Girls slapping guys [Archive]

Abashi

2008-09-25, 20:49

tetsuo

2008-09-25, 20:56

I think its kinda cute. Cause usually its one of those "why can't you just let me love you" slaps. >.> atleast thats the way that I see it most of the times.

Abashi

2008-09-25, 21:15

I think its kinda cute. Cause usually its one of those "why can't you just let me love you" slaps. >.> atleast thats the way that I see it most of the times.

I've seen them mostly as responses for offensive statements. I've always thought it was really kool for a chick to do that, and its not really dirty or violence either, but rather more socially humiliating.

I hate it when guys do it, its much more ominous, and its geared more towards fear and control; while from women its geared towards humiliation.

Well, dats how I feel. :eyespin:

DragoonKain3

2008-09-25, 21:19

I personally don't like violence, however small, on either side.

Then again, my ship of choice is the childhood friend, where mutual understanding is among the things that particular coupling usually represesnts.

In other words, make love, not war. :p

Strahan

2008-09-25, 21:52

I don't like double standards, so no, I don't think it's cute. I think Maddox summed it up best in one of his postings (http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=26_things):

"11. React so cutely when you hit him and it actually hurts.
See, this is what pisses me off about women: they expect special treatment at their discretion. They want equal rights, equal pay, and equal treatment for everything EXCEPT when it comes to shit like this, then they want you to "react cutely" instead of, say, putting them in a head lock and making them eat ants and/or spiders while you give them carpet burn. Why don't women react "cutely" when men hit them for a change? Oops, I forgot, that's domestic abuse. "

MidnightViper88

2008-09-25, 22:06

Violence is fun, but slapping's for sissies!

That's why I like to watch titles like Ghost in the Shell and Appleseed to see the female leads do more than just slap a bitch up!

norly, slapping's not cute; It's only cute if you look like the cover to Pantera's "Vulgar Display of Power"...

cicido

2008-09-25, 22:11

MidnightViper88

2008-09-25, 22:22

Try imagining the gender-swapped version of Love Hina. A young girl becomes the new manager of a male only dorm, but only to be beaten up every now and then.

Why imagine that when I could see it enforced in a hijacked theocracy like Iran?

Slapping someone and beating someone to death are two different things, though... :p

Abashi

2008-09-25, 22:41

I remember there was another thread on this, but I'll post something from there anyways:

Try imagining the gender-swapped version of Love Hina. A young girl becomes the new manager of a male only dorm, but only to be beaten up every now and then.
Cute? I don't think so.

The sexes aren't equal. I havn't seen Love Hina, but I'm sure it is cute. Whatever the girls do to him, its probably not very graphical, and very fake looking violence. I've always liked girls slapping or touching in anyway, whether it be against males or females. People hate me for it, but the same folk that do think its kool for men to do it.

I'm sick of this shyt, they accuse feminists of being hypocrites, but then they make the reverse double standard saying men should hit women and get away with it while women shouldn't; also at the very time saying women should not have equal opportunity or anything. There are many laws and social norms that discriminate against women still, but some reason male chauvs only think the "no hit girls" thing is the only discrimination left or something. A very one sided argument.

Also, if your against double standards, then don't you also think that women should be allowed to dress topless like men? Probably not. Actually, in fact, anti-feminists actually like double standards EXCEPT for when it comes to stuff like this. You accuse feminists of being hypocrites, then you make the reverse double standards. You all do that, doing everything you accuse feminists of doing and not allowing other opinions to exist.

People praise men hitting women all the time, and nobody disrupts those topics, so quite ruining this one for me.

Oh I forgot to mention some anime I just remembered ...

MidnightViper88

2008-09-25, 22:46

So all feminists are as pure as the wind-driven snow and all men are nothing more than sexist predators...OK...

Abashi

2008-09-25, 23:11

I have seen a topic about guys slapping girls in anime, and people were discussing all the scenes where it has happened. I have done a gender swap to discuss scenes in which girls do it, but most of you seem too uptight to talk about it. Why is it ok to talk about guys slapping girls, but not vice versa?

So all feminists are as pure as the wind-driven snow and all men are nothing more than sexist predators...OK...

So all men have to hate feminists? I have heard countless hatred spewed towards women, I never hear that much hate directed towards men; and its never condoned. Misogynists make up crap, claim it to be true, and then do a SWAP of what the complained about in revenge. People glorify men hitting women all the time, but I never heard of anybody glorifying it coming from women. How come those of you who claim to be against violence from both sides only attack those who glorify it from women, yet you won't bother the misogynists when they preach their opinions.

KholdStare

2008-09-25, 23:25

It's cute if it's not to be overdone like nosebleeding.

MidnightViper88

2008-09-25, 23:35

Abashi - I don't even get where you're going with your tangents...

In your response to Strahan, you claim a double-standard over the treatment of women that ironically implies that feminists should be able to get away with things that would normally otherwise be considered taboo if executed by men...Nobody's saying here that men get away with treating women like they're nothing more than punching bags...As a matter of fact, social norms almost have a sort of reverse discrimination to bolster women, much akin to racial minorities, that allow women to do things that men used to do and allow it to be justified; Like self-defense, where if a man takes up self-defense against a woman, they're labeled by society as a beater because men are supposed to be stronger than women...Guess what? Not all women in the feminist movement are pure as the wind-driven snow and not all men are sexist predators, the latter of being a stereotype enforced by a small group of feminazis that aren't contributing anything helpful to women in society and take their frustration on the male gender far beyond the level of logic...You said to me that all men had to hate feminists, HAD TO, when there is nothing in normal logic that supports that, and there's nothing in my post that even implies that; You're throwing the words out, not anyone else...

Use logic in a social context for once; Equality does not include unfair treatment biased towards one side or another because even reverse discrimination is still discrimination...There is no excuse for either men or women to beat up on each other senselessly, since in the end both men and women are humans, so don't use sexual antagonism to try to throw a "one-sided argument" clause when both sides have equal faults...

Abashi

2008-09-25, 23:50

It's cute if it's not to be overdone like nosebleeding.

I agree. I think a slap on the cheek from a girl is kinda cute and haught, but to smash a guy's face with a weapon is going too far, and thus shouldn't be applied to as trivial. I have seen a lot of trivialization when it comes to violence from women in anime, but most of the time its pretty cute.

Going back to Moonphase: Hazuki slapped Kouhei across the face after he said something very offensive to her, and he let her get away with it. Though, even though he lets her off on double standards, he does defend himself. In the next episode, she tries to suck his blood, he shoves her off with his blanket, and she's on the other side of the room (she must be a real light weight).

I believe in double standards when it comes to certain forms of violence (such as slapping or pinching) that would be very different based on who did it. Other more extreme forms of violence, I don't take the same stance on.

Abashi - I don't even get where you're going with your tangents...

In your response to Strahan, you claim a double-standard over the treatment of women that ironically implies that feminists should be able to get away with things that would normally otherwise be considered taboo if executed by men...Nobody's saying here that men get away with treating women like they're nothing more than punching bags...As a matter of fact, social norms almost have a sort of reverse discrimination to bolster women, much akin to racial minorities, that allow women to do things that men used to do and allow it to be justified; Like self-defense, where if a man takes up self-defense against a woman, they're labeled by society as a beater because men are supposed to be stronger than women...Guess what? Not all women in the feminist movement are pure as the wind-driven snow and not all men are sexist predators, the latter of being a stereotype enforced by a small group of feminazis that aren't contributing anything helpful to women in society and take their frustration on the male gender far beyond the level of logic...You said to me that all men had to hate feminists, HAD TO, when there is nothing in normal logic that supports that, and there's nothing in my post that even implies that; You're throwing the words out, not anyone else...

Use logic in a social context for once; Equality does not include unfair treatment biased towards one side or another because even reverse discrimination is still discrimination...There is no excuse for either men or women to beat up on each other senselessly, since in the end both men and women are humans, so don't use sexual antagonism to try to throw a "one-sided argument" clause when both sides have equal faults...

My reaction is based on my experience with people ranting on this gender stuff. Generally from what I have seen over the Internet, as well as experienced with people in person; is that the people who complain about double standards biased against men often make the reverse double standards, while justifying it by citing double standards made by feminists. Second, this one point of view is the only espoused point of view, other views aren't even allowed to exist, yet they accuse radical feminists of censoring them when misogynists actually scream their views all over the place and never shut up about it. Also, think Godwin's law, comparing them to Nazis shows the stupidity of those who are arguing against feminism. If you want to sound more fair, try to stop using terms such as 'feminazi' that imply hatred and narrow-mindedness?

I understand what your trying to say, overall. No offense, I hope.

Vexx

2008-09-26, 00:17

Hasn't this poll been done already (and it turned into a flame fest as well)

Slapstick comedy is called that for a reason....

Xhokhusmak

2008-09-26, 00:18

I have no idea how you guys think being slapped is supposed to be a cute thing. You ever been slapped by a girl in real life? It sucks. And seriously OP, you need more options for the poll, because the real reason that girls slap guys is not there (when you're getting out of hand... in their eyes, not yours).

Abashi

2008-09-26, 00:38

Vexx

2008-09-26, 00:45

Apparently some people are having trouble distinguishing between what is okay in fictionalized anime (ala slapstick or melodrama) and real life....

Cherudim Arche

2008-09-26, 00:49

Playful girl slap to guy, anything else to me is overkill.

Xhokhusmak

2008-09-26, 00:58

Apparently some people are having trouble distinguishing between what is okay in fictionalized anime (ala slapstick or melodrama) and real life....

The scene in Moonphase that the OP talks about, is supposed to be a serious scene. That is what I'm explaining. It's not that I like moonphase, I don't, but if the anime wants to display an act of drama, at least try understand it that way.

But you know what? That series wasn't that good so I guess I can understand why you're misunderstanding it. Poor execution and follow up.

Vexx

2008-09-26, 01:07

I thought the Moon Phase series was outstanding .... and the slap was entirely appropriate in that context. A young girl way in over her head and him being "thick-headed" - and then naturally she ran away because she was distraught.

I think you're misunderstanding .. me. I don't see any real point to confusing a real life slap with a melodramatic one. And, once in a great while, a real life slap can be quite useful (or completely an error). It depends on the context.

Spectacular_Insanity

2008-09-26, 02:22

I find it hilarious... preferably with a oversized paper fan, but any bludgeoning object will do. :heh:

Abashi

2008-09-26, 14:33

A girl's palm is soft enough for a comforting slap, anything else is too painful.

... This topic was supposed to be about scenes when a girl slaps a guy or other girl.

False Dawn

2008-09-26, 18:17

Best slap I've ever seen in anime was in Suzuka. I'm sure they used the sound of wood snapping to make the sound effect :D

Abashi

2008-09-27, 17:29

Best slap I've ever seen in anime was in Suzuka. I'm sure they used the sound of wood snapping to make the sound effect :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMuilq3bojk

I agree, it does sound like a wood sound. It was pretty kool. He kinda deserved it for forcing her into a kiss.

OH LOOK AT THIS FUNNY PARODY HERE:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NedyMq0ZcDA

Strahan

2008-09-28, 16:32

I'm sick of this shyt, they accuse feminists of being hypocrites, but then they make the reverse double standard saying men should hit women and get away with it while women shouldn't; also at the very time saying women should not have equal opportunity or anything. There are many laws and social norms that discriminate against women still, but some reason male chauvs only think the "no hit girls" thing is the only discrimination left or something. A very one sided argument.

Also, if your against double standards, then don't you also think that women should be allowed to dress topless like men? Probably not. Actually, in fact, anti-feminists actually like double standards EXCEPT for when it comes to stuff like this. You accuse feminists of being hypocrites, then you make the reverse double standards. You all do that, doing everything you accuse feminists of doing and not allowing other opinions to exist.

People praise men hitting women all the time, and nobody disrupts those topics, so quite ruining this one for me.

In case you missed it, I was quoting Maddox not speaking myself. I sure as hell do not support men hitting women. I also don't like women thinking it's OK to hit men either just because they're women. As I said, violence is never necessary. Call me a hippy if you like, that's just the way I am.

Also what does any other form of discrimination have to do with it? We're specifically talking about whether or not it's cute if a woman slaps a man. In regards to your dressing topless thing, yea, I'd have no complaints with that. Why would you think I would? I'm not a prude. When do men get praised for hitting women?? Only thrice have I seen a guy hit a girl that I can remember, and in all those times the guy got himself pounded by people who witnessed it.

Sorry if you think I was "disrupting your topic" or "ruining your thread", but you specifically asked if people thought it was cute.. were you only inviting opinions that matched your own?

Nukerjsr

2008-09-30, 15:53

I think the issue with this is when it's done for comedy and when it's crossing the line. I mean, there's several times when you can hit someone and it's done for laughs. It usually makes you feel good if both characters feel good in the end. Or in that case where a person is acting hysterical and the slap helps them by calming them down.

However, I think too much know a days does comedy use that as a form of entertainment. Love Hina, Zero no Tsukaima, romantic comedy anime loves to do this a lot because if the guy effs up then he has a reason to get his ass kicked. But that's not right at ALL. One thing to remember that in comedy, if you feel good, then the audience feels good. It's not everytime when there's a one-sided beating going on that it makes me laugh. What I'm basically saying is that it can be funny, but most of the time it isn't because it's excuted poorly.

This is where the double standard comes into play though. Can you think of an anime where a man hit a woman for the sake of humor? In all these romantic comedies now a days, women beat the ever loving crap out of men for making a wrongful glance. Yet, in that same show, if that man slaps a woman, he's suddenly a horrible monster. It's wrong! That's how this comes into play because it's always considered negative when a man hits a woman. If a woman fights back, it can be considered her empowering herself.

Proto

2008-09-30, 16:16

This is where the double standard comes into play though. Can you think of an anime where a man hit a woman for the sake of humor?

Nodame Cantabile. All the time.

SeedFreedom

2008-09-30, 17:41

In my opinion, I think if they show the attack to be purely comical i have no problem. If you want to get into the whole "why is women hitting men in general accepted but not the other way around" debate, then i agree with you fully. I know plenty of girls who take advantage to truly abuse guys because they cant fight back. That being said, i think women while they do tend to abuse less, should not be let off the hook or assumed not to be violent.

animeboy12

2008-09-30, 19:45

I don't see that appeal in slapping especially in romance. The problem I have is most series don't know where to cross the line. Personally I never really got into Love hina because of the constant male abuse and I went on for 14 volumes. It seemed that every funny or awkard moment would end in male abuse. It's like somebody telling you a 100 differnt jokes with the same punch line.

