The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya - Episode 22 Discussion / Poll [2009 added ep. 12]

[monir]

Welcome to the discussion thread for Suzumiya Haruhi (2009), Episode 12.

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[Daniel E.]

Oh, I wanna see Tsuruya.... and Mikuru Beam... and Yuki jumping on Mikuru for doing just that. :D

Or at the very least, I wanna know why she actually jumps on her! :heh: Been wondering about that scene since the very beginning of the first season. :meh:

[monir]

I wanna see Mikuru fire her AK 47... te-te-te-te-te :naughty:

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Or at the very least, I wanna know why she actually jumps on her! :heh: Been wondering about that scene since the very beginning of the first season. :meh:

Because it's fun to pounce on Mikuru? Haruhi seems to be addicted to it. :p

[Daniel E.]

Because it's fun to pounce on Mikuru? Haruhi seems to be addicted to it. :p

Can't really blame her for getting addicted to that. :D

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

I'd imagine she'd be very comfortable, what with those incredibly large-- I'm gonna stop right there. :heh:

[Daniel Lind]

I wanna see Mikuru fire her AK 47... te-te-te-te-te
Didn't we already see that in Episode 12 (21)?

[ac195]

Mikuru beam!!!

[Kaisos Erranon]

Ah, this ought to be a good episode. It'll shut up the people who are complaining about how boring this arc is.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

But it has been boring. :heh:

[ac195]

Isn't it the typical Haruhi formula? Ordinary followed by extraordinary?

[Kaisos Erranon]

Isn't it the typical Haruhi formula? Ordinary followed by extraordinary?

"Ordinary situations cause extraordinary problems which are solved by mundane solutions."

Yeah, pretty much.

[Heatth]

I would say I think this arc the most boring of all Haruhi.... Exept last episode proved Sighs is better to be watch then to be read :p

[Philos]

Mikuru Beeeeeemmmm!!!

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb175/ierahc/anime/melancholy%20of%20haruhi%20suzumiya/mikuru_1.gif

[Sinfully Naomi]

Don't you fire at me with your $6 budget.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

I highly doubt the literary club only had $6 to work with. :heh:

[Peanutbutter003]

Mikuru Biiiiiiiiiimmmuuuuu!!! :D

[quigonkenny]

Mikuru Beeeeeemmmm!!!

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb175/ierahc/anime/melancholy%20of%20haruhi%20suzumiya/mikuru_1.gif
Is it just me, or does looking at the wonderful animation in that gif make everyone else sad when they think about the current arc? I mean, she actually has real hands...

[Dakota]

Is it just me, or does looking at the wonderful animation in that gif make everyone else sad when they think about the current arc? I mean, she actually has real hands...

Yeah, that animation is pretty wonderful. The special effects are even better. :D

[Jonbob0008]

My guess is that the "scene" won't be until the episode after this one. Anyone agree?

[Mr. Turnabout]

Yeah, I'm waiting to watch it on [a website that can't be named here] right now.
I really hope the Beam happens today.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

My guess is that the "scene" won't be until the episode after this one. Anyone agree?

Just keep in mind that they severely underplayed Nagato's little witch debut last week. That "scene" will most likely be toned down.

Can't have people completely despising their cash cow, now can they? :rolleyes:

[Jonbob0008]

I'd be pretty upset if they did. The scene's pivotal toward understanding Haruhi's character development in the later story arcs. Without it, we instead have Haruhi becoming more humane and empathetic for no reason. It wouldn't make sense.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

And yet they'd do it for the exact reason I mentioned.

[haruhi.ism]

My guess is that the "scene" won't be until the episode after this one. Anyone agree?

i agree, this arc has so far left us on a little cliffhanger, if you will, each episode, especially the last one, where we thought we were gonna get a mikuru beaaaaaam, but didn't.

but man, am i excited to see it!!
MIKURU BEAAAAAAAAM

[Mr. Turnabout]

A Hour is Left Now......

[Mr Bland]

I have a good feeling about today's episode. Can't wait for Tsuruya!

[Dakota]

IT'S ON

Mikuru beeeeeeeeam~~

[Sho-tan]

Uweeeeeeee~

Kyun

[GMT]

Bwahaha! Nyoron-Churuya-san!

[Sho-tan]

Beam is imminent.

[Triple_R]

Just keep in mind that they severely underplayed Nagato's little witch debut last week. That "scene" will most likely be toned down.

Can't have people completely despising their cash cow, now can they? :rolleyes:


Well, K-On's their cash-cow now, and they're probably planning to continue to make Haruhi more K-On-esque...

With that in mind, I also expect "the scene" to be played down. Every Sighs novel scene that was semi-interesting/semi-controversial has been played down so far. :heh:

I agree with Jonbob, though, that I don't expect to see the scene this episode. It'll probably be the next one.

[freakonboard]

In before someone asks;

http://dec.2chan.net/24/res/4098859.htm
http://dec.2chan.net/24/res/4098863.htm

[Triple_R]

In before someone asks;

http://dec.2chan.net/24/res/4098859.htm
http://dec.2chan.net/24/res/4098863.htm

Judging by the images at those links...



1. Haruhi looks to be very K-Onified again. :(

2. She does look really kickass in her Tomb Raider impersonation bits though! :D

3. Tsuruya is back! YAY!!!

4. ...And, though its hard to tell, it looks like Kyon makes some sort of move against Haruhi in this episode... maybe even a punch! This could be exciting! :eyespin:

[ramlaen]

yuki's hand...

[Jonbob0008]

So...maybe that scene really did happen? Good!

[Peanutbutter003]

Oh well, kinda stuck after Tsuruya's first line in S2.

At least Mikuru Beam is out. And Haruhi is....yeah. :twitch:

[SidVicious]

Yuki is awesome. :D

[Game8910]

best episode of Sighs by far

[Daniel Lind]

Awesome.

1) Asahina gets some good moments -- Mikuru Beam is DONE COMPLETELY RIGHT, also some moemoe activites.
2) Itsuki talkingtalkingtalkingtalkingtalkingtalkingtalkingt alkingtalking
3) Ewww, Yuki's hand... That must have hurt.
4) TSURUYA POWER HUUUUUG
5) Kyon showed Haruhi who is the boss. Seems like they are NOT going to censor you-know-which scene.

[W-General]

best episode of Sighs by far

Agreed.

Too bad the justin broadcast died. Gotta have to wait a couple hours for it to show up in other sources...

The art seems comparatively more stable in this episode.


:( Haruhi's completely an ass in this episode. Is the entire sighs arc to build up for audience's love for Nagato?

[Heminga13]

I missed the beginning and end. :(

Oh well, it's not like I won't see it again tonight.

[Jonbob0008]

Well, I for one am a happy camper, and I will eagerly await for this episode to come out on whatever source I can find it. I'll probably watch it raw and then subbed. :p

[GMT]

Oh well, kinda stuck after Tsuruya's first line in S2.

At least Mikuru Beam is out. And Haruhi is....yeah. :twitch:

And the Mikuru Beam was done right. KyoAni did their homework for this one. High-energy lasers really do behave like that in real life.

Also, epic growling, angry Kyon is epic.

[W-General]

And the Mikuru Beam was done right. KyoAni did their homework for this one. High-energy lasers really do behave like that in real life.

Also, epic growling, angry Kyon is epic.

Plus also good to see Tsuruya san again :D :D :D

[haruhi.ism]

i missed the beginning and end, but what i did see, i'm VERY happy with

the K-ON look was toned down, which is a big plus,
and whoa, yuki. she's always epic.
and YAY tsuruya-san!!


-needs to see it again nowwww-

[Game8910]

Nagato was epic this episode, then again she always is XD

Mikuru was a moe machine I hnnnnnnnnggggg

Haruhi was.....Haruhi

also FAK YEAR KYON MANNED THE FUCK UP

[Ithekro]

Missed just the ended as Tsuruya starts to speak. But everything else was fine. Finally get to see why Kyon's camera goes all weird during the Mikuru Beam scene...though he doesn't even catch the half of it.

[Yumii-chan]

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i259/LillaMysen/1251388135508.jpg

[spawnofthejudge]

Is the entire sighs arc to build up for audience's love for Nagato?*can't stop laughing*

[haruhi.ism]

nice, yumii-chan!
^__^

[Toonleap]

MIKURU BEAM!!!!!!!!!! (http://www.cartoonleap.com/2009/08/27/haruhi-second-season-ep-22-mikuru-beam/)

Will update it later because my boss is around.... :(

[Ice Block]

Three things:

Mikuru Beamu! -- done perfectly.
Ep 00 camera effects -- overexposure, underexposure, blurred zoom + focus effects (guess what this was used on this ep :heh:), camera bob
LOL-fang-tan -- the feed died on her portrait, nyoron~.. :(


Good art and animation althroughout. Got surprised by a few scenes (having read Sighs two years ago and forgotten a few events -- thank god for being unspoiled), and Koizumi's expositions were longer than expected. Preemptively rating 10/10 (later when the poll actually opens), as it can only get better with subs and higher quality video.

----------

And this rerun was never "K-Onified" to begin with. K-On!'s art style was a field test of the "new designs" that were brought up by KyoAni a few years ago (though altered to be more Lucky Star-ish). Biggest evidence: K-On! anime character design is rather different from the source 4koma (compare with Google (http://images.google.com.ph/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=k-on)). Admittedly, the first thing that came to my mind (in terms of character design) when I first saw the K-On CM was "Kannagi + Haruhi".

[Triple_R]

----------

And this rerun was never "K-Onified" to begin with. K-On!'s art style was a field test of the "new designs" that were brought up by KyoAni a few years ago (though altered to be more Lucky Star-ish). Biggest evidence: K-On! anime character design is rather different from the source 4koma (compare with Google (http://images.google.com.ph/images?hl=en&source=hp&q=k-on)).

That's why it's called K-Onified, and not "4Koma-ified".

Look, accept the fact that a lot of people don't like the art changes, and everybody knows exactly what is meant by "K-Onified". Given that the art style keeps altering from one episode to the next to the next, people are naturally going to bring up the art style.

[Game8910]

then again people seems to have forgotten that this animation style is actually the one used in Munto....so in other words this animation is "Muntofied", since K-ON wasnt the first to use it :|

[Triple_R]

then again people seems to have forgotten that this animation style is actually the one used in Munto....so in other words this animation is "Muntofied", since K-ON wasnt the first to use it :|

K-On is way more more well-known (through out the internet as a whole, at least) than Munto is. When using a short-hand term through out the internet as a whole, it helps to use a term that people instantly can recognize the meaning behind. Hence, using "K-Onified" instead of "Muntofied".

Munto may have originated the art style, but K-On popularized it.

[Game8910]

K-On is way more more well-known (through out the internet as a whole, at least) than Munto is. When using a short-hand term through out the internet as a whole, it helps to use a term that people instantly can recognize the meaning behind. Hence, using "K-Onified" instead of "Muntofied".

Munto may have originated the art style, but K-On popularized it.

I know...makes me wonder why munto was never popular to begin with....i mean...this was a KyoAni show and they are usually the popular guys

[Triple_R]

I know...makes me wonder why munto was never popular to begin with....i mean...this was a KyoAni show and they are usually the popular guys

In general, I think that Anime Suki overestimates the value of the question of "What animation studio produced it?" in the minds of the fans. When trying to determine what anime I want to check out, I don't even think about "What animation studio produced it?", honestly. That's not even a factor in determining what anime I watch.

[Heatth]

I believe Kyoani become popular after Munto.

What studio produce the serie is important, yes. I believe it is why people watch Lucky*Star and K-ON in the first place.

About the episode, very good one. Specially the Mikuru Beam very well done. I loved Itsuki scared face after have understand what was happening (and Mikuru was looking to him).

[Philos]

Did anyone notice this?
http://upic.me/i/rk/uptv0040782vert.jpg

Others(except Kyon) stay like previous episode.

[Heatth]

I did, last chapter. Haven't checkd this one though.

[haruhi.ism]

hmm? i didn't get to see the ED, the broadcast had cut off

[Daniel Lind]

Credits modification is nothing new.
I remember in one of Melancholies, Haruhi and Kyon names were THIS BIG.

[Ice Block]

And in Melancholy V, Haruhi had the first slide of the credit roll all to herself.

@Heatth: Game was referring to Munto TV I believe. New content on that series used the so called "K-On art style". KyoAni rose to popularity with Air TV and FMP Fumoffu + TSR (leap in quality from Gonzo -> KyoAni was exponential). Coming into Haruhi 06, KyoAni was known for their "kami sakuga" works. Quoting from the General Anime forum:
Kyo-Ani

Abbreviation for the anime production studio Kyoto Animation. Obviously, the name comes from because that they are located in Kyoto.

They started off as a finalization touch up studio for Mushi-Pro. However, as their production values increased, they became a gross-uke (a secondary genga studio responsible to make several episodes at the request of a larger company). Their high quality job began to be noticed by major studios such as Shin-ei, Sunrise, and Pierrot. Their quality was so high that the major studios actually reshuffled some episodes to match Kyo-Ani's schedules so they could get a very important episode that is worthy of a high quality animation.

Their major breakthrough came when they were given the entire anime production rights for "Full Metal Panic? Fumoffu." Many fans had its doubts, especially when they knew how GONZO screwed up the first "Full Metal Panic!", let alone having a company that not many people (other than people outside of the industry) knew about. However, when the box was opened, the beautiful OP sequence and vivid colors of the animation substantially increased Kyo-Ani's name as a "high quality animation studio." When they pulled off "AIR" with godly sakuga quality of flowing hairs and masterful storyline true to the original story, Kyo-Ani was established as a reputable anime production studio.

