/significance of the Illusionary World through jaw-dropping 24 unique fps animation :heh:.

panzerfan

2008-03-15, 08:52

Kristen

2008-03-15, 09:03

After story, should KyoAni choose to animate it, is perhaps the most serious of all of their productions, and one that I think some of the younger audience members will not be able to easily connect to.

In After Story, the grand picture turns to not only Tomoya and his own struggle regarding family, but the need to discuss Furukawa without Nagisa, a remorseful Naoyuki trying to mend what he can and be with his aging mother when it might be too late, the Ibuki moving onwards and the rest of the crew reaching out for the future. The tale of a town is a scope that exceeds other works done by KyoAni, and this isn't typical fare anime material.

Personally, I find Tomoyo After to be more in line with the 'norm'.

Let's see how things will evolve. By next week, hopefully, some indication of KyoAni's intention after the end of high school arc will be made more clear...

I think that KyoAni will probably announce something in two weeks. I don't think anything will be coming next week, thinking back to Air. Even though Episode 12 of Air was the last of the canon, they didn't make any announcement regarding their "Air in Summer" production until after the recap episode.
It actually makes me wonder what they'll do, since 23 is technically not the last episode of Clannad...

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-15, 09:21

After story, should KyoAni choose to animate it, is perhaps the most serious of all of their productions, and one that I think some of the younger audience members will not be able to easily connect to.

In After Story, the grand picture turns to not only Tomoya and his own struggle regarding family, but the need to discuss Furukawa without Nagisa, a remorseful Naoyuki trying to mend what he can and be with his aging mother when it might be too late, the Ibuki moving onwards and the rest of the crew reaching out for the future. The tale of a town is a scope that exceeds other works done by KyoAni, and this isn't typical fare anime material.

Personally, I find Tomoyo After to be more in line with the 'norm'.

Let's see how things will evolve. By next week, hopefully, some indication of KyoAni's intention after the end of high school arc will be made more clear...
As a working 20-something, I feel a strong resonance from AfterStory, as one of the main themes besides family is how things change all the time as everyone moves on, while we would always yearn for the time that is long gone.

panzerfan

2008-03-15, 09:45

MeoTwister5

2008-03-15, 11:06

After Story really got me, especially thinking about Okazaki Shino and the Furukawa couple. With what feeling did Akio and Sanae had as they take after Ushio, and as Shino thinks of her own descendants...

To think in Shino's place did alot of emotional damage on my part. There is definitely a sense of guilt and self-blame for someone, especially from the wartime generation to see how things have evolved for her son and grandson. For an elderly in her twilight, having these things to burden her heart made me pause for more than a moment.

Naoyuki sees his own son repeating his own folly, and knows well that the rift that was not mended during teenage becomes that much harder to bridge in adulthood. Tomoya and Naoyuki by this point is truly no longer father and son in a familial sense, and a flawed man trying to help another flawed man... the taste of this element is so vivid and haunting in how that I've seen and experienced this.

Sanae and Akio are not even hitting their 50s, and they're the ones that are cleaning up after the mourning. Aside from the utter bitterness in burying their child and dealing with such a blow to their dream, their granddaughter has to be raised... what choice have they, given their own loving nature but to shoulder that mantle? I find it a fortunate thing that Akio and Sanae's parents are not discussed....

I wonder if this is anime material...

The moment Ushio asked "Can you tell me about mom?" on the train. I started bawling mye eyes out like an idiot. I can't imagine any father having the heart to answer this question in any straight and calm manner.

That said, KyoAni is doing a remarkable job with the school arc. The problem is that many of the thematic issues and stories are in the normal route, and after that symbolically linked to the true end. I don't doubt their capability to present these themes, but it worries me HOW they'll do so, considering that normal and true and 2 different routes and entities.

Because the themes are a consequence of Nagisa's death. They happened because she died. We'd have to see something of an equal emotional torment happen to Tomoya to see these themes presented. Nothing compares to losing a loved one...

And yet a part of me demands that she live. There has to be a way to present the stories and themes of both routes while keeping her alive. Tomoya and Nagisa deserve that much. They got it in the game, they should get it in the anime.

And if she dies there will be bloodshed.

Gratuitous bloodshed.

Deathscyther

2008-03-15, 11:24

If there is a second season, I see them going for the bad route: nagisa dying, tomoya getting depressed, ushio dying.

And then we'll see the last scene of the illusionary world after that. We'll get to learn everything about that world, before Tomoya is asked to save someone else than the girl...and he decides to save nagisa. Then we'll get the same scene as in the game, where we see the light orbs travelling through the world and time, only to end up with Nagisa when she's about to die. And this time she will survive...and we'll get a happy epilogue with Tomoya and Nagisa, seeing Ushio playing in the fields and her meeting Fuko.

Together with some other arcs (Sanae, Akio, yuusuke and such)this would seem like a fine second season to me. We'll get to see drama, sadness and happiness in the season and we'll get to understand everything about the light orbs and such.

MeoTwister5

2008-03-15, 11:29

And that would entail some sort of time travel. Which is terms of the story's internal reality a bit more outlandish considering it is far more grounded on reality and slice-of-life than Kanon or Air ever was.

The game didn't set a precedent for this since the normal end never had a direct continuoum to the true end, as you had to play that event over again on your own.

The only way normal end to true end story would work is to somehow link them together without making us go WTF.:confused:

Kristen

2008-03-15, 11:36

Deathscyther

2008-03-15, 11:45

hehe, yeah, they should make the scene a little shorter:p

But what do you expect? This is an anime with some mysterious aspects to it. It's not supposed to be a story that's just focused on reality. Fuko's arc already had some mysterious 'outlandish' aspects. And the illusionary world is very mysterious as well.

I think people who haven't played the game already know that there is more to this story then meets the eye. I think some kind of time-warp or something is nessassary to complete the story.

Mirrinus

2008-03-15, 13:18

I'm still trying to figure out whether or not the signs given so far point to the making of the After Story as a second season. For one, there are so many uncovered points that have been hinted at; in particular, parts of the OP don't even make sense unless we bring up the After Story. It's like they're purposely avoiding certain aspects of Clannad that would be better suited to that portion. To not do it would be an incredible disappointment, which makes me rather jittery over it.

Although, what would the OP and ED to it be if it were made? We've already used Mag Mel and Dango Daikazoku, lol.

Proto

2008-03-15, 13:20

Dango Daikazoku was an original arrange of Nagisa's theme and Chiisana Tenohira by Maeda Jun, so I guess they could arrange another of the game's theme BGM into an OP and the ED. Say, Ushio's theme by Riya

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-17, 12:22

Let me join in the speculation of how the direction of the story should be for a possible second series.

If episode 22 ends as expected at the end of the School Festival, which now takes place sometime in July.

We know that since:
1. Summer holiday was not mentioned, they normally start around late July for Japanese schools.
2. Kotomi's epilogue took place two months after her birthday on May 13th.
3. This has to be the latest time possible for the school to elect the new Student Council, it'll be too late for them to do anything if they are elected in September after the summer holidays.

Season two can start off with:

- Tomoya and Nagisa, now a couple, go on their first date, before Nagisa succumbs to her long illness.

- During the months that follow in Nagisa's absence, Yukine can get 1 episode for her story, 1 for Misae-san, and 1/2 for Koumura by the end of the school term.

- Tomoya and co graduate without Nagisa, who has to repeat another year.

- Tomoya's first job with the Furukawas, and Nagisa's third attempt at third year. Tomoyo, and Nishina to get more screentime here, as they're only mentioned off screen in the game.

- Tomoya obtains permanent job with Yoshino, decides to move out with Nagisa and gets permission from Akio and Sanae-san.

- It's still not too late to put in Kappei's story here, as his scenes mostly take place outside the school. Tomoya can still meet him while fixing lamp-posts time to time. Kyo-Ani can allow Tomoya to somehow still keep in touch with the twins. Kyou would be in vocational academy while Ryou would be in nursing school. Plus Yoshino's appearance wouldn't seem too coincidental for Kappei's conclusion. One to two episodes ought to do.

- Rather than keep them apart as in the game, Akio and Sanae-san's side-stories can be told linearly without too many problems.

- Yoshino's album. Kyo-Ani releases a single sung by Midorikawa Hikaru. Though it won't be anywhere near Haruhi's "God Knows".

Series 1/2 completed now.

- Nagisa's graduation. It'll be interesting to see what Kyo-Ani does with the other characters in After Story before this scene. Make them disappear completely or have them as background characters.

- Tomoya marries Nagisa. Nagisa works as waitress.

- Birth arc. Akio tells Tomoya everything about Nagisa's illness. Ushio born.

Series 2/3 completed.

- Ushio arc. Time gap to five years later. Sanae-san arranges for Tomoya to meet his grandmother Shino, taking Ushio with him.

- Tomoya finally accepts Ushio into his life, and finally forgives his father. Kleenex reports huge profits during this week.

- Tomoya finds out Kyou is Ushio's teacher. If they can, might as well put in Kyou's belated confession to Tomoya without affecting their relationship or Tomoya's commitment to Nagisa and Ushio, thus appeasing those who weren't happy with Kyou's "shafting aside" in series 1 episode 18 but decided to stay on watch up till now.

- The Return of Fuuko. Nuff said.

- Second to last episode: Ushio has the same illness as Nagisa, Tomoya is frustrated.

- Final episode: Tomoya embraces Ushio before both "disappear" into the "light". Revelation of Illusionary World. The robot (Tomoya) collects enough Orbs of Happiness and returns to just after Ushio is born to save Nagisa's life. Epilogue.

From how I see it, True End should take place just after the Illusionary Revelation, since everything else has been taken care off. While it works for the game, for a TV series it'll be quite anti-climatic to wind down after this revelation to go to some other seemingly unrelated storyline like Akio's story before coming back to the climax.

It'll be like the Hobbits arriving in Mordor and then deciding they want to take a bath first (or something like that) instead of heading straight to Mt Doom and be rid of the Ring.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-17, 13:48

I like what Kinny says ^ that is perfect!

from reading the summaries, 22 seems like where episode 21 takes off from and then she will do her play. 23 as read is like after the play and a filler of sorts with Mei so 24 must be where is gets ill once more and can't make her 2nd time. So After Story 2nd season seems completely true. I wonder if it would be called Clannad After story or something like my dream ^-^ Or if we will see some newtype scan with Tomoya and Ushio holding hands or what not XD

areas

2008-03-17, 14:34

Hmmm, judging from KyoAni's lineup of anime, what's your take on the date for a possible clannad 2 to happened?

Since next up from KyoAni is Haruhi 2, i hope they can bring clannad 2 in at oct. The same time last year when clannad start.

Mirrinus

2008-03-17, 14:41

I don't think Haruhi 2 is confirmed to be next up. At any rate, the whole "2008-2009" thing on the site makes me expect a Fall or Winter run for Haruhi. Following up with Clannad AS shortly after the first season airs would make more sense for continuity's sake, which might work if it aired for a season in Summer. Then again, that's not exactly necessary...

Clannad's current state reminds me a lot of Higurashi's before season 2 was announced, except the first season wasn't quite so butchered in Clannad's case, lol.

areas

2008-03-17, 14:45

Damn the suspense.... I'm glad i played thru the visual novel... I can feel the stress of those who havent...

But then again, some of us is just overly excited to see certain moments to be animated...

mandarb916

2008-03-17, 22:08

Naoyuki sees his own son repeating his own folly, and knows well that the rift that was not mended during teenage becomes that much harder to bridge in adulthood. Tomoya and Naoyuki by this point is truly no longer father and son in a familial sense, and a flawed man trying to help another flawed man... the taste of this element is so vivid and haunting in how that I've seen and experienced this.

I think it's quite the contrary...from Tomoya's perspective, the relationship may not be perceived as father and son, but that's primarily because he doesn't (or chooses not to) see the sacrifices his father made for him until his grandmother finally talks with him. While the conflict that led to Tomoya's permanently injured shoulder was unfortunate, Naoyuki sacrificed his own happiness to provide for Tomoya, for better or for worse, in the best way he knew how to, while carrying the sorrow of losing his wife at such a young age.

While Naoyuki does screw up (hey he's only human), I think Naoyuki trying to be Tomoya's father is much more respectable than what Tomoya did with Ushio...so while I think Naoyuki is flawed in the sense that he made mistakes that others would possibly make, I don't believe one could really say it's a situation where the truly flawed is leading the flawed.

mandarb916

2008-03-17, 22:14

- It's still not too late to put in Kappei's story here, as his scenes mostly take place outside the school. Tomoya can still meet him while fixing lamp-posts time to time. Kyo-Ani can allow Tomoya to somehow still keep in touch with the twins. Kyou would be in vocational academy while Ryou would be in nursing school. Plus Yoshino's appearance wouldn't seem too coincidental for Kappei's conclusion. One to two episodes ought to do.

I think this would be awful...one of the breather points in the AS was the sudden appearance of Kyou immediately after Tomoya accepts Ushio back into his life and was one of the most touching moments imho when his support structure was at more or less an all time low, an old friend comes back into his life and offers him support...basically setting in stone that kyou was more than just an acquaintance even if the two meeting together again may have been coincidence.

Proto

2008-03-18, 00:06

I guess it wouldn't be that much of a problem to put Kappei's story before Tomoya's graduation anyway, though it would be probably better to put the Yoshino's and Sunohara's 'I want to make a band' moment to remind the audience that Yoshino is not a random character :p Plus it wouldn't be that far stretched to put Yoshino as making a visit to Fuuko (which is what he was probably doing anyway) to explain his sudden appearance.

panzerfan

2008-03-18, 06:49

It is true that Tomoya is being even less responsible than Naoyuki. However issue that exists from my observation is that misgivings between children and parents during teenage years, if not resolved during those time that the family unit spend together, cannot really be mended by maturity as the children have been matured as individuals. Once parents leave the life of their children for an extended period of time when the children are still maturing, the very association of family member weakens. The very social experiences aren't shared and there will be less in common as time progresses. To reclaim such 'lost time' only becomes more and more difficult for all parties involved.

