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Shirley: The Tragic Angel
Was Shirley Doomed from the Start?
Was Shirley Doomed from the Start?
At Cosmic Eagle's suggestion, I present to you the thread to discuss whether or not Shirley was truly doomed to die. Do you think there was something or some things that could have been done to preven her death, or do you think it was inevitable?
As for me, well if that's what Okouchi and Taniguchi had decided, then yeah I'd say she was pretty much doomed from the start. Seriously though, it's kinda hard to say. I guess you could say that Shirley was doomed the moment she fell in love with Lelouch if you believe in the whole "fate" thing. However, you could also say that any number of things could've been done differently to prevent her death, but perhaps her's and Lelouch's worlds were incompatible and couldn't combine, so even if she hadn't had that fateful meeting with Rolo she may have met her end some other way. In fact the whole "different worlds" thing may have ended up really hurting Shirley, she may not have been able to take Lelouch's world and it may have done more harm than good, so perhaps it was a mercy killing.
But really, what I think...I dunno. I'm not a huge believer in fate, so I'm more leaning towards the "any number of things could have been done differently" angle. Shirley could have NOT been passing that sidewalk when Jeremiah used his Geass Canceller. Shirley could have NOT run into the mall. Shirley could have NOT run into Rolo. And any of these changes could have at least allowed her to live longer. But it didn't. Everything happened the way Okouchi and Taniguchi decided, whether it was sensible or not, and the end result...well, it just sucks.
So what do you think?
she wasn't really doomed the moment she's in love with with lulu.
she was actually doomed the moment she knows the truth(lulu is zero) in R2. if she didn't had her memories back, she'd prolly end up like rivalz, still studying at ashford.
because she knows the truth about lulu, while not fully knowing rolo's ability, she was then just doomed... unfortunately.
Yeah, that's probably true. Of course it does go all the way back to the first season when she first found out Lulu's identity, when she was at that battle in episode 13 (wait a minute, why was she there in the first place? Coincidence?) Unfortunately, as an outside source trying to make it into Lulu's "real" world, it just didn't work out.
sure it goes back to R1, but i didn't see her dying back then, the closest person that actually would kill shirley in R1 would be mao(thank god that CC stopped him
but in R1, we didn't have the person like rolo, who's by far more dangerous than mao in killing ability.
so basically her death depends on the situation, i mean if mao and rolo switched geasses, then... well she prolly would have died in R1.
Well, with Mao and Rolo it's just apples and oranges. They had different motives and different reasons for hurting her, plus there wasn't anyone their to interfere with Rolo. I've actually developed this long, convoluted and completely unnecessary theory from a scientific perspective as to why and how Shirley died. But for another day.
I've felt that the moment Shirley decided to stand by Lelouch at whatever the cost, despite knowing his secret, pretty much sealed his fate. Even if Mao, or Rolo did not get her, something else would to completely break or kill her. Logically speaking, her death was a stupid, stupid case of terrible luck but if you think about it, had she lived, she would likely have wound up in more such situations. And at the end when Lelouch commited suicide, there is a high chance she would have as well.
ya... somehow i just don't see her in a BK uniform... it doesn't fit her nice characteristic..
The same could more or less be said of Euphie..... In fact, I was surprised that Nunnally lived at all.
i'm sure all of us were shocked/surprised to see her alive after the flejia event when we thought she died
And unfortunately the explanation wasn't all that satisfying either. Well, at least it wasn't as bad as Guilford.
But I wonder, if Shirley hadn't died, would Lelouch have started Zero Requiem? What would've happened if Shirley lived? Would Lelouch still be alive? Because the attack on the Geass Cult was not as originally planned, but Lelouch changed his original plan due to what had happened to her. And wasn't the Geass Cult attack also a part of why he started Zero Requiem? sorry if thats not right...
if she didn't die, then pretty much everything after epi 14 is different since VV and bartley would still be alive, we won't know CC's deathwish, and BK would be less suspicious with lelouch since he didn't massacre the people in the cult, and so the plot will be a lot more different.
Yep, what fishfood said. Who knows if there even would've been a ZR. I still like the idea that someone proposed of Shirley joining the Black Knights, but always messing up due to her inexperience, resulting in some funny moments
@fishfood: thats true, it might have been a lot less tragic in the end if she had lived. Then again, lets not forget, Euphie's death was also a very sad moment, and that couldnt be overlooked, so it might have been different with Shirley around, but without Euphie...
@nobodyman: That is a cute idea! Sounds like good fanart/fanfiction material....anyone?
Well Shirley never was doomed to die but do to the changes that occured, her death seemed possible. If Rolo hadn't killed Shirley she would have died in another sad way.
I really don't think Shirley was doomed from the start either! Just if Orange-kun hadn't fired his geass canceller and she haddent seen Lelouch, and didn't pick up the gun, she'd still be amongst us!
I really hate it when others say "Oh it was just something to move the plot along." BS!! I think things would've, could've ended diffrently, and BETTER all the way around!
Also I'd a LOVED to see Shirley as a Black Knight! I said it in the thread; "Oh give her a little atitude and a catfight with Kallen and we'd have Shirley the Fierce!" and YES I do think Shirley could've taken Kallen!
I agree that she was doomed the moment she regained her memories,
But she did seem pretty set up since the first season, with all that trouble with Mao. Either way a plot device, is a plot device.
From the start, she was doomed.
First mistake, being friends with that psycho named Lelouch that we all know and love. Not that I don't like him, but he's kinda nuts.
Damn you Lelouch! Making friends with Shirley!
You can say Shirley would not have been doomed to die (or at least die that early) had that freaking immature Rolo not exist in the 1st place. He's a freaking plague.
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