View Full Version : Episode 22: Created Human [Spoilers]
Yondaime
2004-03-03, 06:08
I was watching the preview for ep 22 and saw this pic of the human Alphonse's soul/reflection(?) in one of the Philosopher Stone liquids' tube containers while Ed is looking at it :o Im curious what this is about :o And also it shows in the next frame a pic of Armor Alphonse in a pretty decimated condition due to the Sins :( Anyways here is the pic in question http://dr.light.freeservers.com/Alphonse.jpg I'll be interested to hear your feedback later!
- Yondaime
I was watching the preview for ep 22 and saw this pic of the human Alphonse's soul/reflection(?) in one of the Philosopher Stone liquids' tube containers while Ed is looking at it :o Im curious what this is about :o And also it shows in the next frame a pic of Armor Alphonse in a pretty decimated condition due to the Sins :( Anyways here is the pic in question http://dr.light.freeservers.com/Alphonse.jpg I'll be interested to hear your feedback later!
- Yondaime
Realize that the anime has totally broken off the manga as of 21, so that nobody is going to be able to answer any of these beside speculation.
Yondaime
2004-03-03, 16:43
lol yea im not asking for a definitive answer I just wanted to start some speculation/discussion :D
- Yondaime
PiePants
2004-03-03, 17:26
Wait the deuce, I saw subs there. That was ep 22?? Anbu's already subbing? *explodes into a billion peices then recomposes randomly*
Well, they're trying to put into question whether Alphonse is even human. I don't expect anything to really happen in ep 22 except more plot leading to the climax -- will Alphonse start to doubt his 'existence' that greatly? Hmm...*xD*
I assume that is most likly just a body that was made. like the chimera with nina's face in 21. I wonder how Al is going to react to that . . .
i think it's just a memory that Ed has of Al. probably seeing him lying there defeated, "sees" the young Al in the reflection of the wall, then turns around and does something crazy.... but that's just me.
I have a good clue :P mr evil guy who can morph. I mean, that alphonse in that picture seems semi evil inherently :P This is pure speculation >:)
sarcasteak
2004-03-04, 16:23
i think it's just a memory that Ed has of Al. probably seeing him lying there defeated, "sees" the young Al in the reflection of the wall, then turns around and does something crazy.... but that's just me.
I totally agree with this speculation. The smile of that Alphonse seem more innocent than evil to me...
polymath
2004-03-04, 20:42
Envy posing as Al?
Oooh... Envy is dangerous...
http://wgalland.hp.infoseek.co.jp/200403a.htm (http://wgalland.hp.infoseek.co.jp) has screenshots of episode 22 now.
As usual, they are kind of spoilerful without giving too much detail until you watch the episodes.
Lust, Gluttony & Envy walk out in military uniforms without getting stopped? Now that's too obvious on what's going on :heh: Looks like there wouldn't be a discovery of the real Philosopher's Stone yet.
http://wgalland.hp.infoseek.co.jp has screenshots of episode 22 now.
As usual, they are kind of spoilerful without giving too much detail until you watch the episodes.
Lust, Gluttony & Envy walk out in military uniforms without getting stopped? Now that's too obvious on what's going on :heh: Looks like there wouldn't be a discovery of the real Philosopher's Stone yet.
Yeah, Gluttony seems too obvious. :heh:
Hmm.. seems like a good episode. Can't wait. :D
http://wgalland.hp.infoseek.co.jp has screenshots of episode 22 now.
As usual, they are kind of spoilerful without giving too much detail until you watch the episodes.
Lust, Gluttony & Envy walk out in military uniforms without getting stopped? Now that's too obvious on what's going on :heh: Looks like there wouldn't be a discovery of the real Philosopher's Stone yet.
Shun Tucker was working in conjunction with Sins. He tricked Ed into almost liquidify the last batch of condemn prisoners. However, Kimberly the Mad Bomber have no intention of going quietly into red liquid, and he blasted his way out of the refinary chamber with an involuntary reactan (another prisoner).