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-18, 11:49

I think this would be awful...one of the breather points in the AS was the sudden appearance of Kyou immediately after Tomoya accepts Ushio back into his life and was one of the most touching moments imho when his support structure was at more or less an all time low, an old friend comes back into his life and offers him support...basically setting in stone that kyou was more than just an acquaintance even if the two meeting together again may have been coincidence.

Ah, but you're forgetting one thing. After Nagisa's passing away, Tomoya basically goes into a self-imposed exile and shuns away from everyone he knew like the plague, for five years. This five year gap is more than enough for him and Kyou to reminisce without ruining the touching feel that you mention. So while in the game Tomoya has not seen her for seven years, my suggested route isn't that far off the bat.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-18, 20:30

Oh maybe Kyou can have her rain scene but Tomoya is still too depressed maybe have kappei in the 5 year lull...whichever part just have Kappei! I think I have said it enough...

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-20, 11:51

Now I remember what I wanted to add: It is not just a bonus to put in Yukine's story, it is essential that they do this, for Yukine's scenario is the only one that directly explains the Orbs of Happiness.

And for that to happen, Tomoya must experience Yukine feeling happiness for the gathering of her late brother's friends, and for Tomoya to actually see at least one light orb land in his hand.

atomcepi11

2008-03-21, 02:39

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3117/aaagw9.th.png (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=aaagw9.png)

Akio?

GameMaster0000

2008-03-21, 05:07

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3117/aaagw9.th.png (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=aaagw9.png)

Akio?

I think its not. Akio story is in after story.

I hope they make SS for this series.

Kristen

2008-03-21, 06:51

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/3117/aaagw9.th.png (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=aaagw9.png)

Akio?

DVD 8.

There've been 6 new lights, each time at the start of a new DVD, starting from DVD 3. This light reaffirms my suspicions.

Simply put, too many coincidences to believe otherwise.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-21, 10:30

I really have no idea how they are doing the light orbs.

For episode 24 I do not believe it is After Story since 23 doesn't even seem to show Nagisa becoming sick. I think that will be saved for 24. I'm thinking 23 might focus on sunohara? They could do an odd version of it maybe.

germanturkey

2008-03-21, 21:02

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-21, 21:43

maybe what they'll do for 23 and 24? probably not

23 is after graduation etc, Tomoya and Nagisa are living together. few experiences here and there. 23 ends with the two of them in bed. ushio is conceived. 24 is after Ushio is born and Nagisa has already kicked the bucket. they'll show the event via flashback and end with Tomoya finally accepting Ushio.

Erm, the preview clearly shows that episode 23 is still in the "school life" period. Besides, it is titled "The Summer Break Incident". The Japanese school year starts and ends in March/April. In the story timeline, it's only been around 3 months since Okazaki met Nagisa.

Episode 1 was in spring, at the beginning of term with the sakura blossoming. They changed into summer uniforms halfway through but haven't had a term break yet. Hence, we can safely assume that the whole series is set within one school term. Episode 23 is set during the summer break of the same year, following which, another 7-8 months to go before graduation in March or April of the next year.

It would be impossible to squeeze After Story into one episode. And if they followed your plan for episode 24, they might as well just announce "Dear Viewers, we have decided not to animate this episode. May we kindly refer you to the last 30 minutes of the Clannad Movie" :heh:

For my part, I believe that the second season - if there is one - will end happily. The light orbs were mentioned but not explained in the other world scenes. They must play some role in a hypothetical second season, and I believe that they were key to the miracle (of Nagisa's survival) in the game. If the light orbs won't achieve anything, why mention them? They certainly aren't essential to Nagisa's play. They weren't in the movie, because the movie adhered to the natural laws of life, death and time.

The tone of the serial is sufficiently different from that of the movie to suggest a different ending. The serial is, above all, warm and light-hearted. In the movie, however, even the happiest scenes were shadowed by a sense that joyful times would come to an end, a beautiful but crushing atmosphere (the same was true for Air).

Finally, movie Nagisa was almost surreal, a character 'too good for this world'. Thankfully, serial Nagisa is very down-to-earth ^^

King87

2008-03-22, 02:58

By reading most of these post I would like to know......is nagisa dying in the after story the original ending of the game? If so would the anime do the same?

Ice Block

2008-03-22, 05:40

Season two can start off with:

- Tomoya and Nagisa, now a couple, go on their first date, before Nagisa succumbs to her long illness.

- During the months that follow in Nagisa's absence, Yukine can get 1 episode for her story, 1 for Misae-san, and 1/2 for Koumura by the end of the school term.

- Tomoya and co graduate without Nagisa, who has to repeat another year.

- Tomoya's first job with the Furukawas, and Nagisa's third attempt at third year. Tomoyo, and Nishina to get more screentime here, as they're only mentioned off screen in the game.

- Tomoya obtains permanent job with Yoshino, decides to move out with Nagisa and gets permission from Akio and Sanae-san.

- It's still not too late to put in Kappei's story here, as his scenes mostly take place outside the school. Tomoya can still meet him while fixing lamp-posts time to time. Kyo-Ani can allow Tomoya to somehow still keep in touch with the twins. Kyou would be in vocational academy while Ryou would be in nursing school. Plus Yoshino's appearance wouldn't seem too coincidental for Kappei's conclusion. One to two episodes ought to do.

- Rather than keep them apart as in the game, Akio and Sanae-san's side-stories can be told linearly without too many problems.

- Yoshino's album. Kyo-Ani releases a single sung by Midorikawa Hikaru. Though it won't be anywhere near Haruhi's "God Knows".

Series 1/2 completed now.

- Nagisa's graduation. It'll be interesting to see what Kyo-Ani does with the other characters in After Story before this scene. Make them disappear completely or have them as background characters.

- Tomoya marries Nagisa. Nagisa works as waitress.

- Birth arc. Akio tells Tomoya everything about Nagisa's illness. Ushio born.

Series 2/3 completed.

- Ushio arc. Time gap to five years later. Sanae-san arranges for Tomoya to meet his grandmother Shino, taking Ushio with him.

- Tomoya finally accepts Ushio into his life, and finally forgives his father. Kleenex reports huge profits during this week.

- Tomoya finds out Kyou is Ushio's teacher. If they can, might as well put in Kyou's belated confession to Tomoya without affecting their relationship or Tomoya's commitment to Nagisa and Ushio, thus appeasing those who weren't happy with Kyou's "shafting aside" in series 1 episode 18 but decided to stay on watch up till now.

- The Return of Fuuko. Nuff said.

- Second to last episode: Ushio has the same illness as Nagisa, Tomoya is frustrated.

- Final episode: Tomoya embraces Ushio before both "disappear" into the "light". Revelation of Illusionary World. The robot (Tomoya) collects enough Orbs of Happiness and returns to just after Ushio is born to save Nagisa's life. Epilogue.

The overall format looks good. I'm guessing this is for a 22-26 ep season? IMO, Kappei's scenario should be kept in the school life arc, retaining all the Sunohara goodness :heh:.

Also, I really like the part where KyoAni actually releases Yoshino's album. I bet "Love and Spanner" will be on par with Haruhi's "God Knows". :D

Anyway, here's my take:

Ep01: Nagisa get's sick, drama club visits her occasionally. Tomoya meets Kappei on his way to school. During break, he heads with Sunohara to the Reference room to ask Yukine for a spell to make people feel better; first encounter with Yukine's friends. After school, he asks Misae for advice on treating sick people; conversation drifts to Misae's past.

Ep02: Misae's past scenario; first hints about the light orbs.

Ep03: More Kappei. At school, Tomoya and Sunohara visit Yukine again during break; Yuu's story, more of Yukine's friends, some hints about her brother.

Ep04: Yukine's scenario (Yukine's Light GET); light orbs' past/background explained.

Ep05: More Kappei. Mei visits again, this time leading to the Sunohara siblings' route. (This can also be Ep01 if Ep23/24 of the first season hints about their route.)

Ep06: Sunohara siblings' scenario; Tomoya and Sunohara's relationship with Koumura explained (Sunohara Siblings' Light GET). (This can also be Ep02; same reason as above.)

Ep07: More Kappei :heh:. Kappei starts staying at Sunohara's room, and Ryou and Kappei have their reunion and formal introduction. Sunohara discovers Kappei's past.

Ep08: Kappei's scenario.

Ep09: Winter has arrived; Nagisa's still sick. Her birthday comes. Tomoyo makes her speech; Sunohara goes home to hunt for jobs. Tomoyo's scene in the snow can be included here, but will be very much different from the game.

Ep10: Spring has come. Sunohara comes back, Koumura's past is explained, and all 3rd year students sans Nagisa graduate (Koumura's Light GET). Nagisa finally recovers from her illness, and she repeats her 3rd year again. Tomoya works at Furukawa Bakery, and walks Nagisa to school on her first day, meeting Tomoyo and Takafumi at the bottom of the hill (Sakagami Siblings' Light GET).

Ep11: Tomoya decides to get a real job and moves out of the Furukawa household; cohabitation starts. Build-up to Sanae's and Akio's scenarios can start here.

Ep12: Yoshino's scenario; album production starts.

Ep13: Sanae's scenario (Sanae's Light GET).

Ep14: AKio's scenario (Akio's Light GET).

Ep15: KyoAni releases Yoshino's album (Yoshino's Light GET). Nagisa and Tomoya visit Naoyuki. Nagisa and Tomoya decide to get married after graduation.

Ep16: Winter hits, and Nagisa turns 20. She gets sick again, but assures Tomoya that this time she'll be able to graduate. The school year ends with Nagisa still sick, not attending her graduation ceremony. She gets better, and the couple decides to go on a date to the school.

Ep17: Nagisa's graduation. They visit Naoyuki again, the couple gets married, Nagisa starts working as a waitress.

Ep18: Birth chapter starts.

Ep19: Birth chapter ends (Normal End). Akio and Sanae take care of Ushio. 5-year time skip.

Ep20: Sanae invites Tomoya on a trip with Ushio. Country Train plays. The OP scene is finally shown. Episode ends with Tomoya meeting Shino.

Ep21: BAWWW scene at the cape, BAWWWWWW scene at the train, BAWWWWWWWWW scene at Naoyuki's house (Naoyuki's Light GET). :heh:

Ep22: KYOU!!!! Fuko also returns (Kouko's Light GET). Tomoya remembers Kappei and visits him (Hiiragi Couple's Light GET).

Ep23: Fuko visits Tomoya's apartment. Ushio succumbs to Nagisa's illness. Tomoya gets frustrated. Alteration: Tomoya remembers the orbs of light from Misae's and Yukine's scenario. After he falls asleep, we get an Illusionary world scene. He wakes up in the past, back to school life (time warp) without any memories of the future. Stage is now set for Kyou's route :p.

Ep24: Kyou's scenario part 1.

Ep25: Kyou's scenario part 2.

Ep26: Kyou's scenario part 3 + epilogue (Kyou's Light GET). Halfway into the episode, we see Tomoya falling asleep, another Illusionary world scene, and he wakes up from his sleep back in Ep23 with a warm feeling in his hand, but with no memories of his dream. Tomoya quits his job to take care of Ushio. Episode ends with Ushio asking him to go on a trip together.

Ep27: Episode starts where last ep left off. Tomoya agrees to go. Explanation/revelation of the Illusionary World occurs after the scene in the Snowfield. We get a time warp to the birth scene. Episode ends with "A Tiny Palm". TRUE END. Epilogue. Little Busters! announcement :heh:.

- If I'm not mistaken, Misae's light is in Ep22 of season 1. IIRC, she wanted to spend the school festival with Shima, and that's what happened when Tomoya found the cat in Tomoyo's route.

- KyoAni can come up with some excuse for extending Kappei's hospitalization to 7 years. This way, we can also get an extra scene of Ushio playing with little Hiiragi (lol, I'm getting Kagami/Tsukasa vibes from this kid. Maybe they can have twins too?), since they'll have about the same age ;).

- IMO, the part with the time warp back to School Life above (Ep23) is the only way to get Kyou's light, since her Happiness = her feelings for Tomoya being reciprocated.

- Ep26 could also end with the Snowfield scene. Ep27 can then begin with the Illusionary World Revelation. This way, viewers will be left with the gamers' reactions after finishing normal AS for 1 week :heh:. This will also free up more space for Ep27, so they can pace it perfectly.

- LOL 27 episodes... Ep24 and Ep25 can be merged though, resulting in less build-up for Kyou's route. Whether that's a good or bad thing is up to you :p. OTOH, Ep05 and Ep06 can be skipped if KyoAni animates the Sunohara Siblings' route in Ep23 and Ep24 of the first season.

- If they want, KyoAni could release Ep28, a DVD-only OVA featuring Nagisa's and Tomoya's belated wedding ceremony, attended by the entire cast. Kotomi-chan can make an appearance here ;). They can then end it with Ushio's trip around the world (Memories of a Town).

MeoTwister5

2008-03-22, 06:08

The overall format looks good. I'm guessing this is for a 22-26 ep season? IMO, Kappei's scenario should be kept in the school life arc, retaining all the Sunohara goodness :heh:.

Also, I really like the part where KyoAni actually releases Yoshino's album. I bet "Love and Spanner" will be on par with Haruhi's "God Knows". :D

Anyway, here's my take:

Ep01: Nagisa get's sick, drama club visits her occasionally. Tomoya meets Kappei on his way to school. During break, he heads with Sunohara to the Reference room to ask Yukine for a spell to make people feel better; first encounter with Yukine's friends. After school, he asks Misae for advice on treating sick people; conversation drifts to Misae's past.

Ep02: Misae's past scenario; first hints about the light orbs.

Ep03: More Kappei. At school, Tomoya and Sunohara visit Yukine again during break; Yuu's story, more of Yukine's friends, some hints about her brother.

Ep04: Yukine's scenario (Yukine's Light GET); light orbs' past/background explained.

Ep05: More Kappei. Mei visits again, this time leading to the Sunohara siblings' route. (This can also be Ep01 if Ep23/24 of the first season hints about their route.)

