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Kairin
2009-11-12, 01:17
Welcome to the discussion thread for Darker Than Black 2nd Season, Episode 06.

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Amirali
2009-11-12, 11:47
Spoilers from a reliable source...



It was YIN in the box


Edit:


SPOILERS
IT WAS YIN IN THE BOX
YIN KILLED WATER CONTRACTOR it seems she can control water or something... well who knows YIN WAS PROBABLY TURNED INTO A MODIFIED DOLL FOR COMBAT
AND HEI CANNOT SEE HER
HEI COOKING AGAIN... AND SUOH MAKING HIM PROMISE NOT MORE SHOTS NO MORE ALCOHOL


OK PEOPLE


SPOILER PICS
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043497371.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043701312.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044685498.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044695958.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044892132.jpg
[/QUOTE]

Zwei
2009-11-12, 12:18
spoilers from a reliable source...



it was yin in the box

ok people

spoilers
it was yin in the box
yin killed water contractor it seems she can control water or something... Well who knows yin was probably turned into a modified doll for combat
and hei cannot see her
hei cooking again... And suoh making him promise not more shots no more alcohol


spoiler pics
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043497371.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043701312.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044685498.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044695958.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044892132.jpg


You don't say.

Well, I was 50/50 about Yin being in the box but then again this series is running for twelve episodes, so it was pretty much about time for Yin to show up, or at least confirm whether she was still alive or not but it seems she's in some sort of comatose state.

Exactly how did she kill the water contractor? Either I misunderstood your post, or you just said that Yin controlloed water. :heh:

Amirali
2009-11-12, 12:23
[/spoiler]

You don't say.

Well, I was 50/50 about Yin being in the box but then again this series is running for twelve episodes, so it was pretty much about time for Yin to show up, or at least confirm whether she was still alive or not but it seems she's in some sort of comatose state.

Exactly how did she kill the water contractor? Either I misunderstood your post, or you just said that Yin controlloed water. :heh:


I am not sure. I will update as I get it...

nubby
2009-11-12, 12:33
Spoilers from a reliable source...



It was YIN in the box


Edit:


SPOILERS
IT WAS YIN IN THE BOX
YIN KILLED WATER CONTRACTOR it seems she can control water or something... well who knows YIN WAS PROBABLY TURNED INTO A MODIFIED DOLL FOR COMBAT
AND HEI CANNOT SEE HER
HEI COOKING AGAIN... AND SUOH MAKING HIM PROMISE NOT MORE SHOTS NO MORE ALCOHOL


OK PEOPLE


SPOILER PICS
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043497371.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043701312.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044685498.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044695958.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044892132.jpg
[/QUOTE]



I'm just glad it wasn't a * in a box.


The truck thing is actually the shotacon contractor right? I hope it's not Yin because that looks ridiculous.

Amirali
2009-11-12, 12:49
There was a correction...

It seems that Yin was there in the box but NOT in the box Hei saw... that box was empty

Yin tries to hug Hei
Hei was not capable of seeing Yin even when she was trying to hug him so probably she was in the box but invisible for Hei.

Anyway Yin's spiritual observer was responsible somehow of Norio's mom demise... she is said to be dead.
Suoh is learning new ways to fight.

Que Magical Girl Transformation

.

Bombo
2009-11-12, 13:03
Yin saved..and in box...and she show up in episode = 10/10

nubby
2009-11-12, 13:10
There was a correction...

It seems that Yin was there in the box but NOT in the box Hei saw... that box was empty

Yin tries to hug Hei
Hei was not capable of seeing Yin even when she was trying to hug him so probably she was in the box but invisible for Hei.

Anyway Yin's spiritual observer was responsible somehow of Norio's mom demise... she is said to be dead.
Suoh is learning new ways to fight.

Que Magical Girl Transformation

.



Sounds more like she was in a box somewhere else but is roaming free in her observer form. Hei cannot see her because he is not a contract anymore. Actually, did they ever show Hei being able to see an observer in season 1? I remember an observer going by Hei and he never looked at it. I just thought he did that so they wouldn't be able to tell if he was a contractor since only contractors can see them.

sirn
2009-11-12, 14:03
- Shinji103 was right; Yin was still (somewhat) alive, and Hei was referring to kill her back in episode 3. Too bad he doesn't have any balls to do it.
- The plan failed; Hei chose the wrong truck as planned by Misaki and got attacked by (what's his name again?). He jumps on top of a car that passed by to escape.
- Suou trying to kill Yin in a container, Hei comes the moment she shoot and tell her to stop.
- Norio's mom followed Suou and try to kill her. Suou summons magical rifle and shoot her but missed. Yin appears and killed her, with Norio observing and misunderstanding it as Suou's doing.
- Hei's cooking, use his last bottle of alcohol for it and telling Suou to stop shooting as it doesn't fit her. Suou tell Hei she won't shoot if he quits alcohol, Hei tell her he only go out to buy vegetables.
- Norio shuts in his room griefing his mother's death; his dad tell him "Michiru already prepared for that the moment she becomes a contractor." Norio don't want to accept that.
- Suou notices observer Yin trying to get close to Hei, although he can't see. Suou try to kick the air at where observer Yin left out of jealously?
- Next episode: Suou in school uniform.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-12, 14:19
I'm not going to use spoilers here in a single-episode thread, so here goes....



Hei couldn't see Yin, but Suou could. After Yin's ghostly form disappeared, Suou didn't tell Hei she'd seen it, and kicked the telephone pole she seemed to emerge from. Is Suou developing feelings for Hei? Earlier, after pondering the meaning of love, and Norio's feelings for her, the next image in Suou's mind was Hei: she thought of him stopping her from shooting at Yin's container, and also of the fact that he used her name (Suou) for the first time (I think).

Yin is being transported in the sub, in water. And you could see her ghostly form swimming along beside the sub, lol.

Norio's mom lassoed Suou with a tentacle of water, and demanded that she come along. Suou refused and summoned her gun, but Yin appeared and put Noriomom into a whirling globe of water that eventually killed her, right before her son's eyes -- and Norio thought Suou had done it. New contractor-like ability for Yin. To turn a contractor's ability against them? Or to manipulate water, the element she sees through?

I didn't find Norio's seiyuu, Nomura Katsuhito (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=48265), very good in this episode. Couldn't feel the emotion he was simulating.

Best line for me was when Hei was cooking and poured the last of his sake into the pan to cook with Suou said: "No more sake?" Hei responded: "Yeah." (meaning "yes, no more sake.") Great intonation from his seiyuu, Kiuchi Hidenobu (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=5658), giving the clear impression -- later seemingly confirmed -- that he planned not to drink any more.

Nice summary form sirn. Does Hei wanting Suou not to shoot any more mean that she may begin to use her powers in another way? Or that they may flow back to Hei?

Zwei
2009-11-12, 14:20
- Shinji103 was right; Yin was still (somewhat) alive, and Hei was referring to kill her back in episode 3. Too bad he doesn't have any balls to do it.
- The plan failed; Hei chose the wrong truck as planned by Misaki and got attacked by (what's his name again?). He jumps on top of a car that passed by to escape.
- Suou trying to kill Yin in a container, Hei comes the moment she shoot and tell her to stop.
- Norio's mom followed Suou and try to kill her. Suou summons magical rifle and shoot her but missed. Yin appears and killed her, with Norio observing and misunderstanding it as Suou's doing.
- Hei's cooking, use his last bottle of alcohol for it and telling Suou to stop shooting as it doesn't fit her. Suou tell Hei she won't shoot if he quits alcohol, Hei tell her he only go out to buy vegetables.
- Norio shuts in his room griefing his mother's death; his dad tell him "Michiru already prepared for that the moment she becomes a contractor." Norio don't want to accept that.
- Suou notices observer Yin trying to get close to Hei, although he can't see. Suou try to kick the air at where observer Yin left out of jealously?
- Next episode: Suou in school uniform.

My fears are coming true, Norio is becoming somewhat of a recurring character, though I don't see a good ending for him and most likely he will get killed by Suou.

Suou is jealous of Yin! Or is she? :heh: But I saw that coming miles away.

Hoping to watch this episode soon.

nubby
2009-11-12, 14:27
Man, all these freakin people who want Hei to pair up with Yin or Suou..... they're way too young for him. His perfect match is Misaki!

Zwei
2009-11-12, 14:30
Man, all these freakin people who want Hei to pair up with Yin or Suou..... they're way too young for him. His perfect match is Misaki!

We still don't really know how old is Yin unless I missed something, but I agree--Misaki is the perfect match for him. :heh:

Aryu
2009-11-12, 14:33
I knew it. That they will put in the BOX. Yin probably evolved in something new inside gates, at least her observer apparition is. It could be all those dead bodies in memory scene was her work, maybe that's why Hei wants to kill her.
@nubby
I think it was ep 12 where Yin helped Hei escape from Pandora, Hei definitely saw her observer.
And most important Hei is cooking again and now he need only to get his mask and cloak.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-12, 14:45
Man, all these freakin people who want Hei to pair up with Yin or Suou..... they're way too young for him. His perfect match is Misaki!I'm not saying what I want, just what I see. I agree about Misaki being a good choice, but I don't think he has any feelings of that kind for her, whereas he does have strong feelings for Yin -- at least as a sister, if not as more.

We'll see how things evolve. I think Kyouko told Misaki in this episode that she shouldn't think of them as her friends. It seems likely that Misaki and Hei may end up as a team, fighting everyone from the government to Madame Oreille, so feelings may start then.

The fact that Hei stopped Suou from shooting at Yin's container means to me that he does not want to kill Yin. And his tense conversation with Madame Oreille seems to indicate it may be her he wants to kill. Still not sure about "ano onna," lol.

I think Hei didn't see Yin this time because he has lost his contractor abilities.

Zwei
2009-11-12, 14:57
The fact that Hei stopped Suou from shooting at Yin's container means to me that he does not want to kill Yin. And his tense conversation with Madame Oreille seems to indicate it may be her he wants to kill. Still not sure about "ano onna," lol.

I think Hei didn't see Yin this time because he has lost his contractor abilities.

He probably either wants to kill her himself or at least demands a valid explanation to why she left him before killing her.

And so do we. :heh:

Freeter
2009-11-12, 15:09
I expect a ton of 'Yin in a box' pics on pixiv soon :heh:

Xacual
2009-11-12, 16:11
I thought Yin was like 17 in the first season? I remember reading that somewhere on this forum. She'd be 5 years younger then Hei then?

qwertyman
2009-11-12, 16:50
I'm shocked. I'm starting to like Suou. That kick to the pole was the highlight of the ep for me.

Strange
2009-11-12, 16:57
I think Yin is 17, 18, and now, probably close to 20.

Hei/Suou is kinda wrong, though. Way too young. Misaki wouldn't be a bad choice, I suppose, but Hei has no feelings whatsoever for her unless the plot shifts and makes them buddies or something.

Yin in a box, like most people thought. Good to know, although it does look a bit ridiculous. I don't think she comes out of that box alive, though.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-12, 18:47
I just saw a Chinese sub and a couple more things became clear: first, Shinji103 is right and the one Hei thinks he wants to kill is Yin. That came out in his conversation with Madame Oreille, who said: "So you still say you want to kill that doll yourself?" And also when Suou asked Petya/Mao about Yin and was told she was a former friend who now had a "complicated history" with Hei.

But in addition, Hei is upset that Oreille knew everything and didn't tell him, and says he can't trust her and won't work with her again. That's when she says she feels the same since he has too much emotion, and still wants to kill the doll.

Second, the first "extra story" episode, which will be included in DVD2, is going to have a preview stream on the official site (http://www.d-black.net/index.html) on Saturday at 2:25 AM (not sure if that means Friday night or Saturday night, lol; probably Friday). The four special episodes apparently tell the story of what happened between the two series, especially about an attack on Hei and Yin.

By the way, pretty amazing work from the Chinese fansub group Zhuzhu ("Piggy"), getting a sub out about 3.5 hours after the broadcast ended. And it seemed reasonable work, as far as I could check.

EDIT: I just posted in the image thread (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=2763923#post2763923) some of what I think are screencaps from the four new episodes about Hei and Yin. Makes them seen fairly intimate, although Yin still has a doll's distance in her eyes.

Amirali
2009-11-12, 19:58
Second, the first "extra story" episode, which will be included in DVD2, is going to have a preview stream on the official site on Saturday at 2:25 AM

I have the CM . PM or VM me for link

Edit: Uploaded to Youtube. Link in image thread, since I saw no place else to post it

Vanehei
2009-11-12, 20:35
Anyone notice that there is not Hei in the preview?, that and Suou in school uniform makes me think that maybe this image is about to come
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/9218/largeanimepaperscansdara.th.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/i/largeanimepaperscansdara.jpg/)

dear4life
2009-11-12, 20:47
Anyone notice that there is not Hei in the preview?, that and Suou in school uniforme makes me think that maybe this image is about to come


I was only thinking that Hei was going to at least shave, but that would be even better. It was great to see him cooking again.


I love how Mao was sitting like a human in that squirrel body of his. I was cracking up.

orion
2009-11-12, 21:39
I think Yin is 17, 18, and now, probably close to 20.

Hei/Suou is kinda wrong, though. Way too young. Misaki wouldn't be a bad choice, I suppose, but Hei has no feelings whatsoever for her unless the plot shifts and makes them buddies or something.

Yin in a box, like most people thought. Good to know, although it does look a bit ridiculous. I don't think she comes out of that box alive, though.

Love the one you're with. Of course Suou is going to be jealous. She is a girl after all.

It'll get worse when Hei shaves I bet.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-12, 21:41
...I love how Mao was sitting like a human in that squirrel body of his. I was cracking up.Me, too:

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/4214/petyasit.jpg (http://img188.imageshack.us/my.php?image=petyasit.jpg)

Shinji103
2009-11-12, 21:43
CALLED IT. :D I so knew Yin would be in that box. I'll certainly admit that I fanboyed quite a bit as they just kept saying hint after hint after hint throughout the episode that it was Yin in the box. :heh: So it looks like Yin really could be being manipulated into doing something and Hei is out to stop her from being manipulated the only way he can think of, or she already did something that he can't forgive her for. Personally, I believe it's the former; if so, she apparently isn't being completely manipulated. And I'd say HeixYin is definitely a possibility now. Bones already threw up a couple flags, and she only came back (sort of) just this episode. Plus, when you put that together with screenshots of the DtB 2 DVD/Blu-Ray extras, posted in the Yin character thread......

But..........did they just raise a couple SuouxHei flags on us??!! :twitch: When Suou was thinking about what it's like to love someone, she thought about how Hei had said her name for the first time this episode. Then she kicked the water/snow where Yin's observer spirit had appeared and looked like was hugging Hei. And on a smaller level, she makes a deal with Hei that she won't shoot anymore if he doesn't drink............

Huh.

Anyway, nice to know that Bones didn't embarass me by retconning Hei's statement in the episode 3 epilogue though. :heh: Now we just need to find out what happened in the first place....

Next episode shows Suou in what looks like a school girl's uniform? What the heck is going on there? :hmm:


I love how Mao was sitting like a human in that squirrel body of his. I was cracking up.Me, too:

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/4214/petyasit.jpg (http://img188.imageshack.us/my.php?image=petyasit.jpg)Count me in on that. :D

serenade_beta
2009-11-12, 22:10
Haaa~h? Well, that was a disappointment... The whole Norio thing finished up too forcibly... We get his mother just... instantly killed by one of those spirit things that shouldn't be able to something like that. And Norio somehow manages to misunderstand that Suou did that. When obviously, her ability is to materialize a gun and use it.
Too forced...
The very last scene wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't so badly done...

And do we need the reused magical girl transformation animation everytime?

And Suou's impression of Hei changed too fast. So all of a sudden, she's now jealous?
And what is with the outfit change? Black tights for the win, right, Staff?!

Shinji103
2009-11-12, 22:18
Haaa~h? Well, that was a disappointment... The whole Norio thing finished up too forcibly... We get his mother just... instantly killed by one of those spirit things that shouldn't be able to something like that. And Norio somehow manages to misunderstand that Suou did that. When obviously, her ability is to materialize a gun and use it.
Too forced...
The very last scene wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't so badly done...Well here, I'd have to point out that a) for all we know right now, this could be exactly what Yin is being manipulated to do; kill Contractors. (they made a portable version of the killer thingy from S1, so why not use a doll to make a Contractor killer maybe?) Besides, I'm pretty sure Bones is smart enough to realize that we realize that observer spirits normally can't do that, so there's obviously something going on that we don't know about.
And b) for all Norio knows, it could have been Suou; it's not like he's an expert on Contractors or a guy watching the DtB anime like us.

And do we need the reused magical girl transformation animation everytime?This I definitely agree with, of course. Plus, stock animation for the lose. :heh:

And Suou's impression of Hei changed too fast. So all of a sudden, she's now jealous?And this too, although I can somehow get behind it (somewhat) at the same time.

Zwei
2009-11-12, 22:26
I really saw it coming since the first episode about Suou's feelings towards Hei. It could have been that of master-apprentice at first, but come on, Hei doesn't look so bad and she's only 13.

I'm looking forward to when he shaves off and she starts blushing when looking at him. :heh:

forgottendiary
2009-11-12, 23:35
Spoilers from a reliable source...



It was YIN in the box


Edit:


SPOILERS
IT WAS YIN IN THE BOX
YIN KILLED WATER CONTRACTOR it seems she can control water or something... well who knows YIN WAS PROBABLY TURNED INTO A MODIFIED DOLL FOR COMBAT
AND HEI CANNOT SEE HER
HEI COOKING AGAIN... AND SUOH MAKING HIM PROMISE NOT MORE SHOTS NO MORE ALCOHOL


OK PEOPLE


SPOILER PICS
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043497371.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258043701312.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044685498.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044695958.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b266/dlily/1258044892132.jpg
[/QUOTE]

GAAAHHH! Now I can't wait to go home and watch!!! T_T Someone please kidnap me from the office and send me home >.<

jonli
2009-11-13, 00:09
The animation quality took a dive this episode. It wasn't too bad but it was noticeable seeing as how awesome the last few episodes were.

Great to see Hei changing, seems like we'll get shaven and good looking Hei back really soon.

Surprised at Suou's reaction, jealousy? Pimp Hei is pimp.

Strange
2009-11-13, 00:15
Speaking of pimp Hei, I need to dig up that pic posted in the Image thread of Suou giving Hei a good shave. :heh: It's going to happen almost exactly like it did in the comic.

The wait for English subs is killing me. I think I might need to look for Korean subs or something, since that's something I can deal with.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-13, 00:53
@serenade_beta: 1. We're not sure Norio is actually finished, but in any case, his role was to awaken Suou to thought about romance. And he wasn't the most fascinating character, anyway, so I'm not upset, myself. His seiyuu really didn't impress me, I must say.
2. Yin as killer is a surprise, but not a shock: there's the dream scene with Yin among all those bodies, and also the fact that Izanami is an anti-contractor weapon.
3. Norio may well not know that contractors only have one ability -- and it is likely that Suou in fact may have more than one, if she imbibed Hei's (i.e., his sister's) powers.
4. Which last scene was badly done? If you mean Norio and Lebanon, I agree wholeheartedly. If you mean Suou, Hei and Yin-ghost, I disagree.
5. Personally, I have nothing whatsoever against recycling footage, if it's effective. And in this case, I think the repetition is now actually increasing the effectiveness, since it feels more and more like a semi-involuntary thing that overcomes her like a seizure, as we see it for the umpteenth time. But I didn't hate it in the first place, anyway, unlike most people. The break it caused in the fight was a bit odd, though.
6. Suou's impression of Hei was already changing at the beginning of the last episode, to my eye. And through both episodes she has been trying to figure out what "love" is, so we have been forewarned. Not that we weren't forewarned from the start by the final image in the ED. For now, I think of it as like a schoolgirl crushing her teacher. Stockholm Syndrome might also be involved, lol. The old hate-is-close-to-love thing.


