Eden of the East - Episode 9 Discussion / Poll [Archive]

Pellissier

2009-06-04, 02:51

Welcome to the discussion thread for Eden of the East, Episode 9.

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Tyrone Biggums

2009-06-04, 13:53

Anything????

miroku2192

2009-06-04, 14:20

man i can't wait for this, sorry to ask this, but when does this air in japan again? (What does it correlate to for...eastern time in the US?)

edit:
So including this there's 4 episodes left in total right? Should be interesting to see how they wrap things up. Last episode was a bit slow for me considering how many questions have been raised throughout the series, and how little time left they have to execute/explain the rest...

hamstar

2009-06-04, 15:16

basically the fat boy discovers that akira is a 'hero' and it was number 10 that blew up japan with missiles. It was discovered that the selecao moved people out of cities by lying to the people that there was an earth quake coming. the fat guy sends all his data to akira and when he decides to run out after akira et al., he get run over by 2 celecao. At the end the Eden group meet up with oosugi at the mall where he shows them the writing on the wall "ill kill you takizawa akira!"

ThoHell

2009-06-04, 17:52

Interesting episode. Fat boy is kind of interesting. However, it seems that with Oosugi's annoying behavior (mainly driven by obsessive fiendish jealous), he's going to start turning people against Akira, the guy is like one of those people who think "If I can have her, no one can!". So many needless lies and deceit, when all could be made so much simpler by just telling the truth. Anyways, looking forward to seeing how this unravels!

10B Yen = around 100 mil USD no? That's a lot of people, but hardly enough to do anything on the scale at which they are doing. Maybe they get some insane membership discount? Akira bought that hotel earlier right? Those things cost around 100mil USD, that would of been all of his money.....

golthin

2009-06-04, 18:15

ThoHell

2009-06-04, 18:22

yes, what they pay for things should cost more to any nomal person. It was already discussed that a hotel that big in that area should cost more that 15 million dollars.

That wasn't some hotel. Look at that building, it was a skyscraper. 15 mil isn't enough to cover that. 15 mil is like a high end house in Hollywood. But yeah for sure, he should be long broke by now.

Starry Dust

2009-06-04, 18:36

golthin

2009-06-04, 18:52

Awww, why did the fat guy have to die D;
Not fair. But I gotta say, seeing him in his underwear wasn't the greatest thing to watch :uhoh: I love how his pants just flew away just like that by the wind. Epic story.

And I find it interesting that 1 and 10 are working/hanging together (?) even though this game is bascailly a dog eat dog kind of thing plus there's the supporter going around.

Saki asked Pantsu about the secret in the selecao phone, the funny thing is that Pantsu WARNED Saki that she should be better not knowing the secret in the cell phone. We also get Akira lying to Saki for the first time, regardless whether it is to protect her or for fear that she would run for the hills if she found the true, it is kind of unfair. Both of them now are building a relationship with a foundation of lies and suspicion.

edit;
My prediction that Involving people outside of the selecao will only cause them danger is proven in this episode. All them are working alone with Juiz and seems that they can team with each other, akira is the only one that has involved others. there must be a rule about letting people outside of the game know about it.

anomono

2009-06-05, 00:37

Saki asked Pantsu about the secret in the selecao phone, the funny thing is that Pantsu WARNED Saki that she should be better not knowing the secret in the cell phone. We also get Akira lying to Saki for the first time, regardless whether it is to protect her or for fear that she would run for the hills if she found the true, it is kind of unfair. Both of them now are building a relationship with a foundation of lies and suspicion.
Yes, he warned her, but he didn't say, "hey, you should stay away from such dangerous people," did he? While Pantsu is clearly taking a risk, he is aware of it, and was already involved. There is no reason to think that outsiders ignorant of the situation would be in any immediate danger though. Even the other members he met, while twisted, were not by any means evil.

Also, it is a bit exaggerated to say that their relationship is founded on lies and suspicion. The "game" aside, Akira has been honest with them, and is only withholding information so as to not involve them. If Saki was direct about it, and simply asked him, there is no doubt she would get the whole truth. Instead, she is taking a tack of cautious suspicion at this point, but the result will be the same when she finds out. There is no way that a lie for her own benefit would damage their relationship.

edit;
My prediction that Involving people outside of the selecao will only cause them danger is proven in this episode. All them are working alone with Juiz and seems that they can team with each other, akira is the only one that has involved others. there must be a rule about letting people outside of the game know about it.
No, his interacting with outside people does not "only cause them danger." It also gives them an opportunity to follow their own dreams. Furthermore, to take part in reforming society, by somehow or other leveraging the NEET situation. In any case, he hasn't involved anyone; or are you saying that he shouldn't interact with other people at all?

Are you suggesting that Akira withdraw himself, and throw away a perfectly good opportunity to do some serious good for society? You seem to be implying that he can still manage without interacting with society, but that is absurd. You can not hope to affect society all by yourself, shut in a closet somewhere. Besides, it would make for a very dull story which would never be animated.

~BC~

2009-06-05, 02:29

Darknemo2000

2009-06-05, 02:32

I would not be sad if Oosugi died though.

~BC~

2009-06-05, 02:42

You and who knows how many people. That's why I'd put more on it being Micchon (Itazu sent her the info) or Hirasawa.

Mystique

2009-06-05, 04:41

*whistles*
Bring on the intrigue, suspence and thriller, it's turning edge of the seat stuff now. ^^
It certainly is a dangerous game and it was kinda obvious what was gonna happen to Itazu, hacker that he is asssisting Akira?
Didn't think the other Selecao were gonna let it pass by quietly, heh.
I just hope the copies he's uploading make it but then again, heh
"Juiz... wipe it all."
How can you fight against a power like that? :\

Anyways,
2 eps to go and 1 movie.
6 Selecao exposed, 6 still hidden (iirc)

It does seem like they're gonna gamble this on the movie perhaps, or they're gonna have to pull out some serious stops in the last 2 episodes xD

(PS: Anyone find themselves trying to scan and read all data on the computer? lol
Bitch amount of text in there and a good majority isn't paraphrased at all. Methinks licencing such a series as this would need translation on a mass level.) x.x

As for Osugi, I don't have hate for the guy at all.
In fact the way it's going, here's a sudden thought to mind (no media basis for it, it's just my intuition, ponderings)
He'll end up saving Saki's life in a way Akira probably can't when the time calls for it. She's blantantly ignoring him now, even if he said 'get out of the way', she'll ignore him (bitch, lol) but he'll prob run in to take whatever was aimed at her.
As I said, pure speculation, but my writer's brain is kinda to decode his role in this. It's by no means insigificant, but time will tell how this pans out.
*Goes to have a peek at ep 10 written preview in the meantime* >.>
(edit: Bleh, another informative ep, means it'll gamble on ep 11 + movie it seems...) :(

PPS:
Did anyone else find Akira sizzling hot in that black poloneck? :love:

anomono

2009-06-05, 05:11

@anomono

You seem to forget how he learned about Itazu in the first place; only after he asked the Eden group if they could crack the phone. So yes, he definitely planned on getting them involved. I mean just think about all the information that's on that phone and what it indicates. Government and police corruption on all kinds of levels and whatever other crazy stuff the Selecao have been up to.
He wanted the phone fixed, but I doubt he intended to share its contents with the others. It would also be rather rude for them to rummage through the phone without his permission. To be fair though, this really was not a bright idea on his part.

That thing is obviously so advanced, that I wouldn't even look at it funny; chances are it is always watching and listening. I can't think of a better way to summon the supporter than trying to reactivate someone else's phone to abuse the system. Perhaps someone less technically inclined would not be aware of just how dangerous it is though.

The Selecao he met before were all different types. There is no reason for him to assume that the rest pose no threat. Especially after he learned about "the Supporter".
I would say that there is good reason: they were all chosen as hopeful saviors. The members willingly accepted this obligation, and staked their lives on the chance to make a difference; they should probably be decent people.

The fact is he should've at least given the Eden members the chance to decide whether they wanted to risk their lives. But I guess if someone close to Saki does die it'll provide for more drama than if he was just straight with them. This whole thing with Oosugi is obviously leading us there anyway.
No doubt, it would be better if he could be more up front about it. Given knowledge of the supporter though, it would be all the more unwise to share that information. At least in theory, he has nothing to worry about if he keeps to the rules.

n15738

2009-06-05, 08:46

Why he had to die? From my attitude number1 is the most cruel selecao killing people without any feeling even number10 who used to send the missile to strike japan was still panic. Don't fit well with the testimony indicate num10 is behind the scene.

About Osuki case.
He's a kind of daft man who think if saki doesn't love him, anyone can't be loved too but actually he's a sceptic and maybe it's a cause of death as pantsu was done.

refer to the information about selecao activities list that Itazu had sent before going outside. I'm really curious who will obtain it however, I'm really sure if pantsu posted it on the internet, the story would finnish rapidly than common.

golthin

2009-06-05, 10:00

BetoJR

2009-06-05, 10:08

Starry Dust

2009-06-05, 11:13

Did anyone else find Akira sizzling hot in that black poloneck? :love:
Lol, why yes.
I couldn't stop oogling him in this episode xD

@ Gothlin: Ugh, tell me about it. On other sites you wouldn't believe how many people want the poor guy to die. God forbid him to act like a normal human with jealousy and curiousity against Akira :uhoh: It'll be boring if everyone was a suck up to Akira too. People just jump to conclusions and aren't reasonable....but that happens alot when stuff blocks up their favorite shipping.

