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0utf0xZer0 0utf0xZer0 is offline

Pretentious moe scholar

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Showing Visitor Messages 221 to 230 of 1029
  1. Triple_R
    2014-01-02 07:57
    I get what you're saying, I just can't help but think the new Rozen Maiden would have sold five times as much if it came out in 2008 or 2009. Really.
    You could very well be right about that. The popularity of the characters at the time would have made up for anything else.


    Second, if your theory is correct, I think it's the bleakness of the stories in Rozen Maiden and Watamote that give them this hard hitting quality and can drive off audiences. Otherwise... I realize Oreki is essentially an "anti-otaku" in outlook, but he did prove you can go deep into the headspace of a loner and get decent sales if your show is a little warmer in tone (it's not just a matter of romance... Rozen Maiden 2013 hinted at one too). Hence, I don't think you should really be trying to extend it to cover things like Sakurasou.
    Part of the reason why I added in Sakurasou is that it's lack of success is surprising to me, and I'm trying to determine what caused it. There honestly hasn't been that many great romances in anime lately, and Sakurasou had a pretty strong one (also one of the stronger "alternate possibility" romances). Mashiro is also very popular in moe competitions, so, yeah, Sakurasou's lack of commercial success is surprising to me.


    (Note, BTW, that the anime fandom has sometimes gotten behind extremely bleak stories about loners in the past. Hatedom aside, Evangelion alone proves that. But I think popular shows at the moment suggest this is no longer the "in" thing.)
    Agreed. Most of this is cyclical.
  2. Pocari_Sweat
    2014-01-02 01:40
    Check your PM.
  3. Triple_R
    2014-01-01 21:14
    With Sakurasou, I think it's most of the major characters, not just Ryuunosuke. You already mentioned Mashiro, but there's also how Sorata's dream is to become a video game-maker. That's pretty otaku-ish.

    As for a popular male otaku character - Well, there was Keima in KamiNomi. That show was somewhat popular, IIRC. Keima is strictly a VN otaku, of course, but that might still be enough for some viewers.

    What I've seen in recent years is a bit of a drift away from "Yuji Everyleads" that are just total Joe Averages, and towards characters that are a bit more otaku-ish in their passions and/or hobbies and/or personalities. I don't necessarily think this is good or bad (Yuji Everyleads aren't often memorable, of course), but I do find it interesting in any event.

    And I think this approach can work if you glamorize it a bit, or make it colorfully "over-the-top" (as we see with Ore no Imouto and KamiNomi), but if you play it very straight; if you play it very realistic; I think it can hit a bit too close to home.

    With Jun in Rozen Maiden, I think the writers did a great job of capturing a "nerdy" and somewhat reclusive young adult male that's a bit down on his luck career-wise, school-wise, friendship-wise, and romance-wise. For otakus going through hard times of their own in RL, it probably uncomfortably hits home pretty hard. I have to admit that even I myself felt a bit uncomfortable when I noticed some of my own weaknesses reflected in Jun. This makes for great writing, but it can also be a bit uncomfortable for some viewers.

    Anyway, it's just an idea I had. It might be more accurate to say that anime is more likely to succeed sales-wise if there's a layer of detachment between what it presents, and actual reality. In others, it helps to be a bit idealized, or a bit escapist, or a bit fantastical.
  4. Triple_R
    2013-12-31 23:37
    About the sales struggles of Outbreak Company, Watamote, Rozen Maiden, and Sakurasou...

    I think these are all related. I think they all hit a bit too close to home (Jun in Rozen Maiden applies here).

    For awhile there, it seemed like many otakus wanted to watch shows for otakus, by otakus, and about otakus. But that last one might be changing.

    I think that the anime industry might have taken the wrong lesson from Ore no Imouto. Ore no Imouto somewhat glamorized the otaku lifestyle, but it also made the main otaku characters the female leads (Kirino and Kuroneko). So otaku see their tastes reaffirmed by characters with character designs that also appeal to their tastes. So it's the best of both worlds, in a sense. It also creates a level of detachment that may be comforting (along with a glamorization rather than a strictly realistic approach).

    But I don't think that otakus necessarily want to watch a story focused around a male otaku that's a fair and realistic representation of a real world otaku. I think that might be a bit discomforting to them. And honestly, I don't blame them. Not everybody likes staring in the mirror for a long-time, seeing their strengths (but also their warts) reflected back at them. We like it when people share our interests, but we don't necessarily just want to see ourselves reflected back at us.

    It's interesting that Samurai Flamenco is also struggling. Possibly for the same reason (a show all about a huge tokusatsu fan).
  5. Klashikari
    2013-12-31 15:59
    While I do skim around 2ch and twitter, I can't vouch for most shows in general, that said, some things were noticeable as far as I checked.

