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Originally Posted by Vexx
That is the great flaw in the "you need religion to be good" assertion. Many species, including humanity, that are inherently social creatures practice empathy, altruism, charity, support, etc. simply because evolution selects for those traits -- they are conducive to the survival of the species. Social species behavior is intrinsically different than the "me me me" mode of behavior.
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Originally Posted by ChainLegacy
True enough, though it might be worth exploring the fact that humans are altruistic as an evolved tendency. That way, if you believe in god (or gods), you can say they indirectly caused the process of evolution and are thus still responsible. Then, if your faith does happen to be shaken, you can still understand it the same way, and not lose all your morality.
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I used to entertain the idea that "morality" in humanity is an evolved trait, but have since largely abandoned that view. In essence, it makes a mockery of free will. If we were "programmed" by our genes to be "moral" then, in effect, it means that we are not directly responsible for our own deliberate actions. That being the case, it is meaningless to talk about morality, since we are simply carrying out actions that we cannot help but carry out. A person's actions would thus be no more praiseworthy than they are something we can blame on the actor, since he is simply born to behave that way.
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Originally Posted by Reckoner
I find morals themselves to be meaningless. God or no God, what is the meaning? People tell us that this is "good" and this is "bad." But what does it all mean? Does good mean preserving life, and the emotion we call "happiness?" But do those two concepts by themselves have any meaning? Are emotions even important at all, at the very end?
...In the end, most of these morals seek to preserve life and certain emotions, that even with an eternal force in the universe, still doesn't matter. Are these two concepts themselves anything special? No, probably not.
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To me, morality is akin to aesthetic judgment. It is as difficult to describe what is "good" as it is to describe what is "beautiful". But that doesn't necessarily imply that "good" and "beauty" are meaningless. To answer one of your questions, yes, I believe that emotions are, in fact, very important when it comes to considering what is "right" and "moral", as we are thinking about ideas that have subjective meaning.
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Originally Posted by Reckoner
Then again what is meaning? Is meaning simply knowledge? It's unfathomable to me so see what could ever truly qualify as fulfillment in any human being.
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That sounds like an unnecessarily depressing line of reasoning. "Meaning" would, of course, imply some kind of knowledge, but it also involves more than just knowledge. It also includes how we feel about that knowledge.
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Originally Posted by Reckoner
We seek to drown ourselves in certain kinds of emotions, and our set of rules or "morals" just aid that cause. If God exists like said above, then the creator of everything also seeks to drown us in these emotions for whatever reason. But why are these emotions even worth anything?
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God, if he does exist, is not responsible for your actions. You are. If you choose to drown yourself in emotions, then that is your choice for which you are directly responsible. Why blame God?
It is also a bit pointless to ask whether emotions are worth anything since we are, by nature, born with said emotions. That is not something we can do anything about. They are simply a major part of our human nature. Now, we can learn to live with our emotions, or choose to let them control our every action. That is an individual choice. In the end then, you will be judged not so much by your emotions, but by the choices you make in spite of or according to your emotions.
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Originally Posted by Reckoner
Do we as humans just simply struggle with the fact that there is no ultimate goal to strive for? Because even if we were to reach the ultimate truth and meaning of the universe, does that bring us anything of worth? Are we all doomed to strive for such simple emotions that pleasure us?
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I would argue that the struggle to find meaning is in fact part of the meaning of life, as elaborated in Albert Camus'
Myth of Sisyphus.