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View Poll Results: True Tears - Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 46 35.11%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 41 31.30%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 16 12.21%
7 out of 10 : Good 12 9.16%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 1.53%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.76%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 2.29%
3 out of 10 : Bad 2 1.53%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 0.76%
1 out of 10 : Painful 7 5.34%
Voters: 131. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2008-03-24, 23:12   Link #181
be0wulf
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^That screencap by itself was just...hilarious, given Shin's facial expression and the words below it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vio5555 View Post
@be0wulf
We're going to disagree about Jun's feelings for Noe and the possibility of him having feelings for Hiromi, simply because the scenes with Jun and Hiromi can be read either as him just honoring the contract or him actually maybe thinking of her more than that.

I do think you're wrong though particularly because of how cold he was before Hiromi delivered her speech in episode 11. He put his hand on his cheek and mentioned the contract; right there was where I pretty much realized he had never really felt anything more for Hiromi than maybe some kind of companionship in the abstract sense of her having the same struggle (towards Shin) as he does towards Noe. Either way, him going for Noe's lips was perfectly natural at this point in the story considering how his character has been developed with an obsession towards Noe's happiness...
I suppose viewpoints will differ on Jun's true feelings, and unless the next episode clears things up, it'll remain so.

As for the kiss; Jun's been a calculating individual throughout the series. To think that he'd make a move for his sister right after her little overnight drama in the chickencoop when she's at her most emotionally fragile state, to me, didn't make sense at all. After all, he wants her to be happy, right? Why would he pull something like that when she obviously needs brotherly comfort, and not of the sexual sort?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vio5555 View Post
On the second point, I suppose I agree with you in that Shin'll have been inconsistent in some sense if he goes for Noe, since he's totally ditching the resolve he built in ep 9-10 to do something for Hiromi, but at worst he'll have waited far too long to do things properly if he ends up with Hiromi, so I think the writers do have an out in that sense. It's easily let off as Shin waffling for a little bit early on when he confesses to Noe as part of the contract but getting his resolve by episode 10 and not really acting on it while trying to get Noe's tears in the final 2-3 episodes. Either way, I think a Hiromi ending is consistent to his feelings for Hiromi throughout other than his confession to Noe when he actually seemed interested in Noe at that point. The final two episodes in that explanation would feature him making sure that Noe isn't totally destroyed by him flying away from her...

Honestly though, I don't really care what the pairing is as long as the last episode delivers a satisfactory end for where this has all gone.
Who knows? Maybe Shin will end up with his mother. Just to complete this whole incest theme.
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Old 2008-03-24, 23:20   Link #182
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I don't really care about the ending anymore. The writing was really good in the first half and fell apart in the second. Too many silly cliffhangers and plot twists solely created for lol drama and the huge letdown on the Shin's mom issue. Also unless Aiko does something like talk to Hiromi/Noe about how she got over shin, what's the friggin point of her?

edit: The way it is now, I'm thinking the best end would be Shin leaving and going to art school. Thanking Noe for inspiring him and apologising to Hiromi. Single end.

Last edited by Stretch5920; 2008-03-24 at 23:47.
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Old 2008-03-24, 23:59   Link #183
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OMG OMG OMG!
I don't know who he is going to choose.
It looks like Noe. Omg!
Nice nice nice!
I like the guessing guessing guessing part of this episode.
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Old 2008-03-25, 00:11   Link #184
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Quote:
Originally Posted by be0wulf View Post
As for the kiss; Jun's been a calculating individual throughout the series. To think that he'd make a move for his sister right after her little overnight drama in the chickencoop when she's at her most emotionally fragile state, to me, didn't make sense at all. After all, he wants her to be happy, right? Why would he pull something like that when she obviously needs brotherly comfort, and not of the sexual sort?
I don't really know how much Jun knows about what Noe went through the previous night, so I don't think we really know about how fragile he thinks her emotional state is.

To be honest, I thought about it and the best explanation that I could come up with is that Jun comes to the realization that he's going to finally stop "forcing" Noe to rely on him in some sense.

Everything he's done for Noe (until Hiromi's statement) he's done with her interest in mind. But I think he realizes that he's overprotected her in the sense of making all of the big decisions for her or steering her along certain paths.

For the first time he decides he's just going to show her his feelings and let her decide on her own whether to accept his feelings or reject them.