Gluttony once again kicked Scar's ass (Scar still don't know how to unmake a homunculus yet). He was knocked down into Greed's holding chamber, and Gluttony got dizzy just being near the place. Lust pin Al against the wall while Gluttony immobilize him by eating crucial part of Al. With Al as hostage, they force Ed to continue the ceremony, which Ed very much relunctly proceed, despite Al's protest. Ed first have to repair the refinary chamber. Scar re-intervene again, this time breaking the glass container of the incomplete Philospher's Stone liquid. And Ed have a sever and uncontrolled reaction with all of these raw power, sending shards of spikes up against the Sins. The Sins retreat, wearing the uniform. And it is clear that the President's secetary is NOT Lust (though she does recongized what they are, and are probably in league with them). Lt. Ross was finally able to calm Ed and stop him from interacting with the PS liquid.
Greed and his gang of chimera escape, and Kimberly joins them.
This episode really test Ed's resolves, in terms of what he's willing to do to restore his brother. On one hand, all of the prisoners have already been condemned to death (Kimberly most certaintly deserved his sentence). The President and the rest of Ed's chaperons (Armstrong, Ross and Brosh) went to the research lab and 'rescue' the boys, who's really bang up again.
Rockpaperscissors
2004-03-07, 03:14
I just watched episode 22 raw.. heh I didn't understand anything they said, but man it's still brought shiwers down my spine!!!
next episode is calmer... heh we need one of those...
sarcasteak
2004-03-07, 10:59
Just watched the rawr, can't wait for the sub! Thank God FMA doesn't have stupid 5-minute episode recaps or I would've gone nuts!
Kimberly most likely will join Greed's gang...maybe in the anime Greed won't be just a whipping boy for Wrath! (Eh, though I don't really expect the Mad Bomber to stop Wrath's pwnage, but perhaps just impede it)
That was pretty sad for Scar; he was too slow for Gluttorny to perform any sort of decomposition...
Hmm, another interesting revelation is the fact that the President's secretary is NOT Lust. This gives a huge blow to the theory that Lust was the woman with Scar's brother, because afterall only Envy can morph into the likes of other people. But the two women do resemble Lust... maybe they are her clones? Oh the suspense.
And remember...the episode preview always cut clips to throw you off. Pity those who got fooled by the reflection of Al! :heh:
Just watched the sub (Chinese, KTXP). A good episode and as has been stated lots of times, different from the manga. However it appears the next episode would be similar to the manga's events after the 5th Laboratory incident. Winry'll be back to knock some sense into those boys :p
Some questions that can be raised for speculation here...
(Points to talk about)
The homunculi here stated they want to become humans. Unless they are not deliberately revealing Father, it seems they are on their own? Especially since Envy screams that they are not made but "born". Note: They could be "born" from test tubes rather than created instantly through alchemy.
Envy despises Edward partly because Ed "inherited the bloodline of that guy". Ahh... who is "that guy?". It must be Edward's father Hoenheim then (or ancestor). But why would Envy have such hatred to "that guy"? Could it be something like the animosity between Greed & Envy? If it is, my speculation would be that Hoenheim is Pride and Ed & Al are the sons of homunculi! Basis is of course based on Wrath and that Hoenheim being younger could be the final homunculus (the perfect homunculus, the Pride of the Father's creations).
The Fuhrer's (that is the official rank) secretary is supposed to resemble Tricia Elric, which explains Ed's reactions on first seeing her.
Now just waiting for Izumi to show up, & the Wrath-Greed Shodown!
sarcasteak
2004-03-08, 00:28
...and this is why I need fansubs. :)
The Fuhrer's (that is the official rank) secretary is supposed to resemble Tricia Elric, which explains Ed's reactions on first seeing her.
Wow...I didn't realize that until I read your post. At first I thought she resembled Lust because of her lips (her eyes were closed when we first saw her); then again, that's just the drawing style. And in the end of the episode 15, Al mentions that he hears Mom's voice after the secretary spoke. Personally I couldn't tell the resemblence (since the secretary spoke seriously, whereas their mother was always cheerful), but it does reinforce what you said.
Now just waiting for Izumi to show up, & the Wrath-Greed Shodown!
Yes, the pwnage will come!
