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-   -   Harem Vs. "All Girls" Anime Debate (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=112847)

NeoChan 2012-06-18 19:49

Harem Vs. "All Girls" Anime Debate
 
I wish the MOD will make this a poll thread as well... To start, I tried to watch animes that has an all girl cast like Queen's Blade or some shoujo ai anime but I feel a bit uncomfortable due to the absence of male leads or at the least, male supporting cast. No doubt I love harem because of the girls fighting over a guy.

What do you think? Do you prefer Harem or an All Girls only anime...?

Midonin 2012-06-18 20:00

That's the second thread in two days about people being confused by the lack of a male presence. I don't understand this perspective. What is it about a profusion of girls that's so strange? There's always the underlying idea that being full of girls somehow makes it inherently worse, though that's a false premise if I've ever seen one.

I'll bridge the gap between the two types of series listed in the title by presenting examples that had a male viewpoint character in the source material, but excised him completely for the anime version. Koihime Musou and Milky Holmes. These series are some of my favorites, and I think the decision to remove the protagonist actually gave them fairly unique identities. The characters were allowed to be fleshed out through their interactions with each other, free of the standard romance storytelling. (Not to say there wasn't some romance - Sherlock/Henriette and Kannu/everybody are predominant, but there's no confessions, no dates, no any of that stuff.)

Koihime retains most of its roots as a bawdy comedy, but is allowed to embrace its setting a little more strongly. Whereas Milky Holmes, with Opera Kobayashi (and Rei Kamitsu) out of the picture, goes completely off the rails to become one of the greatest absurd comedies in recent memory. Sure, Koihime does have Kada, and Holmes has a pretty major antagonist in its second season, but the shows shone long before that.

I enjoy both kinds of shows, but for entirely different reasons. I've never been much of a shipping person, so I'd say the mostly-female casts appear to me more as they're largely free of that sort of thing, but I still watch most of the harem series that come along anyway. Their comedy and premises and characters can often be just as interesting to watch.

A female presence is nothing to fear.

Addendum: To the kind sir who said I appear to be a "pervert" or "gay" for making this post, I thank you for your input and will attempt to control my obviously deviant thought processes in the future.

Akito Kinomoto 2012-06-18 20:09

All female cast and yuri/shoujo-ai are not mutually inclusive. Likewise, harem and "all girls" aren't completely divorced either (Iono the Fanatics comes to mind). But anyway, the gender of the characters involved in a romance or anything doesn't really matter to me. There used to be a time long ago when I would gravitate toward a series just for featuring girls draped over each other (I'm male and I find it hawt, okay?). These days I just leave my judgments for the work itself. If we're discussing pure aesthetics though then yeah yuri and/or all-female cast is much more pleasant to my eyes (and doujin fodder!) even if the show itself is insufferable to my enjoyment.

NoemiChan 2012-06-18 20:20

I think the issue why some don't watch "all girl cast" anime is yeah... the lack of males. They may want to see the balance of sexes in the genre ( even in yuri or non romance anime). Some males may feel out of place... Such genres are popular to yuri fans.

On the other hand.... many goes to harem due to romance ( male X female) and ecchi. In this shows, though females are leads, the male supporting cast are doing their roles well in helping the females in their goals which is kinda nice to watch... both sexes are cooperating for the same goal....

My favorite all girl cast anime are K-on and Queen's blade..

Obelisk ze Tormentor 2012-06-18 20:33

As for me, I don’t like Queen’s Blade not because of its all-female cast, but the so-so story and (mainly) pointless fanservice. Well, In my opinion, a fanservice scene where none of the characters in it enjoy it, is pointless. So, if you want to give fanservice to me, please give me a representative character who enjoy those (preferably a male). It’s okay if pointless fanservice happens occasionally but if that becomes the whole content of the anime (generally speaking) I can’t find myself entertained. That’s why I can’t enjoy anime like Queen’s Blade & Ikki Tousen coz even when the sexy girls’ clothes got ripped to shreds, or there’s a bath scene, there’s no character to “enjoy” those lewd scenes (generally speaking), unlike many bath/peeping/accident scenes in harem anime. So, if there’s an all-female-cast anime about girls fighting each other, I prefer that it takes the fighting and story seriously like Mai-Hime and Claymore, not just a bunch of fanservice scenes directed to nobody except the audience. You can call me strange for that, but that’s what I feel :p.

Chaos2Frozen 2012-06-18 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akito_Kinomoto (Post 4213531)
All female cast and yuri/shoujo-ai are not mutually inclusive.

Even if the story isn't meant to be yuri- that's how most of the audience for that show is going to end up viewing it.

Then to maintain those fanbase, eventually the show would shift and be all about yuri :p

Akito Kinomoto 2012-06-18 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen (Post 4213591)
Even if the story isn't meant to be yuri- that's how most of the audience for that show is going to end up viewing it.

Well I certainly don't!

Okay maybe I do...

Triple_R 2012-06-18 21:17

Magical girl anime alone probably makes this a victory for "All Girls" anime for me.

Throw Saki and K-On on top of that, and it's not even close.


I will say, though, that I generally like a little bit of gender diversity, at least in longer series. Even a minor character like Ritsu's brother can make a show's fictional world seem a touch more realistic to me.

Chaos2Frozen 2012-06-18 21:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirito (Post 4213604)
There's nothing wrong with harems, I truly love them and fan service is really awesome...no lie, but compared to few if some all female cast shows, the all girls shows win it the most, at least to me because it doesn't really follow the cliches that most harem shows display and it kind of caters more to more "real" relationship settings, growth, story and scenery to say the least. Harems are like get some guy, put some hot girls in there, and watch the fans see who the guy will end up with...not much to go on in terms of a story. Some harems have great stories, but it's the cliches that make it lose to an all female cast anime, at least to me.


