[magnuskn]

And some space saving.

Spoiler for shpoilersh:

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

I doubt there was much time left afterward. 18 led right into 19 if you recall and 20 was Michael's death. Klan was too broken about Michael to do much more research on Sheryl. At that point, I think she took things at face value. So saying they stopped without anymore interest doesn't work given the timeline of events that happened afterward.

Actually, it does. They had some time to resume their work if they had wanted to.

But even if we take your timeline at face value, you are inferring interest out of nowhere. They didn't show any further interest in digging deeper into the whole scenario and while Macross Frontier didn't spell everything out what was going on beneath the surface, the show was pretty strong at showing at leasts hints and small character comments when people were going to do something... even if they were stopped later from doing it.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Oh, I love his piloting skills. (Take me on board, pilot. I'm all yours.)

But I wish he was a bit more attentive with other characters outside of the triangle. One thing I did grow to like about Hikaru was his attention to his other friends, especially if they were feeling under the weather. Alto throws this away in 9 and instead provokes Michael. He has to be told what the problem is. He, beforehand, doesn't settle down and think that Michael just might have similar problems to his own: family issues. Once he finds out, he does feel upset that he treated Michael that way. But later, after Michael is dead, he doesn't really visit Nanase. He throws yet another friend out to dry until 23.

I'm not saying that's a big character flaw, but given that he loves them all and wants to protect them, he needs to be more attentive to them. I'm not saying he hasn't done it before either. I could give you examples of how he's ignored signs from the triangle too (Ranka and Sheryl alone). It's just that he ignores or otherwise pushes people aside too much and when they're gone, he cries to himself, not realizing it's his own fault for not recognizing them sooner.

I think that's why I love Klan. She doesn't want him to be that way. (And I don't necessarily mean that she wants Alto to view Sheryl romantically, but rather she wants him to acknowledge that Sheryl is in trouble.)

Given that he is a rather private person, my guess is that he wants to give other persons the same right to privacy and expects that they can stand on their own, just as him. When he does get a clue that people around him are suffering, he is quick to help.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Well, I still wish some of the movie pieces would be inserted into the series more. I don't find the second half of the series endearing at all, sadly. It's just, the plot falls apart, and every character following it eats the pieces. I like the movie version better for the plot's ending.

Eh, for me the movie felt too sanitized. Grace, who was hell of an awesome villain, was totally removed from the picture, Leon did not get nearly enough of an upgrade to make up for it and the Galaxy conspirators really kinda out of nowhere.

Besides Michaels death, I like that the series was more messy.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Remember that unless Mishima did a thorough search to make sure he had no Galaxy people left behind in 22-23, there was bound to be someone left behind to leak information and provoke Frontier to rebel against its government.

It's not completely left impossible. People sneak into the government all the time.

Yeah, but saying that it was plausible doesn't mean that it really happened, that's my point. As I said above, the show was pretty good at giving the viewers information when things were going down. Lack of evidence doesn't mean that one can just make up whatever one thinks is most convenient, but rather that the thing in question probably didn't happen.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

He was more honorable in the movie: giving his life to the Vajra Queen to stop the war.

He didn't have to give up his life in the series. How does that make him less honorable than the movie version?

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Regardless, like I said, he has many flaws in the series which made me dislike him quite a bit. His habit of throwing things under the rug, especially when it involves the enemy or plot, wasn't necessary. His movie self made up for this by taking things at face value and questioning what facts he had. An example: the Vajra are the enemy, Ranka says otherwise, question it then find evidence to back it up. And he did. Compared to his series self which said: the Vajra are enemy, Ranka says otherwise, sweep it under the rug, kill all the Vajra.

Different circumstances, different characters. He works fine for in his series incarnation.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Except Ranka seemed very particular about Grace after 15. She seemed very suspicious, especially at first, of why Grace had become her manager. But too bad where Ranka was headed would show her exactly why that suspicion was correct in all the wrong ways.

Well, if she was very suspicious, she surely had a strange way of expressing that, by aquiescing to every demand Grace made of her.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Let me rephrase my original quote: "they didn't think it was awfully convenient that Grace disappeared after Ranka betrayed Frontier?"

