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Old 2010-12-02, 18:36   Link #19323
musouka
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renall View Post
That's a very backhanded way of telling me I'm interpreting the story wrong.
Was I annoyed when I typed that out? Yes. I apologize for insulting you, as that wasn't really my intent, but it's quite irritating to try to have a positive conversation on this site only for it to be inevitably dragged down into general complaints about the quality of the series. I was looking forward to discussing Yasu, not getting into another pissing contest about the relative merits of Umineko as a work of fiction.

Quote:
But did you? She wasn't there. This character didn't exist. You only claim to see her now in what was there then, because before a thing was presented to you to accept as that existence behind the mask, all you had was the assumption that there was anything back there.
Let me tell you something. Based on discussions with a friend, we both came to the conclusion by the end of EP4 that there was a person we hadn't been introduced to that was behind Beatrice. You are welcome to disbelieve me, but discussing this elsewhere is what directly led to things like Jessitrice and the Pony Theory, as people took what we had discovered and used it to create their own theories. This included noticing and documenting things like:

1. Shannon was described as being different, unlike everyone else Battler had previously met when he had come to the island six years ago.
2. The fact that Beato is able to hold a conversation with herself.
3. The consistent switching of personal pronouns, especially when Beato is emotional and losing track of herself.
4. The red at the end of EP4.
5. Beato's shock at still looking like "herself" right before the EP3 Tea Party.
6. Lambda's discussion of actresses in the EP4 Tea Party.
7. The focus of EP4 being generally on miserable young women who turn to "witchcraft" as an outlet and escape for a feeling a lack of control over their own lives--Maria and Ange were pretty obviously paralleling Beato pretty strongly.
8. The broad hints that Beato was and still considers herself "furniture".
9. The only thing we knew regarding Battler's behavior six years ago, when his sin was committed, were promises he had thrown around indiscriminately.
10. A pattern established by Kuwadorian Beatrice of Kinzo believing that Beatrice's soul could be transferred to other bodies.
11. Hell, we even figured out that Genji and Kumasawa were in on "hiding" Beatrice based on Gohda's TIP--which also hinted at an "unknown person is behind Beatrice".

Don't get me wrong. We didn't figure everything out. For example, we thought that Kinzo was probably using orphans from Fukuin to transfer Beato into, and we refused to believe that Beatrice was (technically) Shannon. But all of those things we got from the first four episodes. The character we discussed was very similar to Yasu in personality. We just couldn't figure out how to make her fit into the plot.
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