By the way, for anyone who may be interested, this ep was another written by Okada Mari (true tears). Storyboards by Haraguchi Hiroshi (who directed six eps of Eureka7). The episode director was Sugaya Yuriko (who directed one ep of Naruto Shippuuden, but nothing else I can see). Animation supervision/direction by Watanabe Ruriko (a key animator who animation-directed eps of JyuOhSei and Minamike3) and Matsuoka Kenji (a key animator). So the animation leaders don't seem that experienced as leaders, for one thing. (cf. jonli's post.)

Bombo
2009-11-13, 01:06
I just watched the episode...I like the last scene when suou kicked the wall :D

*I feel hei won't kill Yin maybe will protect her and that increase what i'm thinking after hei stop suou shooting the box

Haladflire65
2009-11-13, 01:12
I really liked this episode... There were some good comedy moments, and I'm starting to warm up to Suou. And finally, Yin! I'm really excited for more.

I also can't wait 'till Hei shaves... I'm still waiting...

Shinji103
2009-11-13, 02:53
I just watched the episode...I like the last scene when suou kicked the wall :DWell just for accuracy, Suou was kicking the water/snow that Yin's observer spirit had appeared from. :p

Freeter
2009-11-13, 03:24
LOL, when did Suou suddenly become tsundere? Maybe she really is a closet masochist :heh:

Someone please shoot Norio already. He's starting to become the anime version of Jar Jar Binks. He'd better play some significant role for all this screentime he's getting.

At least Yin returns to keep things interesting, even if it's her spirit doing most of the action. Looks like Hei still cares for her, otherwise he would've let Suou get a clean shot off. That box is probably going to end up in Shion's hands somehow, heck I wouldn't be surprised if he was the one manipulating her.

Next episode shows Suou in what looks like a school girl's uniform? What the heck is going on there?

She's either infiltrating a school, or trying to please her sugar daddy :heh:

Strange
2009-11-13, 03:34
Someone please shoot Norio already. He's starting to become the anime version of Jar Jar Binks. He'd better play some significant role for all this screentime he's getting.

Hopefully, all this screentime is to build up for the tragic death scene. Instead of the awful alternative of him suddenly developing contractor powers and tagging along as part of the gang. :heh:

orion
2009-11-13, 03:48
She's either infiltrating a school, or trying to please her sugar daddy :heh:

They prob need another alias to cool down in. Suou fanboys get their school uniform. Hei fangirls finally get Hei shaved and alcohol free. Hobo Hei becomes Pimp Hei. :heh:



And Suou's impression of Hei changed too fast. So all of a sudden, she's now jealous?
And what is with the outfit change? Black tights for the win, right, Staff?!

She's a 13 yo girl. Whenever someone that age announces aloud that they hate you, it's either they really mean it or most likely they hate a certain aspect that they want you to change. I was betting that it was the change your ways part as Hei has saved her life numerous times and wasn't that mean without a reason. (She crossed that thin line.) If she really wanted him dead, she could have found some way to kill him without using her rifle (poison).

Suou prob sees herself as a new partner. It's only natural the the new partner feels that the old partner should stay away.

Suou's strength is shooting objects not living things. So to use her to her maximum abilities, it's better for her to hit targets that aren't alive. Besides she needs to rely on other ways to defend herself and not the rifle. A well placed knife could have gotten her out of that situation probably.

willyvereb
2009-11-13, 04:41
Well I doubt DtB has a happy ending. Perhaps we may see a confession from Hei in the end of the series, but I doubt Yin and Hei ends up happily.
And man, Misaki is sure somehow a formiable enemy of Hei...leading him by the nose like that. If they didn't want to catch him alive he might've died. Though I somehow find it strange he didn't have gun with him. Then the contractor guy might've been the one in trouble:p

And Noriyuki or whatever is out? Well, I guess so.

Next Episode: Are they going to be in Tokyo? I sure hope so. It takes half season for them to get there...

orion
2009-11-13, 04:46
Next Episode: Are they going to be in Tokyo? I sure hope so. It takes half season for them to get there...

Nah, I don't care if they take long to get to Tokyo as long as we have Season 1 Hei back when we get there. :heh:

Well I doubt DtB has a happy ending. Perhaps we may see a confession from Hei in the end of the series, but I doubt Yin and Hei ends up happily.


Out with the old partner (Yin), in with the new partners (Suou and July). July even makes tea.

If Yin is called Izanami then there is a possibility that she's not "alive" anymore like her namesake. Yin's observer spirits = Shikome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yomotsu-shikome)

LightningZERO
2009-11-13, 06:05
Nice. The plot thickens and we find out Yin's current situation, apparently she ha been captured and turned into anti-contractor weapon Izanami. More mysteries about Section No. 3 (I think it's part of the syndicate), Madam Oreille's goal.

Suou's thought and her strange feelings for Hei are fascinating. She slowly learns about love and I wonder if her faint feelings (for now) will result in anything. Hei is the pimp!

July taking the bottle everywhere and makes tea too! :D

Mao is as awesome as ever!

I hope this is the last time we are going to hear from Norio. He's really annoying.

Now that the series is at its half point, the remaining half is gonna get better!

arkxkra
2009-11-13, 10:32
Since when Yin (doll) has such a ability to kill, really want to know what happen back then.
So Yin is miss Hei alot, but too bad now Hei can't see her. The last kick by the Suou is a highlight, because of jealous? interesting.

last thing, I wonder Hei has any chance to gain back the contractor ability....

Shinji103
2009-11-13, 10:41
last thing, I wonder Hei has any chance to gain back the contractor ability....About that, I think it's very likely that he can get his powers back. Note how Madame Oreile pointed out a small, red star next to another one in the sky in episode 5; the OP and ED also both show two stars next to each other in the night sky. (well, in the OP and ED it's two shooting stars next to each other) I'm betting the small red star is connected to Suou in some way, and the one next to it is connected to Hei somehow and how his losing his powers due to that device in episode 2/3 was apparently connected to Suou's awakening as a Contractor with the (assumed) meteor fragment.

V4sH
2009-11-13, 11:03
About that, I think it's very likely that he can get his powers back. Note how Madame Oreile pointed out a small, red star next to another one in the sky in episode 5; the OP and ED also both show two stars next to each other in the night sky. (well, in the OP and ED it's two shooting stars next to each other) I'm betting the small red star is connected to Suou in some way, and the one next to it is connected to Hei somehow and how his losing his powers due to that device in episode 2/3 was apparently connected to Suou's awakening as a Contractor with the (assumed) meteor fragment.

Im thinking that the two stars represent suou and shion, as they are both contractors, and the whole gemini twins thing is kind of astrological too.

Shinji103
2009-11-13, 11:08
Im thinking that the two stars represent suou and shion, as they are both contractors, and the whole gemini twins thing is kind of astrological too.Hmmmm, that's possible too, but then why is only the red one small and red, while the other one is normal? Plus, the two stars didn't appear (or at least, weren't pointed out) until after Hei lost his powers.

Nosauz
2009-11-13, 11:58
I really don't understand why hei can't be bad ass? If you think about his character, if you are familiar with mathew reilly novels, Scarecrow is somewhat like hei, insanely skilled, and overall this change in his demeanor is just frustrating. Also maho shoujo in my dtb... gah am I the only one who feels like this is ridiculous.

Strange
2009-11-13, 12:11
I really don't understand why hei can't be bad ass? If you think about his character, if you are familiar with mathew reilly novels, Scarecrow is somewhat like hei, insanely skilled, and overall this change in his demeanor is just frustrating. Also maho shoujo in my dtb... gah am I the only one who feels like this is ridiculous.

I find the magical girl transformation sequence ridiculous too, but it's like five seconds out of the anime. :heh:

I actually like this drunken, bum Hobo Hei. I think he'll go back to his pimp Chinese Batman self soon, but until then, humble Hei cooking for half-Russian lasses is just fine.

Nosauz
2009-11-13, 12:28
I find the magical girl transformation sequence ridiculous too, but it's like five seconds out of the anime. :heh:



BUT it completely ruins the mood, she majo shoujo's a gun out of her chest and thats just RIDICULOUS!!!! I don't know what else to say, plus I would like to see more yin but no all we get is emo hei. I would even settle for misaki's co worker from season 1, the otaku cop in the ova, shes so much of better character that misaki..... stupid megami fetish supplicants.

Zwei
2009-11-13, 12:35
BUT it completely ruins the mood, she majo shoujo's a gun out of her chest and thats just RIDICULOUS!!!! I don't know what else to say, plus I would like to see more yin but no all we get is emo hei. I would even settle for misaki's co worker from season 1, the otaku cop in the ova, shes so much of better character that misaki..... stupid megami fetish supplicants.

I got a solution.

When the transformation sequence is happening...

Close your eyes. There. :heh:

Seriously though, I respect the fact you like Yin but comparing Misaki with her otaku co-worker, I won't accept that; she deserves so much better. I also don't want to bring up the fact that Misaki's body is much more voluptuous than Yin's body will ever be, but if I did bring it up, Yin fans would overwhelm me. :heh:

She's even saving her virginity for Hei!

Have to say though, I'll be content with whoever Hei ends up with; if he ends up with someone. I'm not really watching this for the romance.

Shinji103
2009-11-13, 12:48
I also don't want to bring up the fact that Misaki's body is much more voluptuous than Yin's body will ever be, but if I did bring it up, Yin fans would overwhelm me. :heh:Why does that even matter in the first place? :heh: :p

Zwei
2009-11-13, 12:52
Why does that even matter in the first place? :heh: :p

Since he obviously seemed like a Yin fan...just to get back at him a little. :heh:

Nosauz
2009-11-13, 12:53
I feel kirihara's character is only there because she wears glasses, kinda like bayonetta, and this is somewhat confirmed by the mahou shojo seen where it's clearly pandering to sub groups of otaku. I don't mind maho shoujo hell I love nanoha, and I reallly like cardcaptor sakura but maho shoujo just doesn't fit into dtb, it's just this clash that doesn't seem to fit. And my point about yin was she was a major character in the previous season and we get are some booze induced flash backs that give no reason or mention to why she's not there.

@zwei, no i'm not a yin fan
i actually prefer amber or the otaku girl who was featured in the ova

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-13, 13:57
...maho shoujo in my dtb... gah am I the only one who feels like this is ridiculous.Almost everyone else feels that way -- except me. I try to feel it from Suou's point of view, not an outsider's. I'm not a fan of mahou shoujo at all, but this works okay for me here, to give the feeling that Suou gets of being taken over by this process of the gun emerging from the pendant. I know it's there for fanservice, but since when is fanservice a sin in Japanese media, anyway?

Having just rewatched season one, I actually find that season two feels a bit more serious than season one. That's partly because Hanazawa Kana's Suou is adding human depth. But the ridiculous mad scientist was a total drag that made that first series seem like Scooby Doo or something when he was around. And the bumbling detective was at least as out of place as the mahou shoujo scene, and as annoying as Norio.

As for Hei shaving and becoming the old Hei, I'm sure it will happen, but I don't really care. He is a fascinating character going through changes, plunged into the depths by the betrayal of his dearest person, and now about to be rescued from them by a child. I think he is gaining respect and a sort of parental feeling for Suou. Suou is gaining a crush on him, for perfectly good reasons.

It's clear that Misaki is not really Hei's enemy. It's her job to find him, and she's doing well, but as the dark woman contractor said, Misaki also has feelings for Hei. She wants to find him in order to get closer to him. Misaki and Hei are the logical couple here, considering that Suou is young and Yin is festooned with death flags. They are both quite wounded people, who could heal each other's wounds. But I still can't quite picture it, lol. A happy ending? Naaah.

By the way, for reference, here is more of the story of Izanami and Izanagi, from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izanami-no-Mikoto). I think there are plenty of parallels to work with:Izanagi-no-Mikoto lamented the death of Izanami-no-Mikoto and undertook a journey to Yomi ("the shadowy land of the dead"). Quickly, he searched for Izanami-no-Mikoto and found her. At first, Izanagi-no-Mikoto could not see her at all for the shadows hid her appearance well. Nevertheless, he asked her to return with him. Izanami-no-Mikoto spat out at him, informing Izanagi-no-Mikoto that he was too late. She had already eaten the food of the underworld and was now one with the land of the dead. She could no longer return to the living.

Izanagi-no-Mikoto was shocked at this news but he refused to give in to her wishes of being left to the dark embrace of Yomi. While Izanami-no-Mikoto was sleeping, he took the comb that bound his long hair and set it alight as a torch. Under the sudden burst of light, he saw the horrid form of the once beautiful and graceful Izanami-no-Mikoto. She was now a rotting form of flesh with maggots and foul creatures running over her ravaged body.

Crying out loud, Izanagi-no-Mikoto could no longer control his fear and started to run, intending to return to the living and abandon his death-ridden wife. Izanami-no-Mikoto woke up shrieking and indignant and chased after him. Wild shikome (foul women) also hunted for the frightened Izanagi-no-Mikoto, instructed by Izanami-no-Mikoto to bring him back.

[He finally did escape.]

Strange
2009-11-13, 14:38
Seriously though, I respect the fact you like Yin but comparing Misaki with her otaku co-worker, I won't accept that; she deserves so much better. I also don't want to bring up the fact that Misaki's body is much more voluptuous than Yin's body will ever be, but if I did bring it up, Yin fans would overwhelm me. :heh:



I like Misaki as a character, but her crush on Hei always seemed a bit ridiculous.

You're right though, she has a fabulous body, at least in the manga.

willyvereb
2009-11-13, 14:42
@Nosauz: Meganko fetish? How come? If she's anything she's more of the Class President type...especially in ep 9-10's flashbacks. She isn't one-dimensional. Hard-headed, serious, stern but also reckless, self-sufficing and even a bit of naive. On the top of it she's unexperienced in love and not used to be seen as a woman.
And also a badass normal who stands her ground relatively well in the crazy world of contractors.
Her relationship with Hei and Li-kun was interesting especially because of the "cat vs. mouse" tension. The cat(Misaki) wants to catch the mouse(Bk-201) who actually is right in front of her.
Compared to that Yin lacks character altogether. Her only part of personality is her affection to Hei and being dependant on him(at least in season 1). Half of the second season she even lacked that and was a simple support, like July and every other Doll. That's why I suspect the last two episodes and the gothic lolita otakuism for the cause of her fanbase.
If anything Yin is more of the otaku-favourite type. I doubt anyone would like her if she for example would be a musclebound guy...not as if Misaki wouldn't profit from her looks...

@Kaoru Chujo: When Hei lost his contractor powers I hoped for a conclusion like that. But I have to say it's not really possible. Hei seemingly had few feelings for her if anything, so Misaki hardly has a chance. But I sure hope they're going to talk a bit sometime mid-series. It can be a perfect conclusion for their relationship.

For Yin...well, she:
-dies and Hei has one more girl to mourn for. Probably with her saving his life and the world like Amber did.
-Hei saves her and they end up pretty much like their relationship was in the first season.
-Surprise! romantic confession,smooch else...while perhaps Yin is saved by him.

Now, the first option seems to be possible, though the second has quite a chance too. But with all that Yin-centered DVD extras I have a really bad feeling...

Zwei
2009-11-13, 15:06
I like Misaki as a character, but her crush on Hei always seemed a bit ridiculous.

I wouldn't really call it a crush since she still has feelings for him even after two years, so it's more like she's really in love with him.

EadTaes
2009-11-13, 15:28
I wouldn't really call it a crush since she still has feelings for him even after two years, so it's more like she's really in love with him.

Misaki see's Hei as someone like her. A defender of justice, someone who has high moral values and makes desions bases on what is bet for all.

This comes form the fact that she knows that Hei did not kill anyone in season 1 otehr then contractors that killed inocent people. To her Hei, the GrimReaper is a sort of hero. That is were her feelings for him come from.

willyvereb
2009-11-13, 15:41
And perhaps the kind Li-kun she had exceptional time with. I bet Li-kun was the first male she had even a bit of fun with.

Aqua Knight
2009-11-13, 15:42
Good episodem but the scene when that braided-hair guy was crying over his mom with his dad was very condradicting. What shoulf you feel when you see it? Laughing or sympathize? Really confused about this one.

willyvereb
2009-11-13, 15:43
I felt myself VERY sympatethic while I am laughting...I swear!:)

ZGMF-X10A
2009-11-13, 16:12
Sou didn't go with that water contactor and fought back against her even though she remembered the rough times with Hei, shows that there is something making her want to stay with Hei instead of going with someone else. I liked the very end when Sou saw Yin's water soul thing and than she kicked the pole. That was really kawaii of Sou. great episode

orangejuicetang
2009-11-13, 16:18
I thought this was a pretty good episode. Although the bit with the car driving by just than and Hei hitching a ride was kinda hilarious.

At first, the mahou shoujo transformations annoyed me. This time, however, I found it funny just because of how out of place it was. Seriously, they need to quit that.

I guess I'm the only one who found the Suou kicking telephone pole thing kinda random.

alu546
2009-11-13, 16:20
So when I saw that scene, it was moving, it also said to me: There is a future fat guy in there.

So it was a little bit of laughing.

Im surprised Yin is back so fast. Didnt they kill her off in episode 2 or 3? I dunno, but it seems they are using her for future doomsday scenarios for contractors, so eh.

The best part of the episode this week had to be Suou looking genuinely happy for once. It would seem they have warmed up a little bit. I wish someone would freeze her face after Hei said hed buy vegatables instead of booze, id use it as an avatar.

Kunagisa
2009-11-13, 16:24
I just saw a Chinese sub and a couple more things became clear: first, Shinji103 is right and the one Hei thinks he wants to kill is Yin. That came out in his conversation with Madame Oreille, who said: "So you still say you want to kill that doll yourself?" And also when Suou asked Petya/Mao about Yin and was told she was a former friend who now had a "complicated history" with Hei.

But in addition, Hei is upset that Oreille knew everything and didn't tell him, and says he can't trust her and won't work with her again. That's when she says she feels the same since he has too much emotion, and still wants to kill the doll.

Second, the first "extra story" episode, which will be included in DVD2, is going to have a preview stream on the official site (http://www.d-black.net/index.html) on Saturday at 2:25 AM (not sure if that means Friday night or Saturday night, lol; probably Friday). The four special episodes apparently tell the story of what happened between the two series, especially about an attack on Hei and Yin.

By the way, pretty amazing work from the Chinese fansub group Zhuzhu ("Piggy"), getting a sub out about 3.5 hours after the broadcast ended. And it seemed reasonable work, as far as I could check.

EDIT: I just posted in the image thread (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=2763923#post2763923) some of what I think are screencaps from the four new episodes about Hei and Yin. Makes them seen fairly intimate, although Yin still has a doll's distance in her eyes.

Watched the same thing but didn't get around to post it, but the Eng sub's out now.

There's so much Suou and Hei development this episode, though I have no idea where the plot comes from. I can understand about Suou being attached to Hei, but I don't get how Hei suddenly just went from a drunkard back to normal just because he got some information on Yin.

Also, what Yin did at the end was pretty sad, since Hei lost his contractor status (which is now confirmed by that woman in the sub) he can't see observational ghost.

I find myself having conflicted feelings about Suou kicking the telephone pole, I don't want my two favorite female cast fighting each other =(.

I don't know if anyone mentioned it, it seems the anti-contractor weapon uses the contractor's own power against them (Hei with the electricity, and that mother with her water, so it is not because Yin's catalyst is water, but because water is the contracting ability, that the mother died from water). This means the anti-contractor weapon is designed to kill specifically instead of just making them lose their power.

I also find it intriguing if Yin deliberately kill the mother to protect Suou, or if someone's controlling Yin to kill the mother. I somehow don't think Yin will go that far, and if someone was controlling Yin, then it fits well with the Syndicate wanting to kill all the contractors (and made another weapon for that purpose). Like someone else mentioned, I wouldnt' be surprised Section 3's another Syndicate section. However, the mother should've still had her use, I don't know why would the Syndicate kill her off. I'm quite confused with her death now.

Either way, love the episode, probably best one so far (any episode with Yin auto gets + 100 bonus points). Love the insert song too.

