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Old 2007-09-25, 08:41   Link #1061
MrProphet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeijiSensei View Post
Balsa always seems to refer to Chagum as "Chaguma" on the audio track. With so many other names ending in "a," including his brother's, perhaps that's his real name?
Chagum = チャグム (Chya-Gu-Mu)

"~U" sound is mostly not pronounced in Japanese language: a) between 2 unvoiced consonants, and b) at the end of the word.
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Old 2007-09-25, 08:44   Link #1062
SeijiSensei
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So it must be that "mu" syllable I hear. It always sounded like three syllables though the spelling "Chagum" suggested only two.
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Old 2007-09-25, 14:26   Link #1063
EasyPrey
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Spoiler for Episode 25 comments:


I found TinyReadLeaf's post to be highly insightful about episode 25. Great job. I think I agree with you on most of the points. I will also hold some of my opinions about episode 25, until it is subbed. One thing almost no one can argue is the amount of eye candy this Anime provides.

-EasyPrey
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Old 2007-09-25, 16:12   Link #1064
psycho bolt
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Hehe Chagum so grown now.
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Old 2007-09-25, 17:06   Link #1065
TinyRedLeaf
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"Boy, I see you've grown," says Torogai. (I think that is how I would have translated the shaman's comment at the beginning of the episode.)

It's remarkable isn't it? I mean, given the limitations of character designs in animation, I'm surprised at how well the artists/animators manager to "age" their characters, be it teenage Balsa to adult Balsa, and now, pre-pubescent Chagum to teenage-but-not-quite-teenage Chagum. I'm not quite sure how they did it (it's more than just the cute ponytail, haha; what, Chagum, you're trying to imitate your Mother?), but the difference was immediately obvious the moment we see Chagum tanning the hide. He feels older, somehow.

Old enough to go around asking adults some pretty awkward questions -- "you should just sleep with her"; hahaha, indeed, why not, Tanda?

But, given Balsa's indirect replies, it seems that "romance" would not happen between them anymore. Having grown up with Tanda, Balsa has come to regard poor Tanda as more of a younger brother and close friend rather than as a potential mate. She's well aware of his attraction to her, but feels awkward about it. And I sympathise with how Tanda feels about how time has changed everything. If you don't strike while the iron's hot, you'd become very good friends, but the "moment" would be forever lost. Yeah, I've been there. I know how it feels.

Spoiler for thoughts on romance:


Overall, Ep23 is a beautiful episode in many ways. It's all in the little details, from the animation, the artwork (astounding scenery), the character designs, the music, and most importantly, in the subtle expressions between the characters. For example, Chagum was approaching the promised place with a mixture of determination and trepidation, and he was very glad to have Balsa and Tanda at his side. In his own quiet way, he was thanking the both of them for watching over him, and at the same time, for being the "something meaningful" that he would leave behind in case he died. Sometimes, you don't need words -- holding hands is good enough.

Spoiler for response to SeijiSensei:


Spoiler for response to Ep 25:
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Old 2007-09-26, 14:37   Link #1066
ghstwrld
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It seems to me that some people wanted the structure of seirei no moribito to conform to a certain familiar kind of writing, and are now projecting a negative explanation of why it doesn't.

Last edited by ghstwrld; 2007-09-27 at 10:04.
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Old 2007-09-27, 06:06   Link #1067
leongsh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghstwrld View Post
It seems to me that some people wanted the structure of seirei no moribito to conform to a certain familiar kind of writing, and are now are projecting a negative explanation of why it doesn't.
*pin-pon* That's very true. Too often people tend to want a story to be told in certain ways and find it hard to accept when it doesn't do so according to their expectations.

I'm very pleased with Seirei no Moribito in how the story was told and paced. They were not wasteful in what they showed in the episodes with most nearly everything being relevant or in support of the story.

The last episode (number 26) is this Saturday. The epilogue may give us some hints whether there's hope for a second series.
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Old 2007-09-27, 07:39   Link #1068
gaguri
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Just as often, people find it hard to accept when their favourite shows are being looked at critically from another view. People should be discussing the things said about the show, not speculating about psychology behind it that are pulled out from their ass, in a lame attempt to invalidate those criticisms.
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Old 2007-09-27, 09:23   Link #1069
SeijiSensei
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I have to assume that this discussion concerns things in the spoiler tags for episodes that have yet to be subbed.