I also think that provides an explanation for his tears at that moment. He realizes in some sense that a lot of things he's done for her were actually for his own piece of mind as he says "I've done a lot of selfish things", and he finally gets peace from the release of telling her his true feelings and going for the kiss that he always wanted.

So I guess what I'm saying is that he's finally freeing her from his obsession with her happiness; that is, what he thought her happiness should be, and in that process is finally letting Noe decide what her happiness should be.
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Old 2008-03-25, 00:21   Link #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tun View Post
Spoiler for this picture says otherwise. episode 7, 8:25:
Of course No one doubts that . You are kinda manipulating what i said *_*. Its ok, I bet it was eaither meant as a joke or you didnt realize or maybe i wasnt clear enough. Here is what i said, Full sentence ( rather than partly),:

" He never said , he loves Hiromi or anything. He just said i will do everything properly"

So i am obviously not saying , he didnt have feelings for her. Yes i am not denying that. He had feelings for her. It was mentioned many times during the series. I was talking about when she hugged her, when she kissed her and through out the series. Let me be more clear. He never in the whole series, Not even once, said to Hiromi that he liked her. There was more to my post, You gotta go 2 to 3 page back and read the whole thing .

My apologies if i wasnt clear enough, But i think Deathkillz post does show what we are talking about. Any ways if you want to know my thoughts, here are the rest of them below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deathkillz View Post

Sorry...but doing it proper for me means that he will not fck up again. And guess what? He fcked up.

He knows full well that Hiromi love him. And himself in a sense knows that he loves her. If that wasn't the case then why did he break his back chasing her on that crappy bike on an icy road?

The fact is that he loves her but then suffers from amnesia and now believes that he wants sexy time with Noe

Seriously, what he is doing now isn't proper at all. You said that he never told Hiromi that he loves her...but dammit does their action need to be justified with words already? Now why did Shin accept the kiss from Hiromi? Why didn't he question her motive for kissing him...I'm sure he is a good enough boy to say so.

And I say that thinking about it makes me relation him to makoto more and more.

Makoto never decided, oh no. He only screwed them. He never told kotonoha to break up (so by you logic it would be the same with Shin and Hiromi (and yes, I do believe that their feelings for each other are already mutual). Shin said nothing, he just left for Noe).

Funny how Hiromi is also breaking down...

"Don't leave me" ehh

Well every one has a diffrent take on this, but here is mine ,


Quote:
Sorry...but doing it proper for me means that he will not fck up again. And guess what? He fcked up.
Now, now, we shouldnt blame him. I dont think he was the person at fault here. The person that initiate the kissing is Hiromi. Even after she kisses him, he doesnt reply back. Hiromi knows that he loves Noe, She realizes that but still forces him to be with her. She is an exact replica of Shin's mother. She even call herself selfish. Even though she knows , that Shin loves her, she is manipulating every one so that she can be with him. And yes she is doing all of these bcause she wants him and she loves him, but at the same time she is ignoring what shin wants. Again like how shin's mother is. and As for Noe, she runs off by herself before shin is finished talking. They way i saw it, Shin was just trying to get advice from her as what to do. He was confused at that moment.

Quote:
He knows full well that Hiromi love him. And himself in a sense knows that he loves her. If that wasn't the case then why did he break his back chasing her on that crappy bike on an icy road?
He Knew she loved her before , she goes to his house. While in the house based on Hiromi's cold attitude, he doesnt know if he does or not ( he is confused) and at the very end he realizes that she does love him when she kisses him. And He himself Knows that He Loved her. Right now he doesnt know if he loves her or not. That is why he was taking his time ( almost whole night) thinking. And at the end of the dance festival he realizes that he loves Noe. Even Thought he doesnt see her in the festival cheering for him, he still misses her. He used to love Hiromi ( or what he thought was love), but now Noe comes along. He is confused as Who he really loves and he realizes that the only person who he really( mainly) cared for , the person who he happily worte the book for , the person who tried so hard to dance for was none other than NOE. He didnt want to to dance because he didnt want to be compared to his dad but he practiced hard and enthusiaticly so he could show it to Noe. He was affraid of writing the book, But did it so Noe could read. Almost every thing he did was just for Noe and his inspiration was Noe. Even the book he wrote about Hiromi failed him ( as it was rejected. Another symbolic thing that shows Hiromi v shin fails ). The whole series has been around Noe and Him and Hiromi getting in the way.


and as for the bike thing, well thats obvious thing to do. even at first episode it was stated that he had the feeling that she is depending on him. she lost her parents and shinchi, her childhood friend didnt her one bit
she was suffering and shin didnt comfort her. at the very end he realizes that and he rushes to her side. i saw it more as apologizing to her than chasing because he loved her. So he was kind of saying " i am sorry that i didnt notice".


