Character discussion - Makoto
 

The purpose of this thread is to provide a place to discuss all things Makoto related.
To keep the discussion enjoyable for all School Days fans, please follow the guidelines below and stay on-topic!

Note: Please don't use this for the specific episode / chapter / game talk, there are other threads for that stuff.

---

Thread Guidelines

• No campaigning!
  No "hate" or "xyz must die" posts. Discuss why you do or don't like characters without whining and whining or blatantly campaigning for your favourite.
  
  
• Be polite to your fellow forum members.
  Do not insult or harass other members for their likes and dislikes. Do not take it so seriously that you end up in an argument with another forum member because they express a fondness for a character you loathe. Discussion and good spirited banter is always welcome, but harassing people won't be tolerated.
  
  Makoto is a character that can cause very heated debates and i see high potential for possible flame wars with this one. Remember - this is a discussion, so people are bound to disagree with you. Please pay extra attention to the rule, as no insults towards other forum members will be tolerated.
  
  
  
• Discuss, not Chat.
  Please remember that AnimeSuki is a discussion forum, not a chat room, there is a difference. If you wish to chat, then please make use of our IRC channel (#animeuki) on ZiRC.
  
  
• Have fun, but post intelligently.
  It's great to have fun, but please try your best to add substance to what you post and make your thoughts interesting for the generation of fans that will follow after you’re long gone and on to watching some other series.

Spoiler Policy
Warning: It will be tempting to discuss the surprising endings from the game. Let's save such things for discussion in the thread for the game. Let's just say that some of the endings can be nasty and not say another word!

Due to the heavy nature of possible game spoilers we have decided to disallow any further posting of game spoilers in this thread, even under spoiler tags. Read the following rule for clarification:

Any spoiler/hints/discussion, even under the spoiler tags, from the game/manga that leads to the revealtion of any future events to the anime will be deleted from here on. Furthermore, the poster will also earn a ban to empasize the point that no spoiler will be tolerated in this thread.

You are still invited to use spoiler tags if you feel the need to.

• Adding a Spoiler tag:
  

  Just highlight your spoiler and click the button found on the "Quick Reply" and "Reply to Thread" forms. Make sure that you include a title for the spoiler!

• Please use the Report button if you see any spoilers:
  

  Click the button found to the left of the post, just under the poster's avatar. Using the Report button is anonymous and helps the Moderators to locate and deal with problems quickly.

• Posting prohibited spoilers may result in a ban.
  Note: Reporting a post does not mean the poster will be banned instantly.
  The Moderators will use bans if warnings are repeatedly ignored.

Thanks Skyfall, those threads I thought was really necesary

Well, Makoto isn't the best chracter. He's the most hated :heh: ~ he do all the things he want, as be Kotonoha's boyfriend and be Sekai's lover. But he don't mind about if Sekai's heart (or Kotonoha's heart) is hurter. Sex, sex n' sex is all is in his head. From episode 3 and more he's the most hated, why? becouse he wants girls, girls and girls but if he want other girl he ya don't mind about the other girls' heart.

A few days ago, we and a friend was watching one of the episodes, she said to me "He's like Takayuki" [Takayuki Narumi, Kiminozo] and I get up of the chair and say her, "MAKOTO ISN'T AS HE!" I have reasons,

• Takayuki yes mind about the girls' heart [You know, when Haruka... well, is spoiler and anything related to School Days]
• He wasn't a ecchi

I started out with an open mind, and thought that he would be the typical male lead for a romance series. After the two first episodes I figured he was an alright guy, just a little pushy, but I still cheered for him.
After I'd watched a few more episodes, I really started to *hate* him. This is in fact pretty rare, there are very few characters I actually hate, I dislike many, many annoy me, but I hardly ever hate them.

I think it's because I quickly developed feelings of affection towards both Kotonoha and Sekai, they're both very appealing and cute in their own way.
It just seemed to me that Makoto had no respect whatsoever for his Kotonoha.
- He's extremely pushy, he pretty much demands sexual contact.
- He doesn't try to see things from her point of view at all, even though he must know how shy she is.
- He's basically cheating on her (even he's not stupid enough to know that Sekai also likes him)
- He talks about her behind her back, to the other woman he's involved with, none the less.

I've only seen up to episode 4 at the moment, so my feelings might change after I've watched more of the show, but I doubt I'll ever grow to like Matoko again.
I guess I'm just fed up with the typical guy attitude, sex before everything, if he truly likes her, he would respect the fact that she needs time. Just being with her should bring him happiness, did he truly care for her.
Well, that's my take on it anyways. Cheers.

Stop hating Makoto. He is a dumb ass, but so what?

Quick summary:

He is an immature kid.

He realizes that he can get boners thus he gets boner frequently.

Chick in his school has big bewbs.