LustfulEnvy

2008-09-30, 20:16

I'd rather get slaPPed then punched by a girl aNY daY!
Slappings cute! It can hurt but isn't strong enough to knock you out.us =p

risingstar3110

2008-09-30, 20:44

Kaioshin Sama

2008-10-01, 04:31

Slapping? I'm more into lolis grinding their heels into the backs of fallen dudes until they pass out from the pain personally............what? :uhoh:

FateAnomaly

2008-10-02, 03:51

I am not really against the "violence" per se but i think sometimes the situation could be handled better without losing the temper. It only made things worse.

On the other hand, i think Dokuro-chan way of handling things is pretty unique. :P

othera

2008-10-04, 10:14

The one in moonphase was cute :)

A lot of anime(seen in moon phase alot) a guy accedently walks in on a girl having a bath or naked in some way and she yells at him and slaps him, its usualy comical and its quite funny to watch.

So i like it.

But if its like a girl slapping a guy to hurt him it wont be a + or -

I don't mind it, and comical slaps are always fun for me :)

Amray

2008-10-04, 10:20

I thought one of the more popular slaps would have been when Ayanami Rei slaps Shinji for cursing his own father. (Neon Genesis Evangelion)

Anyway, some slapping scenes are relevant, such as on Fruits Basket as that is a romance anime, but I never looked upon it is being "cute". In real life it is nothing to blush about anyway.

I do also remember a male slapping another male. On Gunslinger Girl when a mobster is about to call someone on his mobile phone in an art gallery and the other man with him slaps him around the face and says how disrespectful it is to do that in such a place full of all Italy's treasures. That was a good one.

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 10:21

othera

2008-10-04, 10:24

Personally, I get annoyed by it sometimes... not cause of the slap but because the girl gets away with it.

I really enjoyed it when the evil bully chick got her face knocked in by the main character in UnbalancexUnbalance.

I agree with him when he said "Just because you're a girl, you think think you can get away with this kind of shit. Thats Bullshit!"

If you have the balls to act up and be "tough", you should have the balls to take a beating as well. Man, women, child, grandpa, etc...

I know what you mean.

As an example moon phase again(i love it to much :p)
Kazuki slaps kouhei many times, does heaps of bad things and when she abuses her powers on kouhei's friend he slaps her(i think it might of just been yelling)
He gets yelled at by everyone even though she does so much and gets away with it just because she is a girl(and probably due to her age, but i mean... shes a damn vampire :p)

Girls often can bash the crap out of a guy and only get a "hey stop it"

Amray

2008-10-04, 10:38

Girls often can bash the crap out of a guy and only get a "hey stop it"

Being slapped by a female does not bother me. When I am to be slapped by one I will just simply stand there....maybe with a little frown or something. It might sometimes work right because the girl may feel guilty afterwards. If not then it would not bother me in the slightest. The one thing I would never do to a female is hit her back. I know some of you people may think it is strange or stupid, but I generally would never hit a girl back if she were to slap me. It goes against my personal nature and the way I was brought up. I grew up thinking it is wrong and this is the result.

MidnightViper88

2008-10-04, 10:40

You know, maybe it's the fighter in me, but uhh...

Does it annoy anyone else that the guys never bother to block an incoming attack or slap?

risingstar3110

2008-10-04, 10:54

You know, maybe it's the fighter in me, but uhh...

Does it annoy anyone else that the guys never bother to block an incoming attack or slap?
It is unrealistic but i don't really think it's annoying. =]

Most of the case the guy probably can't block the slap because the director want the slap to be "too sudden, too shocking that he could't even close his eyes to protect his eyeballs"

PS: second here btw, i have the feeling that i will block any incoming attack first and ask if i really deserve it later

Amray

2008-10-04, 10:57

Heed my words, some slaps are just too fast and sudden to to try and defend. One of the only ways to defend a slap is if you know what you just said to this girl was offensive, that is when you should prepare to block it.

Although I would personally let them do it. It will make them feel better atleast and I respect my woman.

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 11:01

It depends on the girl will reflect on my reaction.

If she's an outright bitch, I'll pimp slap the shit out of her :heh: excuse my french

Sute443

2008-10-04, 11:02

Although I would personally let them do it. It will make them feel better atleast and I respect my woman.

And if your woman started slapping your kids? Would you let her do that if it made her feel better?

Amray

2008-10-04, 11:06

And if your woman started slapping your kids? Would you let her do that if it made her feel better?

A woman slapping myself, and a woman slapping my children are two completely different subjects. If a woman, whether I knew her or not, abused my children then I would take some action. I do respect females, but I also respect children more (especially if they were female children) therefore I would tackle her or something... maybe into a wall or something hard, depending on how much pain she was causing them.

If you think that I would just stand there and watch my children get hit then you have me very much mistaken. I would let a girl slap 'me'...but I would never let her do it to young children.

Sute443

2008-10-04, 11:11

If you think that I would just stand there and watch my children get hit then you have me very much mistaken. I would let a girl slap 'me'...but I would never let her do it to young children.

I was very much hoping that you would not. I simply view the two matters as being much more closely related than you do. In my view, if someone is willing to strike one person they care about, then they are far more likely to be willing to strike others that they care about.

Deathkillz

2008-10-04, 11:14

Getting bitch slapped...is actually quite insulting :rolleyes:

I would only agree in cases where the reciever really deserves it (which happens more often than not, surprisingly :p).

Amray

2008-10-04, 11:19

I was very much hoping that you would not. I simply view the two matters as being much more closely related than you do. In my view, if someone is willing to strike one person they care about, then they are far more likely to be willing to strike others that they care about.

That may be true, but it would only matter to me if she really did it or not. Plus what you state is not always the case. There are some mothers and such out there that would easily slap there husband or what not because of the things that he has done, but would never, ever slap there own children.

Let us put me in the position as being the woman for a moment. If my husband were to come home late and it turned out that he spent the night kissing other girls then I would quite easily beat the crap out of him with slaps. At the same time I as an individual would never hurt children, whether I was male or female it would never happen, therefore they would be safe from me. So yes, "my woman" may very well slap me, but there is also the chance that she might be the type of person to never hurt the younger generation. If she did...then I would take action. But that is only if she were to actually do it.

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 11:22

As much as I love the fairer sex. I'm inclined to believe that we are all equals and should be treated as such. Giving a girl lenancy just because she's a she, than thats just plain favoritism. In a way, you could say, Its me supporting womens rights as equals. lol :heh:

MidnightViper88

2008-10-04, 11:26

Wow, so we've got some guys here that will just Stonewall a slap from a girl and take it like a man...

I'd love to see which way their marriage sways and who controls who... :rolleyes:

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 11:28

I like to believe that the women that'll be my future wife isn't going to be a bitch, lol

I need someone somewhat opposite of me, to "calm the beast" sort of speak, lol

Amray

2008-10-04, 11:30

I'd love to see which way their marriage sways and who controls who... :rolleyes:

If she was cute, short, and flat-chested then I would not care. Being dominated by a girl with lolicon features has always been a dream of mine.

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 11:32

If she was cute then I would not care. Being dominated by a girl with lolicon features has always been a dream of mine.

Ahh, I see I see. You want yourself a Louise eh?

Amray

2008-10-04, 11:37

Ahh, I see I see. You want yourself a Louise eh?

Exactly ..or a Kagami Hiiragi. I am not too fussed.

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 11:40

I don't see Kagami as the dominating type... she seems most likely to be more of the lovey dovey type, as she always wanted a boyfriend.

Amray

2008-10-04, 11:44

She would not abuse her children...which is exactly one of the things I look for in girls; someone I can trust. I would give a girl no reason to slap me anyway, I am just too cute and lovely for that.

Hiiragi Tsukasa would be best for me. She is all cute and innocent, but imagine of she did dominate. That would be me with an instant nose-bleed.

othera

2008-10-04, 12:02

Wow, so we've got some guys here that will just Stonewall a slap from a girl and take it like a man...

I'd love to see which way their marriage sways and who controls who... :rolleyes:

I plan to not marry someone who will slap me.
+ in my life, i have never been slapped or anything like that other then in a playful manner

And if i was to be slapped i would ignore it unless i didn't deserve it.

back to the anime slapping :p

What are your views on hitting a little kid?

I willuse moonphase as an example again, when kouhei hits kazuki i think she deserved it but the amount of crap he got from everyone else for it was unfair on him imo.

And anyone hitting a kid irl is bad imo, no excuses unless they have viciously attacked your or just murdered your friend.

HayashiTakara

2008-10-04, 12:16

Believe it or not, but I've never been slap by a girl. At least not the typical kind... lol, ignore that :heh:

risingstar3110

2008-10-04, 12:25

I was attacked (literally, punched and hit) by a girl for no reason when i was in 4th or 5th grade. Quite a scary experience (even when it was not hurt or anything, but image random people just start to attack you) during that time. But now i feel my young self is so pathetic :D

PS: Now i remember, I ended up having a girl in my class stand up to protect me, pathetic x2 , X____x

MidnightViper88

2008-10-04, 13:03

Zenemis

2008-10-04, 13:09

If I recall correctly, Akemi slaps Shuuji, and receives one back straight after, that leaves her on the ground, sobbing uncontrollably.

Amray

2008-10-04, 13:14

OK, lemme backtrack for a bit and try to define things for myself a bit...

There are guys out there who will take in a woman's slap, have no reaction and try not to block the incoming slap, and then just stand there like a dumbfounded doofus who got smacked by a train and did nothing to prevent it, all the while enjoying it depending on who does the slapping...

You know what I call that? Masochism...You know what else others might call that? Whipped...

Mr. T would call you a disgrace to man...And call me pessimistic, but you would probably also deserve the slap too, if you don't get followed up by having your head ground under the hell of her shoe on top of that... :p

If a football was pelted into your direction really hard and hit you right across the face (the cause uknown) with millions of people watching what would you do? Would you try your best to hide the pain and try and accept it, or would you break down in front of all these people and start crying because it hurt?

This is my point; people react differently to the same things. Some people faint at the sight of blood, whereas I could look at it with no problem. Some people cry when they are bitten by animals, some just curse a lot, some even laugh. So when you see someone get slapped and all you see is a "doofus" standing there accepting it, some others might see a simple man that just cannot be bothered to counter or just simply refuses to hit girls. But if he did hit her some idiots would laugh at a weaker girl being hit, yet others would see a big wimp that likes hitting females..which is one of the reasons that males do not tend to hit females, because they fear what will become of their appearance.

Therefore I would rather have abuse like "Haha, you were "whipped" by a girl" said to me as opposed to "Woman beater! I will start punching you around and see how you like being beaten by men!" et cetera.

MidnightViper88

2008-10-04, 13:15

Uhh...You don't have to launch a counter-strike to put up a defense, you know...

*whistles*

Amray

2008-10-04, 13:24

Uhh...You don't have to launch a counter-strike to put up a defense, you know...

*whistles*

But could you imagine how many people would laugh at you? Blocking an attack from a girl because you were frightened that it would hurt? Seriously though, as I stated before (and believe me) some attacks by girls can be so sudden that by the time you have realised they have slapped you you are living in next week....or on the floor.

othera

2008-10-04, 13:26

If a football was pelted into your direction really hard and hit you right across the face (the cause uknown) with millions of people watching what would you do? Would you try your best to hide the pain and try and accept it, or would you break down in front of all these people and start crying because it hurt?

This is my point; people react differently to the same things. Some people faint at the sight of blood, whereas I could look at it with no problem. Some people cry when they are bitten by animals, some just curse a lot, some even laugh. So when you see someone get slapped and all you see is a "doofus" standing there accepting it, some others might see a simple man that just cannot be bothered to counter or just simply refuses to hit girls. But if he did hit her some idiots would laugh at a weaker girl being hit, yet others would see a big wimp that likes hitting females..which is one of the reasons that males do not tend to hit females, because they fear what will become of their appearance.

Therefore I would rather have abuse like "Haha, you were "whipped" by a girl" as opposed to "Woman beater! I will start punching you around and see how you like being beaten by men!" et cetera.

I agree, i would rather take a punch over being seen as a mean person.

And about the defending yourself thing, i dont bother defending myself because i laugh when i am hit and dont really feel pain(is that a good or bad thing? :P)

And if a girl was to hit me i would let them let out there anger.

EDIT: also about the sometimes your slapped so fast you dont even realize thing, i see that happen so many times... someone is argueing and the girl can be a meter away and in the blink of an eye theres a huge SLAP sound and you barely notice it :p
And unless you have lightning reflexes theres nothing you can do

MidnightViper88

2008-10-04, 13:33

Amray

2008-10-04, 13:39

Come now, it is not my fault I am so tough.

Out of all seriousness though, I have only seen very few anime males get slapped on anime, and they do not just stand there looking like idiots, they just have a shocked expression on there face and look at the girl again, which is what I said I do when slapped. I will look at them either quite shocked or pissed off. That is because it is so sudden and one does not expect it, hence what I have been stating for the passed half an hour..that is why most of us just stand there. Sudden attack...ambush...et cetera. After that it is too late to react and do anything.

othera

2008-10-04, 13:39

Oh, yay! Get laughed at for being beat up by a girl, or being laughed at for blocking a girl's attack and being afraid of the pain; It's one of those "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" situations...I love those; No matter what, you can't win, because she's a girl!

:rolleyes:

OK, before someone derails this topic even further than it almost did on Page 1, let me ret-con myself; My annoyance with guys who stand there and allow a girl to slap them without an instinct reaction of defense is an annoyance of mine found in cliche anime/manga scenarios, not real life...After all, isn't this thread about anime characters bitch slapping each other to hell and back and not real life people?
If someone laughs at you for being slapped by a girl, while they are laughing at you bitch slap them but not as hard as you can. My sister slapped someone who was laughing at someone else for laughing at someone for being slapped, it shut him up :p

and now i think we should get back on topic....

Not enouch anime's use comical slaps, they are damn awsome imo.

anime ronin

2008-10-04, 22:59

i dont know, it kinda pisses me off when guys in like harem animes are always getting their ass kicked by girls for doing something clumsy, or doing sumthing by mistake. its like damn let the boy talk before you beat the shit out of him!

todkapuz

2008-10-07, 20:35

It is very similar to nartual society... at least around here... while maybe not encouraged, generally women can get away with it more... I think when it is used in a natural way and it isn't over exagerated, there is nothing wrong with it, if it really has some point or meaning or is consistent with the perrsonality of the chara... otherwise its silly.

