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View Poll Results: Higurashi Kai Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 54 52.94%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 33 32.35%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 8 7.84%
7 out of 10 : Good 6 5.88%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 0.98%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 102. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-09-26, 14:45   Link #81
Sterling01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarthX View Post
I wonder how they get leaked. Are they uploaded but not linked and people discover their url or what?
I think that may be the case
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Old 2007-09-26, 15:05   Link #82
Green˛
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USCPharmacist View Post
LOL they censored the OP (no blood + no billhook), crazy elevens!
Might I ask anyone here, previously had these cuts been seen on previous episodes of that same network that aired this episode? (Opening theme specifically.) And are these edits being done by the animation studio, or are they being done and/or requested by the network itself? If the later, are there other networks that exhibit looser restrictions?


Spoiler for Ep.12:
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Old 2007-09-26, 15:20   Link #83
FlareKnight
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But there wouldn`t be any reason for Rika to know about the inconsistency concerning Takano`s time of death. The only information she would get is that Takano and Tomitake are dead. Only reason we could suspect Takano is because we have a wider area to look at than Rika does. She can only see her particular viewpoint. Now if all her friends kept their memories all the time they could bring up that inconsistency and she would have something to work with.

If your so centered on saving your friends and your life there is hardly time to be suspecting the dead. Not like she has the luxury of going around interrogating every single person from Ire to the milk man about whether they are connected to her death. Wouldn`t make sense for someone dead to be behind this since if your dead there is no point. It is a pretty large thing to suspect every single person including those you are positive have been killed by the one who is after your life. Have to play it in terms of likelyhood and the dead usually have a tough time going after people. Unless your a zombie or something...

Related to coroners reports. If they did not find anything easily it has to be a tough to track down issue. Only reason it would be found in WW2 would be related to having the resources and time to investigate this heavily. If that stuff is released in a heavy concentration you may not have the luxury of testing. But it is not something that you can completely hide if it was discovered in the first place.
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Old 2007-09-26, 15:26   Link #84
Klashikari
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matrim View Post
No, she didn't.
For Rika, Takano "died", because she doesn't have the "information"
Quote:
Well, then half of this forum are genuises because they (or rather we) suspected Takano ever since her convenient for faking "death". All I am saying that if I somehow get brutally murdered so many times, I would suspect everyone, including those I am not 100% certain that are dead. Also, the most obvious motive would be the knowledge that Rika is the "queen bee" of Hinamizawa which also points at Takano among others.
like i said, she has not the possibility to know the problem
The only time she got the information is in Minagoroshi-hen.
We, watchers, had the convenient third perspective, and watanagashi-hen was quite an alarm about the inconsistency.

But back with Rika perspective, she does NOT know it is a fake death and she has NO mean to do so, as she can't get information.
It is a result of circumstances that Ooishi told her.
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Old 2007-09-26, 15:39   Link #85
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Just saw the previews and thought I should say this...Next Week: The Day The Devil Was Born!...
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Old 2007-09-26, 15:52   Link #86
Matrim
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Yes, this discrepancy with the time of the death was a big hint that Rika was not aware of, but surely Takano is very suspicious if for nothing else then because of the way she "dies" - why burn the body when there is a convenient swamp where it can be dumped? And we all know who can easily switch dental records. Easy to overlook it once, yes, but when Takano dies in the same fashion say 30 times, you really think it's implausible for Rika to suspect even a little that there is something fishy about that?

Quote:
I'm pretty sure no one considered that a serious possibility until after episode 8 of season one.
Well, see the thread for episode six of the first season for instance, among all the twins speculations there are people who doubt that Takano is dead and whether she is a victim or a culprit.
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Old 2007-09-26, 16:16   Link #87
Animaker9
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Awsome, this was an answer-ific episode, when you put it like that, that strage paranoia was just the desease, Keiichi... why did you had to go to that funeral in onikakushi?!