Given that my knowledge is limited to discussions through ep. 23, I haven't a clue who these "some people" are. As far as I can tell, most everyone here has been quite happy with the story-telling in this show throughout.
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Old 2007-09-27, 10:02   Link #1070
ghstwrld
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaguri View Post
Just as often, people find it hard to accept when their favourite shows are being looked at critically from another view. People should be discussing the things said about the show, not speculating about psychology behind it that are pulled out from their ass, in a lame attempt to invalidate those criticisms.
The range of discussion from about episode 3 and beyond has pretty much stemmed from seirei no moribito subverting people's expectations of an epic fantasy drama, e.g. the lack of "big" battles and batman-esque super villians.
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Old 2007-09-27, 16:18   Link #1071
leongsh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghstwrld View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gaguri
Just as often, people find it hard to accept when their favourite shows are being looked at critically from another view. People should be discussing the things said about the show, not speculating about psychology behind it that are pulled out from their ass, in a lame attempt to invalidate those criticisms.
The range of discussion from about episode 3 and beyond has pretty much stemmed from seirei no moribito subverting people's expectations of an epic fantasy drama, e.g. the lack of "big" battles and batman-esque super villians.
That's why I raised the point that some people try to impose their expectations on the series and not watch it as is. It's wanting a show to conform to certain storytelling methods/structures and having characters act/react in certain ways. Oftentimes, the criticism is more on wanting a show to fit into specific confines, i.e. to pigeonhole a show. With shows like Seirei no Moribito, I just want to see how they tell and present the story, warts and all, and understand how and why something is done instead of wanting it to be done in a certain way to fit what I want it to be.
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Old 2007-09-27, 21:05   Link #1072
gaguri
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In that case I think other points haven't been communicated through very well. The problem isn't with the show not going according to 'MAI MASTA PLAN'. That's the false assumptions people are continuously making. The series after 5th episode simply aren't good enough, no matter what direction they are taking, and this has been backed up by numerous examples to death. Most people feel differently (because people in this thread are likely to be fans of Seirei). It's called 'different people having different reactions'. We are all letting the show unfold itself, but simply responding differently to the same thing. And those who are not satisfied enough with what the show has done, inevitably comes to think about things they liked most about the show, or great things they expected from the show and regret that it is taking different and more disappointing directions. If this is pigeonholing then so be it. At least it's not a braindead way of accepting everything they're doing without any questions. That's just close minded.

Quote:
The range of discussion from about episode 3 and beyond has pretty much stemmed from seirei no moribito subverting people's expectations of an epic fantasy drama, e.g. the lack of "big" battles and batman-esque super villians.
Epic fantasy drama =! lack of 'big' battles and batman-esque super villains. Twelve Kingdom =! lack of 'big' battles and batman-esque super villains. Don't make misleading statements. Nobody wants this to turn into another action fest. Nobody wants batman-esque super villains. Action in Seirei is different from other series not only because they're animated with amazing details, because the characters behind them are so great. Action emphasises their strength, resolution, and how determinted they are in following the path they've chosen. Action in Seirei was backed up by great fantasy setting, what seemed to be a intricate web of dark politics and a tragic story behind Balsa (and hence, catalyst behind her embarking this journey and something that will lead to an epic climax). It's a grand thing, it stirs your blood. Other things in Seirei, those conversations, 'slice-of-life moments', etc. they are all nice, something that warms you and make you grin, but hardly having enough substance to have any significant impact. If this is all building upto something brilliant at the end, I've yet to see it. Epic storys such as first arc of Twelve Kingdoms, Now and then here and there and Infinite Ryvius had moderate intervals of highs and lows to constantly provide amazing moments while still having amazing end.

You might have a different view but that doesn't mean I'm pidgeonholing or some crap and you're right in enjoying it for what it is, because that's pure elitist bullshit right there. I'm happy to discuss those aspects of the show, but not the psychological behaviour behind my reasonings.

I'm presently upto episode 21 (or was it 22? been a while since I've watched a recent anime since a.f.k decided to slack off), and I'm liking the story of Jiguro a lot. No one here dislikes the show, only appreciating it at different levels for different reasons.
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Old 2007-09-27, 22:01   Link #1073
ZippyDSM
Incoherance is my friend!
 
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this has got to be the best anime I have seen in years, sure their are shows cooler and more OTT but this dose almsot everything right and makes it a wonderful series, genon is bringing it out int he states right? if its no worse than kara kyo maoh its a buy!

Spoiler for Tanda:
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Old 2007-09-28, 01:30   Link #1074
kujoe
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Finally caught up with everything so far. Damn, what a ride that was. Anyway, like a few others have said regarding episode 25, I too felt a bit...

Spoiler:

Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
Old enough to go around asking adults some pretty awkward questions -- "you should just sleep with her"; hahaha, indeed, why not, Tanda?

