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-   -   Future of Subbing - Online Collaboration? (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=50376)

NaweG 2007-07-04 11:45

Future of Subbing - Online Collaboration?
 
Just wondering if this (http://www.dotsub.com/) is where we're going for subbing? Allows multiple folks to do multiple languages which are then shown during online playback - letting them deal with the bandwidth issues.

Unearthly 2007-07-04 13:01

Would you really want to watch an episode on there? Do you enjoy watching anime on youtube? If so, uh, power to you. But personally I prefer my media high quality and non-streamed, thank you.

I also don't think they'd enjoy you putting lots of copyrighted content on there.
They aren't quite Youtube so I imagine it would be easier to regulate.

False Dawn 2007-07-04 15:37

I think it's more likely that fansubs will start releasing series/episodes with multiple subtitle tracks to allow people to watch in languages other than English - to an extent, some groups have already started doing that - Animanda doing a Slovenian translation for Devil May Cry, and roxfan releasing Toki Wo Kakeru Shoujo with a Russian translation.

Of course, this takes time, so most groups don't release in multiple languages. But it's more likely to happen in a sub group than on an online site like that.

Unearthly 2007-07-04 19:37

Well, they don't even have to be in the same group. Assuming it's softsubs, it would be very easy for something like:

Group A releases anime episode in English.
Person B extracts script, translates English->XXX, posts script online for people to use with original file.

While Group A does the whole translating, editing, timing, typesetting, and encoding, Person B only has to translate and edit their script. This suffers from the same 'Telephone' problem that the site in the OP has, but makes entry to the scene very easy. All you need is to be able to use Matroska tools and translate to your target language.

All the more reason (in my opinion) to use softsubs.

jfs 2007-07-04 20:49

My advice would be to never delay a release because of waiting for multiple languages. It can easily turn into an infinite delay, making everyone on the project impatient and start losing interest, eventually leading to the project dying. At least that has been the fate of those two multi-language sub projects I have participated in.
The better solution is indeed to just release with English softsubs (and perhaps also foreign-language subs that were finished on time, but the selection of included subs should be consistent) and let other people take care of the further translation then.
Scripts for further translation to a third language should probably also be sprinkled with further notes on the meaning of the original text, otherwise lots of nuances can get lost in translation.

Starks 2007-07-04 20:54

Take a look at how StormBerry.tv does things... It's essentially Youtube with softsubs.

Access 2007-07-04 21:19

No. I don't really see any real benefit fir multiple languages, and BT has already made all this streaming stuff obsolete.

DryFire 2007-07-04 21:43

It's a C&D waiting to happen. When 640x480 video at a decent bitrate starts streaming it may be interesting, but for now why hurt your eyes?

Starks 2007-07-05 00:14

The fundamental problem is that streaming quality and Internet bandwidth are essentially tidally locked.

Koroku 2007-07-05 00:20

Eh... I highly doubt it. Unless you see places that start offering to stream h264 720p video without lag... it just isn't going to happen.

The community is becoming so obsessed with "quality" that it's absurd.


*still can not tell a big difference between 320kbps MP3 and FLAC or the difference between LQ XviD and HQ h264 when blown to full screen*

edogawaconan 2007-07-05 00:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by JKaizer (Post 1026612)
*still can not tell a big difference between 320kbps MP3 and FLAC or the difference between LQ XviD and HQ h264 when blown to full screen*

isn't it is _very_ easy? what's difficult is when it is downscaled...

Koroku 2007-07-05 00:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by edogawaconan (Post 1026622)
isn't it is _very_ easy? what's difficult is when it is downscaled...

When it's uped to full screen on a 1024x768 screen, it really doesn't look all that different unless you're really looking for it. But that debate is for another thread.

edogawaconan 2007-07-05 02:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by JKaizer (Post 1026627)
When it's uped to full screen on a 1024x768 screen, it really doesn't look all that different unless you're really looking for it. But that debate is for another thread.

or when you've trained to see them. even AonE's El Cazador encodes looks too soft for me :eyespin: not to mention some blocking in opening scene :)

edit: be grateful if you can't see them as it doesn't improve watching experience (in fact, it decreases). Ability to see them is mainly useful for encoder only... :)

jfs 2007-07-05 07:30

The problem with low-quality streaming video is that (hard) subtitles can quickly turn unreadable. But if this service (I haven't looked at it yet) can do softsubs then they've obviously solved that problem.

xat 2007-07-05 23:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by DryFire (Post 1026419)
It's a C&D waiting to happen. When 640x480 video at a decent bitrate starts streaming it may be interesting, but for now why hurt your eyes?

Doesn't stage6 have this covered to some extent (sans softsubs perhaps)? Granted, their EULA doesn't exactly condone the kind of material we deal with.

LS5 2007-07-06 07:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfs (Post 1026330)
My advice would be to never delay a release because of waiting for multiple languages. It can easily turn into an infinite delay, making everyone on the project impatient and start losing interest, eventually leading to the project dying. At least that has been the fate of those two multi-language sub projects I have participated in.

This is why deadlines exist. I've been in charge of the Dutch translation of Honobono's recent The Bridge over Dreams, so I've had the chance to see how things work in a multi-language project too. All the translators were basically told to have the script ready by the end of the month. After this deadline I noticed a minor error in my ASS formatting which caused it not to display correctly when using libass, but I was told: "Unless we spot some faults in the English script, we're not going to include your fix." Which was totally fair. 'Luckily' for me, some mistakes were found in the English script, so my fix was included in later RCs, but other translators later on were simply told that their changes in the script were not going to make the final release. Projects like this can work fine as long as there are some strict deadlines.

jfs 2007-07-06 07:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by LS5 (Post 1029064)
Projects like this can work fine as long as there are some strict deadlines.

That still doesn't solve the problem of "translator disappearing after a few episodes have been released". Losing a third-language translation halfway through a series doesn't look good at all. (It seems to be a rule, if your project is partially dependent on some specific person, that person will disappear halfway through with no notice at all.)

LS5 2007-07-06 08:05

In that case, simply drop that specific language from the project. It may 'not look good at all', but it sure as hell is a lot better than letting the entire project die.

Nicholi 2007-07-06 20:38

Joost amazingly enough streams H.264, so the possibility of high quality is always there. Though I haven't prodded quite into what the res is yet, I would assume something around standard def at least.


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