But things are getting bad... I can't wait to see what will happen!!
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Old 2007-09-26, 16:36   Link #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matrim View Post
but when Takano dies in the same fashion say 30 times, you really think it's implausible for Rika to suspect even a little that there is something fishy about that?
That's why Rika has done the rule Y.
Be it takano or anyone else, if the plan is still in stone, it will be the same all over.
if we imagine higurashi with... let's say a fourth character in the shadows, killign for real takano and tomitake, the result would be the same : same fashion over 20+.
These murders are the factors how she was able to figure "rules" and "strong will", as even with randomness, the culprit keep going.

that said, Rika doesn't have the third perspective and don't have the luxury to suspect takano as:
-Takano knows the risk if Rika dies
-Rika is her precious guinea pig, along with Irie's.
-Takano is a legitimate target if a said culprit want to kill Rika

Rika doesn't have any reason to have suspicions on takano, because Takano has almost every reasons to PROTECT her. Even Irie doesn't believe that, and only Tomitake has a glimpse of what she want to do, and it required the very last moment for him to figure out.

If Tomitake and Irie, the most close people and involved in both cure and biologic weapons don't have a clue, how Rika can know?
This is the reason how minagoroshi was important, since the "perfect world" still give her an answer, despite the failing point.

But again, it is quite illogical for her to be able to have suspicions on Takano alone
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Old 2007-09-26, 16:43   Link #89
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Wow, that episode was amazing. Even though I read the Wikipedia summaries on the last two arcs, I never knew about the whole biological weapon issue.

I really hope DEEN pulls off the next episode. If they do it right, it'll be so epic.
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Old 2007-09-26, 17:15   Link #90
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This episode was definitely, absolutely worth the wait. It was a thrill from beginning to end, this was one of those episodes where your eyes just stays glued to the screen. Without a doubt one of the best animes I'm currently following.
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Old 2007-09-26, 18:47   Link #91
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Some thoughts: Major props to this ep. for clearing the theories behind the hinamizawa syndrome/sickness. I loved the sense of unity that has continued from the previous episodes into this between the gang. It'll be great (after seeing preview for ep. 13) to see how the group holds their own this time. And I have some questions to clear up some lingering thoughts:

1. Did it take anyone else up to ep. 11 to find out who the mastermind was? I had my suspicions after re-watching S1, but... I couldn't make a feasible theory. ._.!

2. Can someone clarify the roles of the Irie Organization, Yamainu, and 'Tokyo'? My POV: The Irie Org. is researching a bio-weapon version of the disease, the Yamainu is there to keep secret the research, and Tokyo is a group of politicians that sponsor the operations.
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Last edited by SSJiffy; 2007-09-26 at 18:50. Reason: Clarification.
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Old 2007-09-26, 19:00   Link #92
HashiriyaR32
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I knew all along even before I started watching S1 that Takano was behind it (yay for spoilers)
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Old 2007-09-26, 19:06   Link #93
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Quote:
2. Can someone clarify the roles of the Irie Organization, Yamainu, and 'Tokyo'? My POV: The Irie Org. is researching a bio-weapon version of the disease, the Yamainu is there to keep secret the research, and Tokyo is a group of politicians that sponsor the operations.
That's pretty much it, except Irie himself is more interested in using the research to find a cure, and Tokyo consists of more than just politicians.
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Old 2007-09-26, 19:53   Link #94
Matrim
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That's why Rika has done the rule Y.
I know, I shouldn't have said "in the same fashion" since this is a given. My point was that as Rika spent tens of years trying to look for a way out of a horrible sitution one would think she would be bound to suspect everyone with the exception of her closest friends. Even the nature of the curse - one dead and one disappeared person points to something fishy about Takano's burnt body.

Quote:
If Tomitake and Irie, the most close people and involved in both cure and biologic weapons don't have a clue, how Rika can know?
I never said that she should know, I said "suspect at least a little". And, of course, Tomitake and Irie can't recall the same events happening over and over unlike Rika and have no clue that someone keeps on murdering her. Let's just agree to disagree.

