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-   -   Subtitles and Dubbing (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=8330)

Feran 2004-02-27 13:42

Subtitles and Dubbing
 
I don't know, but I prefer everything to be in its original form. Even if it has bugs, every single little aspect of an original thing, for me, makes it special. Consequently, I dislike dubbing. A lot. And sometimes dubbing really sucks (See Dragon Half *hurl*, La Blue Girl *how can people get off to this? >.<*, etc.).

I enjoy subs not only because they have the original voice actors, but also because it helps me learn Japanese. It's like hey, why go take a class when you can learn all the colloquial expressions and basic verb structure, etc., from watching anime?

What's your opinion on subbing and dubbing?

4F0ur 2004-02-27 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feran
I don't know, but I prefer everything to be in its original form. Even if it has bugs, every single little aspect of an original thing, for me, makes it special. Consequently, I dislike dubbing. A lot. And sometimes dubbing really sucks (See Dragon Half *hurl*, La Blue Girl *how can people get off to this? >.<*, etc.).

I enjoy subs not only because they have the original voice actors, but also because it helps me learn Japanese. It's like hey, why go take a class when you can learn all the colloquial expressions and basic verb structure, etc., from watching anime?

What's your opinion on subbing and dubbing?

The reason the dubbing suX is because the people who are doing it
In Japan ..they use voice actors to make the animes(which means they are professionals)....
The normal fan dubbers Never have/had learn how to do voice acting...so its obvious that dubbed animes are not good

and 1more thing..I found out that the voice editting Sux too...they actually Cut off the backgroud music when they dub...
i know its hard..but i think the fan dubbers should prepare all the OST's and reDubb or record the eps from the very beggining

Superchop 2004-02-27 14:08

Learn japanese from watching anime? The only thing you learn from watching anime relating to japanese are some "BASIC" phrases...there's no way you can/ever will learn anything more then that....

As for the whole sub vs. dubs thing...i was pretty sure there have been other threads talking about this but i'm too lazy to search for them now...but i'll edit my post when i find some old threads...

Feran 2004-02-27 14:20

meeeh but when you watch as much as i do..

and think about babies. how do they learn the language? :3 and overseas studies always helps you learn a language better, faster, and more authentically

Superchop 2004-02-27 14:40

Babies learn the language cause they have the parents using at all the time around them and on top of that they also have the parents explain things better...in anime all you do is hear it for the 25 mins and that's it...

I agree with you that being oversees and studying does help but just watching anime, no matter how much you watch, isn't gonna help you very much

babbito2k 2004-02-27 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feran
I don't know, but I prefer everything to be in its original form.

Subtitled anime is not its original form. If you really want something in its original form watch "King of the Hill."
Quote:

Originally Posted by Feran
I enjoy subs ... because it helps me learn Japanese... why go take a class when you can learn all the colloquial expressions and basic verb structure, etc., from watching anime?

The only reason to take a Japanese class is to learn Japanese. The first thing to learn is that it is usually rude to speak the way anime characters tend to do. Watching anime may help you remember some vocabulary but without instruction you have no way to use it. It shows you next to nothing as far as the written language.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Feran
What's your opinion on subbing and dubbing?

I prefer subs. But I watched dubbed anime when I was younger and it didn't kill me. In fact it helped me to get interested in anime. Part of the worldwide audience for anime will always be made up of people who watch dubs.

There's nothing wrong with being enthusiastic about anime but there is little to be gained by making a fuss over dubs. IMO a better use of your time is to think about why you enjoy the particular shows you do and talk about that.

raikage 2004-02-27 14:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feran
I don't know, but I prefer everything to be in its original form. Even if it has bugs, every single little aspect of an original thing, for me, makes it special. Consequently, I dislike dubbing. A lot. And sometimes dubbing really sucks (See Dragon Half *hurl*, La Blue Girl *how can people get off to this? >.<*, etc.).

I enjoy subs not only because they have the original voice actors, but also because it helps me learn Japanese. It's like hey, why go take a class when you can learn all the colloquial expressions and basic verb structure, etc., from watching anime?

What's your opinion on subbing and dubbing?

