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Old 2012-05-13, 21:39   Link #1002
ultimatemegax
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
A discussion focusing on KyoAni/Kadokawa recently took off on the Anime DVD/BD Sales in Japan: Discussion thread, so I'm moving it over here.
Thank you for moving it. I felt very uncomfortable talking about solely KyoAni in that thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I'm pretty sure that A-1 Pictures pulled it (2 10k sellers in one season) off in 2011.
Correct. A1 had both Blue Exorcist and AnoHana in Spring and both sold over 10k (barely in the case of the former). I believe the only other example would be KyoAni's own double-dip of K-On! and The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya in Spring 2009 (just counting the new episodes).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I'd just like to see KyoAni have one project going per season. Back in 2011, KyoAni had exactly one project going on between Winter 2010/2011 to Fall 2011 - Nichijou (the K-On movie probably fits best in Winter 2011/2012). So one two cour project over four seasons. So even if they could add just one additional project per year that could make a huge difference.

For example, back in 2011, that one extra project could have been a FMP sequel (airing in the Fall, say).

This year, it could have been a Haruhi sequel.

In 2013, it could have been Little Busters (Key probably would have waited that long if they had assurance that KyoAni could roll it out by 2013).

So with a bit more production capacity, KyoAni could take on the Nichijous and the Hyou-Kas, and still have the ability to please their established Key, Haruhi, and FMP fans.
The issue with this as I see it is that while sequels are usually easy to plan (Haruhi and (blank)monogatari not-withstanding), new shows take a little while to start up production, which we are not told about until later. This is the first season that a non-Yamada or non-Ishihara work has aired since Spring 2007. Those two (and Takemoto) direct the vast majority of the KyoAni works. Yamada, iirc, trained under Ishihara during the Key works. I'm not sure if they would want to either hire an outside director or promote someone (Ishidate?) to be a third director just for continous work.

Another note is that, unlike other studios that pay per cut, KyoAni animators are paid an hourly salary. They don't rush to finish shows so they have the time to put in quality work. Adding another show (without substantially increasing the amount of animators or outsourcing) would likely overwork those people, thus decreasing quality. A-1 and Shaft get away with multiple jobs because of outsourcing and paying per cut. It's not how KyoAni works, and that prevents additional works.

Having said that, I think they could repeat what happened in 2008/2009. Instead of taking a Spring/Summer show, they likely continued to work on Clannad and finished After Story early. During the late fall/early winter/spring seasons, they then worked on Haruhi-chan/Churuya-san/K-On!/Haruhi 2009/[in quick succession, culminating in the Haruhi movie. Since K-On!! would be a sequel, the amount of animation pre-production work was significantly decreased, and they could animate it quickly. That's probably one of the main reasons why it came out and not Little Busters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
As is, it seems like KyoAni is always forced to choose - More work appealing to fans of an established property, or more new projects; it seems hard for them to have a little bit of both. They tend to keep getting stuck with either leaving some of their fans out in the cold or not doing anything new/different at all, and that's a harsh and unfortunate choice to make, of course.
With the amount of time it takes to produce the animation production materials, we see it as "choosing a new property" much too easy compared to "making a sequel." I can say that Haruhi was decided prior to Fall 2005. Lucky Star was probably decided around that time. Nichijou was confirmed to be picked in 2009. Hyouka was likely decided in 2010. Without knowing sales numbers in 2009 and 2010 for the Haruhi DVDs/BDs, they made those choices over another season of the latter. They couldn't have known how well they would do or if they would sell. After these contracts are signed, it's probably not easy to break them, so they were stuck working on those two projects.

As for the Key works, due to the quick succession of them, I would imagine that TBS/Pony Canyon decided on those three first and then decided to do something new for K-On!. Unlike the Kadokawa works, I'm not as versed in these decisions, so I can't say anything concrete. I'd argue that a sequel to K-On! was the most likely choice to have something airing in 2010. It's rather strange how we've not heard anything about their next work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
Full Metal Panic and Haruhi are the only two I can think of that were Kyoto and Kadokawa series that had sequels. Full Metal Panic: TSR was not fuctionally a sequel to Full Metal Panic? Fumoffu, but one to the GONZO aimated first series. Haruhi is Haruhi, and with the ways they tell things, it is hard to pin the title "sequel" on anything other than the movie. It actually is almost impossible to define exactly what Haruhi 2009 was.

But my contention in terms outside of DVD/BD sales is that Haruhi already sells. And while a new Haruhi series or film would almost certainly sell 20K+ in disks, the series itself doesn't need more animated to generate sales of other products, since people already buy those things. With a new show (Hyouka in this case), there is greater potental for profits throughout all Kadakawa's many branches. All sales will be new aside from some of the older book series fans. Given that the books are selling in the 20K+ region, that means a lot of profit on a 11 year old novel, plus the BD/DVDs, plus any other merchandizing they can come up with. That is a lot of money to come in, all while people are still buying Haruhi products at only a slightly lesser rate than if there was a show on the air. About the only sales projection that they lose on is potental BD/DVD sales of a new Haruhi anime, and I imagine they get more from the volume of sales of other products related to Hyouka than they lose by not making Haruhi for Disc sales. Because everything else Haruhi still sells.

I understand this argument, and I've read variations of it before. On a case-by-case basis, it makes some sense.

But if you always choose the new property over Haruhi, then there's a risk of the Haruhi property losing popularity before it might if you had more anime material of it to help generate increased/sustained interest in it.
To me, it feels like Kadokawa asked KyoAni, "what work do you want to animate?" and Takemoto said "The Kotenbu series" and they let him work on it while Ishihara did Nichijou. Kadokawa has barely promoted this work on their own. This feels more like a KyoAni decision than any other non-Munto work prior. First announcements, special website, constant CMs during broadcasts, named as a sponsor of timeslots, etc. The only negative I can see for that theory is that they're not listed as one of the copyright names like Kadokawa Shouten is, but that's likely a reference to the publishing side. For all we know right now, this could be a project to hold over until Haruhi turns 10 next year. It doesn't make business sense to promote a series that's barely published 5 novels in 9 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Basically, my questions to you (and anybody else interested in answering it) is as follows: What's the end game here? Does Kadokawa have to exhaust its full list of properties before KyoAni gets to do more Haruhi? If so, does Haruhi ever get more animated material done?

Are fans of the Haruhi anime just to be left out in the cold forever, in spite of how strongly they supported the show in huge sales for Haruhi 2006 and Disappearance (and even buying Haruhi 2009 in numbers that most studios would consider a hit)?

At this juncture, if KyoAni/Kadokawa was to come out and say "There will be a new Haruhi show in 2015", I'd take that over what we have now. Yes, it would mean a long wait, but it would be something concrete at least.
One avenue for why no Haruhi announcement could be what happened with announcing a "second season" and then changing their mind to make Disappearance a movie. That delayed production and they don't want to announce something and have that happen again.

Next year, we will probably see what Kadokawa and KyoAni negotiated in 2011. By then, they will have seen the sales for Disappearance and know the printing numbers for Surprise. Lack of information regarding support for the franchise will not be a suitable excuse after that.

Right now, the only information we have regarding a new work is their adaptation of Chuunibyou, which is standard for this time period. I can't find when K-On! was announced, but it was only in August/September 2008 when Haruhi was announced to be coming back (heavily hinted for the following year). We usually only know one/two works from them at one time.

Again, thank you for moving to this thread, I feel more comfortable speculating here than in the DVD/BD sales thread and getting that more off-track.
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Chuunibyou translation: 1st novel - OUT/ 2nd novel - OUT
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