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Old 2007-10-27, 01:55   Link #1
WONDERMIKE
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[MANGA] what went wrong in bleach?

so here we go

to me:

Renjis Bankai - it seems like Kubo had absolutely no idea what kind of bankai renji should get.. in the end it seems to me that this is the most useless/unusable bankai, it is big and slow, and wow(!) it can split itself in its segments wooohoooo (remembers me of aquaman or daredevil, just useless)... i see just one purpose for renji, hes the tank like in mmorpg, so he has to fight with a partner and act as a supporter -> as boring as orihime when it comes to a fight

Kiras Shikai - it is so imbalanced.. there is no need for him to land a hit, blocking is enough, and i cant imagine him getting any stronger, would be just unfair.. so i expect that we won't see him around that often

Rukias and Hitsugayas ice based zanpaktous - we already know that hitsugayas sword is the "most powerful of all ice based zanpaktous".. thats pretty bad for rukia because it would look cheesy when she comes near his powerlevel or performs well in comparison with only using her shikai
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Old 2007-10-27, 01:58   Link #2
Fei-san
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The thing Kubo Tite has for introducing characters and then simply just let them be there with no development whatsoever, like a fart in sealed room
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Old 2007-10-27, 03:43   Link #3
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Way too many damn characters.
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Old 2007-10-27, 08:05   Link #4
cheese no koma
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it'll have to be unnecessary teasing. Just show us urahara's bankai and get it over with instead of giving out hints every now and then.
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Old 2007-10-27, 11:05   Link #5
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What? U want all the characters to have ohsogreatandpretty abilities or what?
Not everyone is Ichigo who with his prettiness and oh so Über bankai styled katana rules them all. Minor characters should stay behind the leading ones, isn't that a rule in shonen??
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Old 2007-10-27, 12:13   Link #6
cheese no koma
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erm, lets see........
creating the orb that leads to aizen becoming a major villain, ever present to provide upgrades and info for characters. Hardly a 'minor' character from my point of view
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Old 2007-10-27, 12:51   Link #7
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I totally disagree with those... here's what I think.

1. Having Hitsugaya (& Matsumoto) be the leader of the team that was sent to the real world. Renji's own explination onto the groups formation is flawed and doesn't really make much sense. IF Renji was asked to make a group based on his own desicions, I severely doubt that those two would have been in it. For the most part Kira and Hisagi should have been the ones to replace those two since they have the most immidiate connection to Renji. If anything, Kubo is guilty here of attempting to please fan girls.

2. The introduction of the Vizards and Shinji. It's redundant no matter how you look at it. The "new mysterious transfer student" thing wears thin after the first time. Furthermore, their participation up to now just blows, like why even make all of them, if you are never going to do anything with them.

3. Several left out explinations.
-How come it's OK for Ichigo to miss an entire month of school?
-How did Ichigo suddenly manage to increase his time with his mask on?
-The whole Espada numbering, some of it seems contradictory.
-Just how did Aizen plug Luppi right into the sixth spot? Considering when Grim got it back he just blew him away.

4. The whole Szayel fight is just beyond a waste. Having him "negate" everyone's powers because he is able to study someone's abilities - at the speed of light mind you - and then cancel out every attack is just a boring, lame, and unimaginative way to drag out a fight; especially when you consider the annoying(ness) of it being placed in pieces every chapter.

5. Nel and her friends. Personal opinion here; whether this was Kubo's attempt to make another Hanataro/Ganju mixed in with a bit of Yoruichi, it has sucked. Specially this last fight with Noitra, man oh man. I couldn't stand Nel's older personality, "I wont kill you", what kinda worthless talk is that? Like shit, what does Kubo expect?

6. Ichigo's lack of character development. You'd figure that after assaulting two places, (Soul Society, Las Noches) he'd get the picture that you simply can't win with the idea of "wanting to save your friends". Zaraki, Dordoni, and Grimmjow have all said that his attitude is the reason why he is weak, because he never fights for himself. If he always relies on the feelings and situations of other people, how the hell can he ever defeat anyone? But I might be wrong about this one.

