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-   -   Anime or not? (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=107755)

domoarigato1995 2011-10-21 16:09

Anime or not?
 
Is it technically anime if, for example, Gonzo or Production I.G and a Canadian animation studio did the main animation production on a movie and worked with investors in Japan?

Kyuu 2011-10-21 16:44

Well... the old "what is anime" question. I've been an advocate on disregarding the "geographical consideration" towards determine if a product is an "anime or not". It is better to focus on the end products themselves to determine that. Even then, there exists a general bottom line that states "who cares". That's on the sheer premise that "animation is animation" regardless and outright.

Finally, this is not a very popular viewpoint, especially among those who retain "anime as something strictly from Japan".

bhl88 2011-10-21 16:53

Yeah... the viewpoint has stuck to me somehow (3 categories for me: anime, animation and cartoons, though they are the same).

Archon_Wing 2011-10-21 17:06

This is a hard one, but it almost comes down to how they want to market it.

Don't the Japanese refer to it all as "animation" anyways?

Puddingman 2011-10-21 17:09

What's the interest in having a solid definition? After all, it's clear you know what it is for yourself. You can identify it and chose to enjoy it if you want, that's what counts. Maybe it's something that can't be put into words? If best understood through words, maybe they'd be books instead :heh:

Archon_Wing 2011-10-21 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puddingman (Post 3818479)
What's the interest in having a solid definition? After all, it's clear you know what it is for yourself. You can identify it and chose to enjoy it if you want, that's what counts. Maybe it's something that can't be put into words? If best understood through words, maybe they'd be books instead :heh:

Well, it is useful if one wants to use that word when talking with others, otherwise it can get confusing.

But yes, it depends on getting the members of any conversation you hold to agree on a definition. There's certainly no law about it, and personal meanings mean the most, but it's nice to clarify things that can come under dispute.

Puddingman 2011-10-21 17:15

Ah I see. If I was ever in that situation I suppose I'd just suggest an anime for someone to watch. I kinda think too that some definitions are too technical for their own good. What if there is a detailed official definition for anime but one outside the art can understand it?

I took a class once where we had to define the term "music therapy" and we came up with this ballin' 1 paragraph long definition; it covered everything about it, but totally meaningless to the average person haha. But I think that's what you're saying when you say personal meanings mean the most.

Archon_Wing 2011-10-21 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puddingman (Post 3818482)
Ah I see. If I was ever in that situation I suppose I'd just suggest an anime for someone to watch. I kinda think too that some definitions are too technical for their own good. What if there is a detailed official definition for anime but one outside the art can understand it?

I took a class once where we had to define the term "music therapy" and we came up with this ballin' 1 paragraph long definition; it covered everything about it, but totally meaningless to the average person haha. But I think that's what you're saying when you say personal meanings mean the most.

You bring up a good point. Not everyone is an anime fan, and yea it'd be nice to come up with a definition that someone who isn't into it could understand. Not the easiest of things, and subject to much nitpicking, but hey... ;)

But I guess we should go back to thinking of some generalizations and examples.

Puddingman 2011-10-21 17:27

Oh yea, sorry about that. I'll contribute a little to make up for my derailing the topic ^_^.

What you were saying earlier about how Japanese people refer to it, I found a wikipedia entry that confirms it (hopefully wikipedia is credible):

"Anime is the Japanese abbreviated pronunciation of 'animation'".

Wikipedia also says that its hand drawn or computer generated images, which makes me think of something. I wonder what would differentiate anime from say wood block prints or other ancient eastern art? Perhaps an answer lies in that.

Vexx 2011-10-21 17:42

If it feels like anime, exudes japanese cultural values, and is directed/produced by japanese, sure I'll call it anime. Where the frames are actually made is secondary.

Triple_R 2011-10-21 17:59

Yeah, I pretty much agree with Vexx here.

I recently watched an episode of the new Thundercats show. It was a good watch, and I enjoyed it as much as I would a lot of anime shows out there.

However, it was clearly culturally North American, and that does make a couple significant differences between it and anime, that I think seasoned anime fans will notice.

I don't think that these cultural differences are necessarily insignificant. Something like Clannad would likely never arise out of North America, in my view, and cultural differences is a big part of the reason why. That's why I once called Clannad "an anime's anime". There's certain anime shows that are quintessentially anime, as it's very hard to imagine them arising out of any other medium and/or in a non-Asian cultural context.

Archon_Wing 2011-10-21 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexx (Post 3818510)
If it feels like anime, exudes japanese cultural values, and is directed/produced by japanese, sure I'll call it anime. Where the frames are actually made is secondary.