Ep06: Sunohara siblings' scenario; Tomoya and Sunohara's relationship with Koumura explained (Sunohara Siblings' Light GET). (This can also be Ep02; same reason as above.)

Ep07: More Kappei :heh:. Kappei starts staying at Sunohara's room, and Ryou and Kappei have their reunion and formal introduction. Sunohara discovers Kappei's past.

Ep08: Kappei's scenario.

Ep09: Winter has arrived; Nagisa's still sick. Her birthday comes. Tomoyo makes her speech; Sunohara goes home to hunt for jobs. Tomoyo's scene in the snow can be included here, but will be very much different from the game.

Ep10: Spring has come. Sunohara comes back, Koumura's past is explained, and all 3rd year students sans Nagisa graduate (Koumura's Light GET). Nagisa finally recovers from her illness, and she repeats her 3rd year again. Tomoya works at Furukawa Bakery, and walks Nagisa to school on her first day, meeting Tomoyo and Takafumi at the bottom of the hill (Sakagami Siblings' Light GET).

Ep11: Tomoya decides to get a real job and moves out of the Furukawa household; cohabitation starts. Build-up to Sanae's and Akio's scenarios can start here.

Ep12: Yoshino's scenario; album production starts.

Ep13: Sanae's scenario (Sanae's Light GET).

Ep14: AKio's scenario (Akio's Light GET).

Ep15: KyoAni releases Yoshino's album (Yoshino's Light GET). Nagisa and Tomoya visit Naoyuki. Nagisa and Tomoya decide to get married after graduation.

Ep16: Winter hits, and Nagisa turns 20. She gets sick again, but assures Tomoya that this time she'll be able to graduate. The school year ends with Nagisa still sick, not attending her graduation ceremony. She gets better, and the couple decides to go on a date to the school.

Ep17: Nagisa's graduation. They visit Naoyuki again, the couple gets married, Nagisa starts working as a waitress.

Ep18: Birth chapter starts.

Ep19: Birth chapter ends (Normal End). Akio and Sanae take care of Ushio. 5-year time skip.

Ep20: Sanae invites Tomoya on a trip with Ushio. Country Train plays. The OP scene is finally shown. Episode ends with Tomoya meeting Shino.

Ep21: BAWWW scene at the cape, BAWWWWWW scene at the train, BAWWWWWWWWW scene at Naoyuki's house (Naoyuki's Light GET). :heh:

Ep22: KYOU!!!! Fuko also returns (Kouko's Light GET). Tomoya remembers Kappei and visits him (Hiiragi Couple's Light GET).

Ep23: Fuko visits Tomoya's apartment. Ushio succumbs to Nagisa's illness. Tomoya gets frustrated. Alteration: Tomoya remembers the orbs of light from Misae's and Yukine's scenario. After he falls asleep, we get an Illusionary world scene. He wakes up in the past, back to school life (time warp) without any memories of the future. Stage is now set for Kyou's route :p.

Ep24: Kyou's scenario part 1.

Ep25: Kyou's scenario part 2.

Ep26: Kyou's scenario part 3 + epilogue (Kyou's Light GET). Halfway into the episode, we see Tomoya falling asleep, another Illusionary world scene, and he wakes up from his sleep back in Ep23 with a warm feeling in his hand, but with no memories of his dream. Tomoya quits his job to take care of Ushio. Episode ends with Ushio asking him to go on a trip together.

Ep27: Episode starts where last ep left off. Tomoya agrees to go. Explanation/revelation of the Illusionary World occurs after the scene in the Snowfield. We get a time warp to the birth scene. Episode ends with "A Tiny Palm". TRUE END. Epilogue. Little Busters! announcement :heh:.

- If I'm not mistaken, Misae's light is in Ep22 of season 1. IIRC, she wanted to spend the school festival with Shima, and that's what happened when Tomoya found the cat in Tomoyo's route.

- KyoAni can come up with some excuse for extending Kappei's hospitalization to 7 years. This way, we can also get an extra scene of Ushio playing with little Hiiragi (lol, I'm getting Kagami/Tsukasa vibes from this kid. Maybe they can have twins too?), since they'll have about the same age ;).

- IMO, the part with the time warp back to School Life above (Ep23) is the only way to get Kyou's light, since her Happiness = her feelings for Tomoya being reciprocated.

- Ep26 could also end with the Snowfield scene. Ep27 can then begin with the Illusionary World Revelation. This way, viewers will be left with the gamers' reactions after finishing normal AS for 1 week :heh:. This will also free up more space for Ep27, so they can pace it perfectly.

- LOL 27 episodes... Ep24 and Ep25 can be merged though, resulting in less build-up for Kyou's route. Whether that's a good or bad thing is up to you :p. OTOH, Ep05 and Ep06 can be skipped if KyoAni animates the Sunohara Siblings' route in Ep23 and Ep24 of the first season.

- If they want, KyoAni could release Ep28, a DVD-only OVA featuring Nagisa's and Tomoya's belated wedding ceremony, attended by the entire cast. Kotomi-chan can make an appearance here ;). They can then end it with Ushio's trip around the world (Memories of a Town).

Ok a few things:

1. Kyou's scenario at any point past the current season is contradictory to both the flow of the story and Tomoya's love for Nagisa. It is clearly stated that Kyou becomes a teacher and Ryou a nurse, and I highly doubt Kyou has any intention of becoming the secondary lover, if at all. That and she's clearly wrapped up her feelings in the current season. And I'd lose all respect for her if she did try to seduce him.:confused:

2. Kappei's story in the game has a major time skip. Either they make him wanna do the damn surgery quickly or find some other way to compress it.

----------------

I'm sure everyone saw Ushio running happily in the intro, which she doesn't do in the game post-death of Nagisa. However there is a still of her running happily through the very same flower field in the True End. I'm hoping this is a guarantee that we are getting a happy ending. No other couple in Japanese anime deserve as much a happy ending as them.:heh:

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-22, 06:10

After Story really got me, especially thinking about Okazaki Shino and the Furukawa couple. With what feeling did Akio and Sanae had as they take after Ushio, and as Shino thinks of her own descendants...

To think in Shino's place did alot of emotional damage on my part. There is definitely a sense of guilt and self-blame for someone, especially from the wartime generation to see how things have evolved for her son and grandson. For an elderly in her twilight, having these things to burden her heart made me pause for more than a moment.

Naoyuki sees his own son repeating his own folly, and knows well that the rift that was not mended during teenage becomes that much harder to bridge in adulthood. Tomoya and Naoyuki by this point is truly no longer father and son in a familial sense, and a flawed man trying to help another flawed man... the taste of this element is so vivid and haunting in how that I've seen and experienced this.

Sanae and Akio are not even hitting their 50s, and they're the ones that are cleaning up after the mourning. Aside from the utter bitterness in burying their child and dealing with such a blow to their dream, their granddaughter has to be raised... what choice have they, given their own loving nature but to shoulder that mantle? I find it a fortunate thing that Akio and Sanae's parents are not discussed....

I wonder if this is anime material...

That's precisely why I want After Story animated, because there's not enough anime centred on family struggles and redemption. Sure, there are lots of series with a family theme, but Clannad takes the family theme to a whole new level and that profundity is exactly what I want to see in anime.

Simply put, whoever is able to animate After Story well will be creating a masterpiece. The questions are whether Kyo Ani is willing to rise up to the challenge, and whether it would be profitable to do so.

(The Fruits Basket manga was actually quite profound in its exploration of family, especially in the later volumes. The anime adaptation, however, was a joke that screamed "made for kids" and "sugary sweet" throughout >_<.)

Ice Block

2008-03-22, 06:41

1. Kyou's scenario at any point past the current season is contradictory to both the flow of the story and Tomoya's love for Nagisa. It is clearly stated that Kyou becomes a teacher and Ryou a nurse, and I highly doubt Kyou has any intention of becoming the secondary lover, if at all. That and she's clearly wrapped up her feelings in the current season. And I'd lose all respect for her if she did try to seduce him.:confused:

I think you missed my suggested time warp. Basically, it'll be like Akio's scenario in the game, where Tomoya lacks 1 light to save Nagisa, causing the player to play through AS again (but this time, it'll be school life). Tomoya's gonna wake up at April 23 of the School Life arc, and follow the Fujibayashi Twins' route ;).

2. Kappei's story in the game has a major time skip. Either they make him wanna do the damn surgery quickly or find some other way to compress it.

Hence he needs to be introduced at the very start, and have his route build up during Ep01 to Ep07. His route will end with his agreement to do the surgery, and then the next time we'll see him will be during After Story's breather point.

I'm sure everyone saw Ushio running happily in the intro, which she doesn't do in the game post-death of Nagisa. However there is a still of her running happily through the very same flower field in the True End. I'm hoping this is a guarantee that we are getting a happy ending. No other couple in Japanese anime deserve as much a happy ending as them.:heh:

IIRC, she was running through the flower field during their trip to the cape (Normal version; Nagisa dies). She even lost the toy that Tomoya brought her on the way to the cape, which then leads to him meeting with Shino when he decides to look for it and let Ushio rest.

Simply put, whoever is able to animate After Story well will be creating a masterpiece. The questions are whether Kyo Ani is willing to rise up to the challenge, and whether it would be profitable to do so.

I find your lack of faith disturbing :heh:. Anyway, I don't know anything about profits, but KyoAni will NOT drop Clannad after this season (IMO, not fact). The only question here is WHEN they'll show it. Maybe production has already started, and they're just waiting for the right time to announce it.

Deathscyther

2008-03-22, 07:50

The overall format looks good. I'm guessing this is for a 22-26 ep season? IMO, Kappei's scenario should be kept in the school life arc, retaining all the Sunohara goodness :heh:.

Also, I really like the part where KyoAni actually releases Yoshino's album. I bet "Love and Spanner" will be on par with Haruhi's "God Knows". :D

Anyway, here's my take:

Ep01: Nagisa get's sick, drama club visits her occasionally. Tomoya meets Kappei on his way to school. During break, he heads with Sunohara to the Reference room to ask Yukine for a spell to make people feel better; first encounter with Yukine's friends. After school, he asks Misae for advice on treating sick people; conversation drifts to Misae's past.

Ep02: Misae's past scenario; first hints about the light orbs.

Ep03: More Kappei. At school, Tomoya and Sunohara visit Yukine again during break; Yuu's story, more of Yukine's friends, some hints about her brother.

Ep04: Yukine's scenario (Yukine's Light GET); light orbs' past/background explained.

Ep05: More Kappei. Mei visits again, this time leading to the Sunohara siblings' route. (This can also be Ep01 if Ep23/24 of the first season hints about their route.)

Ep06: Sunohara siblings' scenario; Tomoya and Sunohara's relationship with Koumura explained (Sunohara Siblings' Light GET). (This can also be Ep02; same reason as above.)

Ep07: More Kappei :heh:. Kappei starts staying at Sunohara's room, and Ryou and Kappei have their reunion and formal introduction. Sunohara discovers Kappei's past.

Ep08: Kappei's scenario.

Ep09: Winter has arrived; Nagisa's still sick. Her birthday comes. Tomoyo makes her speech; Sunohara goes home to hunt for jobs. Tomoyo's scene in the snow can be included here, but will be very much different from the game.

Ep10: Spring has come. Sunohara comes back, Koumura's past is explained, and all 3rd year students sans Nagisa graduate (Koumura's Light GET). Nagisa finally recovers from her illness, and she repeats her 3rd year again. Tomoya works at Furukawa Bakery, and walks Nagisa to school on her first day, meeting Tomoyo and Takafumi at the bottom of the hill (Sakagami Siblings' Light GET).

Ep11: Tomoya decides to get a real job and moves out of the Furukawa household; cohabitation starts. Build-up to Sanae's and Akio's scenarios can start here.

Ep12: Yoshino's scenario; album production starts.

Ep13: Sanae's scenario (Sanae's Light GET).

Ep14: AKio's scenario (Akio's Light GET).

Ep15: KyoAni releases Yoshino's album (Yoshino's Light GET). Nagisa and Tomoya visit Naoyuki. Nagisa and Tomoya decide to get married after graduation.

Ep16: Winter hits, and Nagisa turns 20. She gets sick again, but assures Tomoya that this time she'll be able to graduate. The school year ends with Nagisa still sick, not attending her graduation ceremony. She gets better, and the couple decides to go on a date to the school.

Ep17: Nagisa's graduation. They visit Naoyuki again, the couple gets married, Nagisa starts working as a waitress.

Ep18: Birth chapter starts.

Ep19: Birth chapter ends (Normal End). Akio and Sanae take care of Ushio. 5-year time skip.

Ep20: Sanae invites Tomoya on a trip with Ushio. Country Train plays. The OP scene is finally shown. Episode ends with Tomoya meeting Shino.

Ep21: BAWWW scene at the cape, BAWWWWWW scene at the train, BAWWWWWWWWW scene at Naoyuki's house (Naoyuki's Light GET). :heh:

Ep22: KYOU!!!! Fuko also returns (Kouko's Light GET). Tomoya remembers Kappei and visits him (Hiiragi Couple's Light GET).

Ep23: Fuko visits Tomoya's apartment. Ushio succumbs to Nagisa's illness. Tomoya gets frustrated. Alteration: Tomoya remembers the orbs of light from Misae's and Yukine's scenario. After he falls asleep, we get an Illusionary world scene. He wakes up in the past, back to school life (time warp) without any memories of the future. Stage is now set for Kyou's route :p.

Ep24: Kyou's scenario part 1.

Ep25: Kyou's scenario part 2.

Ep26: Kyou's scenario part 3 + epilogue (Kyou's Light GET). Halfway into the episode, we see Tomoya falling asleep, another Illusionary world scene, and he wakes up from his sleep back in Ep23 with a warm feeling in his hand, but with no memories of his dream. Tomoya quits his job to take care of Ushio. Episode ends with Ushio asking him to go on a trip together.