Langknow

2008-10-08, 10:29

I don't thinking slapping by anyone in a series context is right. (Not that it can't be entertaining thought).

A slap delivered in the right way, can cause a knock out, and actually hurt more than a punch to the face.

The surface area of the palm distributes the whole force of the slap onto the face, even if the attacker misses by a couple of inches, any contact can cause series of vibration , if enough, can make the victim go unconsious.

Though a slap is not as effective as a face palm, where the force is a direct straight force, while a slap is a sideways hit.

kramerica

2008-10-08, 16:02

This topic makes me remember the Naked Gun 2 1/2. Frank Drebin is about to get slapped, but he catches the hand before contact. Then he's quick enough to catch the other hand before it hits. Of course, a third hand pops out of nowhere to slap him across the face :D

As for the topic, I'm sort of annoyed by it. Mostly because when it's done for comical purposes it's usually over-the-top like Love Hina and ZnT, where it suddenly becomes just annoying. As for being serious slap, I've seen it only as acceptable if it's more of a "GET YOURSELF TOGETHER" slap. Slaps due to anger are not my cup of tea. I couldn't care less if it came from a girl.

Have to side with Lelouch's FABULOUS quote "Those who may shoot are only those who are prepared to get shot". That doesn't mean to go eye-for-an-eye, but just standing there doing nothing after being slapped is basically submitting - or more like enjoying being controlled or publicly humiliated just to keep your own personal sense of chivalry. I think a verbal lashing as retaliation might be perfect :P

Abashi

2008-10-08, 23:03

But could you imagine how many people would laugh at you? Blocking an attack from a girl because you were frightened that it would hurt? Seriously though, as I stated before (and believe me) some attacks by girls can be so sudden that by the time you have realised they have slapped you you are living in next week....or on the floor.

It depends on how she wanted to hit me. If she were to just slap me, go ahead; but if it were to be a punch or with a weapon, I'd block, perhaps press charges if I get hit. There is a point in which I'd give women a double standard, but I have a line for everyone, just a different line.

OH WAIT, oops, this was about ANIME.

Darklord_bg

2008-10-09, 00:09

This thread reminds me of this episode of Lost, when Sawyer, Jin and Michael are captured by the tail-section survivors (for those of you who are familiar with the show).

Then Ana-Lucia proceeds to hit Sawyer several times, while he was badly injured. Then he came back with this great quote. I think it was something like this:

"I don't hit women, Hotlips...but, if you hit me one more time, I'll kill you!"

Quite appropriate for this thread, don't you think?

Amray

2008-10-09, 09:09

It depends on how she wanted to hit me. If she were to just slap me, go ahead; but if it were to be a punch or with a weapon, I'd block, perhaps press charges if I get hit. There is a point in which I'd give women a double standard, but I have a line for everyone, just a different line.

OH WAIT, oops, this was about ANIME.

Well..naturally. If anyone came up to you with a giant sledge-hammer and got into a stance to hit you with it anyone would run away or try and defend. But this thread is discussing slapping, not hitting people with weapons. Bloody hell, even if just a little six year old girl came up to me with something like a samurai sword with a suspicious smile I would still run away and hide.

Abashi

2008-10-13, 14:55

Well..naturally. If anyone came up to you with a giant sledge-hammer and got into a stance to hit you with it anyone would run away or try and defend. But this thread is discussing slapping, not hitting people with weapons. Bloody hell, even if just a little six year old girl came up to me with something like a samurai sword with a suspicious smile I would still run away and hide.

Yesh, I know. I would gladly let a girl slap me, just for fun.

MidnightViper88

2008-10-14, 12:44

How about something like in Bleach, where Kukaku throws all hell at Ichigo and Ganju? Or is that too close to straight-up masochism?

Egghead89

2009-01-13, 15:10

If I can interject.
I was thinking about Youhei Sunohara, the guy in Clannad who gets beaten up all time by her schoolmate Tomoyo...
Well, I recently discovered that some sort of "Genderbending of Clannad" is around the net - and, consequently, Youko Sunohara was created:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb153/Ganjalf89/837926506518de41a659167ac777942a.jpg

Then I recalled that, in a video on Nicovideo & Youtube, there was the infamous "Haruhi kicks the Computer Club President" scene, genderswapped.

Now, the question is: with such a precedent set, will they really dare to make a Male Tomoyo beat the hell out of a Female Youhei? :upset:

typhonsentra

2009-01-13, 21:26

I think violence against women in anime can be pretty damn funny when done correctly, and used sparingly. The other way around not so much as it's way overdone.

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-13, 22:46

Female Sunohara getting beaten up might be funny in an "OMG, I can't believe they just did that" kind of way, similar to why things like the "Your resistance" meme is funny. It wouldn't be light hearted fun like male Sunohara getting beaten up, though.

The real question, of course, is whether the moe of a female Sunohara would increase after being beaten up by Tomoyo. I think it would, especially if she cries.

As an example moon phase again(i love it to much )
Kazuki slaps kouhei many times, does heaps of bad things and when she abuses her powers on kouhei's friend he slaps her(i think it might of just been yelling)
He gets yelled at by everyone even though she does so much and gets away with it just because she is a girl(and probably due to her age, but i mean... shes a damn vampire )

The reason people chew Kouhei out is because he's an adult, and it's shameful for him to be losing his temper.

By contrast, Hazuki is only 14. For her, it's certainly bad behaviour, and I do think that Kouhei and co. are very leniant on her... but given her age and background, I don't think it's entirely unexpected either.

As for getting slapped by a girl in real life - it would be inappropriate to beat her up, but I think it's entirely appropriate to defend oneself. At the very least, grab her by the wrist and say "don't do that again" in the most intimidating voice you can manage. Saying it doesn't hurt that much does not make it okay.

(That said, I can understand why a lot of guys don't do anything. I've had a girl in my anime club jab me in the ribs with a kendo stick and another smack me in the back of the head at a restaurant over utterly trivial stuff. By the time I mentally recovered from either, the chance to make an appropriate response had passed.)

Egghead89

2009-01-14, 03:21

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-14, 03:34

BTW, I wonder how Youhei's famous pain screams would be like if he was a girl... :)

Like I said, you have to make her cry. Crying girls are moe.

Egghead89

2009-01-14, 03:57

Like I said, you have to make her cry. Crying girls are moe.

Indeed they are...
But heck, just try to imagine this (http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=ccNeGbBsJ_Q) scene, genderswapped. The image of "Youko" exploding in tears after it... yes, it is moe, but it still makes me feel a bit sorry... :(

Oh wait, that's actually what makes it moe... :rolleyes:

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-14, 04:19

Indeed they are...
But heck, just try to imagine this (http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=ccNeGbBsJ_Q) scene, genderswapped. The image of "Youko" exploding in tears after it... yes, it is moe, but it still makes me feel a bit sorry... :(

Oh wait, that's actually IS what makes it moe - :rolleyes:

Exactly. If EF: A Tale of Melodies taught me anything, it's that abused girls are incredibly moe.

...I'm a bad, bad person, aren't I?

Solafighter

2009-01-14, 05:16

I think its kinda cute, and haught

:D ;) :cool:

MuraKami

2009-01-14, 05:43

Any male character that reeks of mehness should gratefully receive tons of slapping, a nice boat, and is expected to return begging for more. Mmmm, highly amusing.

Narona

2009-01-14, 08:10

I'm wondering, do any of you think its sort of cute or haught for a girl to slap a guy or another girl in anime?

It depends on what the guy (well it can be another girl) did <_<. I don't find that really cute since slapping people, imo, means that someone (the one who is slapped) did/said something really wrong/bad.

Egghead89

2009-01-14, 14:25

It depends on what the guy (well it can be another girl) did <_<. I don't find that really cute since slapping people, imo, means that someone (the one who is slapped) did/said something really wrong/bad.

Not always. Sometimes, Anime guys get slapped from girls for no reason at all.

One example for all: Keitaro from Love Hina.
A good 70% of the times, he gets kicked, punched, launched, bombed, blasted, strangled, burned senseless.

And he just has to cope with it.

Narona

2009-01-14, 15:36

Not always. Sometimes, Anime guys get slapped from girls for no reason at all.

One example for all: Keitaro from Love Hina.
A good 70% of the times, he gets kicked, punched, launched, bombed, blasted, strangled, burned senseless.

And he just has to cope with it.
Good point ^^

But when they hit him, there is a reason. Often after a misunderstanding and they think he acts like a pervert on purpose :p

If a pervert dares to touch my chest IRL, he would have a good chance to be at least slapped by me :p So I understand Naru :D

Yushi

2009-01-14, 18:16

Hmm, personally, I don't like it.
I always imagined what would be the public response if a male anime character was to hit a girl in a comedic situation and the girl would recover magically in the next panel... And I can already tell it won't be very pretty XD
Anime guys can't even verbally talk smack to a girl without being bashed to death. Ex. A tsundere male (and only verbally) like Luke (boy he got bashed quite a bit).
Would be interesting to see an anime of a guy bossing a girl around... basically like tora dora in reverse >=) But I guess then it wouldn't be classified as 'funny' anymore...

animeboy12

2009-01-14, 18:30

with the popularity of Yandere and Tsundere I wonder whether a lot of anime fans have some hidden sadist fetish or something.

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-14, 19:39

with the popularity of Yandere and Tsundere I wonder whether a lot of anime fans have some hidden sadist fetish or something.

The term "sadist fetish" is a bit confusing, since a guy who has a fetish for sadistic girls would be a masochist, not a sadist.

Let me put it this way:
Masochist: Offers himself as a noble sacrifice for a sweet, adorable tsundere or yandere to take out her frustrations on, thereby making the world a better place.
Sadist: Weirdo who likes to cause pain to some poor, sweet, adorable tsundere or yandere.

Get?:)

Arekkusu723

2009-01-14, 19:53

i think its awesome and hilarious considering the scenarios ^^

Darklord_bg

2009-01-14, 20:07

Hmm, some of those responses make me wonder about the gender of the posters.

For instance, why do you find it amusing to see a guy be treated unfairly if you yourself would not like to be treated the same way. I mean, what's the appeal for guys especially?

I can understand girls liking it, since it may feel particularly empowering, but what I don't get is why is it pleasurable for guys to see other guys get kicked in the nuts(figuratively (and sometimes not even that) speaking) - especially if the guy did not deserve it.

I mean...I feel like some people here don't have any pride for being male at all and they would gladly let a hot girl do whatever they want with them. Please, tell me that I am wrong...

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-14, 22:10

For instance, why do you find it amusing to see a guy be treated unfairly if you yourself would not like to be treated the same way. I mean, what's the appeal for guys especially?

For me, it's not funny because of the violence specifically, but because I find the misfortune of fictional characters is often amusing. Heck, I find the misfortune of female characters is often amusing, the only reason a girl being beaten up (usually) isn't amusing is because it reminds me too much of domestic violence.

For other guys, there may be a bit more of a masochist angle to it - someone has to be buying those "girl going tsundere on you" CDs and tsundere voice GPS units (I can't make this shit up).

I mean...I feel like some people here don't have any pride for being male at all and they would gladly let a hot girl do whatever they want with them. Please, tell me that I am wrong...

I might say that a guy who lets a girl walk all over him just because she's a girl has no pride in being male, but if the guy actually enjoys it, it's kind of hard to say the same since it's actually an exercise of personal preference.

Personally, I find girl on girl domination far hotter.

FateAnomaly

2009-01-14, 22:28

Some people are commenting on the premises that the characters are fictional. Some are commenting on it as in RL. But the OP is talking about fictional (I think) So i will only comment on it.

Most of the time the male characters who got hit are so tough that they wouldn't die if a house fall on them. It is hard to think that they would actually be hurt by a slap or worse. I am thus not so affected by the "violence" than the unreasonable personality of the female characters. Louise(ZnT) is on one extreme of the spectrum who really use excessive force unreasonably. Haruka (Minami-ke) is on the other end who use force rationally.

Irenicus

2009-01-15, 00:06

To raise a counterexample: what about Chiaki of Nodame Cantabile? Interestingly enough, the response to his "violence" among the fans is mixed as far as I see, with some who otherwise profess no discomfort with "girl-on-guy" violence protesting Chiaki's treatment of Nodame, sometimes strongly, despite a cartoonish depiction more akin to a physical boke-tsukkomi routine than the sometimes deadpan and eyebrow-raising use of female violence in anime.

Darklord_bg

2009-01-15, 01:55

For me, it's not funny because of the violence specifically, but because I find the misfortune of fictional characters is often amusing. Heck, I find the misfortune of female characters is often amusing, the only reason a girl being beaten up (usually) isn't amusing is because it reminds me too much of domestic violence.

I understand the appeal of slapstick comedy, especially when it is done right. I even appreciate "black" humor, when a situation which is usually not humorous at all is made to look funny.

However, the problem is that this is too one-sided from girls to guys. It's like it's trying to project a message that guys are weaker than girls and cannot defend themselves. And what I find even more shocking is that male viewers seem to accept and love this idea.:confused:

Most of the time the male characters who got hit are so tough that they wouldn't die if a house fall on them. It is hard to think that they would actually be hurt by a slap or worse. I am thus not so affected by the "violence" than the unreasonable personality of the female characters. Louise(ZnT) is on one extreme of the spectrum who really use excessive force unreasonably. Haruka (Minami-ke) is on the other end who use force rationally.

It's not about the physical damage as much as the expression of domination that the beating up involves. Basically, the message is that men have to always do what women want and if they screw up even if unknowingly, they will be punished.

To raise a counterexample: what about Chiaki of Nodame Cantabile? Interestingly enough, the response to his "violence" among the fans is mixed as far as I see, with some who otherwise profess no discomfort with "girl-on-guy" violence protesting Chiaki's treatment of Nodame, sometimes strongly, despite a cartoonish depiction more akin to a physical boke-tsukkomi routine than the sometimes deadpan and eyebrow-raising use of female violence in anime.

Chiaki is one of the rare examples when slapstick violence is used from men to women. The only other example I can remember is Gin from Gintama, who sometimes beats up Kagura. I wonder how a father disciplining his disobedient daughter would be perceived by the fans - or is that also considered "domestic violence" nowadays.