Coming from a shoujo fan, I'm used to that kind of crap but I don't enjoy hearing it much. Disliking a character is different from bashing.

*waits for subs*

Darknemo2000

2009-06-05, 13:30

The hatred for Oosugi is really getting out of hand. I have never seen such hatred toward a character besides MAkoto from school days. The hate comes from the AkiraxSaki shippers as they consider Oosugi an obstacle toward their favorite pairing. It is not enough for them that Oosugi already lost the battle for the girl, but they just want the guy to turn a blind eye and not worry about Saki at all.

I am not AkiraxSaki shipper but I still do not like his character.

But ~BC~'s comment is insightful - if Osugi were to the one to die it would not have a shocking effect, since many people instead of being shocked about innocent dying, would be happy about it. Making a disliked by majority character die, would have an opposite effect as it would almost be like a dream come true for many, thus no shocking/dramatic effect at all, meaning Osugi dying is not very possible at the moment.

Kaoru Chujo

2009-06-05, 14:41

Oosugi is actually finding out useful and interesting things here. This is an Oosugi up and Akira down episode. Akira (or whatever we should now call him) is seeming untrustworthy, for all his high virtue. It's not absolutely clear that his hiding things is for the sake of saving the others. Perhaps it's for the sake of making his own plans easier to carry out. And in reality, his own plans may be the higher good.

I don't think he is wantonly endangering people, since he doesn't really grasp how dangerous these enemies are.

Oosugi will probably come through with more good stuff, but it would be a travesty -- or too much like reality -- if he ended up with Saki.

With such an innocent and sympathetic (sort of) character as Pantsu dying, we are ratcheting the intensity up a notch here.

Do we now have more insight into why #9 would have put himself in front of the White House naked and with a gun? Was it to get himself arrested, but with no way of identifying who he is? For his own safety? Not the best method, but is it possible?

@ miroku2192: First broadcast time is Thursday evenings at 12:45 am. That would be 11:45 am Thursday in New York.

hotel cost: I found a site that said that in 2001, the cost per room of a luxury hotel in NYC would be around $350,000. Say it's now $500,000, you could build a hotel with 30 rooms for that $15 million. The hotel doesn't have to occupy all floors of its building; but two floors might seem too few. In any case, inexactness in this regard is not a deal-breaker, for me.

fish eric

2009-06-05, 19:06

The hatred for Oosugi is really getting out of hand. I have never seen such hatred toward a character besides MAkoto from school days. The hate comes from the AkiraxSaki shippers as they consider Oosugi an obstacle toward their favorite pairing. It is not enough for them that Oosugi already lost the battle for the girl, but they just want the guy to turn a blind eye and not worry about Saki at all.

im not a akiraxsaki fan. i mean its pretty obvious from the opening prologue what is gonna happen. How did he become my prince etc, etc

i think the show has done a good job at not playing up the romance between the two.

but i still fucking hate oosugi. he is so boring and uninteresting.

even his friends don't care about him.

oosugi to group : all the eden members may not be able to sit in the same room again.

group to oosugi : ...im kinda busy to go after you right now. i mean i can see that you are hurt and upset and could really use a friend but, damn this chair is comfortable.

~BC~

2009-06-05, 20:40

golthin

2009-06-05, 21:14

I don't hate Ohsugi at all. I just do not care for his character, myself. He's the quintessential vanilla leading lady's best friend, and his motivations are really banal in the extreme.

But some do cross the line, sometimes. Specially the shippers. :D

yeah, his character is not that great but he has a purpose. He is the voice of reason for the Eden group. there had to be a reason for not trusting the guy, and the reason was that he is his rival for Saki's affection. Nothing evil nothing bad, all is fair in love and war. the problem is that he has not done nothing evil or bad besides bringing the truth that Akira has kept hidden to the surface.
Nobody seems to hate Akira for all the things he is hiding and all the lying because he is a nice guy put in a bad situation. Akira indirectly without bad intention destroyed Oosugi's world, and people just wanted Oosugi to smile and give up. He only wanted to know who was the guy he lost to and he found somthing worse. It is not like he tried to beat Akira up or paid someone to do it. Heck, he could have told someof the people in the Eden webside that wanted to know where Akira was so they could kill him but he has not.

taco

2009-06-05, 22:26

I don't understand the Ohsugi hate. It's completely legitimate for him to investigate Akira Takizawa's mall after figuring out that he has 5 other names with the possibility of being a terrorist. Not to mention that his best friends are hanging out with this guy. He is trying to be safe which is why he was trying to get in contact with Saki. If you don't like him because he'd do what a normal person would do, then go watch some cheesy Sci Fi show.

This was a pretty good episode. I think it's safe to say that Ohsugi or the Supporter will kill Akira, although I'm not sure. Mononobe could be the supporter, he was right next to Akira when he lost his memories. He may have thought of killing him but presumed it was pointless since he had no memories at all.

Haruyasha

2009-06-05, 23:11

Plot hole: Why can the guy use Akira's phone..? I thought they read fingerprints..

edit: nm.. I didn't watch very far lol.

feRfe

2009-06-05, 23:18

now which way will micchon turn

golthin

2009-06-05, 23:47

doesn't Akira comes as an air head, Pantsu asked him for his email adress and he only wrote his phone number. A cluessless guy like him think he can win the game?

vaden

2009-06-06, 00:03

If I learned one thing from this episode, it's that going outside will kill you.

doesn't Akira comes as an air head, Pantsu asked him for his email adress and he only wrote his phone number. A cluessless guy like him think he can win the game?

Does Akira even have an e-mail account?

Raiga

2009-06-06, 00:08

If I learned one thing from this episode, it's that going outside will kill you.

XD

Uh, haven't watched subbed yet (still sitting on my comp since about ten minutes ago) but I kinda figure Akira didn't give him his mail account 'cause he didn't know it... he didn't seem to be that great with working the phone in episode 2, and Saki had to help him transfer files and whatnot. He probably forgot/couldn't use his mail account.

vaden

2009-06-06, 00:16

Actually, it just occurred to me that a good number of cell phone carriers will let you text somebody by sending an e-mail to a certain address constructed from the phone number... though I'm not sure how well that would work out for the Noblesse phones, since they're probably not on a network where that information is publicly available.

golthin

2009-06-06, 00:37

Does Akira even have an e-mail account?

yes he does, Saki does text him. Most people just send other people their email adress by just tranfering it from phone to phone. It might be that Akira doesn't even know his own email address and couldn't write it.

Darknemo2000

2009-06-06, 02:01

yeah, his character is not that great but he has a purpose. He is the voice of reason for the Eden group. there had to be a reason for not trusting the guy, and the reason was that he is his rival for Saki's affection. Nothing evil nothing bad, all is fair in love and war. the problem is that he has not done nothing evil or bad besides bringing the truth that Akira has kept hidden to the surface.
Nobody seems to hate Akira for all the things he is hiding and all the lying because he is a nice guy put in a bad situation. Akira indirectly without bad intention destroyed Oosugi's world, and people just wanted Oosugi to smile and give up. He only wanted to know who was the guy he lost to and he found somthing worse. It is not like he tried to beat Akira up or paid someone to do it. Heck, he could have told someof the people in the Eden webside that wanted to know where Akira was so they could kill him but he has not.

I think you are drawing Oosugi like too much of a prince here. He did not only want to know the truth, he is not the voice of a reason either (unless you count a very strong emotion - jealousy - as a voice of a reason). His drive is not wish to know the truth and not wish to protect others - his drive is his jealousy, trying to take Akira out of the picture. Even if situation were normal (Akira a normal guy etc.) Osugi would still try to mess things up for Akira, because of his jealousy.

rose-wisteria

2009-06-06, 02:11

It is not like he tried to beat Akira up or paid someone to do it. Heck, he could have told someof the people in the Eden webside that wanted to know where Akira was so they could kill him but he has not.

You do know you are talking about the guy who has to hide at the sight of Akira and Saki together last episode right? He wouldn't have the guts to do that in the first place. ;)

As much as I hate Ohsugi (I really do), I think he's necessary to the story. I don't want him to be killed off last or in the future episodes. ^^;; The ending of this episode proves that he will stir some interesting things up now that he has found what he believes is evidence about Akira being a criminal. It's just sad that Itazu has to leave us so early :( and that he can't prove that Akira is actually the opposite of a criminal. Then again, as sad as it is for me to say this, it is crucial that Itazu has to die to keep Akira's past good deed in the dark and move along the story... >__<

fish eric

2009-06-06, 02:34

Actually, I think you've got it backwards. The 'busy' one in this case was Oosugi (the only one employed at the moment). So it's understandable that they didn't chase after him when he says he has to go to work. Plus I don't think they knew how hurt he was; he seems to think they've known about Akira for awhile.

I think it was pretty obvious how upset he was. He talked about them all never being in the same room together. Ever.

Besides that wasn't my point. I said I hate him because he is boring and uninteresting. I have hated him since the first time I saw him in the show.

If they wanted to they could have walked with him to the end of the campus. invited him to get together later on when he was done working. These are the things I would do for my friends. Wouldn't you?

it was pretty pathetic how he was spying on akira and saki. I thought it was a very much a rude thing to do to take someones picture without their permission in Japan. I have only seen this in other animes so I could be mistaken.

