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Old 2007-11-14, 09:29   Link #141
ILikeSquiReLz
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Originally Posted by aksfjh View Post
I'm thinking something similar. However, I slightly disagree with the "incredibly powerful" part. I think Kaien's importance to the story is overplayed and there's more to the reactions of these 2 than just "ZOMG! A dead man is alive!"

I think Isshin has a great connection to a noble house and was exiled, by choice. I won't discredit his striking similarities to the Shiba clan, but the unmistakable quote by Byakuya about "my senior," or however you wish to interpret that, leads me to believe that Isshin has some close connection to the Kuchiki clan and/or had a leading position over Byakuya.

I don't recall mentioning Kaien in my post. Actually I don't have a clue on why people keep thinking I am referring to him. Care to tell me why you think I was talking about him?

My only mention of him is here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILikeSquiReLz View Post
I thought about that as well. But it can't be, by the time he died Byakuya was already a captain and Kaien was a vice captain. Byakuya stated this person Ukitake was thinking about was his superior.
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Old 2007-11-14, 14:39   Link #142
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think that ichigo is the only True Vizard. The other used a technique to gain hollow powers but arent complete like ichigo.
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Old 2007-11-14, 17:59   Link #143
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Try this theory. He mey have been ichigo's Great (times applicable generations) grandfather
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Old 2007-11-14, 22:01   Link #144
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His shikai must be pretty powerful and I WANT TO SEE HIS AND URAHARAS BANKAI!!!!!!


and according to wiki

Spoiler for Vital info don't read unless you know past the arrancar arc:
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Last edited by High_Lord_Demonix; 2007-11-14 at 22:04. Reason: My bad wrong info
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Old 2008-02-23, 21:55   Link #145
tennis1690
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This is what I just read from Wikipedia on Kisuke Urahara:

Spoiler for Bleach - Kisuke Urahara History:


I think it is possible that this gigai he created was for Isshin Kurosaki, and this is the reason how Isshin managed to stay so long in the living world when he was a shinigami captain. This would explain how Masaki was able to physically see him (Masaki had no spiritual power as she was not able to see Grand Fisher when he attacked her and there's been no hint she ever had it). Of course, Isshin and Masaki met and eventually got married and had 3 kids. Isshin was so happy and in love w/ Masaki that he decided to quit his shinigami duties and remain in the living world forever.

Fast forward to the second attack of Grand Fisher on Ichigo (inhabited by Kon that is), and we see Isshin has regained some of his shinigami powers (he is seen with his shinagami captain robe after he has decided to finally abandon his gigai). I believe that sometime after Masaki died, Isshin started regaining his powers mainly because he felt he needed to in order to find and defeat the hollow that killed her wife (it may have taken very long for him to regain some of his power because he may have been a very strong captain, and this would also explain where Ichigo got all his power from and don't forget the speed at which Ichigo keeps improving).

Tell me what you think!
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Old 2008-02-23, 22:24   Link #146
mazer8
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I always saw Ichigo's powers as being inherited. I agree that I think Isshin used Urahara's gigai, but I'm still not sure about the Masaki question. When Ichigo fought the grand fisher near the cemetery...GF said something of the sort, "so you could see me 10 years ago blah blah" which made me sort of think that maybe he wasn't there to kill Ichigo and Masaki got in the way...but that he was really there to kill Masaki in the first place for her power. I was also under the impression that Isshin's sudden resurgence in power was due to the face that Ichigo can't control how his pours out continuously, so his reiatsu was spilling into his father, essentially recharging Isshin's batteries and resurrecting his powers.
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Old 2008-02-24, 01:53   Link #147
Spectacular_Insanity
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tennis1690 View Post
This is what I just read from Wikipedia on Kisuke Urahara:

Spoiler for Bleach - Kisuke Urahara History:


I think it is possible that this gigai he created was for Isshin Kurosaki, and this is the reason how Isshin managed to stay so long in the living world when he was a shinigami captain. This would explain how Masaki was able to physically see him (Masaki had no spiritual power as she was not able to see Grand Fisher when he attacked her and there's been no hint she ever had it). Of course, Isshin and Masaki met and eventually got married and had 3 kids. Isshin was so happy and in love w/ Masaki that he decided to quit his shinigami duties and remain in the living world forever.