Ep27: Episode starts where last ep left off. Tomoya agrees to go. Explanation/revelation of the Illusionary World occurs after the scene in the Snowfield. We get a time warp to the birth scene. Episode ends with "A Tiny Palm". TRUE END. Epilogue. Little Busters! announcement :heh:.

- If I'm not mistaken, Misae's light is in Ep22 of season 1. IIRC, she wanted to spend the school festival with Shima, and that's what happened when Tomoya found the cat in Tomoyo's route.

- KyoAni can come up with some excuse for extending Kappei's hospitalization to 7 years. This way, we can also get an extra scene of Ushio playing with little Hiiragi (lol, I'm getting Kagami/Tsukasa vibes from this kid. Maybe they can have twins too?), since they'll have about the same age ;).

- IMO, the part with the time warp back to School Life above (Ep23) is the only way to get Kyou's light, since her Happiness = her feelings for Tomoya being reciprocated.

- Ep26 could also end with the Snowfield scene. Ep27 can then begin with the Illusionary World Revelation. This way, viewers will be left with the gamers' reactions after finishing normal AS for 1 week :heh:. This will also free up more space for Ep27, so they can pace it perfectly.

- LOL 27 episodes... Ep24 and Ep25 can be merged though, resulting in less build-up for Kyou's route. Whether that's a good or bad thing is up to you :p. OTOH, Ep05 and Ep06 can be skipped if KyoAni animates the Sunohara Siblings' route in Ep23 and Ep24 of the first season.

- If they want, KyoAni could release Ep28, a DVD-only OVA featuring Nagisa's and Tomoya's belated wedding ceremony, attended by the entire cast. Kotomi-chan can make an appearance here ;). They can then end it with Ushio's trip around the world (Memories of a Town).

Sounds very good to me. They could do something like that.

I think that they'll keep the other characters in more though (kotomoi, kyou and such), especially before Nagisa dies. I mean...Kotomi has nobody except her friends. It would be lame to drop her like that. (although Tomoya will probably do so after Nagisa dies)

I'm almost 100% sure that they won't do Kyou's route though. They'll focus on Nagisa and Tomoya's love and that's it. And I bet that they'll save the time warp for the special moment (saving Nagisa) The impact would be less good if they use it for Kyou as well. I like Kyou's route as well, but it won't happen^^;

Kristen

2008-03-22, 08:03

The overall format looks good. I'm guessing this is for a 22-26 ep season? IMO, Kappei's scenario should be kept in the school life arc, retaining all the Sunohara goodness :heh:.

Also, I really like the part where KyoAni actually releases Yoshino's album. I bet "Love and Spanner" will be on par with Haruhi's "God Knows". :D

Anyway, here's my take:

Ep01: Nagisa get's sick, drama club visits her occasionally. Tomoya meets Kappei on his way to school. During break, he heads with Sunohara to the Reference room to ask Yukine for a spell to make people feel better; first encounter with Yukine's friends. After school, he asks Misae for advice on treating sick people; conversation drifts to Misae's past.

Ep02: Misae's past scenario; first hints about the light orbs.

Ep03: More Kappei. At school, Tomoya and Sunohara visit Yukine again during break; Yuu's story, more of Yukine's friends, some hints about her brother.

Ep04: Yukine's scenario (Yukine's Light GET); light orbs' past/background explained.

Ep05: More Kappei. Mei visits again, this time leading to the Sunohara siblings' route. (This can also be Ep01 if Ep23/24 of the first season hints about their route.)

Ep06: Sunohara siblings' scenario; Tomoya and Sunohara's relationship with Koumura explained (Sunohara Siblings' Light GET). (This can also be Ep02; same reason as above.)

Ep07: More Kappei :heh:. Kappei starts staying at Sunohara's room, and Ryou and Kappei have their reunion and formal introduction. Sunohara discovers Kappei's past.

Ep08: Kappei's scenario.

Ep09: Winter has arrived; Nagisa's still sick. Her birthday comes. Tomoyo makes her speech; Sunohara goes home to hunt for jobs. Tomoyo's scene in the snow can be included here, but will be very much different from the game.

Ep10: Spring has come. Sunohara comes back, Koumura's past is explained, and all 3rd year students sans Nagisa graduate (Koumura's Light GET). Nagisa finally recovers from her illness, and she repeats her 3rd year again. Tomoya works at Furukawa Bakery, and walks Nagisa to school on her first day, meeting Tomoyo and Takafumi at the bottom of the hill (Sakagami Siblings' Light GET).

Ep11: Tomoya decides to get a real job and moves out of the Furukawa household; cohabitation starts. Build-up to Sanae's and Akio's scenarios can start here.

Ep12: Yoshino's scenario; album production starts.

Ep13: Sanae's scenario (Sanae's Light GET).

Ep14: AKio's scenario (Akio's Light GET).

Ep15: KyoAni releases Yoshino's album (Yoshino's Light GET). Nagisa and Tomoya visit Naoyuki. Nagisa and Tomoya decide to get married after graduation.

Ep16: Winter hits, and Nagisa turns 20. She gets sick again, but assures Tomoya that this time she'll be able to graduate. The school year ends with Nagisa still sick, not attending her graduation ceremony. She gets better, and the couple decides to go on a date to the school.

Ep17: Nagisa's graduation. They visit Naoyuki again, the couple gets married, Nagisa starts working as a waitress.

Ep18: Birth chapter starts.

Ep19: Birth chapter ends (Normal End). Akio and Sanae take care of Ushio. 5-year time skip.

Ep20: Sanae invites Tomoya on a trip with Ushio. Country Train plays. The OP scene is finally shown. Episode ends with Tomoya meeting Shino.

Ep21: BAWWW scene at the cape, BAWWWWWW scene at the train, BAWWWWWWWWW scene at Naoyuki's house (Naoyuki's Light GET). :heh:

Ep22: KYOU!!!! Fuko also returns (Kouko's Light GET). Tomoya remembers Kappei and visits him (Hiiragi Couple's Light GET).

Ep23: Fuko visits Tomoya's apartment. Ushio succumbs to Nagisa's illness. Tomoya gets frustrated. Alteration: Tomoya remembers the orbs of light from Misae's and Yukine's scenario. After he falls asleep, we get an Illusionary world scene. He wakes up in the past, back to school life (time warp) without any memories of the future. Stage is now set for Kyou's route :p.

Ep24: Kyou's scenario part 1.

Ep25: Kyou's scenario part 2.

Ep26: Kyou's scenario part 3 + epilogue (Kyou's Light GET). Halfway into the episode, we see Tomoya falling asleep, another Illusionary world scene, and he wakes up from his sleep back in Ep23 with a warm feeling in his hand, but with no memories of his dream. Tomoya quits his job to take care of Ushio. Episode ends with Ushio asking him to go on a trip together.

Ep27: Episode starts where last ep left off. Tomoya agrees to go. Explanation/revelation of the Illusionary World occurs after the scene in the Snowfield. We get a time warp to the birth scene. Episode ends with "A Tiny Palm". TRUE END. Epilogue. Little Busters! announcement :heh:.

- If I'm not mistaken, Misae's light is in Ep22 of season 1. IIRC, she wanted to spend the school festival with Shima, and that's what happened when Tomoya found the cat in Tomoyo's route.

- KyoAni can come up with some excuse for extending Kappei's hospitalization to 7 years. This way, we can also get an extra scene of Ushio playing with little Hiiragi (lol, I'm getting Kagami/Tsukasa vibes from this kid. Maybe they can have twins too?), since they'll have about the same age ;).

- IMO, the part with the time warp back to School Life above (Ep23) is the only way to get Kyou's light, since her Happiness = her feelings for Tomoya being reciprocated.

- Ep26 could also end with the Snowfield scene. Ep27 can then begin with the Illusionary World Revelation. This way, viewers will be left with the gamers' reactions after finishing normal AS for 1 week :heh:. This will also free up more space for Ep27, so they can pace it perfectly.

- LOL 27 episodes... Ep24 and Ep25 can be merged though, resulting in less build-up for Kyou's route. Whether that's a good or bad thing is up to you :p. OTOH, Ep05 and Ep06 can be skipped if KyoAni animates the Sunohara Siblings' route in Ep23 and Ep24 of the first season.

- If they want, KyoAni could release Ep28, a DVD-only OVA featuring Nagisa's and Tomoya's belated wedding ceremony, attended by the entire cast. Kotomi-chan can make an appearance here ;). They can then end it with Ushio's trip around the world (Memories of a Town).

Wishful thinking, but it's very detailed. Here are my thoughts on that layout...
First, some of the episodes I feel don't cover enough plot. I can see episodes 3 and 4 being merged together in some way if they move Yuu's past to his scenario. 7 and 8 can be merged, as Kappei doesn't have THAT much scenario. Personally, they could cut out a lot of the Kappei route that is just repitition of the same thing. 9-10-11 would be 2 episodes with that amount of plot. Episode 16 in particular needs to be merged. Those were just a lot of status things.
With 20 and 21, I completely agree, except I think the OP scene would be in episode 21. I felt that the flower field was just as much of a baw scene as any of the others on that trip.
22 and 23 should be merged, since Kyou didn't have THAT big of a role in the After Story.
Now the part I completely disagree with. End of 23, 24, 25, and start of 26. First, the way it is put sounds like a giant plot device just to cover her story. Something like Konoe Fumina in Shana, where it is just made to cover material they had missed. It would be out of canon, and it would DEFINITELY cheapen his love for Nagisa. If it's a dream, even worse, because it shows he is unfaithful to her. If it is a time warp, then again, plot device that will cheapen KyoAni as a whole. Also, we're talking an entire month without being in the canon story, so it dampens the effect of Tomoya losing the thing he loves most almost as soon as he realizes he loves it.
The rest of 26 and 27 I agree with. Though, I think 27 should be an OVA to get viewers who haven't played the game so incredibly saddened by the end only to find out months later that it has a happy end. :p

So, my scenario when trying to include all the routes is 20 episodes. If you include Kyou, which I really think would be awful except to appease her fans, it would be 22, exactly the same as the main story of this season. 27 is dragging it out too much and we'd have a couple of episode with relatively no plot in them instead of being the plot ridden After Story.

However, my thoughts tell me that with Haruhiist, FMPers, and Key fans who didn't like Clannad all wanting something else, KyoAni isn't going to take another 2 seasons to finish this story. I think 12 episodes, not 20.

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-22, 08:31

However, my thoughts tell me that with Haruhiist, FMPers, and Key fans who didn't like Clannad all wanting something else, KyoAni isn't going to take another 2 seasons to finish this story. I think 12 episodes, not 20.

I'd be happy with 12 episodes :)

If we cut out the filler and the other female characters, Ayu's story and Nagisa's school arc both took up around 8 episodes, more or less. Misuzu's story took up significantly less time, but it's still extremely poignant.

Kristen

2008-03-22, 09:57

I'd be happy with 12 episodes :)

If we cut out the filler and the other female characters, Ayu's story and Nagisa's school arc both took up around 8 episodes, more or less. Misuzu's story took up significantly less time, but it's still extremely poignant.

Well, Misuzu's arc took 6 if you count episode 1, episodes 6-7, and the air arc of 10-12. Ayu was around 6 or 8 in total, since she had a lot of time in the introduction arc. But Nagisa was more around 6... Regardless, I see what you mean. :p

12 episodes should be just enough to tell After Story and keep it short and painful. If you need a visual representation, slap your face. Now do it at half speed. Which hurt more? :p

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-22, 23:44

I would be happy with 12 just not make 24 the after story which I really don't believe they will do that.

Ice Block

2008-03-23, 02:32

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-23, 02:39

As long as Haruhi gets a 2nd season this April,

Ahahahaha! Ahahahaha! Hahahahahaha!

No, it's not getting a second season this April. I'm starting to doubt it will ever get one.

By that time, I think Tanigawa may have wrapped up the Haruhiverse,

I also doubt it will take that short of a time for Tanigawa to wrap the novels up, at the speed he writes.

Kristen

2008-03-23, 08:16

Yeah, wishful thinking indeed. And sorry about the pacing, coz I just took some scenes I remembered, gave them about 3-7 minutes each, and inputted them into a 20-minute episode (assuming the OP, ED, sponsors, title screen and preview all add up to 4 mins). I also just gave 1 episode for the minor characters' route proper.

And I, too, am 100% sure that Kyou's scenario will NEVER be included in any future seasons. That's just the fanboy in me talking :heh:. However, if KyoAni does stay true to the game's light orbs, is there any way to get hers?
I remain firm in my opinion that the light orbs in the anime have nothing to do with the events of the anime, but rather, are just a marketing scheme with DVDs. So, in that way, there is no need for each light orb to be assigned a name. That's also partially why I don't think the Miyazawa route is going to be animated.
One of the main reasons I think that the light orbs are not true moment of happiness is episode 15. Under the speculation of true moments of happiness, Kotomi's orb appeared episode 13. However, that is completely inconsistant with the Illusionary World scene Kyoani made up in 15 which started "A new light is born...", as there was no new light orb in 15. So, I think they're going to say that the lights in the illusionary world are the true moments of happiness, and the ones on the title screen are just markers for the DVDs.

:topicoff:

As long as Haruhi gets a 2nd season this April, the Haruhiists shouldn't be storming KyoAni anytime soon. IMO, a steady 1 cour per 2 years of Haruhi is perfect, considering the speed at which the novels are released. S1 - Melancholy, 2006. S2 - Disappearance, 2008. S3 - Intrigues, 2010. S4 - Dissociation and Surprise, 2012. By that time, I think Tanigawa may have wrapped up the Haruhiverse, and KyoAni could then release a 2-cour season, The Culmination of Suzumiya Haruhi, or something along those lines ;).

Don't know about FMP! though. As for Key... there's Tomoyo After, Little Busters!, and, IIRC, ONE? Hey, what about Lucky Star? :heh:

Well, something tells me Haurhi isn't getting a second season for a couple of months. I'd like to see it in April, and Kyoani could always pull a surprise, but I think that they'll be waiting through After Story to see it. I know nothing about FMP either, except that it has a lot of fans asking for a fourth season. There's Tomoyo After (Either OVA or 13 episode anime), Little Busters (No clue. Don't know a thing about that game. :p), and Planetarian (4 EP OVA at best, I think.) They also can animate any of the so called "Pre-Key" games which are One (24 episodes. Would be a 2nd remake, though), Moon (Don't know a thing about it), and Dosei (Think that's the name... But that seemed to just be porn...)
I kind of don't want to see KyoAni animating a second Lucky Star anime. That hurt my head too much. :p

mandarb916

2008-03-23, 11:31

I don't think Tomoyo After is really possible now with the current anime ending...what are they going to do?

TA ep1: "Sorry Nagisa, I thought I liked you, but it turns out I was just hiding my feelings for Tomoyo" ?

lol

Kristen

2008-03-23, 11:44

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-23, 11:52

Kyo ani should throw us a freaking bone XD Something has to air in April from them...just what is it? More Clannad? Haruhi 2? Something else? Man we really need something to go on...what is moon phase telling us? Anything new...?

Why is 24 a DVD only >.< Why would you do that to us! I hope on Thursday they announce something after >.<

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-23, 11:58

Kyo ani should throw us a freaking bone XD Something has to air in April from them...

No, nothing has to air. I think they're working on Munto 3 right now anyway.

mandarb916

2008-03-23, 12:16

Well, you just set it in an alternative universe. :p

Well the alternate universe/non-canon aspect is a given...i'm just curious how they'd actually introduce this alternate universe lol. Nagisa was a torch and she disappeared from existance? lol

I guess it's time to install little busters to tie me over for a while...

any thoughts on Key's 10th anniversary announcement coming soon?

Deathscyther

2008-03-23, 16:59

Tomoyo after would be nice for a OVA or a movie, but I don't think they'll do an anime about it.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-26, 12:56

found this lying around wonder if there is truth to it ....
http://www.riuva.com/?p=1017

also this too can't read chinese at all >.< http://www.yzmydm.com/rss.php?tid=5748

Proto

2008-03-26, 17:32

There will be bound to be many rumours until anything official is announced. I'd suggest to just disregard anything coming short of moonphase.

Furyofthewolves

2008-03-26, 20:55

Well the alternate universe/non-canon aspect is a given...i'm just curious how they'd actually introduce this alternate universe lol. Nagisa was a torch and she disappeared from existance? lol

I guess it's time to install little busters to tie me over for a while...

any thoughts on Key's 10th anniversary announcement coming soon?

Shouldn't be too hard, don't think they really need to do much introducing except to show that the storyline is going to be different, not sure how they would do it tho. But it would be pretty nice if they did OVAs, movies, or anime (tho i doubt it) for each path. That way I'd get to see Kyou's storyline anime style:D

Ice Block

2008-03-27, 04:57

:heh:Shouldn't be too hard, don't think they really need to do much introducing except to show that the storyline is going to be different, not sure how they would do it tho. But it would be pretty nice if they did OVAs, movies, or anime (tho i doubt it) for each path.

They could call it CLANNAD: Another Story :heh:. An anime series would be able to include Misae's, Yukine's, Sunohara's, Kyou's and Kappei's scenarios, with Kyou's as the main story. This could run for a good 12 episodes.

And of course, CLANNAD: Tomoyo After with Tomoyo's FULL scenario in Clannad in first few episodes. 6 episode OVA should be good.

On the other hand, After Story has been announced!
[アニメ]TVA「CLANNAD AFTER STORY」製作決定！

スタッフ、キャストは変わらず。電撃G'sマガジン2008年5月号に監督とシリーズ構成のインタビューが掲載。Well it looks like there's a second season coming our way, Here it says that "the staff and cast will not be changed and that Dengeki G's Magazine (May 2008 Edition) has an interview article with the series director and storyboarder."
Rejoice! I hope they can find a way to include Kyou's rain scene -- it's in the OP after all :(.

boggart

2008-03-27, 05:38

I guess it's time to install little busters to tie me over for a while...

any thoughts on Key's 10th anniversary announcement coming soon?
Little Busters! is definitely worth the play. And it is more apparent after finishing it to 100%.

And about the 10th anniversary project, I'm a bit stumped too... unless they have a project which is being produced concurrently with LB!EX.

Joachim

2008-03-27, 06:29

Little Busters! is definitely worth the play. And it is more apparent after finishing it to 100%.

And about the 10th anniversary project, I'm a bit stumped too... unless they have a project which is being produced concurrently with LB!EX.

i fully support boggart's saying "little busters is definitely worth the play" although many people hate it saying its not really maeda style, but i love it.

OT: any news about little busters EX boggart?

now about after story... most likely kyo ani will not do reset well reset after the normal end, thats it, but i don't know, they even called it After story and the after story context itself deals mostly with nagisa, tomoya and ushio (well not to mention the reset after the normal end) but if they do reset, i will have to say they will do the after story in 2-cour (if they do want to include every possible scenario in the reset) but thats less likely

but heh we'll see :heh:

boggart

2008-03-27, 06:33

i fully support boggart's saying "little busters is definitely worth the play" although many people hate it saying its not really maeda style, but i love it.

OT: any news about little busters EX boggart?

See -here (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=1489284&postcount=204)- for the latest news regarding LB!EX - if we are to take MOON PHASE's word for it.

Kristen

2008-03-27, 07:20

:heh:

They could call it CLANNAD: Another Story :heh:. An anime series would be able to include Misae's, Yukine's, Sunohara's, Kyou's and Kappei's scenarios, with Kyou's as the main story. This could run for a good 12 episodes.

And of course, CLANNAD: Tomoyo After with Tomoyo's FULL scenario in Clannad in first few episodes. 6 episode OVA should be good.

On the other hand, After Story has been announced!

Rejoice! I hope they can find a way to include Kyou's rain scene -- it's in the OP after all :(.

Oh, thank gosh. And since they had a magazine picture, I don't doubt it at all. :) So, any thoughts as to when this will air? I'm thinking like July, since it seems like they are planning to have an interview in May...

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-27, 08:33

now about after story... most likely kyo ani will not do reset well reset after the normal end, thats it, but i don't know, they even called it After story and the after story context itself deals mostly with nagisa, tomoya and ushio (well not to mention the reset after the normal end) but if they do reset, i will have to say they will do the after story in 2-cour (if they do want to include every possible scenario in the reset) but thats less likely

I think Kyo Ani will 'reset'. After all, they took Air and Kanon to their true ends, didn't they? And that included 'resetting' Yukito in Air.

Why would resetting require 2 cours? From what I've read, everything that occurs in the 'reset' is the same up until the birth scene. Kyo Ani could just do a 2-minute sequence of images and flashbacks like Ayu's 'winter, spring, summer, autumn, winter again, and I might finally wake up' sequence in Kanon's last episode. (At the very most, a one-episode recap as in Air, but with a different conclusion of course.)

Finally, what's the point of emphasising the 'other world' so much if not for the possibility of a 'second chance'? (I don't know if 'second chance' is an accurate description, but you get what I mean.) Those scenes certainly weren't just for Nagisa's play. It would be mightily anti-climatic for the whole thing to end with a long journey... and a song... "Dango, Dango, Dango, Dango" :heh:

velocity7

2008-03-27, 09:09

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 09:57

Little Busters! is definitely worth the play. And it is more apparent after finishing it to 100%.

And about the 10th anniversary project, I'm a bit stumped too... unless they have a project which is being produced concurrently with LB!EX.

I've been hearing it's a title that choses its critics and atleast playing the first 1.5 weeks (only have Kurugaya, Saegusa, and Kitakami on the team so far), it's very different from Kanon/Air/Clannad...rather lighthearted still. On the contrary, though, reading some reviews, I guess the refrain can potentially be much more impactful than clannad AS...

Unfortunately (or fortunately? lol) I'm leaving for vacation in about a week so I doubt I'll be able to get to the refrain until after I get back from Japan...which only leaves me 4 days until Senjou no Valkyria comes out for PS3...so perhaps I won't be able to actually get to the refrain for a few months :/

edit: I don't think the 10th ani project is LB!EX since it seems to be alluding to a new production specifically for the 10th ani..

Joachim

2008-03-27, 10:24

I think Kyo Ani will 'reset'. After all, they took Air and Kanon to their true ends, didn't they? And that included 'resetting' Yukito in Air.

Why would resetting require 2 cours? From what I've read, everything that occurs in the 'reset' is the same up until the birth scene. Kyo Ani could just do a 2-minute sequence of images and flashbacks like Ayu's 'winter, spring, summer, autumn, winter again, and I might finally wake up' sequence in Kanon's last episode. (At the very most, a one-episode recap as in Air, but with a different conclusion of course.)

Finally, what's the point of emphasising the 'other world' so much if not for the possibility of a 'second chance'? (I don't know if 'second chance' is an accurate description, but you get what I mean.) Those scenes certainly weren't just for Nagisa's play. It would be mightily anti-climatic for the whole thing to end with a long journey... and a song... "Dango, Dango, Dango, Dango" :heh:

what i mean by reset, means that they reset and do the other "arcs" that hasn't been concluded (meaning kyou, kappei, tomoyo, yukine, etc) thats why i don't think that will happen, lets think if they just show flashback... meet kyou, become intimate, etc, reset, meet yukine, go through yukine scene ini very flash back manner and fast one, reset, go to tomoyo route,etc,etc reset, man that's butchering, it would be even better if they didn't animate it if they want to do it in instant way, sure they can do yukine and kyou conccurently , but how about kyou and tomoyo? in both of their arc tomoya is their lover, so yea

they might just reset until the point of nagisa's birth scene, but not completely reset the whole story just to let tomoya gather orbs to reach true end (which i dont know how they will animate it, higurashi style?)

Joachim

2008-03-27, 10:25

How many cours will it be?

If it's 1-cour, it's enough for Nagisa's route.
If it's 2-cour, it's enough for Illusionary World and covering everyone else (Kyou, Tomoyo, and any other side characters that didn't make it in the first time).

thank you for explaining ;) thats why i think if they do want reset it will need 2-cour or 1 and a half cour

Kinny Riddle

2008-03-27, 10:57

So is series 2: "After Story" official now? Or is that just Dengeki winding us up? lol

Looks like we'll find out in a few hours, hopefully.

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 11:18

So is series 2: "After Story" official now? Or is that just Dengeki winding us up? lol

Looks like we'll find out in a few hours, hopefully.

I doubt dengeki would have a significant article on just rumors and vapour...

relentlessflame

2008-03-27, 11:28

I doubt dengeki would have a significant article on just rumors and vapour...Well, yeah, it's obviously real. Keep in mind Dengeki G's street date is actually Saturday, right after the Extra Episode airs. So I'd say it's virtually assured that the After Story will be mentioned at the end of the episode today (which is, after all, the way Clannad was announced). The magazine just got leaked a bit early.

Kristen

2008-03-27, 11:34

Well, yeah, it's obviously real. Keep in mind Dengeki G's street date is actually Saturday, right after the Extra Episode airs. So I'd say it's virtually assured that the After Story will be mentioned at the end of the episode today (which is, after all, the way Clannad was announced). The magazine just got leaked a bit early.

Unless they want to announce something beyond Haruhi and Clannad After Story... Like Little Busters. ^_^

relentlessflame

2008-03-27, 11:44

Unless they want to announce something beyond Haruhi and Clannad After Story... Like Little Busters. ^_^Well, giving the timing, very doubtful. Dengeki G's and Comptiq do these sorts of "timed unveiling" all the time because it's good for business. The TV show says "Clannad After Story Coming soon!" and then the magazine cover says "Exclusive scoop on the Clannad After Story!" the next day. $$$ If they were going to reveal something else, that would be the scoop in Dengeki G's. It's all about money. :p

Kristen

2008-03-27, 11:52

Well, giving the timing, very doubtful. Dengeki G's and Comptiq do these sorts of "timed unveiling" all the time because it's good for business. The TV show says "Clannad After Story Coming soon!" and then the magazine cover says "Exclusive scoop on the Clannad After Story!" the next day. $$$ If they were going to reveal something else, that would be the scoop in Dengeki G's. It's all about money. :p

Hm... I guess so. :p I just wanted a Little Busters announced so I know I have something to look forward to next fall.

Well, we'll know for sure in half an hour (Or a little longer...)

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-27, 12:34

what i mean by reset, means that they reset and do the other "arcs" that hasn't been concluded (meaning kyou, kappei, tomoyo, yukine, etc) thats why i don't think that will happen, lets think if they just show flashback... meet kyou, become intimate, etc, reset, meet yukine, go through yukine scene ini very flash back manner and fast one, reset, go to tomoyo route,etc,etc reset, man that's butchering, it would be even better if they didn't animate it if they want to do it in instant way, sure they can do yukine and kyou conccurently , but how about kyou and tomoyo? in both of their arc tomoya is their lover, so yea

they might just reset until the point of nagisa's birth scene, but not completely reset the whole story just to let tomoya gather orbs to reach true end (which i dont know how they will animate it, higurashi style?)

My hypothesis (after all, this is the Speculation page :heh:) is that Kyo Ani might take some liberties and have Tomoya gather the orbs without having to actually become intimate with each and every one of the girls.

As in... he gains orbs from the friendship, support and (platonic) love of his friends for both him and Nagisa. Of course, these feelings have already been established in season 1 so season 2 doesn't have to show Tomoya going back and gaining them.

Kyo Ani's Kanon adaptation explained that everyone's miraculous recovery stemmed from the wish of one unconscious girl. In Clannad, they might reverse that and say that one girl's miracle stemmed from the feelings (= light orbs) of everyone who had ever been close to her and Tomoya.

I agree with you that there it would be impossible (even ridiculous) to go back and show how Tomoya gets into relationships with everyone. But neither can I see everything ending with utter despair and tragedy. The mood/tone of Kyo Ani's adaptation is quite different from that of the movie. In the movie, even the happiest moments are tinged with despair. In the TV series, even the darkest scenes are tinged with hope.

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 12:43

In Clannad, they might reverse that and say that one girl's miracle stemmed from the feelings (= light orbs) of everyone who had ever been close to her and Tomoya.

man it's been a while since i've played Clannad in general (except for the Kyou route in the Full Voice version). If I recall properly, the miracle you speak of stemmed from the citizens of the town. The orbs allowed for Tomoya to go into an "infinite?" loop. Nagisa is intimately tied to the town, not just characters of Clannad that you see. I don't think this would be changed in AS as Nagisa's initial recovery from childhood stems from the fact that Akio basically (not meant to sound negative) tied Nagisa to the city. As the city changes from its original form, Nagisa's health changes.

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-27, 12:51

man it's been a while since i've played Clannad in general (except for the Kyou route in the Full Voice version). If I recall properly, the miracle you speak of stemmed from the citizens of the town. The orbs allowed for Tomoya to go into an "infinite?" loop. Nagisa is intimately tied to the town, not just characters of Clannad that you see. I don't think this would be changed in AS as Nagisa's initial recovery from childhood stems from the fact that Akio basically (not meant to sound negative) tied Nagisa to the city. As the city changes from its original form, Nagisa's health changes.

Thanks for clearing that up :)

We'll leave it at that then. Kyo Ani will somehow sort it out, probably simplifying things by a factor of one thousand and without requiring Tomoya to gather light orbs from relationships with other girls.

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 13:19

We'll leave it at that then. Kyo Ani will somehow sort it out, probably simplifying things by a factor of one thousand and without requiring Tomoya to gather light orbs from relationships with other girls.

The light orbs don't have to be from romantic relationships from other people. This is where what was said in the Yukine epilogue is pretty important. Tomoya asks Yukine about the light orb he saw. In the Clannad universe, they were rather common in the past, but as time passed on and the world became modernized (i think?), less and less were seen. They appear when someone helps another person experience pure, unadulterated joy. This explains why the Komura arc had a light orb, as Kouko mentioned throughout the story that Koumura's happiness in life came from helping those that had gone off track in life (in this case, Sunohara and Tomoya becoming delinquents to an extent).

I think Sanae was somewhat similar in how her orb was obtained in that Tomoya helped tie her memory of ...crap i forgot his name... and her cat...i THINK...someone correct me if I'm wrong.

So if the want is there to include the orbs, the story's already setup without deviating from canon, to include it into AS w/o going into romance mode...though the adaptation would require some original story plots and what not.

Kristen

2008-03-27, 13:40

So from the video, I see...

"A world, surface in white"
Nagisa's graduation
Tomoya and Nagisa outside of the jail
Ushio at Sanae's house
More illusionary world
Ushio's death scene

So, still no word as to whether it'll be the good end or the bad end yet, but it seems like they'll have more illusionary world scenes in After Story than the game did.

Klashikari

2008-03-27, 13:42

Mirrinus

2008-03-27, 13:51

The arc system in Higurashi was totally disorienting the first time, but got better when they did it over and over again. Not sure if Clannad doing it just once will produce the same effect of familiarity that Higurashi eventually accomplished...

Kristen

2008-03-27, 14:01

Most likely, they WILL do the time warp and such.
Bad end is pretty much confirmed, but they also confirmed the true end with the OP.

So, it is definite that they will try to stick what the Game conveyed with the multiple routes.
The problem now is how they will show it without going too mindblowing, such like the arcs system in higurashi.

Which part of the OP confirms the true end?

And I think I'm going to call that the good end. To me, it feels like the true end was the bad end. It felt a little more natural as an ending. But, I'll still refer to them as "Good" and "Bad". :p

One this was that there was no Kyou, Tomoyo, Misae, Yukine, etc. in the PV. AKA, I'm expecting a 1 cour season.

Proto

2008-03-27, 14:04

Which part of the OP confirms the true end?

Fuuko finding Ushio deep in the forest I'm guessing.

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 14:07

One this was that there was no Kyou, Tomoyo, Misae, Yukine, etc. in the PV. AKA, I'm expecting a 1 cour season.

Even without those folk, AS can actually be really really long :/...I really do hope they include Kyou in the AS as was done in the game, even if it's only a short appearance.

Yukinokesshou

2008-03-27, 14:07

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-27, 14:08

One this was that there was no Kyou, Tomoyo, Misae, Yukine, etc. in the PV. AKA, I'm expecting a 1 cour season.

Don't forget the Nagisa arc timeskip. It's perfectly possible to fit the Misae, Yukine, Komura, and Kappei arcs into the rest of Tomoya's third year, as someone else already mentioned.

And this would do a good job of filling up that time, as I HATE timeskips. To me, that's bad writing.

Although I doubt we'll get to see any more of Kyou and Tomoyo...

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 14:55

Although I doubt we'll get to see any more of Kyou and Tomoyo...

Kyou is actually in AfterStory in the game lol.

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-27, 14:57

Kyou is actually in AfterStory in the game lol.

I know that. I meant of their arcs.

Also, seeing the 64-hit combo would be awesome.

panzerfan

2008-03-27, 15:00

Well, with this many orbs of light, I can imagine that perhaps S1 Clannad is in effect already time-skipped and this is actually a re-do run that we're seeing, as AS leads itself all the way back to the point of Ushio's death in the imaginary world.

The story comes in full circle as it finally ends with branching from Tomoya able to gather enough lights and lead to the good end... hmm...

Nightengale

2008-03-27, 19:32

Feh, I'll be fine with however Kyoto Animation intends to animate After Story, so long as they can manage some believable synergy with the fact that the anime's drama club and friendship group is far tighter and more demonstrated than the game's Nagisa route.

I'm not expecting much, especially Tomoyo who's most likely bound for tertiary education away from the town except for well... graduation scene, but the rest should be given a small degree of anime liberty in playing slight roles in the emotional context of AS. (( take Kotomi for example, it's very unfathomable that she'd not be there/try to help Tomoya in his worst.... since it's happened to her before ))

As for the True End thing, I think they'll pull a supernatural (( read KEY )) version of "The Best Bet" movie.

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 19:54

I'm not expecting much, especially Tomoyo who's most likely bound for tertiary education away from the town except for well... graduation scene, but the rest should be given a small degree of anime liberty in playing slight roles in the emotional context of AS. (( take Kotomi for example, it's very unfathomable that she'd not be there/try to help Tomoya in his worst.... since it's happened to her before ))

In-game
I THOUGHT Kotomi went abroad after finishing HS in the game
Ryou is going to nursing school, locally, maybe, but I think the hospital she works at in the end is out of town
Kyou is going to further education to become a preschool teacher (and in AS is actually in the same town as a preschool teacher lol)
Sunohara goes back home to work at his home town

I think it's the clear cut difference between HS and AS as to why the quote "Clannad is life" (クラナドは人生) exists, even though the trend was started with AIR. While each social situation/group is different, there's really no denying that as we go through various stages in our life, our social priorities change. Whether we want to or not, we start losing touch with our "friends", we stop, for the most part, dicking around, etc and start to focus on family and career and start facing the harsher realities of life. And while it might be overemphasized a bit, i think this is where the value of family, in particular Sanae and Akio, really start to shine, even moreso than Akio's monologue in ep22. By keeping the other characters recurring frequently, I feel it would greatly cheapen the story that Clannad has the potential to convey. As much as I personally like Kyou's character a good deal in this series, I think her short appearance at the end of AS route 1 being short was perfect...it brings a tremendous sense of nostalgia and reassurance knowing that 7(?) years after last meeting, that true friends truly do stay as true friends...to sound a little cliche, but once again, the overall story pertains more to family, not friends...

While I've only seen the tip of the iceberg so far, I think Little Busters! as a story may be more along the lines of something you may enjoy more, if it ever gets animated :)

Nightengale

2008-03-27, 20:12

In-game
I THOUGHT Kotomi went abroad after finishing HS in the game
Ryou is going to nursing school, locally, maybe, but I think the hospital she works at in the end is out of town
Kyou is going to further education to become a preschool teacher (and in AS is actually in the same town as a preschool teacher lol)
Sunohara goes back home to work at his home town

I think it's the clear cut difference between HS and AS as to why the quote "Clannad is life" (クラナドは人生) exists, even though the trend was started with AIR. While each social situation/group is different, there's really no denying that as we go through various stages in our life, our social priorities change. Whether we want to or not, we start losing touch with our "friends", we stop, for the most part, dicking around, etc and start to focus on family and career and start facing the harsher realities of life. And while it might be overemphasized a bit, i think this is where the value of family, in particular Sanae and Akio, really start to shine, even moreso than Akio's monologue in ep22. By keeping the other characters recurring frequently, I feel it would greatly cheapen the story that Clannad has the potential to convey. As much as I personally like Kyou's character a good deal in this series, I think her short appearance at the end of AS route 1 being short was perfect...it brings a tremendous sense of nostalgia and reassurance knowing that 7(?) years after last meeting, that true friends truly do stay as true friends...to sound a little cliche, but once again, the overall story pertains more to family, not friends...

While I've only seen the tip of the iceberg so far, I think Little Busters! as a story may be more along the lines of something you may enjoy more, if it ever gets animated :)

Exactly, life moves on. It's pretty obvious from how AS was presented since I went through the same phase in life, but at the same point, the relations to how it was done in the game was far more normal than the anime. Technically, we can put into point that Tomoya in the Kotomi route was more subtle than the anime's, just as the Fuuko route mild development for him was taken into account. Which is why I say Tomoyo should have absolutely no role in AS.

I don't expect them to have MAJOR roles whatsoever, (( in fact, if any, Ryou's one of the few viable... since well... nursing role. -_- )), just that taking the anime into account, I don't think doing a direct-straight-to-how-it-was adaption of AS is a good idea.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of ~life goes on~ plot device, like in Hikaru no Go and MAJOR where the bond forged in days of youth doesn't hold and carry the same weight as one grows older, but I do think that Clannad should be a little more subtle about it.

Klashikari

2008-03-27, 20:22

I think it is quite possible to keep Tomoyo as a support if she is present a lot with Nagisa in the first phase of AS.
So, hanging around with Nagisa will certainly put herself in a close relative situation.

As far as KyoAni worked until now, they certainly tried to keep a unity among the characters, and considering the main theme of clannad, we might get the "family" less spread than in the game.
There isn't much problem for Tomoyo and Kyou. Now for Ryou and Kotomi, it will be hard (especially Kotomi, considering that she only had one "fate" or future in clannad, so anything IN character might be tricky, like you said.)

mandarb916

2008-03-27, 23:10

considering the CV for Kotomi (notomami), I think from a marketting standpoint, they'll try to bring her back since she's...rather popular lol, even if it's not canon

Ice Block

2008-03-28, 00:13

Wow, this thread moved fast!

If they do a 2-cour series, everyone's scenarios sans Kyou's can be included (yes, Tomoyo's can still be salvaged since it was only cut short, as opposed to Kyou's which was abandoned :(). I assume it will continue with the school term, as I have roughly outlined here (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=1476748&postcount=370) (sans Kyou's scenario).

So, after my assumed school life part of season 2:

Kotomi, I assume, would go to some far off university or study abroad after graduating. She'll be absent for the most part of season 2. They could bring her back during Nagisa's graduation (doubt it), and... i dunno, their wedding ceremony (anime-original)? She could also return during Ushio's arc.

Ryou will be in nursing school and, considering Kappei's scenario, will be attending to him (Kappei) during his hospitalization, so she'll be absent too. We can only see her when Tomoya visits Kappei during AS proper. She can also be present for Nagisa's graduation.

Fuko... her time will come soon, so please, no more random appearances :heh:.

However, If they do make a 1-cour season, they'll be inserting a (roughly) 8/9 month timeskip during Nagisa's illness, and start Ep02 (or the latter half of Ep01) with the new school year. Whether that's a good or bad thing is for you to decide :heh:.

Joachim

2008-03-28, 00:49

Ironically, Ushio's death scene convinces me that they will do the good end. For some reason, I cannot imagine Kyo Ani ending the series on a completely tragic note, without any shred of hope for Okazaki. They'd either end it like the movie (bittersweet), or have Ushio die and do the time warp. Hence, since Ushio dies, it follows that the time warp will occur.

Just some absurd reasoning on my part :p

i believe they will do the true end,, after they do the bad end, the whole ushio die and time warp

i don't really buy it if they leave it to "normal" end, all thats left is despair and regret for okazaki tomoya, and that is angst fest :heh:

but the probability they gonna leave it at normal end rather than true end is 0:100 at best :D

but there will be bad end... uuugh :(

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-28, 18:26

Fuuko finding Ushio deep in the forest I'm guessing.

Did they really say that the girl was Ushio? I never thought of it that way when I played it. It didn't make sense to me if she came to the real world and Ushio is born too...

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-28, 19:34

Did they really say that the girl was Ushio? I never thought of it that way when I played it. It didn't make sense to me if she came to the real world and Ushio is born too...

Isn't that Fuuko her ghost form, though? Not the "real" one?

If so, it'd make sense that they'd meet, right?

Klashikari

2008-03-28, 19:51

Did they really say that the girl was Ushio? I never thought of it that way when I played it. It didn't make sense to me if she came to the real world and Ushio is born too...
That is because Ushio and IW Ushio are absolutely not the same.
IW Ushio is born from after the very first sorrowful result, where Both she and tomoya die.

Afterwards, in the IW, both went on a journey, and we got the endless "loop" so Tomoya can get the lights and stay "stuck" in a world which didn't end yet, despite his true "ego" is supporting ushio in IW.

Basically, when Tomoya finally break that cursed situation, so saving Nagisa, there is somewhat a time paradox. All the things did happen (all the bad end, alternative routes with the girls etc), so it is all done. Hence why I feel logical that IW Ushio does exist, despite little ushio is born.

It is up to the players to determine why she appeared like that, but it is probable the miracle itself that saved Nagisa, materialized Ushio after such long journey. For what purpose... maa hard to tell.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-28, 19:52

I'm still some what confused >.< I always thought that it was a separate person. That Tomoya was somehow attracted to thsi world and this girl knew what was to happen. I knew it somehow to be related to Tomoya. But at the end the two worlds meet and the girl came into this world, which is why the lights of happiness rain down, they are from that world. I don't get how it could be Ushio
I think i understand now...

Klashikari

2008-03-28, 19:55

That's what I explained. why wouldn't it make sense that the girl in the forest isn't Ushio?
There isn't any contradiction as both Ushio aren't of the same timeline/dimension.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-28, 20:20

That's what I explained. why wouldn't it make sense that the girl in the forest isn't Ushio?
There isn't any contradiction as both Ushio aren't of the same timeline/dimension.

Sorry I fixed my post too many times before I posted it, I understand it now ^-^ Thx so much

GameMaster0000

2008-03-28, 20:35

We don't know how many episode of AS that will be aired.

I guess...
- 13 Ep - They will surly focus only in AS.
- 24-26 Ep - They may include other sub character Act.

I hope they have more longer CM soon. We can guess that how many Episode will contain in AS.

Kristen

2008-03-28, 20:57

I still have some sort of gut feeling that AS is definately NOT going to be 13 episodes. I just have "12" echoing in my head. The difficulty, though, is that if they are adding lights per DVD, they may want to relate it to the last one, making it "10 lights now, he can make a miracle!" But I think Kyoani wants something even and distributable into S1's proportions.

mandarb916

2008-03-28, 22:21

Isn't that Fuuko her ghost form, though? Not the "real" one?

If so, it'd make sense that they'd meet, right?

That Fuuko is the real one which is implied from the clothing she's wearing (red blazer/jacket thing) which is what she wore after starting rehab in AS.

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-28, 22:26

That Fuuko is the real one which is implied from the clothing she's wearing (red blazer/jacket thing) which is what she wore after starting rehab in AS.

Ah.

Man, I need to play more of this...

Marina2

2008-03-28, 23:04

Ahh, when you said about Fuko.

(These are pictures that I have posted in Fuko Character discussion)
When I was watching CLANNAD anime OP for the first time I didn't care anything about it because I'm not finish after story route yet.

But after I finish it... I'm very O_o

http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/8020/clannad94zp4.th.jpg (http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?image=clannad94zp4.jpg)

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/7937/clannad95wc6.th.jpg (http://img295.imageshack.us/my.php?image=clannad95wc6.jpg)

I'm very surprise that those scene in OP come from the last scene in the epilogue of the After story. I wondered who was a girl that they said about but I found the answer sleeping next to the tree when I got back to the menu. :heh:

EDIT : Think for the second time,I don't have to put spoiler tag here.

Kristen

2008-03-29, 11:37

Jimmy C

2008-03-29, 15:15

Wasn't there a qoute from the director or something? Originally they wanted to focus exclusively on Nagisa for AS, but then they decided they could put the other material in as well.

Hao

2008-03-30, 00:42

If it's going to be 13 episodes, I'm sure they can sqeeze in some character routes from the AS, like Sanae, and Akio's for the first couple episodes for warm-up I guess before the real thing starts. I'll be happy as long as they do Akio's part of the story haha. Is there anything he isn't good at besides the drums? He's the type of person we need driving planes, and buses now days.

Quite a bit of the beginning of AS was following Tomoya doing his daily job anyways. They can probably cut back from that and move ahead.

Leo_Otaku

2008-03-31, 00:27

I just want the better stories animated they like totally made the other half of the game. They could have cut down on Fuko to fit anyone.

Ice Block

2008-03-31, 01:20

Wasn't there a qoute from the director or something? Originally they wanted to focus exclusively on Nagisa for AS, but then they decided they could put the other material in as well.
Hmm...
Added a line (presumably from the interview article). “At first, we only decided to take Nagisa’s route, however after many discussions this was decided instead.”
Was this about the upcoming second season? Or were they talking about season 1?

I just want the better stories animated they like totally made the other half of the game. They could have cut down on Fuko to fit anyone.
Lol poor Kappei... He wasn't even mentioned, but that girl in Tomoyo After (Takafumi's girlfriend I think) got a cameo.

Aetheri

2008-03-31, 07:13

So, after some thought about the second season...

Honestly, I don't see them doing any of the other character's scenarios. My reasoning is the name. They officially announced it as "Clannad ~After Story~", and not "Clannad ~Season 2~" or "Part 2" or "Finale" or anything else. The name ~After Story~ to mean means exactly that. They won't try to throw in anything else, in my opinion.

They need to at least show Misae's scenario (preferably both hers and Yukine's, but Yukine's is less critical since it gets mentioned in the illusionary world), or all the first-time viewers are going to get ticked when the miracle comes out of nowhere. I actually would've liked it better if they managed to put a reference to the light orbs in the first season. I know a lot of people who think that there isn't much supernatural stuff in Clannad, and I wonder how they're going to take all this.

On another note, does anyone else think that they could leave out 小さなてのひら and just have Dango Daikazoku for the ending theme for the last episode? I think it could actually work quite well if they wanted to do that (although they probably won't).

MeoTwister5

2008-03-31, 07:17

They need to at least show Misae's scenario (preferably both hers and Yukine's, but Yukine's is less critical since it gets mentioned in the illusionary world), or all the first-time viewers are going to get ticked when the miracle comes out of nowhere. I actually would've liked it better if they managed to put a reference to the light orbs in the first season. I know a lot of people who think that there isn't much supernatural stuff in Clannad, and I wonder how they're going to take all this.

On another note, does anyone else think that they could leave out 小さなてのひら and just have Dango Daikazoku for the ending theme for the last episode? I think it could actually work quite well if they wanted to do that (although they probably won't).

Well if they are ever going to do Yukine and Misae's scenario, they'll have to do it early in the series, before the end of the school year for obvious reasons.

Kaisos Erranon

2008-03-31, 13:58

I'd also like to see Kappei, if only because of how intensely hilarious he is.

karinvampire

2008-03-31, 19:57

so AS has a happy ending right because the girl in the other world is there to save her parents right.

mandarb916

2008-03-31, 19:58

I'd also like to see Kappei, if only because of how intensely hilarious he is.

I hate Kappei...worst character arc in Clannad, bar none, imho

Ice Block

2008-03-31, 23:04

I hate Kappei...worst character arc in Clannad, bar none, imho
How about Koumura's scenario?

mandarb916

2008-04-01, 00:19

How about Koumura's scenario?

I thought the Koumura scenario was actually pretty well done. I'm not much of a fan of suicidal types who don't realize how much support they have around them.

Nightengale

2008-04-01, 08:19

I'm fairly confident they'll throw in a cameo or 2 for Kappei, say... when Nagisa goes to the hospital for check-up. Ryou in a nurse uniform would be a little bit of a stretch for when Nagisa's still alive, but I suppose a mere visit to her boyfriend or nurse internship isn't all that far-fetched.

Though preferably, Kappei's route can be covered in the beginning of anime's After Story or something. It's not like Tomoya's already graduated, and for what's its worth, I think tuned a little, it could be a good catalyst arc for Tomoya to have more reflection on his future, his relationship with Nagisa, etc. :3

Kristen

2008-04-01, 08:25

How about Koumura's scenario?

Heh. I didn't like Kappei's scenario either. I found him to be very boring and frustrating to get through. It was the only arc that I was asking "Can this end already?" Well, besides Misae, which was more because I thought her scenario was over and it had more than 1/2 of it to go. But, Kappei's was just kind of long and drawn out...

About Koumura... Better to have no arc than a bad one. :p

dangodaikazoku

2008-04-01, 11:42

I actually would've liked it better if they managed to put a reference to the light orbs in the first season.

In one of the illusionary world scenes, the girl asks the robot what is strange about their world. His answer is the light orbs. A more obscure reference is when Nagisa and Tomoya are talking to Kouko and a light orb can be seen floating up into the air.

I know a lot of people who think that there isn't much supernatural stuff in Clannad.

They must have been sleeping through the series.
1. Fuko.
2. Kotomi's parents supposedly found evidence of a hidden world.
3. Tomoya mentions that the illusionary world story is familiar to him.
4. All the illusionary world scenes. Nagisa's performance is hardly a climax.

Clannad's full of references to the supernatural. Nagisa doesn't have to spout wings or reincarnate an ancient goddess for us to realize that.

Ryou in a nurse uniform would be a little bit of a stretch for when Nagisa's still alive, but I suppose a mere visit to her boyfriend or nurse internship isn't all that far-fetched.

I don't see why not. In my country, student nurses start work quite soon, like when they are 19 or so.

Proto

2008-04-01, 11:46

Personally I liked Kappei scenario, even if I found his character a little irritating at times. Ryou needed a good end after all, so it served its purpose :p

Leo_Otaku

2008-04-02, 00:51

I hate Kappei...worst character arc in Clannad, bar none, imho

I think Ryou's and Kyou's were the worst. Ryou's regular was the worst >.> There was like really nothing there., I was expecting a lot more from Kyou's story. .

Kappei had a good story, mainly because I know of people who would rather die than not do what they love. As for Misae and Komura I liked them both too. Misae's I liked way better than Kotomi's for the majority (the suitcase part was the only good part). I just wish they would have spent more time on Misae's story, working it up and such.

As for 24 being a Tomoyo route, do you think this is a set up for Tomoyo After? Maybe a plan for after...the after story?

Kaisos Erranon

2008-04-02, 12:36

I think Ryou's and Kyou's were the worst. Ryou's regular was the worst >.> There was like really nothing there., I was expecting a lot more from Kyou's story. .

Kappei had a good story, mainly because I know of people who would rather die than not do what they love. As for Misae and Komura I liked them both too. Misae's I liked way better than Kotomi's for the majority (the suitcase part was the only good part). I just wish they would have spent more time on Misae's story, working it up and such.

As for 24 being a Tomoyo route, do you think this is a set up for Tomoyo After? Maybe a plan for after...the after story?

I don't even see why people want Tomoyo After, considering it's even more depressing than the first playthrough of After Story.

Kristen

2008-04-02, 14:41

I don't even see why people want Tomoyo After, considering it's even more depressing than the first playthrough of After Story.

Based off of the manga version, it really wasn't as depressing at all, at least to me. :p

But depressing is good!

Proto

2008-04-02, 14:48

Well the manga was the ultra compressed, summarized and stripped version. Getting rid of all the forebodding is not considered the best method for building up an emotional atmosphere :p

Klashikari

2008-04-02, 15:10

Yukinokesshou

2008-04-02, 15:42

I think Ryou's and Kyou's were the worst. Ryou's regular was the worst >.> There was like really nothing there., I was expecting a lot more from Kyou's story. .

Kappei had a good story, mainly because I know of people who would rather die than not do what they love. As for Misae and Komura I liked them both too. Misae's I liked way better than Kotomi's for the majority (the suitcase part was the only good part). I just wish they would have spent more time on Misae's story, working it up and such.

As for 24 being a Tomoyo route, do you think this is a set up for Tomoyo After? Maybe a plan for after...the after story?

I agree: the Fujibayashi twins' story was very shallow, a regular angsty teenage romance.

Kotomi's suitcase felt forced and unnatural to me. There's something called an address. Famous scientists ought to be intelligent enough to know about it. "Take this to our daughter", pfft, honestly :rolleyes:

Leo_Otaku

2008-04-02, 19:52

I don't even see why people want Tomoyo After, considering it's even more depressing than the first playthrough of After Story.

I love all of Key's works it is what makes them KEY ^-^ There is also PS2 ending...

mandarb916

2008-04-03, 10:01

I love all of Key's works it is what makes them KEY ^-^ There is also PS2 ending...

If Kyoto were to do the PS2 ending in a hypothetical TA series, I would completely lose all respect for them. The PC ending is far far far more beautiful than the PS2 ending. It feels like the PS2 version was created just to placate those that were upset that the PC version had a "bad end" so to speak.

Kinny Riddle

2008-04-03, 14:39

Kotomi's suitcase felt forced and unnatural to me. There's something called an address. Famous scientists ought to be intelligent enough to know about it. "Take this to our daughter", pfft, honestly :rolleyes:

There's a thing called "suspension of disbelief". OK, the thing with the suitcase traversing oceans and deserts was pushing it, I'll give you that, but you try writing your address calmly and properly while your plane is in rapid descend. :cool:

Here's my silly theory on how this can fit, feel free to tear it apart. :eyespin:

I think they wrote the letter before the crash happened, but they intend to send it together with the teddy via DHL or UPS afterwards, so they didn't write any address on the envelope. During the crash, realizing they would never see their daughter again, they hastily added the "Take this to our daughter" message on the envelope and stuffed it together with the bear in the suitcase.

Yukinokesshou

2008-04-03, 17:01

...you try writing your address calmly and properly while your plane is in rapid descend. :cool:

Here's my silly theory on how this can fit, feel free to tear it apart. :eyespin:

Hahaha :heh: You asked for it. Consider the following sentences...

(1) If you find this suitcase, please take it to our daughter.

(2) 3-24-5 Baka-cho, Aho-ku, Kumamoto, Kumamoto Pref, Japan
(Apocryphal Japanese address.)

... They are almost the same length, and writing your own address usually requires a lot less thinking than forming a grammatically correct sentence in a foreign language :D

But yes, I get your point about suspension of disbelief. I'm not asking you to take me seriously; I just like poking fun at everything.

Kristen

2008-04-03, 22:14

And to be quite honest, the way how it is conveying the events and such (execution and drawn style) was extremely mediocre.
Seriously, most jokes were kinda lame, and the art was nearly an eyesore.

well, kinda my opinion, but yeah it is so compressed that it almost look how TOEI compressed AS in mere 15 minutes.

Ah, so it didn't have the atmosphere. I get it. :)

One thing I liked about the Toei ending was the bittersweetness of it all. Based off of the preview, it's safe to assume that it won't be a bittersweet ending. Either sad of happiness after sadness.

Deathscyther

2008-04-04, 11:29

Well, I want them to animate the sad ending. It was really powerful in the game and I want to see how kyoani will do it. Of course I want to see the true end after that as well:p

dangodaikazoku

2008-04-04, 14:28

Well, I want them to animate the sad ending. It was really powerful in the game and I want to see how kyoani will do it. Of course I want to see the true end after that as well:p

Of course they will (to the former) - last image in preview.