Quote:
The fact is that he loves her but then suffers from amnesia and now believes that he wants sexy time with Noe
Oh pleaaaaaaaase . its not like its one of those animes that the main hero hits his head on an stone and gets thronw into another dimension and comes back to see he has lost all of his memories. How can you suffer from an amnesia about loving some one? Its an interesting theory but , its kinda ...... . Any ways, not a statement i would ever imagine that you would come up with .

Quote:
Seriously, what he is doing now isn't proper at all. You said that he never told Hiromi that he loves her...but dammit does their action need to be justified with words already? Now why did Shin accept the kiss from Hiromi? Why didn't he question her motive for kissing him...I'm sure he is a good enough boy to say so.
Well what actions *_*? So far She has invited him to go outside and then she was the one that kissed him. Every thing has been her doing. Well as why he didnt reject it, was because she did that out of the blue. How could he have. And Also , he is confused as who he loves. He has had feelings for Hiromi, and thus that adds to the confusion. She initiate the kiss, And he didnt stop it ( again because he still has mixed feelings). He just stood there and was suprised to a point. And when she tried to kiss her, he had plenty of time to move forward and join her. But he didnt move forward. It shows that he is still confused. When you see some one that you love is moving for a kiss, you would ususally do the same but SHIN DIDNT. And I think the better question would be why didnt he say he loved her too. And why didnt he move forward for the kiss. And Why would he question Her motive . He knows that she loves her, But he doesnt know if he has the same feelings for her.

Any ways, This is the type of anime that opinions will vary. So as long as we all say what we think, then maybe some other people will start thinking the same way. Many times i have thought of an event in anime in one way, but then i read other people's posts ( Including yours *_*, Which i usually like very much) and then changed my mind. But yeah, unless you can convince me with more evidence to back your post , i am sticking with my idea.


P.S. Deathkillz, Your avatar looks as awesome as ever. Mind if i ask what anime it is from ?
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Old 2008-03-25, 00:23   Link #186
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I saw sooo expecting Noe to pull a Sekai. especially when she was sitting there with her hands over her ears.

anyways, if it ends up shin x noe, i will be soooooo upset. coupled with the inevitable sadness/awesomeness of next week's 00, aria ending, and some unforeseen circumstance, i think i might go into depression or throw fits of rage.

now its basically two mythical forces competing with each other. Hiromi's "don't leave me alone" plus the power of their history at the festival together, vs Noe's i'll make you fly/i'll fly. which one will win, tune in next week.

i know for a fact that if noe wins, thousands of fans will be pissed. you can't go your whole life loving someone, then you finally get the chance to be with them, then throw it away for some girl because she said something quirky to you on an occasion in school. it doesn't happen that way. you don't simply throw away a lifetime of love.

you know the "don't leave me alone" at the festival will factor in somehow next ep. i'm looking forward to hiromi winning next ep. if not, the great harem series known as TT would have taken one of the worst u-turns i've ever seen in an anime.
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Old 2008-03-25, 00:25   Link #187
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Well, I will refrain from commenting this episode because it all depends on what happens next episode. This episode sets up for an upset, but that's no longer the issue for me. From episode 6 or so we have all been looking forward for how True Tears will present the last episode, because right now to me it doesn't really matter who wins, as long as they end it well.

Last edited by KholdStare; 2008-03-25 at 00:55.
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Old 2008-03-25, 01:47   Link #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vio5555 View Post
I don't really know how much Jun knows about what Noe went through the previous night, so I don't think we really know about how fragile he thinks her emotional state is.

To be honest, I thought about it and the best explanation that I could come up with is that Jun comes to the realization that he's going to finally stop "forcing" Noe to rely on him in some sense.

Everything he's done for Noe (until Hiromi's statement) he's done with her interest in mind. But I think he realizes that he's overprotected her in the sense of making all of the big decisions for her or steering her along certain paths.

For the first time he decides he's just going to show her his feelings and let her decide on her own whether to accept his feelings or reject them.

