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View Poll Results: Myself; Yourself - Episode 13 (END) Rating
Perfect 10 43 18.61%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 38 16.45%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 39 16.88%
7 out of 10 : Good 52 22.51%
6 out of 10 : Average 23 9.96%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 7 3.03%
4 out of 10 : Poor 11 4.76%
3 out of 10 : Bad 6 2.60%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 3 1.30%
1 out of 10 : Painful 9 3.90%
Voters: 231. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-12-28, 02:51   Link #201
golthin
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Originally Posted by KholdStare View Post
Wow, I really can't believe that this episode got 20 10/10s. That shows that there are still people new to anime out there.
don't judge, this is not to demostrate your "knowledge" or "expertise" on anime but how much you enjoyed the episode. I kind of laugh at the people that break down their comments in parts as if it was a review. My only complain with the episode was that it was too rushed and they didn't have enough time to cover everything preperly, otherwise it was a good episode and I have been watching anime for 7 years. The time skip needed at least 10-15 minutes by itself.
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Old 2007-12-28, 02:52   Link #202
ipernorris
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Originally Posted by grey_moon View Post
Let me guess you want to hit me instead

If you bothered to read my posts, you will see I actually didn't defend Nanaka's mum. I actually spent of my time having a go at her dad and people who support her dad's actions.

The line about Nanaka being the only victim of the whole sorry affair should have been a bit of a give away!
Uhm I think there is a language matter here: I'm not an English mother tongue so it's quite possible. I used "to deserve" in the meaning the mother called upon what happened to her because she greatly provoked her husband being mean and bitchy instead of being deeply sorry. This doesn't mean it isn't a crime. In fact, if the father would have survived, he should have been sentenced to death or to life prison.
The only person I'm really sorry for is Nanaka, of course.

PS I never beat anyone, let alone girls. But if someone kills my family and then come to me saying "I enjoyed raping your wife" then I cannot exclude I would kill him. It's not the rational way to deal with these things, that I know, but I'm a human being so I'm not perfect.

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Old 2007-12-28, 03:39   Link #203
grey_moon
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When it comes to Nanaka's mums actions, I think a big point about it is perspective. If I try to put myself into her shoes then it is hard to see exactly what she did so wrong that warrants a beating to death. Not that I agree with any form of violence.

So here is a list of crimes against humanity performed by Nanaka's mum in order of time.
1. Adultery
2. Lying to cover up Nanaka's real dad and crime 1.
3. Verbally attacking back

I won't include letting the bio dad teach Nanaka violin as the real dad seemed to be part of that decision too.

My take on each crime...

1. If we look at the evidence we are told that she slept with violin man before she got married. Now we don't know was this a one night stand, or were they both competing for her etc etc. So we don't know if it really was adultery, just that it was before they got married.

2. I can't really fault a parent who is willing to lie to protect the life of their child. Nanaka's dad's actions show to me that she was right in predicting that he would want to abort. If bio dad wasn't just a number one sucky f***y a**e then none of this would have happened. Lying to cover up her adulterous act is dependant on crime 1 being a crime, but if that was the number one thing on her mind then she should have fessed up earlier (like before they got married) then later.

3. I already covered that in my earlier post. We don't get to see how she was responding earlier, we just get to see her defiant after copping a blow to the face. But from the way Nanaka's dad acted when bio bastard relived himself, during the funeral and finally with his brother. I would say that he had already let the green beast take over his soul. Hulk get mad Hulk SMASH!!!!!!

So do you see from my POV, the show hasn't shown me anything to show Nanaka's mum being really bad.

I think the writers are using a trick that some interviewers are very fond of that leaves scenarios opened ended and tests the interviewees response on it.

*Edit*
I just realised that crime 1 can never be counted as adultery as they need to be married for that to happen , what is the word for adultery before you get married?
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:05   Link #204
DanielSong39
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It's called "cheating".

While they weren't married, the two were clearly together when Nanaka's mom cheated on him. It's not a case where she became pregnant with an ex-boyfriend, broke up, and then started dating her future husband; the three were friends since high school and hung around each other all the time.
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:09   Link #205
grey_moon
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Originally Posted by DanielSong39 View Post
It's called "cheating".

While they weren't married, the two were clearly together when Nanaka's mom cheated on him. It's not a case where she became pregnant with an ex-boyfriend, broke up, and then started dating her future husband; the three were friends since high school and hung around each other all the time.
Ah cheating that would cover it nicely.