That is so true, considering some of it is outsourced.

Kirito 2011-10-22 00:50

Well if the characters have big beady eyes, awesome hair colors, and a great plot then yeah I'll consider it an anime.

Kyuu 2011-10-22 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puddingman (Post 3818491)
Oh yea, sorry about that. I'll contribute a little to make up for my derailing the topic ^_^.

What you were saying earlier about how Japanese people refer to it, I found a wikipedia entry that confirms it (hopefully wikipedia is credible):

"Anime is the Japanese abbreviated pronunciation of 'animation'".

Wikipedia also says that its hand drawn or computer generated images, which makes me think of something. I wonder what would differentiate anime from say wood block prints or other ancient eastern art? Perhaps an answer lies in that.

I've dabbed a bit here and there on that article - myself.

:3

After some thought, I've found myself focusing more on the animation styles themselves. With regards to story, that's irrelevant, because you can take any story and plug it into "anime". For example, the Marvel series - despite them not turning out all that great.

When it comes to anime, it is this section that I'd actually want to improve:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anime#V...haracteristics
I started it. Many others have come along with their contributions. But it's still lacking something.

In addition, I had once advocated "Avatar: the Last Airbender" as anime. I did that based on watching just a few minutes of it. I had convinced myself of Avatar being anime -- UNTIL -- I actually watched it. This series had scenery that could rival many anime. Some of the action scenes are also just as comparable. But, when it came time for the characters exchanging dialogue... this is where I changed my mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexx
If it feels like anime

Per that notion -- Avatar did not feel like anime. Great great story though. It had a more "adult" theme too; to think, there was kissing! Oooooo :p

Oddly enough. This "feeling idea". When I watched the X-Men anime -- I didn't like the idea of that one "feeling Japanese", because the X-Men themselves are Americans. Yet, they behaved like the Japanese, when handling a crisis situation. It was fine adding in a Japanese mutant though.

As for Iron Man, Mr Stark remained a brash, perverted white-boy. :heh::D

ahelo 2011-10-22 10:48

Cartoons made in Japan.

Puddingman 2011-10-27 20:00

I was thinking about this a little bit the other night and I had a question.

If you think of anime from a cultural perspective, then does a video game made in Japan become an Anime-Game?

:heh: I thought it was a cool perspective, thinking of say Final Fantasy as an Anime-Game or something. I think it would have helped tie some connections together for me. I always loved video games but never came to anime until the Summer time. I prob would have been more inclined to check it out if the connections between the two were more obvious.

Vexx 2011-10-27 23:12

A lot of asian sourced MMOs have anime art stylings and storylines. They are aometimes fun to explore simply for that reason.

Triple_R 2011-10-28 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puddingman (Post 3828282)
I was thinking about this a little bit the other night and I had a question.

If you think of anime from a cultural perspective, then does a video game made in Japan become an Anime-Game?

:heh: I thought it was a cool perspective, thinking of say Final Fantasy as an Anime-Game or something. I think it would have helped tie some connections together for me. I always loved video games but never came to anime until the Summer time. I prob would have been more inclined to check it out if the connections between the two were more obvious.

JRPGs (especially the most modern ones) often have clear-cut anime influences/inspirations. So, yeah, there's definite similarities between them and anime from a cultural perspective.

bhl88 2011-10-28 01:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vexx (Post 3818510)
If it feels like anime, exudes japanese cultural values, and is directed/produced by japanese, sure I'll call it anime. Where the frames are actually made is secondary.

So if the person is not Japanese (DC), but the one who is making it is JC Studio? (may be NSFW)

Kyuu 2013-02-16 09:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple_R (Post 3828666)
JRPGs (especially the most modern ones) often have clear-cut anime influences/inspirations. So, yeah, there's definite similarities between them and anime from a cultural perspective.

I tend to disregard the cultural aspects, in favor of the more technical ones. Nevertheless, Japanese animation is the only form of animation to have a singular term tied to a specific ethnic group. Many view Japanese animation as "anime", where as everything else is relegated to cartoon or animated series.

Regardless of cultural views, Westerns CAN and should take on careers developing anime on their own. It's all a matter of learning the exact same techniques, when it comes to developing them. Hell, Japanese animators could possibly make some extra money in the states teaching these kinds of courses.

Seeing an add like this today via Facebook is pleasing:

http://i.imgur.com/7zCslvi.png

I'd go into that field myself, except I am too old, not creative enough, and not talented enough to do so. The best I can do is maintain a perspective outside that which is commonly viewed, in the hopes that someone else would take this opportunity.


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