I also think that provides an explanation for his tears at that moment. He realizes in some sense that a lot of things he's done for her were actually for his own piece of mind as he says "I've done a lot of selfish things", and he finally gets peace from the release of telling her his true feelings and going for the kiss that he always wanted.

So I guess what I'm saying is that he's finally freeing her from his obsession with her happiness; that is, what he thought her happiness should be, and in that process is finally letting Noe decide what her happiness should be.
Considering he was frantic enough to call Hiromi...besides, he knows that she was away all night. Note that he didn't even ask her what was wrong or anything.
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Old 2008-03-25, 04:11   Link #189
vio5555
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Originally Posted by be0wulf View Post
Considering he was frantic enough to call Hiromi...besides, he knows that she was away all night. Note that he didn't even ask her what was wrong or anything.
Well, that kind of thing we just assume was taken care of when Noe returned home. It is well into the next day when the Jun/Noe incident occurs. Jun probably just assumes she can handle it at that time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by b0nyb0y View Post
I think the main thing that keeps this series from being 100% realistic is how little characters talk about what they intended to do or how they really feel until the final moment of their corresponding plot arcs. Oftentimes what's said only gave a slight hint (and rather ambiguous at that) of what action the character will take next. Yes, from screenwriting point of view, it makes sense to build suspense and save the revelation for later episodes, but damn, it's so irritating. To me, if the characters have been a little more communicative, and sending less mixed signal in their behaviors, then it wouldn't really stir up so much irritations in audiences as can be seen now in this thread. For example, by the end of this episode, if Shin just want to break up with Noe and go for Hiromi, realistically he should have reassured her before running off to Noe. Likewise, if he chooses to be with Noe, he can make Hiromi knows of his intention by saying just a couple of short sentences before taking off. Doing either of those would take only a few seconds, so he wouldn't really waste any time if he did so. Yet all he did was a little blushing, stayed quiet and said "I need to go now." Yes, from what we've seen so far, we always know who he really loves, so there's no question about that. But still...
This is the probably the best analysis of the realism aspect of True Tears that I've seen on this forums. The writers have been trying to extend the drama across each episode with the large impact endings but it does seem to be a tradeoff between a more realistic calm view versus a stronger dramatic impact with the writers choosing the latter.

Last edited by vio5555; 2008-03-25 at 12:19.
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Old 2008-03-25, 06:21   Link #190
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whitmoon brings up great and very valid points, im in complete agreement that we are going to see a shin x noe ending, just one other big thing that should be noted as well is the dance

Spoiler for eye:
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Old 2008-03-25, 07:29   Link #191
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the person always on his mind
So when he was thinking about Hiromi for the majority of the series he was actually thinking about Noe!?
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Old 2008-03-25, 07:31   Link #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jadman2004 View Post
whitmoon brings up great and very valid points, im in complete agreement that we are going to see a shin x noe ending, just one other big thing that should be noted as well is the dance

Spoiler for eye:
At first glance yes absolutely it can be taken that way but the writers have proven to be very deceitful with symbolisms in TT. The apple of my eye theory seems a clincher but i didnt get that Noe's reflection in his eye was him choosing her. The scene does serve a purpose, because Shin had some type of realization during the dance. However, if you take the preview for the next episode into account the poem is about Hiromi because it was first said in episode 1. If thats the case the poem and the apple of my eye theory cancel each other. What i got from the reflection was he saw something in Noe that he didnt see before. My guess he saw that she can actually fly and rushed after her to show her the book and whatever realization he had about her flying and probably to clear up his romantic feelings. What you say about the reflection in the eye could be true i just didnt get that feeling.
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Old 2008-03-25, 07:53   Link #193
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This scene made me laugh.
Spoiler:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitemoon648 View Post
Now, now, we shouldnt blame him. I dont think he was the person at fault here. The person that initiate the kissing is Hiromi. Even after she kisses him, he doesnt reply back. Hiromi knows that he loves Noe, She realizes that but still forces him to be with her. She is an exact replica of Shin's mother. She even call herself selfish. Even though she knows , that Shin loves her, she is manipulating every one so that she can be with him. And yes she is doing all of these bcause she wants him and she loves him, but at the same time she is ignoring what shin wants. Again like how shin's mother is. and As for Noe, she runs off by herself before shin is finished talking. They way i saw it, Shin was just trying to get advice from her as what to do. He was confused at that moment.
That was actually very nicely put. I agree that Hiromi is being manipulative of everyone but that is for the sake of love. Though I still believe that Shin was by his own will chasing after her because he loves her. But for some reason, his perspective has shifted to Noe. This is the think that ticks me off is that there wasn't any sense in why he would remember that he needs to "sort things out" with Noe when up til now he has pretty much left her. (Okey...a counter for this would be because he was preoccupied with Hiromi at the time, still I'm annoyed that he isn't telling Hiromi that he needs to tell Noe whatever he needs to say.