I get that Mishima knew what happened. However, the other characters did not. Outside of Sheryl, whom was aware of Grace's betrayal by that point, the other characters knew nothing. And poor Luca, whom had been in league with Mishima for a while, didn't know. So it leaves me back on: "no one questioned how convenient it was?"

I find it ironic, really.

Once again, the actual question becomes "How aware were those characters that Grace had disappeared in the first place?"

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Well, it seems that to this one, it is rather unique. And compared to past Macross', this one is the worst in that sense. Even 7 had better understanding of the plot despite the stupidity of the series itself (and the epicness of Basara).

I always preferred Gamlin. The true stars of the show were always Max and Milia, anyway.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

She should've shared the fact they were able to reproduce much like birds (eggs ftw ). Other than that, I doubt the government would believe her words of seeing visions of her mother.

Maybe they would have. But she at least should have tried to tell them.

Again, I prefer my explanation of her having another disasociative amnesia attack due to the stress of the situation.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

The reason being for that was because the government was in a state of war, therefore they wave off the trial beforehand. It's nothing to do with what's happening in the USA, that is how all government works when at war and a spy is found in their mists.

Anwar Al-Awlaki. US citizen, assassinated via drone strike on an executive order without any judicial review.

Eh, sorry. I probably shouldn't bring real life politics into this.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

I really doubt she wouldn't. Like I said above, Frontier has declared a state of war. That means she'd get execution without trial if found to be a spy. However, I do say that it is possible that Mishima might've waved it off or used it as blackmail to get Ranka's powers.

Grace needs her. She has power over Leon and Leon essentially runs the government by manipulating President Glass. It's highly, highly unlikely that they would have harmed Ranka.

I will give you that it would have given them an excellent tool to take her into custody and deny her friends and family access to her, however. That would have made it very easy for them to manipulate her.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

No, I refer to her fake death scene in the movie that was similar to Michael's actual death scene in the series. She didn't pull it off so well. They drew her like a stick figure (for most of the movie too) and the only piece that was nice was the tear on Alto's cheek (which by all logical means should not have hit him since everything is going out and not in, otherwise she would've just fallen).

Ah, allright.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

I don't think it's worth finding something official to state it, especially since Frontier gives you a bit of evidence that says so in the episode. However, evidence for that is moot to Kawamori. Whether or not you take the side that says "it did" or "it didn't," he doesn't care about giving you proof of that part of the story because it's so small.

True enough, let's drop it then.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

Alto, at this point, was just believing whatever the government told him, so I don't count that as noble. However, if he died in 24, and for something he truly believed in, then yes; I'd say that's noble.

He is a good, honorable soldier and someone whose loyalty to his home and friends cannot be questioned, given the totality of his actions. That counts as noble in my book.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

I still say Sheryl was still quite a bit selfish in the second half of the series as opposed to her movie self. And that's why I like her series self better. It's just that, in the series, Sheryl and Ranka were more like sisters (albeit jealous sisters at some points) that knew each other very well. The movie version carries this too. However, Sheryl's persona change does make her fall slightly into the category of being a new Ranka, because she's more open with Alto and allows him to see the side of herself she's hidden so early, and her feelings for him start off as a crush (especially in the flashback). I believe that is why so many AR fans are saying that movie!Sheryl is the series version of Ranka whom fell in love with Alto on first sight. It's not that the whole version of Ranka is mixed in with Sheryl's movie persona, it's that parts of Ranka's persona is mixed into Sheryl's movie persona to make her more able to adapt to the storyline and win the love triangle better. The changes in the storyline especially in the first movie prove my point considering Sheryl got little recycled footage from the series in the first movie compared to other characters. And her attitude in both movies backs up that.

She is more human in the series, that is for sure. But she is also still the better person, because Sheryl from the movies still has that "harvesting Rankas organs" thing going against her.

All in all, Sheryl from the movies felt less like a real person to me. Still an awesome character, though.

Originally Posted by LoveMeKags

If Kawamori ever did a sequel in any way, there might be a time skip to avoid the rehashing or need to get over the series (or in Sheryl's case, the fact she was dying). But regardless, if she returned as her series self, in the sense of whom she was from beginning to end, I think I'd grow to like her more.

Past character development definitely needs to acknowledged, that's for sure.