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-15, 02:59

I understand the appeal of slapstick comedy, especially when it is done right. I even appreciate "black" humor, when a situation which is usually not humorous at all is made to look funny.

However, the problem is that this is too one-sided from girls to guys. It's like it's trying to project a message that guys are weaker than girls and cannot defend themselves. And what I find even more shocking is that male viewers seem to accept and love this idea.:confused:

You actually hold a large piece of the puzzle already:

It's not about the physical damage as much as the expression of domination that the beating up involves. Basically, the message is that men have to always do what women want and if they screw up even if unknowingly, they will be punished.

It's funny because the guy in question is getting pushed around by a woman, and social norms say that guys aren't supposed to get pushed around like that. Like a surprising amount of humour, there's some nasty ostracization going on beneath the surface there.

I would also allege that liking tsunderes in anime doesn't mean a guy wants to be dominated himself. While I wouldn't exactly call my choice in woman submissive (outside the occassional sex fantasy that I'm not going to share here), they do tend to be more shy and/or ladylike than your typical tsundere. Yet when it comes to anime, there's a few tsundere characters I really, really like - Taiga is hands down my favourite character in Toradora, in part because she can be so nasty at times.

BTW, the double standard doesn't just apply to violence. I wanted to throw a bit of a dom-sub routine into a story I'm working on for humour, but I figured that having a male character as the dominant one would be offensive. My solution? Have both characters involved be female.:D

Solafighter

2009-01-15, 04:27

Not always. Sometimes, Anime guys get slapped from girls for no reason at all.One example for all: Keitaro from Love Hina. A good 70% of the times, he gets kicked, punched, launched, bombed, blasted, strangled, burned senseless.And he just has to cope with it.

Well yeah thats neither cute nor something from my point of view. :uhoh:

There shall be a reason to be kicked, punched, launched, bombed, blasted, strangled and burned. :D

Egghead89

2009-01-15, 06:59

My solution? Have both characters involved be female.:D

So you can get a cute girl beaten up without feeling a bastard for liking it.
That's why the Sakuya/Meiling pairing from Touhou is an immense source of lulz. :D

But this still doesn't break the double-standard issue.

For example, returning to the Clannad genderswap:
One of the possible ways to get the "Male Tomoyo wails on Female Youhei" thing to work, is to make the first very, very, girly. Almost trap-like. And the second has to mock him for that: just like in the actual series, but genderflipped (if anybody recalls the quote "Tomoyo's breasts are detachable!", you'll have an idea of what I mean... :eyespin:)

Well yeah thats neither cute nor something from my point of view. :uhoh:

There shall be a reason to be kicked, punched, launched, bombed, blasted, strangled and burned. :D

Does bad luck count as a reason? :)

Solafighter

2009-01-15, 09:47

Does bad luck count as a reason? :)

Yes, indeed. :D

Amray

2009-01-16, 13:42

Does bad luck count as a reason? :)

I think that I speak for myself, and Solid Snake, when I state;

"Luck means nothing on the battlefield".

Being slapped by a girl cannot always be for a bad cause. She may just be slapping you to wake you up so that she can kiss you. ^_^
XXXX

kingsky123

2009-01-23, 18:31

depends how hard, and for what reason

Spectacular_Insanity

2009-01-24, 10:08

I think that I speak for myself, and Solid Snake, when I state;

"Luck means nothing on the battlefield".

I disagree. I would rather be lucky than skilled.

0utf0xZer0

2009-01-29, 15:24

I've said everything serious I have to say about this topic previously...

...but damn, some pictures of guys getting slapped by girls are super cute.
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/2329/tsunderemomentyz3pd2.th.jpg (http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tsunderemomentyz3pd2.jpg)

Egghead89

2009-01-29, 16:36

I've said everything serious I have to say about this topic previously...

...but damn, some pictures of guys getting slapped by girls are super cute.

I cannot agree anymore... :)
Tsundere-type slapping can be very adorable!

Psychopathic Otaku

2009-01-29, 20:45

I think it's kinda cute ^^ and really hot when it's 2 girls o_0 yuri ftw

SkyLight

2009-01-30, 02:17

I think it's kinda cute ^^ and really hot when it's 2 girls o_0 yuri ftw

Can't agree more :p

Tempester

2009-01-30, 23:36

Hey there. :blush:

I personally think that for both sexes, slapping can be justified in serious occasions. I was reminded of that scene in Citizen Kane where Kane slapped his wife for being a selfish brat. The context behind that slap was that he gave her everything she wanted yet complained she didn't get what she wanted. She was disgusting and selfish. That is an example of a "justified" slap. It doesn't matter whether it's male to female, female to male, male to male, female to female, sometimes people need a little slap in the face to get to their senses.

When it comes to comedic slaps, it doesn't matter either in my opinion. Slapstick humor on women by men has been carried out before, often in shoujo manga, and it's actually funny sometimes. I don't think I'm a male chauvinist because I don't condemn females physically abusing men and praise the other way around at the same time. :smile:

And for those who are sick of girls beating up boys all the time, watch Maria Holic. A girl is practically abused and treated like trash by a boy and it's all for the sake of comedy.

Edit: I'm not voting because the OP poster didn't give a choice in the poll for "slapping from both guys and girls is fine with me". Is it possible for a mod to add that choice?

Egghead89

2009-01-31, 05:12

When it comes to comedic slaps, it doesn't matter either in my opinion. Slapstick humor on women by men has been carried out before, often in shoujo manga, and it's actually funny sometimes. I don't think I'm a male chauvinist because I don't condemn females physically abusing men and praise the other way around at the same time. :smile:

Now this is what gender equality should be. I bow to you... :bow:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb153/Ganjalf89/pwn.jpg

Proto

2009-01-31, 20:30

In terms of a man abusing a woman I think Neuro's (from Majin Tantei Nougami Neuro treatment) of Yako easily takes the cake. From either genre. Comedic physical and mental torture taken to the extreme. :p

BlazingSoul

2009-02-01, 09:09

I don't know why but I think that when a girl hits a guy it's only excusable if the guy has done something offensive to the girl. For example if the guy's being an @ss, it's tolerable when a girl hits the guy. But when it's the other way around usually it's best if the guy tries to restrain it because the male gender has always been regarded as "brute and oppressive." It's found in history that the female gender has always been looked down upon on. It's up to the people if they want to follow even treatment but chivalry dictates that women are individuals that are needed to be protected or cared for with special treatment. I don't know. That's just me.

Tempester

2009-02-01, 17:22

I don't know why but I think that when a girl hits a guy it's only excusable if the guy has done something offensive to the girl. For example if the guy's being an @ss, it's tolerable when a girl hits the guy.

Correct, that is an example of a "justified" slap.

But when it's the other way around usually it's best if the guy tries to restrain it because the male gender has always been regarded as "brute and oppressive."

Brute and oppressive? If the girl is being a selfish stuck-up b!Tch, then she deserves a slap whether it's a guy or girl that does the slapping. She cannot be allowed to get away with what she's doing. That's like spoiling her. Girls that use "feminist" tactics (e.g. women are weaker than men so I can hit you but not vice versa) to justify their violent actions are just as brute and oppressive as guys who use their "higher strength" to physically bend girls to their will.

It's found in history that the female gender has always been looked down upon on. It's up to the people if they want to follow even treatment but chivalry dictates that women are individuals that are needed to be protected or cared for with special treatment. I don't know. That's just me.

So does that mean women should have a double standard and given rights over men? That leaves them looking down over men as men have looked down over women so long in the past. You don't stop a flood's damage by changing the direction of the flow. You must stop the flood altogether. What about men today? Why should they be "punished" for the brute and oppressive men of the past? Imagine if you were born into this world and your friend was allowed to hit you at their discretion just because their father was hit by your father.

I really don't have much against women. I just hate double-standards whether it's for guys or girls.

It's good that your post gives people a choice and doesn't force your opinions on others.

shinryou

2009-02-03, 06:38

I cannot agree anymore... :)
Tsundere-type slapping can be very adorable!

probably the thing that makes it most cute out of any other reason...

Egghead89

2009-02-04, 02:24

I was wondering if there's a manga or anime that has a scene where a girl gets hit and becomes a Twinkle in the Sky (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ATwinkleInTheSky)...

EDIT: Excluding Jessie from Pokémon.

velvet

2009-02-04, 03:48

Exactly. If EF: A Tale of Melodies taught me anything, it's that abused girls are incredibly moe.

...I'm a bad, bad person, aren't I?

:eyebrow: You are a si-- *shake hands* Welcome aboard.:heh:

Lonestar9

2009-02-04, 12:58

(That said, I can understand why a lot of guys don't do anything. I've had a girl in my anime club jab me in the ribs with a kendo stick and another smack me in the back of the head at a restaurant over utterly trivial stuff. By the time I mentally recovered from either, the chance to make an appropriate response had passed.)[/QUOTE]

This is the most sensible thing I've read. It's probably too hard to react quickly enough in that kind of situation. For me, I would try to stop a slap by anyone, girl or not. I'm no kid anymore, lol, but in my younger days I had the same thought pattern.

As for slapping in anime, eh, while on occasion I can see it's funny, or the guy deserved it, for the most part I don't think it's enjoyable or something to laugh at.

HayashiTakara

2009-02-04, 13:30

To me it depends on the situation. If its something innocent then I don't mind. If its violent heroines like Naru who's quick to throw a punch. I think the guy should at least block, evade, whatever the hit.

I don't like the gender card. It makes girls think they can get away with things just because of whats between their legs. Whatever happen to the female rights movements? Didn't females wanted to be treated the same as males? If a female bully/bitch/all of the above, is in a manga/anime. I prefer for something like this to happen:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v604/asianknight20/18-2.jpg

Rather than a simple payback of tears and woe is me moment.

Amray

2009-02-04, 14:05

I disagree. I would rather be lucky than skilled.

I would not. Luck can occur to anyone that feels it or thinks that they have it. Therefore I would rather be skilled as I will still have the abilities to do specific things, yet luck may come at me too. If I were an individual that did not believe in luck then I would still have my skills to save my life.

In conclusion, if you have the skills then you cannot lose as you may get lucky as well as just be skilled. If an individual is just simply lucky but lacks in skills in other areas then that is all they will be and there is always the chance that that luck will perish when not careful. That is when ones ability to be able to carry out tasks becomes useful.

Narona

2009-02-07, 08:37

Brute and oppressive? If the girl is being a selfish stuck-up b!Tch, then she deserves a slap whether it's a guy or girl that does the slapping. She cannot be allowed to get away with what she's doing. That's like spoiling her. Girls that use "feminist" tactics (e.g. women are weaker than men so I can hit you but not vice versa) to justify their violent actions are just as brute and oppressive as guys who use their "higher strength" to physically bend girls to their will.

I think it's rather because the men, in majority, are way stronger than the women. So, if an angry man who doesn't restrain himself slaps a girl, it can harm her a whole lot more than when a girl slaps a guy.

Didn't females wanted to be treated the same as males?
It depends on what. A woman is not a man, and even if we ask, for example, the same salaries as men because we are as good as them in many jobs, I am part of those who want to be seen as a woman, not as a man without a penis. It includes, for example, to not be criticized/discriminated at work for being pregnant.

On the matter of "slaps", it is also linked to what I said above. The men are in general stronger than women, and can hurt a person a lot more even with a simple "slap".

Imperial Blaze

2009-02-07, 08:41

A girl giving you a slap is 95% of your fault......get over it....

Tempester

2009-02-08, 20:04

I think it's rather because the men, in majority, are way stronger than the women. So, if an angry man who doesn't restrain himself slaps a girl, it can harm her a whole lot more than when a girl slaps a guy. On the matter of "slaps", it is also linked to what I said above. The men are in general stronger than women, and can hurt a person a lot more even with a simple "slap".

Being a weak scrawny guy, I admit I cannot really connect the above paragraph to my life. Many women who are even slightly athletic can beat me in arm-wrestling. :heh:

So maybe I'll take your words for true then: that men are much stronger than women and should not be allowed to slap them.

But me being the equal-freak feminist-masculinist that I am, I must say that the women must hold back their slaps also if they want to truly be treated on the same level of men. I'm all cool with all you girls gaining men's rights and all, but you must either give up your women's privileges (slapping guys, wearing skirts) or give them to men. I don't want any "well I can do this because I'm a girl and you can't but I still want equal treatment." That's contradictory and women will never gain their equal treatment with a attitude for double-standards.

It depends on what. A woman is not a man, and even if we ask, for example, the same salaries as men because we are as good as them in many jobs, I am part of those who want to be seen as a woman, not as a man without a penis. It includes, for example, to not be criticized/discriminated at work for being pregnant.

No problem. I'm all for that. I also want to be treated as an equal person and not a man who must give double-standards to women just because I'm a "tough man who must deal with it", which I'm not.

A girl giving you a slap is 95% of your fault......get over it....

Hmm, ok, ok, wait a sec? Are you talking to everyone on this thread? There are girls here you know, but your post seems to be directed only towards guys. Girls reading your post will just get the image of another girl slapping them. And it gives the illusion that you are replying to the woman above you, which is even more confusing. Confusing. :eyespin:

klowny

2009-02-08, 20:14

I think it's funny when girls slap guys/guys slap girls, but that's just in anime's.

i can't single out gender because that would mean to me that i'm discriminating (i have a weird way of thinking :D )

i don't like violence much but its around us so we can't escape it :cool:

There's no excuse to hitting someone except maybe when your defending yourself but you can't do something like break their arm or leg or possibly kill them :)

Irenicus

2009-02-08, 21:19

[slightly off topic]

But me being the equal-freak feminist-masculinist that I am, I must say that the women must hold back their slaps also if they want to truly be treated on the same level of men. I'm all cool with all you girls gaining men's rights and all, but you must either give up your women's privileges (slapping guys, wearing skirts) or give them to men. I don't want any "well I can do this because I'm a girl and you can't but I still want equal treatment." That's contradictory and women will never gain their equal treatment with a attitude for double-standards.
That reminds me of an article I've read a while back about the conflicts within the counterculture movements of the 60's and 70's following the Stonewall riots. Transvestites (+ transsexuals et al.)were insistent that they should be treated equally as anybody else; "traditional" feminists were outraged that the "freaks" dare to demand something like that as if their cause was as worthy as mainstream feminism. Words like bitches and freaks and fags were thrown around a lot. A bit ugly, but that's prejudice for you.

