[AuraTwilight]

Originally Posted by FFTHEWINNER

i thought of that,but like i said"if beatrice fabricated the whole scene then that would mean that she can read minds,as how else would she know that current eva has an alter ego that looks like her younger self?"

I'm saying Beatrice could be lying about what's in people's heads, because Battler can't exactly look inside himself.

what if Beatrice herself is,to use a Mass Effect term,Indoctrinated?

i mean,if you want to go a 100% pure "anti-fantasy,no magic can happen at all in normal umineko world" approach(which i dont believe in,but cant deny it as a possibility either)then beatrice's flashback scene pretty much obliterates that possibility,as in it we see clear use of magic to fix what was clearly broken for a while in a scene that,like i said,was from beatrice's memories. she didnt intend to remember it,and battler didnt see it. the only possible way for you to save that belief is for beatrice's own memories to be fake.
furthermore,the "vase cant be restored" line. again,how can beatrice the endless say that?it completely goes against all the principles of her being "her". of her being an endless witch.

She could be lying directly to the reader. It wouldn't be the only time she's addressed the 4th wall above Battler's head.

i am pretty confident it was also said that the mirror had lost its power for a while until kinzo,at some unspecified point,restrengthened it. that unspecified point could be after the suicide.

there are more evidence though. what was the purpose od that mirror?to prevent EVIL spirits from COMING to the island and force the ones already there to leave. first of all,we have no evidence that"old beatrice"was an evil spirit(and according to my theory she wasnt),so the mirror wouldnt affect her if she was a good spirit then. second of all,if old beatrice was a bad spirit then how was she even able to be summoned to the island if the mirror was still working?the mirror should have been like a protective barrier that stops her from entering but forces her to exit if she entered,nor force her to stay. it wouldnt make sense for a protective mirror to force evil spirits to stay.
to summerize,order of events:
1-mirror was weak and not needed,pld beatrice summoned
2-old beato dies/suicides,human beato is made
3-kinzo strengthens the mirror,but not before he modifies the mirror's nature so that it keeps the spirits inside instead of throwing them out. this is done as a protective measure in case "human beatrice"ever regains her power and remembers why she died/suicided.
4:Human Beato dies.

It's specifically mentioned in these earlier episodes that the mirror's eastern power also interfered with Beatrice's western magic and acted as a barrier that kept her from leaving, thus she ended up committing suicide because she couldn't use magic to escape.

in eastern religions,reincarnation is based on how you did in the past life. if old beato was truly that great then she would have reached nirvana,not gotten reincarnated. also,where you get reincarnated is random,so what are the odds she will get reincarnated there of all places?
i believe"she chose to hide/sleep inside kumasawa's body so that she is ready in case beatrice ever gets revived"is a more logical answer.perfect example is the main character in Seikrei.

That kind of goes out the window when the reincarnation is something deliberately done by a powerful magic-user, which is a common element in Japanese folklore and stories.

sorry but i simply cant accept that reasoning. within the story it is impossible for this scene to be fake in anyway(unless my"uncomfortable theory"is correct). this is a game between battler and beato.as far as this game is concerned"we"dont exist. if this was a comedy or parody game i would accept 4th wall breaking and whatnot,but a game that requires you to milk your brain like this must have everything in it make sense by its own rules and story. this is the same reason i know bernkastel isnt talking to"me"in the tea parties. she could be talking to battler or to someone else(although the EP2 tea party part telling you to"go to her because she is waiting for you to get up" followed by battler appearing with her sure seems to suggest it is battler,but the two events could be coincidences). either way,she is talking to"somebody."I"dont exist in this game.

Uh...Bernkastel was talking to both Battler AND the Reader. Though Bernkastel and Lambdadelta exist on a higher layer of reality than Beatrice and Battler, so it's a moot point there.

why was the fate not changeable?because virgilia wasnt an endless witch yet. if she was then the fate would have been changeable. that was explicitly stated in the scene.

But if magic isn't real, what does that scene leave you with?