Quote:
He Knew she loved her before , she goes to his house. While in the house based on Hiromi's cold attitude, he doesnt know if he does or not ( he is confused) and at the very end he realizes that she does love him when she kisses him. And He himself Knows that He Loved her. Right now he doesnt know if he loves her or not. That is why he was taking his time ( almost whole night) thinking. And at the end of the dance festival he realizes that he loves Noe. Even Thought he doesnt see her in the festival cheering for him, he still misses her. He used to love Hiromi ( or what he thought was love), but now Noe comes along. He is confused as Who he really loves and he realizes that the only person who he really( mainly) cared for , the person who he happily worte the book for , the person who tried so hard to dance for was none other than NOE. He didnt want to to dance because he didnt want to be compared to his dad but he practiced hard and enthusiaticly so he could show it to Noe. He was affraid of writing the book, But did it so Noe could read. Almost every thing he did was just for Noe and his inspiration was Noe. Even the book he wrote about Hiromi failed him ( as it was rejected. Another symbolic thing that shows Hiromi v shin fails ). The whole series has been around Noe and Him and Hiromi getting in the way.
I think I am begining to understand your point. Righty so if Shin DID love Hiromi that he would have been chasing after her (but really, I know that he knew that she loves him even before the kiss but w/e ). Still though, even if he has switched (dam you amnesia) overnight, the way he is handling things is the biggest bug on my shoulder. If he knows that Hiromi loves him but he doesn't love her, he should stop letting the "relationship" hang in mid air. If he is so sure that he loves Noe then why doesn't he tell Hiromi.

Anything would do, just a simple "sorry Hiromi, I love Noe". Abit he will get slapped but that is the price for being an idiot

Yet here we have now is Hiromi breakingdown. Dam you one track minded male leads >.>
Quote:
and as for the bike thing, well thats obvious thing to do. even at first episode it was stated that he had the feeling that she is depending on him. she lost her parents and shinchi, her childhood friend didnt her one bit
she was suffering and shin didnt comfort her. at the very end he realizes that and he rushes to her side. i saw it more as apologizing to her than chasing because he loved her. So he was kind of saying " i am sorry that i didnt notice".
Here comes the pity. Hiromi need no pity

I just took it as being that he loves her and he needed to chase her. The thing with thinking that it was because he wanted to apologise is rather...dumb to me. What is there to apologise now? Shin's indecisiveness drove her out of the house in the first place. But then apologising for being an ass works. Shame though as the viewers and Hiromi got the wrong vibes from it (though I still stand by saying that the bugger loves Hiromi ).
Quote:
Oh pleaaaaaaaase . its not like its one of those animes that the main hero hits his head on an stone and gets thronw into another dimension and comes back to see he has lost all of his memories. How can you suffer from an amnesia about loving some one? Its an interesting theory but , its kinda ...... . Any ways, not a statement i would ever imagine that you would come up with .
That is how I still feel about him. Sudden mind change is not my thing as I see no lead up...what a minute. Maybe I am too dumb to get the subtle lead ups (being subtle and all)

whatever
Quote:
Well what actions *_*? So far She has invited him to go outside and then she was the one that kissed him. Every thing has been her doing. Well as why he didnt reject it, was because she did that out of the blue. How could he have. And Also , he is confused as who he loves. He has had feelings for Hiromi, and thus that adds to the confusion. She initiate the kiss, And he didnt stop it ( again because he still has mixed feelings). He just stood there and was suprised to a point. And when she tried to kiss her, he had plenty of time to move forward and join her. But he didnt move forward. It shows that he is still confused. When you see some one that you love is moving for a kiss, you would ususally do the same but SHIN DIDNT. And I think the better question would be why didnt he say he loved her too. And why didnt he move forward for the kiss. And Why would he question Her motive . He knows that she loves her, But he doesnt know if he has the same feelings for her.
Great logic