Mind, many feminists who opposed the "freaks" at the time nowadays state openly that they regret being prejudiced as such. It just shows how complex gender identities and accorded social norms are, I guess. Differences do exist so which point should be equal under all circumstances and where should differences be acknowledged and accommodated for? Pregnancy was brought up and that used to be a big issue and remains an issue still. Women who are pregnant often have to take time off their careers so will they be accommodated as such at this career disadvantage or will the employers just dump all responsibilities on the employee? What about childcare and the like? Is it fair to provide childcare facilities in the workplace at the employer's expense? Etc., etc.

And oh yes, like you I think a normal girl can beat me down any day. So "boys stronger than girls" is something that I can't quite get my head around completely.

[/off topic]

A girl giving you a slap is 95% of your fault......get over it....
No offense, but that's a pretty immature attitude to take. There are as many kinds of girls as there are girls in the world and I'm pretty sure you'll find quite a few whose slaps and physical abuses are not at all "justified" by circumstances at hand.

MidnightViper88

2009-02-08, 22:03

Kafriel

2009-02-09, 07:13

Girls slapping guys? If slaps are overkill you'd have a heart attack watching girls beating up otakus or throwing powerful punches etc...
Well, slaps are fine, as long there's a reason behind it.

MidnightViper88

2009-02-11, 16:55

You know, maybe it's the fighter in me, but uhh...

Does it annoy anyone else that the guys never bother to block an incoming attack or slap?

OH-OH-OH, THAT REMINDS ME

Negima Vol. 14, Period 123: Madoka Kugimiya arrives at a seemingly uncompromising situation where Negi Springfield (Under the "Nagi Springfield" identity) and Kotaro Inugami (Under the Kotaro Murakami identity) walk in on a half-undressed Ako Izumi. This prompts Madoka to slap Nagi, where Nagi takes it. Madoka attempts to slap Kotaro next, but Kotaro blocks the oncoming slap. Madoka, taken off by this, instead punches Kotaro square in the face with her fist. Immediately following that, Kotaro simply states "That hurt", which warrants Kotaro a hard forward smack square in the face with her palm.

I've provided a scan of the manga panels, inside the spoiler tags for size...

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b361/KravinMorhead/NegimaVol14Period123scan.jpg

That's why guys don't try to block or dodge a woman's slap; They retaliate with a more brutal assault... :p

SkyLight

2009-02-11, 22:03

Damn right :p

Pixelation

2009-03-05, 21:15

I think more about the situation than the sex of the characters involved when determining how I feel when characters hit each other. Male or female, slapping people isn't 'ok', it's degrading to the other person. However, a righteous smack can be satisfying and a slapstick smack can be funny:

The Righteous Smack:

Sometimes when a character is being especially cruel or nasty, the situation just screams for a righteous smack. This doesn't magically make hitting people ok, but the slapper (and usually the audience) feel that it was well deserved.

The Slapstick Smack:

Sometimes a character is smacked just for being an 'idiot'. I think the important thing here is the delivery. It has to 'feel' like a humorous blow to be acceptable. If seeing the target smacked around makes you feel like they're being abused instead, then it simply fails at being slapstick.

The Composure Smack:

Sometimes a character is hysterical and there's no time to coddle them back to reality. Enter the '100% Effective Magical Slap of Composure!'. Use only as directed.

These are considered more or less 'acceptable' in anime as well as other entertainment media. However, things become awkward when there's a serious smack with poor justification, or when comedic violence falls flat. This can leave people wondering things like 'This is kinda wrong...' or 'Why is he/she always hitting him/her?' And because of everyone will read a scene differently, a particular smack may seem 'acceptable' to some and 'unwaranted' to others.

Click for some anime examples (which you may or may not agree with...)

Watching Full Metal Panic Fumoffu, I enjoyed the slapstick violence, never once thinking in terms of abuse. Sousuke was a strong lead who could easily handle Chidori's bumps and bruises, plus the things he got smacked around for really were his fault.

Watching Love Hina, I felt that the Keitaro was too often and too unfairly brutalized. He was clearly affected by Naru and the girl's beatings, plus the things he got smacked around for were never his fault. I did not find it amusing.

In the first episode of Lovely Complex, Koizumi smacks Otoni for being all depressed, only to get smacked by him later when she finds herself in the same situation. While she did kinda expect to be taken easy on for being a girl, it a good example of some (more or less) equal rough-housing between a girl and a guy. There should be more of this two-way behavior in anime...

Itazura na Kiss had several male-to-female slaps that could be regarded as anything from justified to offensive depending on the viewer's perspective. The only one I thought played out well is when Sudou slaps Matsumoto to keep her from leaving the hospital. It's really awkward for a second, then she smacks him back three times as hard (breaking the tension and making it funny).

Godai-AK

2009-03-17, 19:52

Coming in a little late to the discussion, but I find the whole topic pretty interesting. Yes, I think there is truth to the idea that because of the history of gender relations, the image of a man hitting a woman is more threatening than a woman hitting a man. But I think that things are also a little more complicated than that.

For me, some of it depends on how the characters are written. If the beating is so over the top that it defies the laws of physics, and under normal circumstances the girl cannot possibly beat the guy in a fight, the guy is genuinely being an ass, and the girl is otherwise very likeable, then the situation is so ridiculous I really can't get offended. Ranma and Akane in Ranma 1/2 being the prime example- Ranma's clearly a much better fighter than she is, and can be a cocky bastard without a filter between his brain and his mouth, her "beatings" are something out of a Looney Tunes cartoon (she doesn't pummel him, just punts him into orbit) and generally speaking she's pretty likeable. Plus the girl was physically assaulted by boys every morning before class, so I can understand why she's a little sensitive to anything remotely sexual.

Anything less than that, like Naru in Love Hina, I'm not that comfortable with - she peeked in on him naked once, and -she- still beat -him- up. I'll admit that it's a fine line, but I think that Naru crossed the line between something I could brush off or laugh at and something that's off-putting and a little nasty.

Also, what if we introduce variables to even out the "balance of power"? What if it's between a teenage girl or woman and an 11 year old boy? Others have mentioned girl vs girl - I always wondered how it would have played out in "El Hazard" if Allielle and Fatora, lesbians who will hit on anything with a vagina - were beaten up and punted into the air a la so many male perverts in anime.

idiffer

2009-03-18, 05:19

if the man is at fault, sure its okay. but then again i have to agree with Tempester that sometimes the girl is just a bitch and needs to be slapped herself. and someone said about hurting the girl too much...you can always lift one hand as if to hit and while the girl is surprised, you grope her with the other. (hope i wont get banned for this)
This thread is turning into a man/woman rights thread, lol.
Agree with Godai-AK, the stuff in love hina almost made me puke. it was so unjustified.

KitsuneNineTails

2009-03-18, 13:53

My favorite anime smack has to be in Noein. Haruka gets smacked upside the head on two occasions (by the same person, in a way, watch the anime for the punchline ;)), and BOTH times Haruka immediately throws a *smack* right back, without even flinching (even when she was in BSOD mode). Gotta love the fiery spunkiness, methinks.

Oh and it was a girl slapping another girl, so no gender tangents to worry about (yay!).

But offhand, I'd have to say I agree that the "correctness" of the slapping depends more on situation than gender, IMHO. "Cute" slapping usually is either a) obviously over the top and therefore hard to take seriously or b) obviously not a full force "I want to physically hurt this person" sort of blow (ie. Kaname with her fan o' doom is just trying to get Sagara's attention off his latest insanity more than anything). Girl-girl, boy-girl, boy-boy, either way. An older girl hitting a young boy would seem very creepy to me, as would a guy hitting a girl with the intention of hurting her (instead of just "snapping her out of it", etc.).

Ciao!

justavisitor

2009-03-18, 14:17

other ppl probably have mentioned this, but in the manga "suzuka" (it has anime adaption as well), suzuka has been slapping the male lead non-stop throughout the manga..and she sometimes slaps multiple times in some "slap incident"

those scenes were funny and actually heart-warming lol..somewhat ( I remember a scene suzuka slaps the male lead and then gives him a kiss :heh:)..but I wonder is there any male in real life who can take this kind of abuse 24/7 :D

danin8r44

2009-03-18, 14:38

idiffer

2009-03-18, 15:14

Godai-AK

2009-03-18, 17:59

all this leads me to think it is a subconcious desire of SM play of the japaneese male population.

I think part of it is also that girls aren't expected to be stronger than guys, so it's "funnier" that way.

"Man bites dog" will always get more attention than "Dog bites man".

Egghead89

2009-03-19, 07:16

I've always had a problem with male abuse by females being so common in anime. My problem with it isn't that the girl is hitting the guy, there are always violent girls. It is that their actions are then "justified" with an off comment somewhere along the lines of "oh well they are a good person at heart..." As if that allows them to constantly physically and mentally abuse any person within an X foot radius.

Yeah, that bugs me too.
I mean, the whole Keitaro Bashing thing is meant to be funny, but I can't deny I felt goddamn sorry for him sometimes (even though he's "immortal").

Naru is violent indeed... and so is Louise form Zero no Tsukaima: in Chapter 2 of the second light novel, she whips Saito so much that he passes out from pain.
Now, there should be a border line between slapstick violence and plain abuse.
I can't blame those Naru Bashers and Louise Haters (and I'm not one of them) for wanting to see them have a taste of their own medicine! :mad:

The closest thing to a "Female Unlucky Immortal Punchbag" (I couldn't come out with a better name, sorry :heh:) is Kanako from Maria Holic.
In episode 4, she gets stampeded from Ryuuken's fans (hurting her badly in the process), but in the next scene (http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb153/Ganjalf89/lolz.jpg), she gets bandaged up and fully recovers in very little time (her eyepatch even disappears (http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb153/Ganjalf89/pwnt.jpg) some seconds later).
Further in the episode, she is sent flying to the wall and smacked to the ground by the same people, but she has no wounds.

Could it be that she shares the same Immortality power that Keitaro, Saito and Youhei Sunohara have? :)

0utf0xZer0

2009-03-19, 10:08

Naru is violent indeed... and so is Louise form Zero no Tsukaima: in Chapter 2 of the second light novel, she whips Saito so much that he passes out from pain.
Now, there should be a border line between slapstick violence and plain abuse.
I can't blame those Naru Bashers and Louise Haters (and I'm not one of them) for wanting to see them have a taste of their own medicine! :mad:

I was under the impression that novel Saito is much more of a dick than anime Saito, although I'm not sure he did anything to deserve something like what you describe. I still find the scene at the end of the first episode of season two in the anime to be one of the funniest girl beating guy moments ever either way.

Anyway, another example of a guy hitting a girl, played entirely serious: Yuu hitting Chihiro in EF: A Tale of Memories. I still wonder if this scene would have been disturbing had the person hitting her been equal in age rather than her guardian.

Yukinokesshou

2009-03-19, 14:08

I think it's rather because the men, in majority, are way stronger than the women. So, if an angry man who doesn't restrain himself slaps a girl, it can harm her a whole lot more than when a girl slaps a guy.

On the matter of "slaps", it is also linked to what I said above. The men are in general stronger than women, and can hurt a person a lot more even with a simple "slap".

Generally, but not always, and "way stronger" is probably an exaggeration.

My personal stance is as follows: (1) striking except in self-defence is wrong regardless of one's sex or apparent strength, and (2) everyone, male or female, has a right to self defence with reasonable force. Strength can be brought into the discussion on reasonable force, but it is important to observe the evidence before jumping to conclusions (i.e. do not blame the man before you look at him and look at the woman).

It depends on what. A woman is not a man, and even if we ask, for example, the same salaries as men because we are as good as them in many jobs, I am part of those who want to be seen as a woman, not as a man without a penis. It includes, for example, to not be criticized/discriminated at work for being pregnant.

In the context of your example, I agree. My main issue with the present state of men and women in society is as follows...

If I am expected to act like a gentleman, then I expect to be treated like a gentleman.
If I am expected to treat someone like a lady, then I would expect her to behave like a lady.

I'm completely fine with equality of the sexes, but what irritates me is the fact that we are at a juncture where despite equality being upheld, traditional expectations of the "gentleman" still persist whilst women are not expected to be "ladies" anymore (indeed, expecting "lady-like" behaviour can be interpreted as sexism!). Either do away with both gentlemanly and lady-like behaviour, or keep both.

P.S. Anime slaps are okay for comedic value :heh:

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 14:38

Eh the general notion that females hitting males is ok kind of perpetuates the constant call of racisits that women want it both ways but in actuallity our evolutionary purposes are different, so other than same work same pay principal there are fundamental differences between men and women, and considering that both sides of the extreme make the middle seem farfetched I think if the "slap" or hit is playful unintentional a man should take it, not because its a manly thing but because the stigma of responding to such a gesture is negatively precieved by society which just makes the situation more complicated from a mans standpoint.

Also Lovehina? Really I felt it was fine, considering Keitaro was getting blasted away in a clearly comical fashion and a clearly exaggerated fashion that it really felt ok, because Love hina in itself is this outrageous work that takes promises, actions to their very extreme, hence the shounen genre.

Yukinokesshou

2009-03-19, 14:40

if the "slap" or hit is playful unintentional a man should take it, not because its a manly thing but because the stigma of responding to such a gesture is negatively precieved by society which just makes the situation more complicated from a mans standpoint.

The bolded bit is exactly what I have an issue with. Equal rights, but society places more responsibility and expectations on men. Otherwise, I agree with you. Playful slaps are just that: playful, and I wouldn't mind one coming from a woman I love.

[Edit] Hmm... yes, I agree that the comedic fashion is why slaps in anime are generally acceptable.

[Edit 2] Sometimes I do feel that a minority of women "want it both ways". Even as they demand equal rights, they are all too happy to hide behind the protection that society affords them. I've heard women say things like "My company is sexist because 80% of the executives are male" one day... and then, "I wouldn't want to marry a guy who earns less than me" the next day.

If you think logically, how does that work out? To get a girlfriend or wife, a man would have to aim for higher qualifications and positions because that's what society expects of him. In the meantime, women are attracted to men with higher positions and salaries, but as soon as they look at the statistics, they start complaining about the "gender imbalance" in high-paying and professional jobs.