He likes her.

She likes him back.

His best friend sets him and the girl up.

He is happy as fuck.

His best friend kisses him. He is confused.

His inexperienced shows on his date.

He continues to be a douche by feeling up on her among other shit.

Still clueless as fuck.

Finds out that his relationship is not right. He does not understand why (obviously they are not compatible).

Best friend acts extremely hurt.

Not completely understanding why she is hurt, wanting to see her, and having a feel that seeing her would be the right thing.

They met up. Her bewbs are busting, because of the rain.

He realizes his mistake and declares he likes her.

They get horny. They do it.



That is the sum of the past 5 episodes. Give the kid a break. Most guys his age do not know how to act/behave around girls. Now add the fact he has 2 hot chicks wanting him. Add the fact that they constantly make out with him. Take all that and you get a confused, horny, little douche, who lets the smaller of his heads make the decisions.

mate you really need to stop saying that she "has big bewbs" as it is giving me the fcking creeps >.> you are beginning to sound like the makoto type yourself ~

its understandable that he is an immature brat virgin (okey before cause he got lucky...) who doesnt know crap about the world...this is NO excuse for him as a human being to do wrong...

its like saying a kid who killed someone shouldnt get punished because "they dont know anything yet" ~ kids dont normally go out and kill so it must be due to other influences (cough parents cough)

get this simple fact right ~ being clueless is not an excuse so i can hate him all i want *cheers* :D (besides this is all personal opinion so theres no point telling people to stop hating him...)

He's old enough to understand any and all of the things I dislike him for doing.
Why should I give him any breaks at all? The very, very least he could do is not get involved with 2 girls at once. What would be even closer to human decency would be to treat them with some respect, but this is of course merely a pipedream at the moment.

The "recipe" you listed, though I agree that we'd end up with a confused, horny douche, doesn't take into consideration that he would have to have been a douche to begin with as well, he's not a victim of circumstance.

Makoto's main fault imo is rushing Kotonoha. Other than going for Sekai before breaking up with Kotonoha that is, but Sekai can be blamed for that as well.

I don't think he's using Sekai only for sex. He obviously likes her more than Kotonoha, and his thoughts in episode 5 with the Sekai replays means that he obviously feels for her and is greatly affected by her actions. If all he thought about was sex, then he would've been affected more by Kotonoha's actions this ep, however he was obviously extremely bored of her.

Though a lot of people seem to hate this guy, I think he's one of the best characters in the series (in terms of making this show one of the most watched shows this season). Flawed characters are way more interesting than perfect characters. Contraversy is always interesting.

Like I said in another topic, being stupid is not an excuse for him to get away with the things he does, but rather the reason he's hated. "He's in high school" isn't an excuse; thank god people in HS didn't act like that.

^ Agreee, Kotonoha don't deserve that.

I was playing at StepMania as always, I put the OP of the game, that was the first time I really get the song. "Plastic lies" (I take it as the lies are he like Kotonoha and he love Sekai), "Paper/Plastic Heart" don't remember what was, Paper or Plastic ( I take the quote as one of the girls heart will be hurted, and I'm scared it will be Kotonoha's heart.)

>< Do you get it?

I blame both makoto and sekai, but that's because Makoto's an idiot, and Sekai let him be an idiot
And poor Kotonoha is totally oblivious to all of it T_T

Pretty much a synopsis of the plot so far, yeah. Makoto doesn't care, Sekai's probably has a little moral ground on him, but she's obviously not blameless.

When I first heard about this series and read all the information about him, I thought that he was just like any other anime male lead in a series, you know trying to hook up with the hot chicks, and try to scored with them. But when I started to look at the Anime and understand his character, the more I think that is the reason why that everybody hates him(he is become a legend, in a very wrong way). Not only he is playing with the girl that he original like heart but every other girl that likes him or cares for him like his friend and Setsuna.
He is the Legend know as Motoko, there is nobody that can come close to his status as a worthless piece of trash that was ever created. I look at alot of Anime in my lifetime and I see some of bad Anime characters but he takes the cake for the worst.

I agree, for a guy to be like Makoto is an ultimate failure in life. I mean, this guy goes for girls just for their physical attributes but not for "love" as he puts it himself. Even though Sekai did tempt him, I would say it's ultimately his own fault for choosing to "ride 2 boats at the same time", if you know what I mean :heh:

Oww my poor Kotonoha :sad:

You speak the truth. Sekai's also to blame, but the responsibility ultimately rests with Makoto.

I guess I disagree. If you have full knowledge of what you are doing wrong, you are no less to blame than someone else who made the same mistake.

If my girlfriend cheated on me with my best friend, I would hate the best friend as much as the girlfriend. Especially when the best friend made the first move - that is betrayal of the first order.