-Sho-
2009-11-13, 17:09
Excellent episode !

Obviously they have to show Yin soon , it was expected in the previous episode and just they are 12 episodes so , 6 episodes left :(

The soundtrack is great !
Mao is awesome XD
July is cute :)
More Hei x Suou development ^^ Suou who kick the pole , it was hilarious .

Wonder what happened to Norio's father to turn into a pedo .
Michiru's remuneration was to make cake lol? well RIP .

Look forward to the next !

Chidori<3
2009-11-13, 17:18
Either way, love the episode, probably best one so far (any episode with Yin auto gets + 100 bonus points). Love the insert song too.

Exactly... xP


I also find it intriguing if Yin deliberately kill the mother to protect Suou, or if someone's controlling Yin to kill the mother. I somehow don't think Yin will go that far, and if someone was controlling Yin, then it fits well with the Syndicate wanting to kill all the contractors (and made another weapon for that purpose). Like someone else mentioned, I wouldnt' be surprised Section 3's another Syndicate section. However, the mother should've still had her use, I don't know why would the Syndicate kill her off. I'm quite confused with her death now.


I'm pretty sure that Yin killed Norio's mother b/c she wanted to protect Suou... or... Yin could have other reasons to do that... Anyway, I think, that Yin did that, because she WANTED to do that, no one was controlling her, and that's why, she didn't kill Hei in ep 2 (you know, that weapon, I think, it was somehow connected to Yin)...
I mean something happened, when they were trying to kill Hei in that ep -
Hei didn't die, he just have lost his powers, so... maybe... Yin saved him somehow? They couldn't kill him b/c Yin didn't want to do that?
So my point is, that they can't control Yin in 100%
She is anti-contractor weapon, but she have got her own will...

Or something like that... xP

Sorry for my bad English...:upset:

anomono
2009-11-13, 17:39
qI thought this was a I guess I'm the only one who found the Suou kicking telephone pole thing kinda random.
Others seem to think that it was motivated by jealousy, but I doubt that Suou would do something like that over jealousy alone.

It was probably (at least in part) anger. Yin mercilessly killed someone right before her, and however she tries to act, it is clear that she still cares about that sort of thing. Not only that, she witnessed the aftermath with Norio.


Aside from that, was anyone else disappointed by Hei's fight? Maybe if he had kicked that guy in the face instead, it would have been more effective. Also, that mirror should have broken off!

JackRydden224
2009-11-13, 17:57
Very good episode.

The Norio family situation shows that could happen when there is a contract in the family or when you know one. Because the situation contractors are put into they could die any second; I just hope this isn't foreshadowing the fate of Hei or Suou.

I do find something interesting though, the fact that Suou addresses herself using "boku" which is usually what what boys at that age start to use. I find it interesting because just two episodes ago she said she's a woman and now she wonders what it is to like someone. On a related note, I wonder if Suou kicking the pole/Yin is a her way to declare her territory.

*I love how Suou gets different clothe. We get to see her in a uniform next week! Woot!

qwertyman
2009-11-13, 18:24
I have to wonder, why doesn't Hei have a knife?

He could've killed truckman so easily with just a plastic knife, or anything even remotely sharp. Truckman didn't even try to block Hei's kick; so I'd have to say it would've been feasible for Hei to have gouged out the dude's eyes a bit.

McMilk
2009-11-13, 18:24
This episode deserves 10/10 with the appearance of Yin itself :D

Just kidding. Great action as always... and it was kind of sad to see Norio's mom pass away so quickly, she could've stayed a bit longer to show off her water abilities. Though, I couldn't stop laughing when he and his father were crying :heh:. It was also nice to see more Hei and Suou development, and I agree with JackRydden224: she finally changes clothing!

But why doesn't it surprise me when we find out that Hei lost his contractor abilities and was unable to see Yin? I think I was kind of expecting something like this...

orangejuicetang
2009-11-13, 18:28
Actually, watching the scene where Suou kicks the pole again, the feeling I get is more that she's just acknowledging that Yin was there rather than any particular feelings of jealousy or anger.

Tyrone Biggums
2009-11-13, 18:29
GIVE HEI HIS POWERS BACK!!!

Maaan, anyone else missing him owning shit left right and center? It just isn't the same w/o BK-201 being true bad ass.

And looks like new girl doesn't like the Yin apparition...hmm...

Zwei
2009-11-13, 18:32
Actually, watching the scene where Suou kicks the pole again, the feeling I get is more that she's just acknowledging that Yin was there rather than any particular feelings of jealousy or anger.

It's more like a foreshadowing about future events, she may have not developed those kinds of feelings yet, but we've all seen it before; we all can see it coming again. :heh:

JackRydden224
2009-11-13, 18:44
Hei will definitely get his powers back because Suou isn't going to shoot anymore. I think it's a simple matter of somebody from that party has to do the hitting. Also, this is a show about contractors amongst other things so what's the point when none of the protagonists use their powers :heh:

I really do think that Suou is in the process of developing feelings for Hei but as she has clearly stated herself she really doesn't know what it is like. There is a clear stage in their relationship in this episode. Hei called Suou by her name which she appreciated, him cooking and taking advice from her and actually allowing her to go with him to shop.

KaneDragon
2009-11-13, 18:48
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/4473/snapshot20091113181939.th.jpg (http://img94.imageshack.us/i/snapshot20091113181939.jpg/)
We can't stop here, this is Batman country. :cool:

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/7711/snapshot20091113181955.th.jpg (http://img94.imageshack.us/i/snapshot20091113181955.jpg/)
Bwahaha, way to go, Mao. :heh:

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/4646/snapshot20091113183028.th.jpg (http://img94.imageshack.us/i/snapshot20091113183028.jpg/)
Don't drink anymore, Daddy. I'll be good, I promise! ;_;
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/3128/snapshot20091113183053.th.jpg (http://img94.imageshack.us/i/snapshot20091113183053.jpg/)
But did you have to leave your brother behind? Hang in there July! ;_;

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/5157/snapshot20091113183237.th.jpg (http://img39.imageshack.us/i/snapshot20091113183237.jpg/)
Take, eat; this is her body which is broken for you; do this in remembrance of her.

http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/4250/snapshot20091113183433.th.jpg (http://img39.imageshack.us/i/snapshot20091113183433.jpg/)
Whatever she meant by it, that it could be taken to be a fit of jealousy is cute. :)

Kunagisa
2009-11-13, 18:52
It's more like a foreshadowing about future events, she may have not developed those kinds of feelings yet, but we've all seen it before; we all can see it coming again. :heh:

Actually, re-watching it again. She doesn't even know what Yin looks like, how the hell does she know if that ghost want to hug Hei or want to attack him. Hell, does she even know what observational ghost is? And speaking of which, Yin's medium's water, why would kicking the telephone pole do anything and how did she come out in the first place (there are like super tiny amount of snow next to the pole that's it). Maybe she's just kicking the pole to make sure that thing doesn't bug Hei again or something.

tsukimoto
2009-11-13, 18:54
Hei without powers D: not cool. Not cool at all. But that doesn't matter because Yin finally appeared :D

izanami = yin, izanagi = suou/shion?

Noe
2009-11-13, 19:31
Good episode. I always thought Amber was Hei's 'woman' in the past.

KaneDragon
2009-11-13, 19:31
Good episode. I always thought Amber was Hei's 'woman' in the past.
Mao is clearly a Yin/Hei shipper, damn him.

Bordix
2009-11-13, 20:46
Hei is slowly reverting back to his old self, but he better not change the way he looks; His S1 look reminds me too much of the Onani master 0_o

They've finally show the whereabouts of Yin, and I bet Hei would go berserk when he finds out July saw her naked :heh:
oh and it looks like Suou is joining the war (the shipping war)

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/4214/petyasit.jpg


LOL. THIS.

Mao's antics are definitely the highlight of this episode for me XD

Haladflire65
2009-11-13, 20:48
Mao's hilarious as a squirrel, with that man's voice coming out of him. It's one of the reasons I'm watching S2 :heh:

Nanaya
2009-11-13, 20:55
Actually, re-watching it again. She doesn't even know what Yin looks like, how the hell does she know if that ghost want to hug Hei or want to attack him.
She knows what Yin is because they saw her earlier kill Norio's mom. Also they talked about more than 3 times throughout the episode with July confirming that it was Yin.
Hell, does she even know what observational ghost is?
Yes. When they were being chased, Hei tells Suou that what she saw was a surveillance spectre in episode 3 IIRC.
And speaking of which, Yin's medium's water, why would kicking the telephone pole do anything and how did she come out in the first place (there are like super tiny amount of snow next to the pole that's it).
There is evidence of wet ground. Yin already leveled up. She probably needs only a small amount of moisture now.
Maybe she's just kicking the pole to make sure that thing doesn't bug Hei again or something.
The telephone pole was close to where Yin appeared. Easier than scraping the ground.

orion
2009-11-13, 21:01
Actually, re-watching it again. She doesn't even know what Yin looks like, how the hell does she know if that ghost want to hug Hei or want to attack him. Hell, does she even know what observational ghost is? And speaking of which, Yin's medium's water, why would kicking the telephone pole do anything and how did she come out in the first place (there are like super tiny amount of snow next to the pole that's it). Maybe she's just kicking the pole to make sure that thing doesn't bug Hei again or something.

The power of denial. It's an awesome thing to observe. :heh:

July spilled the beans and Mao confirmed it. Suou pretty much guessed that there's a history. So she sees Yin's observational spirit attempt to hug Hei and kicks the area afterwards. It's called Suou is establishing her territory. Go girl!

One of those AT rifle rounds now has Yin's name on it. :heh:

Telling Suou that she doesn't have to shoot anymore because it doesn't suit her is so sweet. He even called her by her first name. And she followed him to the store for some alone time. Suou's in love with Hei. We also just had another shoujo moment. :heh:

Hei: Suou! I told you not to shoot anymore.
Suou: But...I really thought that spirit was going to kill you.
Mao: It looked like a hug to me.
July: It was Yin's observational spirit.
Suou: I was only worried about your safety.
Hei: Now she's really dead....
Suou: I'm so sorry.
Suou: Well they said she was as good as dead anyways. It's putting her out of misery. I'm sure we can scrape some remains up for a proper burial.
Madam Orielle: And you will be paid for completing the job now.
Suou: Hey guys we can go on vacation now! Grabs a stunned Hei by the arm and leaves. Humming "kiri".


yGLo79iJx0E

Intranetusa
2009-11-13, 21:38
And most important Hei is cooking again and now he need only to get his mask and cloak.

The highlight of the episode...FOOOOOOD!!!!

Intranetusa
2009-11-13, 21:59
Grabs a stunned Hei by the arm and leaves. Humming "kiri".

yGLo79iJx0E


The ending of ergo proxy was meh....reminded me of the ending to Big O but less epic and way more disappointing...

alu546
2009-11-13, 22:04
Well. I was wondering why she hit the pole, but her holding a bit of resentment to Yins observation spirit makes sense. Its similar to her now hating bugs because her friend used them to kill her other friend.

But right now, there s an attachment to Hei, but for right now it probably isnt love. He is all she has to rely on at the moment, and she is beginning to understand him. Norio said the exact same things to her that she said toward Hei when she encounteered him in episode 2.

But as of now, she still has reasons not to like him. Its wearing down though.

orion
2009-11-13, 22:09
The ending of ergo proxy was meh....reminded me of the ending to Big O but less epic and way more disappointing...

It's the OP for Ergo Proxy. It's romantic and fitting for both titles imo.

Paranoid Android was the ED.



But right now, there s an attachment to Hei, but for right now it probably isnt love. He is all she has to rely on at the moment, and she is beginning to understand him. Norio said the exact same things to her that she said toward Hei when she encounteered him in episode 2.


With that insert song that played, it was a clear shoujo moment imo. First love is in the air with our Suou.

Forever
2009-11-13, 22:32
My guess is that Yin or inazami has the ability to take over someone else's abilities (not just to disable) and uses it to kill the contractor. Then she will truly be an anti-contractor weapon. Furthermore, she can do it remotely.

Imagine anywhere with a pool of water, yin can eletrocute hei if he still had his powers and tanya getting stung to death while brushing her teeth. LoL.

orion
2009-11-13, 22:37
My guess is that Yin or inazami has the ability to take over someone else's abilities (not just to disable) and uses it to kill the contractor. Then she will truly be an anti-contractor weapon. Furthermore, she can do it remotely.

Imagine anywhere with a pool of water, yin can eletrocute hei if he still had his powers and tanya getting stung to death while brushing her teeth. LoL.

But she can't kill Suou. Her power is materialization. She also can't kill a person without contractor abilities. Prob the reason why Madame Orielle sent those 2 after Yin.

And we still don't know what part of Hei's powers were transferred to Suou's pendant.

freakabcd
2009-11-13, 23:05
Ok, someone mentioned Izanami(female) and Izanagi(male) already from wikipedia and someone else already mentioned yin=izanami and suou/shion=izanagi.

If Izanami can take away contractor powers perhaps Izanagi can give them (back) ? In the tale, Izanami sent many women "witches" after the frightened Izanagi to capture him and bring him back. Note that Izanagi is male and definitely cannot be Suou, so it's either Shion or Mao or July. :o

Also there seems to be many "witches" in section 3 :p

Slick_rick
2009-11-13, 23:12
Not the best of episodes so far. It felt bogged down by forced drama. I'm finding myself unable to care about the Norio situation. I expected his mother to die but I didn't expect them to kill her 1 episode in. Feels like a completely contrived storyline to fill time. His meeting and "falling in love" with Suou was in itself random but then his mother popping up and just happening to be a contractor...:rolleyes: It could have worked maybe if they actually stretched it out more and gave it some depth but it as of now it feels a shallow and unnecessary plotline.

The HeiXSuou issue is even worse. Wasn't he beating on her not an episode or so ago? Talk about random change of hearts. Way too much pedo fanservice so far this season. Could we at least get some inkling of why she might like him besides this random shift of gears? All of this seems like them trying to distract me from the lack of actual story they have to tell so they resort to random killing and forced drama. I wish the story would find some focus. Hopefully next episode is where it actually gets on track.

lividsama
2009-11-14, 00:06
this might not belong in episode 6 thread, but I just want to say that: Darker than Black OVA CM is out!!!


http://www.d-black.net/gallary/pv02.html
Yin!!!! Gyaaaah!!!! (^o^)

miroku2192
2009-11-14, 00:06
Not the best of episodes so far. It felt bogged down by forced drama. I'm finding myself unable to care about the Norio situation. I expected his mother to die but I didn't expect them to kill her 1 episode in. Feels like a completely contrived storyline to fill time. His meeting and "falling in love" with Suou was in itself random but then his mother popping up and just happening to be a contractor...:rolleyes: It could have worked maybe if they actually stretched it out more and gave it some depth but it as of now it feels a shallow and unnecessary plotline.

The HeiXSuou issue is even worse. Wasn't he beating on her not an episode or so ago? Talk about random change of hearts. Way too much pedo fanservice so far this season. Could we at least get some inkling of why she might like him besides this random shift of gears? All of this seems like them trying to distract me from the lack of actual story they have to tell so they resort to random killing and forced drama. I wish the story would find some focus. Hopefully next episode is where it actually gets on track.

Exactly...what happened to the whole "I hate you because you killed my father and got me involved with the things which i despise most...contractors [and even more so for turning me into one :X]". I'm pretty sure Suou wanted to kill Hei, so what happened.

Severe case of Stockholm syndrome anyone?

edit:
^Damn...that trailer looked good. And what did Hei say when he was hugging Yin? Right before Yin said "usou..."

Haladflire65
2009-11-14, 00:15
^Damn...that trailer looked good. And what did Hei say when he was hugging Yin? Right before Yin said "usou..."

He said that he'll never leave her alone, I think.

wandering-dreamer
2009-11-14, 00:16
I'm actually thinking that Hei is Izanagi since since Izanagi is male and it was shown in the previous episode that the Japanese have finally realized that Suou is a girl. Makes more sense too, Yin and Hei are more of pair than Yin and Suou/Shion, something could have happened to both of them at Hell's Gate.
And dangit give Hei his powers back! I want to see badass asskicking! And when is Suou going to get her own badass longcoat (i.e. the orange one in the opening)?

velvet nightmare
2009-11-14, 00:27
it appears that hei didn't notice the observation ghost at the end, so does that mean that non-contractors can't see them?

and i can actually see suou falling in love with hei, i think on an episode of CSI tv there was this one episode where the victim falls in love with the kidnapper, it's some sort of syndrome or something where they can identify with their kidnapper or w/e. bottom line it's not completely impossible even if these feelings arnt' driven by plot

orangejuicetang
2009-11-14, 00:34
I'm actually thinking that Hei is Izanagi since since Izanagi is male and it was shown in the previous episode that the Japanese have finally realized that Suou is a girl. Makes more sense too, Yin and Hei are more of pair than Yin and Suou/Shion, something could have happened to both of them at Hell's Gate.
And dangit give Hei his powers back! I want to see badass asskicking! And when is Suou going to get her own badass longcoat (i.e. the orange one in the opening)?

Actually, that could be feasible. Wasn't there something in the last episode of season 1 where they said that Hei could turn people into contracters with his powers? I remember reading that in tvtropes somewhere, but I haven't checked since.

forgottendiary
2009-11-14, 01:01
Not the best of episodes so far. It felt bogged down by forced drama. I'm finding myself unable to care about the Norio situation. I expected his mother to die but I didn't expect them to kill her 1 episode in. Feels like a completely contrived storyline to fill time. His meeting and "falling in love" with Suou was in itself random but then his mother popping up and just happening to be a contractor...:rolleyes: It could have worked maybe if they actually stretched it out more and gave it some depth but it as of now it feels a shallow and unnecessary plotline.

The HeiXSuou issue is even worse. Wasn't he beating on her not an episode or so ago? Talk about random change of hearts. Way too much pedo fanservice so far this season. Could we at least get some inkling of why she might like him besides this random shift of gears? All of this seems like them trying to distract me from the lack of actual story they have to tell so they resort to random killing and forced drama. I wish the story would find some focus. Hopefully next episode is where it actually gets on track.

This, thank you.
Other than that, I'm happy with getting some Yin.

laboo
2009-11-14, 01:45
has anyone considered that Hei was too quick to judge, thinking it was Yin who killed Norio's mother... i mean, Yin's observation ghost was there, but we still don't know anything about her powers or current condition... (from my understanding, observation ghosts don't really seem like they have that power)

perhaps it was someone else... like Izanagi... or more likely, Shion to protect Suou...

the ghost seems more like Yin's spirit... her body could be controlled, while the spirit roams free...

Manji Midou
2009-11-14, 01:50
l know l'm late to the party but did mao just said Yin was hei's woman in the past?

faints/:heehee:::heehee:

Strange
2009-11-14, 01:54
Actually, that could be feasible. Wasn't there something in the last episode of season 1 where they said that Hei could turn people into contracters with his powers? I remember reading that in tvtropes somewhere, but I haven't checked since.

In the manga,

it's said that yes, he can, along with the contractor he's hunting, Harvest.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 01:57
l know l'm late to the party but did mao just said Yin was hei's woman in the past?

faints/:heehee:::heehee:Well, Mao didn't exactly say that. If you're feeling HeixYin-fan-ish enough, you could draw a line to that :p :heh:, but for translational accuracy, Mao said they have a history.

Or at least that's what Mao said if you're talking about the specific scene that I think you're talking about.

Manji Midou
2009-11-14, 02:02
Well, Mao didn't exactly say that. If you're feeling HeixYin-fan-ish enough, you could draw a line to that :p :heh:, but for translational accuracy, Mao said they have a history.

Or at least that's what Mao said if you're talking about the specific scene that I think you're talking about.

l see....
damn you subbers! and here l was very happy...

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 02:10
l see....
damn you subbers! and here l was very happy...Lol, don't hang up those hopes just yet. This episode still had a nice possible HeixYin flag. And then there's the new lengthened OVA trailer...... :D

orangejuicetang
2009-11-14, 02:13
Well, Mao didn't exactly say that. If you're feeling HeixYin-fan-ish enough, you could draw a line to that :p :heh:, but for translational accuracy, Mao said they have a history.

