[VezSketch]

Akiyoshi, have I talked to you on another forum?

Sorry about the tl;dr, guys.

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

I agree with Keroko in that Nanoha is able to enhace her physical power with magic but by herself she's probably just as strong as a well-trained human woman her age and size. I'm pretty sure speed and kinetic force can be greatly enhaced with the use of barriers and flying spells, like her Flash Impact combo she used on Fate on Season 1.

Nanoha could block Subaru and Teana's attacks without her device bare-handley under a limiter. Those two are stronger now, but Nanoha's physical strength (or high-tier or mid-tier mages in general) shouldn't be underestimated. The fact she can contend with Signum and Thoma (Thoma was much stronger while fighting Nanoha than he is currently) in physical combat puts her far above Subaru in physical strength.

I have doubts because we didn't saw anything, the explosion ocurred and then they appeared after the explosion so we didn't get to know how they blocked the attacks. Isis doesn't have any feats supporting she could block an attack that big just like that ...Agito is an even bigger question mark as she shouldn't suppossed to be able to block Tohma's attackas at all, so it's easy to assume she find a way to get around that that doesn't involve magical shields as we know those are useless agains EC Drivers. With Zafira, if you're talking about him blocking Chrono's Stiger Blade-Execution Shift. Yeah you robably right, except for the fact Zafira casted a special shield for that and unlike Hiryuu Issen and Divine buster, that was an attack swith ana acumulative effect on a wide spread area so it's in a sense a bit easier to protect from it than form attacks that focus their damage in one spot like the afformentioned two.

The fact we didn't see them do anything additional to block those attacks isn't supporting evidence towards them in fact doing so. Blocking the attacks is a feat. Zafira's barrier was just a barrier, we have nothing indicating it was "special." You have no basis to claim otherwise. While Chrono's attack wasn't focused, it still wasn't enough power to destroy his barrier and that's all that matters in this case.

They're only stronger than Subaru in terms of magical power, Subaru is a cyborg and unlike Nanoha or Fate she have many feats of great physical strenght.

Like I said before, Nanoha is much stronger than Subaru. Fate is, too. Jet Zanber is comparable to Vita's Gigantform as shown in A's and is now used as a basic melee attack. Her riot forms of her Zanber were able to OHK Tre and Sette (these were S-Ranks ...) while under an AMF and is now something she's shown using in base (upgraded and stronger forms). Zest was able to break Graf Eisen in a compact gigantform (it should carry the same durability, but not power) and knocked Vita out of unison, knocking out Rein II. Her device was not damaged while hitting Reinforce's barrier in A's (this is something that's been estimated to be hundreds of meters and over millions of tons due to how big Reinforce's body was, Vita swung it to reach the Defense System in a fraction of a second. Being able to do that makes her ordinary physical attacks with a more compact Graf Eisen strong as hell - Vita in A's is definitely not as strong as Fate, Signum, Nanoha, and other high tier characters are currently. And Subaru is as strong as Vita never. That's the single most impressive direct physical feat we can scale in the series.).

For starters, she's able to lift and throw people many feet in the air without any magic whatsoever, can punch trough concrete, steel, and whatever alloy the Gadget drones are made of, her special Cyborg Power involves making her fists to emit wild supersonic vibrations something that requires an incredibly tough body to pull off an in such a state she can even punch trough the Saint Craddle's walls (something Nanoha only achieved with a Blaster-3 Divine Buster)

Nothing impressive - the little girls in Vivid have more impressive feats that can be scaled to Subaru in StrikerS, like Einhalt destroying Miura's golem's fist with her physical strength, and then later destroying the entire golem. The Golem's made of rock and tens of meters in height. Rio's lift and toss of this rock (just eyeballing shows it's more than a hundred tons). Hari's breaking of said rock. Nanoha under a limiter was stronger than Subaru was during the events of StrikerS, anyway. And everyone and their mother could cleave through Gadget Drones like butter (best displayed by Nanoha, Fate, and Signum, actually - they did it much easier than people like Ginga and Subaru did). Also, Divine Buster was used to reach Quattro down below in the Cradle while under an AMF, its usage doesn't mean anything and can't be used as an argument to suggest Nanoha couldn't break the walls of the Cradle like Subaru.

