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-   -   Steins;Gate - Episode 13 Discussion / Poll (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=105188)

Pellissier 2011-06-28 07:46

Steins;Gate - Episode 13 Discussion / Poll
 
Welcome to the discussion thread for Steins;Gate, Episode 13.

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gecd 2011-06-28 13:46

- no new OP/ED
- finally future gadget became usefull
- okarin tried to save mayuri of course
- if you think ep 12 was cruel then think again now
minus
NO TECHNOVISION!!!!!! orz

basically ep 10 of certain magical girl is better

overall 8/10

Midonin 2011-06-28 14:01

S;G 13 - Farewell to fear, farewell to sorrow

For the first time in several weeks, I have a Dr. Pepper (cherry) at my side, and the show enters its second half. The subtitle I gave might not seem to match...but in a way, it sort of does.

Mayuri was barely dead before Rintaro jumped into the past (twice! It works, so...congratulations on that, I suppose?). But the universe is really out to get them. Two time leaps, two times the same ending. The final scene of this episode was pretty well done, too - you don't need gore and blood splattering everywhere to make something gripping and scary. If anything, the lack of it makes it scarier. SERN may have eyes and ears and other organs around the city, but y'know, I still believe there's hope. Rintaro's crazy mad scientistness can break through everything. Time. Space. Foreshadowing.

The foreshadowing may be the toughest enemy of all.

Dist 2011-06-28 14:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by gecd (Post 3670595)
Spoiler for ep 13:

overall 8/10

Why are you placing episode 13 details in a spoiler in a thread dedicated to Episode 13 -_-

... Ahem. So does this mean certain things can't be changed, even if you can alter the past? Whole akihabara changing and all that was possible by changing the past, and even going as far as changing Ruka's gender, but you can't change the fate of someone should they die? Or maybe SERN has something to do with her dying over and over and over again D:.

I hope they manage to get over this one way or another.. Having Mayuri dead for the following last 11 episodes is unacceptable.

Episode was pretty good, nice to see '' part-time soldier '' in action too. Only complaint is Kyouma himself. Your friend dies over and over again, and all you do is run all over the place? If you told about it to Kurisu, or Daru, they could come up with a plan.

Here's also a thought ; If Kyouma time leaped, then sent d-mail to the past to make it so that they never even made the microwave, wouldn't this save Mayuri from her inevitable death?

Riga92 2011-06-28 14:46

The time leap machine works, and yet despite taking measures to avoid Mayuri's death, SERN still killed her (MOEKA GOD DAMMIT), and mysteriously, she died a second time accidentally because of Nae. It seems like the universe is actively trying to kill Mayuri, not matter what Okabe does. Fate. Got so many Madoka vibes from this episode :D

Great episode.

Mentar 2011-06-28 15:02

Homura mode...

I think I can see where the story is headed. Find a way to get out of the mess with all people alive...

CatOfTime 2011-06-28 15:04

Great episode!

I seriously laughed at Ruka's expression when Okabe told that he and Mayuri would go for a trip together :D Priceless.

One thing popped into my mind during this episode (even though I'm pretty surprised how Okabe managed to escape from SERN guys after Mayuri was ran over but I can accept that he just somehow managed to run away...) and that is why didn't Okabe just use the time leap twice in row? He'd get more time that way and it'd be much easier for them to escape.

Another thought. Even though it's pretty obvious that Okabe is in panic at the moment and can't think clearly, but why is he so ready to just leave the time machine stuff at lab? Not like SERN would use that equipment for some bad stuff right? :uhoh: :heh:

Also, I'd like Okabe to just talk to his friends... I am sure they could come up with some plan that'd save everyone. Suzuha could seriously help in this situation as she already knows what's going to happen... all Okabe needs to do is open the mouth and talk :P

KoroshiyaX 2011-06-28 15:06

You can bend the rules, but you can't break them I guess. The whole death cannot be cheated has been played over in most time travel stories. It reminded me of the Time Machine movie where the husband repeatedly travels to the past to save his wife from dying, but she ends up dying in a different way every time and he finally just had to accept it.