I have more... but that's enough for now.
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Old 2007-10-27, 20:53   Link #8
Mr. DJ
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Quote:
How come it's ok for Ichigo to miss a month of school?
-well...Ichigo's dad is technically a doctor ain't he? since they run a clinic, though not much of that has been shown since...somewhere in the first 10 episodes. Pretty sure makin up an excuse is easy, sorta like w/ Kagome's grandfather in Inuyasha.

Quote:
How did Ichigo suddenly manage to increase his time with his mask on?
heroes always seem to squeeze out that little bit of extra whatever to keep going

Quote:
The whole Espada numbering, some of it seems contradictory.
maybe it's more than just power that Aizen labels them as so

Quote:
Just how did Aizen plug Luppi right into the sixth spot? Considering when Grim got it back he just blew him away.
good question, can't really think of a reasonable answer myself atm

Quote:
Ichigo's lack of character development. You'd figure that after assaulting two places, (Soul Society, Las Noches) he'd get the picture that you simply can't win with the idea of "wanting to save your friends". Zaraki, Dordoni, and Grimmjow have all said that his attitude is the reason why he is weak, because he never fights for himself. If he always relies on the feelings and situations of other people, how the hell can he ever defeat anyone? But I might be wrong about this one.
well...he saved Rukia didn't he? not everyones strength develops the same from what it looks like.
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Old 2007-10-27, 23:43   Link #9
MAQI
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OK here are mine.
1. How come when you are a "soul" you can get physically sick like rukia's sister and Ukitake? Ukitake coughed up blood in an ep. that means one of two things Tuberculosis or Lung Cancer... how can a soul get those? Never really got that.

2. In one of the early episodes when they first got to the SS chad ran into that parakeet kid and the kid told him when you go to the soul society you don't grow or change but rukia and renji and other did grow up...

3. In the SS there were markets that rukia, renji and their friends stole from. Why have market at all when most souls don't eat anything? and how was there rice and fruit there?

4. How dose a soul die? and where dose it go after that? eg. rukia's sister.

5.
Spoiler for manga:


6.
Spoiler for manga:


I agree with a lot of stuff WONDERMIKE brought up except one thing. Renji's bankai.

It is just as big and cumbersome as Komamura Sajin's bankai, and he uses it well, some are just huge and I think it fits him. The fact that it can now spread into sections is part of its development. It will probably have a few more features as renji masters it.

Same with ichigo, I can't believe its just speed he has. I think he will develop it further.

As for what Jays said about ichigo's lack of development of his character well...
#1 he is only 15
#2 Its manga the character needs stuff to always be working on when it comes to character.
#3 Without that hardheadedness he would not get into trouble and there would be no story.
#4 He will always care for his friends more than himself because its manga...
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Old 2007-10-28, 01:53   Link #10
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Originally Posted by maqi View Post
OK here are mine.
1. How come when you are a "soul" you can get physically sick like rukia's sister and Ukitake? Ukitake coughed up blood in an ep. that means one of two things Tuberculosis or Lung Cancer... how can a soul get those? Never really got that.
Evidently viruses and bacteria go to Soul Society when they die...
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Old 2007-10-28, 03:21   Link #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryuujin View Post
Evidently viruses and bacteria go to Soul Society when they die...
HAHAHA that's too funny

Also, here's one that I think everyone can agree on:

Why does nobody, and I mean nobody every die?
(Hollows being purified notwithstanding)

Also, that one soul that went to hell, well, what the hell...I thought Hueco Mundo existed for those twisted souls in the first place.
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Old 2007-10-28, 04:49   Link #12
tbl
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Yeah, the whole afterlife thing doesn't make much sense, so I don't think about it.

How about giving Ikkaku a bankai? He was defeated by Ichigo when Ichigo was weaker than a lieutenant.

Also, when was it decided that shinigami could move through the air like it was solid ground?