Indeed he didn't move forward. That is already a sign that he has switched. Nothing to dispute here.
Quote:
Any ways, This is the type of anime that opinions will vary. So as long as we all say what we think, then maybe some other people will start thinking the same way. Many times i have thought of an event in anime in one way, but then i read other people's posts ( Including yours *_*, Which i usually like very much) and then changed my mind. But yeah, unless you can convince me with more evidence to back your post , i am sticking with my idea.
Well you do make a lot of valid points. Perhaps my thoughts hinge on quite a lot of "what ifs" and "he should have done that instead" as currently his actions just make little sense to me. He is a shallow inconsiderate person full of empty words and is very much as selfish as Hiromi (if not more seen as it is him who is hurting their feelings). I'm not trying to convince you but just stating my thoughts. But you did a pretty good job at making me rethink on how Shin and Hiromi is acting. Still the conclusion that Shin is an ass still stays
Quote:
P.S. Deathkillz, Your avatar looks as awesome as ever. Mind if i ask what anime it is from ?
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Old 2008-03-25, 10:22   Link #194
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I disagree with the ShinxNoe ending. I think what will happen is that Shin will show Noe the completed picture book and say something like a "thank you". He will then go back to Hiromi and say something like, "I've done everything properly".

Reasons I think this will be the ending is that:
1) Noe strives to get her tears back. Heartbreak is pretty effective in inducing tears.
2) Hiromi strives to get Shin.
EDIT:
3) I really don't think Shin actually loves/likes Noe. The only reason he had any interest in her was because of Noe's interest in him.

I'm probably wrong since I don't know wtf is the whole "flying thing" and the "chickens". Although I knew that was going to happen to Noe after seeing that ending in the picture book.
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Old 2008-03-25, 10:36   Link #195
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First off, I still vote a 10/10 even though my favourite girl is now losing - or she has already lost.

Strong episode indeed, and it somehow counters things that happened on episode 10. Now it's Noe who has the bigger chance, I think the ending will be 70% Noe, 20% Hiromi and 10% no one.

Damn you Shinichiro, you chase after Hiromi on episode 10 but now you want Noe!! >.<
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Old 2008-03-25, 10:46   Link #196
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Watched Episode 12.

My reaction to this episode can be more or less summed up in these lines:

Hiromi: WTF, girl? Squeaky-bum time for you?

Shin: WTF is wrong with you, boy?! Can you do something properly for once?!

Noe: WTF. Just, plain, WTF.

You know, True Tears was once so good that I couldn't help but proclaim that the character development had exceeded CLANNAD's level. But much of the great deal of goodwill I had towards this series just went 'poof' at Episode 9, and I've been losing more and more of it ever since. This episode isn't yet the last straw, but it's pretty close.

At this rate, I'm not sure I care anymore whether it's Noe or Hiromi. 7/10.

Blog article coming soon.
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Old 2008-03-25, 11:30   Link #197
BigGimp77
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Join Date: Feb 2008
I'm at the point to where I'm really ready for the series to end. Ever since the middle way in the series, I havent really enjoyed it as much.

I think it really has to do with the fact I don't like Shin. It's okay to pick a girl and to flip flop once. But flip flopping twice in an anime really makes you look like a jerk. How can you spend the first half of the series always thinking about how you loved Hiromi (While you were with Noe). Then you get Hiromi and now all you think about is Noe.

How can you root for a guy that does nothing but treat the girls like crap and makes them cry all the time lol. Not to mention the fact that the huge flaws in the final two girls remaining. Noe is completely insane, And Hiromi is just over possessive.

Seriously I'm not rooting for ne one any more. I just hope everyone ends up single.
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Old 2008-03-25, 11:35   Link #198
Darklightz
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Join Date: Jun 2006
I also pretty much want this to end. The Shin and Hiromi relationship is just insane

Shin : I love Hiromi

Hiromi : I think I'm Shin's brother so I'll date Jun to try to forget my feelings

Shin : I'm an idiot so I'll date Noe to try to forget my feelings

Hiromi : I can't take this anymore! I love you Shin!

Shin : I love you too!

Hiromi : Really?

Shin : No, I'm going back to Noe now. kthxbai
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Old 2008-03-25, 12:08   Link #199
Liddo-kun
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Location: Nanairogaoka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darklightz View Post
I also pretty much want this to end. The Shin and Hiromi relationship is just insane

Shin : I love Hiromi

Hiromi : I think I'm Shin's brother so I'll date Jun to try to forget my feelings

Shin : I'm an idiot so I'll date Noe to try to forget my feelings

Hiromi : I can't take this anymore! I love you Shin!