I still have hope that Suzuha will be the x-factor in saving Mayurii. He should have gone to her for help right away after the first leap.

Saturn Beaver 2011-06-28 15:13

Ahh, that was depressing. And really nerve-wracking too, all throughout the episode I was afraid that Mayuri is going to be killed, the suspense in the quiet scenes is scary. Okabe, Okabe, I know that you must really be in distraught (what's with triple kill in one episode - actually, four if you count Kurisu as well) but you really shouldn't do it by yourself. Sure the police may not believe you, but there's Kurisu. She definitely understands everything, and her calm and rational approach will really help. Also, the all around badassness of Suzuha will be a great asset as well, not to mention she knows the most about SERN. I wish he'll realize this by next week.

I suppose now we know why Suzuha ran down, it's to set up the CRT to enable the time leap. I wonder though, how far can the time leap go? Because it seems Okarin went to the same time there. Also, I doubt SERN agents will be as young as Nae(remember kids, NEVER EVER run or play near the platform), so it's less SERN and more the universe or fate determined that Mayuri will die.

But the key point here, one that is illustrated will all the deja vu and the toy train, is that with a time leap the worldline stays the same, the world line in which Mayuri Shiina will inevitably die. As such, I predict that now they have to change the world line, doing so by using the microwave. I don't know how they're going to use the two machines together, but I hope they can manage to do it, for Mayuri sake.

The wait for next week is going to be very long...

Kopi 2011-06-28 15:15

No new op and ed...

This episode.. really tortures me.. first they had to replay the footage from last episode when Mayuri got shot and then we had two repeats of Mayuri's deaths in two different forms (wtf Moeka ramming her down with a car!). The last one was really painful to watch even though I knew how it's going to end up and it caused two victims... poor little Nae.

Use the D-mail to move to another world-line Okabe?..

Orin GA 2011-06-28 15:18

Jesus H Christ...how fast was that little girl moving to propel Mayushii in the air like that :heh: Am I the only one that laughed at that scene?

I'm a terrible person :(

Bullet2k4 2011-06-28 15:21

damn.i went and made some popcorn to eat while watching and this happens....

felix 2011-06-28 15:24

I think the whole point of the episode might be that if you don’t create a new world line the universe will just fix itself in other ways, to prevent the paradox. The paradox not being that Mayuri didn’t die, but that Okabe went back. Okabe needs to realize he’s in a paradox: if he saves Mayuri he won’t have a reason to go back and save her so Mayuri will die, which now means he would go back to save her… (going by the show’s logic the world lines themselvs are immutable)

Reckoner 2011-06-28 15:29

Steins;Gate is definitely in full swing now. Intensity at max levels.

I really find Okabe's relationship with Mayuri to be heart warming. You can really feel how bad Okabe wants to protect his dear childhood friend.

Now as if it wasn't bad enough that they tore open a wound last episode, they had to pour salt all over it too. Oh gosh :heh:.

I think the speculation about using a combination of the D-mail with the new gadget is what's going to be needed.

Okabe needs a change of plan though.

I'm still trying to factor in how Kurisu dies in the first episode fits in all this. I really do wonder if it was Okabe who killed her :heh:.

creb 2011-06-28 15:30

I don't think Suzahu ran down to turn the tv on initially. I think she's been torn all series long about how much she should interfere. Sometimes she can't help it, like her outburst concerning Kurisu, and yet the very act of restraint on her part despite the venom she bears towards Kurisu would indicate she's trying hard not to change the timeline too much willy nilly. I suspect she has a very specific reason for traveling back in time, and isn't actually supposed to do anything else out of fears of contaminating the timeline. I think this was just one of those times where she likely intended to leave, but couldn't bear leaving them to their fate, so turned the tv on and came back.

Okarin is not the brightest lightbulb on the planet, that's for sure. One would think the last place you want for Mayuri to be is by his side, seeing as he's their target. His refusal to explain what's going on doesn't help things either. I do hope there's more to this story than another 10+ episodes of him repeatedly "killing" Mayuri despite his attempts. :p It's been a great series, but I'd be disappointed if this is all that it climaxes to.

