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View Poll Results: Lucky Star - Episode 16 Rating
Perfect 10 90 62.50%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 34 23.61%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 11 7.64%
7 out of 10 : Good 4 2.78%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 0.69%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.69%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 0.69%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 2 1.39%
Voters: 144. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-07-22, 20:36   Link #21
krln99
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Awesome episode. We finally get to see where Konata works (bout time!)
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Old 2007-07-22, 20:40   Link #22
Kaoru Chujo
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Yes, I am one-track minded, but the highlight of this episode for me was the appearance (finally) of Sasaki Nozomi as Patricia Martin. We didn't get to hear much, but there were definite hints of her amazing mobile squeeze-toy voice. "Yo-ro-shee-ku." (She was Nanami in Bokura ga Ita.)

I'm not going to blame Kaioshin if he is further put off by the appearance of more Haruhi, but it certainly didn't bother me. Quite the contrary: I loved it, since it was done so well. Those few seconds of Hare Hare Yukai were pure gold, as were Kagami's reactions. And as, of course, was another self-duet from Hirano Aya, as Konata and Konata-as-Haruhi. I personally found Konata's Haruhi too tsuntsun -- but maybe I've just forgotten, or maybe that's how Konata sees her, lol.

And it was interesting to see them keep balancing Animate and Gamers. I loved the scenes in Gamers, particularly considering that we were just in some place similar last week in Doujin Work, too.

Kagami keeps getting wonderful scenes. Her giving Tsukasa some of her meat was just great.

And I liked the ED. Good singing and subtle humor. I noticed it was a actually produced and directed by people from Lantis, the music company, rather than by anyone connected to KyoAni. Looks like we will be getting live EDs from everyone?

As for the new records, it was confirmed last week that there will be eight (as opposed to the previously announced four) character CDs, and Sasaki Nozomi will be doing one of them. See my post here. I don't think the Konata-Patty CD is real, but who knows.
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2007-07-22 at 20:59.
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Old 2007-07-22, 21:39   Link #23
dahl_moon
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Posting after watching just the ED. Liked it sooo much more than the previous "Shiraishi fooling around not sure what to do" skit. But, how OLD is this song? Sounds like stuff people in their 60s and above would listen. The camera shots also look so old fashioned. The title is "三十路岬" by the way.

Back from watching the actual episode. The highlight of the episode would definitely be
Spoiler:


So Patricia was Sasaki Nozomi, eh? I greatly enjoyed her performance as Nanami, so I'll be looking forward to her also.

By the way, the character drawn by Aya returns (lower right)!
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Last edited by dahl_moon; 2007-07-22 at 22:29. Reason: Aya mascot
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Old 2007-07-22, 22:36   Link #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dahl_moon View Post
Spoiler:
Spoiler for answer:
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Old 2007-07-22, 22:51   Link #25
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Originally Posted by Nemo_N View Post
Spoiler for answer:
Spoiler:
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:01   Link #26
Kaioshin Sama
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Red face

I'm afraid I have to disagree with the people who find the advertising and references to be well done up to this point. Perhaps it's because I have a knack for predicting screenwriting that runs in the family as well as finding maybe about 30 ads I've ever seen in my life interesting, but I've called pretty much every advertising gimmick that Lucky Star has thrown at me, and it's just far to predictable now for me to find interesting or praisworthy on top of it just being par for the course at this point. When I see an ad coming around every corner, know the characters and get the reference before it's really even begun I just find myself saying "Next Please" .

To me the most noteworthy and surprisingly intriguing scene in the anime was last episodes setup for the trip to Miyuki's house that never happened. It was a nice little bit of jumping around between the characters that required a little thought and fitting the pieces of the puzzle together to get the whole thing. Somehow I don't see this happening this episode though.
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:10   Link #27
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Originally Posted by Kaioshin_Sama View Post
When I see an ad coming around every corner, know the characters and get the reference before it's really even begun I just find myself saying "Next Please" .
I get what you're saying, but how does Kyoani show Konata's 'otaku-ness?' Make a fake show or genre and use that??

How did the manga handle this??

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Old 2007-07-22, 23:14   Link #28
Risaa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrowKenobi View Post
I get what you're saying, but how does Kyoani show Konata's 'otaku-ness?' Make a fake show or genre and use that??

How did the manga handle this??
The thing with me is, there's thousands of other series they could make references to, but it continues to be Haruhi. I understand it's "family", but it's not like I go around wearing a t-shirt with a pic of my sister everywhere. (OK, lame example, I admit. XD )

If it must be family, I wouldn't mind a *different* series being referenced to sometimes to help cancel out all the SHnY. Maybe I should start keeping track of how many times Haruhi is referenced compared to other "family series".....
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:25   Link #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Risaa View Post
The thing with me is, there's thousands of other series they could make references to, but it continues to be Haruhi. I understand it's "family", but it's not like I go around wearing a t-shirt with a pic of my sister everywhere. (OK, lame example, I admit. XD )

If it must be family, I wouldn't mind a *different* series being referenced to sometimes to help cancel out all the SHnY. Maybe I should start keeping track of how many times Haruhi is referenced compared to other "family series".....
Good answer Risaa. I like the analogy you used here too, it fits quite well with what AVPlaya has mentioned as a possible reason behind the use of certain series. I would imagine a Hardcore otaku like Konata isn't so focused on only one show and likes to ramble about other series. Show's like Hayate The Combat Butler have no problem pulling in bits from other series and it's not even about otakus. So why not Lucky Star. The family tree of referenced series has much room to grow from the "Root".
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:29   Link #30
kj1980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dahl_moon View Post
Posting after watching just the ED. Liked it sooo much more than the previous "Shiraishi fooling around not sure what to do" skit. But, how OLD is this song? Sounds like stuff people in their 60s and above would listen. The camera shots also look so old fashioned. The title is "三十路岬" by the way.
Enka is a traditional Japanese genre. That doesn't mean "new" enka doesn't get produced every now and then (it is our culture, though sadly many young people don't care and enka is slowly being eradicated to death). "Misoji Misaki" is a new song sung by Konno Hiromi (aka Kogami Akira) which will be released as an actual CD on August 29, 2007. Also they showed a commercial for "Konata & Patty" CD as an actual release...I wonder if the people at Lantis are serious about this wwwww
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:37   Link #31
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Well, the only other family series besides Haruhi is FMP, really. The only other TV shows Kyoto Animation has completed are AIR and Kanon, both of which belong to Key/Visual Arts, so they probably can't reference those as liberally as they like. As for FMP, it actually has received a disproportionately large amount of attention in the series. If Haruhi is the main thing that Konata likes, then you can argue that FMP is pretty much the ONLY thing Kagami likes. And I'm pretty sure almost no one would get a Munto reference, lol...

As for this episode itself, it was perfectly appropriate for a reference of some sort to be made, seeing as where that particular scene takes place. I can understand why Kyoto Animation would feel that Haruhi is the best thing to refer to in such an instance. They would naturally want something that is already well-known by most of their audience, and that they can use liberally without worrying about licensing issues. What better reference material could they use? After all, how many people who regularly watch Lucky☆Star don’t know what Haruhi is (regardless of whether they like it or not), as opposed to anything else they could use? This is one of the most well-known and universal references they can make, which they can be sure their audience will understand. And when your main character is a blatantly obsessive otaku, your show must understandably have such references, preferably one that the vast majority of your audience can understand. Of course, references to other things are necessary as well, but the reason one in particular is used is to ensure a familiar “foundation” of sorts to unify the connection between the show and the audience.

To justify a negative response, then, you must come up with either a reason why another show should be referenced other than Haruhi, or show why that scene itself should never have even taken place in such a setting. For the former, you come across the question: What would be the alternative to using Haruhi? Whatever it is, it will likely alienate more members of the audience. After all, the Da Capo references from episode 15 totally went over my head, seeing as I’ve never seen the series before, and have no clue who those characters were. The best thing I could come up with as a replacement for that cosplay scene that might fit the scope of a popular otaku show might be Nanoha, but even that isn't as good of a replacement. After all, I myself have never even seen an episode of that show, lol...

So the alternative may be to cut out the scene entirely? Eh...but it's already been long established that such a scene would take place, ever since the earliest episodes, so that doesn't bode well for continuity either. In the end, some major referencing has to be made. What's the best choice that Kyoto Animation could come up with? Whatever it is, it's probably not as recent, as familiar, as popular, and as easily accessable for both viewer and studio as Haruhi.

Shows like Hayate the Combat Butler do have lots of varied references, yes, but they're quite different from Lucky☆Star's. Hayate's references are mostly confined to offhand remarks, 2-second visual gags, and random censored names being thrown around. They're hardly ever integrated into what's actually going on in the story, such as Konata going to Comiket or attending a concert; as such, the references are usually on a much smaller scale in Hayate, and ultimately much more forgettable. Such minor references wouldn't integrate well with a story about otaku characters for whom anime is more than a mere reference, but a notable part of their lives. If Hayate were to do references like Lucky☆Star, then they'd have to show Nagi being a fan of, say, Ouran High School Host Club manga, and forcing Hayate into various situations related to that series. I guess what I'm trying to say is that for minor speech or visual references that barely relate to what's actually going on, varied references are fine, because the humor (or lack thereof, if the viewer doesn't get it) of such references isn't integrated into the actual story. In fact, this is where Lucky☆Star has a more diverse list of references, including Fate/Stay Night, Full Metal Alchemist, Higurashi, Rozen Maiden, Kanon, One Piece, and much more. Most of those scene can be funny even when you haven't seen those shows, because the references are so minor. For example, the dinner scene in episode 10 with Konata's dad and the 3 girls was funny for me, even if I didn't understand how Konata's dad was referring to Fate/Stay Night characters during the meal. But when the show does a larger, more drawn out reference, they probably want to use something more recognizable to the audience, to ensure familiarity. Haruhi becomes the most common choice, although not always THE choice. Recall the running Marimite references in episode 7, or the largely Keroro-inspired scene in episode 13 (admittedly punctured by that Code Geass parody).

Last edited by Mirrinus; 2007-07-22 at 23:56.
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:51   Link #32
Nemo_N
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I get this feeling that those getting tired of the Haruhi references either don't get the other references or use a magnifying glass on the Haruhi ones.

Really, I haven't grow tired of the Haruhi references and I'm hardly a Haruhi hardcore fan; they have been done well up to this point (short and not out of place), and most of them based on the simple fact that Konata is a hardcore otaku, with a particular liking for Haruhi.

Konata has mentioned other shows, but Haruhi as the main subject is far from being out of place; it's a tremendously popular show.

Why should they use another show? To avoid getting the audience tired? I'm not.
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Old 2007-07-22, 23:53   Link #33
Kaoru Chujo
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I simply disagree completely with Kaioshin. Those Haruhi references are fun. F-U-N. KyoAni wants to make money and have fun at the same time. This is not wrong. Self-referentiality is the soul of good TV, lol.

I must admit that I do find it a little odd that you are making these negative posts, bringing me down a bit from my great enjoyment of the episode, before you have even watched it. I guess it makes for good discussion, though. I liked a lot of what Mirrinus said. And personally, I grew tired of Hayate a few eps ago and quit watching. Maybe KyoAni's method works better.
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Old 2007-07-23, 00:03   Link #34
bayoab
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Originally Posted by Kaioshin_Sama View Post
I'm afraid I have to disagree with the people who find the advertising and references to be well done up to this point. Perhaps it's because I have a knack for predicting screenwriting that runs in the family as well as finding maybe about 30 ads I've ever seen in my life interesting, but I've called pretty much every advertising gimmick that Lucky Star has thrown at me, and it's just far to predictable now for me to find interesting or praisworthy on top of it just being par for the course at this point. When I see an ad coming around every corner, know the characters and get the reference before it's really even begun I just find myself saying "Next Please" .
You name the problem exactly here. You see it all as advertising, not referencing because it made by the same company. One could pull the same comment with the Negima references in Sayonara Zetsubou or any of the many shounen sunday references in Hayate. It's not meant to be an advertising gimmick.

All but a handful of the items they show from haruhi are previously available or are already solicited and have a future release date. It isn't like they are creating new posters for the show and then putting them on sale. Many of the references are even just in the dialog or reusing voice actors.

In this episode, haruhi character cds 8 and 9 are shown as "new", they have been on sale for a good 6 months (if not longer) now. Haruhi cosplay outfits have been available forever. The same goes for the Haruhi ringtones and posters.

Now, what they ARE selling is Lucky Star goods like Akira's CD and the possibly, the Konata and Patie CD. (There was no product ID for this but everything else was there.)
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Old 2007-07-23, 00:10   Link #35
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Ironically, some of the "merchandise" that they "advertise" are completely unrelated to Kyoto Animation or Kadokawa Shoten. One has to wonder what good it would do any of those companies if we all went out to buy Bubba's unlicensed, fan-developed God Knows Haruhi figure displayed in episode 15.
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Old 2007-07-23, 00:13   Link #36
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I myself don't mind the Haruhi references that much. I do think an occasional Kanon reference would be nice, though (a few episodes back Konata was watching Haruhi real-time, so Konata should have been watching Kanon around episode 12ish, and should be watching L*S now).

There was another Code Geass reference BTW.

On another topic.
Spoiler:
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Last edited by dahl_moon; 2007-07-23 at 00:14. Reason: spoiler tags
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Old 2007-07-23, 00:14   Link #37
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Ironically, some of the "merchandise" that they "advertise" are completely unrelated to Kyoto Animation or Kadokawa Shoten. One has to wonder what good it would do any of those companies if we all went out to buy Bubba's unlicensed, fan-developed God Knows Haruhi figure displayed in episode 15.
Not to mention that it was the first figure of any kind of Haruhi.

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Old 2007-07-23, 00:26   Link #38
Nemo_N
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Did anyone else find this part cute? Kagami's congratulatory smile that is:



Man, I love this kind of details.

Last edited by Nemo_N; 2007-07-23 at 00:39.
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Old 2007-07-23, 00:51   Link #39
Luminisk
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Did anyone else find this part cute? Kagami's congratulatory smile that is:



Man, I love this kind of details.
There is a lot of good scenes in this episode.
Pity the raws that I have at the moment are sorta dark even in the more brighter scenes.
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Old 2007-07-23, 01:25   Link #40
~Tsukuyomi
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Still trying to figure out the whole "Taking Tsukasa picture scene" (I watch RAW but I don't speak Japanese)... Is this another "To Heart" thing where they mistaken Tsukasa as that Akari (whatever) character???
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