Or at least that's what Mao said if you're talking about the specific scene that I think you're talking about.

Actually, that's more along the thoughts of what I thought he said. It makes more sense, considering that this Mao is a backup from the pre-gate incident.

Manji Midou
2009-11-14, 02:18
Lol, don't hang up those hopes just yet. This episode still had a nice possible HeixYin flag. And then there's the new lengthened OVA trailer...... :D

Yeah the trailer looked hot...hiexyin all the way!
when is that out....and when does it take place timeline wise?:confused:

Strange
2009-11-14, 02:22
Yeah the trailer looked hot...hiexyin all the way!
when is that out....and when does it take place timeline wise?:confused:

January I think, and it takes place in between seasons one and two.

orangejuicetang
2009-11-14, 02:22
Yeah the trailer looked hot...hiexyin all the way!
when is that out....and when does it take place timeline wise?:confused:

It's a bridge between season 1 and season 2.

*beaten to it.

Nanaya
2009-11-14, 02:22
Not the best of episodes so far. It felt bogged down by forced drama. I'm finding myself unable to care about the Norio situation. I expected his mother to die but I didn't expect them to kill her 1 episode in. Feels like a completely contrived storyline to fill time. His meeting and "falling in love" with Suou was in itself random but then his mother popping up and just happening to be a contractor...:rolleyes: It could have worked maybe if they actually stretched it out more and gave it some depth but it as of now it feels a shallow and unnecessary plotline.
Love at first sight needs no explanation. Norio is a teenager with hormonal imbalances. And it was in episode 5 (1 episode ago) that Lebanon told Suou that his wife was a contractor. So if you had to complain about that development, you should have done that last episode.

First season of Darker than Black had contractors dying one episode in, if not the first episode of the two episode arcs. You should have no complaints about her dying one episode in either.

The HeiXSuou issue is even worse. Wasn't he beating on her not an episode or so ago? Talk about random change of hearts. Way too much pedo fanservice so far this season. Could we at least get some inkling of why she might like him besides this random shift of gears? All of this seems like them trying to distract me from the lack of actual story they have to tell so they resort to random killing and forced drama. I wish the story would find some focus. Hopefully next episode is where it actually gets on track.
It started after Suou said she hated Hei for beating her in episode 4. Made Hei think twice it would seem the next episode.

Hei refrained from hitting Suou, confusing her. Next thing that happened would be him acting as a decoy. Followed by Hei using his common Li-kun tactics with the bad-tasting food and asking for seconds to not hurt Suou in her cooking. Basically, he mellowed his stance on Suou last episode and continued to do so this episode.

We would have to add the times Hei has saved her as well.

Hei has unknowingly confused her, but she also has no idea what love is yet, as she keeps asking about what it is. I think we could liken what Suou's feeling right now as one of possessiveness rather than what you're thinking of as sudden love. Suou has no idea what she has now, just that she hates the fact that someone else is getting the attention of her current benefactor/protector in Hei.

The story also does have focus: going to Tokyo, now for two reasons (Suou's and Hei's). You just let the relationship advancement between the two of them blind you into a seething rage.

orangejuicetang
2009-11-14, 02:24
I just want to point out that when Suou was wondering about what love was, one of things she flashed to was Hei stopping her from shooting Yin.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 02:25
I just want to point out that when Suou was wondering about what love was, one of things she flashed to was Hei stopping her from shooting Yin.She flash-backed to that scene because she was thinking about how Hei had finally called her name. Suou: "He......said my name."

On the matter of release dates, episode 12 (which is apparently the last episode) airs.........yep..........Christmas Eve. Is anybody else getting that sinking feeling that they're not going to air episode 12 that day and make us wait an extra week for the final episode in favor of Christmas programming or whatever they air around Christmas? >.>

And I've been thinking by the way............I've thought it odd that the OP kept showing Suou travelling around by herself with squirel-Mao, even though that't not what's happening. Anybody else suspect that the OP may be showing us what happens to Suou at the end of the series? Just like the ED to Soukou no Strain was the final scene of the final episode all along. (and I know there was at least one other anime that did the same with its OP or ED, I just can't remember it)

EDIT: Edited because of release changes. :(

Nanaya
2009-11-14, 02:28
It comes out on the the 23rd of December, and is supposed to fuill in the 2 year gap between S1 and S2.

No, actually, the OVA comes out late January in the second DVD/BD of season 2. Four episodes, 1 in every even numbered release.

So we won't be seeing the Gaiden untill next year. And it won't finish until all the DVD/BDs have been released.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 02:35
No, actually, the OVA comes out late January in the second DVD/BD of season 2. Four episodes, 1 in every even numbered release.

So we won't be seeing the Gaiden untill next year. And it won't finish until all the DVD/BDs have been released.%^$@#&*@#$&#%^#!@%

They originally said the OAV episodes were being released with each S2 DVD/BD release. >.>

Equidistant
2009-11-14, 03:10
Anyone notice that when Misaki was talking to the ninja chick she seemed to imply that Suou was Izanagi.

Strange
2009-11-14, 03:14
Anyone notice that when Misaki was talking to the ninja chick she seemed to imply that Suou was Izanagi.

Yeah, that's what I noticed as well. It's just July and Suou up there. Although July could very well be Izanagi, fitting the whole 'combat doll' definition if his talents grow in that direction. :heh: It's most likely Suou and her ability/pendant, though.

DavidLin
2009-11-14, 03:20
Maybe Hei gets his powers back when he gets near Hells Gate. "If he don't get his powers back then this amine is pointless to watch." (IMO)

Zwei
2009-11-14, 03:36
No, actually, the OVA comes out late January in the second DVD/BD of season 2. Four episodes, 1 in every even numbered release.

So we won't be seeing the Gaiden untill next year. And it won't finish until all the DVD/BDs have been released.

I thought the OVA's were being released in late December this year, each DVD containing one OVA episode? :/

Slick_rick
2009-11-14, 03:39
Love at first sight needs no explanation. Norio is a teenager with hormonal imbalances. And it was in episode 5 (1 episode ago) that Lebanon told Suou that his wife was a contractor. So if you had to complain about that development, you should have done that last episode.

That's just plain silly. Love at first sight is fine when used correctly and when it doesn't come off as completely contrived. This certainly doesn't come off well. He just happens to be walking by her and falls madly in love with her. Then low and behold he just happens to be the son of contractor, who happens to be involved in a case they have. It's just many instances of people being connected for the sake of drama. They could have done it much better instead of random love in the middle of a street to connect them. Love at sight can't be used to explain away bad story telling. Also I can complain whenever I want to I don't really need your permission. I didn't comment in 5 but if I did or didn't I still reserve my rights to call up relevant issues to my point. You don't have to like it and I don't care whether you do or don't.

First season of Darker than Black had contractors dying one episode in, if not the first episode of the two episode arcs. You should have no complaints about her dying one episode in either.

I don't know what this has to do with anything. My point, which you seem to miss, was that her story was badly thought out. They brought her in to basically just die. She added very little to the story. They gave her a half-assed backstory then set her up to die. It left me feeling unattached. Instead of just making her another random mook contractor to die they tried to and IMO failed to give her some relevance to the story. This is probably supposed to come off as character building for Suou but what it really comes off as is forced drama because of a lack of anything else to show.

It started after Suou said she hated Hei for beating her in episode 4. Made Hei think twice it would seem the next episode.

Hei refrained from hitting Suou, confusing her. Next thing that happened would be him acting as a decoy. Followed by Hei using his common Li-kun tactics with the bad-tasting food and asking for seconds to not hurt Suou in her cooking. Basically, he mellowed his stance on Suou last episode and continued to do so this episode.

We would have to add the times Hei has saved her as well.

Hei has unknowingly confused her, but she also has no idea what love is yet, as she keeps asking about what it is. I think we could liken what Suou's feeling right now as one of possessiveness rather than what you're thinking of as sudden love. Suou has no idea what she has now, just that she hates the fact that someone else is getting the attention of her current benefactor/protector in Hei.

The story also does have focus: going to Tokyo, now for two reasons (Suou's and Hei's). You just let the relationship advancement between the two of them blind you into a seething rage.

Once again another plotline that could use focus. These feelings should be better relayed. Instead we have one episode where she states she hates him, only to have her not two episodes later do a 180. Maybe there was some softening but going for that to this is just comes off badly. There was really no instance that stood out for when she might have changed her mind instead we only have this episode where all of a sudden she willing to go throw hoops to please him.

The story should have focus now since they are going to Tokyo but this little excursion was lacking in it. The whole Norio sidestory was just basically throwaway drama. I don't let any blind me but my opinions differ from you since I don't think the producers did a good job of making this "advancement" seem logical and not forced. Perhaps this relationship advancement has blinded you so your unable to tell when something is being forced on you without proper setup so your all defensive now.

Nanaya
2009-11-14, 05:26
1
Love is silly, nuff said. Norio's mom being a Contractor that handles cases in Sapporo where she lived isn't as bad as it sounds, being she's a native of Sapporo before she became a Contractor.

Now Norio's mom being a Contractor? This would be the only part that could be considered a coincidence. Apart from them meeting the 2 Lebanon family members in a small town where a huge love hotel is bankrupt and most of the place is just being put under construction while stores are mostly closed. In retrospect, that actually increases the chance of people meeting in a small town...

2
Season 1 of Darker than Black did this as well. They add people with some backgrounds and stuff gets resolved next episode. She didn't need to add more to the story. She was a Contractor mom that abandoned her kid. That's all. If they spent more time on her, Suou would've never have left Sapporo at that rate. But it's your right to feel unattached.

My point is if you didn't expect this after watching Darker than Black, why are you even watching season 2?

3
I've already given you the reasons. AND as I've said, she is NOT in love with Hei YET. She's just being possessive like a child would for above reasons. They have several more episodes to explore it if they choose. If you can't see through that, it's your fault, not mine.

Besides, one two episode? They only have twelve episodes to flesh this out. Time and events do come to pass within those episodes. In this case, it was enough for Suou to change her opinion of Hei after he stopped being abusive and became kinder to her. Not love, but more a give and take kindness thing. You have to understand as well, Hei is the only one that Suou has as of now.

4
Because every episode should have plot focus amirite? Especially right after a plot twist? They can't have character development in between, is that it?

Suou is the lead heroine and if I'm correct, they're making her grow up through this season of DtB. The Norio sidestory is there to show that Suou has no idea what love is, even when it's sticking right in her face. Call it throwaway drama, it still had its use even though it was annoying at some parts.

Whether her possessiveness of Hei leads to something or nothing is not for me or you to decide, however.

But I initially replied to you because you're just nitpicking at a show. And I hate nitpickers.

Mr. Anime
2009-11-14, 05:34
I just saw a Chinese sub and a couple more things became clear: first, Shinji103 is right and the one Hei thinks he wants to kill is Yin. That came out in his conversation with Madame Oreille, who said: "So you still say you want to kill that doll yourself?" And also when Suou asked Petya/Mao about Yin and was told she was a former friend who now had a "complicated history" with Hei.

But in addition, Hei is upset that Oreille knew everything and didn't tell him, and says he can't trust her and won't work with her again. That's when she says she feels the same since he has too much emotion, and still wants to kill the doll.


i dont think so, he said to madame oreille he wants to kill yin, probably to get information about yin and to save her. he stopped working for madame oreile because if he continued to work for her he might accidently kill yin. hei and madame oreille were both right concerning trust, hei probably tried to trick her to find yin and she tried to trick him to kill yin, but hei noticed it, thats why he quit working for her. When hei stopped suou it looked like genuine concern for yin and not because he wanted to kill her himself. i am sure all this "i ll kill yin" was just an act. now it looks like he ll even stop drinking not only because suou said so but because he has hope again to find yin.
NOW ALL HE NEEDS ARE HIS BADASS CONTRACTOR POWERS TO SAVE THE DAY.

Slick_rick
2009-11-14, 06:01
Love is silly, nuff said. Norio's mom being a Contractor that handles cases in Sapporo where she lived isn't as bad as it sounds, being she's a native of Sapporo before she became a Contractor.

Bad excuse for a badly put together plotline.


Now Norio's mom being a Contractor? This would be the only part that could be considered a coincidence. Apart from them meeting the 2 Lebanon family members in a small town where a huge love hotel is bankrupt and most of the place is just being put under construction while stores are mostly closed.

Norio meeting and immediately falling in love. Norio father happened to have been them not long before an establishing a relationship, this includes that this guy happens to turn out to Norio's father. Norio's mother being a contractor and not only that being the one new contractor introduced. All could have been put together much better and worked if they half tried.


Season 1 of Darker than Black did this as well. They add people with some backgrounds and stuff gets resolved next episode. She didn't need to add more to the story. She was a Contractor mom that abandoned her kid. That's all. If they spent more time on her, Suou would've never have left Sapporo at that rate. But it's your right to feel unattached.

My point is if you didn't expect this after watching Darker than Black, why are you even watching season 2?

I think you don't get that just because something has been doing that means that there is doing something in a believable way and an enjoyable way and just throwing in elements together. Most of the stories in S1 had a much better structure towards there telling. They made more sense as Hei was sent to track down these people often and in so doing there stories would come out. In this case the story was forced and barely there in the first place. They was no real connection formed in which I gave a damn about her death so in all it was a wasted story.


I've already given you the reasons. AND as I've said, she is NOT in love with Hei YET. She's just being possessive like a child would for above reasons. They have several more episodes to explore it if they choose. If you can't see through that, it's your fault, not mine.

Besides, one two episode? They only have twelve episodes to flesh this out. Time and events do come to pass within those episodes. In this case, it was enough for Suou to change her opinion of Hei after he stopped being abusive and became kinder to her. Not love, but more a give and take kindness thing. You have to understand as well, Hei is the only one that Suou has as of now.

They could have easily taken the time to flesh it out but they didn't. If they need more than 12 episodes to tell a story that's doesn't feel forced and a random then that's on them not me. They was no noticable shift in dynamics between the characters nor was there any real insight into what lead to this changes. You can claim all the loneliness you want but as far as I can see for the most part that was pushing her away then this episode that dynamic completely changed. It feels forced.


But I initially replied to you because you're just nitpicking at a show. And I hate nitpickers.

I believe that's just your low standards talking. Don't hate on me because of my higher standards for my Anime.

orion
2009-11-14, 06:37
and i can actually see suou falling in love with hei, i think on an episode of CSI tv there was this one episode where the victim falls in love with the kidnapper, it's some sort of syndrome or something where they can identify with their kidnapper or w/e. bottom line it's not completely impossible even if these feelings arnt' driven by plot

Except that Suou isn't a hostage. She's his partner for the time being along with July and Mao. She gets paid for her participation and fed well if Hei continues to hate weeds. Not to mention TV and decent roof over her head. And somebody spent some money (http://news.3yen.com/2009-03-13/tokyo-shojo/) on next episode's uniform.

IIRC being called by your first name is suppose to be a big deal for the Japanese. It's a relationship shift from the user's standpoint.

Also, when Genma was talking about Hei's girlfriend ("honey" in the subs) and imminent death, Hei was thinking he meant Suou and not Yin.

The past is the past for those fanboying over the OVA trailer.

For anyone who continues to yell pedo, Suou is 13.

Avira
2009-11-14, 07:16
Also, when Genma was talking about Hei's girlfriend ("honey" in the subs) and imminent death, Hei was thinking he meant Suou and not Yin.

The past is the past for those fanboying over the OVA trailer.

For anyone who continues to yell pedo, Suou is 13.

First of all, who else was was Genma supposed to mean from Hei's point of view? July?? I don't think so. Hei's not gonna go " Omg you must mean my only love YIN!". Nah, his reaction was more along the lines of : " Honey? I guess you mean the girl." It was an obvious guess.

And um, I don't know about you, but a 20-something-year-old guy going after a 13-year-old kid is pedo all the way. At least in Germany.

How old are the rest anyway? Like Yin, July, Misaki and Hei?

About Misaki, she's a nice person and all, but I've always despised glasses (since I actually need them myself) and she just never really appeared especially endearing(Yin)/awesome(Hei)/cute(July)...she's sort of a 'meh' character for me:heh:
The katana woman (Mina or something?) is a lot more interesting^^

I'm personally really happy about this turn of events; Hei definitly still has feelings for Yin and Suou is starting to get jealous (my inner evil fangirl is laughing at her)...staring in the air thoughtfully while hearing that Yin was Hei's woman in the past and kicking the lamp post where Yin's ghost was trying to hug Hei make it more than clear.

Am I the only one mutating into a July fan? The tea scene was so adorable!^^
I'm considering SuouxJuly a bit, just for the sheer cuteness :D

orion
2009-11-14, 07:25
And um, I don't know about you, but a 20-something-year-old guy going after a 13-year-old kid is pedo all the way. At least in Germany.

How old are the rest anyway? Like Yin, July, Misaki and Hei?


Loveless had a similar age difference and it wasn't called pedo. Loveless did more than what this is doing. Ritsuka age 12, Soubi age 21. Now we have a heterosexual "couple" and it's called pedo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedophilia) which isn't correct since this title went out of its way to show that Suou just had her period. Therefore, she is not (http://www.avert.org/puberty-girls.htm) considered prepubescent (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/prepubescent).

Loveless anime was in 2005.

Hei is 24 IIRC.
Others can tell you about Yin, Misaki and July.

You could think of her half way to being considered an emancipated minor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emancipation_of_minors). Russia via marriage was age 14 with parental consent.

Avira
2009-11-14, 07:31
Loveless had a similar age difference and it wasn't called pedo. Lovoless didm more than what this is doing. Ritsuka age 12, Soubi age 21. Now we have a heterosexual couple and it's pedo.

Loveless anime was in 2005.

There's also incest anime, so basically there are no limits, yes. But still, pedo comes from pedophile and 13 & 24 is that in my opinion :heh:
So it is pedo if anything, isn't it?

V4sH
2009-11-14, 07:33
First of all, who else was was Genma supposed to mean from Hei's point of view? July?? I don't think so. Hei's not gonna go " Omg you must mean my only love YIN!". Nah, his reaction was more along the lines of : " Honey? I guess you mean the girl." It was an obvious guess.

Am I the only one mutating into a July fan? The tea scene was so adorable!^^
I'm considering SuouxJuly a bit, just for the sheer cuteness :D

yeah, at that point hei didn't know that yin was even there so the obvious conclusion to "your honey" would be the only girl he knows for sure is there.

Also yes I am also turning into a July fan, hes great. A SuouxJuly pairing would result in so much cuteness that world peace would break out. Cant have that in darker than black ><.

orion
2009-11-14, 07:45
There's also incest anime, so basically there are no limits, yes. But still, pedo comes from pedophile and 13 & 24 is that in my opinion :heh:
So it is pedo if anything, isn't it?

Loveless anime is shonen ai. That got released in 2005 without issues.

It's your opinion but you can't say pedo when the person is at puberty as being prepubescent is a part of the definition and regional laws allow for different scenarios (involving emancipated minors which is the closest to her situation).

That was prob a secondary reason why they emphasized the first menses anyways. Physiologically she's at puberty and you calling the title pedo based on her age alone is faulty imo. Even her age falls within the range of puberty.

Also, depending on the region in Japan, the age of consent (http://www.avert.org/age-of-consent.htm) may still be 13 IIRC (16-18 yo in most prefectures with regional override).

They haven't even had sexual intercourse so really this title isn't pedo at all imo.

Chidori<3
2009-11-14, 07:48
Hei is 24 IIRC.
Others can tell you about Yin, Misaki and July.



Yin is now about 20...

but I don't know how old is July... 13 or less ?

Mr. Anime
2009-11-14, 07:58
Loveless anime is shonen ai. That got released in 2005 without issues.

It's your opinion but you can't say pedo when the person is at puberty as being prepubescent is a part of the definition and regional laws allow for different scenarios (involving emancipated minors which is the closest to her situation).