But this also means..."that" will happen soon...*sob sob*
Edit: I just saw the sub, and wow Envy has such a big mouth. = 0
I'm surprised how the Sins claim to want to become humans, the "foolish" creatures they've been mocking for 22 episodes. Are they just saying that to gain sympathy...or are they really that interested in becoming humans? Judging from Envy's reaction, they might actually be serious. o_0;;
I don't recall exactly what Father and the gang wanted to achieve in the manga, but I'm pretty sure they weren't trying to become humans. Oh, and I definitely think the anime's path is better; instead of merely being on top of the list for "sacrificial candidates," Ed is taking such a significant and active role for the Sins' scheme.
Sigh... Can we have anime discussion without complete manga spoilers? I already read up to vol6 of the manga and there are still tons of spoilers here.
I just saw the episode and I was jumping up in my seat in the end when we caught a glimpse of the
remaining Sins. Since Lust, Envy, and Gluttonny got away, I'm wondering what happened to Scar then? And I'm dying to know why all was being mean and dark in the next episode. it's pretty obvious this is gonna put a wrinkle in the story and cause another problem for Al.
Overall I think episode 21 and 22 were da best ^_^ I heart fma!
holyorder812
2004-03-08, 11:39
my hohenheim's theory
I think hohenheim is Pride, and he broke away from the other sins (like Greed). That's why Envy despised Edward and say to him "You have his blood" . Being as the most powerful sin, Hohenheim has the qualities of both human and homunculus. He can have offsprings, alchemy abilities and his own unique abilities as a homunculus (Wrath who were created earlier from him had similiar human properties, without the alchemy abilities). Hohenheim broke away from because he is too arrogant to be in league with the other sins who were obviously did not share the same "craftmanship" as him. Hohenheim left the army because he heard someone out there were in search of the philosopher's stone (scar's brother).
don't kill me if I'm wrong.
Shenlong
2004-03-08, 11:58
Winry looks very mature and hot with her hair down in the previews..
*blushes*
dreamless
2004-03-08, 12:14
I think Winry looks like Ed in the previews... *_*
Bindibadgi
2004-03-08, 15:47
Right im getting well confused with all these sins flying around!
Envy = cross-dressing-person-changer-dude?
Glutony = fat guy that eats Al?
Lust = foxy chick with nails you wouldnt like scratching your back in bed
Greed = ? I forgot
Pride = we speculate is Elerics father?
Now im lost on the rest, is it cause ive not read the manga? Or should i just rewatch the series?
Right im getting well confused with all these sins flying around!
Envy = cross-dressing-person-changer-dude?
Glutony = fat guy that eats Al?
Lust = foxy chick with nails you wouldnt like scratching your back in bed
Greed = ? I forgot
Pride = we speculate is Elerics father?
Now im lost on the rest, is it cause ive not read the manga? Or should i just rewatch the series?
Greed is the guy wearing fur coat. In the anime, he's the one locked up inside the 5th Central Research lab for 130 years.
Sloth has not appear yet, and Wrath is someone you've already seen.
ShadowLady
2004-03-08, 16:51
Winry looks very mature and hot with her hair down in the previews..
*blushes*
Yeah I kinda noticed that too.
I actually paused the video because i was like "huh is that winry 0.o?"
DarkNtity
2004-03-08, 17:04
Man, Greed and three other unknown people I assumed were the other sins, since at least one of them sports a red tattoo. Sweet episode, until I read this bloody thread so full of manga spoilers it could choke someone to death. Why are manga readers making predictions in the anime thread? Even if the anime breaks away from the manga storyline from time to time, some facts will never change.
I mean it doesn't say manga spoilers ahead. So what at least I presumed was that the spoiler tags are there for those who haven't seen the episode yet.
For whining out loud, one post pratically says "Some questions that can be raised for speculation here..." so I go in thinking "Gosh speculation regarding this ep, this should be fun" and I come out feeling violated by blades dipped in manga spoilers. Why???
sarcasteak
2004-03-08, 19:06
Why are manga readers making predictions in the anime thread?
Hmm, I do it because 1.) I don't discuss anywhere else other than Chinese forums, 2.) some people want those spoilers, and 3.) I use spoiler tag.
