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Glorious Asylum of Magnificent TAKdom for Beneficial Discussion of Random Shenanigans
Say, do we actually have Gundam fans here?
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Say, do we actually have Gundam fans here?
I am asking because most of us come from the Frontier forums. Whenever I go online, if you put Macross & Gundam in the same search bar, you get a list of almost pointless VS threads but never something involving a genuine appreciation for both franchises. It appears as if you can like one franchise but not the other. I know there are people who love both, like myself, but they seem to be a silent crowd.
I can't help but wonder, do we have any Gundam fans here?
Î never got into that universe. Must be because of incessant whiner Kira, who was my first exposure to it.
Seed and Seed destiny are like my guilty pleasures, TM being in them is great too :P. There's a lot of things I dislike in those series but somehow I ended up enjoying it. I was recommended Unicorn too, and I'm loving Banagher and Audrey so far. I tried 00 and couldn't get into it, same with AGE. Though I LOVE 8th MS team, Aina and Shiro were the most romantic. I guess its Gundam is another outlet to get my fix...
Wing was my first Gundam. I only saw the OVA for it though. I've seen bits and pieces of Seed and Seed Destiny once they were dubbed... but I don't really it. The very first one was an interesting series though. Like Macross, the originals are better than the later versions... weird.
Gundam - The 8th MS Team, Gundam 0080 - War in The Pocket and Gundam 0083 - Stardust Memory are some of my favoritest things, ever.
Also, Char Aznable rules.
The other series receive wildly varying degrees of appreciation (even though I've never watched a single episode of Seed/Destiny, myself), and Unicorn and Age appeal to different sentiments.
All in all, me likes it. Don't see a reason for bickering amongst fanbases, but to each their own...
8th MS Team is definitely one of my favorite. I even dare say the characters in there proved to be more likable than probably any other characters who existed in the UC era.
I also highly appreciate Unicorn. The characters are a bit old-school, but that was intentional.
Favorite series in Gundam had always been SEED/DESTINY for me, but that was mostly because of Lacus & Kira, and I like small military organizations (or the underdog, if you will).
Gundam 00 was pretty nice, except the abuse of Deus Ex Machina, special powers and a pretty absurd plot, which takes conspiracy levels to a new, if not impossible, height. I've always thought either Marie/Soma or Allelujah would not survive the end of second season, but I was delightfully proven wrong. Although secondary characters, I'd argue they had more development than the rest of the cast in 00. Episode 6 (IIRC) of second season proved to be a highlight for me in that series.
I dug 00, as well. Haven't seen the movie yet, tho.
The movie features probably the single
Gundam battle to date. Its nowhere near the scale of Macross battles, but very impressive by Gundam standards. Its basically humanity's last stand, and a very well produced one, at that.
For discussion of action: Macross has forever outweighed Gundam. Be it the animation quality or the overall enjoyment, Macross has forever overshadowed Gundam. Yet Gundam is more popular than Macross.
I think the lack of impressive and memorable fights in Gundam is what erases it from my mind a lot. I've always enjoyed the mecha in Macross more for impressive the fights are. DYRL is one of my favorite mecha movies of all time. No Gundam has come close so far, even by viewing anime music videos of various Gundam series, I can't find one. If you have one, go ahead and share it with me.
I've never really paid attention to romance in Gundam. It didn't seem to be a large part of the franchise like it was for Macross. Although there were some interesting ones that I noted briefly in SEED whilst watching it on broadcast in America, they were nothing compared to even Zero. So I can easily say I wasn't a shipper for Gundam. Frontier is the first major ship I've ever had besides InuYasha and Rurouni Kenshin - both of which I loved and won.
Wing wasn't overall impressive. Actually, if my memory is correct, it wasn't a very popular Gundam either... Doesn't shock me. The plot alone is hard to follow even just for the first ten episodes that I sampled on YouTube a year back. Yes, I was watching the dubs all along but I don't think that changes the plot. But the main hero (ironically named Hero) interested me with his aloof personality. I actually liked him. But what shocked me was the girl that I assume he'll even end up with - although Wiki says otherwise - (whose name doesn't ring a bell at this time) who helps him even though he tried to kill her. Am I wrong to think that is just stupid and badass at the same time?