And why did Oosugi have them all come down to the multiplex? To show them some graffiti? He has a camera phone. He really had 3 people drive in Tokyo of all places to see that? and how does a message that says ill kill you takizawa make him a criminal? I didn't know that someone hating you made you a criminal. Using different names doesn't make you a criminal either although it does seriously bring into question your character. But he could have used those names to try and save people during the missile attacks.

I thought he was suppose to be at work. How did he end up at the multiplex?

Oosugi is such a baby. "if you guys don't stop hanging out with akira then im not gonna be your friend anymore. Waaah waaah." :T_T:

alright im done hating.

This was a pretty good episode. Did anyone see what country the preemptive missile strike was targeting? I was really starting to like pantsu's character. It is too bad he had to die. I don't understand why he didn't just plug his phone into the wall. How could running down the street possibly be faster than plugging your phone into the wall? That doesn't make any sense. Plot-hole?

It was curious that #10 said he was trying to prevent people from dying in a missile strike, but he was the one who tried to blow people up. whats that all about?

golthin

2009-06-06, 02:49

Then again, as sad as it is for me to say this, it is crucial that Itazu has to die to keep Akira's past good deed in the dark and move along the story... >__<

well, if the data transfer is completed, then the people in the eden site will be able to see the data. what I fear is that number 1 and 10 will see that the data was transfered and this will put more people in Danger. you know, I wouldn't mind if a couple of the Eden Gang get killed and because of Oosugi Jealousy and he distancing himself from the group he survives. It will be so good if Saki finds out that because she brought Akira into the group and he kept his activities a secret two or more of her friends were killed.

paradox13

2009-06-06, 02:56

Oosugi is an annoying little bastard. A very realistic character (you don't ever see a character like him in fiction) definitely, but an annoying little bastard nevertheless.

I hope someone gets Juiz to run him over.

Kazu-kun

2009-06-06, 03:03

It was curious that #10 said he was trying to prevent people from dying in a missile strike, but he was the one who tried to blow people up. whats that all about?
Mistranslation probably. nº1 said nº10 shouldn't be whining about killing one person (Itazu) when he's out to kill a lot of people with the missile attack.
I wouldn't mind if a couple of the Eden Gang get killed and because of Oosugi Jealousy and he distancing himself from the group he survives. It will be so good if Saki finds out that because she brought Akira into the group and he kept his activities a secret two or more of her friends were killed.
When Akira saved Japan from Mononobe's evil machinations the first time (Careless Monday), there were 10 missiles. Now there are 60!! With Itazu dead, the only ones who can help Akira to deal with this crisis are the guys form Eden club, so I doubt any of them is going to kick the bucket now.

fish eric

2009-06-06, 03:07

Mistranslation probably. nº1 said nº10 shouldn't be whining about killing one person (Itazu) when he's out to kill a lot of people with the missile attack.

That makes alot more sense.

~BC~

2009-06-06, 03:08

@fish eric

Sorry, I wasn't trying to change your opinion on Oosugi. Just explaining why I felt the others didn't pursue him. Given the circumstances of how he found out about Akira it's understandable why he wouldn't want to be in the same room with him. I doubt anyone holds it against him.

And there's never any one way to deal with an upset friend. Sometimes you go after them, other times you just have to let them cool off. It was obvious that Oosugi was done with the conversation. Frankly this entire thing is really for Saki to deal with, IMO.

As for him calling them over to the multiplex it was more of a 'see it with you own eyes' type of thing. Seeing as he was the spurned companion he probably doesn't want them thinking he's fabricating stuff.

rose-wisteria

2009-06-06, 03:16

well, if the data transfer is completed, then the people in the eden site will be able to see the data. what I fear is that number 1 and 10 will see that the data was transfered and this will put more people in Danger. you know, I wouldn't mind if a couple of the Eden Gang get killed and because of Oosugi Jealousy and he distancing himself from the group he survives. It will be so good if Saki finds out that because she brought Akira into the group and he kept his activities a secret two or more of her friends were killed.

Oh. Was that what he was doing before he left the house? Makes sense. Thanks ;)

Though I don't think you can totally blame Akira or Saki if her friends get killed thanks to this Selecao game...

Haak

2009-06-06, 03:20

God DAMN this was one freaking awesome episode.

I can't believe Pantsu died. well, actually I saw it coming as soon as we saw No1 reach his house but MAN I'm still not happy. My gut was wrenching when that petal dropped

~BC~

2009-06-06, 03:27

Yeah, it was pretty screwed up how he allowed a machine to forecast his destiny and once an actual human being gave him a reason to go against it he gets killed.

MeoTwister5

2009-06-06, 03:34

When I think about it, I finally believe that the "I'll kill you Akira Takizawa" spray painted on the walls of the mall's inner section was not made by the NEETs but possibly by either I or X. From the way X acts he looks completely pussywhipped (for lack of a better term) by I, like he's just being ordered around by I. It no longer seems like X's use of the missle attack was solely by his hand or idea but rather influenced by I. Clearly they've been working together for a while and probably share similar ideals, but X is being given the bigger share of the responsibilities of having their plans carried out.

The most massive revelation in this episode and probably the series so far is the "Return to pre-WWII era Japan" tagged on the missle strikes. To me it's probably the core of the plans of I and probably X for improvement of Japan: Remilitarization of Japan prior to the second World War. It would suggest that the missle strikes were fully intended as a wake up call to Japan that needs to re-arm itself and break away from the anti-rearmament pacts it had agreed upon after WWII.

It is already more than clear that Akira's acts pre-wipe was to counter X, by essentially saving the NEETs and planning the evacuation of the areas hit by the missle prior to Careless Monday. The problem is, waving a gun bare-assed in front of the White House and Saki seems to run counter to his actions before that point. Based on what was revealed in the history, he's more a pacifist and peacemaker trying to stop the aggressive and sacrificing actions of X.

This makes me reconsider his action on that day: it seems more likely that being naked with a gun on Penn avenue was not a choice of his own but as if he was either forced into it, or was backed into a corner. Either way, wiping his mind seems to have become a way out of that situation where he would have done something drastic, as if banking on the essential nature of his character that even without memories, he can make his way back and find another way. Again, something must have happened that forced him into that situation, which as I've said before is probably the central problem and climax of the story.

Of course this doesn't explain whether he was aiming for Saki or the White House, but it further deepens the gravity of involvement.

golthin

2009-06-06, 03:42

Though I don't think you can totally blame Akira or Saki if her friends get killed thanks to this Selecao game...

oh yes i can, I wouldn't blame Saki as much, but she still has some blame. she brought a guy like akira to the group, a guy she met under very strange circumstances. I know it is anime, but it seems that the most hated guy in the show is the only one with some common sense, regardless of his initial motives. No wonder he is the only one that has found a Job.

Haak

2009-06-06, 03:46

They don't deserve blame. When you meet a mysterious man with no memory you shouldn't have to expect them to be part of a massive dangeruous consipracy.

Akira might be a little blameworthy since he still refuses to tell Saki what's happening even though he knows he's playing a game. It's not that he's a bad person. Again, he's just not thinking things through. And for all pantsu's intelligence it doesn't look as if he was either when he told Saki that.

People have an annoying habit of assuming they know what's best for other people.

And I'm sure the most hated guys in the show are now #1 and #10.

SonOfHeaven

2009-06-06, 03:49

What an great episode. I was sad to see it end due to all the information gained from the episode.

Darknemo2000

2009-06-06, 04:23

oh yes i can, I wouldn't blame Saki as much, but she still has some blame. she brought a guy like akira to the group, a guy she met under very strange circumstances. I know it is anime, but it seems that the most hated guy in the show is the only one with some common sense, regardless of his initial motives. No wonder he is the only one that has found a Job.

Not just initial motives. Jealosy is his drive, not something that just started the ball rolling, but something that keeps him going. Jealousy and somewhat hatred for Akira (for taking away something that was never his) is what keeps him going, rather than care or reason. It is not the voice of reason, it is the voice of jealosy, that accidentally leads towards the same direction as the reason, yet has a different goal (not to trying to find out the TRUTH, but to find out the FACTS that would push Akira away from the group and most importantly Saki).

SSJiffy

2009-06-06, 04:48

I don't get it. Why couldn't Pantsu have just ordered some new slacks online to be delivered to his door?

Haak

2009-06-06, 04:50

He decided he would never go out because he thought he would be someone great but his own invention told him he'd just be a NEET.

I think to him, the whole slacks blowing away thing was a sign rather than a reason.

golthin

2009-06-06, 05:05

Not just initial motives. Jealosy is his drive, not something that just started the ball rolling, but something that keeps him going. Jealousy and somewhat hatred for Akira (for taking away something that was never his) is what keeps him going, rather than care or reason. It is not the voice of reason, it is the voice of jealosy, that accidentally leads towards the same direction as the reason, yet has a different goal (not to trying to find out the TRUTH, but to find out the FACTS that would push Akira away from the group and most importantly Saki).

his initial motive was wanting to find out who Akira was. Now after he found out the information he is honestly trying to warn his friends about something dangerous. really, you people make the guy so bad. If it was me, after my friends betray me and rather help the new commer, i wouldn't care less if they all went to hell. I think Oosugi is too nice of a guy for his own good. if after watching this episode and seeing what happened to pantsu, anyone that can keep saying that being involved with Akira is not dangerous is in denial.

izmosmolnar

2009-06-06, 05:05

I'm utterly disgusted with all the hatred toward Oosugi.
Wishing him dead, just because he is investigating a potential boyfriend of his love-interest? Worse than SD Makoto? And at the same time no one gives a shit about such crimes like #11's habit...
It is ironic to see that a bigger part of the people who hates him, would probably behave similarly given the very same circumstances.
And please refer to my Teal Deer post in the previous episode thread, IMO he isn't all that different to Saki in that regard to be honest.
Well, truthfully I couldn't care less about that love-triangle part of the story, I find it out of place.

