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View Poll Results: Spice and Wolf - Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 48 47.06%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 30 29.41%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 16 15.69%
7 out of 10 : Good 5 4.90%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 0.98%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 1.96%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 102. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2008-03-22, 18:51   Link #121
Green²
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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Better spotlight this episode for the shepherd and Enik. I mean, at least now we know that one of them is aware about Horo's secret. Because for a long while there, it's like if one of your specialties is about the wolf thing, then what about the one that is standing right next to you? Well, not that we know for certain if Nora does know yet. Probably doesn't, as we do know that she wouldn't want to invoke the wrath of Horo, ...and us seeing that Nora just wanted to be with Lawre... *thunk* Ah..Hey!.. What? ...But it's true!

Ah, but then what do you think Nora had whispered to Horo?

Spoiler for Pics:
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Old 2008-03-22, 20:59   Link #122
Ninjamasta
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This is a great episode until the end....grrr....I wanna see what happen next and how Lawrence is going to get himself out of trouble this time.

Btw...I thought this season only has 12 episodes and the 1 extra for dvd. Is it true? I wanna get the dvd regardless cause this show is too good to pass up.
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Old 2008-03-22, 21:01   Link #123
Masanori Ota
It's Horo, not Han Solo.
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Green² View Post
Better spotlight this episode for the shepherd and Enik. I mean, at least now we know that one of them is aware about Horo's secret. Because for a long while there, it's like if one of your specialties is about the wolf thing, then what about the one that is standing right next to you? Well, not that we know for certain if Nora does know yet. Probably doesn't, as we do know that she wouldn't want to invoke the wrath of Horo, ...and us seeing that Nora just wanted to be with Lawre... *thunk* Ah..Hey!.. What? ...But it's true!

Ah, but then what do you think Nora had whispered to Horo?

Spoiler for Pics:
She whispered what she thought of Lawrence, probably not something romantic. Probably something about him being a "softy".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjamasta View Post
This is a great episode until the end....grrr....I wanna see what happen next and how Lawrence is going to get himself out of trouble this time.

Btw...I thought this season only has 12 episodes and the 1 extra for dvd. Is it true? I wanna get the dvd regardless cause this show is too good to pass up.
There's 12 episodes on air, one on the DVD. 13 episodes total.

Buy the DVDs anyhow, if you want a second season.
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Old 2008-03-22, 23:15   Link #124
mikesince83
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Censorship...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masanori Ota View Post
She whispered what she thought of Lawrence, probably not something romantic. Probably something about him being a "softy".
That sounds about right considering the reaction from Horo.

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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Was something censored? I'm not aware of any censoring unless you're referring to the art style they use when Horo is undressed.
There is a form of censorship, in that nipples are removed/not animated. Possibly that's what you meant by "art style"?
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Old 2008-03-23, 03:55   Link #125
HayashiTakara
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Yeah when I meant by censored is the fact that they obviously didn't draw her nipples in, or have the side bangs of her hair poorly hiding her nipples when the shot is close enough to "see" it better.
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Old 2008-03-23, 06:07   Link #126
Tri-ring
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Originally Posted by HayashiTakara View Post
Yeah when I meant by censored is the fact that they obviously didn't draw her nipples in, or have the side bangs of her hair poorly hiding her nipples when the shot is close enough to "see" it better.
To my knowledge there isn't an official censorship against nipples in Japan and mostly they are self-regulated guidelines so it can be marketed in other nations sensitive to those stuff like *cough USA cough*
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Old 2008-03-23, 06:36   Link #127
seaghyn16
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I don't think it's even censored. The light novel 1, like first page, has a picture of Horo, and theres nothing "drawn in" on the 2 slight bulges on her chest. The part about her unclothed is more a detail Asuna's probobly put in to represent how Horo, in wolf form, is as animals tend to be in the wild, unclothed, except for their fur. Horo isn't a magical beast, so her fur doesn't "turn" into clothes. When horo transforms, the constricting clothing is torn off, so when she returns to human form, obviously those clothes wouldn't be with her. It's not a "fan-service" thing, or something put in to draw in those interested in "fan-service." It's simply another way Asuna tries to make the events that happen as realistic as possible, under the circumstances of wolf diety's and the like. Besides, if you look at how a wolf feeds it's young, milk doesn't come from mammary glands on the chest, instead they are close to the genital region. Horo's "female anatomy" on her chest is more of a store for fat or how like how her paws turn to hands, her chest develops a shape similar to a females, rather than the location of the milk for young cubs. Thus, it has no need for a nipple which acts as the "suckle," and has no real point being drawn in.