So what at least I presumed was that the spoiler tags are there for those who haven't seen the episode yet.
Any speculations based on this episode shouldn't even have spoiler tags to begin with, though! ^_^;;
or whining out loud, one post pratically says "Some questions that can be raised for speculation here..." so I go in thinking "Gosh speculation regarding this ep, this should be fun" and I come out feeling violated by blades dipped in manga spoilers. Why???
Ummm, Yebyosh made those speculations based mainly on this episode; yes, he did incorporate "Father" and "Wrath," but for the most part it was based on the anime alone. Don't bash indiscriminately...
Dark_Sun
2004-03-08, 19:35
so is ed like MEGA POWERFUL!?
Mikesmaf
2004-03-08, 20:40
i think the jolt of power was a temporary thing...but this is just a guess.
Any speculations based on this episode shouldn't even have spoiler tags to begin with, though! ^_^;;
Ummm, Yebyosh made those speculations based mainly on this episode; yes, he did incorporate "Father" and "Wrath," but for the most part it was based on the anime alone. Don't bash indiscriminately...
How 'bout this. In the future, if we bring anything that's manga-sourced spoiler, we'd marked accordingly.
SketchyMcChips
2004-03-08, 20:59
i think the jolt of power was a temporary thing...but this is just a guess.
I'm in the habit of putting everything in these threads in spoilers so my apoligies if you don't think it classes as one.
I'd imagine so - but it's be interesting if it wasn't...considering he managed to scare the crap out of 3 homunculi when he had the power surge...just imagine what he could do with the philosophers stone???? How on earth did they homunculi get out of there??? Greed does look way too obvious, even if Envy and Lust managed to pull it off, Greed doesn't look human enough.
and looking ahead to ep 23...
Well looks like we have a nice quiet one coming up whilst Ed recovers. Seems as well like Al is going to take the opportunity to confront the possibility that he isn't the soul he thinks he is. It'll be a nice turn of pace to give us a break from all the action.
I think Winry looks like Ed in the previews... *_*
Haven't you heard of the sayings that fated devoted couples tend to grow to look alike? :D I think that pretty much settles who the anime crew would like to pair Ed with :p
To SketchyMcChips: I believe you are referring to Gluttony, not Greed.
DarkNtity
2004-03-08, 21:20
Hmm, I do it because 1.) I don't discuss anywhere else other than Chinese forums, 2.) some people want those spoilers, and 3.) I use spoiler tag.
1) That has no relevance bringing the discussion here. 2) I don't see anyone asking for spoilers. But I do see spoilers confusing someone. 3) Good for you. But since you were responding to Yebyosh, there was no need to read whatever you tagged.
Any speculations based on this episode shouldn't even have spoiler tags to begin with, though! ^_^;;
Really? So are my eyes decieving me? Aren't you the very one who has an overview with added speculation regarding this episode + a drop of a manga spoiler all hidden in spoiler tags?
So please, don't give me that crap.
Ummm, Yebyosh made those speculations based mainly on this episode; yes, he did incorporate "Father" and "Wrath," but for the most part it was based on the anime alone. Don't bash indiscriminately...
I watch the anime. And I can perfectly asess by myself when too much info is given. There was more going on in there than "Father" and "Wrath". And even that alone is valid in this case.
It's not like I'm the only one who feels this way.
Sigh... Can we have anime discussion without complete manga spoilers? I already read up to vol6 of the manga and there are still tons of spoilers here.
And who is bashing, indiscriminately for that matter?
This is a critique.
this thread is amazing!!! i learned so much thing i didn't know. Hey it seems that the manga is more detailed.
YuuOminae
2004-03-08, 21:45
I'm going to have to agree with Darkntity. A lot of people just watch the anime and hence would prefer not to have to be constantly spoiled about what's happening in the manga, which will mostly likely be what will happen in the anime.
It'd be better to make a separate thread just for the manga.
sarcasteak
2004-03-09, 03:01
1) That has no relevance bringing the discussion here. 2) I don't see anyone asking for spoilers. But I do see spoilers confusing someone. 3) Good for you. But since you were responding to Yebyosh, there was no need to read whatever you tagged.