Anyway, I'm a tiny bit disappointed with the episode, because it was more or less predictable (except running over Jack-Black).
The few things worth mentioning

#10 doesn't seem to suspect #1 being the Supporter strangely.
#10: "Especially since they say IX isn't the Supporter". Who are "they"? #11 was convinced Akira is the supporter and both Kondo, both Hiura seemed to think the same, so is #10 referring here on the other Selecaos? Why would they think it differently anyway?
#10: "but IX is different to cooperate with". If we can believe him, he implies he tried to cooperate with Akira. IDK is that before or after the Careless Monday, where Akira obstructed #10's plan and evacuated the people. Or it's also possible they cooperated up to that point and Akira deceived him in the end, and evacuated them.
Desk Ninja-kun from the club says Akira is only famous by 5 name, and not more.
The names on the passports in episode1: Shibutane Makoto; Mirose Koji; Hasegawa Kasuja; (+Takizawa Akira obviously) and there might be more passports than that.
Oosugi's phone at the trainscene episode8: Hasegawa Kazuya; Hozosawa Naoki; Gise Koji (and Kozi on the boatscene); Shibuya Makoto; Okada Shintaro.
As we can see the fake names are the names from his passports. Obviously there are a few differences comparing the names romanized, but the kanjis seems the same for me (do note I can't read kanjis).
How nice of Saki to ignore Oosugi again! Did she forget already the events few episodes earlier where her ignorant behavior eventually caused a much much worse outcome? Surely hearing him out wtf is his problem wouldn't kill anyone...
Too bad we jumped through the purchase entries (if there was any) between the mindwhipe and the careless monday...
Is that a coincidence or is that really #10 there at the scene? (sorry for shitty quality)http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/6509/22208036.jpg(he doesn't say what was his profession, he only just said he dislikes bureaucracy, and bureaucrats)
#1 is furious that Panties hacked into the phone and seen the deleted entries, which kinda implies he might have been behind the erase history (and probably the memorywhipe).
I don't understand Panties though. Why don't he put his phone on the charger and call him? Surely it could be more efficient to wait 1-2 minutes until the phone is capable to endure a call, than running after them. Additionally why don't he calls Akira through the internet? Or sending a text message through the web shouldn't be unheard for a hacker of his caliber.
The other thing with Panties, in order to survive for two years, I believe he probably had to order food delivery through the internet. Then why don't he orders a new trousers too? (Hell using the anime's logic from ep1, it would be okay to go outside and ask a business man to hand over his own trousers).

Edit:How can #1 drive from the passenger seat? Are the cars in Japan automatic geared too? Because he shouldn't be able to reach the clutch from there if there's any...
The gear seems automatic alright, since he "pulls it down" instead of shifting it on the top left/right, but if it is automatic gear why is he using a manual hand-break? I haven't used my hand-break for like 2 years, since I'm driving car with automatic gear. (FYI: the gear also contains a position which works almost the same way as the hand break).
The other thing: why is he pressing down the accelerator pedal before changing gears? As far as I know it's not possible to change gears unless someone holds a foot down on the break pedal.
Anyway, why is that car left-sided there in the first place? (Japanese cars have the driver seat on the right-side).
At 04:01 in the parking lot we can see #10 standing before the door on the right side, which implies that the same car was right-sided there! It is the same car, but why did the animators made the driving seat on the other side? The only "logical" (?) explanation is that they changed cars to an exported (or imported if it's foreign) car, but the imported car is exactly the same, except the driver seat. WTF? :heh:

Haak

2009-06-06, 05:11

Is that a coincidence or is that really #10 there at the scene? (sorry for shitty quality)http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/6509/22208036.jpg(he doesn't say what was his proffesion, he only just said he dislikes bureaucracy, and bureaucrats)

That looked like Akira to me.

anomono

2009-06-06, 05:13

@Darknemo2000

Well said. Oosugi is childish jerk, driven by jealousy. I never liked him, but his behavior in this episode truly disgusts me.

He has uncovered some disturbing information about their new acquaintance, and what does he do with it? He drags the Eden members out to the mall, and puts on a show for them.

Likewise, he messages Saki as a pretext to get some alone time with her. He should have just put the relevant details in the message itself, as that would have been the quickest way to get that information to her.

Haak

2009-06-06, 05:24

SemperMalum

2009-06-06, 05:29

10B Yen = around 100 mil USD no? That's a lot of people, but hardly enough to do anything on the scale at which they are doing. Maybe they get some insane membership discount? Akira bought that hotel earlier right? Those things cost around 100mil USD, that would of been all of his money.....

From my understanding, the money probably went into a bribe that they couldn't refuse.

As for this episode, it was fantastic. I'm like on the edge of my seat waiting for what's next.

And, side note, Oosugi is a very typical though normal character, but as an outside party, it's also very easy to hate on him due to the fact that he's attempting to organize an entire group of 'friends' against Akira. You can understand where he's coming from, but that doesn't necessarily make it 'okay' by the viewer's standards. We only got to view him as a negative character.

golthin

2009-06-06, 06:15

[LIST]
#1 is furious that Panties hacked into the phone and seen the deleted entries, which kinda implies he might have been behind the erase history (and probably the memorywhipe).
logic from ep1, it would be okay to go outside and ask a business man to hand over his own trousers).

people seem to misunderstand something, Pantsu didn't retrieved the erased data from From Akira's phone as many thought Akira wanted to do. He fixed number 4 phone which still have all the history.

@Darknemo2000

Well said. Oosugi is childish jerk, driven by jealousy. I never liked him, but his behavior in this episode truly disgusts me.

He has uncovered some disturbing information about their new acquaintance, and what does he do with it? He drags the Eden members out to the mall, and puts on a show for them.

Likewise, he messages Saki as a pretext to get some alone time with her. He should have just put the relevant details in the message itself, as that would have been the quickest way to get that information to her.
he invited them to see the evidence with their own eyes as he suspect that if he just told them about it, that they will dismiss it as he just making things up out of jealousy. Heck, even all of you that are the audience and know all the facts are saying that he is doing all this out of jealousy. that was Saki's reaction when she saw his text message.

edit:
by the way people, you are free to hate Oosugi, but don't try to reationalize it as if he is doing anything wrong.
He is being an obstacle to the canon couple and if I was still a shipper like I was at the beginning before I found out more about the dangerous game Akira is on, I think I would hate him too. He is just being a friend to the Eden gang, if after they receive all this info and they continue to work with Akira, they can end all just like pantsu. the only member I would be sad to see dead is the loli computer freak.

Darknemo2000

2009-06-06, 06:18

his initial motive was wanting to find out who Akira was. Now after he found out the information he is honestly trying to warn his friends about something dangerous. really, you people make the guy so bad. If it was me, after my friends betray me and rather help the new commer, i wouldn't care less if they all went to hell. I think Oosugi is too nice of a guy for his own good. if after watching this episode and seeing what happened to pantsu, anyone that can keep saying that being involved with Akira is not dangerous is in denial.

And you can be blamed for trying to pull him out as much nicer than he actually is.

Your point? Everyone free to have their own opinion. I see him as jealousy driven guy, who would not be afraid to tell lies for others as long as it would suit him in his purpose (to drive Akira away from Saki). It just matches that the truth is leading the same way, but he is far from a concerned little bunny you try to picture him, I believe.

I find his main drive is the jealousy rather than concern and the search for the truth, and I do not find him a nice guy at all. It is up to each person how one presents Ossugi's motives to be.

We see the acts but we do not see what is the main purpose of these acts (just implications that can have various interpretations) - I believe this drive to be jealousy, you believe that it is a concern like a fluffy, little prince, who is too nice guy for his own good - but again it is up to everyone to believe the way they want.

anomono

2009-06-06, 06:28

Wha the hell are you talking about? He gave the Eden members the info over the phone right? That's the first thing he did.
No need to be a jerk yourself. If you feel that you must respond, at least address the point of my post. Which is to say...

The way he goes about "warning" the others makes his motivation clear; Saki sees right through it, and blows him off. Why does he want to meet her, saying he has something important to say, rather than just writing it?

Oosugi has nothing but unfounded suspicions at this point, and dragging them out to the mall is appealing to their emotion, not reason. At the end, he acts like he is about to deliver some rehearsed propaganda.

Akira is clearly something special, but Oosugi could care less about the quality of his character; he is just grasping for an excuse to get rid of an obstacle to his romantic ambitions. So far, all he has is hearsay and graffiti.

golthin

2009-06-06, 06:32

No need to be a jerk yourself. If you feel that you must respond, at least address the point of my post. Which is to say...