I'm also not sure if Moeka is with SERN or not. She says, "SERN will take the time machine", which is a bit ambiguous. For all we know, she could be anti-SERN and in her own bizarre way be there to kidnap/kill them so SERN doesn't get them. I guess my problem with automatically assuming she's with SERN is why would she be looking for an IBN 5100 if she was? One would think SERN employees wouldn't need to look for one.

Still have no idea why certain things stop. Like the sand in the hourglass or Mayuri's watch. They made sure to show the sand flowing in this episode so you didn't have any doubts that it had stopped last episode or that Myuri's watch had simply malfunctioned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reckoner (Post 3670721)
I'm still trying to factor in how Kurisu dies in the first episode fits in all this. I really do wonder if it was Okabe who killed her :heh:.

Well, I've given that a lot of thought. We know Kurisu met a version of Okarin besides the present day Okarin, since she had met him 15 minutes prior to the present day Okarin meeting her. That would seem to indicate that at some point, actual physical time travel is going to occur, not just sending memories back in time. That said, if this other Okarin was going to kill her, why would he have talked to her first, and then left her alone until the time of her death? We also know Suzahu was there as well, as we see her on the rooftop prior to Kurisu's death. Yet, if Suzahu killed Kurisu, it would indicate it was part of the reason she went back in time. Which doesn't hold any water since Suzahu hasn't tried to kill Kurisu again, and if that was her mission, she would have.

It also seems like there is another person off-screen on the roof with Suzahu. That person's motives would also seem to fall under the same arguments as Suzahu's though. Which returns us to Okarin or some unknown third party. If we assume it was Okarin, it's possible his talking to Kurisu first was simply a warning that he bungles badly since he's not the best conversationalist. Then, that scream that sounds a lot like him coming from the direction of Kurisu's corpse could have been him summoning his "courage" to do the deed. Could it be at some point he comes to the conclusion that whatever summation of troubles occurred so far and will occur in the near future can all be averted by killing Kurisu? I have a hard time believing that, but then again, Suzahu seems to have quite the foreknowledge concerning what Kurisu might do, so I think it's possible. I'm just not sure how we go from the Kurisu we know to some future Kurisu who screws everyone over.

All of this, of course, begs the question: If Okarin travelled back in time to the date of the first episode, how does the timeline work? The timeline shifted in that episode remember? Does that mean that if one was to travel back in time prior to that "shift", it would be the previous timeline where Kurisu was murdered, or the same timeline you shifted to in which she wasn't? Logic would indicate it has to be the latter, which then makes this very complicated as that would seem there's no way for present day Okarin to return to that timeline in which she was killed, which means whatever happened to Kurisu and whoever was involved, was all part of a timeline prior to this story even taking place. ie: In a pre-show timeline, Okarin develops a timemachine, shit happens, and eventually he decides to travel back in time to kill Kurisu.

Anyways, interested to see if I'm just thinking things through too much and it turns out you CAN travel back to a timeline you shifted from, and episode one turns out to be the last episode as we circle back to it, or if it's just something that already occurred in a long series of time shifts, and the animated story of Steins;Gate is just a snapshot in the middle of them all (or the end). :)

Edit: Lastly, did we ever get confirmation that you have to send memories back to yourself? Or would it be possible to send them to anyone in the past and overwrite them so you could be...Okarin in Kurisu's body or something equally perverted? :p

Dist 2011-06-28 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saturn Beaver (Post 3670707)

I suppose now we know why Suzuha ran down, it's to set up the CRT to enable the time leap. I wonder though, how far can the time leap go? Because it seems Okarin went to the same time there. Also, I doubt SERN agents will be as young as Nae(remember kids, NEVER EVER run or play near the platform), so it's less SERN and more the universe or fate determined that Mayuri will die.

Did you already forget what happened in Episode 12? They set up the time leap, and Kurisu explained that it can only allow a time leap of 48 hours at most.

