[azul120]

Originally Posted by Xander

Blame Lelouch himself, who essentially says even in early R2 (and mid-to-late S1, from what I recall) that he was committing evil to defeat a greater evil.

Is evil not morally repugnant? The lesser evil is not an absolute good. Ask the victims or innocent observers what they would say about the morality of such things.

He was granting freedom to the people with one hand and carrying out numerous ethical offenses with the other. The man was (usually) not deluded about the fact that, for all his propaganda and the truth that he did produce good results, his rebellion included lots of evil actions taken for an ostensibly good cause. Which is where the logic of "the ends justify the means" comes in. If the means were absolutely good, there would be no such tension in place.

The real or perceived lack of options does not alter this.

Allow me to counter with the following: All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing. Lelouch would never succeed by playing fair, and any efforts would amount to naught, basically tantamount to doing nothing.

To paraphrase Lelouch, even when he was just acting as Zero:

"I am Zero...the man who destroys the world...and creates it anew!"

"Destruction always comes before creation."

etc.

The scale of the destruction was obviously larger when he assumed the role of Emperor Lelouch, though one might well argue the details, but think back to Narita (a miscalculation, yes, but he embraced it after the fact) or even the original Black Rebellion which destroyed large portions of the Tokyo Settlement's surrounding area. Not to mention his co-responsibility for the actual destruction of Tokyo at the hands of the FLEIJA warhead. Calculate how many people had died in those events.

The FLEIJA warhead was practically Schneizel's doing, orchestrated against him. Besides, Lelouch allowed Schneizel to set Damocles in motion as part of the gambit.

Another thing, Tokyo Settlement destruction <<<<<<<< Mt. Fuji destruction.

From Lelouch's perspective, he simply applied that same line of thought again.

As for the last part, that's where the other theme repeated numerous times throughout both seasons comes in:

"When Lelouch and Suzaku are together, they can accomplish anything."

Unrealistic and risky? Absolutely, but it's thematically consistent.



Lelouch either forgave them or didn't care about that. He only chose to deal with his own fate, not theirs.

He only ran away from the duty of helping with the reconstruction of the world and not caused as many deaths by taking another route to world peace.

Originally Posted by wredsa

Without Suzaku's help Lelouch would not achieve World Peace. For one of those reasons ZR was born. Lelouch seemed satisfied enough chilling in the World of C, but then Suzaku came with CC and they intended to stop Schneizel.

All those talk about transgression of Emperor Lelouch is mostly made up. Lelouch did not commit any real crime while being Emperor ( except for chaining up his former allies ).

Lelouch's guilt was using geass and the collateral damage his rebellion caused. Funny thing is even Abraham Lincoln caused collateral damage while saving the African-Americans from slavery.

Lelouch caused less collateral damage and geass usage during the rebellion than the ZR. And if you think he didn't commit any real crime, you might want to check out the 2nd to last picture drama (Turn 22.05).

Lelouch could have also achieved world peace without Suzaku's interference at key moments: keeping Nunnally in Britannia's grip, ready to be used against him as a pawn, the 2nd fight over Tokyo where he refused to back down even though he knew he was outclassed, resulting in FLEIJA going off.

Originally Posted by wredsa

It is not quite bad guys win but some bad guys redeemed after going through ordeals themselves ( like Cornelia ), however Schneizel got the short end of the stick. He had the worst outcome of all ( being a doll for Zero ).

Cornelia was WORSE than Lelouch ever was during the rebellion, and had been at it for much longer. She razed a ghetto of innocents for pete's sake. Never really atoned or repented for her barbaric racism. Just read a plausible fanfic scene where a Saitama refugee encounters her in the infirmary where she is recovering from Schneizel's bullets, and threatens to kill her as payback for her family.