[Sabaku Kyu]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

You can't compare the two things, in case of Hashirama and Madara we have two independent clans which are enemies and are fighting so desperately that it threatens the existence of their clans. As i wrote in my post there are external and internal enemies, and there's a big difference. Madara was an external enemy, just like in the Konoha vs other village cases. Madara was a leader of his own clan who was completely independent from Hashirama, and the Uchiha were the biggest threat to the Senju.

Same thing just different circumstances. Hashirama wouldn't have extended the truce if he didn't have faith Madara had enough integrity to honor it. He was wrong. Both Hashirama and Hiruzen were allied with irredeemable villains and vainly hoped that they would be able to work with them for a peaceful future. In both cases, the villain spit on that notion and plot against them anyway

My point was that the 3rd hokage was strong enough and had enough influence over his own vlllage and his ninja that he could have killed both Danzou and Orochimaru when it became clear that they are or will be a threat to the village, but he didn't do so because of his emotional connection to them.

Simply killing anyone you believe to be a threat in cold blood is not acting rationally. Hanzou went that route and ended up creating a powerful enemy who killed him and wiped out his entire family.

I was arguing that it was because of personal ties to these characters, not because of "altruism and mercy". We see how rational and cold Sarutobi is when it comes to other issues: sacrificing Neji's father who was an innocent man, and handling of the Uchiha case.

Not true. Sandaime allowed those things to happen. In both cases, these were decisions reached by others (Danzou and the elders for the Uchiha, the Hyuuga main family in the death of Neji's father) and Hiruzen didn't interfere because he had little choice. He has always been reluctant to resort to killing if there's any possible alternative. And it's not just with people he has personal ties to. Even when he believed he was talking to the Kazekage (though it turned out be Oro) who betrayed their truce, unleashed his army on the village and was holding a knife to his throat, he tried talking with him and thought it wasn't too late avoid a war.

Originally Posted by Hunter

Oh and Sabaku Kyu, the first time (that we know off) that Danzou acted against the village was when he made a secret deal with Hanzou in order to seize power from Sarutobi... And created Pain in the process.

You're correct as usual. Though I guess what I should've said is that Danzou hid his dirty dealings pretty well. So even though several didn't like him, there was never anything incriminating enough justify simply getting rid of him. We only recognize him as an obvious threat because we see behind the curtain as readers