Though I do wonder really why didn't Okabe then leap 48 hours, not just 3 hours.

^The IBN 5100 is a threat to SERN as it allows to decrypt something on their servers.. or something. It doesn't allow time leap or anything like that. That's probably why Moeka wanted it - If we assume she's SERN agent, she was probably ordered to get her hands on it. I do wonder what is this FB though. She seemed hesistant to shoot Mayuri (or is it just me?) but kept saying '' For the FB '' or something like that, and then did it.

Reckoner 2011-06-28 15:35

Considering that the idea of brain washing was given to us earlier, I'd have to wonder if Moeka is simply a target of this brain washing or is really a spy.

In regards to telling people about everything... Well you're short on time, and it would be pretty difficult to believe Okabe about all the things that are happening no? I can see why he doesn't want to spare time to try and save Mayuri considering he is in a panic at the moment. However, it should be clear to him now that there's more than just trying to get Mayuri away it regards to preventing her fate.

Sheba 2011-06-28 15:44

Checkov's Gun, Final Destination style of foreshadowing and the cherry to top the cake, a Diabolus Ex Machina.

Saturn Beaver 2011-06-28 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dist (Post 3670724)
Did you already forget what happened in Episode 12? They set up the time leap, and Kurisu explained that it can only allow a time leap of 48 hours at most.

Though I do wonder really why didn't Okabe then leap 48 hours, not just 3 hours.

^The IBN 5100 is a threat to SERN as it allows to decrypt something on their servers.. or something. It doesn't allow time leap or anything like that. That's probably why Moeka wanted it - If we assume she's SERN agent, she was probably ordered to get her hands on it. I do wonder what is this FB though. She seemed hesistant to shoot Mayuri (or is it just me?) but kept saying '' For the FB '' or something like that, and then did it.

Oh yeah, I completely forgot, thanks for the reminder. Although like you it also makes me wonder why he stuck with just 3 hours, maybe Kurisu was only able to adjust it to 3 hours and Okarin is stuck with the settings? I hope this will be addressed next episode.

Kanon 2011-06-28 15:55

This is that Time Machine remake movie all over again... There is still hope here, however, since the same rules of time travel don't apply (time was linear in this movie, the hero of the Time Machine couldn't save his wife because the death of his wife is the reason he created the time machine in the first place; saving his wife would create a paradox). I'm actually not sure why Mayuri can't be saved, so far it seemed like the world line could be greatly altered to accommodate any changes. At any rate, the first episode itself proves it is possible to prevent a person's death, so I'm sure Mayuri will be saved. Maybe you have to sacrifice a life to save another, which means that for Mayuri to survive, someone else needs to die. My vote goes to Moeka.

I don't get why Okabe only went a few hours back and didn't make use of the full extent of the time leap's capabilities. A 48 hours window would make it easier to save Mayuri and the others, although as the end of the episode showed us, Mayuri seems destined to die at a set hour no matter what.

Anyway, I hope we won't get to see her die every episode, firstly because it shatters my poor heart, and secondly because it'll get boring.

Quote:

Originally Posted by creb (Post 3670722)
Still have no idea why certain things stop. Like the sand in the hourglass or Mayuri's watch. They made sure to show the sand flowing in this episode so you didn't have any doubts that it had stopped last episode or that Myuri's watch had simply malfunctioned.

Mayuri's watch is a memento from a dead grandmother, whom she was eager to join in the afterlife. The watch stopping is a sign Mayuri's time is up. Incidentally, the flashback was very touching. So that's why Mayuri is Okabe's hostage, it's simply the only thing that went through his mind when he tried to come up with reasons to make her stay (that's also the reason he acts like mad scientist). Tss, just say you love her, idiot! ;)

As for the hourglass, I haven't really paid attention to it, does it mysteriously stop or does it stop simply because it runs out of sand? If it's the latter, I'll say it's just there for symbolism, like the watch.

It might be nothing, but something caught my attention: did female Ruka use the male pronoun (boku) to refer to herself in past episodes? She did in this one. If she did that earlier too, disregard that.


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