Shin : I love you too!

Hiromi : Really?

Shin : No, I'm going back to Noe now. kthxbai
Good post, that pretty much summarizes the evets that happened so far. You get a cookie.
The only thing Shinichiro got right in this episode was the dance...
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Old 2008-03-25, 12:08   Link #200
jaisrh
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Did anyone else notice that at 4:30 of this episode, Shin said to himself "What was she saying? I was the one who superimposed Jibeta with myself. I was the one who did'nt realize Jibeta's strength".

Shin basically admitted that he represented himself as Jibeta at some point. I know there was a debate in episode 11 about who Jibeta was supposed to represent but here Shin is telling us that he "superimposed Jibeta" with himself. The writers might have given an element of foreshadowing by having Noe fall off the tree to parallel Jibeta's fall in episode 11, but at the time Shin was thinking of himself as Jibeta and not Noe because he "superimposed Jibeta" with himself.

With that being said, while I think the interpretations for Raigomaru and Jibeta in episodes 9-11 were valid for those episodes, episode 12 brought another shift in his thinking as he watched and listened to Noe at the beginning of the episode. Since she jumped off the tree at the end of the episode and the preview has Noe saying "Shinichiro said that I can fly", Shin likely has given up on the association of Jibeta and himself, and instead probably associates Jibeta with Noe now.

So now Shin is stuck with Raigomaru as representing him wanting to fly. Without using Jibeta as a separate representation of his feelings, I think it has evolved to the point where Raigomaru can represent him flying to either Hiromi or Noe because he has reconciled his separate feelings in Raigomaru and Jibeta into just Raigomaru.

Look at his self-dialogue as he danced. "Before he had even realized it, Raigomaru had been lured by the red seeds...and was standing on top of the hill. I want to fly! Was it because he ate those red seeds(Noe)?. Or was it because of the white snow (Hiromi)? He did'nt know." And it continues for a bit afterwards.

Anyway, I think that Shin realized and appreciated that Noe was the one who guided him into wanting to fly which is separate from actually wanting to fly for Noe. In the self-dialogue he was'nt really thinking in terms of who he wanted to fly for (symbolism: red seeds for Noe, white snow for Hiromi) because he said Raigomaru "did'nt know" the reason. He just wanted to show her his appreciation for helping him to fly, which is the realization that I think he came to, and that's why he was looking for Noe so he could tell her about the ending he had come up with and see what she thought of it.

I think that's the resolution that Shin has come with in regards to his relationship with Noe. She's the 'angel' who guided him into flying but Hiromi is the one he has loved for years. With the writers showing Noe saying "The one in Shinichiro's heart...is Yuasa Hiromi" both at the end of episode 11 and yet again at the beginning of episode 12, that should only reinforce that path. If Shin does'nt do things properly with Noe by himself, she could be the one to help him do it because she realizes that Hiromi is the one in Shin's heart. It took her this long to realize the feelings that Shin and Hiromi have for each other, and also she has to now take into consideration her brother's feelings for her.

Anyway, I'm interpreting things as still being consistent with the overall story. Shin was feeling guilty in episode 11 because he was 'officially' still dating Noe even though he was spending time with the girl he has liked for years. He still had a smile on his face when he came home after receiving Hiromi's kiss. He definitely was affected and had some self-doubt when he saw Jun at Hiromi's basketball game and later at the park. That shows that his feelings for Hiromi are still there, they did'nt 'shift' as some people said. It's just that when Noe did'nt come home, Shin started feeling worried on top of the guilt. He was concerned that he was hurting Noe even though she had inspired him into wanting to fly for Hiromi (ep 10 chase scene). Episode 12 to me is where he thinks and comes up with his answer. I was expecting Shin to resolve things at the beginning of the episode 12 because he had brought his picture book with him when looking for Noe. Unfortunately he was too confused to talk to her but now he seemed ready at the end of episode 12.

While the lie told by Shin's mother set up all the major misunderstandings in this show I think they revealed it as a lie so that not only can Mrs. Nakagami redeem herself but also so that the mistakes that were a result of it can be corrected. Otherwise you could end up with Shin and Hiromi holding bitterness towards Shin's mother for preventing something that should /would have happened if it was'nt for her meddling. Even Mrs. Nakagami would feel bad about herself. It depends on whether they decide on a more idealistic or more messy ending.
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