The way he goes about "warning" the others makes his motivation clear; Saki sees right through it, and blows him off. Why does he want to meet her, saying he has something important to say, rather than just writing it?

Oosugi has nothing but unfounded suspicions at this point, and dragging them out to the mall is appealing to their emotion, not reason. At the end, he acts like he is about to deliver some rehearsed propaganda.

Akira is clearly something special, but Oosugi could care less about the quality of his character; he is just grasping for an excuse to get rid of an obstacle to his romantic ambitions. So far, all he has is hearsay and graffiti.

he didn't ask her to meet him, he asked her to give him a call whenever Akira was not around. she just doesn't want to deal with it right now.

drobertbaker

2009-06-06, 06:40

Why does Itazu call Akira "Vintage"?

What's with the tiny pants?

It's "take us back to the post-WW2 era" not "take us back to the pre-WW2 era". 戦後 = sengo =　post-war. This was not a time of nationalism and militarism, but a time of reconstruction and restructuring.

From the images of the evacuation, it looks like IX used the NEETS as fake soldiers and policemen for the evacuation.

The data is being transferred to Mikuru Katsuhara (Micchon).

Did no one notice that IX and X are twins??? Isn't this kind of significant? X used to be a NEET, but now is working with the bureaucrats. IX appears to be some kind of earlier incarnation of X. Oh, that's right! He had his memory erased, which would revert him back to the person he used to be, wouldn't it?

And Johnny is the bridge.

Why, with all the mysteries and significant events in this series, is half the text in this forum devoted to some minor character, his motivations, and how much we dislike him?

Will you still hate Oosugi when he gets the girl? When he's there to console Saki over the self-sacrificing death of IX? IX is doomed and was from the very beginning of the very 1st episode:

"He didn't have a choice in becoming a prince. At least, its because he WAS aware that, for the future we look forward to, someone must take on the role of a prince, as a SACRIFICE. Even though he WAS neither innocent nor virtuous, he became the prince that this world lacked."

Saki was listening outside the door and heard the Itazu-IX conversation so that she knows they are lying to her and keeping secrets. She is being further distanced from IX. Any chance of romance died when he stood her up at the movies. He will be just an interesting story that she will tell to her (and Oosugi's) grandchildren.

izmosmolnar

2009-06-06, 06:43

people seem to misunderstand something, Pantsu didn't retrieved the erased data from From Akira's phone as many thought Akira wanted to do. He fixed number 4 phone which still have all the history.
I'm sorry but no.
Preview episode 9:
"Itazu runs an analysis on Takizawa's cellphone. Finally, Takizawa's past comes to light. According to the activity logs, Selecao No. 10's request for a catastrophic attack on the country has been accepted. In the meanwhile, Selecao No. 10 and Selecao No. 01 make their appearance in front of Itazu's house*.
SOURCE (http://community.livejournal.com/edenoftheeast/27914.html#cutid1) wrote by Silverya. If you are dubious about it we can ask his (her?) japanese source where he translated it from.

Anyway, I would have expected that deleting stuff from the account history will do it on the whole network and not just on a single phone. The purchase history deletion was charged by Juiz, so I have no reason to believe why would anyone order deleting 2 months worth of entry, and specify it that you only want it deleted on one phone, while leaving it intact on the others.

anomono

2009-06-06, 06:47

he didn't ask her to meet him, he asked her to give him a call whenever Akira was not around. she just doesn't want to deal with it right now.
Reading it again, he did only ask her to contact him. He is still using it as an excuse to talk to and persuade her though, rather than just including the vital information.

golthin

2009-06-06, 06:56

I'm sorry but no.
Preview episode 9:

SOURCE (http://community.livejournal.com/edenoftheeast/27914.html#cutid1) wrote by Silverya. If you are dubious about it we can ask his (her?) japanese source where he translated it from.

Anyway, I would have expected that deleting stuff from the account history will do it on the whole network and not just on a single phone. The purchase history deletion was charged by Juiz, so I have no reason to believe why would anyone order deleting 2 months worth of entry, and specify it that you only want it deleted on one phone, while leaving it intact on the others.

well, the phone patsu opened and akira left behind was #4 phone. You can clearly see it when #1 picked it up after he ran pantsu over. It would not be wise to mess with your own phone and run the chance to break it up. akira had TWO phones , so "Takizawa's cellphone" my be refering to his spare. Remember when Kondo died, he told Akira that he could find about his past from his phone. It is obvious that Akira still has his own phone from watching the episode.

Kinny Riddle

2009-06-06, 09:20

Is it me or does the Kyoto Selecao #10, Yuuki, resemble Akira a lot?

From Yuuki's rather timid nature and reaction at Fat Boy getting runned down by his car, it's likely he got goaded by Mononobe, the sinister looking 4-eyed Selecao, into launching those missiles on Careless Monday, leading to Akira to stop them.

(I notice people here calling Mononobe #1, but I didn't notice that. Care to provide some screenshots?)

In other words, by manipulating Yuuki, Mononobe in effect has two Selecao phones, i.e. 20 billion yen at his disposal. I'm guessing he's planning on finishing off Yuuki after he launches the missiles to destroy Japan again, and then use his own 10 billion credit to rebuild Japan, thus "saving" it.

izmosmolnar

2009-06-06, 09:37

(I notice people here calling Mononobe #1, but I didn't notice that. Care to provide some screenshots?)

In other words, by manipulating Yuuki, Mononobe in effect has two Selecao phones, i.e. 20 billion yen at his disposal. I'm guessing he's planning on finishing off Yuuki after he launches the missiles to destroy Japan again, and then use his own 10 billion credit to rebuild Japan, thus "saving" it.
http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/2210/42215985.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=42215985.jpg)
04:11
#1: "Well, let's call all the taxi companies"
#10: That's just like you Mononobe.

As for #1 backstabbing him, or how much he really cares about him... Check out the OP, where #10's badge disappears, just like #4's and #5's. *hint* *hint* ;)

aohige

2009-06-06, 09:41

He's name is Dead Meat as far as I'm concerned, for what he did to Pants.

Will not rest till we see his blood.

Kinny Riddle

2009-06-06, 09:42

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/2210/42215985.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=42215985.jpg)
04:11
#1: "Well, let's call all the taxi companies"
#10: That's just like you Mononobe.

As for #1 backstabbing him, or how much he really cares about him... Check out the OP, where #10's badge disappears, just like #4's and #5's. *hint* *hint* ;)

Excuse me? From that screenshot, I still don't see where Mononobe is referred to as #1.

Jan-Poo

2009-06-06, 09:43

Your point? Everyone free to have their own opinion. I see him as jealousy driven guy, who would not be afraid to tell lies for others as long as it would suit him in his purpose (to drive Akira away from Saki). It just matches that the truth is leading the same way, but he is far from a concerned little bunny you try to picture him, I believe.

I find his main drive is the jealousy rather than concern and the search for the truth, and I do not find him a nice guy at all. It is up to each person how one presents Ossugi's motives to be.

We see the acts but we do not see what is the main purpose of these acts (just implications that can have various interpretations) - I believe this drive to be jealousy, you believe that it is a concern like a fluffy, little prince, who is too nice guy for his own good - but again it is up to everyone to believe the way they want.

Well my point would be that someone should be considered innocent unless proven otherwise. You say that Ohsugi would go as far as to lie to discredit Akira, but where's the proof? He has never lied so far not even once, and if you consider "keeping something secret" a lie then Saki and Akira are as guilty as him.

By saying so you practically confirm that you hate Ohsugi for something you imagine he would do rather than something he actually does.

Anyway I have reasons to think Ohsugi wouldn't act that way because that's what it was shown until he got the info on Akira. He said he would give up on Saki. He said he would just leave the club (If he planned to still win Saki over Akira, why leaving the club? It doesn't make sense).

Now on the serious parts

#10 doesn't seem to suspect #1 being the Supporter strangely.

Yes it appear that neither #10 nor #1 are the supporters. Either way why would they even talk about #9 being the supporter? However they do say that he gave that impression, but why? This is not clear yet...
It looks like #1 had his personal reason to acts against #9, since it appears Akira was an obstacle to his plans.

Desk Ninja-kun from the club says Akira is only famous by 5 name, and not more.

No he says he is known by 5 additional names, so a total of six.

Is that a coincidence or is that really #10 there at the scene? (sorry for shitty quality)

That's definitely Akira ^^;

I don't understand Panties though. Why don't he put his phone on the charger and call him? Surely it could be more efficient to wait 1-2 minutes until the phone is capable to endure a call, than running after them. Additionally why don't he calls Akira through the internet? Or sending a text message through the web shouldn't be unheard for a hacker of his caliber.

The director needed an excuse to make Pantsu get out of his 4,5 tatami room and get ran over by number X's car. At this point I'm not really going to be surprised anymore by such scenario driven events.

about the car, it looks like in Japan driving an import car with the driver seat on the left is a sort of status symbol. The strange thing is that number X could have stopped number I by just pressing the brake. You can press the gas pedal as much as you want, if the brake is down the car won't move.
BTW so much for my theory about number I not doing the killings himself. Anyway I see no reason to believe he killed Hiura...

some additional points:

In this episode we see a twist on the theory that Akira was behind the careless monday. However this is yet another thing hard to explain. Since the order actually came from number X, why they think number IX is involved? Of course they have seen that number IX did all those things to evacuate the area of the attacks, so maybe they think he is buddy buddy with number X. However why number IV thinks Akira is a dangerous guy who killed 20k NEETs seeing as how he out such an effort into preventing any victim from the missile attacks?
Okay Kondo was a pretty stupid guy, but Diana isn't. Itazu didn't really see anything different from any other seleçao and he came to the obvious conclusion that Akira actually wanted to prevent victims from number X actions. So why Diana and Kondo think otherwise? Maybe Hiura got it right, though...