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 14:47

Interesting thread.
I think girls slapping guys in anime is overdone, seriously in the beginning it was funny (the time around Ranma) but now it kinda gets annoying. Girls slapping guys for now reason or because they have goddamn anger issues isn't right! They must learn that at some point someone might slap freaking back. No and I don't want to say with that that guys should slap back! Violence shouldn't be the answer. But I think if a girl goes around and slaps everyone she thinks deserved it someone might slap back.
If the slap has a good reason, like insulting the family or making fun of something really serious (like ehm...for example a friend disappears on the way to school and no one knows where said friend is and someone makes fun of it even after being told to stop). I think in such cases even a guy is allowed to slap a girl, if he is able of controlling his strength (girls of course should know to how to control their strength before slapping). I think it's okay...not good but somehow acceptable.

I get a slap almost every week for reason like making an awkward comment or to make fun of something....My poor glasses T_T

idiffer

2009-03-19, 14:57

I get a slap almost every week for reason like making an awkward comment or to make fun of something....My poor glasses T_T

poor you, cant think of how you live with it. i mean come on, AWKWARD COMMENT? that is no reason to be slapped! then again its your life, not my buisness...
back to topic. I think that if an anime emits a feel that "everything's fine, the guy's okay and doesnt really care", that doesnt cut it, when it comes to actual plot and character development, especially in love comedies. its only okay for me in slap stick comedies with no plot.

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 15:04

@kitsu, really? The tsundere has very few means of effectively show her bipolar self to the protaganist or love interest. When it comes to tsun tsun, I would say anything goes because it offers character development, and its really the opposite of what their trying to express but because of embarassment or lack of expeirence the only thing that comes out is the cold cold hand to the face.

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 15:33

I can live with that because it doesn't hurt me. Only my glasses (which I don't like) are the problem. I'm used to it by now and at least she apologizes most of the time. And as long I'm the only one that gets slapped it's fine..if she starts to slap other people, too I might need to have a serious talk with her. And sometimes I deserve it

@Nosauz
Lack of experience and not knowing how to express themselves isn't a good excuse . but okay fine...still it's really overdone by now. It's nothing new that's why I think that the whole Tsundere joke isn't really funny anymore, also if it such a reason like not knowing how to express themselves then slapping back is the best way to show them it isn't correct to slap or beat up other people
And if you were implying said girl which slaps me is a tsundere..then..I hope not, also she is normally really nice and isn't violent at all...only I get slapped by her.

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 15:38

The fact that they are drawings and the fact that these are works of fiction already add to the reasons why this behavior is ok, its not like anime and to the most extent fiction are social commentary. Theres room for suspension of disbelief, and with exaggerated gestures its fine. Really its not like anime is meant to teach us anything, one can look at in a deeper way but its main goal is to entertain the viewer, if it happens to bring up social commentary thats fine because its main goal is one of entertainment. The fact that everything is required to be PC kind of feeds into the censorship stuff that I just can't stand. If the girl didn't do those things, the story would not be the same, lets just be frank, we watch anime/read books/manga to escape from reality and to a lesser extent to escape the confines of this real world, the purpose is to entertain if a story is written as such doesn't make it in proper.

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 15:46

Of course I have nothing against Tsundere characters and such, but still I think it's really overdone by now. i really like Love Hina for example. Like I said in the beginning it was funny. (okay love hina isn't quite the beginning) People need to create something knew though it's really difficult.

idiffer

2009-03-19, 15:55

I agree that its just old. Its not entertaining anymore. and also the whole art form called Anime is a huge social commentary on the japaneese way and view of life, even if its not intended. anime is not meant to teach us, but it does... some lost people, not always with positive results.

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 15:59

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 16:10

I know what you mean. You need to write so that most of the target audience likes it. And if it is to write almost the same stuff again then you have to do it. But in my Opinion the story loses it meaning with that. And before you start ranting... Every story has a meaning, that meaning doesn't need to teach us anything but still every story has a meaning, something personal the author wants to show the world. But if the author just takes one stereotype after another and mix them in one story I think the meaning of story telling gets lost. Story telling in it's origin is creating something new.
Also Love Hina was a filler for me, when I got nothing to do and was waiting for a chapter of my favorites to come out I read it. The same for all of Akamatsu's work. It wasn't something that really fascinated me

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 16:17

idiffer

2009-03-19, 16:17

I just think your taking the fiction aspect a little to lightly. Story telling unlike reallife needs to be embellished, I know I embellish all the time when it comes to retelling a "funny story" to the guys because you know what, the reason you tell a story is to get your target audience excited and interested in what you have to say. And in this case the over exaggerated physical touching is meant to drive across a point. I just find it really irritating because the call for PC work, and "non derivative" work is very general arguement. If you look at Love Hina its what all Harem mangas strive to be, the characters are well thought out, in the end to a leser degree you end up liking all the girls, and the male lead though a complete moron is quite interesting, and when you look at it in that stand point the slappig/hitting help differentiate and acted as a foil to the other subtle actions the girls had with keitaro. Really I don't find slapping and hitting as cliche because so are many many many other things in that sense it really is context senstive so I just find the whole slapping thing a none issue, though in real life its a much different story.

1) i think you're taking the reality/believebility aspect too lightly. its a very important part of anime and movies and books alike. (see your last sentance)
2) why does hitting a guy with no obvious reason is most likely to get the audience interested? (heres the time to think about the japaneese people and their twisted way of thinking)
3) so what is the point that physical touching is supposed to drive across?
4) what is PC and non derivative work?
5) yeah. i'm taking this too seriously, but i cant restrain myself, lol.

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 16:24

There is nothing orginal in modern fiction, thats what I see here, most stories are done to death, and the more learned you are the more this becomes obvious, why then are critics able to discern good story telling from bad? The reason is we are all unique, and even if it may be a cliched theme, the method the story is told depends on the uniqueness that we all possess. Since previous ficitional stories pretty much encompass all of fiction and motifs are borrowed from past works does it make them not good? I find stuff like Ender's Game quite entertaining even though it has borrowed quite a bit from the scifi genre, my whole point is derivative or not, the way the story is told is important, if you don't like the story thats your thing, but criticize it solely based on your view that it is derivative while not acknowledging the derivative nature of fiction seems a bit baffling.

We have in german a saying which goes:
"Das Rad neu erfinden" which means "To invent the wheel new". Do you get the meaning of that sentence? Of course I can work with Tsundere in my stories, but i need to invent them new. change them so they become unique. Explore the possibilities. But most Tsundere are all alike that's the problem. It's all the same, that's why I can't get myself to watch Toradora. the main character Taiga is like all Tsundere and has nothing unique, even so her story differs with those of the other Tsundere the character is almost the same. And I always thought persons are individuals.

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 16:29

PC=Politically Correct, nonderivative=original, again original work in fiction is very hard to comeby why? because as a writer one of the main things you do is read, lots and lots of reading and that knowledge becomes part of your writing, so no matter how "innovative" it is there are hints homeages to works that you've previously read, your own style is just an amalgamation of your personality and the amount of research/reading you have done, so when it comes to story telling the idea of orginal is very hard to take seriously. I never said a girl hitting a guy is right, but I did say its context sensitive. Honestly a character hitting another character develops the character exposing likes and dislikes, exposes the personality of the character, there actions act as foils for others actions to similar actions or situations.

I really don't get why fans have to input and want to change the way a story is written, other than cases of severe truncation and blatant bad writing, the idea that a story belongs to the fan is asinine, the world is created by the author and to an extent the author is allowed domain over what he has created, and if s/he chooses to use a one form or another to express certain feelings its up to the other not the patron. Even when there is bad writing thats at the hands of the author, which envitably means that maybe when fans project themselves into a work of fiction, the connection made is too deep. I just feel that it really is a non issue because changing that aspect of say Love Hina changes the entire dynamic between keitaro and Naru and to some extent Mikoto.

@kitsu

I guess your not a fan of most rom com films or god forbid an action film, hollywood is highly derivative, and again the idea of reinventing the wheel is rediculous. Its a friggin wheel, just because you use a different material doesn't change the fact its a wheel, just because you change the diameter doesn't change the fact that its a wheel. Once you accept the derivativeness of fiction, and actually see the writer for their personality and their expeirences then you can truly appreciate a "derivate" work.

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 16:41

@Nosauz

Nope, i don't like most of those films that's why I always quarrel with my family. I don't like those movies because I really can predict everything because I know it from somewhere else.
Haha...you can't reinvent a wheel...that's strange what about a ehm let's say rim..after all it's a wheel...but you wouldn't call it wheel. Or a bicycle wheel differs from the one of a car, but it's still a wheel isn't it? Strange isn't it?

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 16:49

reinvention is an oxymoron, a bicycle wheel is based on a wheel... thats my whole point, to see its genius or lack of genius is whats important... a turntable is a wheel... anyway I'm done discussing this with you because clearly you don't even acknowledge my arguement choosing to nitpick... but then again I tried to convince you and I failed.. no loss.

Kitsu

2009-03-19, 16:53

Fine with me^^ ^But you seem to have over read something in the start
-Of course I can work with Tsundere in my stories, but i need to invent them new. change them so they become unique. Explore the possibilities.

-a bicycle wheel is based on a wheel
is what you say and I said nothing against it still...

it was changed wasn't it? And my problem is that those "wheels" doesn't change anymore.

Irenicus

2009-03-19, 16:58

I really don't get why fans have to input and want to change the way a story is written, other than cases of severe truncation and blatant bad writing, the idea that a story belongs to the fan is asinine, the world is created by the author and to an extent the author is allowed domain over what he has created, and if s/he chooses to use a one form or another to express certain feelings its up to the other not the patron. Even when there is bad writing thats at the hands of the author, which envitably means that maybe when fans project themselves into a work of fiction, the connection made is too deep. I just feel that it really is a non issue because changing that aspect of say Love Hina changes the entire dynamic between keitaro and Naru and to some extent Mikoto.
Fans are audiences. Audiences do that. If audiences don't like the slappings, who are you -- even if you're the author, God, or Roger Ebert, who's a few steps above God -- to tell anyone they are wrong? To tell anyone they should take it like it is like a blank page of paper to be written on? To tell them their reactions -- the second half of all interactions -- are way off? Audiences are full of life, full of prejudices, full of responses, and fully capable of changing the meaning of a work for themselves. Once an author presents something out to the public in concrete form, that's it. The work's on its own, and an author who comes back and say "oh, I don't intend* it this way; you're reading it wrong" is, well, wrong.

*"I didn't mean it to be racist!" is a common example of this.

Note that I'm not disagreeing with you on everything or something like that, as you and countless others before you have said the reactions tend to be based on highly context-sensitive points (and unclarified universal denunciations either way seems to show a shallowness of viewpoint, quite) but this assertion just asks to be refuted.

^That was actually the TL;DR of a long post that I cut out because the theoretical aspects and examples I described in detail are probably way off topic.

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 16:58

One last note, the wheel does change, at least in akamatsu's work, the "severe" beatings are brought up in naru's internal dialogue, and her "change" to not smack the living daylights out of keitaro play a very important role in her overall character development. If thats derivative then I don't know what you would want. Also it really shows akumatsu's playfulness with his characters and treating them as unique individuals.

@Irenicus

I really could careless about what people actually think about a work of fiction hell even nonfiction, my point was changing how a story is written fundamentally changes the story. And if you can't accept the story for what it is then maybe the viewer should go reflect on some other things. Its ok to oppose an idea of say violence that is gender biased but really most of the times its context senstive and because people were making generalizations of voilence from females directed at males. You can interpret a work in any way you want but nothing gives you the right to change someone elses work and claim it as that persons work, or a "better" version. Projecting what you want from a work of fiction is fine but demanding that it fit to your standards is not only the crippling of creative freedom but in itself a very ignorant standpoint. Unfortuanetly my previous post did not state this opinion but that was what i was aiming for.

Yukinokesshou

2009-03-19, 17:33

It's all the same, that's why I can't get myself to watch Toradora. the main character Taiga is like all Tsundere and has nothing unique, even so her story differs with those of the other Tsundere the character is almost the same. And I always thought persons are individuals.

Taiga is actually one of the better tsundere characters in the sense that it is possible to forget about her tsundere-ness at times, especially in the second half of the series. Take away the punches, and Taiga's personality still shines through, which is more than I can say for most other tsundere characters. In other words, there's a lot more to Taiga than tsundere.

Honestly, give Toradora a try. Taiga is somewhat unique and much more realistic than any other tsundere I've seen in anime.

Irenicus

2009-03-19, 17:41

^If people dislike the idea of girls slapping guys in a story enough to come up and complain about it (or, hey, make a thread about it :) ), aren't you barring their creative freedom by telling them to go off and do something else?

And, quite frankly, I suspect most authors know damn well once you throw something off to the public you lose most of your power over it. There's this one theory out there, it's telling a rather radical but quite interesting idea: a piece of work (them theorists call it pretentiously, the "text") is not only appreciated differently by each person -- it changes, in the fullest sense of the word, as it goes from one person to another. So, in this case, someone who reads Love Hina, finds Naru's little power trip horrifying, knows the work not as just "Love Hina" but "Love Hina, with Naru's little power trip that horrified me," and so on and so forth. No work ever really stands on its own, floating on some infinite empty space. Your Love Hina is a Love Hina that will include primarily the manga in hand of course, but also the mood that you read it in, the opinions you've heard of it, the prejudices you carried with you into it, your knowledge of prior derivative works of this nature, your cultural background, even the very way you read is different from anybody else's; all those "little" things. The "slap" is thus a very different thing from one person to another. They go way more radical and complicated than this (try Mel Gibson's Hamlet) but I'll stop there.

A more concrete example would be a certain famous book by a tragic young diarist, Anne Frank. It's just a well-written little book by an imaginative young girl who fell in love, who was confined and persecuted, eventually murdered, and who grew up with a diary by her side. But once it got thrown into a public desperate for voices of humanity from the victims of the tragedy in question, it became a masterpiece. The audiences made it a masterpiece. Her words, which I doubt were written with a premonition of death in mind (the diary ended before she and her family were captured), became the haunting voices that they are because of the context recognized neither by the author nor even the text of the book, but rather by the audience's knowledge of it.

Likewise, the audience can shun something, call for a book burning session, or some other utterly ridiculous reaction, and it'd still be a part of the work for them. According to this theory at least. There are always competing viewpoints.

Yukinokesshou

2009-03-19, 17:53

^If people dislike the idea of girls slapping guys in a story enough to come up and complain about it (or, hey, make a thread about it :) ), aren't you barring their creative freedom by telling them to go off and do something else?