Yes, I was having a little discussion with Yebyosh, and I truly apologize for not using the PM option!!
Really? So are my eyes decieving me? Aren't you the very one who has an overview with added speculation regarding this episode + a drop of a manga spoiler all hidden in spoiler tags?
So please, don't give me that crap.
Read what I said again; why do people need spoiler tags if their speculations are based on the current episode? I wasn't referring to myself.
I watch the anime. And I can perfectly asess by myself when too much info is given. There was more going on in there than "Father" and "Wrath". And even that alone is valid in this case.
I felt those were just minor details in that particular discussion, but obviously you disagree. Note taken.
It's not like I'm the only one who feels this way.
Your complaint has been heard. We'll have our own little discussions with our new [mangaspoiler] tags.
And who is bashing, indiscriminately for that matter?
This is a critique.
I felt the speculation you were "criticizing" did not involve many manga spoilers (or anything that hasn't been repeatedly spoiled already) and thus the comment.
Bindibadgi
2004-03-09, 03:30
and looking ahead to ep 23...
Well looks like we have a nice quiet one coming up whilst Ed recovers. Seems as well like Al is going to take the opportunity to confront the possibility that he isn't the soul he thinks he is. It'll be a nice turn of pace to give us a break from all the action.
Are you nuts? Al's gone dark by the looks of the preview. Shouldnt have as much physical action but it aint gonna be quiet imo ;)
That Other Ninja
2004-03-09, 05:17
Any comments made about who r Sloth n Wrath? Or if Sloth is someone we've already seen...
...is it Scar?
Any comments made about who r Sloth n Wrath? Or if Sloth is someone we've already seen...
...is it Scar?
Possilbe Manga Spoiler
Sloth isn't anyone that the anime've shown. Wrath is someone who's been on the anime for quite a while. And it's not Scar.
but one thing for sure.. FMA is getting more n more interesting.. man, its a really good anime.. i like winry ^O^, even though she forgot one screw... :twitch:
for me FMA is the best anime so far, beside one piece..
That Other Ninja
2004-03-09, 18:15
Er... I meant Wrath for Scar, not Sloth.
velmeran
2004-03-09, 20:26
Funniest part of Full Metal Alchemist...
When the faux philosiphers stone stuff starts going crazy with Ed and all I can think about is him going super saijn and throwing energy balls, thankfully thats not going to happen.
I must admit it but FMA is getting very interesting and entertaining. I stopped watching the series around episode 9 but then I started to noticed how many downloads FMA gets every time a new episode comes out, so I thought lets give it a second chance and WOW by episode 15 things started heating up.
Episodes 21 and 22 are the best ones.
I like it now :)
SetaNoriyasu
2004-03-10, 08:45
Current Speculation On Al....
Ok... I am figuring that in Ep 23, Al finds out that he (or his soul?) is just merely a creation of Ed's memory? Because not much has been explained about the Soul Affixing Alchemy... The closest thing that has been mentioned about soul affixing alchemy is when Tucker said that he could affix his memory of Nina into the chimera he created, thus giving her (it) memories etc. etc. etc. if he got the info from the Humuculi.... another thing I like to point out is in the episode when Ed and Al went back to the Rockbells' to get fixed up, Ed wanted to say something to Al.......
Well Thats what I assume......
Dont flame me if I am wrong *cowers in a dark secluded corner in fear of retribution*
Bindibadgi
2004-03-10, 12:37
Current Speculation On Al....
Ok... I am figuring that in Ep 23, Al finds out that he (or his soul?) is just merely a creation of Ed's memory? Because not much has been explained about the Soul Affixing Alchemy... The closest thing that has been mentioned about soul affixing alchemy is when Tucker said that he could affix his memory of Nina into the chimera he created, thus giving her (it) memories etc. etc. etc. if he got the info from the Humuculi.... another thing I like to point out is in the episode when Ed and Al went back to the Rockbells' to get fixed up, Ed wanted to say something to Al.......
Well Thats what I assume......
Dont flame me if I am wrong *cowers in a dark secluded corner in fear of retribution*
Im thinking you're right thinking about it, remember the reflection on the glass of the red water when ed was looking into it..?