It is however interesting to see this new development. With this additional information it is possible that the 20k NEET abduction was actually done to save them from an impending danger. Maybe one of the other 6 seleçao is planning to kill them all? However the NEETs are going back to Japan, so if this is the case it's a just a temporary solution.

About the order written in red, I'll need some clarifications. It says post-war isn't it? It makes a lot of difference between pre-war and post-war. Pre-war would mean that they strive to take Japan back at its imperialistic agenda. Post-war would mean they want to take Japan back to its economic boom era.
The latter better fit with the bombing but it's quite unrealistic... I mean Japan experienced an incredible economic growth because it started from a bad situation in the first place. By bringing Japan back to that era... would mean to destroy its economy so that people would try hard to restore it... what's the point? °°

Last thing: Anyone noticed at the start of the episode in Itazu's room you can see a poster with "Outsider" written on it. It must be said that actually it's called "Mr Outside" in the anime, but it's still a funny coincidence ^^;

Excuse me? From that screenshot, I still don't see where Mononobe is referred to as #1.

Well... 3:24 Number I makes a call and says "Mononobe desu"...

izmosmolnar

2009-06-06, 09:46

Excuse me? From that screenshot, I still don't see where Mononobe is referred to as #1.
Well what else he can mean? They are speaking with each other and he suddenly blurts out Mononobe at the end of his sentence, like addressing someone. Anyway the scene you were asking for is at 04:11.
As for preferences I still prefer to call him #1.

Kinny Riddle

2009-06-06, 09:47

About the order written in red, I'll need some clarifications. It says post-war isn't it? It makes a lot of difference between pre-war and post-war. Pre-war would mean that they strive to take Japan back at its imperialistic agenda. Post-war would mean they want to take Japan back to its economic boom era.
The latter better fit with the bombing but it's quite unrealistic... I mean Japan experienced an incredible economic growth because it started from a bad situation in the first place. By bringing Japan back to that era... would mean to destroy its economy so that people would try hard to restore it... what's the point? °°

That is the whole point. As Japan lay in ruins, its people actually found the drive and resolve to rebuild the country into the economic powerhouse. Now that the economy is once again becoming decadent, #1 and #10 decide the best way to "save" the country is to start from scratch.

Well what else he can mean? They are speaking with each other and he suddenly blurts out Mononobe at the end of his sentence, like addressing someone. Anyway the scene you were asking for is at 04:11.
As for preferences I still prefer to call him #1.

I'm sorry, I'm still struggling to understand what you mean.

Mononobe was that guy's name, so what was wrong with addressing him as such? And how does that end up being concluded that he's #1? I don't hear or see that number being mentioned.

Edit: Nevermind. It seems we have both misunderstood each other. You thought I was asking when he was called Mononobe, when I was asking why he's called #1. And then I neglected your last sentence that it was only your preference of calling him #1.

aohige

2009-06-06, 09:50

I don't understand Panties though. Why don't he put his phone on the charger and call him?

The director needed an excuse to make Pantsu get out of his 4,5 tatami room and get ran over by number X's car. At this point I'm not really going to be surprised anymore by such scenario driven events.

No, that's not why. It was clearly stated by Pants that contract for the phone was long expired. Dunno if fansub translations (if there are any) didn't catch that or whatnot, but he definitely says it.

Service contracts for cellphones expiring is pretty common to hikikomori. :heh:

Jan-Poo

2009-06-06, 09:58

Kinny Riddle

2009-06-06, 10:08

Lol the subs only say "the power ran out again". BTW is it really that in Japan there isn't a web based SMS service? That's odd °°;

EDIT: Lol I just noticed something looking at that scene. Mushrooms! Mushrooms are growing in Itazu's room!!!
I was thinking the same thing.

Though Fat Boy said Akira only gave him his number but not the email address, so it seems 3G phones there still aren't capable of receiving SMS from the internet just with the phone number alone.

aohige

2009-06-06, 10:12

He said
電源どころか、契約とうに切れとるじゃないかい！

Not only is the power out, the contract's up long ago!

I understand his Hiroshima-accent is a little hard to understand, but still, it's pretty clear what he said.
They need to get a better translator if they're gonna ignore the entire latter half of the sentence. :heh:

Jan-Poo

2009-06-06, 10:15

I know mobile phones in Japan are actually a lot different than in the rest of the world, so I don't know how exactly they work. "SMS" as a term isn't even used, they call it "mail" is in internet e-mail. But I thought it was still an SMS who can be sent to a specific phone number.

電源どころか、契約とうに切れとるじゃないかい！

Not only is the power out, the contract's up long ago!

Well this at least clarify things. But yet it's funny, if he knew the contract expired why he looked for the phone in the first place? XD He certainly didn't notice that looking at the phone since it wasn't working at all °°;

izmosmolnar

2009-06-06, 10:22

edit : oh alright then.

No he says he is known by 5 additional names, so a total of six
Pardon, my mistake. Indeed 5 extra name besides Takizawa. It seems like it was about 6 passport in episode 1 too.
That's definitely Akira ^^
Well it is a quite confusing they are so similar, as I definitely associated on #10 instead, and not on Akira. They could have animated them a bit differently to be honest.
No, that's not why. It was clearly stated by Pants that contract for the phone was long expired. Dunno if fansub translations (if there are any) didn't catch that or whatnot, but he definitely says it.
Thank you very much for clearing this up, the subs I've seen it indeed said that the power ran out.
about the car, it looks like in Japan driving an import car with the driver seat on the left is a sort of status symbol. The strange thing is that number X could have stopped number I by just pressing the brake. You can press the gas pedal as much as you want, if the brake is down the car won't move.
My point is that he shouldn't have been able to change gears with his feet on the accelarator (at least my own Skoda, and my mate's Audi requires the driver to push the break pedal down, otherwise the gear handle won't even move anywhere).
I mean I could explain the hand-break (habit or something), and that the car was always left sided and #10 just went across to the right side, while he speaks (I used to wander around when I'm on the phone too), but #1 shouldn't have started the car like that AFAIK.

As for personal theories regarding #1, I think #1 is someone who currently commits the supporter duties, however in reality #12 is the real supporter.
#1 only received the order to behave like one, however he mustn't tell it to anyone he is someone who had any connection with the Supporter. That's why #10 seems puzzled #9 is not the Supporter, while on the other hand #1 doesn't really seem to care about it.

Jan-Poo

2009-06-06, 10:52

Uh I'm not familiar with automatic transmissions so I have no clue °°

when I was asking why he's called #1

Oh I missed this, I dunno if I'm misunderstanding this again ^^; but you mean you are not sure that the guy we see in this episode who refers to himself as Mononobe is number I?

If that's the case you need to go back to episode 5 where the same character is shown using a seleçao phone with a number I badge on it.

Starry Dust

2009-06-06, 11:45

#10: "but IX is different to cooperate with". If we can believe him, he implies he tried to cooperate with Akira. IDK is that before or after the Careless Monday, where Akira obstructed #10's plan and evacuated the people. Or it's also possible they cooperated up to that point and Akira deceived him in the end, and evacuated them.

I was thinking of that too. Sure Akira could've had easily checked out the other Selecao's history information and maybe solved up the pieces to the puzzle that the missles were going to create a disaster....or maybe he simply used to work with him and I like you said. You gain more knowledge if you work within something instead of observing it from outside.

But I is one manipulative sly bastard :heh:
Clearly X has no backbone. That or both X and I made some compromise on only which would be a lie and will end up badly ( with X, well Yuuki, dying anyways ) I don't want to think of him as stupid but easily influenced and naive. He reminds me of a lost puppy dog following his master.

kamikazex

2009-06-06, 14:22

man this series is sooo awesome....pantsu man cool too pity he had to die. wish this series was longer
also the OP is growing onto me slowly....sounds cooler and cooler everytime i hear it

therewego

2009-06-06, 14:29

BlackDove

2009-06-06, 16:11

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/3803/1244321193934.gif

A FLYING NEET
MAKES NO SOUND

etc.

M.Marangio

2009-06-06, 17:13

[...]you need to go back to episode 5 where the same character is shown using a seleçao phone with a number I badge on it.

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i180/M_Marangio/Eden%20of%20the%20East/th_EdenoftheEast-05-Large16.jpg (http://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i180/M_Marangio/Eden%20of%20the%20East/?action=view&current=EdenoftheEast-05-Large16.jpg)
Screenshot from the random curiosity blog (http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2009/05/07/eden-of-the-east-05/)

So we know 6 Selecao:
I - Mononobe
IV - Kondo (dead)
V - Hajime Hiura (dead)
IX - Akira
X - Yuuki
XI - Kuroha Diana Shiratori

ETA: Mononobe is also Selecao #1 in the official character list (http://juiz.jp/blog/character/). Yuuki is still missing.