*bangs head against wall*
*stops, then bangs head against wall again*

Exactly how much have you learned by watching anime? This has been covered in many other threads, and everyone (who has actually taken a Japanese class) agrees that you CANNOT learn by watching anime. PERIOD. Anime will not even HELP you until you are at a certain level.

Mcdonalds 2004-02-27 14:47

i agree with superchop in that it will not help you learn much. Sure it will allow you to pick up certain phrases but japanese is a very complex subject. Unlike english, word structure is different, words of nouns change from past and future tenses and nouns combined with other nouns make different words etc (as far i as know from learning japanese online so i hope its not to misleading). So although you may learn some phrases, you will never get to learn the grammar or the way a word is meant to be said in a certain context.

Anyway, onto the subject, i personally prefer subbing rather than dubbing. Maybe its my fondness of the japanese language, but i personally prefer watching anime is japanese if thats how it originally was. In fact, i prefer everything that is original. This is aptly demonstrated when i was watching the rugrats in chinese and i thought, this is crappy compared to its english counterpart

nak 2004-02-27 16:14

Yea I basically agree with everyone on the learning japanese thing. Basic phrases and random words are all I've ever learned. I haven't learned at all how to actually manipulate the language.

Anyway most anime fans prefer subbing, since the earliest animes dubbed in the US has left me scarred and still upset and untrusting of American dubbing from then and now and probably later on. The Japanese language sounds very diffrent from English and has certain sounds and pitches of voice Japanese voice actors preform that just sound weird in English. I would rather hear a Japanese gurl scream in an anime rather than have an English voice actress imitate that same scream since..well I can just tolerate the cuteness of it in japanese more cause in enlglish it just sounds really annoying. As in Steel Angel Kurumi and Nadesico, all the screaming in laughing in the dubbing made me wanna rip my ears off.

Kurara 2004-02-27 17:10

Personally I prefer watching fansubs. Not because it's the truthful original version, but because it's fun to hear the characters speak Japanese and to hear their original voices.

I think that dubs could be very well made. There's nothing wrong with enjoying dubbed anime. It's just that, as we all know, a lot [ not all! ] of dubbed anime has crappy voice actors, altered music, altered scenario, sometimes censorship. When we watch fansubs, we don't have those inconvenients. But dubs could be the same as fansubs in the way that they could keep the same music and the same dialogues and not cut or censor anything. By example, a lot of french dubs are very good. They hire very good and sometimes famous voice actors to do the voices of the characters. A lot of American dubs are not bad too, in my opinion. It's just that a lot of them are bad.

method 2004-02-27 19:32

Most dubbed anime doesn't have altered music, scenes, or censorship. The only company that makes changes things like is 4kids and they are only interested in the kiddy market.

Tabiree 2004-02-27 19:48

Dragon Half and La Blue Girl are Hentai, correct?

Hentai always have had bad voice actors. THe quality of the dub has never been it's high-selling point.

I watch dubs. And dubs are getting better. Sure, they aren't always that good, but still, you're adapting a foreign language show for a different audience while trying to catre for tons of different aspects of a fanbase, where anywhere from 25-75% hates your guts.

Not only that, They don't have Disney budgets, so they have to work with what they have.

Not to say those scripting/dubbing it aren't enthusiastic, but you have to understand that certian projects are done simply because they -HAVE- to be done, hence no enthusiasm.

TangentZ 2004-02-27 20:03

I just wanted to say that I'm disappointed by (almost) all the English dubs that I've personally watched.

On the other hand, many HK (Cantonese) dubs are quite good. I first watched Rurouni Kenshin on HK TV and loved it.

So, I think the language does not matter as much as having good voice actors doing the dubbing.

Tabiree 2004-02-27 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by TangentZ
I just wanted to say that I'm disappointed by (almost) all the English dubs that I've personally watched.

On the other hand, many HK (Cantonese) dubs are quite good. I first watched Rurouni Kenshin on HK TV and loved it.

So, I think the language does not matter as much as having good voice actors doing the dubbing.