But the thing is, unless I missed it, we don't know the state of their relationship, just that Nanaka's mum had happy happy time with bio dad and that she ended up married to Nanaka's real dad. All I can see is that the assumption is that she was together with the bloke she married.
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:32   Link #206
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Nanaka's father didn't know that Nanaka was not his child for many years, which tells you everything you need to know.

Quite a preview of Sana and Nanaka's future...
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:36   Link #207
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Nanaka's father didn't know that Nanaka was not his child for many years, which tells you everything you need to know.

Quite a preview of Sana and Nanaka's future...
Their kid won't even live long enough to witness the fallout between the two. He has the oil of not 1, but 2 wrist-cutters flowing through his veins!
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:39   Link #208
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Their kid won't even live long enough to witness the fallout between the two. He has the oil of not 1, but 2 wrist-cutters flowing through his veins!
He also needs to watch out for fire. His oil will be set in flames!

And then, Sana catches a fatal disease and summons Shuusuke to hear his final words...

On that very night, Shuusuke kills Sana and Shuri because he finds out that his child (yeah, 10 years so he has one, a girl called ShuriMarkII) was actually Sana's.

Years later, history repeats.

Myself; Yourself 2: Themselves; Ourselves
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:40   Link #209
ipernorris
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Originally Posted by grey_moon View Post
So do you see from my POV, the show hasn't shown me anything to show Nanaka's mum being really bad.

I think the writers are using a trick that some interviewers are very fond of that leaves scenarios opened ended and tests the interviewees response on it.
In matter of hours Nanaka's father discovered:
1) he wasn't her real father.
2) his wife made a fool out of him lying for years.
3) She made a fool out of him again making him believing the music sensei was just a sensei while he was Nanaka's real father.
4) She wasn't even sorry and she had the nerve to say she wanted Nanaka to inherit her bio father traits.

I think there is enough to drive mad anyone. Of course this doesn't change anything about the crime commited by Nanaka's father: an assassination is an assassination so he should have been punished accordingly if he would have survived, as I've said.
To sum it up: I'm very sad for Nanaka, that poor girl was the only true victim of her mother's bitchness, her father madness and her biological father selfishness.
I'm not sad at all for her parents, her mother in particular. I really liked the time-skip: Nanaka became such a beautiful woman!
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:47   Link #210
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I don't know about Nanaka's mom as a perpetual cheater. She was at least forthright about it and did show remorse, so it doesn't seem like she's that type of sneaky cheater.

Also, what if Nanaka was conceived just before the marriage? And finally, it's not like she was dating a total stranger to begin with.

Or maybe I just have life experience with this stuff, and not all of it simply falls into the 'cheating' category to me.
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:48   Link #211
serenade_beta
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Originally Posted by ipernorris View Post
that poor girl was the only true victim of her mother's bitchness, her father madness and her biological father selfishness.
Well, the biological father was a bit harder to judge for me.

He at least had the nerves (in a good way) to confess to his old friend what he did, hoping for forgiveness.
In the end, he had no ill intentions, unlike the crazy couple.
But in the end, his confession screwed up the lives of three people...
It's not like it's not understandable for him to be "selfish". They've been friends for many years already, and he knows that the dad would be extremely shocked to find out that his daughter isn't blood-related to him, so he kept it to himself because all would be fine that way...
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Old 2007-12-28, 04:57   Link #212
grey_moon
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Originally Posted by serenade_beta View Post
Well, the biological father was a bit harder to judge for me.

He at least had the nerves (in a good way) to confess to his old friend what he did, hoping for forgiveness.
In the end, he had no ill intentions, unlike the crazy couple.
But in the end, his confession screwed up the lives of three people...
It's not like it's not understandable for him to be "selfish". They've been friends for many years already, and he knows that the dad would be extremely shocked to find out that his daughter isn't blood-related to him, so he kept it to himself because all would be fine that way...
Personally I think he was trying to cleanse his soul to be allowed into heaven with no regard for those he left behind.