Freya

2009-06-06, 22:10

Seriously I hope Ohsugi gets killed off. He's jealous and goes off to do his little investigation only to start misunderstanding.

golthin

2009-06-06, 23:29

Seriously I hope Ohsugi gets killed off. He's jealous and goes off to do his little investigation only to start misunderstanding.

and the Ironic thing is that because of his "jealousy" , he will be the one that has a good chance of surviving. Don't worry, I think the Eden gang will still help Akira regardless of Oosugi's warning and this will cause a big tragic. I predict that at least two members will die and this will weight heavily on Saki. Oosugi will break all ties with the Gang after they still decide to help Akira. He will get a reward for losing the girl, Stay alive.

Kazu-kun

2009-06-06, 23:55

and the Ironic thing is that because of his "jealousy" , he will be the one that has a good chance of surviving. Don't worry, I think the Eden gang will still help Akira regardless of Oosugi's warning and this will cause a big tragic. I predict that at least two members will die and this will weight heavily on Saki. Oosugi will break all ties with the Gang after they still decide to help Akira. He will get a reward for losing the girl, Stay alive.

If Akira needs the Eden club's help to stop #1 (and since Itazu sent the data to Micchon, the plot dictates that Akira's definitely gonna need them), then they have no other choice than help him (even Oosugi), because if those 60 tomahawk missiles really strike Japan, a freaking lot of people (probably including the Eden guys) are gonna die.

golthin

2009-06-07, 00:04

If Akira needs the Eden club's help to stop #1 (and since Itazu sent the data to Micchon, the plot dictates that Akira's definitely gonna need them), then they have no other choice than help him (even Oosugi), because if those 60 tomahawk missiles really strike Japan, a freaking lot of people (probably including the Eden guys) are gonna die.

yeah, that is why i said that Oosugi's effort are meaningless. I doubt Oosugi will help.

Kazu-kun

2009-06-07, 00:10

yeah, that is why i said that Oosugi's effort are meaningless. I doubt Oosugi will help.
If after knowing the truth he still refuses to help, then he's just an asshole. But I don't think he's like that. Once he realizes what really is going on, I think he's going to cooperate with Akira and the Eden guys.

golthin

2009-06-07, 01:06

If after knowing the truth he still refuses to help, then he's just an asshole. But I don't think he's like that. Once he realizes what really is going on, I think he's going to cooperate with Akira and the Eden guys.

yeah, once he find what is going on. The thing is that I don't think he will get a chance to find out what is going on. He already gave the Eden group an ultimatum. I could be wrong and he still go back, but considering he is the only one with a job, the chances of he cutting all ties with them are good.

I think that if Oosugi were to help Akira, people will forgive him. This is of course because people inner hatred for Oosugi is because he is an obstacle to Saki and Akira being together. I actually want Oosugi to cut all ties with the group, a few of the eden group dying and Saki at last resort come asking Oosugi for help to save Akira at the last minute.

Elvanvitar

2009-06-07, 01:45

Looking back at episode 1 and now this it's clear that #1 caught up with Akira and forced him to get naked with a gun in front of the white house. I'm guessing the plan was for him to be killed or something. Who really knows. Is #1 the supporter?

reverse

2009-06-07, 02:12

patsu should be alive if he just ask Saki or Micchon akira email
the possibility that he don't have their email is absurd

Kinny Riddle

2009-06-07, 05:13

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i180/M_Marangio/Eden%20of%20the%20East/th_EdenoftheEast-05-Large16.jpg (http://s72.photobucket.com/albums/i180/M_Marangio/Eden%20of%20the%20East/?action=view&current=EdenoftheEast-05-Large16.jpg)
Screenshot from the random curiosity blog (http://randomc.animeblogger.net/2009/05/07/eden-of-the-east-05/)

So we know 6 Selecao:
I - Mononobe
IV - Kondo (dead)
V - Hajime Hiura (dead)
IX - Akira
X - Yuuki
XI - Kuroha Diana Shiratori

ETA: Mononobe is also Selecao #1 in the official character list (http://juiz.jp/blog/character/). Yuuki is still missing.
Ah that's why. Now it's beginning to make sense.

In episode 1, the man in the car outside the White House telling Juiz that Akira's "finished" is most definitely Mononobe, as he is seen with the ruby ring on his finger, and if you play the video slowly, you can just make out the Roman numeral "I" on his phone.

Of course, there he is again in episode 5, seen with the ruby ring and the #1 phone. Though there was another man whose face wasn't seen, standing next to Mononobe, remarking amusingly about how the PM's approval ratings gone up by just one "gyafun".

Either I could be thinking too much and he's just a normal civil servant colleague of Mononobe's, working in the Ministry of Defense; or he could be another Selecao, the Supporter, or even Mr Outside himself.

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/8892/edenoftheeastmysteryman.th.png (http://img188.imageshack.us/my.php?image=edenoftheeastmysteryman.png)

Though from the look of his phone, it doesn't look like a Selecao phone, so he's probably just a normal civil servant. Then again, it wasn't mentioned whether Mr Outside himself uses a Selecao phone or not.

izmosmolnar

2009-06-07, 05:44

Sorry again for misunderstanding you, I've thought everyone is aware why he is selecao number 1, via seeing his phone a few times already.
That's why I prefer to call him like that, and I don't even bother to remember his real name :p.
As for his colleague I really doubt he's a selecao.

therewego

2009-06-07, 09:02

WanderingKnight

2009-06-07, 10:54

A FLYING NEET
MAKES NO SOUND

etc.

You, sir, are a genius.

Kinny Riddle

2009-06-07, 11:52

Got so involved in the discussion that I forgot to mention this minor oversight to the excellent guys at gg fansubs: You forgot to remove a commercial in between. :cool:

golthin

2009-06-07, 11:55

Got so involved in the discussion that I forgot to mention this minor oversight to the excellent guys at gg fansubs: You forgot to remove a commercial in between. :cool:

they probably were in a rush and the raw the timer used had the commercial, so instead of reencoding the file, sending it back to the timer, they just released it like that.

Raiga

2009-06-07, 12:10

Think of it as more accurate to the original Japanese viewing experience. :P

SkoolRumble4Ya

2009-06-07, 13:12

What is the other two selecao hoping to accomplish by shooting out missiles?

vaden

2009-06-07, 14:02

they probably were in a rush and the raw the timer used had the commercial, so instead of reencoding the file, sending it back to the timer, they just released it like that.

gg did it last week with a Star Trek commercial, too. It's just there for "weird ad, lolwut" more than anything else. (Though it also breaks up the two halves of the episode, so I guess it has some actual function....)

Casshern

2009-06-07, 14:19

I can't believe they killed my favourite character in the second episode he appeared :(

achirist

2009-06-07, 15:26

Osugi is quite a loser here; he is endlessly groping around for evidence, and all he has is a spam thread of a bunch of names on the internet and the fact that someone doesn't like Akira very much. But it could all be solved if Saki bothered to communicate with him and would just let him down gently, let him get his emotions out in her presence. But it is ironic that the people who defend him here spend the rest of their time abusing Akira.

Of course, if/since panties could apparently order food delivered, he also could have paid someone to bring a pair of pants to him and continue at college/not gain 100 pounds, but I see there is a sort of depressive passivity to his neetdom which is the real reason. I honestly can't beleive that Akira left; it would have been quite fine to come up with some excuse; i.e. "we are still trying to crack the phone, so I'm going to stay here and hang out for awhile, but you two can go," they already suspected him, so who cares; keeping the phone/data/learning more secrets should have triumphed all. But no, Akira had no idea anyone would want to kill Itazu or anyone else; and he is a good person, even willing to go so far out of his way to help Osugi, so it is the eden group that should have been up front with him. Akira also saved many thousands of lives by having the missle sites evacuated.

Yet that is interesting; watching this series seriously makes me wonder; is it against the rules of the game for a (non-supporter) Selecao to kill another Selecao?

drobertbaker

2009-06-07, 15:30

What is the other two selecao hoping to accomplish by shooting out missiles?They believe that the country is going to hell as exemplified by the proliferation of NEETs, i.e. a huge proportion of young people who are aimless, selfish, and unproductive.

If the country is reduced to a condition similar to that after World War II (in ruins), these young people will all be imbued with a sense of purpose (reconstruction) and will learn the joys of communal effort and goals. The government will also have to change to restore the constructive values of that time.

I watched a wonderful history of Japan today called Samurai. This kind of opinion does exist in modern Japan and is really a reflection of a deep current in the Japanese psyche, the samurai ideal, bushido.

It's kind of odd, in that these ideals were really made up in a long period of peace, when these warriors who previously were essential to the country, were no longer needed and had nothing to do. So they made up these intense codes of conduct to justify their existence by showing how fanatically loyal, self-sacrificing, and honorable they were (or would be if they had anything to do). And then they would look for (or even try to create) situations where they could demonstrate their suicidal fanaticism.

This attitude is really exemplified by the case of Yukio Mishima in about 1970. Mishima was a right wing writer and philosopher who preached a return to these values and had a following.

Finally he and his friends dressed up in army uniforms and invaded an army base. He gathered the troops together and gave them a long speech, saying that they should join with him and overthrow the government to return to the ancient values. The troops laughed him off the stage so he went in the back and committed traditional seppaku.

Many Japanese were deeply affected by this act and many still revere Mishima today and agree with his principles.

