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Old 2008-01-31, 00:29   Link #61
DragoonKain3
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I wholeheartedly agree with nuay.

I'm somewhat of an otaku. I only really started collecting DVDs last year summer, and I'm counting I have 49 boxsets, just ordered one more boxset coming (Utawarerumono), collecting another one by one (Zegapain), and starting another by February (Kanon). Not to mention buying more at a discount (at least a dozen) in an upcoming convention in may.

But people like me are hard to come by even in my area that has a lot of anime fans, much less finding those who's willing to pay those kind of prices (aka. the true otaku).



But I think it's as relentless says. They don't really expect to make a killing, just to make up a bit of extra money. I imagine that if all they ever had to do is to make an english cover and a translation, it won't be much of a header in terms of cost. There exists more hardcore otaku than I am in north america (just haven't personally met any yet I suppose), and at those prices they'll still make a bit of money despite it being passed over by the vast majority of anime fans. And I think that's all they're looking forward to (recouping production cost), I guess.
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Old 2008-01-31, 00:44   Link #62
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That was unexpected and omg at the price. It'll be interesting to see how this pans out.
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Old 2008-01-31, 00:45   Link #63
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Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
They don't really expect to make a killing, just to make up a bit of extra money. I imagine that if all they ever had to do is to make an english cover and a translation, it won't be much of a header in terms of cost.
If they make just a little more money doing this than just licensing to a second party, then they came ahead!
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Old 2008-01-31, 00:50   Link #64
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If they make just a little more money doing this than just licensing to a second party, then they came ahead!
We'll just have to wait to find out if they do make more this way. It is an interesting experiment. Just keep in mind that based on the fees I've seen for licensing they'll have to sell a lot of DVDs to match the money. Of course, they won't have to sell as many DVDs as the licensor would have had to, but that's when we find out how many customers will adapt to the new price point and how many will just decide to purchase another title for less money.
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Old 2008-01-31, 00:55   Link #65
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Originally Posted by NoSanninWa View Post
We'll just have to wait to find out if they do make more this way. It is an interesting experiment. Just keep in mind that based on the fees I've seen for licensing they'll have to sell a lot of DVDs to match the money. Of course, they won't have to sell as many DVDs as the licensor would have had to, but that's when we find out how many customers will adapt to the new price point and how many will just decide to purchase another title for less money.
if you are not forbidden from telling, what kind of amount have you seen? I have never seen anywhere any spesific amount discussed before.
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Old 2008-01-31, 01:05   Link #66
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Here you go: The Industry - Costs

Apparently license fees run about $20,000 per episode. At a DVD cost of $40 per 2 episodes that means they'd have to sell at least 1000 DVDs to break even.

Of course they'd need to budget for R1 advertising and production costs. But the costs aren't really too bad unless many people feel the price is outrageous. I'm not sure how much advertising would cost and I don't really feel like researching it right now, but I guess they would have to sell a minimum of 1500 DVDs to cover it. Anyone want to look up how much licensors spend on advertising? I know they're pretty close mouthed, but there is probably a mention somewhere.
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Old 2008-01-31, 01:37   Link #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoSanninWa View Post
Here you go: The Industry - Costs

Apparently license fees run about $20,000 per episode. At a DVD cost of $40 per 2 episodes that means they'd have to sell at least 1000 DVDs to break even.

Of course they'd need to budget for R1 advertising and production costs. But the costs aren't really too bad unless many people feel the price is outrageous. I'm not sure how much advertising would cost and I don't really feel like researching it right now, but I guess they would have to sell a minimum of 1500 DVDs to cover it. Anyone want to look up how much licensors spend on advertising? I know they're pretty close mouthed, but there is probably a mention somewhere.
that doesnt even count the other costs that the company can pay, so it could run at about 1500+ or even more to really break even. that's a lot of dvd's to sell. no wonder they licensed it early.

but 20,000 dollars per episode? that's kinda low considering the costs that was made to make that 1 episode. but i dont know...
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Old 2008-01-31, 02:11   Link #68
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What are they thinking? I could buy every Kanon and Air DvD for the price they want for a 13 episode series.

I enjoy True Tears, but there's no way in hell I'm paying that much. I hope some group still fansubs it. If not, oh well. Bandai Visual will never see a single penny of my money.
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Old 2008-01-31, 02:11   Link #69
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but 20,000 dollars per episode? that's kinda low considering the costs that was made to make that 1 episode. but i dont know...
Well, naturally the license fee costs less than the amount needed to make the episode. This is just one of many sources of revenue necessary to recoup that investment. Considering how anime companies in the US are faring lately, I suspect that the fee is already at the limit of the R1 market to recover the sum.
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Old 2008-01-31, 02:20   Link #70
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IIRC , about a month or two ago BV's president state that there are many titles that they can't break even . There is also a rumour that the sale of BV's gun buster dvd combine all 3 volumes is even less than the sale of Rozen maiden volume 1,which is state by Geneon that it was one of their worse selling. True Tears is good anime but it won't appeal to larger audience and now BV make it even more niche with their stupid model. Why can't they just look at how other company ,like MB, did with their sub only release? Why MB can recoup their money while they releases 4-5 sub only episode per disc with only 20$ retail price? I mean why is it so hard to apply the model that already prove to be "work" in the market?
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Old 2008-01-31, 02:31   Link #71
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You're missing an important difference.

Media Blasters gave the low price and sub only treatment to anime that was older or of questionable salability. Those shows had a very low license fee, so they combined that with low production costs by leaving out a dub track, then passed the savings on to the consumer to increase sales.