    -NagiAsu: like I stated, Hikari didn't exactly leave a good early impression which was a bit detrimental. Combined with the fact that it is a 2 cour series, some people were expecting a very long "vendetta" with Hikari and the rest of the surface people. I can't say if it is the main reason for its very discreet popularity, but it was repeated quite a lot for the first two episodes.
    The other issue at hand is that another fraction of the audience wasn't interested in the romance developments from NagiAsu. Right from the first episode, they already made diagram of "who likes who" and when you had Miura and her friend showing up, the japanese audience was more or less wondering "what the hell is going on lol".

    -Outbreak Company: the wishful thinking setup might be appealing first, and while I enjoyed the eroge jabs and gag, from what I could see with JP comments is that OC presentation feels more like a mockery of the otaku fandom. I can't say I'm completely sure of that since this impression I had is based on vastly less JP samples than I had with NagiAsu...

    As for the rest, I'm as clueless as you are. I can always ask few japanese friends, although not all of them roam on 2ch, so I can't say the "data" I will have will be any pertinent in the big picture.

    Suffice to say, it is rather difficult to have relevant samples.
  6. Reckoner
    2013-12-31 14:42
    Don't know where you got that idea from, but I wasn't saying that IS2 selling well somehow takes away sales from a series like NagiAsu. My point is that if things like IS2 continue to sell in the industry, then it's hard for me to believe that the buying habits of otaku in general have much to do with anything pertaining to the actual story telling itself other than superfluous elements (i.e. fanservice, meta humor, moe, etc.), which of course makes it easier to stream out merchandise and extras for them.

    The anime industry isn't a zero sum game of success .
  7. Pocari_Sweat
    2013-12-30 10:49
    Does that "some people" crowd include me?
  8. Pocari_Sweat
    2013-12-29 12:53
    I'll make some comments based on your post to Triple R:

    TV shows:
    Shinsekai Yori - no brainer.
    Sakurasou no Pet na Kanojo - about as good as Toradora to me. Which means I liked it, but less than what some others did.
    Dansai Bunri no Crime Edge - only saw the first episode and was put off by it lol.
    Uchouten Kazoku - excellent series. Best PAW production since True Tears albeit very different to what they normally do.
    Rozen Maiden: Zuruckspulen - got about halfway and plan to finish it. Probably the best of the Rozen Maiden adaptations as it has a much more sombre tone.
    Watamote - great series. Best awkward "black comedy" since Welcome to the NHK.
    Monogatari Second Season - I'm pretty much done with monogatari franchise atm. Dropped it after Nise and Kuro after it turned into a full out harem.
    White Album 2 - True tears style romance done by a different production team and studio. Loves it to bits. However, lack of production values and "artistic" merit brings it slightly down compared to it and ef tale of memories, which I consider the two giants in seinen romance drama.

    Wolf Children - favourite Hosoda movie. For some reason I love sentimental familial themes even though I'm not a parent or anything.
    Madoka Magica: Rebellion - haven't seen any of the madoka movies actually. I should remedy this.
    Hanasaku Iroha: Home Sweet Home - great movie. spent most of the time on the stuff which made me like the tv series, though I could do less of Yuina being obnoxious and annoying and Nako's kids causing unnecessary drama.
  9. Pocari_Sweat
    2013-12-29 06:21
    Interesting list. Mine is here.

    My list tells me that I actually didn't watch much this year
  10. Pocari_Sweat
    2013-12-29 04:33
    As for the Tamako Market sequel... no comment. I will watch it on the assumption that Tamako herself as a character was pleasant enough to continue on with the series/movie/ova (or whatever it is) even if the plot and rest of the characters suck.

About Me

  • About 0utf0xZer0
    Vancouver, Canada
    Pretentious moe scholarship, computers, PC gaming, brainstorming fantasy novels, animal-eared girls
    PC Configuration
    Laptop: Thinkpad X120e, AMD E-350, 6GB RAM, 11.6 inch screen Desktop1: 2.4 ghz Core 2 Quad, 4GB RAM, HD4770 512MB Desktop 2: Phenom II X4 BE at 3.4ghz, 6GB RAM, 8800GTS 512MB
    Avatar & Signature
    Avatar: Mashiro Mito (Tayutama) Signature composition by Ganbaru, original work by an unknown artist
    Currently Watching
    EF: A Tale of Memories/Melodies
    Moon Phase
    Shin Sekai Yori
    Iriya no Sora, UFO no Natsu
    Wolf Children
    Detroit Metal City
    Madoka Magica
    Ikoku Meiro no Croisee
    Hanasaku Iroha
  • Signature

    Signature courtesy of Ganbaru.


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  • Join Date: 2006-10-23


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