SEED grabbed my attention for a few episodes and then just became a boredom series to watch on nights when there was nothing else on TV. Perhaps the reason for this is the animation quality is very different from Wing. The characters looked very different and it was hard to swallow.
Then again, I speak as a person who avoided BLEACH for almost all its airing years, forgot completely about DYRL being broadcasted on Starz back in 2005, and avoided Macross like a plague until Frontier. Gundam is bound to have this impression on me too. Series that I saw when I was younger don't give me a better impression as I get older.
(Sailor Moon is one of those series that try as you might... you never forget. The anime was ridiculous but the manga is semi-decent.)
Yet Gundam is more popular than Macross.
Because a new Gundam is always in the works, and a new series would be released every year or every other year. The AU settings for Gundam also made it rather convenient for studios to press the
all the time. Macross on the other hand, is a continuation, and I think we should keep it that way. OTOH, Amuro and Char definitely had a greater impact in anime history than Hikaru. Of course, if Macross was primarily
Max, then it might have been a different story...
As for your comment about SEED, just remember, that series created perhaps the 2 most popular characters & pair of the 21st century, yet. Sure, SEED/DESTINY's animation quality is not on par its successors, but the characters are a whole different story.
That's one of the reason why the animation for the whole franchise is bad and varies. They've even canceled a few over the years due to budget problems. Because they do so many back-to-back series, fans don't get a break to truly appreciate the series. Plus, they don't take long to produce the next series, thus the plots and scripts are horrible. I lost interest in SEED for this reason.
I think Macross is better in this case. It leaves an impact both mecha and romance, makes you want more but gives you time to warm up to the idea there is another series to come. By the time the next one arrives, it is a pleasant start.
Gundam doesn't really do this. As soon as one ends, the next one starts. There's no breathing room. The franchise suffers greatly from this but yet it still remains so popular.
In a way, the series is similar to Pokemon and Digimon... endlessly back-to-back with horrible plots and scripts.
For your comment about SEED, I never stated that I disliked the series or characters. I hope you didn't take it that way. I lost interest in it. That could be for multiple reasons that I can't fully remember right now, for my last viewing of the series was on television in 2005, around the same time InuYasha and S-cry-ed was airing on the Adult Swim of Cartoon Network. That's a while ago for me. To be honest, the animation quality was most of it. I like series with fair quality that stays structured throughout the entire series with minor flaws here and there. SEED did not live up to this expectation... For that purpose, InuYasha received my most attention and introduced me into the world of shipping.
However, nothing beats Cowboy Bebop for me. God, I miss Spike...
You might actually try some of the older (and newer) series before spouting that they all have horrible scripts. Just a heads up.
The original was fine. The others besides the two I mentioned, I've only sampled certain episode clips on YouTube of. So far, I cannot see myself watching any others in the future. I might sample 00 when I find time though... it looked interesting based on summaries flying around the Internet.
I've seen 008th MS Team, Unicorn (slightly behind on it though), 00, and parts of Turn A Gundam (the latter is another of the things I've picked up bits and pieces during my inconsistent attendance at a university anime club).
008th MS Team and Unicorn are both really good, but I wasn't too fond of 00. It was like it was trying to be "relevant" but ended up coming across as ridiculous instead. Plus it was kind of super robot-ish.
As for Turn A Gundam, that was... a bit odd. From what I understand the main character's tendency to end up in drag was a protest against the executive decision that the series wouldn't be allowed to have a female as the main character. :lol:
I have to argue though, Turn A Gundam was probably the most beautiful Gundam ever supervised by Tomino himself, surpassing all of his track records. It was a Gundam series with
Though I am not sure
rumor regarding female main characters is true. If Turn A had a female protagonist, it really wouldn't work... not the way its already setup. As far as female protagonists go, there are plenty of Gundams with them.