Fast forward to the second attack of Grand Fisher on Ichigo (inhabited by Kon that is), and we see Isshin has regained some of his shinigami powers (he is seen with his shinagami captain robe after he has decided to finally abandon his gigai). I believe that sometime after Masaki died, Isshin started regaining his powers mainly because he felt he needed to in order to find and defeat the hollow that killed her wife (it may have taken very long for him to regain some of his power because he may have been a very strong captain, and this would also explain where Ichigo got all his power from and don't forget the speed at which Ichigo keeps improving).

Tell me what you think!
Well, it would certainly make sense. At least the part about the gigai. I don't remember much about Ichigo's mother, but overall I would say it's extremely plausable.
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Old 2008-02-24, 21:12   Link #148
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Just read this on Wikipedia and I thought it was interesting. I don't know if the difference in how his sword is makes him either very old, very strong or a royal gaurd... check it out.

The name of Isshin's zanpakutō has not yet been revealed. Isshin has only used it once as an example of how every captain-level shinigami must compress the sizes of their zanpakutō, as they would otherwise be swinging swords the size of skyscrapers, when he spoke to Grand Fisher.[5] He also implies that he has abilities on-par to that of a Captain-level shinigami. It is also worn with the edge down like a tachi, instead of the edge up like a katana. The end of the hilt has a tassel similar to Ichigo's original zanpakutō.

The tachi (太刀:たち, tachi?) is a Japanese sword, often said to be more curved and slightly longer than the katana. However Gilbertson, Oscar Ratti, and Adele Westbrook state that a sword is called a tachi when hung from the obi (belt or sash) with the edge down, and the same sword becomes a katana when worn edge up thrust through the girdle.[citation needed] The "tachi" style was eventually discarded in favor of the katana. The daitō (long swords) that pre-date the katana average about 78cm in blade length; larger than the katana average of around 70cm. As opposed to the traditional manner of wearing the katana, the tachi was worn hung from the belt with the cutting-edge down, and usually used by cavalry. Deviations from the average length of tachi have the prefixes ko- for "short" and ō- for "great" attached. For instance, tachi that were shōtō and closer in size to a wakizashi were called kodachi. The longest tachi (considered a 15th century ōdachi) in existence is more than 3.7 meters in total length (2.2m blade) but believed to be ceremonial. During the year 1600, many old tachi were cut down into katana. The majority of surviving tachi blades now are o-suriage, so it is rare to see an original signed ubu tachi.[citation needed]
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Old 2008-03-21, 18:13   Link #149
yaluckyboy
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I totally beleive that Isshin is actually Kaien

He was a prodigy amongst shinigami; graduating from a six year curriculum in just one year and becoming a lieutenant five years after.

I believe that if Isshin really is Kaien, then the reason stands that Ichigo would inherit his father's insane growth rate.
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Old 2008-03-21, 21:44   Link #150
Irkalla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yaluckyboy View Post
I totally beleive that Isshin is actually Kaien

He was a prodigy amongst shinigami; graduating from a six year curriculum in just one year and becoming a lieutenant five years after.

I believe that if Isshin really is Kaien, then the reason stands that Ichigo would inherit his father's insane growth rate.
Lol, Isshin Kaien? Holly crap, that is the weirdest and most impossible theory ever.

Now seriously about Isshin I have sooo many theories in my mind, that it might explode, but my most favorite one is that Masaki and Isshin met like Ichigo and Rukia, and the whole story....
Well, whatever I'll just wait and see.
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Old 2008-03-23, 10:39   Link #151
yaluckyboy
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i have found some incredible information as to the Kaien/Ichigo theory

Spoiler for insane:


and yes, these are both real pictures
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Old 2008-03-24, 15:39   Link #152
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kaien can't be isshin because the 9th espada is formed from a menos that devouered the holow that ate kaien shiba. thats why the espada was able to gain his form and powers
or so i think
and why would isshin if he was kaien hide himself?
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Old 2008-03-24, 17:27   Link #153
MAQI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yaluckyboy View Post
i have found some incredible information as to the Kaien/Ichigo theory

Spoiler for insane:


and yes, these are both real pictures
Isshin can't be Kaien. Kaien's soul got eaten by a hollow, then that hollow got eaten by #9 espada, so how in the world he Isshin be Kaien??? Yes Ichigo looks like Kaien, but the theory has been brought up before that Isshin is a shiba. Hence the look a likes, KT has already explained where Kaien went after he died and that story is done and over with. Kurosaki Isshin I think is a shiba and I think the reason the shiba fell out of the SS's good graces is because of Isshin. Read the SS ark and see where Ganjyu talks about his brother Kaien.
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Old 2008-03-24, 19:12   Link #154
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Isshin is NOT Kaien. Kaien died and possibly has reincarnated as human (as the story goes) and still is human assuming the reincarnated version didn't die later. Besides, Isshin hadn't exactly died and still is more or less a Shinigami (though almost a powerless and retired one). Isshin is certainly old enough to be not known by many younger Shinigami like Rukia but remembered by some of the older ones.
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Old 2008-03-29, 21:36   Link #155
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My theory falls under the Isshin shiba category. by this point in time we can pretty much assume, although its not for certain, that isshin was a 13 court guard squad captain, most likely around the same time as urahara (i have a feeling that we're going to find out for certain with the next chapter or two of the manga coming out).

