[Patchwork Chimera]

Originally Posted by Captain Bluebeard

Do you even understand what Yasu's motive was? Because you're basically reffering to the many-many-many-many bits forming it, seeming to be actually missing the essence. At least, revenge for forgetting to bring her a pony is not it.

Yasu's hope to be loved, her despair and her confusion come as facepalmin worth... she's had the good things since the begining. She's loved, she's going to marry, she's rich, she doesn't have to deal with kinzo and she could stop all the bad things that happen in her work if she just said 'heir of kinzo here, I'll take enough to live a life and leave the rest of the money to you'. All the siblings would call her the witch Beatrice or even Kinzo if she said so.

Originally Posted by Captain Bluebeard

We've been assuming that Prime-Yasu is the culprit just for argument's sake, but I actually don't really believe that. In EP5, Battler reaches a truth. A truth that not only makes him forgive Beato, it even makes him willing to apologize to her. That's a good enough reason to believe that PrimeYasu isn't the culprit, and does not deserve being despised.

Yeah, I don't think she killed them all alone. But she had accomplices and was trying at least to recreate a murder game. So nobody died. She still wanted Battler to see the 'corpses' of his family while he kept enough calm to resolve the whydunit of someone who he barely remembers. So Prime Yasu, at least, was an ass.

Originally Posted by Captain Bluebeard

Like Yasu, Eva wasn't a saint either. She did fuck Ange's life up, it's twisted to blame her for feeling remorseful about that fact.

And after all, what if Yasu didn't really kill her family? Yasu, the author of the forgeries isn't PieceBeatrice but MetaBeatrice. PieceBeatrice is the role she assigns to herself. However, in actuality, she is Meta-Beatrice, the one who spins the tales, killing and reviving everyone endlessly.

Eva is apologizing for being a bad Aunt over and over in twilight. Beatrice is eating some snacks and floating around her husband.

Besides, Eva is not the type to forgive some stranger's mistakes if they led to her losing something. She's kind of an ass, too. Someone had to start the circus, and that someone was Yasu even if she didn't kill anyone.

Originally Posted by Captain Bluebeard

That's a bit controversial in this case. Because Yasu's motive would be perfectly understandable to a person who actually believes in magic. I don't think such people exist (or at least the're very scarce?), but I am willing to accept it in the context of Umineko.

And actually, I do sympathize with (Piece)Yasu. I'm not saying I agree with killing everyone, I'm just saying I can see how she has been hurt, regardless of disagreeing with her actions.

Are you sure we're on the same page about Yasu's motive?

Yes, I know her motive. What I was saying is that it sound really weird and non-convincing to me. The 'wanted to blow up something' was just to show how much sense her starting point made to me.

Originally Posted by Captain Bluebeard

Yean, but you know what? IF! She had no way to know how George might react. And Yasu is always depicted as a really insecure person (considering her body and how she's been brought up, it's natural).

Yasu's case isn't the same as that. Plus, she's sort of in the middle of a huge mess she herself has been creating for six years.

I seriously believe (and forgive me if my assumptions are rushed) that either you don't get the situation or you're just trying to be sarcastic. But you know, Yasu isn't afraid that George might not like her body. She's scared because it practically ruins his dreams for their relationship's future. Plus, her confession isn't an easy one to make.

Needless to say, I disagree with her choice of not coming clean with George, but it's not like it's hard to guess where it came from.

One of the triggers to make her so inclined to murder was this. She was so worried about George's reaction. Why didn't she use that 'bet magic' in betting on something else than trying to ruin the day of a guy she didn't even knew? She could've made a bet like 'I come clean. Red, George likes me and we go. Black, George doesn't like me and I stay with milady. Special slot (0): Battler remembers me.' She went and involucred bribes, gold, murder misteries and explosions.

Originally Posted by GoldenLand

I have the feeling you're confusing the meta-layer/Rokkenjima Prime with the gameboards here. It looks as if you're talking partially about Tohya. If meta-Battler in the games is representing the part of Tohya that's Battler, then to him, if he realises that Beatrice is the culprit on the gameboard but might not be the culprit in Rokkenjima Prime, then maybe he has reason to forgive her. If Beatrice is painting herself as the culprit in the stories to cover for someone, then he could feel bad about thinking it was her. (Particularly if Battler is the real culprit or an accomplice! )

The impression I got isn't that Battler forgave Beatrice, but that he realised that she wasn't to blame in the first place and that he even wanted her forgiveness. Now, if what he realised was "If only I hadn't forgotten my promise, Beatrice wouldn't have killed my family! It's all my fault!" then OK, things are messed up there. But it doesn't make sense for him to think that, in my opinion. Jesus or not, it isn't a logical train of thought for him to follow. Meta-Battler didn't get presented as a person who would simply forgive mass murder in real life. But he did grow into someone who wasn't always horrified by "fictional" murder on the gameboards - like in the love duel, where he was hardly yelling at Jessica/George/Shannon/Kanon/Beatrice for the murders they committed during that.

Put in purple were wyou wrote the point I was trying to make. Cuz I like purple, no particular reason. Battler can forgive judas for all I care, but his reasons and reactions are so messed up is not funny. That's what I was trying to say. Where did that line of thought engendrated, Battler?

Originally Posted by Wanderer

Which makes Bern the biggest hypocrite in the world for the way she treats Ange and Erika. Meanwhile Beatrice's "torture" was just a front all along, anyway.

Bern has her standards. So she was a bitch, I never said she wasn't. But remember, Erika is a piece created from herself. Is like if Yasu started treating bad Shannon or Beatrice: she's just bitching at something that in the general POV is herself.

At the end, Ange got her anwers and everything else, and Erika became a detective/witch. Earn your happy ending, and all that.

Originally Posted by Wanderer

It just doesn't matter how much pain she's in, it doesn't make sense to randomly kill everyone.

In the first place, it was not the revelation of Yasu's sexual problems, or the revelation that her most trusted guardians were lying to her her whole life or anything like that that actually triggered any actual intent to murder. The trigger was Battler's return.

So how could news of Battler's return cause Yasu to plan and carry out a mass murder?

In other words, it's not a matter of her "snapping" from pain. In fact, it's more like she "snapped" from hope. So what we have is a situation where Yasu's motive for killing over a dozen people is not vengeance, nor desire for destruction caused by a sense of powerlessness, nor some other motive that places intrinsic meaning in the act of taking the lives of the victims. No, the motive is to create a chance of Battler remembering her. In other words, these murders are no more than a means to an end. The victims are less than human. They're consumable tools. They're pieces.

This is not a satisfying motive for murder. It's a fantasy motive.

Yasu simply has no "mystery" motive. That's why I think Yasu is innocent in Prime.

From Dlanor's Forward in Our Confessions (previously translated by LyricalTwilight):

Without love, it can't be seen.

They are her words.
But I shall repeat them.

Love exists in everyone's hearts.

Her true tragedy was that she couldn't see it.

So Yasu's motive was fantasy. In real world she doesn't have any.

Wait, what?