, and don't forget what Keroko says about her new ability of braking weapons with her left hand. There's no doubt Nanoha and Fate are a lot more powerfull than Subaru in the overall scenario but physically Subaru is far stronger than them and most members of Section Six, being probably just as strong or even stronger than Vita and Signum themselves.

Sword Break is impressive, but not that much. Subaru is strong but not that strong.

Quinn used an especial attack along with her divider sword, and attack Cypha explained in detail during their fight.

Also note Quinn didn't even scratch Cypha with the same method, Fate left Cypha with damage (Signum was damaging Cypha with several hits) and without getting hit in a fight. One attack from Cypha went through Quinn. Fate is much stronger than Quinn just like Cypha. It's also notable Fate was the only one on her side with the upper hand against her opponent in their tag match on Esquad, lol.

Deville on the other hand damaged Erio's unit with brute streght alone.

Yeah, but then you have Thoma cleaving through Nanoha's Fortress Shields and she was fighting with him without going all out (she wasn't trying to beat him down, wasn't using her more powerful spells, no blaster bits or system, etc. No way she was operating with full power). Base DeVille was not on par with Fate (that would also suggest he could match a Reacted Cypha) and because of his quick transformation, we don't how he would've fared in a fight with her.

It's doubtful if Vita and Signum could "curbstomp Quinn" tough, as she's an EC Driver and her reacted divider is probably even more powerfull.

They would.

Cypha can get away with that because she have more experience with EC powers as also having the power of being tough as hell and thus able to fend off Quinn's attack that will be unblockable for non EC Driver opponents.

Non EC Driver opponents can block them ... as we've seen. Not being able to block an attack because of anti-magic also says nothing.

Subaru's low rank came more likely from her limited fightstyle as she have mostly melee-range attacks and is unable to fly which can limit her effectiveness under certain conditions. For everything else, see the above explanation about her feats xD.

Yeah. Being able to be scaled as powerful as Arf is impressive because of Arf's feat on the Garden of Time when she blasts a hole (since the Garden of Time has been estimated to be massive, the size of the rocks she made fly in a fraction of a second were pretty big. Kinetic energy and all) to escape Precia.

Correction, Fortress mode can physically contend with Tohma and Nanoah did go all out in the battle yet Tohma shruged of the damage like nothing due to his very powerfull healing factor. Once Tohma destroyed the Strike Cannon and the Fortress units(in one raid to boot) Nanoha was left totally defenseless and at his mercy being in the need to be rescued by Subaru before Tohma can deal the killing blow.

Nanoha wasn't operating with full power like I mentioned above and the intent wasn't to defeat Thoma in combat. Thoma did shrug off the damage but the attacks she used on him can't be compared to spells like Strike Stars, Exelion Buster, SLB, etc. I do have to say it was impressive he could withstand the heat of a plasma beam, though. Subaru saving Nanoha doesn't make her anymore impressive, Thoma would've destroyed her.

Why is that a massive leap in logic? Isis surviving a broken neck from a man who can break steel with brute strenght alone is very clear feat of durability, Isis even bleed from the attack proving that Deville wasn't lying when he said he broke her neck. That's definetely something almost everyone else on Section Six wouldn't be able to rise from without assitance and some time in the hospital. It's also a hint about Isis misterious nature.

Breaking steel isn't impressive in the Nanoha universe and Base DeVille could not break the necks of everyone in Section Six, he hasn't even been proven to be as strong as the more powerful members.

I agree with Curren being the strongest of them all, tough xD!

She's probably fight in chapter 40 in like 2 years.