NightWalker XI
2004-03-10, 12:46
I want to punch Al in the face after watching this episode and the preview, he is really styarting to get on my nerves, he is only one year younger than Ed and is so immature and alwaysd whinning and stuff...blargh...he annoys me, don't like him..
So Sloth is someone we've been watching for quite a while....so...
Isn't Sloth like, laziness or sumthing? so...
maybe..whats his name the dude with glasses...nah he ain't that lazy is he....Hughes, thats his name..I always forget names...who else could it be? Mustang...one of his little tagalongs?
I want to punch Al in the face after watching this episode and the preview, he is really styarting to get on my nerves, he is only one year younger than Ed and is so immature and alwaysd whinning and stuff...blargh...he annoys me, don't like him..
So Sloth is someone we've been watching for quite a while....so...
Isn't Sloth like, laziness or sumthing? so...
maybe..whats his name the dude with glasses...nah he ain't that lazy is he....Hughes, thats his name..I always forget names...who else could it be? Mustang...one of his little tagalongs?
Manga Spoiler
No. For the last time, Wrath is the one who's been on scene for quite a while. Sloth is someone we've never seen on screen yet.
I want to punch Al in the face after watching this episode and the preview, he is really styarting to get on my nerves, he is only one year younger than Ed and is so immature and alwaysd whinning and stuff...blargh...he annoys me, don't like him..
So Sloth is someone we've been watching for quite a while....so...
Isn't Sloth like, laziness or sumthing? so...
maybe..whats his name the dude with glasses...nah he ain't that lazy is he....Hughes, thats his name..I always forget names...who else could it be? Mustang...one of his little tagalongs?
Well, if Al really is a creation of Ed's memories, that might explain Al's immaturity. Since he's based on a memory, and thus not a real person, he can't really grow up wihtout contradicting the implanted persona.
Nine Devil
2004-03-10, 14:13
So bigfire-san tell me who is wrath then in spoilers please.
Current Speculation On Al....
Ok... I am figuring that in Ep 23, Al finds out that he (or his soul?) is just merely a creation of Ed's memory? Because not much has been explained about the Soul Affixing Alchemy... The closest thing that has been mentioned about soul affixing alchemy is when Tucker said that he could affix his memory of Nina into the chimera he created, thus giving her (it) memories etc. etc. etc. if he got the info from the Humuculi.... another thing I like to point out is in the episode when Ed and Al went back to the Rockbells' to get fixed up, Ed wanted to say something to Al.......
Well Thats what I assume......
Dont flame me if I am wrong *cowers in a dark secluded corner in fear of retribution*
well you're thinking too much like al. if he was then ed wouldn't have asked that chimera dude how he intended to bring nina's soul back. Al, like the butcher guy and the two brothers who were affixed to the armor are real souls.
SketchyMcChips
2004-03-10, 16:08
So bigfire-san tell me who is wrath then in spoilers please.
Look at the other threads for FMA - its posted on one of them.
Bindibadgi
2004-03-10, 18:53
I want to punch Al in the face after watching this episode and the preview, he is really styarting to get on my nerves, he is only one year younger than Ed and is so immature and alwaysd whinning and stuff...blargh...he annoys me, don't like him..
well ill bind you to a suit of armour and see how u like it :p
he's also more mature - Ed gets worked up about crap waaaay too much, but Al = Mr. Cool at times.
well you're thinking too much like al. if he was then ed wouldn't have asked that chimera dude how he intended to bring nina's soul back. Al, like the butcher guy and the two brothers who were affixed to the armor are real souls.
You assume that Ed's transmutation was completely successful. While he reacts to Al as if he were his real brother, it seems possible that he essentially recreated Al without intending to.
sarcasteak
2004-03-10, 23:01
So Wrath is someone we've been watching for quite a while....so...
Fixed.
So bigfire-san tell me who is wrath then in spoilers please.
I really recommend waiting for it...his introduction came along with a massive ass-whooping.
If you really want to find out, check this tribute Yebyosh made.
Warning: manga spoiler that might burn your virgin eyes (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=7276)
damn Ed pisses me off hehehe!!! he's really weak minded!!
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