Makoto could have chosen to ride 2 boats at the same time, but one of those boats knows it is cheating on the other boat, and knows how hurt the other boat will be when it finds out - but did it anyway.

Also in Makoto's book, he doesn't like the other boat anymore anyway. I think by episode 5 he has fallen out of infatuation ( I won't say love) with Kotonoha.

I seem to understand where all that hatred for Makoto came from, somehow.

Judging from the latest episode, though, I would agree with the fact that both Makoto and Sekai are to be blamed for what has happened (if you consider it cheating on Kotonoha, which I do). It is indeed true Makoto can't control his own hormones and carnal impulses, but the fact of the matter is despite having a higher level of restraint, Sekai did initiate the thought of the possibility of attraction with Makoto with that kiss.

What's the man to do? Control himself, damn it.

What's the woman to do? Either just withhold you feelings and support him fully or go after him already, even before he hooked up with Kotonoha.

Well, I guess the conflict here is the charm of their relationships.

If you've read my posts in the general discussion thread then you would know that I hated episode two because of that date where Makoto just wants some action. Now I don't really mind, so maybe I'm getting used to his pervertedness. It's bound to happen.

huh.. what?! I don't intend to flame, but did we watch the same show? oO



as for Makoto, yes Sekai is indeed a factor, but does it make the mistake equal to his idiocy?
I beg to differ: Makoto is simply superficial, and can't overcome his horminal rage. I'm even wondering if Makoto wouldn't be attracted by Sekai even if she didn't kiss him or the like. (play the game, and you can tell how his twisted mind can lead you to...)

You do realize that many couples can be fine, while both persons are seducted by other persons as well? how so? well simply because they have WILLPOWER.

and High school isn't a fair arguement here, because even if guys at that period have hard time to deal with hormones and the like, it require basic COMMON sense to actually care of the other's feelings ans so forth.
The worst thing is episode 5, Makoto having no guilt despite Sekai repeats he already has kotonoha.

Makoto lives only with his present desire, and doesn't see anything in the middle and long term.

my head hurts...

you really need to pay more attention to the story in that case...makato and hiroki have nothing in common even with their give similar promises (wTH even that line is a lie he has nothing in common with this sulg...:twitch:)

there just isnt any comparing for makoto as in his case he is a total jerk...i think the only person who would even come close to a slight comparison is taka from kimi nozomu ~

My posts were nothing more than what I force myself to believe so that I could continue watching this anime. Please don't think that I'm trying to change your opinions, because I am not. It's just my own unique view of things because I always want to cut the main character some slack.

^ canvas spoiler ~

I dunno.

It'd be silly if he acts like a moron throughout the whole series, then he does -one- good thing in the end and we're supposed to look at him like a hero. I've seen that happen in other shows and to be honest I find it quite lame.

My only hope for Motoko at this point is that he does go through a period of growth where he starts to think about others feelings and not just his own. It would be pretty boring if he stayed the same way through the series and destroy my faith in man

well maybe not a hero but a better person...though it's still no excuse to forgive him if he leaves kotonoha in a mental hospital :frustrated:

I don't mean that though, of course he'll have to redeem himself...somehow.

Just that I've grown a bit tired of leads acting like utter douches throughout the entire story, and then because they get one thing right at the end, we're meant to think they're amazing, and everyone moves on, and they're all friends and happy after ever. A little too unrealistic, methinks. Not that I want a sad ending, I'm mostly complaining about the common leads, I guess, but I gotta admit we've been getting some decent ones lately; of course, Makoto is down there with the worst...

@Deathkillz - Tear is amazing. I'm playing ToTA, my first playthrough, but I plan to go on to unknown and do everything. Tear and Jade are my favourite characters, for different reasons. Jade's such an ass he's just hilarious.

Well, we'll never know since in the game, teh kiss happens regardless. Anyways, the game is really a different universe from the anime.

If a person has to resort to willpower to avoid cheating, I'd say their current partner is the wrong one for them. If you really love someone, then anyone other than your partner should not have the power to seduct you.


In his mind, he doesn't like Kotonoha anymore, and has realised that he loves Sekai (Witness his bored sighing face whenever he has to interact with Kotonoha in episode 5). I say "loves" because he actually says "Sekai ga suki." Or at least in his mind he thinks he loves Sekai.

This is probably the reason why he feels no guilt.

If Makoto falls out of love with Sekai and comes back to Kotonoha this will be true. As for planning for the future, young people generally don't do that.

Actually, what i mean is many people just have another affair, because they are attracted only for sex and anything of that sort. Most of the time, either that person is weak enough and doesn't confess/break up, or "still love that person somehow".
Yes, it looks extremely stupid, but many persons just can't withstand the desire, and just jump at the occasion(s), even if they heart belong to someone else, and this is of course, mainly a man's problem.
I don't pretend that men, even in love, are weak enough to get tempted by any gorgeous figure, but reasons behind "cheating" are most of the time of that type.