@ipnorris - I think u best watch the epi again. from the point he heard the confession, to the funeral (at least several days especially if they follow that watch the body custom), then going to to get drunk with his brother and then killing his wife is a little more then a few hours.
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Old 2007-12-28, 05:38   Link #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grey_moon View Post
Personally I think he was trying to cleanse his soul to be allowed into heaven with no regard for those he left behind.
Shame he was the only one who did then

And Nanaka's father went crazy before he was provoked by his wife's words. That guy is a "traditional male" sorta person you see all those years back. The types who hold absolute authority in the house and beats their wife >.>

Nanaka's mother was making a stand in reaction to her husband's anger...which then caused him to react...then the cycle of argument repeats
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Old 2007-12-28, 05:56   Link #214
stjeppe
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hmm well this episode get an 8/10.
they showed background, so questions about Nanaka or Sana are gone.
they ended up together which is also good.
only downside is the time jump... (10 yrs...in which nothing happened??)
also no conclusive end on the twins...you might say stuff happened because they were holding hands...but it's all speculation in my eyes. in ep 11 they were holding hands aswell also said in the past when they wre younger they were holding hands...it's all speculation..

anyways i enjoyed the episode
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Old 2007-12-28, 06:18   Link #215
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Sana past abit short... i mean abit, huh?...
The fire is started by Nanaka father, I thought is her uncle, but ...

10 years jump, skip a lot of thing, at least at the end scene there, all friend should take photo together or something like tat, but it go back to the past....The ending is ok for me, happy end at least .

Nanaka look nice too after 10 years, but Sana hairstyle abit ..., on the stage Nanaka is wearing the ring, so she agreed to marry to Sana? And all the friend are come back as well, although the twin didnt show the face.

BTW, who is the boy with Hinako? She mention he younger than her 5 years old, is her boyfriend?
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Old 2007-12-28, 06:47   Link #216
grey_moon
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Originally Posted by arkxkra View Post
BTW, who is the boy with Hinako? She mention he younger than her 5 years old, is her boyfriend?
That was Hinako's younger brother so it is another case of incest.

Joking! It is Asami's cousin from the Haunted House episode.
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Old 2007-12-28, 07:37   Link #217
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That was Hinako's younger brother so it is another case of incest.

Joking! It is Asami's cousin from the Haunted House episode.
oic, no wonder the name sound familiar...
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Old 2007-12-28, 07:53   Link #218
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Hello. watched the episode and was rather disappointed because of numerous inconsistencies.
It took on the whole 20 years for Sana and Nanaka to settle things. For me it is actually strange to see people keep in touch 10 years later especially considering the fact that their relationships were quite strained. You know 10 years is enough to graduate and then write a thesis for a Ph.D. What I saw instead was basically the same 15 year old people who grew just a bit fatter.
Speaking of Nanaka. I find it strange that she turned to be a violinist after cutting her wrist (which hand was it, right or left). Also judging by how they showed it one might get an impression that she was laying in the bath for a week, i e the whole time Sana kept paying visits to her place.
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Old 2007-12-28, 08:08   Link #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipernorris View Post

@Sinestra
Don't play the white knight... lol
grey_moon is perfectly able to speak for himself/herself.
Exactly right I dont need to speak for him he did it for himself. Also, thats not called playing the white knight thats called respecting others opinions. I know english is not your native tounge so i think we had some mix up's with how we were trying to get our points accross. I respect your opinion on the matter i just disagree with it. Grey_Moon and I just happen to agree on this patricular subject. We all said what we had to presented our thoughts and evidence to back up our claims. Nothing harm no foul.

As for the music sensei/Nanaka's bio father. I agree he was trying to make amends before he died. But he was selfish about it he hoped for the best? hoped to be forgiven? Yea right he was perfectly content to keep the secret for over 7 or 8 years and if he had not gotten cancer he probably would have kept the secret. He slept with his bestfriends fiance at the time and even after they got married never said anything, a person was truely sorry would have spoken up right away. Now im not sure if he was ever told that Nanaka was his child. It seems the mom kept that secret from him as well. I put him on the same level as Nanaka's fathers they are all bad role models. They say time heals wounds well time also lets old wounds fester in more animoisty
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Old 2007-12-28, 10:29   Link #220
golthin
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It's called "cheating".

While they weren't married, the two were clearly together when Nanaka's mom cheated on him. It's not a case where she became pregnant with an ex-boyfriend, broke up, and then started dating her future husband; the three were friends since high school and hung around each other all the time.
that is what they call one last fling before you are commited and it happens more than you think.
Some people have the twisted thinking that even when you are in a relationship, as long as you are not married it is less harmful than after you are married, so to not have any regrets they have one last go at sex with someone else.
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