I think that the blood ties place isshin in the shiba clan, i'm going out on a limb and guessing that he would be ganju's uncle or something close like that. If i'm not mistaken, the shiba clan had its title of nobility stripped from it with the death of kaien. I also believe i read somewhere that the shiba clan used to be one of the great noble families like the shihoins and the kuchikis. This would explain why isshin is such a ba in the one action scene we've seen him in so far.

anyway, everyones probably sick of hearing how ichigo looks like kaien, but has anyone else noticed that kuukako looks like she might be a much more mature version of karin? not to mention that someone earlier mentioned that ganju bears a resemblance to isshin himself.

if Isshin was a member of one of the great noble families, then it would be expected that he would have much higher spirit energy than most shinigami, as such it would be expected that ichigo, his son, would also have the incredibly high spiritual pressure of a noble. Lets all think back to ichigo's earlier days, i'm specifically thinking of the rant that byakura goes on right before ichigo releases his bankai for the first time about how difficult it is for people to achieve bankai and its almost unheard of among people who don't have noble blood. Well if ichigo has the blood of the one noble shiba clan in him, then it would explain a lot.

I'm not exaclty sure why isshin would have left the soul society, but my guess is that it definatly has something to do with urahara. Reading the theories on uraharas gigai being used on isshin, it makes a lot of sence. If the gigai is designed to eat away at a persons rietsu until they become human than it would explain why isshin lost his shinigami powers, how he managed to regain those powers? probably just with time. As for the "how did he have kids if he's in a gigai" argument, personally i don't really think TK put that much thought into it.

At this point it would be a little risky to go ahead and guess how poweful isshin is, but he appears to pack quite the punch. As for isshins Relation with the vizard, i think he knows about them but doesn't really have anything to do with them. Ichigo became a vizard becaus he gained his shinigami powers moments before becoming a hollow, i'm fairly confident its not in his blood.

I'm curious as to what happened between isshin, uryus dad, and urahara, as well as find out the truth behind these characters.
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Old 2008-03-29, 21:48   Link #156
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Originally Posted by Cross Languard View Post
If i'm not mistaken, the shiba clan had its title of nobility stripped from it with the death of kaien. I also believe i read somewhere that the shiba clan used to be one of the great noble families like the shihoins and the kuchikis. This would explain why isshin is such a ba in the one action scene we've seen him in so far.
There was nothing dishonorable about Kaien's death. I firmly believe that they were disgraced well before that.

Possibly because of Isshin
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Old 2008-03-29, 21:53   Link #157
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well i don't think it was so much that he died dishonorably, but that with his death the family didn't have enough influence/power to keep their title of nobility
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Old 2008-03-29, 22:12   Link #158
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I dont think Isshin=Kaien

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAQI View Post
Isshin can't be Kaien. Kaien's soul got eaten by a hollow, then that hollow got eaten by #9 espada,
Kaien's soul wasnt consumed by Metastacia . It was Kaien's Body that fused with Metastacia . Rukia slayed Kaien~Metastacia , the body was programmed to go back to HM . Arro devoured Kaien~Metastacia .No part of Arro was Kaien including soul . He had memories of Kaien due to his consumption of Metastacia~Kaien body . Whichever body or hollow Arro consumes he gets there memories and skills . Why he was using Kaien's appearance . Arro was into vanity noticed those heterosexual frills . Out of 33000 odd hollows Arro consumed Kaien had the best appearance . He was using Kaien face so he could feel good about having a glass jar for a head .
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Old 2008-03-31, 15:40   Link #159
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So does Ichigo knows about his father or not? I was shocked to see Isshin all of a sudden in front of Grand Fisher i was like: wtf is he doing there? That was a nice surprise and it explains why Ichigo sister also can see hollows, and has some kind of spiritual power herself...

Karin & Hitsugaya are cute together
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Old 2008-03-31, 20:13   Link #160
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Kaien is reincarnated as Ichigo.
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