Since then, they were given "Full Metal Panic? Fumoffu," and currently makes "Suzumiya Haruhi no Yuutsu." This autumn, they will release the remake of "Kanon," which is highly rumored that Baba CEO of Key/VisualArt's personally requested to Kyo-Ani. Gatoh Shoji, the author of "Full Metal Panic," also has a large preference of Kyo-Ani's production quality that it is highly expected that other "Full Metal Panic!" novels will become animated through Kyo-Ani as well. Kyo-Ani has established itself as a respected company in the tough world of anime production companies; so much that once fans learn that a certain title will be made by Kyo-Ani, they all sigh in relief and praise that the title was "worthy of being animated by the gods at Kyo-Ani."
----------

That's why it's called K-Onified, and not "4Koma-ified".Because all 4komas have K-On! 4koma's art stlye?
Look, accept the fact that a lot of people don't like the art changes, and everybody knows exactly what is meant by "K-Onified". Given that the art style keeps altering from one episode to the next to the next, people are naturally going to bring up the art style.
Or, you could accept the fact that the art shift is here to stay and there's nothing you can do about it. So stubborn. By comparison, Hayate no Gotoku fan complaints only lasted until ~episode 2 (OVA, 1, 2).
In general, I think that Anime Suki overestimates the value of the question of "What animation studio produced it?" in the minds of the fans. When trying to determine what anime I want to check out, I don't even think about "What animation studio produced it?", honestly. That's not even a factor in determining what anime I watch. Are you on the other side of the internet? Design, style, reputation, and genre and general expertise. Unless you watch all shows on the seasonal charts, these are what you take note on animation companies in order to determine which shows to follow, which to marathon, gloss over, pass, etc., helping you pick shows which you have no background about.

[Heatth]

And in Melancholy V, Haruhi had the first slide of the credit roll all to herself.

@Heatth: Game was referring to Munto TV I believe. New content on that series used the so called "K-On art style". KyoAni rose to popularity with Air TV and FMP Fumoffu + TSR (leap in quality from Gonzo -> KyoAni was exponential). Coming into Haruhi 06, KyoAni was known for their "kami sakuga" works. Quoting from the General Anime forum:


Eh, I know that. Munto was created before Kyoani becomes popular right?

Also really don't matter how the new style is called. People call it K-ONstyle because it wa the first popular anime to use it. "No one" knows Munto, so call it Munto style is kinda pointless.

(also, "no one" know the 4koma K-ON as no "one know" the 4koma Lucky*Star)

By 'no one' I mean 'most people' and, for this forum intent 'most Haruhi's fans'.

[Triple_R]

Or, you could accept the fact that the art shift is here to stay and there's nothing you can do about it.

Or, you could accept the fact that fans can like a show overall, and still make constructive criticism of elements of it.

I get the feeling that some Haruhi fans think that you have to be gung-ho 100% supportive of everything the anime/franchise does in order to be a fan of it. Well, no, you don't. Being a fan of something doesn't mean giving a thumbs up to everything about it.

Also, there is no consistent art shift, Ice Block. That's what's causing the art style discussions to continue. If Haruhi 2009 was K-Onified all the time, I probably would have dropped the subject by now... if not the anime itself, to be brutally frank. However, the art style for the new episodes this year is all over the board.

At times, it's very close to Haruhi 2006 art style (last episode was very close to 2006 art style). Other times, it's very close to K-On's art style. Such a wide range of art styles from episode to episode is practically begging for fan feedback - for all we know, KyoAni may be reading message boards to see which art styles generate the most positive feedback and which art styles generate the most negative feedback. So, I'm naturally going to vocally support the art styles that I like (such as episode 8 and 11) and vocally critique those that I don't (such as episode 1 and 10).

I see enough touches - and even long sequences - of Haruhi 2006 art style to keep my hope alive that we may get that art style back yet. Or, at least, something close enough to it that I'm happy with it anyway (such as last episode).


So stubborn.

It's not about being stubborn. It's simply about recognizing that the art style fluctuates from episode to episode, and hence I speak better of the art styles that I like the most.



Are you on the other side of the internet? Design, style, reputation, and genre and general expertise.

You don't need to even know what animation studio is doing the anime in order to judge the design, style, and genre of that anime. A simple google image search will tell you design - a simply YouTube video will tell you style - and a simple Wiki look up will tell you genre.


Unless you watch all shows on the seasonal charts, these are what you take note on animation companies in order to determine which shows to follow, which to marathon, gloss over, pass, etc., helping you pick shows which you have no background about.

How I determine what animes shows to try is...

1) How much the concept and premise behind the anime intrigues me.

2) How much I like the character designs.

3) What my fellow anime-watching friends have to tell me about the anime in question.

4) The general impression I get from the anime through reading fans talking about it (on message boards like this one), and/or from reading up on the anime on Wiki.


I've seen great animes by JC Staff, I've seen great animes by Gainax, I've seen great animes by Kyoto Animation, I've seen great animes by Shaft, I've seen great animes by countless different animation studios.

To think that any animation studio holds a monopoly on quality anime is false thinking, imo. It's also false thinking, I think, to think that any particular animation studio can do no wrong.

[Daniel Lind]

Must we still bring artstyle issue up?
The corpse has been beaten to a second death already and that was back during Endless Eight.

[ReneeBurossamu]

OH GOD
I really, really have to see this episode.

[Ice Block]

Eh, I know that. Munto was created before Kyoani becomes popular right?

Also really don't matter how the new style is called. People call it K-ONstyle because it wa the first popular anime to use it. "No one" knows Munto, so call it Munto style is kinda pointless.

(also, "no one" know the 4koma K-ON as no "one know" the 4koma Lucky*Star)

By 'no one' I mean 'most people' and, for this forum intent 'most Haruhi's fans'.
Munto OVA 1, yep. Released a few months before Fumoffu. And yeah, incorrect labeling doesn't really matter (in the long run and to everyone else). I just feel that this labeling seems somehow... incorrect, IMO.
Or, you could accept the fact that fans can like a show overall, and still make constructive criticism of elements of it
...and not act like they're stuck in a time loop. I guess people are tsundere for E8 after all. This is all fine, however I am not pleased with the constant degradation of certain shows just because they "delayed" Haruhi and somehow affected its holiness. This is inevitable though, as I was expecting Haruhi to push everything else down when it kicks into high gear, and if it falters then the preceding shows would take the butt of the whine stick.

Just to be clear:
zzz K-On style again... = bad
what the fuck did they do to the character designs?! = good

And, sorry to crush your hopes, but we're not getting the old art style back. Animation quality, perhaps, and it is getting there. Art style? No. Or have you not differentiated these two?
Also, there is no consistent art shift, Ice Block. That's what's causing the art style discussions to continue. If Haruhi 2009 was K-Onified all the time, I probably would have dropped the subject by now... if not the anime itself, to be brutally frank. However, the art style for the new episodes this year is all over the board.There were only two episodes that were "K-Onified", E8 3 and 4. And there is (was) a consistent art shift. Character portraits from different episodes may not be totally superimposable, but the general "style" (character design) is preserved throughout, except E8 3, and to a lesser extent E8 4. And, to be curious, how much of K-On! did you actually watch?

And whining =/= doing something about it. And I hope discussion regarding this matter ends here.

I've seen great animes by JC Staff, I've seen great animes by Gainax, I've seen great animes by Kyoto Animation, I've seen great animes by Shaft, I've seen great animes by countless different animation studios.Coincidentally, all the named studious here are currently popularly considered "Above Average". What I'm trying to say is that the animation company handling a show should be your first reference, provided you are familiar with the company's previous works. And this is mostly in terms of expectations. You don't pick up a show by Studio Deen and proceed to complain about animation quality. You don't pick up a Gonzo show and then complain about "bad and confusing" endings. Likewise, you don't pick up a KyoAni show and complain about lack of original content. You don't pick up a Sunrise mecha show and complain about stock "scene templates" during MS battles. You don't pick up a SHAFT show and complain about getting SHAFTed. (You don't expect to be pleased by the Toei adaptation of a KEY game.)

Most companies have their quirks and specialties, niches if you will (ex: Sunrise - Mecha). They stick to these for higher chances of win, since they have usually mastered the formula over time. But isn't it interesting when you see a studio tackle on something from outside it's niche? Of course it is, but you'd have to come to it with lower expectations (ex: KyoAni - Munto TV).

[Oyajitchi]

My guess is that the "scene" won't be until the episode after this one. Anyone agree?

EGAD~!

DON'T SAY THAT! (You'll jinx us ya' know?)

But anyway I rather enjoy the current arc and season. Sure the whole "Endless Eight" thing with basically the same episode 8 times and was annoying but what about all the talk about it and the anticipation that the Arc ends next week?, looking forward to see if the Endless Summer will finally cease?

Brilliant suspense I'd say.

Also you have to realize that Haruhi is at a second season now after so many years, so think of it this way, "It's been so long since a new season and now it is finally here, enjoy it while it lasts."

That is all! :P

[khryoleoz]

But it has been boring. :heh:
I kinda agree with this about this arc. Frankly I found the actually movie to be more enlightening as a foreshadowing of what things were to come in the show. The making of the film was a tedious read for me. Not that there weren't things I couldn't enjoy, but I definitely can't call volume 2 my favorite.

I much preferred 9 episodes of Endless Eight over the preparations for the culture festival wherein Kyon and Haruhi's relationship is strained to a very low point. Does what I wrote just now count as a spoiler?

[Triple_R]

Munto OVA 1, yep. Released a few months before Fumoffu. And yeah, incorrect labeling doesn't really matter (in the long run and to everyone else). I just feel that this labeling seems somehow... incorrect, IMO.

Frequent legitimate comparisons have been drawn between how Haruhi looks in some of the new episodes (far from all, but some), and how Yui looks in K-On.

Haruhi's character design, this year, is frequently (not always, but frequently) K-Onified. So are Yuki and Mikuru's character designs, but I don't care that much about their character design changes, since its arguably an improvement anyway, and also since the basic distinctive look of the two characters has been retained. In Haruhi's case, though, her distinctive look has been compromised at times, imo.




...and not act like they're stuck in a time loop.

Nobody is stuck in a time loop. The art style changes considerably from episode to episode, imo. I respect that you don't see it that way, but I do. That makes it a legitimate topic for discussion, imo.


This is all fine, however I am not pleased with the constant degradation of certain shows just because they "delayed" Haruhi and somehow affected its holiness.

I'm not degrading any shows. I'll be the first to say that K-On's art style is perfectly fine for K-On itself. It suits the general mood and feeling of that show quite nicely.

It doesn't suit the general mood and feeling of Haurhi's show, imo.

Everything I say about the art style... or for that matter, pretty much everything I say about the anime - is just my opinion. If you don't agree, fine.


This is inevitable though, as I was expecting Haruhi to push everything else down when it kicks into high gear, and if it falters then the preceding shows would take the butt of the whine stick.

It seems like any kind of criticism is automatically "butt hurt", or "nerd rage", or now "whine stick". It's as though if anything deviates the slightest bit from pure 100% praise, it's unacceptable.

Is this really what you want for episode discussion? Just an echo chamber of nothing but praise - even when its undeserved - with out the slightest serious critique whatsoever?

Heatth made a good point on one of the character discussion threads when he said that in order for discussions there to be good, you need to have at least somebody there who doesn't like the character. That keep debate exciting, and lively, imo.




And, sorry to crush your hopes, but we're not getting the old art style back.

And you know this how?

The art style is constantly changing, imo. Episode 11 looked considerably different from episode 10 - and these are two of the three most recent episodes. Episode 11 did look very close to Haruhi 2006 in my view. So... why is it impossible for the old art style to come back?




Animation quality, perhaps, and it is getting there. Art style? No. Or have you not differentiated these two?

Of course I know the difference.

Art style = character and setting design. How characters and settings are drawn, colored, inked, and lighted/shaded in a still picture.

Animation = The quality and effect of visual flow from one frame to the next. It's the art work in motion.



There were only two episodes that were "K-Onified", E8 3 and 4.

I disagree. Episode 10 looked very K-Onified to me.


And there is (was) a consistent art shift.

No, it hasn't been consistent at all, imo.


Character portraits from different episodes may not be totally superimposable, but the general "style" (character design) is preserved throughout, except E8 3, and to a lesser extent E8 4. And, to be curious, how much of K-On! did you actually watch?

11 episodes as of this writing.


And whining =/= doing something about it.

Not all criticism is whining.


And I hope discussion regarding this matter ends here.

Well, if you choose not to respond to my post here, then I probably won't bring the art style up again, aside from a possible blog review of the episode in the near future.




Coincidentally, all the named studious here are currently popularly considered "Above Average".

Really? I've heard quite a bit of criticism made towards Gainax, JC Staff, and Shaft.

KyoAni appears to be the only sacrosanct animation studio...


What I'm trying to say is that the animation company handling a show should be your first reference,

Why? I have found that my entirely different approach to choosing animes to sample and watch has served me extremely well. Why should I stop using an approach that works for me?


...provided you are familiar with the company's previous works. And this is mostly in terms of expectations. You don't pick up a show by Studio Deen and proceed to complain about animation quality. You don't pick up a Gonzo show and then complain about "bad and confusing" endings. Likewise, you don't pick up a KyoAni show and complain about lack of original content.

I disagree.

What you're suggesting is glossing over a flaw (in some cases, a big flaw - bad endings are a big flaw, in my opinion) in an anime just because of the typical flaws of the studio that produces it.

Sure, you can say, for example "Well, it has the typical Gainax ending, but other than that, it's a great anime!", but that doesn't mean you should just completely dismiss the poor ending as though it never happened. There's nothing forcing Gainax to create the sort of endings that they do - they could choose to make a different sort of ending if they wanted to.

Even famous movie directors can break off their personal beaten path and alter their style from time to time. No doubt constructive criticism for some of their typical flaws is what lead them to do it.


You don't pick up a Sunrise mecha show and complain about stock "scene templates" during MS battles.

I agree with you here, but only because of budgeting considerations.


But isn't it interesting when you see a studio tackle on something from outside it's niche?

Exactly. Well said.

And what causes that is people pointing out things like "Hey, Gainax, do you think you could do something other than deeply metaphysical and not-so-happy endings for a change?" or "Hey, KyoAni, do you think you could do something a little less moeblob for a change?".

[Vexx]

What worked beatifully for K-On! just seems to work less well here in terms of art style. Haruhi's storyline has some pretty serious edges to it -- the first season style was closer to seinen works like Hataraki Man which gave it the serious edge power when it needed it. This style is fine for the comedy but falters a bit when serious things start to happen.