That was prob a secondary reason why they emphasized the first menses anyways. Physiologically she's at puberty and you calling the title pedo based on her age alone is faulty imo. Even her age falls within the range of puberty.

They haven't even had sexual intercourse so really this title isn't pedo at all imo.

well a 13 years old girl and a 24 years old guy just isnt right, sure a 13 year old girl could develop a crush on a cool guy like hei, but its only one sided. maybe u are around the age of suou orion so u can identify urself with her but i am around heis age and believe me a 13 year old girl just lacks everything a normal guy seeks in a relationship^^

orion
2009-11-14, 08:05
well a 13 years old girl and a 24 years old guy just isnt right, sure a 13 year old girl could develop a crush on a cool guy like hei, but its only one sided. maybe u are around the age of suou orion so u can identify urself with her but i am around heis age and believe me a 13 year old girl just lacks everything a normal guy seeks in a relationship^^

It may not be "right". You may feel uncomfortable but it's not technically pedo depending on region and he hasn't even touched the girl. There isn't a romantic relationship portrayed at this time. So, it's not pedo.

If she turns 14 during the anime, then the pedo arguement lessens imo.

My age has nothing to do with the discussion at hand by the way.

Slick_rick
2009-11-14, 08:06
Loveless anime is shonen ai. That got released in 2005 without issues.

It's your opinion but you can't say pedo when the person is at puberty as being prepubescent is a part of the definition and regional laws allow for different scenarios (involving emancipated minors which is the closest to her situation).

That was prob a secondary reason why they emphasized the first menses anyways. Physiologically she's at puberty and you calling the title pedo based on her age alone is faulty imo. Even her age falls within the range of puberty.

They haven't even had sexual intercourse so really this title isn't pedo at all imo.

Kodomo No Jikan got released in 2007 and its overtly pedo so I don't know what your point it. I'm sure someone has brought up the issue of the age difference in loveless too. I seriously doubt it went unnoticed by many. The care for that would probably be low though since the main audience of that is Yaoi fangirls who probably could careless as long as long as they get their Yaoi fill.

I'm don't think anyone called DTB a pedo anime but I commented on the pedo fanservice, ie meaning an underage girl being put in awkward fanservice scenes and a contrived relationship with a much older man. I honestly don't think it going anywhere nor should it but the need to put it in there I question. It's just fetish fuel and not my taste at all.

Mr. Anime
2009-11-14, 08:22
It may not be "right". You may feel uncomfortable but it's not technically pedo depending on region and he hasn't even touched the girl.

If she turns 14 during the anime, then the pedo arguement lessens imo.

My age has nothing to do with the discussion at hand by the way.

i didnt mean to insult u about the age thing if u felt offended by it then i apologize to u. but seriously do u think its a good think to pair up with a guy who has approximately 2 times ur lifeexperience? regions where such things are ok are regions where women often are discriminated against

its nice to see how shipper wars break out in many animes^^. i would be a heiyin shipper but taking my anime/manga experience into account i dont think there s gonna be an romantic ending with heiyin or heimisaki but i sure hope there will be^^. suouhei probably has no chances.

orion
2009-11-14, 08:22
Kodomo No Jikan got released in 2007 and its overtly pedo so I don't know what your point it. I'm sure someone has brought up the issue of the age difference in loveless too. I seriously doubt it went unnoticed by many. The care for that would probably be low though since the main audience of that is Yaoi fangirls who probably could careless as long as long as they get their Yaoi fill.


The girls in Kodomo no Jikan were 9 yo. 9 yo is pedo by all definitions. Suou is a menstrating 13 yo. She is at puberty. The only restrictions on her is regional age of consent laws depending on her situation.

This kind of stuff happens in Japan anyways. It's not like the audience isn't used to hearing about it. Prob a few were snickering and joking "oyaji".



its nice to see how shipper wars break out in many animes^^. i would be a heiyin shipper but taking my anime/manga experience into account i dont think there s gonna be an romantic ending with heiyin or heimisaki but i sure hope there will be^^. suouhei probably has no chances.

That all depends on what the producers have in mind. They could end with Suou staying with Hei, do another 2-4 yr time skip and she's a 16-18 yo. Well within the range of the sensitive type of anime watchers imo. Then we can have more "oyaji" jokes.

Joe_fh
2009-11-14, 08:26
%^$@#&*@#$&#%^#!@%

They originally said the OAV episodes were being released with each S2 DVD/BD release. >.>

Yes it did but sadly even if the first DVD is out on the 23rd we'll get the first OVA with the scond DVD for some reason. It looks really great though.

And I still can't see the whole YinxHei love relationship. They do love and care for each other a lot but in a different way. Maybe it's just me though but the only romantic relatioship for Hei was the one with Amber since she was the only one that loved him in that kind of way.
Suou well I can't see her starting to love him after all he did to her (maybe that will change after I watch the episode) Still a Hei Suou relationship is just too creepy for me.

And yes if they get in that kind of relationship Hei will be a pedo. That's what the term pedo means in the first place - an adult (Hei 24) who is attracted to a child (Suou 13). Everyone under 14 is considered a minor and a child in most normal countries.
It doesn't really matter if she is in puberty or not since her body is just starting to develop as a woman's body. Thus she is still a child.
Though I seriously doubt we'll see much progres with this.

I'm going to watch the episode soon so I can't say anything about it yet. :heh:

Slick_rick
2009-11-14, 08:34
The girls in Kodomo no Jikan were 9 yo. 9 yo is pedo by all definitions. Suou is a menstrating 13 yo. She is at puberty. The only restrictions on her is regional age of consent laws depending on her situation.

Doesn't make it any less pedo fanservice in my book. She hit puberty all of yesterday. You can try to justify this anyway you want but its geared towards pedos, underaged girls who have fantasies about older men because all guys their age don't want them, closet pedos, and older women who used to have these fantasies and now still can't get any men so they have to try to resort to such fantasizing again about what could have been.

Ok, I'm being facetious and exaggerating a bit but only slightly...

Mr. Anime
2009-11-14, 08:39
The girls in Kodomo no Jikan were 9 yo. 9 yo is pedo by all definitions. Suou is a menstrating 13 yo. She is at puberty. The only restrictions on her is regional age of consent laws depending on her situation.

This kind of stuff happens in Japan anyways. It's not like the audience isn't used to hearing about it.

That all depends on what the producers have in mind. They could end with Suou staying with Hei, do another 2-4 yr time skip and she's a 16-18 yo. Well within the range of the sensitive type of anime watchers imo.

u could be right, who knows.
but kodomo no jikan was awesome ^^

orion
2009-11-14, 08:41
Doesn't make it any less pedo fanservice in my book. She hit puberty all of yesterday. You can try to justify this anyway you want but its geared towards pedos, underaged girls who have fantasies about older men because all guys their age don't want them, closet pedos, and older women who used to have these fantasies and now still can't get any men so they have to try to resort to such fantasizing again about what could have been.

Ok, I'm being facetious and exaggerating a bit but only slightly...

In the end, it doesn't matter if those are the ones buying the DVDs, BDs.

Besides, if nothing happens then it's not pedo. So far it's all in the head of the person interpreting the dialogue and video. Thought crimes aren't convictable in most countries.

Edit: And if you really want to joke around. Since he saw Suou buck naked, he has to marry her anyways. :heh:

-Sho-
2009-11-14, 08:42
The oav look greats :)
You can see that Yin wears the same clothes in the last pic in this episode .
Is it Amber in the last part ?

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 10:42
Norio meeting and immediately falling in love. Norio father happened to have been them not long before an establishing a relationship, this includes that this guy happens to turn out to Norio's father. Norio's mother being a contractor and not only that being the one new contractor introduced. All could have been put together much better and worked if they half tried.Erm, maybe you didn't notice, but practicaly everything in anime, and fictional television productions for that matter, is a bunch of "coincidences" and "conveniently" occuring events. If you think it could have been done better, then why don't you tell us how you would've done it? :heh:


And I see we have a bunch of people once again hammering down on ages in a TV show. Have we really devolved as a society so much that we have to force our own views and opinions so hard on a fictional television production? >.> Maybe if Bones gave us a strongly emotional scene like Hei raping Suou, then there would be something to get on about, but if I recall correctly, nothing like that has happened. I don't see Hei foaming at the mouth over Suou or anybody falling in love with a 13 year old (besides Norio, but he's clearly not 20+ and he's obviously not truly in the leagues for Suou's affections), so what are we whining about here?

As for the matter of age differences, I think when we have 13-year+ age differences between mates in real life living happily and getting married, age differences in fictional productions become rather insignificant.


And I still can't see the whole YinxHei love relationship. They do love and care for each other a lot but in a different way. Maybe it's just me though but the only romantic relatioship for Hei was the one with Amber since she was the only one that loved him in that kind of way.And I still can't see how people can deny even the possibility. Where has it been stated that Hei and Yin don't love each other as mates? There hasn't been anything in DtB that has limited their relationship to brother/sister. It just strikes me as odd how in other animes a relationship like Hei's and Yin's would be thought of as love, but here a lot of people are quick to try and pin pseudo-sibling love to it.

miroku2192
2009-11-14, 12:18
^ I agree, and especially with the whole Hei and Yin running away from the Syndicate, and only having one another to trust... I just feel like that time period (the period between season 1 and season 2) is more than enough for them to propel their relationship from a (if it even was one to begin with) brotherly/sisterly love to an actual full blown love/relationship.

I miss amber though :'(. They need to make some OVAs with Hei x Amber, and then finish the series with Hei x Yin.

Tanksenior
2009-11-14, 12:29
Why will season 2 be only 12 episodes anyway? And is there a source for this? I would personally be kind of dissapointed with that little amount of eps.

Also does anyone know if there is room for a s3 or will dbt's story actually be concluded by the end of s2?

Anyway Great ep! Loved the scene with the transformer guy realises that he destroyed the truck :D, mao is awesome as always ;).

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 12:40
Why will season 2 be only 12 episodes anyway? And is there a source for this? I would personally be kind of dissapointed with that little amount of eps.

Also does anyone know if there is room for a s3 or will dbt's story actually be concluded by the end of s2?As far as I know, there hasn't been an official announcement on the episode number, but the DVD release schedule suggests 12 episodes. (hence why i always only say "apparently" 12 episodes) But it would make sense; as I've said before, S2 has been announced by the staff to be straight story and plot instead of arcs like S1, and if you were to take away all the arc stuff from S1, you'd end up with around 12 episodes.

No word on if S2 is going to be an end to the story or make way for S3. But even if S2 isn't open-ended, they could still make an S3. After all, S2 feels more like it was planned after S1 finished and Bones saw all the fan-desires, rather than having been planeed from the very beginning. (you can tell since they made a whole bunch of new conflicts and characters that didn't weren't in S1, just like the last two movies of the Pirates of the Carribean and Bourne trilogies) Plus, they're only releasing the in-the-2-year-gap OAVs now with S2, rather than in the gap between S1's end and S2's start, indicating that the idea didn't even exist until S2's planning started.

Poetic Justice
2009-11-14, 12:46
I liked this episode a lot more than the past few ones, Moreso because we finally find out what happened to Yin and the fact that she's alive. The plot does seem to be moving ahead now, though still at an unacceptable pace for a 12 episode series.

Toilet woman being killed was predictable but i thought it would be by souo, not yin. And i just don't like the idea of this awkward loli love triangle being formed, Though it should be expected since the start of the series.

Also the rock guy's power turned out to be better than i originally thought, Him having the ability to use anything in the environment as a power coat thing is intriguing, Will be interesting to see how Hei fights him later.

Now since they're heading to tokyo hopefully we'll see some old faces like that detective and his sidekick.

Azuma Denton
2009-11-14, 13:12
Hei...
You really are a criminal... :heh:

Just once you call Suou her name, and now she's falling all over you... :heh:
Ha ha ha, quite hillarious when Suou kick the pole at the end of episode... Jealousy?? :heh:


Hmm, why a mere doll can use her observer to kill Contractor?
Has Yin evolved into a contractor too??

orion
2009-11-14, 13:24
^ I agree, and especially with the whole Hei and Yin running away from the Syndicate, and only having one another to trust... I just feel like that time period (the period between season 1 and season 2) is more than enough for them to propel their relationship from a (if it even was one to begin with) brotherly/sisterly love to an actual full blown love/relationship.

I miss amber though :'(. They need to make some OVAs with Hei x Amber, and then finish the series with Hei x Yin.

The OVA trailer doesn't look too good for that either imo. The music is sad in parts. He's looking sad thru out or fighting. And then she gets caught...

If she was a "normal" female, you might have something. But you're talking about a doll. So this season offers a controversial choice imo 13 yo normal female vs 20 yo doll.

Perhaps, that's a reason for her monologues at the end "cursing" her state so to speak. Not considered human, can't talk, no need for memories...

Perhaps those monologues represent Yin telling us about her state inside that machine as her becoming more of a weapon progresses.

gunrik
2009-11-14, 13:27
If Yin appeared, sure everyone would be a lot happier and Suou would have a new friend. :P

Zwei
2009-11-14, 13:31
If Yin appeared, sure everyone would be a lot happier and Suou would have a new friend. :P

Or rival. :heh:

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 13:36
The OVA trailer doesn't look too good for that either imo. The music is sad in parts. He's looking sad thru out or fighting. And then she gets caught...Well of course the OAV isn't going to be a straight "they live happily ever after" OAV and will probably be pretty dark in parts, especially toward the end. We already know Yin is captured and whatever happens to her makes Hei's statement inthe episode 3 epilogue. So of course the trailer isn't going to show a happy romance mood.

If she was a "normal" female, you might have something. But you're talking about a doll. So this season offers a controversial choice imo 13 yo normal female vs 20 yo doll.Why would Yin being a doll stop anything from happening between the two of them? S1 showed she's plenty close enough to being human and that Hei thinks of her as human too.

orion
2009-11-14, 13:40
And why would Yin being a doll stop anything from happening between the two of them? S1 showed she's plenty close enough to being human and that Hei thinks of her as human too.

It would be rather interesting having a relationship with someone who doesn't have much free will. It's like having a relationship with a sex android from GitS.

She is a human. Her genetics states it clearly but a relationship built on more than just genetics...

Vanehei
2009-11-14, 13:43
Im sorry for what im goint to say but..... Yin is boring....

Cyrus17
2009-11-14, 13:45
Grown up man and young girl falling in love with each other in shounen anime? NEVER!

A pity though...

Zwei
2009-11-14, 14:00
Grown up man and young girl falling in love with each other in shounen anime? NEVER!

A pity though...

A pity that this is not a shounen anime and should not be considered as such? :heh:

Besides, whoever said Hei will fall in love with Suou? Seeing the trailer for the OVA, I'm pretty convinced now that Hei and Yin's relationship wasn't just a sibling love-relationship.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 14:30
It would be rather interesting having a relationship with someone who doesn't have much free will. It's like having a relationship with a sex android from GitS. That's where I'm saying there's no difference; you're saying that just because Yin doesn't have free will (which has been proven to be untrue, both in S1 and now S2) she can't have a relationship with Hei, but that's not true. There's nothing stopping them from having feelings for each other and having a relationship.

She is a human. Her genetics sates it clearly but a relationship built on more than just genetics...Who's saying anything about genetics? I'm saying Yin is plenty human enough period, and Hei thinks of her as such.

Nosauz
2009-11-14, 14:47
Kodomo No Jikan got released in 2007 and its overtly pedo so I don't know what your point it. I'm sure someone has brought up the issue of the age difference in loveless too. I seriously doubt it went unnoticed by many. The care for that would probably be low though since the main audience of that is Yaoi fangirls who probably could careless as long as long as they get their Yaoi fill.

I'm don't think anyone called DTB a pedo anime but I commented on the pedo fanservice, ie meaning an underage girl being put in awkward fanservice scenes and a contrived relationship with a much older man. I honestly don't think it going anywhere nor should it but the need to put it in there I question. It's just fetish fuel and not my taste at all.

It's not really pedo but the main thing is that it feels like bones is pandering certain sub generes of otaku lolicon and mahou shojo fans which is frustrating, it destroys the vibe established in s1 or w/e. Also if you think about it would be like ga zero and ga grouped together when in fact their genres are quite different, one being more of a horror show and the other being a shounen. The point is why would you sacrifice everything that made the first season great with a story that is somewhat nonsensical at this point, and I just wish bones had more backbone about this project instead of pandering to otaku to sell some dvds.

orion
2009-11-14, 14:51
It's not really pedo but the main thing is that it feels like bones is pandering certain sub generes of otaku lolicon and mahou shojo fans which is frustrating, it destroys the vibe established in s1 or w/e. Also if you think about it would be like ga zero and ga grouped together when in fact their genres are quite different, one being more of a horror show and the other being a shounen. The point is why would you sacrifice everything that made the first season great with a story that is somewhat nonsensical at this point, and I just wish bones had more backbone about this project instead of pandering to otaku to sell some dvds.

Well they do have to pay the bills.

They even had Genma looking like the mecha from Xam'd in this episode.

That's where I'm saying there's no difference; you're saying that just because Yin doesn't have free will (which has been proven to be untrue, both in S1 and now S2) she can't have a relationship with Hei, but that's not true. There's nothing stopping them from having feelings for each other and having a relationship.

Who's saying anything about genetics? I'm saying Yin is plenty human enough period, and Hei thinks of her as such.

Genetics is all she has now. She's a weapon. She's transported sedated and nude inside a metal carrier by people who don't consider dolls to be human. What little free will remaining is going to be removed pretty soon to better control the weapon unless you think she likes to kill now.

And if Genma wasn't just baiting Hei, she's going to be killed soon. (Izanami died in childbirth in the myth IIRC.)

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 14:54
It's not really pedo but the main thing is that it feels like bones is pandering certain sub generes of otaku lolicon and mahou shojo fans which is frustrating, it destroys the vibe established in s1 or w/e. Also if you think about it would be like ga zero and ga grouped together when in fact their genres are quite different, one being more of a horror show and the other being a shounen. The point is why would you sacrifice everything that made the first season great with a story that is somewhat nonsensical at this point, and I just wish bones had more backbone about this project instead of pandering to otaku to sell some dvds.I'm not sure where this is coming from. Just because there are some things here in S2 that weren't there in S1 doesn't mean anybody is pandering, and it certainly doesn't mean Bones lost their backbone. For all we know, the whole and only reason Suou is 13 years old here in S2 is because Bones plans to have her be a solo grown woman main character in a third series.

Nosauz
2009-11-14, 15:03
suou's "transformation" is clearly pandering to the mahou shojo crowd. Specifically everything about it screams out as it is a throw back to magical girl crowd, which i've state before I do enjoy, it's just like the direction is scattered. There really isn't any real flow, I seriously cringe everytime during the transformation.

Cyrus17
2009-11-14, 15:11
A pity that this is not a shounen anime and should not be considered as such? :heh:
DtB-1 was seinen, but this one is typical shounen. IMO.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 15:12
suou's "transformation" is clearly pandering to the mahou shojo crowd. Specifically everything about it screams out as it is a throw back to magical girl crowd, which i've state before I do enjoy, it's just like the direction is scattered. There really isn't any real flow, I seriously cringe everytime during the transformation.I'd certainly agree that it's different for DtB, but I still wouldn't agree that it's pandering to anybody. If they wanted to pander, they could have done a heck of a lot more than just a transformation sequence. You could have energy particles, laser charging, voice commands, the works. And while I don't really like it either, it doesn't ruin anything for me. I just push fastfoward for a second and be done with it.

Proto
2009-11-14, 15:14
Geez, you people are such kids. Don't you understand the economical importance of reusable footage?

orion
2009-11-14, 15:15
I'm not sure where this is coming from. Just because there are some things here in S2 that weren't there in S1 doesn't mean anybody is pandering, and it certainly doesn't mean Bones lost their backbone. For all we know, the whole and only reason Suou is 13 years old here in S2 is because Bones plans to have her be a solo grown woman main character in a third series.