The examples of harem series you've given are more comedy/fanservice based than any serious plot, while the yuri series you've given are all more plot driven, so kind of one-sided don't you think?

Wouldn't a better yuri comparison if you're using something like Highschool DxD would be with say- Manyuu Hikenchou :p :p :p ?

Chaos2Frozen 2012-06-18 21:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirito (Post 4213651)
I can't tell whether you're mocking or spiting me -_-. I'm just saying what I think, and I don't really can't really recall any serious harem. As for Manyuu Hikenchou I never took that show seriously. I enjoyed it but didn't take it serious like the other female shows I've watched in awhile.

Maybe I'm doing both :p ?

Ore no Imouto, Bakamonogatari, Utawarerumono, To Aru majutsu no Index, Fate/Stay Night, Suzumiya Haruhi, C3, Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon, Code Geass etc... All of them have serious stories underneath their colorful exterior.

Yes, most of them aren't pure romance comedy fanservice harem series, but then again some of your examples also have more going for them than two girls going at it with each other right :p ?

Ichihara Asako 2012-06-18 21:55

I typically prefer series without male characters at all, because the vast majority of males in anime are incredibly stupid, weak and lame characters that are a detriment to the story/setting.

And while I do enjoy harem, it's typically just for the female cast; the male leads are almost always generic and boring nobodies. They're designed that way for male audiences, apparently, but I'm a woman and just hate weak male characters that are so abundant in anime.

BaKaBaKaOtaKu 2012-06-18 22:00

I prefer All-girls of course -grins widely-

Harem tends to be actually tiring unless the story is in Omnibus format. With that, I don't have to suffer seeing the girls fawning over the Stupid Male Lead at the same time.

Chaos2Frozen 2012-06-18 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirito (Post 4213668)
Yeah, forgive me for being so stupid since I can't live up to your standards. I might as well just quit posting on this site then if it'll make people like you happy and many others happy, right -_-...

...Are you... Pouting because I corrected you :twitch: ?

Chaos2Frozen 2012-06-18 22:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirito (Post 4213676)
No, I'm actually agreeing with you when you think that I'm stupid. Yeah you're right, it's no wonder people on this forum "befriended" me because I'm such a pathetic loser who can't make my opinions click with other people here.

I'm a big loser with no anime sense or value, happy?

...You know, I was only kidding when I said 'maybe I'm doing both'... =_=

FateAnomaly 2012-06-18 22:18

I prefer all girls shows vs harem. I just can't find any reason to show any interest in the pointless existence of the lone guy.

SilverSyko 2012-06-18 22:23

I definitely would say shows with all-female casts are the superior choice here for me. Despite that, I've watched very few shows with that criteria considering my personal taste in entertainment favors cool male characters. Probably the two I've liked the most with only female characters so far though are Madoka Magica and Black Rock Shooter. :)

Honestly though, I'd much rather prefer a series with an even or near-even male to female ratio in it's characters. While I do prefer male characters and follow some series with a very high amount of them, I always think they could stand to add some more women sometimes. :uhoh:

When it comes to harems, I can very rarely look at the female cast as anything more than tools to fulfill the wishes and desires of horny teenage otaku. Seldom will I also come across one with a decent male protagonist and a downplayed harem aspect, and when I do that's usually the only real reason for me to pay it any mind at all. :eyebrow:

Liddo-kun 2012-06-18 22:28

If there would be a poll, then I hope it has the "undecided" option.

Currently watching Smile Precure, which is mostly an all girl anime.
A supporter of the precure franchise in general (except for the Fresh series which garnered all my dislike).

But I've also liked some shows which has male leads like Ore no Imouto and True Tears. Well, True Tears has not left my favorites list in MAL since 2008 and Oreimo would probably last as long.

Chaos2Frozen 2012-06-18 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichihara Asako (Post 4213666)
I typically prefer series without male characters at all, because the vast majority of males in anime are incredibly stupid, weak and lame characters that are a detriment to the story/setting.

And while I do enjoy harem, it's typically just for the female cast; the male leads are almost always generic and boring nobodies. They're designed that way for male audiences, apparently, but I'm a woman and just hate weak male characters that are so abundant in anime.

When was the last time you're seen a harem series? 2006? Because most of the spineless seem to have died off then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FateAnomaly (Post 4213700)
I prefer all girls shows vs harem. I just can't find any reason to show any interest in the pointless existence of the lone guy.

So if the guy wasn't pointless and lonely...? Or if there's a greater plot moving things behind it all...?

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverSyko (Post 4213706)
Honestly though, I'd much rather prefer a series with an even or near-even male to female ratio in it's characters. While I do prefer male characters and follow some series with a very high amount of them, I always think they could stand to add some more women sometimes. :uhoh:

A population of 1:2 in favor of girls feels about right to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverSyko (Post 4213706)
When it comes to harems, I can very rarely look at the female cast as anything more than tools to fulfill the wishes and desires of horny teenage otaku. Seldom will I also come across one with a decent male protagonist and a downplayed harem aspect, and when I do that's usually the only real reason for me to pay it any mind at all. :eyebrow:

You do realize that yuri shows are marketed to the same desires of horny teenage otaku right :p ?

Ithekro 2012-06-18 22:36

All Girls verse the Harem.....


Sounds like either a super hero teams fight or pro-wrestling.

Eragon 2012-06-18 22:53

I prefer an all girls cast over a harem. The reason being, as some may have mentioned before, the harem shows generally tend to have a very cliched male and female cast.
On a more personal note the male lead is just too freaking lame and stupid for me to stand and also the concept of several - absolutely gorgeous, if I may add - girls fighting over that same lame guy is just to bizarre for me to accept.
The only harem(if you can call it that) show that I liked was Clannad.


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