It doesn't *ruin* the series - but for a number of viewers it does reduce the power of the series a bit. I haven't yet watched the current episodes in chrono order with the original first season so I'm wondering just how jarring the difference is.

I'm also often wondering where the "money shots" are this season (the ones that Kyo-Ani knocks out of the park). Hopefully, they're saving budget for that set of 14 eps people seem to see on the horizon. There have been a few (I liked the forceful moment when Kyon is breaking the time loop and we see hundreds of Haruhi leaving the cafe).

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Just wondering...
Are those people who STILL bring up K-On this episode, going to continue doing so for the rest of Sigh?

I want to discuss this episode for what's in it, not hearing the same complaints every week. Accept it and get over it. Doing this for one week is enough, you are getting in the way of real discussions.

[Triple_R]

Just wondering...
Are those people who STILL bring up K-On this episode, going to continue doing so for the rest of Sigh?

I want to discuss this episode for what's in it, not hearing the same complaints every week. Accept it and get over it. Doing this for one week is enough, you are getting in the way of real discussions.

What "real discussions" are being blocked?

I don't know if anybody has noticed this, but... this thread would be almost dead right now, if not for the discussion on art style. If you eliminated all the posts made in the last three or four hours that mentioned art style, you'd be left with hardly anything - three posts, I think.

It seems to me that if people want us art critics to quiet down then they ought to offer up something else to talk about. So, with that being said... what specific piece of "what's in the episode" do you want to talk about?

And it's each individual fan's choice if they're going to "accept" something or not. There's "living with it", but "accept" implies something a bit stronger than that, imo.

[ReneeBurossamu]

Wow, the episode starts up abruptly again. Though I should've expected.

By the way, raws are out.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

What "real discussions" are being blocked?

I don't know if anybody has noticed this, but... this thread would be almost dead right now, if not for the discussion on art style. If you eliminated all the posts made in the last three or four hours that mentioned art style, you'd be left with hardly anything - three posts, I think.

It seems to me that if people want us art critics to quiet down then they ought to offer up something else to talk about. So, with that being said... what specific piece of "what's in the episode" do you want to talk about?

And it's each individual fan's choice if they're going to "accept" something or not. There's "living with it", but "accept" implies something a bit stronger than that, imo.

That's only because the Raw isn't out yet. There would be plenty more discussion on the episode when the raws and subs come out.
(I would comment, but I missed the Justin screening this week)

And being a critic doesn't mean saying the same things every week. Why don't you just say "I hate the K-On style" at the start of every episode thread before the show aired to get it over with?

Let me repeat my question; are you going to complain about the art style every week from now on, or are you going to let it go eventually?

[Vexx]

Just wondering...
Are those people who STILL bring up K-On this episode, going to continue doing so for the rest of Sigh?

I want to discuss this episode for what's in it, not hearing the same complaints every week. Accept it and get over it. Doing this for one week is enough, you are getting in the way of real discussions.
So I guess you'd rather hear the same praise week after week.... that's okay is it? :)

There's really not much to discuss here since we're just seeing the behind-the-scenes making of the ep0 film. As others have said... mostly this reveals how exhausting it is dealing with energetic Haruhi on a daily basis.

I suppose we could get really analytical and do a tight comparison between the film we saw in ep0 and whether the poor continuity editor went insane trying to connect all the dots for these episodes.

[Proto]

So I guess you'd rather hear the same praise week after week.... that's okay is it?

Yup, positive thinking is good by definition. :)

[Heatth]

That's only because the Raw isn't out yet. There would be plenty more discussion on the episode when the raws and subs come out.
(I would comment, but I missed the Justin screening this week)

And being a critic doesn't mean saying the same things every week. Why don't you just say "I hate the K-On style" at the start of every episode thread before the show aired to get it over with?

Let me repeat my question; are you going to complain about the art style every week from now on, or are you going to let it go eventually?

As the art style did change a little every week, I don't think why we shoul stop discussing the matter.

[Triple_R]

That's only because the Raw isn't out yet. There would be plenty more discussion on the episode when the raws and subs come out.
(I would comment, but I missed the Justin screening this week)

Ok... I'm going to admit some ignorance here. What's the Justin screening?

I have to admit that I thought that the raw was already out. The reason being this post...

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i259/LillaMysen/1251388135508.jpg

That's a very large screen-shot, and it struck me as indicating that the raw was out (again, I emphasize that I don't know what the Justin screening is). It left me baffled as to why there wasn't more discussion.

So, if people aren't going to talk about anything else from the raw, why not talk about the art style?

That's partly what I was thinking (under the mistaken view that the raw was already out).




And being a critic doesn't mean saying the same things every week. Why don't you just say "I hate the K-On style" at the start of every episode thread before the show aired to get it over with?

I'm not saying the same things every week. Some weeks I make positive comments on the art style.

And I don't hate the K-On art style, per se. I just don't think that it's good for Haruhi.

I mean - to me - art is a big part of anime. Art is an important part of any visual medium. I don't see where it benefits people to not talk about it at all.




Let me repeat my question; are you going to complain about the art style every week from now on, or are you going to let it go eventually?

I don't complain about the art style every week - last week, I gave it some compliments.


Here it is:


Artwork and animation were both a bit better this episode. At the very least, I didn't notice much to criticize about it; nowhere near as much as I did last episode. Haruhi looked much closer to her 2006 self here, and in fact had many nice shots. She still looked K-Onified about 25% of the time, but that's a lot better than many episodes this season. The rest of the cast were exceptionally well-animated and positioned. Kyon, Itsuki, Mikuru, and Yuki simply all felt right this episode.

Haruhi conveyed, in art/animation; voice acting; and dialogue; the playful but bossy villainous overlord role quite nicely in this episode. This is precisely how I like to view her.

This is probably the best episode of the year thus far. I'll try to put a more detailed review up on my blog later today, but this is a solid episode - not much to poke fun at here, which is great for everything except trying to make a comedic review of it of course.

This is a 9/10 for me - very close to 10/10, and losing that purely for artwork/animation issues, same as Kaisos.



What's wrong with that review, VCV?

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

As the art style did change a little every week, I don't think why we shoul stop discussing the matter.

What's there to "discuss" on the matter?

"I hate K-On in this Animu"? What, are we 4 Chan now or something?
It would be the equivalent of me going to a Gundam thread and complain that there is too much mecha, every week.

Anyway, I watched some of the raw before I have to go to work, and my favorite part is Yuki charging towards Mikuru to remove the contacts. Yuki doesn't "run". She glides in the air like she is in the vacuum of Space.

[Heatth]

What's there to "discuss" on the matter?

"I hate K-On in this Animu"? What, are we 4 Chan now or something?
It would be the equivalent of me going to a Gundam thread and complain that there is too much mecha, every week.

What flood the episode tread with posts are mostly useless comments, anyway. Also, Triple and Ice Box were discussing the matter.

[Mecha_Trueno]

I About the episode, very good one. Specially the Mikuru Beam very well done. I loved Itsuki scared face after have understand what was happening (and Mikuru was looking to him).Agreed, Koizumi's "Oh f*ck, no way, it can't be..." face coupled with the BGM was amazing!

Mikuru-chan was adorable during "what's that? Is she saying I don't look reliable?" scene:D.

[DJ Trouble]

Haruhi said something that sent a chill through Koizumi when they were eating lunch. His whole body shook from . . . fear I guess. Hilarious. You don't see that too often.

[Mecha_Trueno]

Haruhi said something that sent a chill through Koizumi when they were eating lunch. His whole body shook from . . . fear I guess. Hilarious. You don't see that too often.LOL and Kyon was enjoying that to the fullest:D

One thing I wish they didn't cut out was...Kyon's sister's "killer elbow attack":heh:

[Heatth]

Haruhi said something that sent a chill through Koizumi when they were eating lunch. His whole body shook from . . . fear I guess. Hilarious. You don't see that too often.

Well, he did have a mortal wapon pointed to his derection. Anyone would be afraid. The funny thing is he was still smiling. Please Haruhi and make she don't suspect nothing is really hard. :heh:

[Mecha_Trueno]

By the way, did anyone notice Tsuruya-san was wearing winter uniform? In the illustration in the novel she was wearing summer uniform, which is strange since it is September.

[Heatth]

By the way, did anyone notice Tsuruya-san was wearing winter uniform? In the illustration in the novel she was wearing summer uniform, which is strange since it is September.

Itou Noizi made an error an Kyoani is fixing it. Also, is not September, is October.

PP:
Actually, Baka-Tsuki (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Suzumiya_Haruhi:Timeline) says it is November

[Daniel E.]

Yup, positive thinking is good by definition. :)

Yes, but in this particular case, the positive thinking wants the other kind of thinking to shut up.

And that sounds more like oppressive thinking, wich is never good by definition.

[Mecha_Trueno]

Also, is not September, is October.

PP:
Actually, Baka-Tsuki (http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Suzumiya_Haruhi:Timeline) says it is NovemberMy bad:p

Btw, I can't believe no one has mentioned this is previous threads (sorry if someone did and I missed)... but has anyone thought of how hilarious the making of "Koi no Mikuru Densetsu" would be?:D
IIRC the novel didn't go over this, it'll be a nice anime-original touch to add.

[Heatth]

Btw, I can't believe no one has mentioned this is previous threads (sorry if someone did and I missed)... but has anyone thought of how hilarious the making of "Koi no Mikuru Densetsu" would be?:D
IIRC the novel didn't go over this, it'll be a nice anime-original touch to add.

As I said, this story is better to be watch then to be read.

[DJ Trouble]

Isn't the movie supposed to take place during the spring?

[Heatth]

No, why do you think that? The cherry trees? :rolleyes:

[Apache Thunder]

For un-informed folks, the blooming trees was the result of Haruhi....not natural weather patterns.
So no, it wasn't in the middle of spring/summer! :D

[Rice_slayer]

I could Really go for some SUBSway right now :P. Mazui subs are out, but they say vid is not good quality due to a late HD raw :(.

[fish eric]

Mikuru's voice is so cute

"Mikuru bemu, Mikuru beeeemu"

[Ithekro]

Haruhi powered Mikuru is quite dangerous.

[aulzon]

Again, the ending was really abrupt but still a nice episode. I really can't wait til we get more Tsuruya.

[Launch]

Just watched subs. ;] (It's a shame that Mazui's release has a lower video quality than usual this week. Oh well)

Things I liked in this episode:
- Koizumi shuddering once Haruhi tells him he gets more screentime in the movie.
- Mi.. Mi.. Mikuru Beam!
- Nagato's swift running towards Mikuru to gouge her contact out :p
- Haruhi/Kyon 'fight' scene. Music and everything was great!
- TSURUYA
- Taniguchi's expression throughout the last scenes. Constantly in the background going :O
- Mikuru's movie 'outtakes'. I'm glad they're using the same camera effects as the original.
- The awesome art style. Especially during the movie scenes, it looked almost S1ish.

All I can think of for now. Though, this is my favourite Sighs episode so far.

Oh, and also the knowledge of more Tsuruya next week. xD

[sacundim]

8.5/10

This whole arc has been hilarious so far; IMO funnier than the rest of the series. The one problem that bugs me is that the episode transitions are being done very brusquely.

[Rice_slayer]

Next week SHOULD have the part I want to see, Haruhi Vs. Kyon! I am actually liking this arc in the anime way more than in the novel, the Koizumi speeches were LOOOOOOONNNNGGG in the novel :(. 10/10 again, loved the art this week for some reason...

[Dakota]

Mazui subs are out, but the HQ raw is taking forever, so they put a LQ one out.

But. This has been the best episode so far this season. It had a good balance of comedy while still being strikingly shocking. The Mikuru Beam was played out nicely, I realize now why everyone goes apeshit over it. The characters seem well drawn I guess, they seemed to fit in with the background art.

AND YAY! NYORO~N IS BACK
9/10

[kniteowl]

Here I was hoping for a flash back fanservice scene of Nagato biting Mikuru in Kyon's imagination lmao... ah well...

Pretty kool episode, it wasn't as suprising or as shocking, when I 1st reed the novel where I learnt Mikuru could really shot lasers from her eye, most likely because I already knew what was gonna happen. Makes me wonder if non-novel/manag readers were suprised or shocked by the scene in the episode.

I hope to see more of Tsuruya... she's so fast that you don't have time to answer any of her questions.

[Jintor]

Oh my god HARUHI IS SUCH A JERK

[Heatth]

Rewaching with subs (and being able to pause) mad me notice some more things:


After have complaning last week, I think Nagato looks nice now. Specially her first shot, in the begining.
It is reallyobvious now she only follow Kyon's order. Twice this episode she asaked for his permission to follow Haruhi and Koizumi.
It is hilarious seeing Koizumi still smileing even when is obvious he don' want too. Like after have reciving his 'reward' for suggesting having extras and after being shoot by Mikuru.
There s two continuity errors. Just after Mikuru 'lose' her contact lens Haruhi have the idea of only usingthen after the 'transformation'. Yet, she doesn't wear then in the first fight scene. Also, the many familys just vanish during Mikuru's and Nagato's 'fight'.
Haruhi's and Kyon's fight was very well done.
Again, the Mikuru Beam scene was awesome.
Nagato did a big leap in that scene too. Almost a fly, really.
Haruhi must really be blind. How the hell she didn't noticed before the reflector had be cut?
Hilarious Kyon claming being an amatour after giving many wierd scyfi names
Kyon's random references are awesome. Pope Inoccent III? Really?
Both Tsuruya and Taniguchi are awesome. Period.
Taniguchi and Kunikida conversation is very funny. I wonder if is always like that.
The black taxis intriged me. I wonder if the cab is Arakawa (we couldn't se his/her face).
TFEI? I didn't remember it. It seen to be the humanoid interface, but what it means? It was spoke in english, so the meaning must be in english as well right?
Speaking on they, apparently Yuki is very skilled amongst then. What intrigued me, however, is Nagato don't explang anything, unike the others. So the others interfaces explaing things to the Organization?

Wow, I talked a lot now. :heh: I guess I should reread Sighs... I really didn't remember that TFEI thing.