But, given Balsa's indirect replies, it seems that "romance" would not happen between them anymore. Having grown up with Tanda, Balsa has come to regard poor Tanda as more of a younger brother and close friend rather than as a potential mate. She's well aware of his attraction to her, but feels awkward about it. And I sympathise with how Tanda feels about how time has changed everything. If you don't strike while the iron's hot, you'd become very good friends, but the "moment" would be forever lost. Yeah, I've been there. I know how it feels.
To be honest, I found the whole thing to be still unresolved. Tanda mentioned that he's satisfied with the way things are "for now", whereas Balsa didn't like being asked such a thing during the middle of everything, hence her indirect refusal and calling him an idiot later on. And there's that interesting conversation she had with Torogai the next day—about her plans for the future, recurring dream and all that.

It seems to me that there's still a lot of baggage between them, and whether that gets settled or not in the near future, feelings still run deep and hidden. That scene with Chagum holding on to their hands seems like a gesture of hope—or perhaps, an act reiterating all those unsaid things. Maybe the later novels dwell on this more, but then again perhaps they don't.

Well, whatever. I'm still a sap when it comes to them, so I hope so.

And oh, yes. I think I would like a second season as well. In fact, Kamiyama may skip a 4th Gig (or 3rd... not sure of the official "numbering") if he and his staff can adapt more of the novels. Well, I guess it all depends on the final episode.

Last edited by kujoe; 2007-09-28 at 01:48.
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Old 2007-09-28, 08:11   Link #1075
SeijiSensei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZippyDSM View Post
Geneon is bringing it out in the states right?
Nope, Geneon USA is closing its doors this week. We simply don't know yet what wlll become of the programs they have licensed in R1. It's certainly possible that Geneon will sub-license some of their titles to other R1 producers like ADV, but which ones and how soon remain a mystery.

At least they didn't start Seirei yet. There are many other shows ending in mid-release leaving people collecting the DVDs for those shows high and dry.

There was no doubt in my mind that I would have purchased the R1 DVDs had they been released in the States. I sincerely hope Geneon passes the baton to someone else, hopefully a licensor willing to invest the effort this remarkable show deserves.
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Old 2007-09-29, 06:26   Link #1076
wao
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Well, so it finally ended... I ahve nothing much to say. The last episode kind of basically wrapped up whatever needed to be wrapped up and in that sense it felt like it was a bit of a chore... I know, everything needs a proper ending and whatever, but I actually don't know why I watched teh last episode aside from the fact that I like most of Seirei no Moribito and I like the characters and go all "awwww" at the appropriate places. Everything else is pretty much as it's expected. Although I did like
Spoiler:


Yeah, just bring on the second season, dammit, they seemed to be hinting at the possibility of doing so.

I also am very curious as to how this is going to get distributed what with Geneon's troubles now.
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Old 2007-09-29, 14:48   Link #1077
Saffire
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For not understanding much of anything, I can say I really enjoyed the ending. In fact, the only episode I can remember not being super pleased with was episode 13. I think it's been an awesome ride, and I've really enjoyed the show up to its end. If it does come on DVD in the states, this is something I'd actually purchase. Have to put that HD TV to good use somehow.

Spoiler for Ending:
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Old 2007-09-29, 18:22   Link #1078
Berserker
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That sucks that Geneon is closing its doors. I was so looking forward to them releasing this awesome show in English!

I just watched episode 23 subbed, and it was another great episode. I hope another company rescues the license from Geneon.
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Old 2007-09-29, 19:40   Link #1079
ZippyDSM
Incoherance is my friend!
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeijiSensei View Post
Nope, Geneon USA is closing its doors this week. We simply don't know yet what wlll become of the programs they have licensed in R1. It's certainly possible that Geneon will sub-license some of their titles to other R1 producers like ADV, but which ones and how soon remain a mystery.

At least they didn't start Seirei yet. There are many other shows ending in mid-release leaving people collecting the DVDs for those shows high and dry.

There was no doubt in my mind that I would have purchased the R1 DVDs had they been released in the States. I sincerely hope Geneon passes the baton to someone else, hopefully a licensor willing to invest the effort this remarkable show deserves.
They have not closed their doors as much as suspending operations until they can reorganize, I see it now quality and staff drooped to make localizations "more hip" *shudders*
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Old 2007-09-29, 23:08   Link #1080
TinyRedLeaf
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Seirei no Moribito OST Vol 2

Seirei no Moribito Ongaku hen 2

I'm slightly surprised that no one has mentioned this yet, so I'll be the first. The second volume of the OST is out (has been since 21 Sep). There are a total of 29 tracks, many of which are the less familiar tunes that were seldom used in the series. The few notable tracks are Tracks 3 (the funeral march), 14 (the canyon chase) and 15 (Jiguro vs Tagul in Ep3). Sachi Tainaka's Itoshii Hito e is also included (Track 29).

Given that the R1 DVD release is likely to be postponed indefinitely now, it might not be a bad idea to support the series via its OSTs. Well, that's up to you of course.
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