I've always been pretty dissapointed with the quality of Cantonese dubs, strange that :)

d07n37 2004-02-27 20:48

Personally i feel that some commercial dubs of films (example - princess mononoke) are excellant. These use seasoned actors (not necessarily voice actors) who know how to convey a lot of emotion via vocal intonation and their enunciation of the words. more care is put into the translation of the original script and usually overseen by the original screenplay writer. truer experience.

dubs of TV series use cheap contracted voice actors who are sometimes overused in different series. this gives dubbed anime that samey sound no matter what series you watch. no quality control by original author.. you may not even get the same story as the japanese anime (example - sin), some details may be changed etc.... these people just crank them out. most notable on long running series where they don't have time to redo a scene before the ep is to be aired. dvd released anime is better.

and when everyone goes on about anime being dubbed in english they're wrong. anime is usually dubbed in american. with really annoying whinning voice actors who are really streching to emphasise an emotion vocally. horrible.

has any one here seen ranma1/2 in dub AND sub? the dub is terrible... it even removes one of the cute characteristics of Shampoo. in the jap lang / eng sub you get to here what a chinese person speaking japanese badly sounds like... very funny, helps convey the character's personna. in the end dub this is removed and she speaks normally. ruined.

one proper english dub i've had the pleasure of enjoying is Hellsing. proper british accents as it's set in england.

also... fansubs tend to convey more than commercial subs as fansubs are for fans who would normally, or pretend to know about japese cultural references. therefore cultural refernces are included by fansubbers. commercial subbers/dubbers remove these and replace them with western friendly ideals/references.

i've also found that commercial subs are short and often simplify whats being said on screen. this is also true of any western subs. try watching star trek with subs on. you miss quite a lot of dialogue. fansubbers try and give you everything, even if it means not being able to read the subs fast enough and having to review ('rewind') and pause the divx!

i'd go for subs over dubs anyday. those crazy japanese voice actors! overhearing japanese ppl talk while i'm in the pub really highlights the fact that that japanese ppl don't talk like they do in anime. remember that.

ShadowLady 2004-02-27 21:02

Hmm I did actually learn to understand english by watching a shitload of cartoon network as a kid, too bad it isn't the same thing with japanese.
Watching dubs makes me want to scratch my ears out. especially when I know how it's supposed to sound.. but when I haven't seen show in Japanese and I watch a dub I don't have much of a problem with it. I've only seen dubbed eps of shin-chan and I think it's great.. but I'd bet I'd hate it as soon as I know how it's supposed to sound.
And in dubs they often cut out a lot of the japanese jokes, while subs sometimes take the time to explain them (well fansubs anyway)

aFlipGuy 2004-02-27 23:25

^_^ same here shadow lady ^_^ i use to watch scooby doo and old school cartoons and learned english easier when i was transported here in the US and um....fansub owns

after watching all these animes, all i've picked up are, nani, doshta, ano and um.....psh i dunno i just read the subs plus i prolly didnt spell those rite at all ^_^'"

Tabiree 2004-02-28 19:56

1. THe Mononoke Dub wasn't that great.

2. The Mononoke dub/rest of Ghibli used professional actors. I'm sure if ADV/Bandai/Pioneer/anyone else could employ said actors, then they would. But remember, these things cost money.

3. The Jokes are changed because they simply will not make sense in English. Just because it sounds good in your head does not mean it will sound any good voiced out-loud.

4. aFlipGuy- kekkee kawaii ^_^ (sarcasm)

5. I hate these topics so very much.

6. "How they're supposed to sound". What, you'd rather the original Japanese voice actors read Katakana-based english scripts? Ever heard that done before? It's extremely stupid, and confusing for everyone involved.

7. Meh. No one is better than anyone.

unrelatedwaffle 2004-02-29 00:20

I really dislike dubbing, not only of anime but of movies. It totally nullifies the original actor's performance, and that's not fair. Especially with anime, when you can't even see the seiyuus' gestures and facial expressions to convey their emotion. Not to mention lots of dubs are terrible. . .but that's another issue. I for one believe reading subtitles is a lost art to a whole bunch of lazy people.

JubeiYamazaki 2004-02-29 01:20

Cam Clarke, Tony Oliver, Reba West > all the other VAs.


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