This code seems perverted to me. It was created by obsolete people trying to justify their existence by going so overboard as to defeat their own purpose. For example, they love to prove how honorable and self-sacrificing they are by charging suicidally into enemy fire when there is no hope of success. THIS IS NOT GOOD TACTICS! Just a pointless display of bravery.

The upshot of this outlook is glorious self-destruction, an ideal shared by the German people (see Gotterdamerung). The results can be seen by the outcome (in both countries) of World War II. And we again see the same kind of results here as these lunatics plan to destroy their entire country to "save" it. However the philosophy seems to have a very inspirational effect on the Japanese culture. Go figure.

Kaoru Chujo

2009-06-07, 16:36

I'm confused about the part at the end when Itazu said that "when he made the PM said uncle... the MP of the opposing party started to catch on, but his intelligence source was replaced with a mail from his lover.. so whoever made this phone must be closed to the state power..." i rewatched ep 5 but still couldn't see the connection.. any explanation? thanks!!....I can't exactly hear the Japanese, partly because of Pantsu's Kansai accent, but a Chinese sub translates this as Pantsu saying the Selecao leaked part of the truth to an Opposition member so he would ask a question, sending the info to him in a way to make it look as if it came from his lover. Then Pantsu says that from this it appears the people who made the Selecao phone must be close to state power.

I think the sub now out has a number of problems, actually. I'm waiting for new ones. But I like seeing the commercial there.

And yes, #1 is hot. But cold and brutal, too.... Nice summary of his probable attitude from drobertbaker.

Schneizel

2009-06-07, 17:48

I can't exactly hear the Japanese, partly because of Pantsu's Kansai accent, but a Chinese sub translates this as Pantsu saying the Selecao leaked part of the truth to an Opposition member so he would ask a question, sending the info to him in a way to make it look as if it came from his lover. Then Pantsu says that from this it appears the people who made the Selecao phone must be close to state power.
10 is the one who replaced the sender on the Member of Parliament's SMS from his source, it's on his phone log when shown on Panties' screen. Now why would 10 of all people leak?

BlackDove

2009-06-07, 18:00

You, sir, are a genius.

Why thank you, I do try.

golthin

2009-06-07, 20:14

What is the other two selecao hoping to accomplish by shooting out missiles?

it was already said. Return Japan to post ww-2. Japan had a huge recovery after WW2 and thanks to the effort of its people, japan became an economic superpower. They just want to start over.

orion

2009-06-07, 21:11

Oosugi needs to die. That guy is a jerk. Because he didn't get the girl, he's gong to poison the view of the guy with her and everybody else.

Grafitti on a wall does not mean that he is a killer and all those names may not be his as X looks like !X. He came to the wrong conclusion with very little evidence because he was jealous. What a loser.

I is cruel. He has to be the Supporter. He killed way to easily and without fear of the consequences.

Totally off-topic: Doesn't X remind you of the lead from The Sky Crawlers (Kannami)?

k//eternal

2009-06-07, 21:20

I is cruel. He has to be the Supporter. He killed way to easily and without fear of the consequences.

No way. The Supporter isn't just around to kill the "failures", but as the name implies, also to help them out with achieving the goal.

That guy is just absorbed in the way he plays the game. He might think he's the Supporter, but it's unlikely that he is.

orion

2009-06-07, 21:22

No way. The Supporter isn't just around to kill the "failures", but as the name implies, also to help them out with achieving the goal.

That guy is just absorbed in the way he plays the game. He might think he's the Supporter, but it's unlikely that he is.

The OP is a hint apparently. But we prob won't definitely know until the movie.

magnumcyclonex

2009-06-07, 21:27

That other guy looks similar to Number IX.

Question, who is (no)Pants transferring files to? Eden?

golthin

2009-06-07, 21:28

That other guy looks similar to Number IX.

Question, who is (no)Pants transferring files to? Eden?

yeah to Eden. I think to loli member.

magnumcyclonex

2009-06-07, 21:35

Thanks.

Also, I like the commercials. Seems random, but like someone else said, it makes for a more realistic viewing experience. Keep them in gg!

vaden

2009-06-07, 22:00

The OP is a hint apparently. But we prob won't definitely know until the movie.

Speaking of OP hints...

... the Seleção badge sequence dictates that X is going to be dead by the time this series is out.

Kaioshin Sama

2009-06-07, 23:53

it was already said. Return Japan to post ww-2. Japan had a huge recovery after WW2 and thanks to the effort of its people, japan became an economic superpower. They just want to start over.

I KNEW IT! I knew something like this was going to come up.

suka-pon-tan

2009-06-08, 00:27

wierd. They shot SSM for shoot down aircraft? not SAM? I don`t think Kamiyama and IG make that kind mistake...

btw, Seleceo No3 became my favorit character now.

Haak

2009-06-08, 01:50

But it is ironic that the people who defend him here spend the rest of their time abusing Akira.

No one's been doing that. Everyone has who has been criticising Akira has just been pointing out that he's not perfect either and has his flaws.

Fevvers

2009-06-08, 04:50

golthin

2009-06-08, 06:03

Honestly, for the dangerous position Akira has been placed in, he sure is far from cautious. The careless and laid-back attitude he has been exhibiting, while may not be malicious in nature, is surely (as shown with what's happened with Pantsu here) going to severely hit him on the head.

Exactly, that is my big issue with Akira. the guy is too reckless, it is like he doesn't learn at all. He has met 3 Selecao; one beat the heck out of him, one drugged him and another got him hurt very badly. It is about time he realize he is in a serious business and that the people he involve in the game can get hurt. It is unfair to keep things secret for those people. Now, if he comes out clean and tells all the people of the Eden Gang the info and they still want to help him, then I am all for it. hopefuly once the Eden Gang see the info pantsu sent and ALL the true comes out and they might come and confront Akira, they can make their own choice.

moo_gyuu

2009-06-08, 09:32

wierd. They shot SSM for shoot down aircraft? not SAM? I don`t think Kamiyama and IG make that kind mistake...

Yes, I was wondering about that too. The attack #10 ordered for that date was definitely based on "hacking of a tomahawk missile", but the plane crash we saw reported in the TV clips may have been caused by something else.

And it might also be relevant that while #10's request was for an attack on Toyosu, the impact area we saw was at the end of Harumi Pier, about a mile away from Toyosu. I don't want to think that Juiz would make that sort of miscalculation.

(also, this week's Juiz Call may have had a hint about this 11th missile, but I wish I had a more reliable source for this than /a/nonymous. Does anyone know if those Juiz Call messages are being collected on the web anywhere?)

So anyway, maybe it wasn't an IG mistake after all. There may be something more to that attack we haven't been told about yet.

paradox13

2009-06-08, 11:39

Jack Black

Didn't notice it myself, but now that you mention it......

http://www.collider.com/uploads/imageGallery/Jack_Black/jack_black.jpg

:heh:

And for people who don't check the spoiler threads:

The burst of text at around 15:41 of this week's episode told us a bit about some of the other selecaos.

Details at the Japanese fan wiki http://www36.atwiki.jp/higashino_eden/pages/26.html

#3 - seems decent but doesn't seem to understand the scope of this game. Ordering up tomato salad for jobless+homeless temp workers is good, I guess, but this selecao doesn't seem to be fixing Japan; with tiny requests like "Juiz, please have someone pick up the garbage in this park" they're just dealing with what's right in front of them.

#6 might be just as unambitious, but at least they're having a bit of fun, with "Juiz, karaoke reservations for 60 please".

#7 is interested in corporate misbehaviour, specifically in food adulteration scandals. But they still have 9.1bn yen left on their phone. They should be thinking that when the game ends not only will they be killed, they'll leave most of their money unspent. A waste.

#8 is angry at the bad performance of Japan's national soccer team. Heh. It seems to be really expensive to diagnose and fix though. I think #9 got a bargain in this episode when it only cost him 56 million yen to turn the Carp into a championship team.

What do ppl make of this? Interesting info, to say the least...

Jan-Poo

2009-06-08, 11:45

I bet number 3 is a woman. and number 8 is a man.

Kaoru Chujo

2009-06-08, 14:05

Exactly, that is my big issue with Akira. the guy is too reckless, it is like he doesn't learn at all....His bold, positive, confident, relaxed attitude is also his great strength. The way he marched right into Pantsu's house. The way he put his feet on the chair at the Eden office. The amount of stuff he was willing to tell them. The way he went straight after Oosugi when he thought he had been kidnapped. His apparent past willingness to protect the NEETs from the Selecao who want to off them. Even his smooth acceptance of finding himself naked in front of the White House, and then his bold sweeping up of Saki on his way back to Japan.

Sure he's reckless, but that's how he gets things done. Quite a breath of fresh air for Saki, after being with people like Oosugi and the other club members. This guy is a warrior. But that also means death and injury follow him about. As usual, his strength is his weakness.

I was looking for a compendium of Juiz Call answers in the wiki, but only found a nice section on the geography (http://www36.atwiki.jp/higashino_eden/pages/60.html) of the show, with a map (http://maps.google.co.jp/maps/ms?hl=ja&gl=jp&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&msa=0&msid=101940109380507078404.00046a9b4999f5fa637dc&ll=35.636651,139.764633&spn=0.3153,0.697632&z=11), as well as a full list of every Selecao's phone records (http://www36.atwiki.jp/higashino_eden/pages/26.html). (all in Japanese)