By comparison, True Tears and Shigofumi are being released concurrently in R1 and R2. That's the furthest thing from an old title with questionable salability. They expect these will be hot releases. They're merely leaving off the dub track because they doubt its value and it would slow down the release date. They are counting on the consumer to be so eager to get their hands on them that it will be worth a little extra money.
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Old 2008-01-31, 02:53   Link #72
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There was an interesting interview with Funi's CEO last week where he made it sound like the advances R1 companies have to pay to license titles are rapidly falling to zero (although I'm sure they still pay a percentage of sales or something):

Quote:
With the recent changes in the U.S. anime market, are Japanese licensors reducing their demands in terms of what it costs to acquire material for the U.S. market?
The Japanese are absolutely reducing their advances required to acquire titles. Obviously, they need to charge what's fair in the market for us to be able to recoup. So yes, the numbers are getting as low as free (no advance), which is still not free because we still have to spend $10,000 an episode to dub the thing. It's a huge investment for us. Then we have to spend tons of money marketing it, launching it, designing the package. It's huge money to launch a title, so in a sense we are totally investing regardless of the advance. The advance concept is getting to be a silly notion, I think.
His comment on how much dubs cost ($10,000/ep) makes me think sub-only releases will become even more common...not a big deal for me personally since I'm a sub fan, but I do feel for dub fans that aren't getting what they want on releases like this.
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Old 2008-01-31, 03:16   Link #73
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He says that the advances are approaching zero. I assume that means the licensor is making a nice percentage off each DVD sold to make up for that low advance... I wonder how it compares in the end...

That is interesting to learn that a dub costs $10K/episode. I suspect that Bandai Visual is not spending that money because dubbing would slow down the release, so it won't count against their costs. If they do dub, that will require them to sell another 500 units.
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Old 2008-01-31, 03:19   Link #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suguru View Post
His comment on how much dubs cost ($10,000/ep) makes me think sub-only releases will become even more common...not a big deal for me personally since I'm a sub fan, but I do feel for dub fans that aren't getting what they want on releases like this.
Personally I'd like every series to have a dub, but I'm also realistic enough to realize and accept that some will have to be released subbed only due to the way the market is. Hence why I still went for stuff like Kashimashi for example.
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Old 2008-01-31, 03:24   Link #75
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Originally Posted by Rhyel View Post
The guys of Bandai visit the Animesuki. Possible dialog in Bandai Visual US:

- Hey Boss, look. True Tears win a subforum on AnimeSuki.

- Wow, Then True Tears is really good. Fast, call to Bandai Visual JP now.

- Roger.

- Hello, Boss JP, Here is Boss US speaking, Give a License to True Tears, please.

- Sure, but surprise me the speed of the request, any reason?

- No, just my intuition for business.



PS: Sorry my English
I lol-ed for this one.

But if you ask me,i rather if they just go for School Days which is much more well-known among the fans for its nice boat f**king bloody ending.

Its sure feel weird to see True Tears got licensed by Bandai.I don't think that True Tears is that different compared to the other school romance series like H2O or KimiKiss...even the anime quality is comparably same with other series of the same genre.I'm not sure how they gonna make money from this anime though,since its a new series for this season,beside the game itself is not that well-known among all gamers around the globe.
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Old 2008-01-31, 05:13   Link #76
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Originally Posted by NoSanninWa View Post
They might blame fansubs, but they won't be able to believe that propoganda if it actually sells worse than other shows that have been fansubbed.

More likely this is just an experiment devised as a compromise between the licensor and licensee. For a long time Bandai has wanted to release quickly, but the Japanese companies don't like the idea since their releases in Japan are so much more expensive. The Japanes companies fear that nobody will buy the R2 release if they R1 release is cheaper and comes out at the same time. I could easily see all those Japanese otaku importing Bandai USA's release to save a LOT of money.

This way, Bandai gets to release concurrently with the R2 release. If it sells poorly they'll know that it is a failed experiment and won't do it again. If it sells well, then Bandai will be laughing all the way to the bank. They'll make more money AND they will get their product to market faster.

We'll just have to wait a few months to see which outcome is true.
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Old 2008-01-31, 05:15   Link #77
NoSanninWa
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Sorry, but I don't understand that joke.

Anyway, I now know better than what I posted way back then. Please ignore my earlier misconceptions.
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Old 2008-01-31, 05:22   Link #78
golthin
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Originally Posted by supahem View Post
that doesnt even count the other costs that the company can pay, so it could run at about 1500+ or even more to really break even. that's a lot of dvd's to sell. no wonder they licensed it early.

but 20,000 dollars per episode? that's kinda low considering the costs that was made to make that 1 episode. but i dont know...
remember that $40 is not what they get per DVD, that is MSRP which mean that they get about half of that for each sale and the rest goes to the retailer. I don't know what retailers pay for each DVD but i have seen most online retailers selling the 29.99 MSRP DVD at $18-22 after discounts. so at $20k per episode, they would need to sale 2000 DVD to pay for what a licensing fee will cost.
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Old 2008-01-31, 05:51   Link #79
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ouch talk about ripping off, bandai truely wants to rape people's purse on this one.
i feel for all of you who are in R2
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Old 2008-01-31, 06:15   Link #80
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Quite a surprise, True Tears gets a subforum on Animesuki.
The next day it's licensed. o.o!

*planning to buy the DVD's

EDIT: I just realized how expensive this purchase is, these better be worth it...

Last edited by Liddo-kun; 2008-02-01 at 08:54.
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