That's the answer I came up with. None of it is censored, it's just that there, in reality, is nothing there.

This may also be on purpose by Asuna to keep reminding us of the true difference between Lawrence and Horo. In the end, no matter how close they may get, Horo simply is not a human girl, and he continues to reference and remind us of this.
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Old 2008-03-23, 06:49   Link #128
Anh_Minh
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Then how come she doesn't have nipples on the belly?
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Old 2008-03-23, 07:03   Link #129
seaghyn16
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Hmmmm, well, a wolf has a number of teats, (I'm actually unsure of the number) but probobly around the amount of pups born in a litter, which could amount to around 4 or 5 ish...as to why they aren't on the belly, let's go with Asuna taking dramatic liscense to give Horo a relative sense of humanity, even while trying hard, reminding us of her inhumanity. He balances it, and chooses not to draw in any strange 4-5 protruding pieces of flesh from around the lower stomach region, while also choosing to not to draw in said protruding pieces of flesh from the upper chest region. Mostly it comes down to dramatic liscense, and the added bonuses of possibly a better international perception, coupled with slight realistic aspects, and removal of strange aspects. (four random teats on the stomach would be extremely awkward, while simply not having teats on the upper chest region isn't such a radical change)

I'm actually kinda freaked that an episode 12 discussion with absolutely nothing in regards to what these past xx # of posts have talked about, is having this discussion....I feel kinda bad for all those that don't want to read this kinda material =), and I do feel a bit awkward talking about it, recognizing that there are obviously readers that are girls, and this isn't something that should be discussed really on a public forum (the female anatomy) yet here I am trying to relate why Asuna's drawing is....

Anyway, I apologize to all the female's out there, and from here on will try to keep my posts a bit more...concious.
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Old 2008-03-23, 07:50   Link #130
seaghyn16
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Any one have any ideas on what will happen to Horo if for some reason she loses the fight, or get's seriously injured, and is unable to return to Lawrence? maybe all those "hundreds" of wolves would all storm at her if she wins or something?
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Old 2008-03-23, 07:57   Link #131
HayashiTakara
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Its Human form, I'm fairly certain that her anatomy is as close to a human as she can get. If there was nothing there, Lawrence would be WTF you have no nipples?!?!?!?! the first time they met... since he thought she was just a naked chick at first. The nipple part of the breast is what completes the breast, without it, its just not as "attractive".

I personally think that if it wasn't necessarily drawn clearly in the manga as well, then its the choice of the artist to not make it explicit as its not something he/she wants the viewers to focus on (obviously) so, its not necessarily something "magical" its more of a concious choice of the artist as to not make it explicit.
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Old 2008-03-23, 08:06   Link #132
Tri-ring
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seaghyn16 View Post
Any one have any ideas on what will happen to Horo if for some reason she loses the fight, or get's seriously injured, and is unable to return to Lawrence? maybe all those "hundreds" of wolves would all storm at her if she wins or something?
The most gruesome possibility is that the young wolf god wouldl munch on her brains to obtain her wisdom as was hinted by earlier posts.
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Old 2008-03-23, 08:10   Link #133
seaghyn16
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can a wolf gain the knowledge of another wolf by eating the brains though? I remember Horo saying specifically human brains to gain wisdom and stuff....

At the end of the scene with Horo, she was surrounded by many many wolves. What do you think they're stance on this is? Is it like "hmmm, this is an interesting one" or something like "haha our boss is gonna beat you" or "the winner of this fight will be our new boss" or "if you win for some reason, we'll eat you!"

