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Old 2008-01-09, 23:31   Link #181
Sparrow1770
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It seemed to me that Lawrence understood Chloe's intentions perfectly, and that he pretended not to in order to avoid a direct refusal. He does not see her as an adult or a love interest, and he didn't want to hurt her. I got the impression he regarded her more as a little sister than anything. When she sprawls on the hay, and he catches himself looking her over, he immediately looks away in embarrassment.

C: I've grown without you even noticing.
L: No, you have a long way to go as a merchant...

He keeps his distance here, never giving in to the innuendo. The whole scene is a conversation on two levels at once.
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Old 2008-01-09, 23:41   Link #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparrow1770 View Post
The whole scene is a conversation on two levels at once.
Yet because of what lawrence thought of her, and the fact that she wasn't confirming anything, the converstation remained on the "merchant" subject on the surface.
Pratically because of that they were playing dumb with each other - while lawrence understood what she meant, chloe wasn't able to confirm whether he does or not based on his reaction.
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Old 2008-01-09, 23:49   Link #183
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Yet because of what lawrence thought of her, and the fact that she wasn't confirming anything, the converstation remained on the "merchant" subject on the surface.
Pratically because of that they were playing dumb with each other - while lawrence understood what she meant, chloe wasn't able to confirm whether he does or not based on his reaction.
I got the impression that he's not ready to settle down yet... no matter how tempting the offer was.

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Old 2008-01-09, 23:54   Link #184
Masanori Ota
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Originally Posted by Sparrow1770 View Post
It seemed to me that Lawrence understood Chloe's intentions perfectly, and that he pretended not to in order to avoid a direct refusal. He does not see her as an adult or a love interest, and he didn't want to hurt her. I got the impression he regarded her more as a little sister than anything. When she sprawls on the hay, and he catches himself looking her over, he immediately looks away in embarrassment.

C: I've grown without you even noticing.
L: No, you have a long way to go as a merchant...

He keeps his distance here, never giving in to the innuendo. The whole scene is a conversation on two levels at once.
Exactly. Exactly. Exactly.

Not much more I can add. Uploading illustrations from volume 2 of the novels.
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Old 2008-01-10, 00:32   Link #185
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I like the OP for this anime. ;D
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Old 2008-01-10, 00:39   Link #186
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And that guy must not be very straight to be standing and talking to a naked Horo, who is less than an arms length away, without any reaction!
Seriously what did you expect? Him to pick her up and get down to "business" with her in his cart? Also I'm sure the ears and tail would put a bit of a dent in most people libido. At least he didn't react like the site of her naked body would be instant death for him like the majority of anime leads. Also I think it's a bit too much to say he had no reaction at all..
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Old 2008-01-10, 00:46   Link #187
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Hope they have an accurate(or close to) translation of the ending song cause I really want to know its lyric, just can't wait until they release the CD
The audio's clearer, it shouldn't be too hard now. I didn't want to guess about it any more than you, though.
(I won't even say what the line after "sunshine pie" sounds like...)
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Old 2008-01-10, 00:49   Link #188
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Also I'm sure the ears and tail would put a bit of a dent in most people libido.
Umm...some people like it that way you know...
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Old 2008-01-10, 00:52   Link #189
Westlo
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Umm...some people like it that way you know...
I know No offense to those people but I hope Horo being a fav of mine doesn't put me in "that" category.
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Old 2008-01-10, 00:54   Link #190
Masanori Ota
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I know No offense to those people but I hope Horo being a fav of mine doesn't put me in "that" category.
She's only 10% furry, so I don't believe it does.
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Old 2008-01-10, 01:09   Link #191
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Besides on the serious side having a tail and wolf ears would send the signal that she isn't human so better not do something stupid. Sure first guess was a demon or something, but that's probably why. Still I wouldn't say he had no reaction just that other things came to mind first.
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Old 2008-01-10, 01:11   Link #192
issei
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Oh shi-, it's issei? In this thread?
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Although I do think Horo's voiceacting didn't quite click with me and I couldn't stop thinking "why is Lelouch here?" even though I don't watch Code Geass, dammit...

Maybe I'll just watch it when I'm free - I just hope it doesn't get majorly fuxx0red along the way.

EDIT: For you guys who like the composition of the OP music, it's by this guy called Tomohiko Kira - he composed the 12 Kingdoms ending song. If you want to look for more music by him, look for "ZABADAK" Not all of it is like the OP though.
i'm of the opinion that horo's VA is doing a great job of playing the character thus far. the intonations illustrate that she's definitely a creature apart from the rest, and impart the feeling of a capricious, finicky wolf-in-sheep's-clothing (so to speak).

and yeah, ZABADAK is pretty cool : )
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Old 2008-01-10, 01:16   Link #193
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Good point, Vexx. I'm just a bit miffed that Chloe even exists.
Why? Is she not supposed to? I quite like her myself...
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Old 2008-01-10, 02:06   Link #194
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^ because she seems like a wasted character? When lawrence goes on travel I doubt we would see her again any time soon - this is horo's chance I like chloe, but I don't think she would play a major role in the series besides the usual "love and not loved" drama.
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Old 2008-01-10, 02:46   Link #195
Vexx
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Heh, it's not the nudity. I like beautiful naked women.

But that's the thing -- women, not teenagers. Why has a 250-year-old fertility goddess adopted the form of a 15-year-old girl? I hope there is actually a good reason why Horo takes that form. (Actually, I thought at first that Horo had possessed Chloe; or perhaps, Horo takes the form of whichever villager plays the role of the "wolf" during the harvest festival. In which case, lucky for Lawrence, the village chose to use Chloe that year.)

It would have been so much more interesting, in my opinion, if Horo were somewhat aloof, mocking even, but still sweet and innocent at the same time, as befitting an immortal who sees things from a completely alien perspective. I'd have hoped for a full-grown woman, complete with all the contradicting complexity that is the hallmark of an adult female, like Horo is supposed to be. I'm thinking, perhaps, of Kikyo from Inuyasha, a tragic character who was free to behave like a normal human only after she was no longer human.

As it were, Horo as she is presented now, seems like yet another exercise in wish-fulfilment for vulnerable young men who are afraid of dating real women. (Yes, yes, I know, the usual stereotype of Japanese otaku, but hey, Horo isn't exactly a break from the norm too, you know?)
Only problem I see with that view is that in feudal times, 15 yr olds were "women" in every sense of the term - adult and usually getting married or betrothed. Chloe may be only a couple of years older in physical age. The way you describe Horo though is exactly how the manga (and by extension the light novels) portrays her and how the anime is trying to portray her - though we've not yet seen enough to know if they've done well.

The adult way they handled Horo's unconcern with nudity (no stupid omigosh aiee crap) especially with Lawrence's reaction (very adult) really bodes well so far.....

Note: Chloe is not a "wasted character" ... she is an anime-only character (as far as whats been written in the source material). However, as a character, she provides a focus for the events that are going to give Horo and Lawrence a hard time. Otherwise, you're just watching a documentary of official actions rather than a personal view. I can speculate about how she'll play a role in the anime series and whether she later pursues and interacts with the pair (especially after the one-god zealots apparently have put a kibosh on the festival -- my guess at what happened at the end of episode one) but I'd rather just watch it unfold.

Last edited by Vexx; 2008-01-10 at 03:05.
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Old 2008-01-10, 02:53   Link #196
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Just saw that ADTRW released their take on episode 1 and the tag line on "that bittorrent site" says that it could be HD since the "staff text is so clear I could cry!" ...or not.

Just downloaded it to compare. They used a MUCH better source. I wouldn't exactly say it's HD but the resolution and quality is far better.
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Old 2008-01-10, 03:54   Link #197
herbert
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I am really worried how they're going to place Chloe within the story.

Spoiler for very little novel spoiler:


ps. I am wondering if there are any place in AnimeSuki I can talk about novel stuff? A manga thread or something. I still remember those days we put all Ghost Hunt spoilerish discussion in manga thread so kept anime thread spoiler-free. I wonder if we can do same thing here with Spice and Wolf.

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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Yeah, the Horo/Lawrence angle is more romantic ... and also more impossible for more than a journey unless something magical happens.
I am trying to tell you something and avoid spoiler as much as possible. I remember you said your have read 4 chapters of manga, so I advise to reread chap. 2.
Spoiler for manga:
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Old 2008-01-10, 04:38   Link #198
Vexx
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You could start a Light Novel thread in the Manga section -- that'd be best until 'Spice and Wolf' develops enough traffic for a subforum... a separate manga thread might be best as well if one isn't already in progress. (haven't looked yet) If a subforum develops, the mods would just move the threads over if they thought it useful.

My quote "impossible for more than a journey"..... heh, I didn't say I thought the journey would be short -- journeys can takes *years* so I think there's plenty of time possible for a long relationship. They're heading towards her home country in the Far North and a lot can happen on the way -- which makes for a lot of potential story. The countryside looks mid-latitude, which means it may be one or more thousand miles to her homeland (at 5 miles a day, maybe... not including stops).

However, even if it takes years.... Horo is a young immortal and Lawrence isn't. I'll just point you to Arwen and Aragorn in Lord of the Rings (though it is a fantasy.... there's nothing that says Horo must stay immortal so far). Romance is sweet yet bitter.
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Old 2008-01-10, 04:46   Link #199
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Originally Posted by Vexx
Only problem I see with that view is that in feudal times, 15 yr olds were "women" in every sense of the term - adult and usually getting married or betrothed.
Aye, you make a good point. Historically, 15-year-old females were considered adults during the Middle Ages. That was the reality. Although, I should point out that the world of Spice and Wolf may not necessarily reflect Middle Ages Europe. From what little I see so far, Chloe is considered young by her fellow villagers, even though she may actually be "older" than Horo in relative physical age. Young enough for Lawrence to feel uncomfortable with her advances. Relatively speaking, that means Horo is "young", by the standards of her world.

But, I shan't quibble. I'm arguing over a purely academic point anyway, and besides I do actually enjoy Horo as she is at the moment. I only feel that it's a pity that she isn't a bit more "mature", but since you assure me of her potential depth, I'll look forward to the future episodes.
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Old 2008-01-10, 05:39   Link #200
Vexx
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Well.. don't bite me if the anime fails to convey it as well as the manga (and I assume the light novels) do. I have high hopes for the entertainment value of this one for me.... but then I remind myself of all the other series that failed to do justice to their premises.
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