If you're referring to me, then a quick read of the last two pages will reveal that I actually take an active interest in this discussion and also have quite a lot to complain about :heh:

I was referring to a specific example in my last post. I have little fondness for the hackneyed tsundere archetype but I enjoyed Toradora so much that I felt I should make a stand for it.

Irenicus

2009-03-19, 18:08

If you're referring to me, then a quick read of the last two pages will reveal that I actually take an active interest in this discussion and also have quite a lot to complain about :heh:
Oh no! I'm sorry. I was responding to the poster exactly one post above you. I didn't see your post when I was typing it. :heh:

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 18:43

Godai-AK

2009-03-19, 19:25

See that's where I differ from you, I precieve a work as a piece of work, any additional oppinions about are irrelavent to its true intentions. If some one is displeased with it so be it, true its purpose and meaning may change as people refer to it in the future or the present but its essence is what the author creates, and to the author and all who precieve fiction/text the way i do value the authors opinion. Its just a view of a story created by the author nothing more nothing less. trying to incorporate ones feelings about a work do nothing to the work other than acknowledging its existance. The opinion may validate its existance but in the end the work of an author is just that like a child it carries his/her essence within its words.

I think that most of us responding to the thread here believe that the work is the work, independent of the author. I do have an interest in the author's opinion or intent, but not to the point where it would color my own personal impression of the work one way or the other. Author's intent is not completely meaningless, but after a while the work can become so removed from the author that his or her "essence" starts to fade away from importance.

Are your own impressions of a story always overridden by the author's intent?

And even accepting that "author's intent" is law, any kind of creative endeavor is both a highly conscious and subconcsious activity. There will be ideas that an author is putting into his or her work that they're not even consciously aware of. For instance, a lot of people may share bigoted preconceptions, but don't consider themselves racist. If any of them put their ideas down in a story, you don't believe that that could be reflected in their writing, even if it's not their intent?

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 20:05

My thinking process about a work is based on information given by the author, information about the author, historical context in which is written to get where the author is coming from. I beleive my stance is more of the historian approach to literature and history which isn't suited for all. The author's intent is merely a guide to interpreting the story and since the historical context to a story is actually quite influential in how its written and its style I find it valueable information to actually attempt to judge a work of fiction or history. I rarely take anything for face value, and at the end of the day when our opinions have faded, the work itself will remain. And in this case opinions don't really matter to a work, because new eyes and new ears will eventually find that work again even if its lost in obscurity. When I read Dune, I truly get a sense of where Herbert's coming from, it doesn't mean I think all of his writing is fantastic, actually is some parts of Children of Dune I almost gave up reading because it felt like a chore, but after I read it I went back to analyze it and I could see where he got his ideas, why he chose certain things, and what some of the motifs and homages were. This applies to C.S Lewis and Tolkein and whole slew of other authors that I love. It doesn't change the fact that sometimes their writing was unbelievable uneloiquent even though most critics say their the creme of the crop when it comes to fantasy. An author's essence never is detached from his/her work unless its adapted and changed, as long as what the original says is still intact a part of the author is innately apart of the story.

The author's intent never really affects the way I precieve the characters, his words are what make me interested in the story, and if a character is required to hit another character to emphasize a certain trait or a certain dynamic in the relationship so be it, since, I know that cultural bias, and societal bias play a role in character actions I just try to look at in terms of how the characters are portrayed. So if a slap comes as out of character for the character perpetrating the action like any action I would consider it bad righting, but if its established that this is indeed a trait of the character why not embrace it and take the story for what it is and not what is politically correct to say.

idiffer

2009-03-19, 20:40

okay, i'll try to embrace the situation for what it is. first of all, i repeat, i object to this kind of behavior only when its unjustified and the girl is constantly being a bitch (e.g. tsundere)
1) only dumb people resort to violence in the types of situations in love comedies. everything can be solved with discussion. violence has almost no use, its unconstructive. so the trait of the girl is stupidity.
2) with constant slaps and whatnot, typically, in the end the girl gets together with the guy and presumebly lives happily ever after. so the guy takes all of this abuse and doesnt say a word. i dont know the word for a trait of a guy who would fall in love with this type of girl and live with the abuse. probably masochism))
for me it all boils down to my unwillingness to watch a show about stupid people and wimps, this has nothing to do with being politically correct. its my subjective opinion.

Nosauz

2009-03-19, 21:13

Yukinokesshou

2009-03-19, 21:16

i dont know the word for a trait of a guy who would fall in love with this type of girl and live with the abuse. probably masochism

A Korean friend of mine says that he would absolutely fall for girls like the female protagonist in the Korean film "My Sassy Girl". For those of you not in the know, she's a live-action tsundere; there are obviously limits in the tsundere-ness of live action characters - their victims are mere mortals - so the violence is considerably less extreme than in anime but still contains quite a bit of slapping and toying around.

I have no doubts that my friend will change his opinion faster than lightning if he is ever unfortunate enough to get himself into a relationship with such a girl. It just goes to show how different things are in fiction and real life. Fiction is fiction: just enjoy it for what it's worth :)

danin8r44

2009-03-20, 02:00

See that's where I differ from you, I precieve a work as a piece of work, any additional oppinions about are irrelavent to its true intentions. If some one is displeased with it so be it, true its purpose and meaning may change as people refer to it in the future or the present but its essence is what the author creates, and to the author and all who precieve fiction/text the way i do value the authors opinion. Its just a view of a story created by the author nothing more nothing less. trying to incorporate ones feelings about a work do nothing to the work other than acknowledging its existance. The opinion may validate its existance but in the end the work of an author is just that like a child it carries his/her essence within its words.

In a work of fiction the only thing that matters is the readers opinion. Seeing a work of fiction through an authors eyes may give you more insight into a work or it may not. Truly great works are taken beyond what the author intended for the book. They build onto them their own personas in each persons eyes and are not limited simply to the creators perspective. The same works for all plot devices in a work of fiction. A girl slapping a guy is only ever acceptable if the reader thinks its acceptable because when an author sends a work out to be published it is meant for the enjoyment and analysis of the masses, not of the author.
Just my opinion. :cool:
A Korean friend of mine says that he would absolutely fall for girls like the female protagonist in the Korean film "My Sassy Girl". For those of you not in the know, she's a live-action tsundere; there are obviously limits in the tsundere-ness of live action characters - their victims are mere mortals - so the violence is considerably less extreme than in anime but still contains quite a bit of slapping and toying around.

I have no doubts that my friend will change his opinion faster than lightning if he is ever unfortunate enough to get himself into a relationship with such a girl. It just goes to show how different things are in fiction and real life. Fiction is fiction: just enjoy it for what it's worth :)
There will always be masochists in this world. Though I do think many people who enjoy tsunderes would be in for a surprise if they ever dated one. I call for an experiment!! 1otaku+1tsundere=1unhappy otaku+1satisfied tsundere (My hypothesis):D

0utf0xZer0

2009-03-20, 02:10

Taiga is actually one of the better tsundere characters in the sense that it is possible to forget about her tsundere-ness at times, especially in the second half of the series. Take away the punches, and Taiga's personality still shines through, which is more than I can say for most other tsundere characters. In other words, there's a lot more to Taiga than tsundere.

QFT. I'm not big on the stereotypical tsundere, but Taiga falls into the "starts out nasty, turns nice" tsunderes, which I like way more than the overused "hot one minute, cold the next" stereotype. Her "defrosting" process makes for great character development and the fact it always seems like she chews people out because she genuinely dislikes them rather than because of some trivial infraction makes her oddly more likeable than most.

Tsugumi from the visual novel Ever 17 is another great defrosting tsundere, particularly because you as the player get to play a key role in stripping away her jackass layers and it's oh so very satisfying to do so.

There will always be masochists in this world. Though I do think many people who enjoy tsunderes would be in for a surprise if they ever dated one. I call for an experiment!! 1otaku+1tsundere=1unhappy otaku+1satisfied tsundere (My hypothesis)

I'm not sure how many tsundere fans actually would date one though. I generally find the nasty, vicious girl in a story oddly enduring in a story, but it's the softer, kinder girls who I'd be more interested in if I ever met them.

idiffer

2009-03-20, 04:08

Thats fine, judge a book by its cover for all i care, your doing a disservice to yourself, not like it really matters, but to blatantly claim that tsunderes are stupid is by far the most preposterous thing I have ever heard. Thats fine its your opinions, since you didn't even care to read my post I see no point in discussing the matter with you.

thats really funny, cause you're so pissed just because i bashed the type of fictional character you like and you also made 2 unfounded claims. while i at least tried to explain my opinion, you didnt. too bad you wont be discussing the matter with me.

Nosauz

2009-03-20, 08:43

In a work of fiction the only thing that matters is the readers opinion. Seeing a work of fiction through an authors eyes may give you more insight into a work or it may not. Truly great works are taken beyond what the author intended for the book. They build onto them their own personas in each persons eyes and are not limited simply to the creators perspective. The same works for all plot devices in a work of fiction. A girl slapping a guy is only ever acceptable if the reader thinks its acceptable because when an author sends a work out to be published it is meant for the enjoyment and analysis of the masses, not of the author.
Just my opinion. :cool:

Really thats the thing, you consider reader as king, where as I view the reader as just a that a fleeting visitor whos opinion is FINITE, whereas the work can persist beyond the span on not just life, but millions and billions. Thats what makes fiction/text so interesting, because once they are given life from their creator they act as their own entities. I just don't find reader opinions as important as the work by itself. The reader is up to interpret it, but in the end the works nature will never really change, certain aspects may be illuminated by reader opinions but in the end, all information is found within the text which makes good writing.

@idiffer
.... if you read any of my comments you would know my opinion but since you didn't give me the courtesy to read my attempts to discuss what I wrote then I just don't care because discussion requires two people.

FragrantFlora

2009-03-24, 04:55

We shouldn't really take this whole thing seriously when it comes to anime. It all depends on the situation though. Some slaps can be cute just like in Rozen Maiden when Shinku abuses Jun. It's just playful.^^

Vexx

2009-03-24, 13:44

Aye, people seem to be forgetting that to a large extent - the slapping in anime is a form of comedy: slapstick. Might as well start bashing on the Three Stooges, Lucille Ball or Carol Burnett.
In the situations where it is serious --- you might as well start bashing on soap operas as well. A slap is simply a very old theatrical form of expressing the situation visually.

In real life, it is never appropriate to slap someone in anger be they male or female. Over the decades, my wife has punched me in the arm or chest maybe 2 or 3 times in utter frustration at me (but more often its the kitchen pots and pans that take a beating :) ).... but then she's about 95lbs-4'10" to my 210lbs-6'0" so frankly I took those 2 or 3 times for what they were: problems in communication and listening.

Jethro

2009-03-24, 19:20

MidnightViper88

2009-03-25, 10:59

In real life, it is never appropriate to slap someone in anger be they male or female.

Because slapping doesn't nearly do it as much as beating the shit out of someone does, something I'd be doing often if I didn't have self-restraint, especially with my half-brother...

Spectacular_Insanity

2009-03-25, 13:10

In real life, it is never appropriate to slap someone in anger be they male or female.

True. In anime, characters can take a 10-megaton hammer to the forehead and get up two minutes later like nothing happened. In real life... well, let's just say it would be far more messy and be followed by a court investigation, to say the least. :heh:

MidnightViper88

2009-03-25, 13:34

True. In anime, characters can take a 10-megaton hammer to the forehead and get up two minutes later like nothing happened. In real life... well, let's just say it would be far more messy and be followed by a court investigation, to say the least. :heh:

Court investigation? If you're lucky, a case on a crime show show like CSI will be inspired by your imaginative murder...

KimmyChan

2009-03-26, 08:58

I've always thought it was kinda cute and haught :)

Egghead89

2009-03-30, 13:35

Zira

2009-04-07, 14:18

War_Lord

2009-04-07, 17:47

I don't really have a particular opinion about it. It really depends on the situation and whether or not the male/female offender was asking for it. One scene that I can't escape is from Evangelion. Rei slaps Shinji for speaking ill of his father. I thought it was uncalled for, but I also liked it because it was the most emotional reaction I've seen from her throughout the whole series.

Nochgo

2009-04-07, 20:48

There are many situations that result in slaps, and most of them are for good uses and effects. I especially agree when girls slap guys because the girl becomes infuriated with the guy, due to the guy in question action really stupid, whatever that may be. Its rarer to see guys slapping girls, but usually for unjustified reasons.

Chiyuki

2009-04-08, 15:31

I like the slap Ulquiorra gets from Orihime on Bleach! Slapping is the number 1 way to say I love you XD

Abashi

2009-09-21, 20:25

Full Metal Coast

2009-09-21, 21:51

Slapstick violence works better when the victim deserves it.

Epic moment from the Love Hina manga, volume 12:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb153/Ganjalf89/112.jpg

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb153/Ganjalf89/113.jpg

Pure gold, if you ask me.
Eat some of your own medicine, Naru! :D

bhahaha. that is quality.

in my opinion in anime i dont mind it coming from a female as it can be quite funny but with characters like Naru Narusegawa and to a certain extent Kaname Chidori from full metal Panic it really wears thin as they take it completely overboard.
i would like to see Kaname get a taste of her own medicine for all the time she has hit sousuke without hearing his side of the story.

a tsundere i dont mind is Shana from Shakugan no Shana though

and i do have to agree chiyuki that Slapping is the number 1 way of saying i love you.

Cyz

2009-09-21, 22:02

Well if the guy deserves to be slapped then sure. But if you're asking for out of pride, then well that's a little different I guess

achirist

2009-09-23, 18:33

I think anime girls should be arrested for their violence; I don't find it in the least 'funny' and actually think it is very offensive when extremely violent girls spend all their time bludgeoning boys for no acceptable reason, especially when a relationship exists and thus it amounts to domestic abuse. An example is Sunohara being beat up on clannad, a show that was generally against boys and their emotions. It is never, never, never acceptable to respond to words with violence, and no one 'deserves' to be hit; violence is illegal.

Triple_R

2009-09-23, 21:22

Usually in anime, if a girl slaps a guy, she generally gets away with it, not only that but is a likable character. During ep 3 of Moonphase, Hazuki slapped Kouhei across the face after he said something very offensive to her and about her family. His grandfather told him to stop, but he kept on ranting, then SLAP! It was quite a shocking scene, and quite cute, but I didn't know who did that at first. Afterwards she ran away and he came and rescued her. Great example of Chivalry. I'm wondering, do any of you think its sort of cute or haught for a girl to slap a guy or another girl in anime?