Deathscyther

2008-04-04, 15:43

Of course they will (to the former) - last image in preview.

Yeah, I know:)

Just wanted to say that I'm happy with that. It's one of the best parts in the game imo to see how Tomoya has to deal with all the hardships. It may be sad, but it's really good.

dangodaikazoku

2008-04-04, 16:22

Yeah, I know:)

Just wanted to say that I'm happy with that. It's one of the best parts in the game imo to see how Tomoya has to deal with all the hardships. It may be sad, but it's really good.

Yep. The scene where Tomoya apologized to Ushio and reminesced about Nagisa was probably the single most tear-jerking part of the whole Clannad story for me. I must have used up a whole pack of tissues. Awful, just awful, but so good.

"Sanae-san says it is only okay to cry... in the bathroom... or on Papa's chest."

"I loved her... truly loved her. I loved no one but Nagisa... I loved that humble side of Nagisa, that occasionally spirited smile of Nagisa, that cute smile of Nagisa... 'Forever by your side, always by your side'... Why... are you not next to me now?"

uuuuuuuuuuuuuuu T_T

Jun Maeda, creator of Clannad, really knows how to manipulate our emotions >_< Wikipedia says he has a degree in psychology. I am not surprised.

Joachim

2008-04-05, 01:22

Hahaha :heh: You asked for it. Consider the following sentences...

(1) If you find this suitcase, please take it to our daughter.

(2) 3-24-5 Baka-cho, Aho-ku, Kumamoto, Kumamoto Pref, Japan
(Apocryphal Japanese address.)

... They are almost the same length, and writing your own address usually requires a lot less thinking than forming a grammatically correct sentence in a foreign language :D

But yes, I get your point about suspension of disbelief. I'm not asking you to take me seriously; I just like poking fun at everything.

i think if they just wrote the address, people will not feel the urgency of the item, when the found it they will think its just another ordinary lost package

but when people saw the note saying "IF you FIND this SUITCASE, please take it to our DAUGHTER" you will feel the sense of urgency and the need ;)

i just think they need to at "please take it to our daughter in JAPAN" to be more precise :heh:

lordjuggernaut

2008-04-05, 02:27

i think if they just wrote the address, people will not feel the urgency of the item, when the found it they will think its just another ordinary lost package

but when people saw the note saying "IF you FIND this SUITCASE, please take it to our DAUGHTER" you will feel the sense of urgency and the need ;)

i just think they need to at "please take it to our daughter in JAPAN" to be more precise :heh:

..... the suitcase prolly would have his home and office address monogrammed on the inside of the suitcase, as it had initials on the outside.... ( i have one of those custom-made ones i bought at a garage sale.... J.h. Hinds, 453, Burma road, Singapore- ( the rest was water damaged.... but contained tonnes of '70s period blank stationary water maked/smudged........ i am not complaining tho)

Joachim

2008-04-05, 08:14

..... the suitcase prolly would have his home and office address monogrammed on the inside of the suitcase, as it had initials on the outside.... ( i have one of those custom-made ones i bought at a garage sale.... J.h. Hinds, 453, Burma road, Singapore- ( the rest was water damaged.... but contained tonnes of '70s period blank stationary water maked/smudged........ i am not complaining tho)

ah yea her parents should have that.. but maybe they just brought along a suitcase that didn't have initials and address on it

but if you reply to my post about the address and why i say it is better to wrote the initial line, well i'm not arguing about the suitcase, but the letter, why the suitcase doesn't have the initial and address in it.. god knows why :heh:

dgreater1

2008-04-05, 10:05

Ok, I'll explain the suitcase part to all of you. This is just my THEORY so don't take it as a fact...

"If you find this suitcase, please take it to our daughter.

K&M Ich----"

This is the exact message in the envelope in game. Now I'll ask you, why was it that it got cut of halfway on their signature? What do you write first when you send a message?

This might be what they're planning to write, but they weren't able to finish the message. As to what reason they stuffed that without finishing the message, you'll have to look for the answer yourself.

"If you find this suitcase, please take it to our daughter.

K&M Ich(inose)
(Address: Figure it out yourselves)

(Thank you very much)."

The question is a bit similar to, "Why would you let your car travel 5 more kilometers to load gasoline when there's already a gasoline station just ahead." The reason? Ask the driver. The driver is already dead though, he died in a car crash when he was about to reach next gas station. :heh:

mandarb916

2008-04-07, 08:56

considering ep24 will specifically be about Tomoyo in an alternate universe (atleast the news entry translates into an alternate universe), it looks like KyoAni might be setting up for both After Story and eventually Tomoyo After...

what do you guys think?

Deathscyther

2008-04-08, 07:14

mandarb916

2008-04-08, 07:50

Tomoyo after won't be animated in season 2. I don't know where that all came from. Just because Tomoyo gets her own episode, they have to animate tomoyo after too? I think that the episode will be some kind of replacement for tomoyo after, to make the tomoyo fans content.

The whole story in the anime focuses on Tomoya and Nagisa. Do you really think that they'll let Nagisa die, only to let Tomoya end up with Tomoyo? Wouldn't the original game ending would be much better? They would destroy the entire meaning of the story if they'll do tomoyo after now...

They might animate tomoyo after, but only in a movie or ova.

Well, it's clearly stated on the website that ep24 will be set in an alternate reality (so to speak) so depending on how it plays out, it could easily set the stage for animating TA in the future after KyotoAni finishes Clannad_AS and lets some time pass...whether it be OVA or another TV anime series (or if it's a movie, please don't let Toei produce it).

The Clannad epilogue, imho, was good, but it doesn't really compare to the PC version of TA. Much heavier than Clannad epilogue by far. The sheer emotional impact of learning what Tomoyo goes through, more or less by herself, is much much more moving than what Sanae/Akio go through. While it's different in some regards, TA still has undertones about family.

If KyotoAni does do some form of a bastardized TA in ep24...well...i think it'd be better off if they just left it at ep23 as the final ep.

Deathscyther

2008-04-08, 10:14

Well yeah, the could make a special anime/ova/movie for tomoyo after, especially after episode 24. I didn't like the game very much myself, but I know that a lot of people did love the game. So I'm sure that people would watch it.

But yeah, season 2 will be After story, so no Tomoyo after there. I wonder if we're going to see much of Tomoyo at all in season 2.

Kaisos Erranon

2008-04-08, 11:34

Well, it's clearly stated on the website that ep24 will be set in an alternate reality (so to speak) so depending on how it plays out, it could easily set the stage for animating TA in the future after KyotoAni finishes Clannad_AS and lets some time pass...whether it be OVA or another TV anime series (or if it's a movie, please don't let Toei produce it).

The Clannad epilogue, imho, was good, but it doesn't really compare to the PC version of TA. Much heavier than Clannad epilogue by far. The sheer emotional impact of learning what Tomoyo goes through, more or less by herself, is much much more moving than what Sanae/Akio go through. While it's different in some regards, TA still has undertones about family.

If KyotoAni does do some form of a bastardized TA in ep24...well...i think it'd be better off if they just left it at ep23 as the final ep.

I can't understand why people enjoy something as emotionally destroying as Tomoyo After... from what I've read, it sounds nearly as bad as SaiKano...

I don't mind depressing stories as long as they end happily, like Clannad does...

Well yeah, the could make a special anime/ova/movie for tomoyo after, especially after episode 24. I didn't like the game very much myself, but I know that a lot of people did love the game. So I'm sure that people would watch it.

But yeah, season 2 will be After story, so no Tomoyo after there. I wonder if we're going to see much of Tomoyo at all in season 2.

Don't count on that. If they go for 24 episodes they could fit the side character arcs in there, and Tomoyo could still make a few appearances.

mandarb916

2008-04-08, 17:08

Kaisos Erranon

2008-04-08, 17:09

I wouldn't say it's emotionally destroying...ok well maybe it is a little bit...but the story itself once it enters the epilogue is very beautiful for lack of a better term...reading of a person making the best of living through a human tragedy and seeing her ultimately grow and surpass that, while still keeping the important things in her life, close to her heart.

But did they really need to use Clannad characters? The story, again from what I've read, doesn't appear to rely on much of Clannad's plot.

They could have just used a different young couple, right?

Proto

2008-04-08, 17:55

It's more emotionally involving to feel for characters you have been previously acquainted with (not to mention that they can skip the build up. That means more screen time for the actual tragedy). Additionally they can rake more money from a game with characters the target market is specially interested in. It's a win-win situation :p

Kaisos Erranon

2008-04-08, 17:58

It's more emotionally involving to feel for characters you have been previously acquainted with (not to mention that they can skip the build up). Additionally they can rake more money from a game with characters the target market is specially interested in. It's a win-win situation :p

That makes sense, I guess.

But I also can't help but feel that, regardless of what Jun Maeda says, Key just did this to shut up the Tomoyo fanboys who wanted a 'better' ending.

mandarb916

2008-04-08, 18:21

The PS2 ending, imho, was to shut up the fanbois that wanted a "better" ending lol.

They obviously could have used another couple, but there was prior turmoil mentioned in Clannad (Tomoyo's aggressiveness in her early HS years and the events that brought her family together which is a prelude to the events that happen in AS) which would have been difficult to start from complete scratch without significant development time, imho.

Leo_Otaku

2008-04-09, 18:02

At any rate >.> If they do do a Tomoyo After I wonder if it will be OVA format or something...

Any news if As will be 2 cours or one? Zalas mentioned someone said it was 2 possibly.

Kristen

2008-04-10, 08:37

At any rate >.> If they do do a Tomoyo After I wonder if it will be OVA format or something...

Any news if As will be 2 cours or one? Zalas mentioned someone said it was 2 possibly.

I can't find any official news on it. In all likelihood, it's just going to be one to cover the After Story, and not include the second to cover additional routes.

My only guess is that it'll air in the summer if it's one cour, fall if it's two.

Joachim

2008-04-20, 22:49

This I am hoping for. I even made my own detailed outline for Season 2, though outdated and badly paced, here (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=1476748). (Warning! Plot/Ending Spoilers)

I don't think we'll be seeing that scene AT ALL... qq

But hey, Tomoyo got her own OVA. Maybe Kyou can have one too? Yes she can! :heh:

And yes, the Sunohara Siblings' route is awesome. It's my favorite scenario in the School Life chapter.

All routes FTW!

major spoiler bound ahead

in your outline, did you skip the bad end? because from what i read from your outline,
tomoya go back in time after ushio succumb to illness (so no ushio's death scene?)

I for one want to see they animate the bad end first then true end because bad end is pure BAWWWW.. and i need my emo dose :D

but mostly i love your outline cheers mate

Ice Block

2008-04-21, 11:36

@Joachim:
Glad you liked it.

Anyway, Ushio's death scene is in Ep27, which I described as the scene in the snowfield.

Aizu

2008-04-26, 03:55

Wait a sec, i've just finished the game, and
i saw only two variations of endings - the first time, when Ushio is dying on Tomoya's hands and shortly after that a scene in illusionary world, then main menu and the next time - the true ending, where we can "call out" in the scene of "leaving" for Nagisa shortly after Ushio's birth.
So, there is something else or not ?

Ice Block, mmm, maybe there will be no Kappei, e.t.c. And we still don't know the number of episodes. But let's hope, that it will be near 24.

Klashikari

2008-04-26, 04:39

Nope. Congratulations, you finished completely the game :)

Aizu

2008-04-26, 11:09

Thanks. The game is really amazing. Some episodes really made me cry. So, some time ago there was a really interesting question about the girl, who
was in this illusionary world before Ushio. But, as we can see from the game ending, this world exists only with Ushio, so, "she is this world", and it will be no illusionary world without her. I want to say, that's impossible. If another person was in "this" world before her, so, this world can't be the same, it will be an "another" world.

Hmm, i really want to hear any other ideas.

And one more thing, what were the last words in Illusionary world ? My japanese isn't fluental enough. The last word, i think, is "Papa", but what were the two words before ?

Proto

2008-04-26, 11:10

Would you happen to have a screenshot?

Farplaner

2008-04-26, 11:19

And one more thing, what were the last words in Illusionary world ? My japanese isn't fluental enough. The last word is "Papa", but what were the two words before ?

Sayonara = Goodbye

Aizu

2008-04-26, 11:23

Farplaner, thanks a lot.

By the way, if someone interested, here this words (http://img516.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wordsvu1.jpg).

mandarb916

2008-04-27, 05:00

Aizu

2008-04-27, 05:29

Yep, of course. I didn't mention it, because i talked only about endings. For me it was like this : as 1st time -> akio -> as again. And one more thing - what's the difference between two variations in Fuuko's route - kiss or not to kiss ?

Klashikari

2008-04-27, 07:18

i thought you needed the AS Akio/Sanae ending to get to the Clannad Epilogue with Fuko
You cannot get the true end without finishing the rest anyway. Whenever you got the true end, you get the epilogue after the credits, it is included with the true end anyway.

Yep, of course. I didn't mention it, because i talked only about endings. For me it was like this : as 1st time -> akio -> as again. And one more thing - what's the difference between two variations in Fuuko's route - kiss or not to kiss ?
Without any kiss, it is the "good end" as "friendship", but it doesn't count as "Fuuko's route finished".
The true end, with the kiss, is required to clear her route, so it will be validated for the whole walkthrough.

Trivia: the "no kiss" was supposed to be the original end, but considering how the other routes conclusions were, Maede Jun changed and offered both.

velocity7

2008-04-30, 16:48

This Tomoyo image (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=1568862&postcount=1743) pretty much confirms once and for all how alternate universe this is going to be. :)

Kaisos Erranon

2008-04-30, 17:12

This Tomoyo image (http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=1568862&postcount=1743) pretty much confirms once and for all how alternate universe this is going to be. :)

Wait, if that's Tomoyo, who's in the bear suit?

velocity7

2008-04-30, 17:37

She's probably just laying it down by her.