Not really main protagonists, tho. But that's also true for Macross, actually...
Well, there is War in the Pocket...
"But that's also true for Macross, actually..."
Actually, there was one exception... the original PC game where it starred Komilia
The irony is that, Macross II featured a heroine who actually sidelined the male protagonist in terms of badassary.
I agree. I liked Ishtar but the main character was meant to be Hibiki. He just didn't live up to it. He was completely sidelined. Not to mention... the whole concept of the story was never fully explained before it ended, even knowing that it would not be considered a sequel in the end...
I have decided to peek at Gundam 00 today. Anyone wanna warn me of things before I see it? (For episodes one through five mostly.)
Not really. Gundam 00 came off to me as one of the best real-robot anime out there. Except the characters aren't all that interesting. Setsuna, especially, is about as alive as a wooden board. Funny, because its the secondary characters shine brighter than he did.
Hibiki just couldn't be badass... the way they set him up, as a reporter, pretty much acted as a stopper. He is also the only Macross male protagonist who never fired a single shot.
I'll give you my personal opinion regarding Macross II and let you agree to disagree with it, though I doubt we have many different opinions regarding the characters:
boring characters, weird love triangle, and horrible plot, but a watch worth it...
Had the series been longer and the plot more developed, I felt Hibiki could've shined as a main character and hero. He just recently became a pilot, as he so nicely mentions to his boss. But since it was only four episodes (or a movie depending on your view of it), he was pushed aside by the two females.
Of course you had Ishtar that was a bit confusing the entire time. Her character remained undeveloped through the entire four episodes. Though she turned to the side of good, her reasons for doing so are muffled by the time constraints. Take it like this: she's first afraid of Earth's culture, of its music, and of its people; then she accepts it, loves it, and protects it. But why? The only scene that comes close to explaining this is the concert she attended. Otherwise, her time with him really changed her that much? I really doubt it. But I do sense a sort of crush developing towards him in the series. Even that remained undeveloped.
Silvie was much better at piloting than him. She was also a more interesting character than either of the other two. She is a memorable character. She was completely badass. Any woman that can shoot into an enemy mother ship to rescue a girl she barely knows is badass to me. And she did it because Hibiki requested she do it. But I found her interest in men to be poor in taste. Between the general (or was that lieutenant) who is womanizing most of the time but crushes on her and the reporter who is interested only in his stories, I don't know which is worse. But I saw the ending of that coming...
I found it hard to consider Hibiki's interest in either girl as a "love interest." The series fell short in that category. Unlike the other two short series know as Plus and Zero, the series lacked potential for love interests based on the plot. So I never really cared which girl he picked, just as long as the plot was resolved. And, in a way, it was. Though they left a few explanations out, the plot reached its close.
The secondary character known as Feff seemed to be a more badass character than any of the others. He risked heaven and high hell to save Ishtar, even turned against his beliefs and ruler. In my opinion, I think he is the character I missed most. And he was the one with the smallest background history...
Overall, the series deserved at least two more episodes but the animation alone was bad in comparison to DYRL, its predecessor. The only reason I got to see it was because it got dubbed in English and broadcasted on Starz.
It is the only series not supported by Kawamori...
Back to 00, I watched the first episode.
So far, I find none of the characters to be interesting. Then again, this is the first episode...
It starts off much like Wing. There are similarities in the Gundam appearing with no explanation and suddenly attacking military grounds without stating why until later (although this one explains in the first episode whilst the other took quite a few). It starts out with a strange boy who is later revealed to be the enemy of the military. However, the difference is how the characters backgrounds are perceived. Whilst Setsuna's is shown in the first episode, Heero's doesn't come until later (and I haven't seen it yet).
Overall, it seems interesting. Albeit... is it just me or are there two seasons to this and a movie? I've only found the first season on YouTube with English subs. Isn't there a second season and a movie out there? Guess I'll have to look for them separately.
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