What other anime series can you think of that has a girl slap a guy or another girl? The ones I know of are: Kashimashi, Mai Otome, Ergo Proxy, Higurashi, Noein, and some of the shows on tv. There are many others, but those are the ones I have seen so far.

Well, the example you gave wouldn't strike me as cute, but rather as dramatic. It's romantic drama, and it may have been executed quite nicely by the sounds of it.

If a guy is verbally being a really abusive jerk, I don't see a big problem with it (up to a simple slap across the face, anyway).

On the other hand, the slapstick violence of something like Love Hina! does cross the line for me, because it's not based on the guy being a really abusive jerk, but rather on him simply being clumsy.

For me, the question is "Did he have it coming?" If the answer is yes, so be it. If the answer is no, he didn't; rather the girl just jumped to incorrect conclusions and belted him for an innocent case of clumsiness, then no, I don't like it. This is one of the main reasons why I've largely given up on harem anime. I feel the pain of the poor sap who's getting abused just for being clumsy rather than laughter at the sight of the slapstick.

Sackett

2009-09-23, 21:43

Can any of you recommend me some anime where the girls slap?

These are hard to find in the US because the western population prefers men that slap, whilst its politically incorrect for women to do it. I like anime where girls slap, in addition to a good Yuri.

Same here! ;)

Huh...?

What part of the US are you in?

Western culture is very down on men who slap women. A man slapping a man... well I guess maybe in a "get ahold of your self man" situation, but males don't slap each other when they are mad- they punch.

Women who slap men on the other hand are "feisty" Maureen O'Hara was famous for such depictions. (Redhead of course)

In fact I would say that it's Asian culture that is more... open to men... uh... disciplining women. At least, I've seen several depictions were a man threatens to slap a woman when she is acting unreasonable (and usually they are- for example, in Maison Ikkoku when Kyoko calls Godai Akemi's pimp), and this threat is seen as being manly and taking charge.

On the other hand... I think only a handful have ever actually gone through with slapping a woman- and usually they suffer for it if they do.

Lots of anime have this. A common tactic of tsundere. Some of course go over board.

Ranma 1/2 for example: "Ranma no baka!" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QleyNcziqc0), of course in that anime, everyone knows martial arts (I mean everyone- even noodle store managers) and everybody smacks everybody.

But it crops up for dramatic effect in other anime too.

Abashi

2010-01-06, 13:51

I understand the appeal of slapstick comedy, especially when it is done right. I even appreciate "black" humor, when a situation which is usually not humorous at all is made to look funny.

However, the problem is that this is too one-sided from girls to guys. It's like it's trying to project a message that guys are weaker than girls and cannot defend themselves. And what I find even more shocking is that male viewers seem to accept and love this idea.:confused:

Its the opposite now of days

It's not about the physical damage as much as the expression of domination that the beating up involves. Basically, the message is that men have to always do what women want and if they screw up even if unknowingly, they will be punished.

Its the opposite now of days

Chiaki is one of the rare examples when slapstick violence is used from men to women. The only other example I can remember is Gin from Gintama, who sometimes beats up Kagura. I wonder how a father disciplining his disobedient daughter would be perceived by the fans - or is that also considered "domestic violence" nowadays.

Which is why hypocritical lying misogynists like you love it!

It is the opposite now of days actually. People think its haught and sexy for men to slap women or other men, but get extremely offended when its women slapping men or other women. They also say that only women get to groin kick, so only men get to slap. Do you even view American media? Of course you do. Also, you live in California, and here men slapping women is universally accepted, even before it was accepted in the other states. Even all the women here enjoy seeing men slap women, but get offended if a woman slaps anybody.

One reason I like Japanese media is that the girls do things that only guys do where I live. Sometimes the girls slap, or they caress somebody, both I like to see coming from women, not men.

Dilla

2010-01-06, 15:10

It is the opposite now of days actually. People think its haught and sexy for men to slap women or other men, but get extremely offended when its women slapping men or other women. They also say that only women get to groin kick, so only men get to slap. Do you even view American media? Of course you do. Also, you live in California, and here men slapping women is universally accepted, even before it was accepted in the other states. Even all the women here enjoy seeing men slap women, but get offended if a woman slaps anybody.

One reason I like Japanese media is that the girls do things that only guys do where I live. Sometimes the girls slap, or they caress somebody, both I like to see coming from women, not men.:confused:

What Bizzaro World do you live in? I've seen no sign of what you are saying being correct at all. At least not enough to support the large generalization you just made.

Dark Adonis

2010-01-07, 21:05

If the slap is deserved, I think it is perfectly fine for the girl to slap the guy. I do, however, think that girls slapping guys has become an extremely overused running gag in anime. This is especially true when girls are always assuming guys are perverts (even when they did absolutely nothing wrong). In these cases, I might actually cheer if the guy slapped the girl back. If, in protecting a girl from falling, my hand accidentally landed on her breast and she slapped me for it, she could forget about me ever saving her ungrateful ass again.

SamKajam

2010-01-08, 01:29

I'm beginning to think this thread has a mild case of masochism...

roriconfan

2010-01-08, 03:38

Ok, let's make this clear by playing with the stereotypes...

1) Man punching man -> normal
A normal reaction in all cases, unless you are an noble Eglishman who uses gloves...

2) Man slapping man -> gay
Although fat guys usually slap hard instead of punching, and we can count in this category an adult slapping a teenager just because he doesn't want to hurt him much.

3) Woman slapping man -> questionably rightful
If he deserved it, ok, if it's a cliche "let's hit him for fun", no.

4) Woman punching man -> tsundere
Tomboys and psychobitches are excused though...

5) Man slapping woman -> questionably rightful
If she deserved it, ok, if it's a cliche "let's hit her to show our manliness", no.

6) Man punching woman -> too much
Except if she is a superhero...

7) Woman slapping woman -> normal
Or erotic if it is a catfight...

8)Woman punching woman -> does not compute
Does it?

Neat Hedgehog

2010-01-09, 17:19

3) Woman slapping man -> questionably rightful
If he deserved it, ok, if it's a cliche "let's hit him for fun", no.

I used to find that sort of thing more objectionable before I noticed that it's actually a pretty common occurrence, even in other species.

For instance, I've got a cat who is roughly the size of a small house. He's not fat when he's 16lbs, and about the biggest house cat you'll find who isn't actually a Maine Coon. He's pretty laid back, but he'll fight like a demon if you care to try him. I've seen him whip two other male cats at once until they ran for the hills, and even chase small raccoons.

Now, we used to have a little female cat who was about 8lbs. Right up until she died of old age, she loved to walk right up to him, and slap him across the face. Pretty hard, too. You could hear it from across the room. Then she'd trot off looking all happy with herself. Her sister and to other unrelated females would all do the same thing, too.

What do you think he did when they did that? He'd just kind of sit there and look bored. Never laid a paw on any of them (They were spayed, too, so it's not like he even had that incentive to refrain from pummeling them). It wasn't that they didn't like him. They'd play with him, and even run behind him like a shield if they were being chased, and he'd protect them or die trying.

I do think that in anime it's an overused gag, or too often used as a placeholder for when the writers can't think of any good dialog. I don't really see anything wrong with it for what it is, though, and I'd say that it is actually to be expected to some degree.

Triple_R

2010-01-09, 18:20

I used to find that sort of thing more objectionable before I noticed that it's actually a pretty common occurrence, even in other species.

For instance, I've got a cat who is roughly the size of a small house. He's not fat when he's 16lbs, and about the biggest house cat you'll find who isn't actually a Maine Coon. He's pretty laid back, but he'll fight like a demon if you care to try him. I've seen him whip two other male cats at once until they ran for the hills, and even chase small raccoons.

Now, we used to have a little female cat who was about 8lbs. Right up until she died of old age, she loved to walk right up to him, and slap him across the face. Pretty hard, too. You could hear it from across the room. Then she'd trot off looking all happy with herself. Her sister and to other unrelated females would all do the same thing, too.

What do you think he did when they did that? He'd just kind of sit there and look bored. Never laid a paw on any of them (They were spayed, too, so it's not like he even had that incentive to refrain from pummeling them). It wasn't that they didn't like him. They'd play with him, and even run behind him like a shield if they were being chased, and he'd protect them or die trying.

I do think that in anime it's an overused gag, or too often used as a placeholder for when the writers can't think of any good dialog. I don't really see anything wrong with it for what it is, though, and I'd say that it is actually to be expected to some degree.

So... it's Ok, in your opinion, for women to inflict serious physical pain on a man for the sheer fun of it all?

That's the basic gist I take from your argument here.

Maybe more should be expected of humans than what we expect of house cats...

Also, IIRC, there's some insect species where the female kills the male in the process of having sex with him or afterwards.

I doubt that the "It's Ok that I killed the guy during sex because other species do it" defense would hold up in court... ;)

Neat Hedgehog

2010-01-09, 19:00

So... it's Ok, in your opinion, for women to inflict serious physical pain on a man for the sheer fun of it all?

That's the basic gist I take from your argument here.

Not sure how you got that. Getting slapped in the face is hardly "serious physical pain." Maybe it's just me, but the general opinion around where I live is that if a cut stops bleeding inside of five minutes, your joints aren't dislocated, or the broken bone pieces at least still match up, then you're just fine. And really, if you can reset that joint by yourself, you're fine, too.

If someone here called getting slapped in the face "serious physical pain," he'd never hear the end of it.

I doubt that the "It's Ok that I killed the guy during sex because other species do it" defense would hold up in court... ;)

I didn't say anything like that, though. I was just pointing out that it was hardly a unique human trait and that it occurs more frequently than people might think. Plus, in my example, nobody's really getting hurt, unlike your example where someone gets killed.

Which isn't to say that I don't think it can be abusive, but that I think it's more of a subjective thing. For instance, if you smack someone in the face and they go "waaah! He hit me!" then you shouldn't have hit him. Sure, it probably didn't hurt that much, but it was still going overboard for him, so it was abusive. But if you smack somebody like me who just goes "ok, now what?" then it's really not an issue, and nobody cares.

So I guess that basically what I mean is that if you aren't getting hurt, I don't see how that's any kind of issue. If you are actually in danger of getting hurt, then that's a problem, so feel free to haul off and set your adversary on the ground.

roriconfan

2010-01-09, 19:09

Punch or slap, it always leaves a scar to your mind

Theowne

2010-01-09, 19:17

Slapping, punching, these things are usually portrayed in a slapstick manner in anime. I don't think there's much point in discussing it in comparison to reality.

But when its done with a more realistic tone, I think they can actually be very powerful dramatic elements of a story when its done between friends or acquaintances. I personally consider the idea of getting so emotional about something that you want someone you care about to feel physical pain is a very, very serious thing. And when it's done in a serious fashion, like in an early episode of Touch, or in the film Umi Ga Kikoeru, it can quite powerful, emotionally. Maybe that's just me.

Obviously, I'm not talking about deranged abusive husbands or anything like that :heh:

Velsy

2010-01-10, 04:05

Well I dont mind seeing girls slap the guys when its Just, Had reason behind it, after being insulted or just funny/amusing.

But its annoys me when its just random or prefermed for no reason whatsoever, than its classed assault to an extent.

Example. In Clannad Afterstory when Kyou slaps Tomoya for no reason which was mainly just Sunohara fooling around. Thats pretty much an assault. Tomoya should of really got pissed at that and question why are they really friends.

But theres times when the slap is preformed and is just really amusing or misunderstood. Example, Moka in Rosarior+Vampire. She slapped Taskune because she thought he was leaving them, but the matter of fact, all he was doing was trying to post a letter. I like to rewatch those seens many times because its sooo funny. They get so owned like that :p

Anyway thats my thoughts on it.

-Sho-

2010-01-10, 08:00

"Bitch slap" :p

roriconfan

2010-01-10, 08:58

Slap can be used to wake up someone from his crazy mode.
Punch is a punishment.
Then there is also Naruto punching Gaara to wake him up from Bijuu mode. But then again, Sakura hitting Naruto in that series grew boring beyond repair so it can be abused. So did Nami in One Piece and so did any neurotic female colead with a mini skirt in any shounen.

MeoTwister5

2010-01-10, 09:16

In all honesty it's relatively rare to see a girl slap a guy some sense in anime in a serious, "he fucking deserved it" sort of way that just demands that the entire show pause for that second for a bit of mental processing, as opposed to the way it's usually used for slapstick.

Not to say that slapstick slaps aren't serious in some form (they usually aren't), but they don't usually carry the serious weight a well-deserving slap has.

Socke

2010-01-11, 07:40

How should I care? There are lots of similar scenes in Hollywood movies but people never reacted to it.

Poetic Justice

2010-01-11, 12:45

http://images.encyclopediadramatica.com/images/9/9c/How_can_she_slap.gif
How can she slap?

Bea Rabbit

2010-01-22, 11:23

No, violence is wrong from both sexes
I dont appreciate violence. Their decision to making such a relationship so they must avoid those kind of things.

OT : Its only kool when comming FROM guys
if its come from Izaya Orihara. lol

Socke

2010-01-23, 06:09

Shoujo fangirls love to see their hated "bitches" being slapped by their "charming princes". Yes both men and women are sexist.

Irenicus

2010-01-23, 09:36

Shoujo fangirls love to see their hated "bitches" being slapped by their "charming princes". Yes both men and women are sexist.
That's news to me, and I'd argue I've read more shoujo manga than you ever will. ;)

Boy-slaps-girl is very, very rare in shoujo manga, unless the author is explicitly writing a story with an abusive male character (BF or otherwise). Girl-slaps-girl, on the other hand...

Badkarma 1

2010-01-24, 00:41

While I really don't mind it in anime but it does get old after the 10th or 20th time!
For example Love Hina after about the 3rd slap I was "Well hit her back you wimp"! Same with Code Geass,Kallen was quite slap happy and when Susaku finally nailed her in the solar plexus I was like "Hell Yeah"! Only to watch her beat him down later!(Although if he had fought back, the outcome might have been different)
In real life though if a girl slaps a guy it's usually because he's being an arse. However if said girl just slapped the guy because he was there or the nearest target and either a:she goes to jail for battery or assault or b: the guy turns and beats her senseless! A no win situation. While slapping in anime is ok,down right funny as long as it ain't done to death or said hitter gets some payback eventually,in real life it'll get you in trouble or worse DEAD! :eyebrow::eyebrow: