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Old 2007-08-06, 03:29   Link #1
anti-sasuke brigade
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Join Date: Dec 2006
new computer

use:
pure enterainment
games (maybe)


so far i love the EVGA products

at the moment im thinking btw these 3 graphic cards

eVGA GeForce 7900GT KO 256Mb
eVGA 7900GT Signature Series 256MB
eVGA GEFORCE 8800 GTS SUPERCLOCKED 320MB 8800GTS

what i look in, for these products?
well i want quality for my money works great

reason?
ok heres the deal i want quality products and ran well, i know eVGA GEFORCE 8800 GTS SUPERCLOCKED 320MB 8800GTS is way better than the other two but is it worth paying the extra cash for it IF the other two ran just as well.

note: i heard pretty bad reviews about eVGA 7900GT Signature Series 256MB, anyone can confirm this? also how about the other two products i have listed

other component
looking for an AM2 dual core
montherboard suggestions?
more suggestions

ps: remember quality,works great, cost average

sorry if there are any typos or my sentence doesnt make sense, english aint my first language.

money?
im unsure about how much im willing to spend, but i see where this will lead first

thanks in advance

sincerely

proud member of the animesuki forum

Last edited by anti-sasuke brigade; 2007-08-06 at 04:44. Reason: typos
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Old 2007-08-06, 04:09   Link #2
problemedchild
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Don't bother with the superclocked version. eVGA's warranty covers OCing, so just buy a regular one and OC it to Superclocked speeds.

You could go all out eVGA and buy its motherboard too! =P
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Old 2007-08-06, 05:30   Link #3
hobbes_fan
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With AM2 don't go higher than x2 4400+. Outside the budget range AMD just gets demolished by Intel E4400 and higher. Up to the 4400+ (factoring in motherboard costs) it compares favorably as good X2 motherboards are always cheaper than good Core2Duo motherboards.

Yeah don't bother with o/c editions of anything, unless the price is too good to pass up or it offers some special cooling solution, it isn't hard to o/c just takes a bit of time and trial and error.

Don't forget a quality power supply by a reputable manufacturer. Also X2's benefit greatly by using DDR2 800 RAM. Use 2 sticks obviously to get dual channel as well to squeeze a bit more performance (2x512, 2x1 gig etc etc)

That said, there's 2 (I won't bother listing SLi Board as I think SLi and ATi Crossfire as the biggest scams going around) these are the best 2 I can think off that isn't to expensive

Non overclocking HTPC use Asus M2a-vm(lots of HTPC features but limited o/c options in BIOS)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131174

gaming/overclocking abit an52 plenty of o/c options voltage options on this. (though don't forget to get a better cpu heatsink and fan if you plan on some serious overclocking)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813127026

Last edited by hobbes_fan; 2007-08-06 at 05:40.
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Old 2007-08-06, 05:52   Link #4
problemedchild
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There are valid uses for SLI and Crossfire, however most people browsing Animesuki most likely will not have the money, so it's pretty much a moot point here =)
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Old 2007-08-06, 06:01   Link #5
anti-sasuke brigade
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbes_fan View Post
With AM2 don't go higher than x2 4400+. Outside the budget range AMD just gets demolished by Intel E4400 and higher. Up to the 4400+ (factoring in motherboard costs) it compares favorably as good X2 motherboards are always cheaper than good Core2Duo motherboards.
can you rephrase this paragraph please my english is limited

sorry english is not my first language

money?
well depends on my dad mood if his in a bad mood 1000 AUD

happy 1000++

thanks in advance
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Old 2007-08-06, 06:03   Link #6
Gundam Master
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one suggestion that I can make is buy a big hard drive. In some cases you can get a 400GB hard drive for about $100. I was looking through some ads in the newspaper and fry's had a 250GB Hard drive for I think $50
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Old 2007-08-06, 06:21   Link #7
hobbes_fan
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$1000 Aud? Australian? I'm a bit confused here? As I live in Australia?

Simply

Ok to buy
x2 3600+, x2 3800+, x2 4000+ x2 4200+, x2 4400+. They cost from $70 Australian to about $120 Australian.

But
the Intel Core2Duo E4300 (about $140 Australian) and higher models have better performance in comparison to the more expensive AMD models.

AMD X2 Motherboards are cheaper than Intel core2duo motherboards.


I really can't put it any simpler.

If you are in Australia, and are planning to build you own I find msy.com.au to be the cheapest, but you have to go to their shop.

Processor
e4400 - $145
Motherboard
Gigbyte P35 s3l - $125
RAM
2x1gig OCZ DDR2 667 - $109
HDD
Seagate SATA 250gig - $82
DVD Burner
18X A-Open - $41
Case
Asus TA861 - $69
Powersupply
Coolermaster iGreen 500w - $121
VideoCard
Gigabyte 320mb 8800gts - $399


Total= $1091

Quote:
Originally Posted by problemedchild View Post
There are valid uses for SLI and Crossfire, however most people browsing Animesuki most likely will not have the money, so it's pretty much a moot point here =)
running multiple monitors is the only one I can think of. But every bench I've seen shows that two low budget cards barely make it worthwhile performance wise up against single card in a slightly higher bracket. (2x7300gt vs 7900gs, 2x8600gt vs 1 8800GTS) considering you have to factor in the cost of the motherboard and a bigger powersupply.

Last edited by hobbes_fan; 2007-08-06 at 07:36. Reason: Updated pricing to reflect Intel price drops
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Old 2007-08-06, 15:26   Link #8
arcadeplayer987
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E6550
MSI NEo2 P35 mobo
Corsair 2x1GB 667Mhz
EVGA 8800GTS 320
Corsair 450W PSU
Seagate Sata II 3200Gb
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Old 2007-08-06, 16:33   Link #9
problemedchild
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbes_fan View Post

running multiple monitors is the only one I can think of. But every bench I've seen shows that two low budget cards barely make it worthwhile performance wise up against single card in a slightly higher bracket. (2x7300gt vs 7900gs, 2x8600gt vs 1 8800GTS) considering you have to factor in the cost of the motherboard and a bigger powersupply.
You cannot run multiple monitors while using SLI or Crossfire, you have to disable it. I'm not talking about SLIing two low budget cards though, I'm talking SLI two high end (GTX) cards to run games at 2560 x 1600 with all the settings enabled while maintaining a decent frame rate.


I was going to push for you to OC your CPU given how much headroom there is for Intel CPUs, but seeing as you don't understand english too well, that might not be a good idea.
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Old 2007-08-06, 17:11   Link #10
Tiberium Wolf
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1st you need to be sure how much you are willing to spent. Coz the components you get for that $ will depend on it.

For those ghx cards the only that matters is the 8800. Now about the brand and if it's overclocked that depends on you.

For cpu I wouldn't recommend amd coz of the several benchmark you can find with google. Get a c2d.

For ram get 2 x 1 GB sticks. The near future is 2 GB of ram.

Still I dont get ppl are recommending psu lower than 550W. Since psu will be losing power over time and these systems use a lot of power and nowadays we use more than 1 HDD I wouldn't go below a 550W or 600W. Anyway you can use this site to do a psu calc.

http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp
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Old 2007-08-06, 18:22   Link #11
hobbes_fan
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a Psu is at most will be about 60% efficiency after a decade. And that's on 24 hours a day 7 days a week running at close to full load near the maximum operating temperature ie under extreme duress. f it's looked after a PSU will last generally 50,000 hours MTBF no matter the wattage. Have you even done the calc in link you posted? It's 402w PEAK meaning everything is running at full load, (ie cpu usage at 100%, DVD drives spinning and burning at max speeds, HDDS spinning at max speed, fans at max rpm, VGA card at 100%) for an e6750 system, 3 HDDs, 3 120mm fans, 2 sticks of RAM, 1dvd drive and 1 bluray drive plus 2 PCIE cards and 2 USB powered devices. Newsflash - that doesn't happen, running all those and apps would make the most powerful quadcore fall to it's knees.

If you're buying a crappy generic PSU which isn't recommended then by all means go buy a 600w- 750w, it'll be lucky to be able to generate 1/2 it's claimed wattage.

Now explain to me again why a 600w+ PSU is required? If you plan to crossfire two 2900xt's yeah sure 1000w+. Also it's no longer just about wattage anymore, it about the amps on the 12w rail.

By the time the PSU has degraded to the point of uselesness this PC should have been relegated to the the junkyard.

Also there are apparently suggestions the next gen of dx10 cards due to be released around October, November. But until acual DX10 games are on the market we don't even know for sure how well the 8800's and 2900's will hold up.

Don't make assumptions on what he needs for RAM consider what O/s he's using 1 gig is fine for XP (32bit), 2 gigs for Vista. (32bit) More is better always (but you're limited to 3 gig on 32 bit O/S as 32bit can't utilise any more)

And you seem to forget, that the current trend is to make PC's "green" and more energy efficient. This is one of the main selling points of x2's and core2duo's. more and more peripherals too are doing the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by problemedchild View Post
You cannot run multiple monitors while using SLI or Crossfire, you have to disable it.
crap I keep forgetting that.

Last edited by hobbes_fan; 2007-08-06 at 20:19.
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Old 2007-08-06, 20:13   Link #12
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2 GB is standard regardless of the OS right now. Considering that 2GB of 6400 costs only 80 dollars to buy, it shouldn't break the bank.
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Old 2007-08-06, 20:56   Link #13
hobbes_fan
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I think he said he's in Australia so if he needs to cut corners 1 gig will be fine on xp. 1 gig of OCZ ddr2 800 is $78, 2gigs matched pair is 160. so it's a sizeable chunk of his budget. 1 is usable on xp for the time being, RAM is an easy enough upgrade anyway. But still you're right 2 gigs is the sweet spot for gaming.
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Old 2007-08-07, 00:28   Link #14
Tiberium Wolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbes_fan View Post
a Psu is at most will be about 60% efficiency after a decade. And that's on 24 hours a day 7 days a week running at close to full load near the maximum operating temperature ie under extreme duress. f it's looked after a PSU will last generally 50,000 hours MTBF no matter the wattage. Have you even done the calc in link you posted? It's 402w PEAK meaning everything is running at full load, (ie cpu usage at 100%, DVD drives spinning and burning at max speeds, HDDS spinning at max speed, fans at max rpm, VGA card at 100%) for an e6750 system, 3 HDDs, 3 120mm fans, 2 sticks of RAM, 1dvd drive and 1 bluray drive plus 2 PCIE cards and 2 USB powered devices. Newsflash - that doesn't happen, running all those and apps would make the most powerful quadcore fall to it's knees.

If you're buying a crappy generic PSU which isn't recommended then by all means go buy a 600w- 750w, it'll be lucky to be able to generate 1/2 it's claimed wattage.

Now explain to me again why a 600w+ PSU is required? If you plan to crossfire two 2900xt's yeah sure 1000w+. Also it's no longer just about wattage anymore, it about the amps on the 12w rail.

By the time the PSU has degraded to the point of uselesness this PC should have been relegated to the the junkyard.

Also there are apparently suggestions the next gen of dx10 cards due to be released around October, November. But until acual DX10 games are on the market we don't even know for sure how well the 8800's and 2900's will hold up.

Don't make assumptions on what he needs for RAM consider what O/s he's using 1 gig is fine for XP (32bit), 2 gigs for Vista. (32bit) More is better always (but you're limited to 3 gig on 32 bit O/S as 32bit can't utilise any more)

And you seem to forget, that the current trend is to make PC's "green" and more energy efficient. This is one of the main selling points of x2's and core2duo's. more and more peripherals too are doing the same.



crap I keep forgetting that.

If the psu will age and you have a 450w if it drops below 400W wouldn't your system be instable? Isn't always good to have some kinda of extra w? We don't need to buy thing to work on the edge so that in the future if something happens it screw us up.

Anyway in shops I have near by the psu between 400w-600w of known brands have almost the same price anyway.
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Old 2007-08-07, 07:29   Link #15
hobbes_fan
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You keep talking about aging, how long do you think it will take to lose 30-40% efficiency? Guess what? it's at least 5 years of constant use, that is flicking it on and off constantly 24 hours a day 7 days a week. With the way PC's, video cards and technology is going do you think this PC will still be a viable gaming platform?

Again read what 402 W PEAK is. You still have 100w left after Peak (which never happens).The specs I used calc was well over what he already had. And again by the time you've you're at 60-75% capacity of the PSU that PC has been relegated to the heap. There's a point of redundancy. No-one buys a reputable 700w PSU for a single video card config - it's a pointless exercise.

If you want to waste your money on a PSU that will be as just as dead in 5 years time go for it no-ones telling you you can't. As it stands I've proven that a good 500w PSU is suited for this application using your calculator, hell even a 450w PSU could run this safely.

As for your comment on price lets just see (using this list http://www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Power_Supply_Unit )
Hmm majority of 500w between $99-$132

Let's see 600w
Oh they start from $155 to about $170

Now on a budget of $1000 would you rather spend unnecessary $ on a PSU that's overkill? or would you rather spend the $20-$30 change on a better CPU/motherboard/RAM, considering that the calculator you've listed and the data I've used which has more than covered any future upgrades within reason suchas additional HDD's and PCI cards, says there's still plenty of leeway at PEAK system draw?

I think you know what I would do.
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Old 2007-08-07, 08:05   Link #16
anti-sasuke brigade
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talking about PSU can the motherboard handle any watts from the PSU?

yes i am from australia
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Old 2007-08-07, 08:32   Link #17
Tiberium Wolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbes_fan View Post
As for your comment on price lets just see (using this list http://www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Power_Supply_Unit )
Hmm majority of 500w between $99-$132

Let's see 600w
Oh they start from $155 to about $170
Leaving about if there is enough Watts or not. Something is wrong with those prices. Coz you don't need all that money to find a good psu. With 45€ you get can a 600w psu. I got my Nox Urano 600w Sli 12cm for 45€(there are other cheapers that from other brands, not generic). In fact Portugal what concerns about the pc hardware everything is expensive.
Those psu in your link seems more like to me those overkill ones sold above 60€ in Portugal. No point buying those.

If you are using AU currency 45euro = 72au. PSU can't be that expensive.

Edit: Ok I went to some AU online shops and jesus! Other components prices seems the same in Portugal but the psu are waaaaaaaaay too expensive! Something's wrong!
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Last edited by Tiberium Wolf; 2007-08-07 at 09:11.
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Old 2007-08-07, 09:59   Link #18
grey_moon
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Minimum power ratings are a guide... Well for any Shuttle user they are, as most of us only have 250 watt PSUs and we have our boxes chocker with 1 optical, 2 HDD, wireless and a GPU that recommends min of 300 watt.... Lets not forget all of the USB goodies such as KB, mouse and webcam..

Not saying that you shouldn't try to follow these recommendations, but the main thing to keep in mind it is all about rails (as someone has already mentioned).

Personally I would go for a good quality efficient PSU and look at the power the rails supply rather then the overall wattage. Bad PSU's can equal unstable systems, or at worse spike the c**p out of the rest of your kit.
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Old 2007-08-07, 15:02   Link #19
arcadeplayer987
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Originally Posted by problemedchild View Post
2 GB is standard regardless of the OS right now. Considering that 2GB of 6400 costs only 80 dollars to buy, it shouldn't break the bank.
Why not E6550 instead of E6400 because E6550 is cheaper with 25$ and has 2.33GHZ and 1333 Bus
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Old 2007-08-07, 16:55   Link #20
problemedchild
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Why not E6550 instead of E6400 because E6550 is cheaper with 25$ and has 2.33GHZ and 1333 Bus
6400 comes with 2 GB of cache? =O
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