And of course there are those impenetrable character shields.
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Old 2007-10-28, 05:02   Link #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleLaptopChan View Post

Also, here's one that I think everyone can agree on:

Why does nobody, and I mean nobody every die?
(Hollows being purified notwithstanding)

Also, that one soul that went to hell, well, what the hell...I thought Hueco Mundo existed for those twisted souls in the first place.
Kubo loves his characters, i think he just want to "build them up", so they can die a kind of meaningful way at the end of bleach(rangiku - gin, tousen - komamura, hinamori - aizen, etc.. it will be a flashback orgy). Next thing is that you cant have a better chance to survive than being in bleach universe i mean, your body is made of spirit particles or ectoplasm.. must feel great according to people that switch to a gigai

hueco mundo/hell/... -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollow_(Bleach)) its only natural for a hollow to feed on souls, so that cant really count as a sin
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Old 2007-10-28, 08:20   Link #14
benji000
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1. Wonderwice (The little kid arrancar with a big sword on his back, not sure how to spell) turning from a fighter into a pet.
2. Letting Nell be sexy and own in only 3 to 4 chapters and then turning back to a child.
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Old 2007-10-28, 08:44   Link #15
mcruz1014
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One of the things that irks me most is the way that Kubo totally ignores the development of Tatsuki and other characters from earth. She's introduced in the beginning and has a fairly large part early on in the storyline, then is almost totally forgotten after the first arc of the story. I suppose the reason for this is the introduction of too many new characters. Its hard to get attached to characters that only stick around for a few chapters or episodes.
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Old 2007-10-28, 11:27   Link #16
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Originally Posted by Ryuujin View Post
Evidently viruses and bacteria go to Soul Society when they die...
I know I know, but that is just lame... also there being extreme poverty in the SS. If HM is like hell shouldn't the SS be like well, Heaven? How is there poverty in Heaven??? Like I said f#@&ing lame...
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Old 2007-10-28, 11:32   Link #17
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Originally Posted by tbl View Post
Yeah, the whole afterlife thing doesn't make much sense, so I don't think about it.

How about giving Ikkaku a bankai? He was defeated by Ichigo when Ichigo was weaker than a lieutenant.

Also, when was it decided that shinigami could move through the air like it was solid ground?

And of course there are those impenetrable character shields.
The only thing I can say to that is that Ikkaku doesn't want anyone knowing he has a bankai, so maybe he played stupid not to be found out.

Ichigo was not weaker than a lieutenant, never has been. He is just not as experienced in battle as they are.

Yeah the fighting in air thing is something I had a problem with too but I forgot to mention it on my list of bitches...
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Old 2007-10-28, 11:54   Link #18
Scep
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For the current arc...

1. Multitasking: Multitasking both noi / szayel fights.

2. Dragging out fights: Guilty for both too.

3. Unwillingness to kill off characters: I'm not sadistic, but some deaths are needed to keep a good plot going.

4. Repeated character designs: Neriel. Need i say more?

5. Similar storyline. SS arc and the current LN arc.
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Old 2007-10-28, 12:41   Link #19
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I'll only reference your points where I feel I have something to add, Maqi.


Quote:
Originally Posted by maqi View Post
2. In one of the early episodes when they first got to the SS chad ran into that parakeet kid and the kid told him when you go to the soul society you don't grow or change but rukia and renji and other did grow up...
Probably only those with "reiatsu" age. We saw in an earlier episode that only those with reiatsu get hungry (the renji flashback during his fight with Ichigo), so maybe the same applies to aging.


Quote:
Originally Posted by maqi View Post
4. How dose a soul die? and where dose it go after that? eg. rukia's sister.
They're reborn in the real world; I agree that its weird how they die....I still don't understand why.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maqi View Post
5.
Spoiler for manga-Byakuya attitude:
Spoiler for manga. Byakuya attitude:


Quote:
Originally Posted by maqi View Post
6.
Spoiler for manga latest-warning:
My response:
Spoiler for manga latest - warning:

Last edited by Amirali; 2007-10-28 at 21:25.
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Old 2007-10-28, 13:15   Link #20
MAQI
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Probably only those with "reiatsu" age. We saw in an earlier episode that only those with reiatsu get hungry (the renji flashback during his fight with Ichigo), so maybe the same applies to aging.
I thought the same thing, but I wanted to see if anyone else did. I just think KT went forward with the whole SS thing and then in the middle he had ideas that didn't really fit with spiritual rules. Kind of like how religion gives god, angels, and demons human traits to explain their actions. Thanks for the kudos.
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