Well, this is what the target population likes (http://www.animenation.net/blog/2009/11/06/the-world-is-upside-down/) currently. Grown female protagonists aren't sellable in Japan from what I heard online.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 15:19
Genetics is all she has now. She's a weapon. She's transported sedated and nude inside a metal carrier by people who don't consider dolls to be human. What little free will remaining is going to be removed pretty soon to better control the weapon unless you think she likes to kill now.And why can't Hei and Suou rescue her and stop that from happening?

Grown female protagonists aren't sellable in Japan from what I heard online.Well, my statement about that was more of an example; "We don't know what Bones' intentions are, so we should stop poking at them for everything." And it still doesn't mean that Bones is really pandering to anybody.

orangejuicetang
2009-11-14, 15:20
Well, this is what the target population likes (http://www.animenation.net/blog/2009/11/06/the-world-is-upside-down/) currently.
There a few things in this list that made me lol. TTGL is more popular among girls than boys might have been the biggest one.

Nosauz
2009-11-14, 15:23
le sigh, i wouldn't complain if i didn't like the franchise :( it can be helped

Strange
2009-11-14, 15:24
I don't see much pandering, tbh. Given the director's track record, I highly doubt any elements of the story that conform to pre-existing stereotypes were intentional.

orion
2009-11-14, 15:25
And why can't Hei and Suou rescue her and stop that from happening?


They aren't travelling as fast as a sub imo. They stopping at a safehouse and lying low and travelling the long way. And they don't know Yin's destination.

The government has a sub (speedy transport), known destination and a locked facility on their side.

Whatever is due to happen to Yin, they prob won't arrive in time to stop it imo.

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 15:26
They aren't travelling as fast as a sub imo. They stopping at a safehouse and lying low and travelling the long way. And they don't know Yin's destination.

The government has a sub (speedy transport), known destination and a locked facility on their side.And since when has any of that ever stopped the good guys from killing the bad guys and saving the girl? :p :D I think you'd be hard-pressed to find an anime where the good guys aren't pushed into a corner before prevailing.

Besides, why would it be too late to save Yin if/when the sub gets to wherever it's going? Heck, pretty much all the time the good guys still save the girl even after she's been turned into a will-less super weapon.

Less-corn-ily, who says they're going to do whatever they're going to do to Yin as soon as they get to wherever they're going? Who says they're even going to change her, let alone permanently?

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-14, 17:14
...Also yes I am also turning into a July fan, hes great. A SuouxJuly pairing would result in so much cuteness that world peace would break out. Cant have that in darker than black ><.Lol. So true on all counts.

slick_rick made some good points, even if the way he made them seemed offensive almost to the point of trolling to someone who is enjoying this show as much as I am. Good points, but I don't actually agree with him fully.

1. When Norio first saw and became infatuated with Suou, it was so ridiculously sudden, especially with someone apparently younger, that there was clearly more going on than met the eye. His saying she "shone" was a clue to me at the time that he unconsciously realized she was a contractor. Then Lebanon was made to say that he realized she was a contractor, too, and that solidified the impression for me. I concluded that both men were sensitized to contractors by having lived with Norio's mother, and that Norio just was caught like a fly in honey. In that scene at the door to Norio's cave, Lebanon mentions that Norio may see Suou again. Sounds to me like a sign that we haven't seen the end of Norio yet.

2. So it is not really a surprise that Norio was connected with another contractor. The only ex-machina part of the situation is that she was involved with chasing Hei and Suou. She has at least three roles in the plot: one, to explain Norio's attraction to Suou; two, to give Yin a chance to enter the situation in a way that protects Hei's people and opposes her captors; and three, to give us a better sense of the way contractors and ordinary people relate. I loved Noriomom as a character. I thought the character design, voice acting, and script for her were all terrific.

3. Wanting "more focus" on Suou's change of heart is understandable, but I sometimes find that when all the i's are dotted and t's crossed, things become too obvious and the drama loses interest. I have felt Suou's change progressing slowly in the background in a quite satisfying way, starting from the beginning of the previous episode, when she was shown as becoming committed to being a contractor, and Hei softened toward her. The mysteriousness adds life.

It's perfectly understandable to me that she would grow a crush on her captor/saviour. Although I don't believe she realizes what she is feeling quite yet. In part, I think her feeling is like that of an initiate toward the person who is initiating her into being a real contractor, which is her new life. And since she is partly a contractor, her psychology is interestingly a bit odd.

ideas about other posts:

Suou knew what Yin looked like because she saw her form at the fountain and had it identified later by July. And she felt the unknown emotion of jealousy, I believe, and wanted that thing away from Hei. After she kicked the pole, she started walking a bit closer to Hei.

When Noriomom told her to come with her, she immediately thought of having to leave Hei, and didn't want to. And when she thought of love, she thought of Hei stopping her from shooting Yin, as well as of Hei calling her by her name: I think that means she thought of Hei loving Yin, but also of Hei getting closer to herself.

Someone who knows Japanese well maybe could help me here, but my feeling was that the robo-contractor's "taisetsu na hanii-chan" ("precious little honey") would more likely refer to a girlfriend, but could also refer to a daughter. In any case, I don't feel convinced that Hei has anything but parental-type feelings toward Suou. Suou, however, has somewhat romantic feelings that she doesn't quite recognize or understand.

I continue to be blown away by Hanazawa Kana's work as Suou, and also by Kiuchi Hidenobu as Hei. But Norio's voice actor (Nomura Katsuhito) really disappointed me, especially since I liked him in Asatte no Houkou. His wild emotion sounded silly, and he didn't make me believe in Norio's natural bizarreness.

socto
2009-11-14, 17:14
is it possible for someone to make a GIF of norio crying and munching on the cake? it truly was delicious cake and he just had to eat it...

Shinji103
2009-11-14, 17:20
Someone who knows Japanese well maybe could help me here, but my feeling was that the robo-contractor's "taisetsu na honey-chan" ("precious little honey") would more likely refer to a girlfriend, but could also refer to a daughter. In any case, I don't feel convinced that Hei has anything but parental-type feelings toward Suou. Suou, however, has somewhat romantic feelings that she doesn't quite recognize or understand.The guy is obviously one of those types who's heavy on sarcasm (which fits well as an opposite to Hazuki's (mostly) straight-serious personality), so what he says shouldn't just be taken straight. But anyways, that line could be directed at any girl, really. The guy (for the life of me, I can't remember his name.....) was just teasing Hei about it, really.

Joe_fh
2009-11-14, 18:33
And I still can't see how people can deny even the possibility. Where has it been stated that Hei and Yin don't love each other as mates? There hasn't been anything in DtB that has limited their relationship to brother/sister. It just strikes me as odd how in other animes a relationship like Hei's and Yin's would be thought of as love, but here a lot of people are quick to try and pin pseudo-sibling love to it.

Haha I agree with that. There's always a possibility until proven wrong :heh:
I just see it as a very close sibling relationship because of the manga and the S1. In both Hei was very close to Yin and cared a lot about her promissed to be with her, tried to make her happy, never leave her alone etc. but he never acted in a way that would clearly show they're lovers. Sure those parts might just be cut but there's no way to know. It's still love just not that kind.
Besides I've never seen all those love relationships in DtB. For me the only relationship that was presented as a real love relationship was between Hei and Amber and it was mostly on Amber's part.
And of course that's just my opinion so you're free to disagree. I really wouldn't mind a HeixYin relationship. In fact it will be really nice to see and it would be much better than a HeixSuou one.

On the Yin doll part I have to agree with Shinji. he gave good examples of her development. Also it was clearly shown many times that dolls are a lot more than first shown. They have their own will and the act on it even if it's not that common amongst them. They were shown a bit similar to contractors and just like them they evolved throughout the anime.

I still haven't watched this episode so I can't say anything about the SuouxHei relationship development. :heh:

Slick_rick
2009-11-14, 18:41
Lol. So true on all counts.

slick_rick made some good points, even if the way he made them seemed offensive almost to the point of trolling to someone who is enjoying this show as much as I am. Good points, but I don't actually agree with him fully.

I dislike being called a nitpicker because I have a different opinion. I get labeled at the bad guy sometimes because I'm more than willing to throw someones condescending words back at time at greater forced. It's not a issue I'm concerned about in the least.


1. When Norio first saw and became infatuated with Suou, it was so ridiculously sudden, especially with someone apparently younger, that there was clearly more going on than met the eye. His saying she "shone" was a clue to me at the time that he unconsciously realized she was a contractor. Then Lebanon was made to say that he realized she was a contractor, too, and that solidified the impression for me. I concluded that both men were sensitized to contractors by having lived with Norio's mother, and that Norio just was caught like a fly in honey. In that scene at the door to Norio's cave, Lebanon mentions that Norio may see Suou again. Sounds to me like a sign that we haven't seen the end of Norio yet.

It doesn't make sense. His father had actual interactions with them and could draw that conclusion. He on the other hand could fell in love at quite a distance for no apparent reason. I don't buy into this magical contractor awareness. Apparently from there conversation his mother has been gone for a long time and was either still an infant or very young child when she left so I don't think he gained any real experience from "living with a contractor".


2. So it is not really a surprise that Norio was connected with another contractor. The only ex-machina part of the situation is that she was involved with chasing Hei and Suou. She has at least three roles in the plot: one, to explain Norio's attraction to Suou; two, to give Yin a chance to enter the situation in a way that protects Hei's people and opposes her captors; and three, to give us a better sense of the way contractors and ordinary people relate. I loved Noriomom as a character. I thought the character design, voice acting, and script for her were all terrific.

All could have been put together better instead of giving a feeling of randomness when watching. When the contractor turned out to be Norio's mom I completely rolled my eyes. I immediately knew then her death was imminent but if the absurdity of killing her the next episode with even a better connection with her being formed. I could careless that she died and consequently felt even more detached from Norio's situation than I already did.


3. Wanting "more focus" on Suou's change of heart is understandable, but I sometimes find that when all the i's are dotted and t's crossed, things become too obvious and the drama loses interest. I have felt Suou's change progressing slowly in the background in a quite satisfying way, starting from the beginning of the previous episode, when she was shown as becoming committed to being a contractor, and Hei softened toward her. The mysteriousness adds life.

I don't need the every detail but this "development" certainly leaves me wondering why they could have stretched it out a couple more episodes to give it a better lead in. One episode of "softening", if you can really call it that, doesn't really justify such a change in dynamics. This could have waited till they were in Tokyo to present the change gradually or through the fact that Hei might have reverted back to his old self more but instead putting it here comes off a contrived and forced for the sake of having some Suou vs Yin moments for lack of a better storyline to fill time.

orion
2009-11-14, 19:19
And since when has any of that ever stopped the good guys from killing the bad guys and saving the girl? :p :D I think you'd be hard-pressed to find an anime where the good guys aren't pushed into a corner before prevailing.

Less-corn-ily, who says they're going to do whatever they're going to do to Yin as soon as they get to wherever they're going? Who says they're even going to change her, let alone permanently?

And how do you know that it's a complete torso/body in the carrier? You only saw neck up. For all you know, she could already be modified for whatever machine she is finally being inserted into and is being transported just like you transport an engine to the final assembly site.

They showed no signs for worrying about her well being after she was dropped and the carrier flew open.

The carrier didn't have life sign monitors and there wasn't any way for nutrition to get in there.


Besides, why would it be too late to save Yin if/when the sub gets to wherever it's going? Heck, pretty much all the time the good guys still save the girl even after she's been turned into a will-less super weapon

You haven't read King of Thorn (http://www.kingofthorn.net/) right? :heh:

Saving Yin just wouldn't feel right for a dark title imo.

-----

I'm still wondering why did Norio's mom have to die. She wasn't going to kill Suou.

It seemed like her death was a way to show that Yin was possibly out of control and to give Suou a lesson on how it feels to have someone say to her what she said to Hei.

Manji Midou
2009-11-14, 19:25
And I still can't see how people can deny even the possibility. Where has it been stated that Hei and Yin don't love each other as mates? There hasn't been anything in DtB that has limited their relationship to brother/sister. It just strikes me as odd how in other animes a relationship like Hei's and Yin's would be thought of as love but here a lot of people are quick to try and pin pseudo-sibling love to it.

Amber/Misaki fans.... just don't want to accept it.....that what yin/hei may share love for each other ....not the brotherly-sisterly love.... but as lovers.


there are three things l think favor a yinxhei couple ending in the end.

1) Amber has already given her blessing to Yin in regards to Hei
2) lt has been proven a doll has free will and can come to love somone of their own decision. The brother to that yakuza guy proved as much...
3) ....

orion
2009-11-14, 19:45
Amber/Misaki fans.... just don't want to accept it.....that what yin/hei may share love for each other ....not the brotherly-sisterly love.... but as lovers.


there are three things l think favor a yinxhei couple ending in the end.

1) Amber has already given her blessing to Yin in regards to Hei
2) lt has been proven a doll has free will and can come to love somone of their own decision. The brother to that yakuza guy proved as much...
3) ....

1. And when does the blessings of a possibly dead person count. The guy hated Amber. It's not like she was going to get anywhere with him. So she gives her blessings to the least likely competition. :heh:

2. With that doll, we didn't see a follow up. How do you know that the relationship went well? It could have turned into the relationship from hell leading the guy to abandon that doll.

Yu Ominae
2009-11-14, 21:30
I now find it interesting that Youko's warning Misaki to be careful. Not to mention Hei going in all alone with any "support". Sneaky to know who his employer was. :D

PS - Suō kicked the electric pole. :D

hei
2009-11-14, 22:10
Just watched the episode.

First, positive thing. Episode 6 is finally finished, which means no more filler episodes from now on. ;) At the same time, the scenario writer of Kodomo no Jikan will be gone as well. Hooray!

Next, negative things. Unfortunately, there are many, but it looks like most of them were already mentioned. I will just add one more thing. It's about action. Last episode Hei was trapped, so I expected some battle scenes of the Black Reaper. However, it turned out to be a huge disappointment for me (especially just after watching the OVA promotional video!). Genma and co. had enough time to prepare a trap, but they just let Hei run away without any meaningful action? Weren't they supposed to be professional agents? Whenever I saw them, I am just curious. What's the point of introducing those two Section 3 characters except their perverted talks? Simply, they remind me that I really miss colorful characters of S1 such as November 11, Huang, Wei, Nick, ... even landlady grandma! Anyway, it will be very interesting to see whether next episodes will be able to save the show.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-14, 22:43
1. I personally love the idea of HeixYin, and see nothing "wrong" about it. I'd say he's 24 and she 19, from what I've read -- not that that matters much in anime, as opposed to real life. They were definitely developing a closer relationship -- of whatever kind -- through the latter episodes of the first series. They seemed to be humanizing each other, somehow. Dolls are empty creatures, but they can develop, as both Yin and the one rescued by the petty crook did (a bit) in the first series.

2. Based on the Izanami-Izanagi myth, Hei/Izanagi will go in to rescue Yin/Izanami, but find that she is too far gone to be rescuable.

3. I expect that by then, Misaki will help Hei escape. WhoxWho after that, if anyone, I don't know. There aren't many episodes available, so maybe becoming comrades could make HeixMisaki happen fast.

4. I have a sinking feeling that Norio may become a contractor. Maybe from the cake, lol. He is certainly unstable as a human.

5. I agree that Suou kicked the pole.

6. I haven't seen a filler episode yet -- unlike season one, which had some filler. And I have liked the eps written by Okada Mari, who was lead writer on true tears, Toradora, Vampire Knight, Canaan, and Bantorra, as well as KnJ. But the next three episodes at least, as you say, will be written by Onishi Shinsuke, who did seven episodes of season one, as well as having been lead writer on The Third, Innocent Venus, and 009-1. EDIT: But I think what goes into each episode is decided by the director and the lead writer -- who in this case are both Okamura Tensai -- and the episode writer just creates the scenes and the words. He probably chose Okada Mari to do the more human episodes and Onishi to do ones with more action. We'll see.

forgottendiary
2009-11-14, 22:53
1. I personally love the idea of HeixYin, and see nothing "wrong" about it. I'd say he's 24 and she 19, from what I've read -- not that that matters much in anime, as opposed to real life. They were definitely developing a closer relationship -- of whatever kind -- through the latter episodes of the first series. They seemed to be humanizing each other, somehow. Dolls are empty creatures, but they can develop, as both Yin and the one rescued by the petty crook did (a bit) in the first series.

2. Based on the Izanami-Izanagi myth, Hei/Izanagi will go in to rescue Yin/Izanami, but find that she is too far gone to be rescuable.

3. I expect that by then, Misaki will help Hei escape. WhoxWho after that, if anyone, I don't know. There aren't many episodes available, so maybe becoming comrades could make HeixMisaki happen fast.

4. I have a sinking feeling that Norio may become a contractor. Maybe from the cake, lol. He is certainly unstable as a human.

5. I agree that Suou kicked the pole.

6. I haven't seen a filler episode yet -- unlike season one, which had some filler. And I have liked the eps written by Okada Mari, who was lead writer on true tears, Toradora, Vampire Knight, Canaan, and Bantorra, as well as KnJ. But the next three episodes at least, as you say, will be written by Onishi Shinsuke, who did seven episodes of season one, as well as having been lead writer on The Third, Innocent Venus, and 009-1.

ILU for this. :3 :3 :3

Vanehei
2009-11-14, 22:54
I dont thing that the show has to be saved.... it had had a lot of great moments so far so... it just can get better and better.

Mei19
2009-11-14, 23:32
Amber/Misaki fans.... just don't want to accept it.....that what yin/hei may share love for each other ....not the brotherly-sisterly love.... but as lovers.



I can't keep a straight face whenever I try to see Hei and Yin as "lovers" XD Yin didn't even speak 88%of the time in the first season. Hei and Yin are more like close siblings. Love it or hate it. The type that even if Hobo Hei found himself a romantic partner, he'll readily ditch her for Yin. They're that close. It's awkard that they're making Yin take over Amber's place for the antagonist spot. Hope not.

As I see it, it's just Sou vs Yin for the title of Hei's little angel XD Misaki is on her own league. I wonder how she'll react once she finds out her Li-kun transformed into a hobo.:heh:

My thoughts on this episode: Norio should get the best personality award:eyespin: Poor soul.

Zwei
2009-11-15, 00:04
DtB-1 was seinen, but this one is typical shounen. IMO.

What?

The first episode of S2 gives off a more darker seinen feeling than S1 did in the first place. I don't see how this is "typical" and "shounen" nor how you came across it as such, maybe I'm watching a different series here. :rolleyes:

Haladflire65
2009-11-15, 00:06
What?

The first episode of S2 gives off a more darker seinen feeling than S1 did in the first place. I don't see how this is "typical" and "shounen" nor how you came across it as such, maybe I'm watching a different series here. :rolleyes:

I actually felt like that, too. With Suou as the protagonist and everything... I thought it felt Shounen, too. I have to say that I prefer the feel of the first season to S2.

Manji Midou
2009-11-15, 00:09
misaki is a groupie she has no chance at all. :heh:

Narona
2009-11-15, 02:23
Things finally started to become interesting again imo :D

I hope Hei will return to his usual self now :)

I see some famous faces from the Regios forum here, Huhu, hi again everyone :D :)

Arissa
2009-11-15, 04:10
Isn't that Izanagi is Shion? Suou's Twin

Equidistant
2009-11-15, 04:15
Isn't that Izanagi is Shion? Suou's TwinIt's actually implied in this episode that Suou is Izanagi...or at least section 3 thinks she is. Which explains why Norio's mother wanted to bring Suou in, and Yin may have killed Norio's mother to stop whatever may happen when they have Inanagi and Inazami, but that's just speculation.