[Jintor]

Hot jesus regeneration is awesome.

My lord Tsuruya is awesome

my lord haruhi is a jerk

lol biting

[GMT]

This week on The Sighs of Haruhi Suzumiya menage a Parte Trois!

Shout-out to Nyoron Churuya-San!
EPIC Zombie GROWLING Priests!
The SOS-dan's take on Monty Python's Holy Grail!
The Molestation Fanservice of Mikuru Asahina!
Haruhi "Hairband of Doom" Suzumiya vs Kyyy- "Microbe of Fault-Finding" -onnn!
The Revenge of MIKURU BEEEEAM!
Mikuru hunting out of season! Koizumi's 'brown alert'! The Flash Vaporization of Yuki Nagato!
Yuki vs Mikuru no-holds-barred jello wrestling!
Mugi-vision, ~nyoro!

Loved this episode. The bubbling anger when Haruhi began beating Mikuru. The cheering for Kyon when he grew a pair. The astonishment at the accurate portrayal of high-energy lasers!

Coming attractions:


Mikuru gets all wet for Tanaguchi! Kyon outraged!
Mikuru Asahina vs. A Tequila Sunrise!
Kyon takes on Haruhi in the most anticipated match since Frazier vs Ali!
What's this? Haruhi in a ponytail? Is Kyon dreaming? Stay tuned, folks!

[Ice Block]

From Mazui's release:
Tsuruya: Mikuru, you're so cute! I want to bring you home!
Nice one. :heh:

The last part there was great. Just goes to show how much I've missed Tsuruya (and her accent).

[Kaisos Erranon]

So, what was Haruhi humming when she skipped off near the end?

It wasn't Rock is Dead (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syrrhcq3aMw) like in the book, unfortunately... although I can see why that would be impossible for Aya Hirano to hum... :heh:

In any case, great episode. Really can't find much to complain about, so 9/10.

They've covered up through Chapter Three and into Chapter Four, and I suspect they'll want to end the episode with -that scene-, which should be interesting.

[OkamiNoKaze]

Great episode, Yeah glad to see Kyon grow a pair finally, and Tsuruya's back yay. Also some have said Yuki appearing in her witch costume was toned down last episode, from the novel. How is it different? Also was Mikuru claiming to be sick in the novel? or are they going to use that as an excuse to get around Mikuru getting drunk

[kniteowl]

* Speaking on they, apparently Yuki is very skilled amongst then. What intrigued me, however, is Nagato don't explang anything, unike the others. So the others interfaces explaing things to the Organization?


I thought it was more Koizumi's opinion then an actual fact, from my POV, it looked liked all aliens related to IDSE have similar powers to Nagato. Although I can kind of see Nagato being more skilled then your average IDSE humanoid alien when you consider Asakura being Nagato's backup.

[chinaboat]

Favorite moment: Kyon clutching Haruhi by the back of the neck while she sulks

Favorite line: "It seems I unexpectedly fired an optical weapon....

Definitely the best Sighs ep so far and, indeed, anime improved the narrative 100%.

[Kaisos Erranon]

Great episode, Yeah glad to see Kyon grow a pair finally, and Tsuruya's back yay. Also some have said Yuki appearing in her witch costume was toned down last episode, from the novel. How is it different? Also was Mikuru claiming to be sick in the novel? or are they going to use that as an excuse to get around Mikuru getting drunk

It's in the novel too.

If they do -that scene- completely uncensored, I'll be very happy.

They won't, but I'd be very happy. >_>

[Daniel Lind]

If they do -that scene- completely uncensored, I'll be very happy.
I dunno, they have even drawn the scene of Nagato's injuries, as well as Kyon stopping Haruhi for the first time... Might as well go all the way.

[Kaisos Erranon]

I dunno, they have even drawn the scene of Nagato's injuries, as well as Kyon stopping Haruhi for the first time... Might as well go all the way.

It's more that -that scene- has content related to stuff that was censored in the -original broadcast-, so...

But, like I said, if they do go all the way I'll be -happy-.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Also some have said Yuki appearing in her witch costume was toned down last episode, from the novel. How is it different?

Well, at any point during the scene, did you get the feeling that Nagato was Death? :heh:

At this moment, the clubroom door opened.

“…”

I thought it was someone else, and for a moment my mind was filled with terror. I thought my short life had finally come to an end, since even Death had come to receive me. I even thought I was in the backstage of the movie where Salieri slowly destroyed Mozart as he composed his Requiem.

“…”

Nagato's usual pale face silently emerged from the doorway. She only showed her face, while her body was shrouded in darkness.

I wasn't the only one frightened into silence, Haruhi and Asahina-san weren't any better, even Koizumi's usual smile carried a bit of fearfulness in it. Nagato was wearing a strange costume that even Asahina-san would feel startled in. She had covered herself with a black cloak, wearing an equally pitch black pointed hat, a recognizable witch outfit.

Under our petrified gaze, Nagato, who was dressed like Death, silently walked to her reserved seat by the corner, took out her bag and hard-back book from under her cloak, and placed it on the table.

Ignoring our stunned glances, she began to read her book.

Nagato scared the hell out of them in the novel, to the point that Haruhi was rendered utterly speechless until after she sat down and started reading.

The anime really didn't convey that all too well. Sure, the basic details were there, but the overall feeling of dread was completely absent.

[touge-n00b]

Liking Sigh so far, I'll agree with what a lot are already saying: This arc is better animated then written. This episode pretty much confirms it for me. The Mikuru Beam scene was priceless.

And it looks like the scene I've been waiting for, in "someones" house is next week. :D

[Vexx]

Well, at any point during the scene, did you get the feeling that Nagato was Death? :heh:



Nagato scared the hell out of them in the novel, to the point that Haruhi was rendered utterly speechless until after she sat down and started reading.

The anime really didn't convey that all too well. Sure, the basic details were there, but the overall feeling of dread was completely absent.

aye, in the anime it came across more as "omfgbqq how CUTE!!!!!" and how self-satisfied she was.

[brocko]

The anime definitely portrayed Yuki's entrance more as shocking rather than fearful. You kinda get a better feeling as to why Haruhi goes all genki over Yuki right after she sits donw in the novel, since Yuki's frightful attire was exactly what Haruhi wanted in the villain.

Strangely enough, Tsuruya seemed to be the best drawn character of the whole cast this episode imo. Makes me wonder if there's a certain soft spot for her within KyoAni's animation department :heh:

[Jintor]

Nagato scared the hell out of them in the novel, to the point that Haruhi was rendered utterly speechless until after she sat down and started reading.

The anime really didn't convey that all too well. Sure, the basic details were there, but the overall feeling of dread was completely absent.

TBH (and I read Sighs a long time ago, which may colour some things) I never fealt that that feeling of dread was even appropriate there.

[The Bloodlust Kid]

Mikuru Beeeeeemmmm!!!

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb175/ierahc/anime/melancholy%20of%20haruhi%20suzumiya/mikuru_1.gif

I'm suddenly reminded of Adam West's Batman dance.

And I think Sigh has made up for half of Endless Eight.

[Triple_R]

Absolutely magnificent episode.

Those still pictures from 2Chan that I was using to make my initial assessment of the artwork from, didn't do this episode justice at all, imo. Those still pictures tended to get mostly the worst bits; missing a lot of some great close-up shots of Haruhi's face.

Haruhi was fantastic in this episode, and just about everybody had at least one cool scene or two. Animation flow was wonderful. Background music was superb.

This is definitely the best episode of the year, imo, and I'd probably put this as one of my five favorite Haruhi episodes of all-time... including Haruhi 2006 episodes.

Somebody on this animation staff must be a big fan of 90s anime too - I saw more than a few
allusions/similarities to Excel Saga, El Hazard, and Ranma 1/2. Personally, I love this - it's really cool to see a modern prominent anime really pay some respect to the 90s classics.

Later today, I'm going to put up a lengthier review on my blog.

This kind of episode is precisely what I had hoped for with Haruhi 2009. It's quite refreshing to see it arrive at last! :D

[freakonboard]

I like this reference.

http://image.ohozaa.com/ty/nyoro0005.jpg (http://image.ohozaa.com/iy/nyoro0005.jpg)

[DJ Trouble]

For un-informed folks, the blooming trees was the result of Haruhi....not natural weather patterns.
So no, it wasn't in the middle of spring/summer! :D


I know what time of year it is for them, but in the movie it's supposed to be spring, isn't it? Isn't that why Haruhi wanted the cherry trees to blossom? So then it would make sense for her to have people wearing their summer uniforms.

Also, something that's started to annoy me this episode is Mikuru's face changing colors whenever she's scared.

[baltakatei]

Amusing observations:

1. After Haruhi orders Nagato to use her evil alien magic to attack Mikuru (Mikuru: O_O;; ), Nagato glances away from Mikuru at Haruhi/Kyon as if to ask: "Seriously? You want me to do *that*?" Kyon's adamant "No!" was just as I imagined it from the novel.

2. Haruhi's humming as she prances away is similar to, but not quite, part of Rufus' Welcoming Ceremony to me. Youtube link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oCIS25qevU#t=0m48s). Any ideas where Nobuo stole this melody from?

3. Taniguchi's random rant on taxi love is random.

4. Everything is set up for more Mikuru Beam vs. Metal Fence next week. :D

Somebody on this animation staff must be a big fan of 90s anime too - I saw more than a few
allusions/similarities to Excel Saga, El Hazard, and Ranma 1/2. Personally, I love this - it's really cool to see a modern prominent anime really pay some respect to the 90s classics.


Specific screenshots and comparisons?

[Peanutbutter003]

Next episode, Taniguchi in the water!

Are they gonna throw Shiraishi in a pond as part of DVD extras? :heh:

[TadloS]

Lol, that an interesting and funny episode not saying that it was greatly animated. Haruhi firing at old geezer and after that retreat was really amusing. And when Haruhi started to beat(you can put words in this way) Mikuru was really harsh, I glad that Kyon stand up for her. The highlight of episode was Mikuru Beam. And like always Nagato saved Kyon's ass.

Anyway, awesome episode.

[Triple_R]

Amusing observations:

1. After Haruhi orders Nagato to use her evil alien magic to attack Mikuru (Mikuru: O_O;; ), Nagato glances away from Mikuru at Haruhi/Kyon as if to ask: "Seriously? You want me to do *that*?" Kyon's adamant "No!" was just as I imagined it from the novel.

2. Haruhi's humming as she prances away is similar to, but not quite, part of Rufus' Welcoming Ceremony to me. Youtube link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oCIS25qevU#t=0m48s). Any ideas where Nobuo stole this melody from?

3. Taniguchi's random rant on taxi love is random.

4. Everything is set up for more Mikuru Beam vs. Metal Fence next week. :D



Specific screenshots and comparisons?


Nice observations! Anyway, I didn't get into specific screenshot comparisons, but I did compare a couple of scenes in this episode to scenes from El Hazard, as well as compare Haruhi and Mikuru themselves to certain El Hazard and Excel Saga characters. Finally, the Haruhi retreat run made me think of Ranma 1/2, as did the older Shrine Priest's character design for some reason.

If anybody's interested, they can read about it (and about my take on the episode in general) over at my latest blog entry/episode review...

http://assessingtheanime.blogspot.com/2009/08/haruhi-2009-episode-12-minutia-review.html

I forewarn you though - it's pretty long. :heh:

[Heatth]

I just noticed something: Why the hell T&K and Tsuruya are wearing their uniforms on Sunday!? I mean, Itsuki explicitly said he is only wearing his cause Haru said so. However, Tsuruya didn't even know they weere doing a movie, so why would she wear her uniform on Sunday?

Also, Knikida, of all people, seen to hear Kyon's narration at 19:57. This time, is very clear his mouth was shut. Is also clear Kunikida was talking about his narration.
Kyon(withoug move his mouth): "Stare at Nagato or something"
Kunikida: "Now that you mention it, Nagato-san's costume really suits her.

At that point I really believe it was a Kyoani mistake.

[Ithekro]

Well Yuki's enterance last week was scary...(sort of for the viewers), but how often is Haruhi speechless? They all reacted to her appearace. Kyon and Mikuru with fear. Haruhi was speechless. Itsuki...well he wasn't all smiles at least.

If this week was interesting...next week will be even more so. Means two weeks until cat time.

Oh and Kunikida is the one that has been around Kyon the longest. Maybe he can read Kyon's expessions.

[Stardust Romance]

Haruhi is a Sailor Moon fan I see lol.

Great episode.
Haruhi was really harsh this episode but I kinda expected that already ^^;
But man, I just want to hug Mikuru and tell her everything is alright. She sounds like a beaten up puppy most of the time. Poor thing.

And Yuki was awesome. So she bit Mikuru? O__o
I see lol.

And it's nice to have Tsuruya back :3

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

I just noticed something: Why the hell T&K and Tsuruya are wearing their uniforms on Sunday!? I mean, Itsuki explicitly said he is only wearing his cause Haru said so. However, Tsuruya didn't even know they weere doing a movie, so why would she wear her uniform on Sunday?

School Uniforms Are The New Black (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SchoolUniformsAreTheNewBlack)? :heh:

Also, Knikida, of all people, seen to hear Kyon's narration at 19:57. This time, is very clear his mouth was shut. Is also clear Kunikida was talking about his narration.

Two possibilities:
1. Kunikida is a psychic.
2. Kyon is capable of projecting his thoughts onto others.

how often is Haruhi speechless?

Very. Rarely. Which is why the fact that the scene was so bland is painful.

[Heatth]

Oh and Kunikida is the one that has been around Kyon the longest. Maybe he can read Kyon's expessions.

He said 'Now that you mention it, Nagato-san...'. As Kyon had talked about her. 'Mention' is not a word you use when you are reading someone expression. Unless it was a Mazui and baka-tsuki translation error, it is weird.

Post Postum:
School Uniforms Are The New Black (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SchoolUniformsAreTheNewBlack)? :heh:

The add thing is Haruhi aways was an anime that averted this trope (exept for Nagato). It is not an error from Kyoani, however, as they dress like that in the novel too.

Two possibilities:
1. Kunikida is a psychic.
2. Kyon is capable of projecting his thoughts onto others.

