[Haak]

Originally Posted by amaterasu4

For a second I thought you were being symbollic

Originally Posted by Washu-Chan

"Shinn really didn't win; I lost." -- Kira, to Athrun, in response to his defeat by Shinn in episode 34

Er...yeah...totally intentional...

Spoiler for @ monster:

Originally Posted by monster

Now that would be false equivalence.

For example, just because I would feel remorse for stealing something from a friend doesn't mean that stealing is now on the same level as murder.[/quote]

So if I follow this analogy correctly, that means what they did is on the same level of stealing (which is against the law) but not murder. That actually sounds about right to me. I'm not accusing them of murder.

I believe Yuuna asked Cagalli along the line of whether Cagalli was willing to let Orb burn again.

That's what I'm calling BS on though. Their decision to go with the treaty. There wasn't any hint before that.

As for the Orb military, it will follow what the government decides. In fact, if you're asking for reaction, you have it there in Destiny through the Orb soldiers. You saw how they remained loyal to the Orb government.

And how they hated it and eventually defected to Cagalli so they could follow their ideals again? Yes I saw.

And as for the people's hate, it could go either way. Just because they would hate the AF doesn't mean they would disagree with the decision to avoid fighting the AF on their own again.

But they would definitely disagree with a decision to join and help the AF. They'd be livid that they're now supporting the very people who invaded them and killed their people two years ago.

These ideals are there to protect Orb. Neutrality is just one method, which, yes, is interlinked with the other two in Orb's ideals. But again, the idea is to protect Orb.

Through neutrality. That's the method. That's the ideal.

Let's step back for a moment. First of all, we're just talking about the AF fleet that was sent to Orb, not the whole EA force. That fleet consists only of several ships and however many Strike Daggers they can safely fit. And remember, these are first generation mobile suits. With the AF Gundams out of the way, Freedom alone would be more than enough to help Orb's fleet.

If you're trying to argue that Orb did still have a chance in it then what you've pointed out is a plot hole. The fact of the matter is that the story still made it clear it was only a matter of time for Orb and they were quickly running out.

What happens if the US Constitution were to be abolished? The people would lose the rights they currently enjoy, including the right to have a say in the way the government is run.

What happens if Orb were to abolish its ideals? Nothing, Orb will still go to war when it wants to or not. But the people's relations with the government won't change and it doesn't affect any right they may have as Orb citizens.

Why does it have to affect it's human rights? The US Constitution is all about human rights, hence why abolishing it affects human rights. The ideals concern foreign policy not internal human rights.

Episode 44

Well I’m glad it didn’t go overboard with the Lacus Clyne debacle. It is serious because it potentially shows the ZAFT soldiers that they’ve been lied to by their own leader but nothing else. Gladys is right: Lacus Clyne isn't the one giving her orders.

But it looks like the whole thing with the Chairman doesn't matter anymore now that the attention is back on LOGOS and as Jibril ultimately proves to the final villain. I’d rather the Chairman was the final villain since Jibril is just too easy, but oh well.

But I have to wonder now why Jibril just didn't do that before. Was the cannon conveniently finished after he escaped to Orb or something?

Episode 45

Well it got me there. Jibril was dealt with quicker than I expected but what now? This means the Chairman really will be the final antagonist but I'm wondering what the Chairman will do now to achieve that. He’s been quite harsh when it comes to means and ends but it’s hard to see him become as much of a threat to the world (Or rather the solar system to be precise) as Jibril was.

And did this show just hint as a MeyrinXAthrun end? I hope so. I've actually been hoping for a while now but didn't say anything because I didn't think there was a chance but it looks like there’s one now. I think they make a better couple imo.

And as we turn towards the final arc, I can’t say any dam has broken nor can I imagine it happening in these final episodes. It’s certainly had its flaws but I'm finding it hard to consider it any worse than the first series if I'm honest.

[EDIT]

Episode 46

Ugh...

...Lacus Clyne...

They wasted a whole episode on this.

[EDIT]

Episode 47

OH MY GOD, they wasted TWO episodes on this. Just get the frikkin story already!

[EDIT]

Episode 48

Durandal's plan seems a bit vague. What exactly is the Destiny Plan supposed to achieve. Turn you into a Co-ordinator? Or this "maximising your genes" some sort of Gattaca style society in plan? Whatever the case he's fallen into the obvious trap as labelling everyone who disagrees with him an enemy. And what's more he's decided to use that giant canon as well. Ehh...I'm not really thrilled with this direction since now it just seems like conflict for the sake of it.

[EDIT]

Episode 49 & Final Plus

Well whatever misgivings I may have had about the set up to this conflict, this finale still ended up being very action packed and gripping. My only real complain here is that they didn't have the balls to kill any good guy except maybe Gladys (and no one cares about Gladys. I don't even know why she decided to die and abandon her son).

Didn't expect Rey to be the one to shoot Durandal but it does make some sense and was quite the twist. Though to be honest I think going to extent of being willing to kill Durandal was a slight step too far. I expected him to simply not intervene and let Durandal be shot, not be the one to shoot. Personally I think it would've been loads better if Kira and Rey were replaced with Athrun and Shinn in that scene but that's just me. This was good anyway.

Overall impressions

Same as my impressions with the first season really. It had it's good moments and bad moments. There was a bit of a larger than usual hiccup between episode 46 and 48 but otherwise I don't consider it that much more flawed than the first season. Maybe the first season is slightly better but only slightly. One thing that i don't think I've mentioned (and is more to do with the entire SEED franchise as a whole) is how Orb is just so God damn ideal and just happens to exhibit a lot of Japanese culture. Seems a bit obnoxious but maybe I'm just looking into things too much.

Overall Rating: 7.0/10