[user112168]

Originally Posted by wisteria233

The only real inference we have to go by is them saying that Ranshe had the virus when she gave birth to Ranka, they never said anything about Brera because logically they weren't looking for information about him.

You have zero evidence for Brera being infected by v-type bacteria, whereas there is the video ep 24 5:00+ discusses Grace's use of fold-quartz in her control implants.
Also, Brera's abilities are more in line with Alto + earring than with Ranka / Sheryl.

Which doesn't prove your point

Saying so don't make it so. I'll reiterate the point we've been discussung in this line you claim to be able to refute, along with all the evidence and citations.

Originally Posted by me

"CLAIM 1": Alto heard both singers during the ep 7 concert / battle.

- This is what you've been disputing.

Evidence : your own eyes and ears watching episode 7, from about 19:30+

Supporting Evidence : 2 scenes from episode 15 :-

Scene 1 (ep 15, 9:45+) : Grace's lot : (words) "...the separate fold wave mixed with Sheryl's singing intercepted by Brera when we had him scout inside the Vajra Carrier" accompanied by pictures of the ep 7 battle, and inside the carrier. This speech follows a section making it clear the separate fold-wave was Ranka's

Scene 2 (ep 15, 17:45+) Alto : "But I was save too ... By you two singing [...] When I was about bite the dust during the farewell concert battle, I felt like I heard something...your two singing voices" This is also accompanied by images from the ep 7 event.

Now, do you still dispute my "CLAIM 1" or not?

Grace controlled Ranka who then controlled the Vajra. Once Ranka woke up Grace lost control over the Vajra.

Episode 23, 14 mins in, Ai-kun's eyes turn red, he captures Ranka and hands her over to Grace. There's no way Ranka caused her own capture by Grace here.

And that's not quite true about what happened when Ranka woke up. Grace maintained her control over the network, regardless of Ranka being asleep, but when Ranka and Sheryl sang they competed with Grace's control.
Sorry to be picky, but you left that one open

Considering the fact that you've been touting that scene around as Alto's sudden break through in terms of character development, makes for why your joke doesn't translate well.

The joke was about the earring. The scene i've been discussing in ep 23 has NOTHING to do with the earring, and I haven't tried at any point to link the earring to that scene.

It doesn't make it any less of a Dues ex Machina, that's what I said on the subject of Alto suddenly being able to use fold waves.

Does something being Deus-ex-Machina change whether you believed it happened in the story?

You've actually misread a lot of scenes. Brera's also had said harmonica since he was young, so you might want to abandon ship on your theory of Brera having anything but cybernetic attachments. Those voices share one body, she's not talking to them from across the galaxy, she's talking to them inside her head. It was explained in the third Drama Cd.
Again Brera is a cyborg he has cybernetics attached to his body. It was never stated that Brera had fold quatrz in his body where does it say that Brera had fold quatrz in his body. The blood could have just been because of strain from him breaking free from the programing installed by Grace. Never once did they say that he had fold quartz in his head. Its more of an example of cybernetics eat your soul. Grace controlled Brera like she controlled galaxy.

Maybe she shared her head with those voices, it's not a big deal.
Ok we'll just say Brera communicated by magic then? Despite the facts
1. Grace's implant and control technology used fold-quartz (ep 24)
2. Grace had plans to stick the control implants in as many human's heads as possible, or kill any human who resisted
3. Brera was a cyborg with implants, and under Graces control, a prime candidate for having a control implant
4. Brera able to receive fold waves from both girls in episode 7 (confirmed to be true in ep 15)
5. Brera able to astral communicate with Ranka, same as Ranka/Sheryl in ep 7, and Alto/Ranka/Sheryl in ep 25.
6. Fold-quartz gives instantaneous transmission - perfect for controlling Brera more effectively. Why wouldn't Grace have used the tech on Brera? or for her link with Macross Galaxy for that matter?

1) They never said that Brera had fold quartz installed his body just cybernetics

They said as much when they revealed Grace's tech for controlling people was based on fold-quartz implants in ep 24.

2)Grace used Ranka to control the Vajra because she couldn't do so on her own

The scene where Ai-kun turns on Ranka to capture her and gives her to Grace.

3) Alto does not have the ability to produce fold waves

Several sources state there's fold-quartz inside the v-type bacteria, and when you consider it, that's got to be true. Otherwise fold-quartz is NOT the only substance that can emit the fold-waves, and loses it's significance. So, Ranka and Sheryl are both using fold-quartz in a way already - it amplifies their singing as fold-waves. it's not hard then, to say Alto with fold-quartz could have a fraction of their power.

4)They also never said that Grace had fold quartz installed in her body either so I have no idea where you got that from

From episode 24, near the start. Plus she monitors fold-waves during the series - you need fold-quartz for that. And she would obviously be using her own zero-time-implant technology, there's more than one Grace (clones) at most times remember?

5)Fold quartz is a rare commodity in the Macross universe there isn't enough to just go passing around like its the holidays

A few key agents and clones is hardly likely to break the bank. If the stuff was that hard for Grace to acquire, she'd have yanked those earrings out of Sheryl's ears the minute she met her. She is shown to directly control at least one Vajra, and Galaxy / Brera's craft seem to be able to hide from the Vajra pretty well even before Grace got control of the queen. If MacGalaxy can hide near the Vajra main planet without alerting the Vajra to their presence, they can definitely take out a few straggling Vajra for more Fold-Quartz

6)Grace and Brera as well as most of Galaxy are cyborgs as in they have cybernetics installed in them, yes their minds included (in the Drama CDs Grace erases her memories of Sheryl growing up so that she would be able to exact her revenge).

Pure cybernetics can't interact with fold-waves without the fold-quartz present. This would dilute any reason to go after the fold-quartz in the series.

7) fold quartz does not give you the ability to emit your own fold waves

How does it work in Grace's implant set-up then ? this was supposed to give human-human direct contact using fold-quartz (creating an 'overmind' like the Vajra)