It seems to me they're a bit too close and personal =)
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Old 2008-03-23, 08:19   Link #134
Tri-ring
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Originally Posted by seaghyn16 View Post
can a wolf gain the knowledge of another wolf by eating the brains though? I remember Horo saying specifically human brains to gain wisdom and stuff....

At the end of the scene with Horo, she was surrounded by many many wolves. What do you think they're stance on this is? Is it like "hmmm, this is an interesting one" or something like "haha our boss is gonna beat you" or "the winner of this fight will be our new boss" or "if you win for some reason, we'll eat you!"

It seems to me they're a bit too close and personal =)
Well a wolf pack is usually a close knit family group so they are probably rooting for their boss to win but since it is a challenge for the position for alpha male I guess they are just there to watch the outcome.

The wild kingdom is much more simple.
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Old 2008-03-23, 09:36   Link #135
seaghyn16
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@Tri-ring The wild kingdom is much more simple.

aint that the truth....

"in the jungle the mighty jungle, the wolf does sleep tonight...."
"hush my darling, don't fear my darling, the *big bad wolf* sleeps tonight!"
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Old 2008-03-23, 11:15   Link #136
Vexx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikesince83 View Post
That sounds about right considering the reaction from Horo.



There is a form of censorship, in that nipples are removed/not animated. Possibly that's what you meant by "art style"?
Yes, I call it an art style... take a look at medieval stained glass or wood cut depictions of people and you'll notice minor details are left out. Basically though, the art style is following that of the author's illustrations. It doesn't appear to be his purpose to arouse so much as make it natural to the reader and remind of her natural comfort in being unclothed.

I don't know about the gritty anatomical issues of teats and such but the illustrations basically portray a human girl who happens to have a tail and wolf ears -- I'd assume that a photograph might show nipples where human girls have nipples. It just isn't pertinent to the story.
They don't show teenagers having acne either

If this discussion belongs anywhere, it belongs in ep 1 or 2's thread.

(My recollection is that explicit nipples earns an automatic "R-15" (which Shuffle! earned for a couple of episodes) -- it simply dictates that the episode be restricted within certain time periods and most would like to avoid that for maximum flexibility.)

Last edited by Vexx; 2008-03-23 at 12:50.
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Old 2008-03-23, 11:24   Link #137
HayashiTakara
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They can always add nipples for fan-service, lol, sorry I have a nipple obsession as any healthy man would XP
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Old 2008-03-23, 13:02   Link #138
Kaguya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seaghyn16 View Post
At the end of the scene with Horo, she was surrounded by many many wolves. What do you think they're stance on this is? Is it like "hmmm, this is an interesting one" or something like "haha our boss is gonna beat you" or "the winner of this fight will be our new boss" or "if you win for some reason, we'll eat you!"

It seems to me they're a bit too close and personal =)
Well... I cannot endure and have read volume2.
Spoiler for Ep13:
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Old 2008-03-23, 13:04   Link #139
Masanori Ota
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Yeah, what if Horo and the big guy DON'T fight? Everyone's assuming they do, it seems. :l
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Old 2008-03-23, 13:49   Link #140
LKK
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Masanori Ota View Post
Yeah, what if Horo and the big guy DON'T fight? Everyone's assuming they do, it seems. :l
Not fighting is the more realistic way for animals to settle territorial disputes. Animal equivalents of knock-down drag-out fights aren't the norm in the animal kingdom. Usually there are displays of strength, some intimidation, and then one contestant concedes defeat and skulks off out of the territory. If the author wants us to remember that Horo is a wolf and not a human, that may be how this crisis is resolved.

Here's another thought. While our sympathies lie with Horo, she is in fact the territorial invader. Older and wiser, she may be, but the territory belongs to the other wolf. She may try to avoid a skirmish altogether because in the animal kingdom's way of looking at things, she's in the wrong for entering another wolf's territory. Maybe she'll try some lupine diplomacy saying "I'm just passing through. So let's keep it peaceful, shall we?"
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Last edited by LKK; 2008-03-23 at 14:10.
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