Mr. Anime
2009-11-15, 05:36
I actually felt like that, too. With Suou as the protagonist and everything... I thought it felt Shounen, too. I have to say that I prefer the feel of the first season to S2.

i dont think its shounen when the girl u love kills u using bugs^^, or when the main male character drinks alcohol all the time, many people get killed in a short amount of time and the male protagonist does most of it without crying or showing remorse ----> it IS seinen, thats why the end is harder to predict. on the one hand i think that yin is still saveable even if she were to kill some contractors, in front of hei she will certainly act different. on the other hand the probability of her dying (or an other miserable fate) is high, because animes like DtB rarely have an all around happy ending. the trailer of the ova shows that they are in a somewhat romantic relationship (i wouldnt say "i ll never let u alone" to my little sister^^, i am rly looking forward to see it)

Anh_Minh
2009-11-15, 08:07
I'm not sure I like Hei's love life. Goddamn lolicon.

Shinji103
2009-11-15, 09:28
And how do you know that it's a complete torso/body in the carrier? You only saw neck up. For all you know, she could already be modified for whatever machine she is finally being inserted into and is being transported just like you transport an engine to the final assembly site.

They showed no signs for worrying about her well being after she was dropped and the carrier flew open.

The carrier didn't have life sign monitors and there wasn't any way for nutrition to get in there.Again, nothing says she will be modified in any way or that she cant be saved, so there's no point in calling the score at halftime.

It's a secured container; what would be the point of making something like that if it couldn't withstand a substantial shock? It obviously wasn't damaged from the fall.

Then why the oxygen mask?

You haven't read King of Thorn (http://www.kingofthorn.net/) right? :heh:

Saving Yin just wouldn't feel right for a dark title imo.That's the thing; this isn't as dark a title as you seem to think it is. It's obviously not happy-cheery like Negima or something lol, but I've seen good endings come from much darker series-es.


I'm not sure I like Hei's love life. Goddamn lolicon.Hey hey hey now, I don't see him foaming at the mouth for Suou. :heh:

Anh_Minh
2009-11-15, 10:54
Hey hey hey now, I don't see him foaming at the mouth for Suou. :heh:
There's a kinda precedent with Yin. And now, who does he think of when someone mentions his "honey"? Goddamn lolicon.

Manji Midou
2009-11-15, 12:59
Hey hey hey now, I don't see him foaming at the mouth for Suou. :heh:

Maybe not for Suou but what about July...
>_>

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-15, 13:37
There's a kinda precedent with Yin. And now, who does he think of when someone mentions his "honey"? Goddamn lolicon.I don't think the robocontractor saying "taisetsu na hanii-chan" definitely implied she was Hei's girlfriend, it was just ragging on Hei. And there was no other small female person under his care whom Hei could have thought of, since he had no idea Yin was around.

As for Yin, at this point she is probably 19 and Hei 24 or so. What's wrong with that? Even 22 and 17 seem reasonable for romance, even if going further would be technically illegal. Dolls are not exactly normal humans, anyway. Both more and less. And it's perfectly normal for older guys to like somewhat younger girls, and vice-versa. Personally, however, I'm still going on the basis that Yin and Hei's relationship is more sibling, but we'll see.

-- If Yin is Izanami, then the most likely Izanagi is Hei, since Izanami and Izanagi were sibling-spouses. If Shion is Izanagi, then Suou has to be Izanami. But the government forces may be mistakenly thinking of Shion as Izanagi and Yin as Izanami, and it's their terminology, so whatever.

-- There is nothing in the anime itself that suggests Yin is disabled or ruined. But if she is Izanami, there is a myth that Izanami died and was in the underworld and Izanagi came to rescue her, but when he found her, her body was already being eaten by maggots, even though she could still talk.

-- Speaking as a comparative non-fan of shounen, this feels less shounen than the first series, to me. This even has a touch of shoujo in the female protagonist and attention paid to subtle internal feelings. That last thing makes it more adult -- and therefore seinen -- than the first series, to me. So does the absence of silly stock characters like the mad scientist and the comic detective. Even Norio and Lebanon aren't quite stock. But classification is usually a mug's game, so I'll stop being a mug.

-- Shion has been absent from the scene and from our comments for a while now. But he is clearly the key to all this. How was he able to get up from his chair and start walking around? Where was he headed when Suou saw him? Where is he now, what are his plans, who are his allies, if any?

...I see some famous faces from the Regios forum here....I didn't watch Regios when it was on, but I'm watching it now (for Takagaki Ayahi) and finding out what I was missing. Enjoyable show.

Shinji103
2009-11-15, 13:46
There's a kinda precedent with Yin. And now, who does he think of when someone mentions his "honey"? Goddamn lolicon.Umm, I guess you didn't read my reply to Kaoru Chujo; the armor-guy is the sarcastic, joker-type character; he'd refer to Hei's grandmother as honey. Hei knows the guy is jerking him around, so he just thinks about the only female character he thinks is in the equation. You're taking that line way too seriously. Basically, what Kaoru said above.

And I'm sorry, but Yin is no loli. If you honestly think that, then you have some serious age-definition problems. Then they have a 4-5 year age difference. Big deal. I don't know why I have to keep being the voice of logic here or why I have to keep repeating myself, but people in real life get married with 10+ year age-differences; I don't think a 4-5 year age-gap between characters in a fictional television production is as big a deal as that, eh?

Anh_Minh
2009-11-15, 14:03
No, you guys are taking my posts too seriously. I'm not really serious about Hei being a lolicon - I just find it amusing to accuse him of being one.

I also really don't like his pairing with Yin. They were too much like siblings in S1, and she had an "undeveloped" quality that made her seem younger than her physical age. So, yeah - the relationship has incestuous and lolicon overtones even if, factually speaking, it's neither.


Personally, however, I'm still going on the basis that Yin and Hei's relationship is more sibling, but we'll see.

Maybe the kind of siblings you'll find in some rural parts of the States, considering how strongly the OVA PV hinted at sex... :p

Strange
2009-11-15, 14:04
It's probably the size difference that gets people thinking that Yin is a loli, when it's just that Hei is really, really freaking tall. He's taller than every female character in the anime.

Manji Midou
2009-11-15, 14:10
Maybe the kind of siblings you'll find in some rural parts of the States, considering how strongly the OVA PV hinted at sex... :p

O_O l thought they just cuddled....
Oh my...

Anh_Minh
2009-11-15, 14:13
It's probably the size difference that gets people thinking that Yin is a loli, when it's just that Hei is really, really freaking tall. He's taller than every female character in the anime.
Which is kinda normal for an adult male.

miroku2192
2009-11-15, 14:42
I still don't get what's wrong with a Hei x Yin relationship. It doesn't make him a loli at all. And she has definitely grown from just a "doll", so i think it's perfectly fine.

Shinji103
2009-11-15, 15:03
I also really don't like his pairing with Yin. They were too much like siblings in S1, and she had an "undeveloped" quality that made her seem younger than her physical age. So, yeah - the relationship has incestuous and lolicon overtones even if, factually speaking, it's neither.I still don't see where people are getting the idea. And I especially don't see anything saying that their relationship isn't a mate relationship.

And as miroku (as well as myself) said, Yin has definitely grown from being an average doll with no will. Her whole arc alone showed she has plenty of free will, and Hei in particular takes that free will seriously. And she is the one who pulled Hei back from the brink in the S1 ending.

Joe_fh
2009-11-15, 17:51
Lol you're still going at teh YinxHei relationship :heh:

We'll see what kind of relationship they have in 2010 and I don't think it really has anything to do with what's going on right now. Fact is Hei cares a lot about Yin and something happened that made him whant to kill her. Doesn't really matter what kind of love they had for each other.
As I said earlier I don't really mind how their relatioship will work out. For now I see it as the facts suggest.

miroku2192
2009-11-15, 18:32
^Wait...I thought we came to the conclusion that the real person Hei wanted to kill was the Blonde lady on the phone getting the massage.

I don't really remember from the episode...but wasn't Hei shocked to know that Yin was inside the container? Wasn't mao shocked as well? [now was that shock a "oh my gawd, she's alive?" or "oh my gawd, she's in a box?"]

I mean, we as viewers aren't 100% sure that the woman he was referring to was Yin was it? If hei really wanted Yin dead, wouldn't he have just let Suou shoot the container? And besides, didn't mr. truck guy say "your honey" will get hurt? Sure that has some kind of a "taunting" feel to it, but i think there's more to it than just that.

Now, unless of course Hei is a cynical bastard (meaning the only reason he stopped Suou is because he wants to kill Yin himself...lawl), then I get the feeling that the woman he wants to kill is NOT yin, but rather (most likely) that blonde lady...

Strange
2009-11-15, 18:40
Good point, considering how Hei expected a woman within the container, but clearly didn't expect it to be Yin (and had a change of heart--not to mention stopping Suou from taking out the container--once he realized the truth).

So who the fuck was he talking about? He didn't know that Izanami was Yin, and from what Hei said to Oreille, it doesn't look like he wants to kill Oreille either. I don't know, Amber, considering her appearance in the OAD?

miroku2192
2009-11-15, 18:42
Good point, considering how Hei expected a woman within the container, but clearly didn't expect it to be Yin (and had a change of heart--not to mention stopping Suou from taking out the container--once he realized the truth).

So who the fuck was he talking about? He didn't know that Izanami was Yin, and from what Hei said to Oreille, it doesn't look like he wants to kill Oreille either. I don't know, Amber, considering her appearance in the OAD?

Yes...and he even quit drinking (FOR YIN :P)!!!

Shinji103
2009-11-15, 18:53
^Wait...I thought we came to the conclusion that the real person Hei wanted to kill was the Blonde lady on the phone getting the massage. Um, no we didn't. I've been saying all along that he said he was going to kill Yin, and Madame Oreille (blonde lady) confirmed that this episode.........

I don't really remember from the episode...but wasn't Hei shocked to know that Yin was inside the container? Wasn't mao shocked as well? [now was that shock a "oh my gawd, she's alive?" or "oh my gawd, she's in a box?"]Yes he was shocked, because Oreille didn't tell him, so he didn't know.

I mean, we as viewers aren't 100% sure that the woman he was referring to was Yin was it? If hei really wanted Yin dead, wouldn't he have just let Suou shoot the container? And besides, didn't mr. truck guy say "your honey" will get hurt? Sure that has some kind of a "taunting" feel to it, but i think there's more to it than just that.As I and others have said, we don't think that Hei really wants to kill Yin. I and others speculate that he's trying to convince himself he needs to and thus tries to put it into words, but can't truly convince himself to do it, thus we have Hobo Hei. And others speculate it was a front to get Oreille to back him up since it seems Oreille does want her dead, which we can put together now that we know things shown in this episode that we didn't know three episodes ago.

Now, unless of course Hei is a cynical bastard (meaning the only reason he stopped Suou is because he wants to kill Yin himself...lawl), then I get the feeling that the woman he wants to kill is NOT yin, but rather (most likely) that blonde lady...That could indeed be true. That's what Oreille said in their phone call, at least: "Even though you kept saying you'd kill that doll yourself".


Good point, considering how Hei expected a woman within the container, but clearly didn't expect it to be Yin (and had a change of heart--not to mention stopping Suou from taking out the container--once he realized the truth). They didn't expect a person to be in there at all.

So who the fuck was he talking about? He didn't know that Izanami was Yin, and from what Hei said to Oreille, it doesn't look like he wants to kill Oreille either. I don't know, Amber, considering her appearance in the OAD?Again, for the last time, this episode confirms he was talking about Yin. >.> His reason is unkown, but the fact remains.

Yeah, now this is getting a tad annoying; I explained the Japanese, as a Japanese person, in episode 3. Episode 6 confirms it. People pointed it out in the first pages of this thread. People pointed it out on other sites and blogs. And people still aren't getting it. >.>

EDIT: GAH, fixed for annoying typos.

Joe_fh
2009-11-15, 19:04
I got it in episode 3 but didn't really want to believe it until now since - well they said it loud and clear :heh:
And as before I agree with you that he really doesn't want to kill her but more like he wants to convinve himself he wants to kill her for some reason. Same thing with him distancing himself from Suou in the first few episodes.

miroku2192
2009-11-15, 19:05
Um, no we didn't. I've been saying all along he said he was going to kill Yin, and Madame Oreille (blonde lady) confirmed that this episode..............

Yes he was shocked, because Oreille didn't tell him, so he didn't know.

As I and others have said, we don't think that Hei really wants to kill Yin. Either he's trying to convince himself he needs to and thus tries to put it into words, or it was a front to get Oreille to back him up since it seems Oreille does want her dead.

That could indeed be true. That's what Oreille said in their phone call, at least: "Even though you kept saying you'd kill that doll yourself".


They didn't expect a person to be in there at all.

Again, for the last time, this episode confirms he was talking about Yin. >.> His reason is unkown, but the fact remains.

Yeah, now this is getting a tad annoying; I explained the Japanese, as a Japanese person, in episode 3. Episode 6 confirms it. People pointed it out in the first pages of this thread. People pointed it out on other sites and blogs. And people still aren't getting it. >.>

ehehehahahah. I knew i should've sat down and watched the whole episode, i was skipping around [too busy with exams >.<]and totally missed what oreille said to Hei.

Thanks for clearing that up! (At least Hei stopped drinking though [for yin ;)])

edit:
btw still no confirmation on this definitely being a 12-episode season right? But it most likely is?

Shinji103
2009-11-15, 19:16
edit:
btw still no confirmation on this definitely being a 12-episode season right? But it most likely is?Nope, still no confirmation, just DVD release schedules. But it would fit with how fast they're pulling Suou into having feelings for Hei. Although I've been having a few doubts; putting aside Suou's already-developing feelings, it just feels like the plot is moving along a bit slowly to be wrapped up in 6 more episodes. It could be just me though. Or they're going to go for an airing-break at the halfway point, making an S2 and S3, since that seems to be a bit of a trend lately. *shrug*

The OST comes out on December 23rd, by the way. This show has some great music. :)

miroku2192
2009-11-15, 19:23
Nope, still no confirmation, just DVD release schedules. But it would fit with how fast they're pulling Suou into having feelings for Hei. Although I've been having a few doubts; putting aside Suou's already-developing feelings, it just feels like the plot is moving along a bit slowly to be wrapped up in 6 more episodes. It could be just me though. Or they're going to go for an airing-break at the halfway point, making an S2 and S3, since that seems to be a bit of a trend lately. *shrug*

The OST comes out on December 23rd, by the way. This show has some great music. :)

Yes i love the music.

I really hate the fact that Suou has developed these feelings for Hei so fast. It just seems way too forced to me. But then again, since she has become a contractor, and she is curious about what love is, Hei is really the only person (well not the only), but probably and in this case the first person for her to really latch on to.


Anywayyyy...i still want Hei x Yin! NAOW! If they end the series with Yin dying...my Gawd i will be so pissed. I was pissed @ the ending of Season 1, i was pissed @ the ending of Ga rei zero, I was pissed @ the ending of phantom requiem, I was pissed @...insert most of this year's anime series... this year has just been sucky sucky sucky for me. Only a few good series. Maybe my tastes have changed and i'm just not appreciating anime as much...i've become so picky :mad:

edit:
and before anyone can ask...NO IT'S NOT THAT TIME OF THE MONTH

Joe_fh
2009-11-15, 19:45
Yes i love the music.

I really hate the fact that Suou has developed these feelings for Hei so fast. It just seems way too forced to me. But then again, since she has become a contractor, and she is curious about what love is, Hei is really the only person (well not the only), but probably and in this case the first person for her to really latch on to.


Anywayyyy...i still want Hei x Yin! NAOW! If they end the series with Yin dying...my Gawd i will be so pissed. I was pissed @ the ending of Season 1, i was pissed @ the ending of Ga rei zero, I was pissed @ the ending of phantom requiem, I was pissed @...insert most of this year's anime series... this year has just been sucky sucky sucky for me. Only a few good series. Maybe my tastes have changed and i'm just not appreciating anime as much...i've become so picky :mad:

edit:
and before anyone can ask...NO IT'S NOT THAT TIME OF THE MONTH

Lol and the edit :heh:

It seems to me that Suou developed feeling but at the same time she's not aware of them at all. Remember how she felt with Nika's confession? I don't think she feels the same way with Hei so there's still a long way to go with her feelings developing. Also I think it happened in this episode because otherwise Hei would have closed off any relatioship development since he now has confronted Yin. If they didn't make it now it would have felt a bit out of place to do it later though I agree that it happened a bit too fast.

And as you said right now she doesn't really have anyone else so it's normal to develop some kind of feelings for the perosn that's next to you. It's natural for humans to get close to each other when they are the only ones even if they have their differences. They're contractors so this should apply to them as well and besides if you consider that Suou is thinking rationally that would explain why she's sort of overlooking the fact that Hei destroyed her life (at leas she thinks that it was him)

And unrelated but both Ga-Rei and Phantom had really good endings IMO. Both were sad (so that might be a reason to be pissed at them since I would have loved a happy ending) but were really something to remeber.

And Shinji thanks for the OST release date ^^

V4sH
2009-11-15, 19:54
ehehehahahah. I knew i should've sat down and watched the whole episode, i was skipping around [too busy with exams >.<]and totally missed what oreille said to Hei.

Thanks for clearing that up! (At least Hei stopped drinking though [for yin ;)])

edit:
btw still no confirmation on this definitely being a 12-episode season right? But it most likely is?

http://www.mahou.org/Showtime/

Mahou showtime have it scheduled for only 12 slots, they're not the most official source, but they are like 98% accurate (I've never known them to be wrong about a single show, but 2% margin of error to be safe). So I'd take it as fact that there will only be 12 episodes in this season.

miroku2192
2009-11-15, 20:15
Lol and the edit :heh:
it's normal to develop some kind of feelings for the perosn that holds you captive


*cough* Stockholm syndrome

And unrelated but both Ga-Rei and Phantom had really good endings IMO. Both were sad (so that might be a reason to be pissed at them since I would have loved a happy ending) but were really something to remeber.

Yeah...well ga-rei zero was sad, but good (so thats why i was angry).

Phantom on the other hand...they realllly butchered it.

Joe_fh
2009-11-15, 20:23
Yeah there is that part but then again Hei didn't really kidnap her. He jsut offerd to take her to Tokyo. Of course it serves hims some kind of purpose but she's free to go wherever she wants to. The reson she's still with him is because it's the most rational thing to do( and she's a contractor after all).
If she's alone she'll probably die the way she is now.

Yeah the whole theme of Ga-rei was really good
And Phantom...well that's a long topic and it depends on the point of view (as all things do) but I liked it. It could have been better though...

And all unofficial sources point to 12 episodes but there is nothing official. Maybe they'll do 12 episodes than we'll see the OVAs and then another 12 episodes to finish it off. They have to pick up the pase a lot if they want to finish it with only 12 and I'm not really sure how good that will be since there won't be enough time for proper development.

Full Metal Coast
2009-11-15, 20:38
i thought this was possibly the best episode so far this season but the one thing that pissed me off was when Misaki admiral akbared Hei i mean come on she should be helping him and not trusting section 3. one thing that i really enjoyed about this episode thought is the improvement in the relationship (not romantically) between Suou and Hei. i loved the fact that he is starting to treat her more like a person. it was also good that Li is starting to make a bit of a return.

im just hoping soon that Hei gets his powers back and starts tearing section 3 apart.

Shinji103
2009-11-15, 21:42
It seems to me that Suou developed feeling but at the same time she's not aware of them at all. Remember how she felt with Nika's confession? I don't think she feels the same way with Hei so there's still a long way to go with her feelings developing.I definitely agree with this. For one thing, she stills refers to him with "aitsu." It's a less-formal, and when used by a girl, somewhat-impolite word for "him/her." Basically when a girl uses it to refer to a person, she doesn't really like him/her. Usually. (sometimes in anime, a girl will still use "aitsu" in reference to her boyfriend/lover in tsundere couples :heh:)

caracantabile
2009-11-15, 21:47
I thought it was a pretty typical 13-year old thing for Suou to start having odd feelings about Hei -- after all, hobo or not, he is supposed to be good-looking, plus the whole tsundere + "I'm so emotionally wounded" act can be a huge thing for young girls. Just look at how people swoon over Kiryu Zero in Vampire Knight :p

As far as Hei x Yin or even Hei x Suou... just my thinking maybe it's a little off the mark to think of it as romantic. I think it's more of a moe thing where Hei just has this compulsion or need to have a younger female to protect and help -- sort of a Bai substitute? More a brotherly kind of love if that. He can be violent yeah, but doesn't seem like the lolicon type. And, romantic love doesn't seem to fit into the DtB world --- it's too bad, because I thought November 11 x Misaki would've been splendid !