Opition 2 sound better, as this happens all time with many people. I really prfer to think it is a Kyoani mistake. But, who knows? Maybe Tanigawa had asked then to place some hints about it.

[GMT]

He said 'Now that you mention it, Nagato-san...'. As Kyon had talked about her. 'Mention' is not a word you use when you are reading someone expression. Unless it was a Mazui and baka-tsuki translation error, it is weird.

Post Postum:


The add thing is Haruhi aways was an anime that averted this trope (exept for Nagato). It is not an error from Kyoani, however, as they dress like that in the novel too.

If I'm not mistaken, they're in uniform for their roles in the move.

[baltakatei]

Oh and Kunikida is the one that has been around Kyon the longest. Maybe he can read Kyon's expessions.

Kunikida: "Now that you mention it [with your face], Nagato-san's costume really suits her."

=P

I blame Tanigawa for giving KyoAni a very ambiguous script to work with.

Any attempt at explanation will probably cover whether or not Kunikida and Taniguchi are figments of Kyon's imagination, such as is seen with Mr. Nash's best friend in A Beautiful Mind.

Hmm....

Nagato: The persons you know as Taniguchi and Kunikida do not exist as physical persons in this world.

Kyon: ... Um.... Nagato, what do you mean by that?

Nagato: Normal humans with ordinary senses are unable to sense the presence of your two friends since they do not exist.

Kyon: But... Koizumi has seen them. They were on the baseball team. Everyone saw them.

Nagato: Your memories of these events have been modified by an unknown faction.

Kyon: Another faction? An enemy faction? Koizumi, do you know anything about this?

Koizumi: I'm afraid I do not. Honestly, I was careless when you mentioned Taniguchi or Kunikida. But I can assure you on behalf of the Organization of one thing: They do not exist.

Kyon: O__O But... they were in the movie. You saw them, didn't you Nagato? Taniguchi fell into the water with Asahina!

Nagato: ... *shakes head*

Koizumi: Things are more serious than I suspected. Kyon, when did you first begin seeing them?

Kyon: I don't... I don't know... Why doesn't anyone remember seeing them? That idiot Taniguchi walks up that same hill with me every morning. How can he... wait... You! *points at Koizumi* You've never called me "Kyon" before. Ever!

Koizumi: ... *confused*

Kyon: Nagato, what's going on. Tell me. Did someone erase Taniguchi and Kunikida?

*Nagato dons a pitying expression and is interrupted by Koizumi*

Koizumi: Kyon, I didn't think it would take this long, but I had to tell you sooner or later: The girls you know as Haruhi, Mikuru, and Nagato... They're imaginary.

Kyon: ...

Koizumi: When I joined the literary club, you were working on a novel. Those girls were characters in the novel. But, bit by bit, you--

Kyon: No! You're a fake! *shouts hysterically* This isn't real. It's changed. Nagato, tell me what's wrong?

*Nagato turns into an RPG character sheet in Kyon's hands*

*Haruhi walks into the clubroom, notices Kyon freaking out*

Haruhi: ... *watches in stunned silence*

*Kyon sees Haruhi, rushes up to her in a daze*

Kyon: Haruhi, I'm John Smith. John Smith. The guy you met on Tanabata three years ago. You have to remember. *shakes Haruhi by the shoulders*

Haruhi: Kyon what's gotten... John... who?

Kyon(frantic): You have to remember. Haruhi. Koizumi isn't Koizumi. Nagato's been... *shakes paper* I don't know what's going on. The world's changed. We need to get back to the real one.... You remember John Smith... don't you?

Haruhi (seriously): Kyon... I don't know what you're talking about.

*Haruhi disappears, leaving behind only her orange armband in Kyon's grip*

*Kyon laughs hysterically for 4 minutes straight*

*Kyon blacks out form hyperventilation*

BAD END.


Why do all my daydreams end up like that? (http://xkcd.com/429/)

[Heatth]

If I'm not mistaken, they're in uniform for their roles in the move.

The problem is she doesn't know this, as on of the first things she asked to Kyon was what they are going to do. I can, however, see Haruhi justing calling her, telling to her go with the uniform and she just didn't ask why. Fit both Haruhi and Tsuruya's personality.

[typhonsentra]

Triple R's post made me think about something in this episode: Haruhi's reaction to Kyon's ogling. When it's directed at her she confronts it right away and makes accusations of him being a perv, when it's towards towards others she tries to stop it but never says anything directly. In the first book when Kyon and Mikuru were wrestling over the mouse she ignores the incident after an initial comment and this time she simply says to not "Shoot things he's not told to".

And the One time she does ask him directly about his relationship with Nagato, she avoids eye contact while doing so.

[Triple_R]

Triple R's post made me think about something in this episode: Haruhi's reaction to Kyon's ogling. When it's directed at her she confronts it right away and makes accusations of him being a perv, when it's towards towards others she tries to stop it but never says anything directly. In the first book when Kyon and Mikuru were wrestling over the mouse she ignores the incident after an initial comment and this time she simply says to not "Shoot things he's not told to".

And the One time she does ask him directly about his relationship with Nagato, she avoids eye contact while doing so.

Yay! Glad my review helped sparked some sort of conversation anyway. :)

I think that if a situation involves Haruhi directly, she herself will be direct in responding to it. Perhaps its an issue of pride for her.

However, if a relationship-related issue doesn't involve her directly, but it's annoying her anyway, she prefers to deal with the matter under pretenses.

Serious relational discussions are very rarely, if ever, Haruhi's forte, I think. Still, she has her pride.


One thing that I found interesting about Novel 4 that may relate to this discussion...

During the beginning of Novel 4, Haruhi reveals that she's sworn off alcohol consumption for herself. Given Haruhi's very playful and partying nature, this took me a bit by surprise. I think for Haruhi, though, she's done this because of her own sort of personal pride - she doesn't ever want to be drunk, and caught doing something that she'd later feel ashamed of.

Though you don't really get much indication of it, I do think that Haruhi has some firm moral convictions and principles that are important to her.


Anyway, these are just my rambling thoughts on the matter. Part of the reason why I raised Haruhi's reaction to Kyon's ogling the way I did is because I was hoping that one of the review readers might spark a conversation on it; a conversation on it that might lead to some understanding of why Haruhi's like that... because I'm still trying to figure it out, really.

So, thanks for bringing it up on this thread, typhonsentra. :)

[velderia]

This was an average for me. Sue me.

[Kaisos Erranon]

During the beginning of Novel 4, Haruhi reveals that she's sworn off alcohol consumption for herself. Given Haruhi's very playful and partying nature, this took me a bit by surprise. I think for Haruhi, though, she's done this because of her own sort of personal pride - she doesn't ever want to be drunk, and caught doing something that she'd later feel ashamed of.

Though you don't really get much indication of it, I do think that Haruhi has some firm moral convictions and principles that are important to her.

Actually, it's because of the novel's Lone Island Syndrome... one of those "I'LL NEVER DRINK AGAIN" hangovers is pretty much what caused that.

[Triple_R]

Actually, it's because of the novel's Lone Island Syndrome... one of those "I'LL NEVER DRINK AGAIN" hangovers is pretty much what caused that.

Thanks for the info. A bit disappointing that it isn't something a bit more in-depth behind her decision... but, oh well.

[Vexx]

This episode was complete win.... not even going to pick at the animation or art I was satisfied enough.

[ReneeBurossamu]

I actually think that this episode of Sighs has some better quality (in terms of plot) than most of the episodes. I've never laughed so much in one episode, and the discovery of Mikuru's LAZOR was really well done. Nagato also showed that she's capable of more than what everyone sees and her self-healing was pretty cool.

Just perfect 10. The solid art throughout was a plus.

[Roger Rambo]

So how long until we see Mikuru get shopped with Shoop da whoop?

[Dakota]

Oh yeah, anyone notice that Kyon actually visualized Haruhi in the waitress costume?

That's some slight non-visual fanservice, but I found it odd she knew right away. She observes Kyon's every move, and yet...

Totally misses a laser that shot out of Mikuru's eye thrice times.

Mazui put a high quality out. Ain't bad.

[Vampire]

Just saw the episode, couldn't tell which was more epic: Mikuru Beam or Nagato Rape?

[Ithekro]

Light speed is hard to see. No the standard substandard beam weapons one normally seeing in sci-fi and mecha anime. Just a flash and target hit...ni visable "beam", just the point of impact.

Plus you can see the birds all taking off behind the reflector board. I wonder what else she hit.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Oh yeah, anyone notice that Kyon actually visualized Haruhi in the waitress costume?

That's some slight non-visual fanservice, but I found it odd she knew right away. She observes Kyon's every move, and yet...

Totally misses a laser that shot out of Mikuru's eye thrice times.

It's invisible. Beams in real life are usually not brightly colored, and the point of contact is the only thing that is clearly visible. There was no loud noise nor huge explosion, so Haruhi had an excuse for not noticing. But what happens next episode is another matter...

[Dakota]

Plus you can see the birds all taking off behind the reflector board. I wonder what else she hit.

Probably another planet, maybe an airplane.

[Mecha_Trueno]

During the beginning of Novel 4, Haruhi reveals that she's sworn off alcohol consumption for herself. Given Haruhi's very playful and partying nature, this took me a bit by surprise. I think for Haruhi, though, she's done this because of her own sort of personal pride - she doesn't ever want to be drunk, and caught doing something that she'd later feel ashamed of.OF COURSE she'll drink again!:D
EVERYONE goes through this at least a few times:heh:... after you feel like crap from sh*t loads of drinks, you say to yourself "man, I'm never drinking again...ughh" then next week, what do you know?:D
But then this IS Haruhi, who is a million times more stubborn than everyone else...

[Ithekro]

She could turn the wine into water I suppose....

[Fishfood1]

wow I love this episode, by far my fav in this season. definitely made up for some of what E8 did. :)

[OkamiNoKaze]

Ooh there are more beams? I thought Yuki's bite made her not able to fire them anymore?

[Ithekro]

No more laser beams...anyway.

[OkamiNoKaze]

Nagato: The persons you know as Taniguchi and Kunikida do not exist as physical persons in this world.

Kyon: ... Um.... Nagato, what do you mean by that?

Nagato: Normal humans with ordinary senses are unable to sense the presence of your two friends since they do not exist.

Kyon: But... Koizumi has seen them. They were on the baseball team. Everyone saw them.

Nagato: Your memories of these events have been modified by an unknown faction.

Kyon: Another faction? An enemy faction? Koizumi, do you know anything about this?

Koizumi: I'm afraid I do not. Honestly, I was careless when you mentioned Taniguchi or Kunikida. But I can assure you on behalf of the Organization of one thing: They do not exist.

Kyon: O__O But... they were in the movie. You saw them, didn't you Nagato? Taniguchi fell into the water with Asahina!

Nagato: ... *shakes head*

Koizumi: Things are more serious than I suspected. Kyon, when did you first begin seeing them?

Kyon: I don't... I don't know... Why doesn't anyone remember seeing them? That idiot Taniguchi walks up that same hill with me every morning. How can he... wait... You! *points at Koizumi* You've never called me "Kyon" before. Ever!

Koizumi: ... *confused*

Kyon: Nagato, what's going on. Tell me. Did someone erase Taniguchi and Kunikida?

*Nagato dons a pitying expression and is interrupted by Koizumi*

Koizumi: Kyon, I didn't think it would take this long, but I had to tell you sooner or later: The girls you know as Haruhi, Mikuru, and Nagato... They're imaginary.

Kyon: ...

Koizumi: When I joined the literary club, you were working on a novel. Those girls were characters in the novel. But, bit by bit, you--

Kyon: No! You're a fake! *shouts hysterically* This isn't real. It's changed. Nagato, tell me what's wrong?

*Nagato turns into an RPG character sheet in Kyon's hands*

*Haruhi walks into the clubroom, notices Kyon freaking out*

Haruhi: ... *watches in stunned silence*

*Kyon sees Haruhi, rushes up to her in a daze*

Kyon: Haruhi, I'm John Smith. John Smith. The guy you met on Tanabata three years ago. You have to remember. *shakes Haruhi by the shoulders*

Haruhi: Kyon what's gotten... John... who?

Kyon(frantic): You have to remember. Haruhi. Koizumi isn't Koizumi. Nagato's been... *shakes paper* I don't know what's going on. The world's changed. We need to get back to the real one.... You remember John Smith... don't you?

Haruhi (seriously): Kyon... I don't know what you're talking about.

*Haruhi disappears, leaving behind only her orange armband in Kyon's grip*

*Kyon laughs hysterically for 4 minutes straight*

*Kyon blacks out form hyperventilation*

BAD END.


Why do all my daydreams end up like that? (http://xkcd.com/429/)

I don't like that scenario one bit, the ending I'd like to see is Kyon, and his kids around that heated table thing, (I forget the proper name for them) telling them "and that's how I met your mom and how we got together", as she enters the room bearing dinner.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

I don't know... the thought that Kyon is completely insane and only imagines the three girls are there amuses me.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

I don't know... the thought that Kyon is completely insane and only imagines the three girls are there amuses me.

But Tsuruya has a life outside Kyon. In fact, she is THE anchor to prevent the "it's all a dream" theory to get out of hand. Tsuruya is an outside observer of SOS-dan, who really have no reason to be present if the world was someone's imagination.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Kyon only knows Tsuruya because of Mikuru, and even then only because of the baseball game Haruhi signed them up for. If neither Haruhi nor Mikuru exists, then can you prove Tsuruya does? She has less proof of existence than Taniguchi or Kunikida, given the fact that he knew Kunikida from before high school and theoretically could have met Taniguchi through him.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Kyon only knows Tsuruya because of Mikuru, and even then only because of the baseball game Haruhi signed them up for. If neither Haruhi nor Mikuru exists, then can you prove Tsuruya does? She has less proof of existence than Taniguchi or Kunikida, given the fact that he knew Kunikida from before high school and theoretically could have met Taniguchi through him.