The problem i see here is basically that Makoto is hardly in love with any of the 2 girls. maybe having more affinities with Sekai, but without the training, things would turn a bit differently.

The problem with Makoto's words is basically that he feels attracted by kotonoha and soon, it has a "bigger" attraction to sekai.

Of course, i believe he shouldn't feel guilt to have "changed" his feelings, since it can't be helped. My problem is basically that he reazlied only now, and doesn't even break up with kotonoha first.

He was just jumping on sekai, without thinking of the consequences.


He doesn't need to be in love with anyone to do "that".
Episode 4 was enough: he didn't really have romantic feelings for sekai first, and became horny during this training. Of course, the training wasn't really innoncent, but OTOH, he just followed his desires, and didn't think of his current situation, nor the possible aftermath, until his cellphone rang.

I strongly disagree, being in love doesn't mean you become entirely oblivious to the opposite gender. You can be just plain not interested in someone but that does not mean you can't find anyone else physically attractive, and that you should resist them should they try to pull anything off.

Of course, in real life, it's hard to find a girl actually seducing you unless you somehow worked to get there in which case it'd be your fault - but my point still stands.

Basically, although this is an awful generalization, it's not too odd for men to cheat for sexual desires, while when girls cheat they do it, for the most part, when they're unhappy with their current partner. It can be justified or not, but that's how I think it is.
It doesn't matter if he doesn't feel any guilt because he "loves" her. If he had half a brain he should be able to tell that cheating and lying to someone who did nothing to deserve it is being a jackass. If on top of that he thinks he's somehow exempt from feeling any guilt, he's even lower than I thought I guess.

which isnt anything to be proud of by any means...but for myself im still pondering if it really is love and not just overwhelming sexual impulses...until i get more proof that he really is in love with sekai i am still 50-50 on the matter...
do you honestly think that makoto is planning for the future? i can see him getting bored with sekai sooner of later then moving over to kotonoha AGAIN...this is the reason why i say that there is less chance for him to tell kotonoha to break up with him seen as she is acting like a safety net/2nd choice if sekai doesnt work out...
i agree...might very well be a sexist view but it is true in most cases (men are dogs afterall :rolleyes:)
well he just doesnt care at that moment in time...as long as he gets sex hes willing to do anything *sigh*

If would be pretty hard for Makoto to make amends, since he did this willingly and was completely aware of the consequences. It wasn't a spur of the moment thing, he knew what he was doing, and he knew how his current girlfriend would react if she'd find out. It is inexcusable. Whether or not he loves Sekai, it really makes no differences as to whether or not his actions were justifiable. Saying stuff like "I don't care about her anymore", makes me wonder if he's got a conscience at all.

The sad thing is i dont even think Motoko knows what the consequences are. Also, hes so clueless its possible that the fact hes cheated twice has escaped his mind. I dont even think that he knows what hes done is wrong and thats makes it all the sadder.

Well, I am seriously thinking now that he never care about any of those girls or their feelings. I mean he has a good g/f in Kotonoha but he never really like her, he was just lusting for her and that was it. He was just using Sekai for his own means but he never have true feelings for her either. I dont think he never care about any of the other girls what so ever. I can finally see why that he is one of the worst or maybe the worst anime character that was ever created.

Um, pardon me, but what disguishes a playboy (Like those guys who you see sleeping with plenty of girls and every girl likes him) and a **** like Makato? Because unlike 99% of all males in shonen anime. He isnt sexually incompetant.

What exactly do you mean? If the so-called "playboy" sleeps with other girls while he has a loving girlfriend waiting for him at home, nothing distinguishes them. If he's just playing the field and has a lot of one-night-stands, there's a clear difference.
I don't know where you're going with this, no one hates Makoto because he's sexually competent, that's a ridiculous postulation. He's hated because of his inconsiderate/stupid actions, and his apparent indifference to anyone else's feelings.
This isn't a shonen anime either, in any event. :<

That's not hard to answer. They're getting easy, dumb girls. Or maybe they know how to lie to the good ones. But they do know how to lie to the opposite gender decently enough.

Makoto's clueless and socially incompetent, and couldn't possibly attract good or even stupid girls. Kotonoha and Sekai aren't exactly dumb broads, so it's quite unrealistic for them to be with someone as worthless as Makoto.

Makoto isn't even sexually competent, he's a perverted little kid who is overexcited about sex.

Playboys are the type of characters that sweet talk dumb girls into having sex. Makoto's just an idiot that has no common sense when it comes to sex, nor has any idea what kind of a mess he's made for himself. Sekai hasn't helped much on the matter either.
Honestly, Makoto's the type of person I yell at for being an idiot.