Zwei
2009-11-15, 21:55
As far as Hei x Yin or even Hei x Suou... just my thinking maybe it's a little off the mark to think of it as romantic. I think it's more of a moe thing where Hei just has this compulsion or need to have a younger female to protect and help -- sort of a Bai substitute? More a brotherly kind of love if that. He can be violent yeah, but doesn't seem like the lolicon type. And, romantic love doesn't seem to fit into the DtB world --- it's too bad, because I thought November 11 x Misaki would've been splendid !

Well, even though I'm not watching for the romance, just because it's a "dark" story, doesn't mean romance can't fit into it. Yin x Hei's relationship remains a mystery for now, but obviously seeing the huge fandom surrounding Yin and Yin x Hei fans, I'm sure they're gonna take it up to the next level soon enough---merchandise sells after all. :heh:

xKeen
2009-11-16, 03:29
Just watched this episode.Firstly the song when the bullet was shot was great.
Didn't go through the pages so here goes.Hei wants to kill a woman,it isn't yin.But the person can be found in Tokyo...Can't think currently,need more information D:
The stuff those people(forgot the group name,13 something) are shitting up the system imo.I don't like how hei's powers are gone but about yin gaining abilities,I don't know anymore...
July is extremely cute,running with the bottle everywhere and his messy hair at Hei's house.

Shinji103
2009-11-16, 03:46
Didn't go through the pages so here goes.Hei wants to kill a woman,it isn't yin.But the person can be found in Tokyo...Can't think currently,need more information D:I suggest you read through the pages then, before going down that line of thought. Because that's all already been cleared up.........

xKeen
2009-11-16, 07:57
Just read through it,couldn't find answers (I don't think I even asked one).My english sucks,so...I don't understand most of the posts here...

miroku2192
2009-11-16, 08:20
Just read through it,couldn't find answers (I don't think I even asked one).My english sucks,so...I don't understand most of the posts here...

Read the previous page lawl (page 11). We already talked about which girl Hei was referring to, and the evidence all points to Yin as being that girl.

May i ask, where are you from?

Irkalla
2009-11-16, 12:15
So I take that Suou is falling for Hei now too? And she got jelaous over Yin, oh how cute it would have been if I shipped any of the two XD

Sinestra
2009-11-16, 12:32
So I take that Suou is falling for Hei now too? And she got jelaous over Yin, oh how cute it would have been if I shipped any of the two XD

I dont think i would assume she is falling fo Hei. It seems to be Suou has not experience in matters of the heart and this would be the second time she has come across something that has to do with Love. I do think she is seeing another side of Hei though. This was possibly the first time she saw Hei have compassion. I think she is curious about what Hei is really like. But i must admit that kick looked like a form of jealously to me as well which was took me by surprise.

This episode left me with many more questions than answers. I did not expect to see Yin in such a state and how it come to pass im sure will be revealed. Also they finally acknowledged that Hei has lost his powers (which sucks cause i miss him kicking ass)

Also they made a refrenece to Suous friends the one that became a contractor and the boy who i am assuming is dead after that bloody bug scene but it kind of went no where and Suou has not really thought much about them since about episode 3 or 4. Also the death of the mother shocked me as well im not sure of the reason she was terminated i will have to watch it again.

Good episode we finally we get back to Tokyo but now that Hei's powers are gone what use do they have for him? I sense another show down between certain forces on one side and contractors on the other.

The cake ending scene was weird and didnt really do much for me.

8/10

EadTaes
2009-11-16, 15:53
Suou is getting infatuated by Hei. It's tipical thing that can happen to young girls. At that age girls are easy to get attached to an older adult male that takes care of them and they will interpret this as love because of their lack of experience with it. My GF was going on about this when she saw this episode so this post is mostly her veiw of the situation. I just happen to agree with it and decided to post it for you guys to enjoy.

That kick Suou made was indeed a kick out of jealousy. She is in a way trying to mark her turff saying Hei is hers and whats best about ti is that Suou doesn't know she's doing it because of that.

Okay lets start at the first important Suou and Hei point fot he episode. Where Hei calls her by her name. Every one here knoew what significance it has in japan what name you use with each other. It marks distinc relationship levels. How ever Hei is Chinesse, or Korean whatever he's not Japanesse. Suou is Russian so for them thsi should not have such meaning but it is a jap anime. How ever before that point Hei always only adresed Suou to give her orders and things to do and train. And there for never called her name and hence never acknologed her. And by finaly calling her name he acknologed her and that trigered something.

Secondsly Suou found out things about Hei's pass from Mao and a bit from Hei him self. This helped her connect to hima nd realise soem fo the things she said in episode 3 to Hei were wrong.
In fact the most flagrant realisations he got fo that is when Noiro's mom gets killed and Noiro blames Suou for it. In his spite toward her he spits out teh exact same words she told Hei in episode 3 rigth before Hei hits her. Her face when she hears that tells the whole story of her revelation. and makes her realise with all that has happen up to that point that she has been wrogn about Hei all allong. That she judge him without knowing him.

The next important moment is the cooking scene. 3 things happen here. First Hei tells Suou that he will not make her kill anythign anymore. This is very important since it means he will not force her to do things such as killign anymore and Suou still deeply cares about life. And secondly Hei who has been up till now simply giving order to Suou and telling her: "THIS IS HOW IT IS BECAUSE I SAID SO" has conceded to 2 of her demands. Well 3 but one is trivial. First the trivial demand, Suou complains that canned meat reack of metal, Hei fixes that problem with the lats of his liquor.
Secondly and the first inportant one, Hei accepts her terms that he will stop drinking so Suou stops shooting. She realise the Hei she was eeing was not the real one and she now wants to see the real Hei so she demands he stops drinkign and he agrees.
Thirdly Suou asked for vegetables and once again Hei conceded to her. This to her means he cares about her enought to listen to her. this is the first reason why she is getting closer to Hei he has listen to her and taken care of her.

Then we have the scene of Yin ghost tryign to hug Hei. Makes Suou realise unconsiously she has competition and she gets protective of her caretaker.

xKeen
2009-11-16, 18:42
Read the previous page lawl (page 11). We already talked about which girl Hei was referring to, and the evidence all points to Yin as being that girl.

May i ask, where are you from?

I see...I'm from malaysia.
EDIT : Oh,I saw that xD Ok I'm sorry and thanks.

Jetbent
2009-11-16, 20:02
Yeah... definitely found myself wanting Hei to be with Yin in the first series, but since she's been out of the picture, I have the inexplicable desire for Hei to hook up with Suou. Though these things are frustrating because the 13 year old never gets the 20 year old guy. And by the way, anyone notice how all of these shows star 20 year-old 40 year-olds? I turn 20 in a month and a half, and I just don't see how some of these protagonists can graduate high school, then become a General in the army, then a renegade pirate, then a fantastical alchemist in 2 years... so there's that unrelated tidbit.

Rasengan
2009-11-16, 21:06
All this romance thing is annoying. Does anyone share the same opinion as me that Hei just shouldn't end up with anyone in a relationship? They can all be his friend or treat him as a mentor of some kind. It just doesn't match Hei's character to stay in a romantic relationship with someone... which is why this season hasn't been as enjoyable as the first season for me =(

On a side note, I'd like to know more about Hei's sister, season 1 didn't do a good job of explaining what she really is...

Zwei
2009-11-16, 23:34
All this romance thing is annoying. Does anyone share the same opinion as me that Hei just shouldn't end up with anyone in a relationship?

I wouldn't really mind that but then again I wouldn't mind if he ended up with someone either. *cough* Misaki *cough* :heh:

They can all be his friend or treat him as a mentor of some kind. It just doesn't match Hei's character to stay in a romantic relationship with someone... which is why this season hasn't been as enjoyable as the first season for me =(

Hei is currently not in a romantic relationship with anyone as far as I know and right now he's basically Suou's mentor, so I don't see why it shouldn't be enjoyable just as much, it fits your criteria perfectly.

On a side note, I'd like to know more about Hei's sister, season 1 didn't do a good job of explaining what she really is...

Taken from wikipedia;

Hei's younger sister. Pai is the Contractor responsible for the disappearance of Heaven's Gate five years prior to the story's setting and had since vanished. The Messier code BK-201 belongs to her star. Pai's abilities are said to be vast, with generating abnormal electricity as only the tip of the iceberg. In addition to this, she also has the power of molecular reconstruction. Her remuneration is to sleep. At the time of the Heaven's War in South America, Hei was constantly together with Pai during their many operations, acting as a bodyguard of sorts. It was for Pai's sake that Hei originally joined the Syndicate. When the Heaven's Gate disappeared, Pai's power became Hei's, because—according to Amber—she continues to exist within him. Hei himself remains oblivious to the fact, until the very end. Her another name is revealed at the end: Xing (which may in this instance mean "star".)

I think we know enough though, or is enough never enough? :heh:

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-17, 00:57
@EadTaes -- Lots of perceptive stuff from you and your GF about Suou. Thanks. One thing: Suou's mother was Japanese, so she probably understands more Japanese culture than your average Russian. Of course, in this show and lots of anime, everyone seems to understand each other, whatever language they are supposed to be speaking.

Also, through the first series they made a point of not confirming that Hei was really Chinese, just that he could speak Japanese very well (I think the landlady said that). But at the end when he called his sister Xing (as Zwei just pointed out), it made it seem they really were Chinese. Anyway, he was very acculturated to Japan, so would know what using a personal name meant. I think he is thinking of Suou like a little sister, but it could become more, I suppose.

@Zwei -- At the end of season one, Pai said "sayonara" to Hei, but he still had powers after she left. Is she still within him, or did she really mean "good-bye forever"? Did he still have all her powers, or did he use them up at the end there when he used them to divert the anti-contractor weapon? Did he lose all his powers to the Yin weapon or just the electric power? Did Suou just get the rifle power or did she get all, or at least more, of Hei's powers? I am not sure about any of these questions.

@JetBent -- Yeah. In anime, people grow up really fast, look older than they are, and get impossible skills in no time, lol. In Phantom, I kept thinking Reiji was about 25, when he turned out to be 16 (at the start).

@Rasengan -- I am happy to see romance break out in anime at any time, but if none does here, that will be okay, too. I'm just waiting for them to keep wowing me with whatever they do, as they have so far.

MushroomSamba
2009-11-17, 01:35
Norio is bordering on Raki-level annoyingness.

Other than that, frickin' sweet episode. Yin is back! Well, sorta.

Zwei
2009-11-17, 01:39
@Zwei -- At the end of season one, Pai said "sayonara" to Hei, but he still had powers after she left. Is she still within him, or did she really mean "good-bye forever"?

According to Amber, Pai still lives on within Hei. I haven't rewatched S1 in a while though, but maybe by that "Sayonara" she really meant "Stop chasing after my shadow and make your meaningless life more meaningful" so I don't know but I'm going by Amber's theory. :heh:

Did he still have all her powers, or did he use them up at the end there when he used them to divert the anti-contractor weapon? Did he lose all his powers to the Yin weapon or just the electric power? Did Suou just get the rifle power or did she get all, or at least more, of Hei's powers? I am not sure about any of these questions.

I am not sure either and I don't think there's an answer for them yet but hopefully we'll get our questions answered soon.

Yeah. In anime, people grow up really fast, look older than they are, and get impossible skills in no time, lol. In Phantom, I kept thinking Reiji was about 25, when he turned out to be 16 (at the start).

Really? I thought he looked quite young though and only looked older when he let his hair grow out in the middle of the series. :heh:

Full Metal Coast
2009-11-17, 01:46
@EadTaes
@Zwei -- At the end of season one, Pai said "sayonara" to Hei, but he still had powers after she left. Is she still within him, or did she really mean "good-bye forever"? Did he still have all her powers, or did he use them up at the end there when he used them to divert the anti-contractor weapon? Did he lose all his powers to the Yin weapon or just the electric power? Did Suou just get the rifle power or did she get all, or at least more, of Hei's powers? I am not sure about any of these questions.



ive always taken that as a goodbye becaue it would be the last time that they see each other but as long as Hei has powers there will always be a trace of Pai within him.

Jetbent
2009-11-17, 01:56
hmm... another thing... anime characters don't look like any nationality :) jk. Yeah... what I don't understand is how Hei went from being a man of action at the end of S1, to an essentially drunken baby in S2... where was the indication at the finale of S1 that Hei was going to become a loser? Granted, he seems to be changing for Suou (since he hasn't hit her in a while... Eep!)... and what's her deal? Is she going to be a contractor like Hei who can feel emotion? And how did his powers disappear again? He had them an episode or two ago didn't he?... did they disappear when he opened the truck or something?

risingstar3110
2009-11-17, 03:20
Interesting episode. The action is quite good, but how could that guy (Genma) break through the asphalt road, and even can cause a earth slitting move? :heh:

Now back to the romance/character development. I am happy that Hei stopped his emotionless hobo mode, and started to live his life again. Must be tired for him to act cold all these time.
It's nice to see Suou start to open up for him as well, and must start to like him. A little bit jealous in the end as we expected (it's cute through ^^). But maybe a little bit of anger as well due to various reasons (she could kill Norio's mother, and she may abandoned Hei...).

Well, i am sort of like Hei xSuou and found their interaction interesting. Would be heartwarming seeing Hei taking care of Suou, then Suou' secret crush (if it ever spring) would be cute too watch. About serious relationship, maybe a time skip to when Suou in her high school will be more worth shipping (the chance to see it is slime through). But for now, seeing their interaction and all the subtext joke is good enough :D

I also sort of like Hei and Yin's relationship. However i won't like the idea of it turning to be a romantic one (from current "nakama/comrade"). Unless Yin somehow can escape her doll state, any further relationship is not possible to think of

forgottendiary
2009-11-17, 03:48
I also sort of like Hei and Yin's relationship. However i won't like the idea of it turning to be a romantic one (from current "nakama/comrade"). Unless Yin somehow can escape her doll state, any further relationship is not possible to think of

3 letters: OVA

JackRydden224
2009-11-17, 03:53
It'll just be weird if Hei calls Suou by her last name since it's pretty long...I think the significance here is that Hei acknowledges her as a person instead of his mission which leads to my next point. The dynamics of their relationship is now completely different now they are out for their own goals. If Hei continues to train her it will be for her own safety instead of orders.

risingstar3110
2009-11-17, 04:01
3 letters: OVA
I still hold my point through...

forgottendiary
2009-11-17, 04:27
I still hold my point through...

But it's not necessarily not possible anymore.

Joe_fh
2009-11-17, 04:42
I think at that moment Hei called her by her name to give it more impact. If he tried to say it in the usual way she wouldn't notice it at first and it was a matter of seconds. When someone calls you by your name suddenly you usually stop doing what you're doing and so it's a good way to attract attention. Because of this I really don't think Hei put that much meaning into it like the Japanese meaning.
Of course there are other valid reasons for him to coninue to call her that and they don't have anything to do with this but in that moment I really think he did it to get her attention fast.

Eisdrache
2009-11-17, 05:00
I think that Norios mom was a pretty interesting contractor. They showed us with Tanya that contractors loose all their feelings and only think rational but his mother seems to be aware of her sons feelings.

edit: I loooooooooove the glasses girl from section ...3? 6? Damn. She is hot! Also when they showed her in the submarine (or was that in EP5) she looks scary D: Oh and Im a fag for the twins :3

orion
2009-11-17, 09:05
First the trivial demand, Suou complains that canned meat reack of metal, Hei fixes that problem with the lats of his liquor.


Actually, if someone is an alcoholic, then it's not a trivial thing. That's pretty significant to use the last of your stash for cooking purposes and then concede not to drink anymore.



Then why the oxygen mask?


To keep her brain alive.

Kaoru Chujo
2009-11-17, 12:07
According to Amber, Pai still lives on within Hei....I just rewatched s1 and Amber said that before Pai said goodbye.
They showed us with Tanya that contractors loose all their feelings and only think rational but his mother seems to be aware of her sons feelings.Someone in s1 -- I think it was November11 -- said that contractors don't lose their emotions, they just don't base their decisions on them. I think both seasons have been a bit inconsistent about this, but that's what he said.

PiggyBank
2009-11-17, 12:57
Someone please shoot Norio already. He's starting to become the anime version of Jar Jar Binks. He'd better play some significant role for all this screentime he's getting.
Hopefully, all this screentime is to build up for the tragic death scene. Instead of the awful alternative of him suddenly developing contractor powers and tagging along as part of the gang. :heh:
Don't even scare me like that! :eek:

Apart from that, great episode. Loved the little kitchen scene between Suou and Hei. Ok, it's possible that she's changing her attitude towards Hei a bit rapidly but hey, it's not like she jumping to hug him already. She just seem to be confused with his behaviour and starts to notice some degree of humanity in him.

I found Hei hitchhiking a ride on a roof rather amusing.
And did anyone notice how much sugar July puts into Mao's tea???

JackRydden224
2009-11-17, 15:01
Someone in s1 -- I think it was November11 -- said that contractors don't lose their emotions, they just don't base their decisions on them. I think both seasons have been a bit inconsistent about this, but that's what he said.

In the manga Harvest said that contractors don't lose their emotions ; contractors will only act on what makes rational sense.

Michiru's case is different then Suou's and Tanya's. Michiru has been a contractor for however old Norio is but the two girls have only recently became contractors. I'm guessing that "veteran" contractors have their way around things, such as showing emotions or what not.

Anh_Minh
2009-11-17, 18:25
I think that Norios mom was a pretty interesting contractor. They showed us with Tanya that contractors loose all their feelings and only think rational but his mother seems to be aware of her sons feelings.

edit: I loooooooooove the glasses girl from section ...3? 6? Damn. She is hot! Also when they showed her in the submarine (or was that in EP5) she looks scary D: Oh and Im a fag for the twins :3

I think it shows the difference in the relationships. Tanya's kept her dim awareness of Mika's feelings - she just doesn't care. She must have felt flattered and curious about the love confession, and she liked him a bit, but that's all. So when she became a contractor, all that ceased to matter.

Michiru, OTOH, did the rational thing to protect her son - by going away. She could easily do that because, as a contractor, her love wasn't the same as an attachment.

Sinestra
2009-11-18, 20:06
I think it shows the difference in the relationships. Tanya's kept her dim awareness of Mika's feelings - she just doesn't care. She must have felt flattered and curious about the love confession, and she liked him a bit, but that's all. So when she became a contractor, all that ceased to matter.

Michiru, OTOH, did the rational thing to protect her son - by going away. She could easily do that because, as a contractor, her love wasn't the same as an attachment.

This is what i also felt about Michiru's character so it did not surprise me that her character acted in such a way. One thing as mentioned that we learn about contractors is their feelings cease to motivate their actions unlike normal humans where emotion drives majority of our actions, therefore if its not rational to a contractor they wont bother. Although becoming a contractor changes the way feelings are perceived with them you can not remove human instinct in this case it would be a mothers connection to her child. A childs love for a mother is rational and vice versa. She did not show affection in the traditional sense but trying to protect her sons feelings made sense because of the bond a mother and child share. Logic dictated Michiru's actions after she become a contractor right to her reunion with her son and sadly her death. Tanya's situation was different as Anh_Minh stated. Analyzing how she acted before she became a contractor and afterwords gave a pretty clear picture of why she acted the way she did. At least thats how i interrupted situations.

DragoZERO
2009-11-18, 21:47
I think I should have guessed that it was Yin. I thought it was Amber actually, with the way they were referring to her as Hei's girl. I was expecting a new character to be in there too. Guess I missed that, huh? lol.

I really really really want to know what happened in this two year gap. Luckily there are OVAs bundled or included as extras on the DVD/BD of the first season (nice marketing idea).

Amirali
2009-11-19, 11:50
I have spoilers and pics for today's episode. Should I post here or wait for thread?