The problem isn't "proof of existence" The problem is why she exists. Tsuruya disappears for weeks on end with no one knowing what she's up to. This character trait simply wouldn't exist if she was made up in someone's imagination; it doesn't serve a purpose in an imaginary world. In a dream, anything that isn't relevant simply doesn't have substance. But Tsuruya HAS substance, yet she is not a necessary aspect of SOS-dan. So if SOS-dan is someone's imagination, Tsuruya simply can't exist as she is.

Thus Tsuruya is not a dream. QED.^_^

[Triple_R]

The problem isn't "proof of existence" The problem is why she exists. Tsuruya disappears for weeks on end with no one knowing what she's up to. This character trait simply wouldn't exist if she was made up in someone's imagination; it doesn't serve a purpose in an imaginary world. In a dream, anything that isn't relevant simply doesn't have substance. But Tsuruya HAS substance, yet she is not a necessary aspect of SOS-dan. So if SOS-dan is someone's imagination, Tsuruya simply can't exist as she is.

Thus Tsuruya is not a dream. QED.^_^

I very much dislike the idea of this entire anime being a dream in Kyon's head (this is, after all, the oldest story cop out in the book), but in fairness... even in a dream, Tsuruya has relevance; she serves the purpose of being a good extra for when more than five people are needed. Instead of creating entirely different dream characters whole cloth for whenever an extra person or two is needed, Kyon keeps coming back to Tsuruya, Taniguchi, and Kunikida.

That would fit as a theory, anyway, I think.

[Ithekro]

Or she's the mental image of some social services person or some doctor that checks on Kyon every once in a while. He just thinks of her as some sort of super hero that is off doing stuff and he only sees her in her secret identity which he makes up.


Do you get the feeling Yuki is messing with Kyon and Mikuru with her moving her wand in circles? Sort of how like she would later move the mouse around in the air...in circles.

[Triple_R]

Or she's the mental image of some social services person or some doctor that checks on Kyon every once in a while. He just thinks of her as some sort of super hero that is off doing stuff and he only sees her in her secret identity which he makes up.


Do you get the feeling Yuki is messing with Kyon and Mikuru with her moving her wand in circles? Sort of how like she would later move the mouse around in the air...in circles.

Maybe.

However, I think that Yuki is mainly doing that for Haruhi. She has to show Haruhi something - some sort of action - and so she moves her wand in the air in circles.

[chinaboat]

Two possibilities:
1. Kunikida is a psychic.
2. Kyon is capable of projecting his thoughts onto others.



Option two is correct in regards solely to Haruhi or rather Haruhi can sometimes sense/hear Kyon's thoughts regarding her - although she's not aware that's what's happening. I think it first happens in Melancholy Pt 1: KYON: (all in narration) "Which is why when Haruhi showed up with her long hair cut I was rather disturbed. Anyway isn't cutting it the day after I point it out a bit hasty? (maybe not in narration) Hey?" HARUHI: "Not really" - Then again in Pt 2 Kyon in narration talks about the stuff she's accumulated and sarcastically wonders if she's going to live there and she immediately turns to him and says a computer would be nice, too - Right at the beginning of Pt 5 as the narrator he discusses walking home from school with a girl. He never says anything to Haruhi but after she points to a direction she asks if he had said something.

Of course there are numerous instances when Yuki communicates with Itsuki and Mikuru without speaking

However, in the case of Kunikida, I think that instance was a mistake on the production company's part.

[Mecha_Trueno]

Also, Knikida, of all people, seen to hear Kyon's narration at 19:57. This time, is very clear his mouth was shut. Is also clear Kunikida was talking about his narration.


At that point I really believe it was a Kyoani mistake.Two possibilities:
1. Kunikida is a psychic.
2. Kyon is capable of projecting his thoughts onto others.

He said 'Now that you mention it, Nagato-san...'. As Kyon had talked about her. 'Mention' is not a word you use when you are reading someone expression. Unless it was a Mazui and baka-tsuki translation error, it is weird.


Opition 2 sound better, as this happens all time with many people. I really prfer to think it is a Kyoani mistake. But, who knows? Maybe Tanigawa had asked then to place some hints about it.However, in the case of Kunikida, I think that instance was a mistake on the production company's part.
Its neither a mistake on Kyoani's part, Baka-Tsuki's translation, nor Mazui-subs (I haven't actually watched their version).
What Kunikida said, "それにしても", doesn't necessarily need to be a 'reply' to something. Both B-T and Mazui translated it to the best they could with what they had. Its just one of those things where there isn't a direct Japanese to English translation.

[ac195]

Are will still discussing about how characters seem to read Kyon's mind?

It's just a quirk Tanigawa(the author) uses in the light novels (the source material). Kyon is the narrator and doesn't always make it clear which of his lines are being spoken and which aren't.

[Ice Block]

Or, he could be masking unimportant dialogues with his "slightly more interesting" internal monologues. It's an interesting technique when used sparingly, providing a small mystery element on the exact conversations.

And this has been done to death back in 2006 already. I thought people were used to this? Or has this phenomenon not appeared in any popular show since then?

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

The people discussing it now, myself included, weren't around in 2006. However, I'm just going along with the discussion for the hell of it. I really don't care one way or the other. :heh:

[ac195]

Again, the ending was really abrupt but still a nice episode. I really can't wait til we get more Tsuruya.

Heminga13 pointed this out already. The whole Sighs arc is being deliberately portrayed like an entire movie cut into episodes (KyoAni is really loving the meta aspect of this season).

[Ascaloth]

Episode 22 article is up:

[RIUVA] Suzumiya Haruhi no Yuutsu (2009), Episode 22: Suzumiya Haruhi no Tameiki III (http://www.riuva.com/?p=1490)

This was by far the best new episode of the 2009 broadcast. 9/10.

And you know, all the speculation about Kunikida reading Kyon's mind really underscores the whole There Is No Coincidence (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThereAreNoCoincidences) trope. :heh:

[Philos]

First order of business for the day; while they were fleeing, where the hell was Yuki?
http://upic.me/i/jh/haruhi5.jpg (http://upic.me/show.php?id=eef02b9f55567bd204b00a1bf803f0dd)
I just notice....

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Heminga13 pointed this out already. The whole Sighs arc is being deliberately portrayed like an entire movie cut into episodes (KyoAni is really loving the meta aspect of this season).

Unfortunately, the illusion of that was completely demolished at the start of Sigh II, where there is a noticeable jump in detail from where Sigh I left off. :heh:

[Heatth]

Its neither a mistake on Kyoani's part, Baka-Tsuki's translation, nor Mazui-subs (I haven't actually watched their version).
What Kunikida said, "それにしても", doesn't necessarily need to be a 'reply' to something. Both B-T and Mazui translated it to the best they could with what they had. Its just one of those things where there isn't a direct Japanese to English translation.

This is a translation error them. Maybe not so much for B-T, as they couldn't seen Kyon was not speaking. However, Mazui could see Kyon didn't open his mouth, so they should have choosed another word to translate it.

Thanks for the info, anyway. This probably explain other situations.

[baltakatei]

I must say, though: If you watch episodes imagining everyone except Kyon and Koizumi as imaginary, a lot of things start to make sense.

1. Why doesn't the Student Council oust Haruhi from the Literary club?

2. Why does Mikuru take so much abuse from Haruhi? If she's just an RPG plaything of Kyon's, then she could be whatever he wanted her to be.

Also, in this episode, Kyon is the one tasked with everything from hauling the camera around to editing the video. Koizumi is the only other person involved with handling physical props. Haruhi just sits in her director's chair and shouts out commands. The most Mikuru does is fire her air guns. If you watch the episode imagining only Kyon and Koizumi exist, scenes such as when the Brigade flees from the shrine priest would still look normal: Kyon and Koizumi running more-or-less side-by-side as they flee, as if they started running at the same time.

Anyway, that's as much mileage as this theory has. Reality has to be stretched too much to fit in the events of Lone Island Syndrome or Live Alive.

[ac195]

Unfortunately, the illusion of that was completely demolished at the start of Sigh II, where there is a noticeable jump in detail from where Sigh I left off. :heh:

You wouldn't really notice unless you were watching them side-by-side. That's pretty much what the in-between week's worth of time is for :p

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Anyway, that's as much mileage as this theory has. Reality has to be stretched too much to fit in the events of Lone Island Syndrome or Live Alive.

Actually, Lone Island Syndrome can be rather easily included with the theory, making it so Koizumi is attempting to snap Kyon out of his fantasy illusion by setting up a fake murder mystery. Live Alive would be tricky, but the only major problems would be the stop in the cafe and the band members appearing in class 1-5 the following day.

*e*

You wouldn't really notice unless you were watching them side-by-side. That's pretty much what the in-between week's worth of time is for :p

You're probably right. However, unless they drastically improve the quality of the final scene in Sigh I, the problem is going to come up the first time someone watches the DVD. :heh:

[Triple_R]

Or, he could be masking unimportant dialogues with his "slightly more interesting" internal monologues. It's an interesting technique when used sparingly, providing a small mystery element on the exact conversations.

And this has been done to death back in 2006 already.

Like Kogetsu said, not everybody here right now were here back in 2006. I... don't think that I was here back then myself. I think my first encounter with Anime Suki was 2007.


I thought people were used to this? Or has this phenomenon not appeared in any popular show since then?

I don't think that anybody here is saying that this phenomenon is necessarily a bad thing. We're just trying to pick sense out of it. Your own theory of "masking unimportant dialogues with more interesting internal monologues" makes a lot of sense to me. It's a nice theory.

And if your theory is right, then the novels/anime are probably better for it.

[Jintor]

My god, had someone been planting epileptic trees in here? D:

That said, it's certainly an interesting thought experiment to consider.

[GMT]

Maybe.

However, I think that Yuki is mainly doing that for Haruhi. She has to show Haruhi something - some sort of action - and so she moves her wand in the air in circles.
She doesn't really need to do anything for Haruhi, as Haruhi's default expectation of her is for her to stand there and do nothing/sit and read/be the weirdo quiet girl. Waving her wand is likely for Kyon and Mikuru's benefit. Likely her way of saying Okay, you've had your moe profuse apology moment. Get on with the exposition already! Tsuruya's only going to distract Haruhi for another thirty seconds. Then it'll be her turn to molest you. Bwahahaha! Only with less evil laughter at the end.

[Ithekro]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascaloth
First order of business for the day; while they were fleeing, where the hell was Yuki?
http://upic.me/i/jh/haruhi5.jpg (http://upic.me/show.php?id=eef02b9f55567bd204b00a1bf803f0dd)

I just notice....


Standing off in the distance. You can see her in costume near Haruhi's head. Either she didn't go with them, or when given the "retreat" order she used her speed to full advantage.

[GMT]

Standing off in the distance. You can see her in costume near Haruhi's head. Either she didn't go with them, or when given the "retreat" order she used her speed to full advantage.
I saw that from the first viewing of the live stream. You'll also notice that she's not there in the SOS-dan reaction shot to the appearance of Priest-zilla. She must've thought "Oh this has bad idea written all over it. How about I go stand way over there and join you once it stops raining pigeon crap?"

[Ithekro]

Ah...the picture was just an broken red X when I typed that.

[Heminga13]

You know, this arc has them shooting off [toy] guns in public a lot. Sometimes at innocent bystanders. You'd think they'd get in trouble or something lol

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

THEY GET AWAY WITH IT BECAUSE HARUHI-SAMA WILLS IT SO!

... Actually it's just because they run away a lot and no one catches 'em. :heh:

[Sackett]

Hmm...

Sorry to bring up the whole K-On-ification issue again. I'm not that big on visual aspects, as plot and character development are more important to me, but these are my thoughts on the matter:

Mikuru actually looks better with the slight K-On-ification

Nagato isn't really that noticable unless you put them side by side, so I don't think it's much of an issue for her.

Kozumi and Kyon loked terrible when they were K-Onified, but that was only in that one episode of Endless Eight, and they haven't been really modified that much from the original since- which is a good thing I think.

Haruhi is the most noticeable- particularly since there are several scenes that make her look a lot like Yui. Personally I prefer the older version of Haruhi, but watching Sighs I have to say that the K-On-ification can work, if only because the contrast between Haruhi's cute exterior and her jerkish behavior are really played up by the art shift.

So I guess I can get used to it.

What I'm really sad about is Tsuruya. She also seemed slightly K-On-ified in this episode. Especially her face which is more round, and her hair which is less... bishoujo? If that's the right word for it. Maybe it's just because I haven't got used to it yet, but it saddened me because I think Tsuruya's elegant outward appearance combined with Genki Girl personality really was a nice contrast.

Ryoko had a similar contrast going on, I hope she doesn't get K-On-ified too.

Anyway, Tsuruya's appearance was what I think was new this episode in the whole K-On-ification debate.

Not that a small issue like this will turn me away from watching, but maybe Kyo-Ani is losing it's touch. I'd hate for them to become pigeon-holed into one type of animation style.

[Triple_R]

Haruhi is the most noticeable- particularly since there are several scenes that make her look a lot like Yui. Personally I prefer the older version of Haruhi, but watching Sighs I have to say that the K-On-ification can work, if only because the contrast between Haruhi's cute exterior and her jerkish behavior are really played up by the art shift.

After watching episode 12... I don't see where Haruhi is K-Onified in this episode. Many of her facial expressions are just about identical to her facial expressions in the classic 2006 style. Also, Haruhi has regained her somewhat unique open smile, which had been Yui-fied for a while.

The only K-On-ifed element that remains is lack of line definition (such as broken closed smiles - i.e. instead of one solid line for the smile, we have a half-smile line and then a little bit more line added in after a break). Other than that (and it's not even constant - frequently, you do have line definition), Haruhi looks to be back on 2006 model to me. Aside from degree of line definition, is there anything about Haruhi's look in this episode that makes you think K-On or Yui?

As for line definition... well, it's such a small part of the artwork, that if everything else is the way I like it, I'll let it slide.




Not that a small issue like this will turn me away from watching, but maybe Kyo-Ani is losing it's touch. I'd hate for them to become pigeon-holed into one type of animation style.

I agree with you here. However, I'm pretty much happy with the art style in this episode.