Anyway, who has any theories as to why Disaster didn't happen in Watanashi? I have some guesses:
- when Rika's body is not gutted and mutiliated it continues its function and supresses the symptoms of the disease even though she is dead. Sounds too unbeliveable and stupid even to me.
- for some reason the disease disappears when all the members of the Gosanke are dead. Also a very wild guess.
- It's not true that Rika supresses the disease. This begs the question coudl there be another reason for the disaster other than preventing the spread of the disease and the uncovering of the awful truth. If the Yamainu release the gas, why wouldn't they do it in Watanagashi, even if they know Rika is not really the "queen bee"?

*goes to rewatch season 1 in search of clues*
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Old 2007-09-26, 20:19   Link #95
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Takano couldn't find Rika's body
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Old 2007-09-27, 06:15   Link #96
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Great episode!! Now I'm starting to see why it's called Minagoroshi-hen...they're gonna have a last stand at Rika's house! Dreadful, but I can't wait to see that.

that Queen theory Rika told about was already proved wrong in this thread, since nothing happened when, for example, Rika committed suicide at Shion's house. It also sounds really fake, 20 generations or so wouldn't be enough for a human community to evolve into some strange beehive-like system in order to counter a disease. Rena getting sick after leaving the village can be explained from the stress she got from family issues+things that happened in her school.

Takano researched everything about Oyashiro-sama. The real reason for Takano to kill Rika would be that when she's found with her guts torn out on the Furude shrine, it's going to put the villagers in panic because of their religion and unleash the disease. Still, it's strange that the villagers didn't react much when Rika died from plain murder. And it doesn't explain what's the point in unleashing the disease in the first place, or how the gassing happens.
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Old 2007-09-27, 07:57   Link #97
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Great episode especially since Rika admitted that she never thought of trusting her friends enough to tell them the truth. Even though im not sure if its part of the whole plot or not. This episode showed just how powerful true friendship can be. They believe Rika because she is their friend and to me that was touching. All the memebers of the group are pretty intelligent. Shion, Mion and K1 deduced fairly quickly that Takano would be the most likley person as the mastermind. They have shown several times when working together they can get results especially when K1 goes into GAR mode.

Iv also noticed that you cant stop some killings from occuring. I knew it was over for Ooishi when MIW asked for permission to fire, and sure POP capped right in the head. The problem being now that is one less ally for Rika and everyone else. They are definetly coming for Rika, it will be interesting to see if they can stop it. IF everything ends in disaster i cant see any other world getting better than this. But since Rika retains some of her memories from world to world. If the worst happens maybe she will remember that Takano is the culprit and will be able to take more decisve actions. Its sucks because even if they live they are pretty much stuck in that town forever unless Irie comes up with a cure and thats assuming he lives long enough to make one.

I will admit that the Hinamizawa syndrome would make a formiable biological weapon but it could also backfire as well. I dont think these military guys ever thought of the possibilty of it mutating outside of the Hinamizawa. Which could happen if its released in a new area. Over all i gave ep 12 a 9 out 10. I still have a ray of hope but im not holding my breath since we still have one more arc to go.
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Old 2007-09-27, 08:19   Link #98
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Is pretty tough to keep some hope after all we've seen and since there are more episodes to come. Unless they decide to surprise everyone by solving it in the next episode. Then having a another batch of episodes about the peaceful life .

Is a little disconcerting. I mean this is probably the best world possible. Even with this Takano information Rika will need to take care of any and all issues that arise like with her friends and losing it. Plus then figure out how to stop what is going to come. Oh well should be interesting regardless.
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Old 2007-09-27, 10:16   Link #99
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KBS Kyoto's schedule now lists Kai 12 for tomorrow. Looks like we will have to wait till Monday to see the end of Minagoroshi.
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Old 2007-09-27, 14:08   Link #100
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Hmmm for those who read the TIPS, didn't you notice that
Spoiler for Satoko:
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