[Ithekro]

For the Mikuru Beam scene, Yuki crossed that entire distance in about six steps touching the ground. :eek:

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

Okay, this episode was a LOT better than the last two. I honestly can't think of any problems, other than the fact that Tsuruya looked like a cardboard cutout when Haruhi was yelling on the phone. :heh:

[Xiomay]

I don't know if this was mentioned before, but I was wondering if, in the scene where Haruhi hits Mikuru with the plastic megaphone, whether part of her rant towards Mikuru was a subliminal message to Kyon saying "Hey! I can be as cute as her too if I wanted to!"

A bit off topic, but I was just wondering if there was anyone else that thought so too when they saw this scene.

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

I liked the fact that it looked like Haruhi was about to whack her in the head, stopped just short and tapped her.

You know, so they keep the requirement of Haruhi hitting her on the head without making her look like a monster.

[TMSIDR]

I also think that the "rerun" get s better and better and I really liked the new Tsuruya-san. Her K-On! touch fits her fine I think. The only thing that bothers me a little bit, is that the characters do not blink as much as in 2006. But this might be just my bad memory :heh: .

It wonders me that nobody mentioned here that this episode really has some great John Woo references with the whole white doves -> pigeons thing and her double pistols. So that for the sake of completion I mention it now^^.

[4as]

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/4893/grab07374.jpg
SOOOOOOO CUTE
I think I'll vectorize it and make a wallpaper out of that screeny.

[siber222000]

kinda getting pissed off at haruhi as this arc goes on, but LOL mikuru beam was the best.

[Peanutbutter003]

Haruhi in the battle waitress outfit? Yes! :heh: I find it cute that Haruhi is peeved at Kyon molesting her with his eyes. Now we need some images of Haruhi in that costume. :p

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

I also think that the "rerun" get s better and better and I really liked the new Tsuruya-san. Her K-On! touch fits her fine I think.

Tsuruya looks awesome no matter what style she's in! Anyone denying that must suffer the wrath of BaTsuruya! :p

mikuru beam was the best.

... poor Nagato...

Haruhi in the battle waitress outfit? Yes! :heh: I find it cute that Haruhi is peeved at Kyon molesting her with his eyes. Now we need some images of Haruhi in that costume. :p

That visual data would be... intriguing...

[Triple_R]

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/4893/grab07374.jpg
SOOOOOOO CUTE
I think I'll vectorize it and make a wallpaper out of that screeny.

It's a really cute shot. Love how Haruhi is crossing her arms over her breasts. I have to admit that I get a chuckle out of the poetic justice of she who constantly plays up Mikuru's sex appeal feeling ogled a bit herself for a change. ;)



That visual data would be... intriguing...

Agreed. That's one piece of artwork that I'd really like to see someone attempt! :D

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

If it were anyone but Kyon, he'd probably be dead. :heh:

[Xhokhusmak]

Mikuru Beam was just Haruhi giving shit back to Kyon. :p

[sacundim]

I find it cute that Haruhi is peeved at Kyon molesting her with his eyes.

I don't think she's actually peeved—it's just putting on an act that she's peeved. Look at Haruhi's reaction in the opening scene of Sighs II, in the train, once she realizes Kyon is staring at her. She wants to be stared at by Kyon.

Her reaction to the matching blue hoodies is also probably related to this, though it's much harder to read. ("Oh, awesome, we look like we match!")

[sacundim]

It's a really cute shot. Love how Haruhi is crossing her arms over her breasts. I have to admit that I get a chuckle out of the poetic justice of she who constantly plays up Mikuru's sex appeal feeling ogled a bit herself for a change. ;)


I'm not so sure if the arm-crossing really means that. She also does that gesture before the ogling happens:

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3599/screenshot4atq.png

So it could go either way. As I said in another post, Haruhi clearly wants Kyon to stare at her. What lines she might want Kyon not to cross are impossible to tell, given that we just don't know what's going through that head of hers.

[Jonbob0008]

Agreed. That's one piece of artwork that I'd really like to see someone attempt! :D

I've seen it somewhere before. I'd have to look through the images thread to find it, but that could take all day. I assure you, though, that it was really cute.

Edit: I just realized I haven't commented on this episode yet.

Anyway, best episode of the new content yet. I'm becoming much more convinced that the "scene" will happen, as Haruhi's abusive behavior is definitely not toned down nearly enough for me to think otherwise. She was really mean to Mikuru in this episode, and she'll probably be even meaner in the next.

I wonder if part of the reason she's acting like this is because she thinks that this is how directors are supposed to act. I'm not trying to defend her behavior, I just trying to understand it better.

[Triple_R]

I'm not so sure if the arm-crossing really means that. She also does that gesture before the ogling happens:

http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/3599/screenshot4atq.png

Well, Kyon looks like he's staring at her there, too.


So it could go either way. As I said in another post, Haruhi clearly wants Kyon to stare at her.

In the train scene, she seemed to appreciate the attention there, yes. I'm inclined to think that Haruhi was just glad that Kyon was looking at her instead of Mikuru, for a change.

What lines she might want Kyon not to cross are impossible to tell, given that we just don't know what's going through that head of hers.

You could be right. My thinking is that Haruhi would like Kyon to appreciate her physical attractiveness more than he does Mikuru's (that's the main key for her, I think), but that she doesn't want Kyon to be ogling anybody a lot. She certainly likes to get some attention though.

I've seen it somewhere before. I'd have to look through the images thread to find it, but that could take all day. I assure you, though, that it was really cute.

Maybe a Google search will bring it up - I'm inclined to think that this would actually be faster than combing through Anime Suki's Haruhi images thread. :heh:

Edit: Found it! Or something like it anyway...

http://th06.deviantart.net/fs16/300W/f/2007/214/3/a/Suzumiya_Haruhi___fanart_by_Ninamo_chan.jpg


Mmmmmm~~ ... Haruhi does indeed look pretty good there! :D



Edit: I just realized I haven't commented on this episode yet.

Anyway, best episode of the new content yet. I'm becoming much more convinced that the "scene" will happen, as Haruhi's abusive behavior is definitely not toned down nearly enough for me to think otherwise. She was really mean to Mikuru in this episode, and she'll probably be even meaner in the next.

Yeah, the scene will happen, I think.


They may soften Haruhi a bit, but not a lot. And I fully expect Kyon to, er, come out swinging. ;)




I wonder if part of the reason she's acting like this is because she thinks that this is how directors are supposed to act. I'm not trying to defend her behavior, I just trying to understand it better.

Honestly... I know that most fans of this series tend to feel sorry for Mikuru, but I've always found the girl to be overly soft and to get upset really easily. I might get fed up with her too if I was in Haruhi's shoes, and had Mikuru whining and practically having a nervous breakdown over every little thing that I asked her to do. Now, don't get me wrong, Haruhi went too far, and hence it was nice to see Kyon come to Mikuru's rescue, but... Mikuru could really use a spine transplant, to be brutally honest. :heh:

[Voitan]

Episode was very good, reminded me of the good times.

Tsuruya's reintroduction to this season felt appropriate.

It's as if she needed to cram in as many lines as she could considering how much time she'll appear in this "season" and all of them very much like the ditzy lolfang-tan we know.

[OkamiNoKaze]

Unless Haruhi has changed that much since the beginning of the series, I don't think she would have minded it, if it was anybody buy Kyon. this is the girl that used to change right in front of everybody.

[khryoleoz]

Just watched subs. ;] (It's a shame that Mazui's release has a lower video quality than usual this week. Oh well)

Things I liked in this episode:
- Koizumi shuddering once Haruhi tells him he gets more screentime in the movie.
- Mi.. Mi.. Mikuru Beam!
- Nagato's swift running towards Mikuru to gouge her contact out :p
- Haruhi/Kyon 'fight' scene. Music and everything was great!
- TSURUYA
- Taniguchi's expression throughout the last scenes. Constantly in the background going :O
- Mikuru's movie 'outtakes'. I'm glad they're using the same camera effects as the original.
- The awesome art style. Especially during the movie scenes, it looked almost S1ish.

All I can think of for now. Though, this is my favourite Sighs episode so far.

Oh, and also the knowledge of more Tsuruya next week. xD
I agree 100%. Vol 2 of the book was the least interesting for me but that has more to do with how it strains the Kyon and Haruhi relationship. But having watched this episode, this anime adaptation brought greater intensity to all of these action scenes than what the book was able to convey to me. Kudos KyoAni.

[sacundim]

Well, Kyon looks like he's staring at her there, too.

In that scene, Kyon's just asked her a question, and Haruhi's been answering at length. And there's no cue that he's ogling her at that point in time.

[Triple_R]

In that scene, Kyon's just asked her a question, and Haruhi's been answering at length. And there's no cue that he's ogling her at that point in time.

He's looking in her general direction. "Stare" may be a bit too strong, but he is looking her way.

[Jonbob0008]

I agree that the anime version of Sighs has definitely been superior to the book version. This is definitely one of the cases where "the book was not better." Of course, this has a lot to do with the fact that the anime has done a very faithful adaptation of the book. Plus, all the actors have done a tremendous job delivering the lines. Everything just feels so much more lively than when I read the book.

Man, I can't wait for the next episode!

[Triple_R]

I agree that the anime version of Sighs has definitely been superior to the book version. This is definitely one of the cases where "the book was not better." Of course, this has a lot to do with the fact that the anime has done a very faithful adaptation of the book. Plus, all the actors have done a tremendous job delivering the lines. Everything just feels so much more lively than when I read the book.

Man, I can't wait for the next episode!

After reading a few of the novels, I definitely feel that Haruhi & Kyon's story is better presented in a visual medium than in a written one. Mostly for the reasons that you just outlined. :)

[Heatth]

I agree that the anime version of Sighs has definitely been superior to the book version. This is definitely one of the cases where "the book was not better." Of course, this has a lot to do with the fact that the anime has done a very faithful adaptation of the book. Plus, all the actors have done a tremendous job delivering the lines. Everything just feels so much more lively than when I read the book.

Man, I can't wait for the next episode!

Not only Sighs, but most storys are better in the anime. Mostly because the faithful adaption. Even Endless Eight, if you ignore the repeats. An exeption would be Lone Island (not bad in the anime, but better in the novel).

The only, unavoidable, problem is probably the missing narration lines. They mostly need to be cut, which is a pitty, cause they are good.

[Triple_R]

Not only Sighs, but most storys are better in the anime. Mostly because the faithful adaption. Even Endless Eight, if you ignore the repeats. An exeption would be Lone Island (not bad in the anime, but better in the novel).

The only, unavoidable, problem is probably the missing narration lines. They mostly need to be cut, which is a pitty, cause they are good.

Though in Sighs case, I'm glad to see some of those narration lines go. :heh:

[Ithekro]

"Men are potatos"...Kyon is slave labor. She reacts to slave labor looking at her.

[Bri]

Great episode like last weeks, the art work really seemed to hit the mark and the music was stellar.

[Jonbob0008]

Not only Sighs, but most storys are better in the anime. Mostly because the faithful adaption. Even Endless Eight, if you ignore the repeats. An exeption would be Lone Island (not bad in the anime, but better in the novel).

The only, unavoidable, problem is probably the missing narration lines. They mostly need to be cut, which is a pitty, cause they are good.

I actually liked Day of Sagittarius better in the novel, mostly because it was easier to understand what the hell was going on. Other than that, I agree completely.

I should also give a shout out to the directors of the episodes for making sure that the characters' expressions as as lively as possible. When I imagined the expressions made while reading Sighs, it wasn't nearly as varied and enterraining as the directors imagined it. Those guys are brilliant!

[Mecha_Trueno]

This is a translation error them. Maybe not so much for B-T, as they couldn't seen Kyon was not speaking. However, Mazui could see Kyon didn't open his mouth, so they should have choosed another word to translate it.That's true, I personally wouldn't have went with "now that you mention it..."


Ah man, I just realised we've only got 2 episodes left of new material... at the current pace, that's probably only gonna be JUST ABOUT enough to cover the rest of Sighs canon material.
... there's goes my hopes of seeing a 'making of Koi no Mikuru Densetsu':(, it would've been a good laugh seeing all the NGs and re-recording there'll have to go through:D not to mention Mikuru-chan struggling to reach the high notes:heh:

[CrowKenobi]

Maybe a Google search will bring it up - I'm inclined to think that this would actually be faster than combing through Anime Suki's Haruhi images thread. :heh:
Edit: Found it! Or something like it anyway...

http://th06.deviantart.net/fs16/300W/f/2007/214/3/a/Suzumiya_Haruhi___fanart_by_Ninamo_chan.jpg
Mmmmmm~~ ... Haruhi does indeed look pretty good there! :D Found a better one! :p

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/307/1186916238086.th.jpg (http://img42.imageshack.us/i/1186916238086.jpg/)Now the big question would be: if given the chance, would Haruhi actually do it? :D

[Triple_R]

Found a better one! :p

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/307/1186916238086.th.jpg (http://img42.imageshack.us/i/1186916238086.jpg/)Now the big question would be: if given the chance, would Haruhi actually do it? :D

Yeah, I like the one that you found better. Haruhi is more, um, full-bodied there. :D Great find!

Would she do it? Well, if she sincerely felt that doing it would cause Kyon to start liking her appearance more than he does Mikuru's... ;)

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

If she could find an excuse for it, she'd do it.

[OkamiNoKaze]

I think it would be funny if Haruhi was actually wearing Mikuru's outfit, and the top didn't fit quite right

[Kogetsu Shirogane]

... Only so we'd get to see her struggling to try and keep covered. I'd imagine she'd be rather cute in such a situation. :heh:

[CrowKenobi]

Chihiro subs are out!! :D

EDIT: Finished watching it and the game's afoot! :p 9/10

Next episode... the scene! (probably end on it)

EDIT 2: serious music is serious. :nod:

[GMT]

I liked the fact that it looked like Haruhi was about to whack her in the head, stopped just short and tapped her.

You know, so they keep the requirement of Haruhi hitting her on the head without making her look like a monster.
She sure didn't hold back a little later, when she started repeatedly beating Mikuru over the head with it. Then she was in full monster mode, and that was when Serious Kyon rode to the rescue.

[Ascaloth]

I just realised something.

Remember in The Adventures of Mikuru Asahina Episode 00, the camera was panning up and down after the Mikuru Beam and when Yuki was raping tackling Mikuru?

Take a closer look at Kyon's hand movements (specifically the one holding the camera) in that same scene in this episode. :D

[Peanutbutter003]

I just realised something.

Remember in The Adventures of Mikuru Asahina Episode 00, the camera was panning up and down after the Mikuru Beam and when Yuki was raping tackling Mikuru?

Take a closer look at Kyon's hand movements (specifically the one holding the camera) in that same scene in this episode. :D

Kyon panned it down instead of up, right? ;)

[Ascaloth]

Kyon panned it down instead of up, right? ;)

Not really. Kyon panned it up at first, then down afterwards. What was seen in Mikuru 00 more or less fit the sequence. :D

[Ithekro]

That he stops recording after the flash and then starts up again is interesting. He's also still zoomed in. His hand motions with the camera fit just about perfectly with what we see in the finished product...also Haruhi walks around Mikuru and Yuki so that when she comes into camera in the film, she comes in from the left size, even though the director's chair was off camera to the right. An accurate recreation of something they animated three plus years ago, from a completely different angle.

[ac195]

You're probably right. However, unless they drastically improve the quality of the final scene in Sigh I, the problem is going to come up the first time someone watches the DVD. :heh:

That's what the credits are for :p And again, unless you really are looking at them side by side... you won't really notice.

[thirdlc]

After watching episode 12... I don't see where Haruhi is K-Onified in this episode. Many of her facial expressions are just about identical to her facial expressions in the classic 2006 style. Also, Haruhi has regained her somewhat unique open smile, which had been Yui-fied for a while.

The only K-On-ifed element that remains is lack of line definition (such as broken closed smiles - i.e. instead of one solid line for the smile, we have a half-smile line and then a little bit more line added in after a break). Other than that (and it's not even constant - frequently, you do have line definition), Haruhi looks to be back on 2006 model to me. Aside from degree of line definition, is there anything about Haruhi's look in this episode that makes you think K-On or Yui?

As for line definition... well, it's such a small part of the artwork, that if everything else is the way I like it, I'll let it slide.




I agree with you here. However, I'm pretty much happy with the art style in this episode.

Even during K-ON, Ikeda's episodes were the most away from K-ON design and looked like Clannad, so how could Haruhi be K-ONified? ;) She isn't under the influence of K-ON.

But, you call what we saw in Clannad a K-ONified element too? Every time people say K-ON in Haruhi threads , I didn't get the point and was confused, but I'm getting the idea of it now. K-ON itself doesn't matter, right?

[Kaioshin Sama]

Yeah...as mixed as my feelings for this franchise have always been my opinion of it has never been as low as it's been these past couple of months. This episode doesn't really change that feeling much (at least it's not E8 wore off quickly) and frankly none of the new episodes have really been anything other than decent time passers so far. I could at least point to some episodes of the original run that were exceptional, but it seems that recently any and all creative notions and artistic (in the intellectual sense) have truly left this production duo behind. Disappointing outside of the fanservice and moe as usual for Neo-Kyoani.

[Myssa Rei]

*snips*

It's not all bad, but I do wish that the art consistency could be maintained. For example, in this episodes, there were parts that were very VERY close to the 2006 airing in terms of style, then in the next scene they change back to the newer KyoAni style.

[Takamura Mamoru]

I finally started picking this up again and watched Sighs. And I have to say, I like it. Yes, it's quite good.

Those were my reactions:

Episode 20:

- Hilarious beginning scene with Yuki
- Great dialogue
- "If at all possible, I'd like to blow up a building, but do you know where they'd sell dynamite?" GENIUS!

Episode 21:

- Great dialgoue again
- Yes, Yuki in her wizard outfit
- There was some awesome background music in the middle
- "Mama, what's that?" "Ssh, don't look at them." LOL
- Random guy taking a photo of bunny girl Mikuru... Kyon turning around and giving the guy a Death Glare.. Random guy winces.. LOL
- They actually made the commercial filming exactly the same as in Episode 00, except from the opposite perspective
- "plugsuit".. I see an Evangelion reference
- Taking Mikuru's tea she gave to Kyon! Jerkass Haruhi strikes again, but for some reason, I love the expression she has in that scene.
- Kyon: "Stop watching." Koizumi: "Of course." Lol, great voice acting.

Episode 22:

- Haruhi knows Gun Kata. (http://i660.photobucket.com/albums/uu328/Smokie1/snapshot20090830164620.jpg)It's Equilibrium!
- She fired at the monk! "Retreat!" LOL
- I really like Haruhi's clothes in this episode
- Koizumi made his situation worse.. His reaction was hilarious.
- Oh shit, Haruhi's Jerkass mode in extreme.. Serious moment! Well, at least Kyon physically intervened..
- Excellent voice acting on Aya Hirano's side
- BADASS YUKI TO THE ACTION!
- Ahh, great dialogue between Kyon and Yuki again.
- "Go eat your ripoff and die." LOL Kyon.
- TSURUYA!
- There's that cool background music again..

So I rated Sighs I with 7/10, Sighs II & III with 8/10.

[OkamiNoKaze]

I think calling the style K-onified is just spillover from people that didn't like that show. And because they're appling the style of a show they hated on to Haruhi, it just makes it worse for them.

[ReneeBurossamu]

.... you know what I just noticed?
I've never seen Koizumi eat anything, just drink tea.
/pointless

[worldruined]

.... you know what I just noticed?
I've never seen Koizumi eat anything, just drink tea.
/pointless
Kyon actually mentions this in Where Did the Cat Go? -- "Oh yes, I have never seen him chowing down on food."

He apparently does eat sometimes (presumably dinners during Lone Island Syndrome [maybe?], lunch at the pool during Endless Eight [I count two shots of him with food in hand in the anime episodes], a ham and pork chop sandwich in Snow Mountain Syndrome [he compliments Haruhi on its taste]), but never much or quickly. Keeping up the "elegant" image, I suppose, or maybe he runs on coffee Esper Energy? XD?

[Roger Rambo]

Kyon actually mentions this in Where Did the Cat Go? -- "Oh yes, I have never seen him chowing down on food."

He apparently does eat sometimes (presumably dinners during Lone Island Syndrome [maybe?], lunch at the pool during Endless Eight [I count two shots of him with food in hand in the anime episodes], a ham and pork chop sandwich in Snow Mountain Syndrome [he compliments Haruhi on its taste]), but never much or quickly. Keeping up the "elegant" image, I suppose, or maybe he runs on coffee Esper Energy? XD?
I suppose he just noshes it down when nobody is looking.

Just like Mikuru spits into Haruhi's tea when she's not watched.

[Kaisos Erranon]

I could at least point to some episodes of the original run that were exceptional, but it seems that recently any and all creative notions and artistic (in the intellectual sense) have truly left this production duo behind. Disappointing outside of the fanservice and moe as usual for Neo-Kyoani.

Why are you discrediting KyoAni for this?

This is Sighs. It is the absolute worst, most boring part of the source material outside of Where Did the Cat Go (and as much as I love that story, I'll admit that much).

There honestly isn't much they can do with this story aside from what they're doing already. This isn't like Live Alive or DoS where they have artistic freedom~ to work with.

This is still infinitely better than the original novel. And that's KyoAni's doing.

But wait. You complain about everything that KyoAni makes regardless of its qualiy.

[Triple_R]

Why are you discrediting KyoAni for this?

This is Sighs. It is the absolute worst, most boring part of the source material outside of Where Did the Cat Go (and as much as I love that story, I'll admit that much).

There honestly isn't much they can do with this story aside from what they're doing already. This isn't like Live Alive or DoS where they have artistic freedom~ to work with.

This is still infinitely better than the original novel. And that's KyoAni's doing.



Yeah, KyoAni deserves credit for Sighs. I think that they kind of missed the boat on a couple of key bits in episodes 10 and 11, but they were bang on superb for episode 12, and overall, their work for 10 through 12 has been quite commendable.

If Kaioshin hasn't read the novels, I can understand him being a bit non-plussed, but this really is an outstanding job of taking a part of the source material where almost every central character is at his or her worst, and making it pretty enjoyable instead.

[Ithekro]

Now don't go starting a new fetish, soon everyone will want some Mikuru spit in their tea.

[Takamura Mamoru]

Mmh, the plot of Sighs may not be interesting, but I think certain scenes help the character development and there's a lot of great dialogue. I'm definitely enjoying it and don't think KyoAni is doing a bad job (except for the art/animation).

[Jintor]

It's not up to S1 quality but then again I feel a lot of you are rose-tinting S1 quality anyway (apart from backgrounds, they almost always rocked). New style is different in its own way, that way being moe-ness, which I can appreciate that not everybody likes but hell - I like K-On Kyon.

[Akka]

That he stops recording after the flash and then starts up again is interesting.
Isn't it just Yuki's hand blocking the view ?

[ac195]

I'll say it again, those peeps who are grasping at straws to still hate on Haruhi are just still butthurt about E8 or just lingering trolls.

I love how they can pick apart a show by just a single paused frame... one you wouldn't even notice unless you went into the show with an already negative mind set.

[Nochgo]

These last few episode was pretty well done I thought, except the animation. The Sighs section of the novel was one of few novel parts i skipped, so its enjoyable to watch the process of the movie making. The more and more I watch, the more affection I feel for Mikuru (which was never there until now) and more annoyed I get at Haruhi, but well, Haruhi is just being Haruhi I guess.

Lol at Koizumi snagging the contacts. Wonder if he is excited to add laser beam eye to his list of esper powers.

[GDB]

Lol at Koizumi snagging the contacts. Wonder if he is excited to add laser beam eye to his list of esper powers.

Probably not, since Nagato specifically says that the contact has no actual power. It's just Mikuru with alternate color eye = Mikuru Beam.

[ac195]

Probably not, since Nagato specifically says that the contact has no actual power. It's just Mikuru with alternate color eye = Mikuru Beam.

...minus the variants Nagato has crossed of the list with each bite. ;)

[Ithekro]

Isn't it just Yuki's hand blocking the view ?


Partly, but the pause would be too long, and he moves the camera to a downward angle...before Yuki intercepts shot number two (which would have unblocked the camera lens to looking at concrete). After shot number three, at Itsuki, Kyon brings the camera back up and Yuki takes off running.

It is possible that they editted some of that in post, but it looks more like he stopped recording when the screen blacked out on him, then started up just before Yuki took off running, since in the film you see the flash, darkness, refocus on Mikuru's face, Mikuru drops her arm, then Yuki tackles her....followed by Kyon's hand (and body) movements as he runs over to them. He then turns off the camera.

I wonder if he has it set so that it will only record when his thumb is holding the button rather than press it once to record. I somehow remember the older Sony camcorders use to work like that.

[worldruined]

Lol at Koizumi snagging the contacts. Wonder if he is excited to add laser beam eye to his list of esper powers.
Nah, he has to add it to the Organization's collection of Holy Haruhi Relics. :nod:

[Archon_Wing]

A very good episode, I thought. Unlike something like Sighs I, where I was sometimes checking to see when it was going to end, this one kept me watching. Also, I didn't find anything wrong with the art; which I did in the previous episodes.

There's plenty of funny moments such as the comment about hardcore fans, Haruhi's BB guns, Kyon's camera focus, and the note about executing people twice. Haruhi is quite the dictator. :D We learn the reason for Yuki's odd behavior in episode 00, and as usual she saves the day.

Of course, the story itself is kinda meh, with Haruhi's over the topness bordering on sadism, outright crossing into it when Mikuru gets sick, and seemingly undoing practically all the character development she has gone through for the sake of a few cheap laughs at Mikuru's expense. It feels out of character even for her. But at least Kyon tries to intervene, to keep her enthusiasm from going too far and the other two are trying to help. 8/10

[Triple_R]

Of course, the story itself is kinda meh, with Haruhi's over the topness bordering on sadism, outright crossing into it when Mikuru gets sick, and seemingly undoing practically all the character development she has gone through for the sake of a few cheap laughs at Mikuru's expense. It feels out of character even for her. But at least Kyon tries to intervene, to keep her enthusiasm from going too far and the other two are trying to help. 8/10

This is a bit off-topic, but... Sighs, as a novel, may have been a slight overcompensation on the author's part. I think that Sighs is meant to demonstrate that Haruhi's core characterization, drives, and personality has not been altered whatsoever by the events of the Melancholy novel. Sighs is meant to show that the end of the Melancholy novel is not a permanent solution to a permanent problem but merely an one-time solution for an unique problem (the problem could, in theory, rise again, but it is an unique problem). In other words, the overarching issues arising from Haruhi's character remain. She's still impulsive, she's still reckless, she's still overbearing, and she's still lacking empathy for the feelings of others.

Sighs is meant to hammer that home, and to show that there's an awful lot of work left to be done on the part of the rest of the SOS Brigade.

[Archon_Wing]

This is a bit off-topic, but... Sighs, as a novel, may have been a slight overcompensation on the author's part. I think that Sighs is meant to demonstrate that Haruhi's core characterization, drives, and personality has not been altered whatsoever by the events of the Melancholy novel. Sighs is meant to show that the end of the Melancholy novel is not a permanent solution to a permanent problem but merely an one-time solution for an unique problem (the problem could, in theory, rise again, but it is an unique problem). In other words, the overarching issues arising from Haruhi's character remain. She's still impulsive, she's still reckless, she's still overbearing, and she's still lacking empathy for the feelings of others.

Sighs is meant to hammer that home, and to show that there's an awful lot of work left to be done on the part of the rest of the SOS Brigade.

Yea, fair enough. I do actually think Sighs is appropriate as it offers the question of "how much you can take", but a bit too extreme. But as (wikipedia shows) this is set after stories like Lone Island Syndrome and gah... Endless Eight , I'd think Haruhi has gained some kind of concern of what others want. I found the part where Haruhi is demanding Mikuru shoot a beam to stretch my suspension of belief. Yes, she made an excuse about that, but I don't think she's the type of person to confuse metaphors with reality. She's a smart person, and she would not expect something out of someone that can't happen. Now those outfits, are another story. ;)