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Old 2008-04-15, 17:45   Link #23601
LimitedEternal
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Sky of stone, floor of flame.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhoenixFlare View Post
:3

Well, this will come as a little surprise, but this chapter is supposedly combined together with Chapter 8. A little review separated them, though, because I think dropping another Bluecheese Nuke rivaling Chapter 6 (which was capped at 26K words, combined Chapter 7-8 probably slightly more than that) is going to make a lot of people go bonkers and start screaming for my skin .

Nothing big here, really, just a lot of information dump. And I think I got some of the characters OOC (Out-of-Character) and some things OOC (Out-of-Canon) .

Anyway ...

*drops nuke and runs*

Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha GuardianS

Chapter Seven—A Tale from the Past

*long story is long*
And PF delivers his massively long BLUECHEESE!

That is a mighty impressive piece o' work, though. Nicely written. My head's still wobbling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
-You never mentioned Rein's Full Size abillity
You mean Rein Zwei, right? Can she even do that?
Quote:
The article mentions Thrawn. That makes it inherently awesome.
When you can combine magnificent bastard and master strategist, you know someone's badass.
Quote:
... You just reminded me why I need to write the Tesla/Keroko fights. There are none. Nanoha and Teana are the only range oriented fighters we see, and they often get paired of with/against melee fighters. The closest we get is the dogfight with the type-2 aerial gadgets in episode 5. I really wish we could have seen a bit more of that.

However, that does not mean it is impossible to write one. The X-Wing novels were focussed around dogfighting, and were a great joy to read. Applying that style of writing -replacing a lot of the technollogy with magic- should be possible.
Now that you mention it, there isn't much real dogfighting in the series, is there?
Quote:
Thank you.
You and your trap tomfoolery.
Quote:
True, you could. Question is, can you live with the consequences? Will you live?
Somehow, I think getting Tesla drunk the honest way might be a better option...not that I'm eager to try.
Quote:
Ah, so you want to take the step towards canon inegration then? Let me warn you then that the integration route is one filled with many traps and pitfalls. Too often will you get the urge to let your characters take the lead, to solve the problem that the Main Character is struggling with. However, you can't. Nanoha is the Main Character, not yours. If canon dictates that Nanoha is the one to finish things, then Nanoha is the one to finish things. Our characters can only aid.
Also, remember that the Aces are supposed to be amazingly ahead of their age and level. Yes, they're overpowered and get more screen time than everyone else put together, but it does make them excellent pinnacles to compare by. The general red line here is about their level; we get suspicious when someone's equal to or above their level.

If you're dead set on canon integration though, Keroko-kun here's as good as anyone to get advice from.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Also when the hell did I apparently become Mid/Ranged magics Champion?!
Well, by your own admission, you're a fan of long-range combat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
If you've only got 12, go with the Falcon. Why?

Less maintainnance costs.

Smaller ship = lower maintainnace = more cash to play around with = less time stuck in rest/refit cycle.
Besides, you can use all that money for black market modification. :3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirificus View Post
The TSAB has a damning tendency to fighting fair.
They're gonna be in trouble when the "fuck fair play" alien race comes along...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuyu no Sora View Post
Okay, so things have infinitely improved :3

At least now I have 7 more pages of backlog to try and catch up to when I get home

I've been having some trouble handling exams, work and other stuff lately so I expect to be back (again) to full duty by the end of the week ^^; For now I'll try to keep up with things here but mostly in lurker status

Though I simply skimmed the surface of it, I've seen some interesting charas. The one that mostly caught my eye would be Keroko-kun's Rebuilt of Uomo. I haven't had time to read the third yet though (Sorry Keroko-kun ). Nice new pic for him though

I'm in school and about to receive a lecture from my teacher for slacking off so I'll see you guys later

*Runs before receiving lecture*
Just keep slogging through it. It's the end of my semester here, so I'm busier than normal too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghazghkull View Post
And this is where I shall get off the train.

This is definitely not worth the headache you're giving me, especially since I've got final exams around the corner.
Should done what I did and just taken the high road outright.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Where is original when all I seem to see is some kind of obsession over porting characters from other franchises?

I mean, even my first character was made on the blue with no existing base; another of my characters, the pirate Morgan may have been inspired by Cobra but he is nothing like him.

USB500's Alita may have been based on Patchouli, but she is nowhere a carbon copy of the original. And the list goes on.
See Coma, the point here is to come up with your own ideas. Inspiration's the most powerful tool you can get, and if you get ideas from another series, that's not a bad thing. But direct ports don't cut it - you gotta put your own spin on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saint X View Post


*warps in*

Saint X could only chuckle as the conversation is going on

Saint X holds up a sign saying "Go to IRC NAO"

Nao Bows


O_O

krisslanza, get your child to act properly please...

*warps out*
O_o Eeeeh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kagerou View Post
That doesn't explain your Vita fetish.

*RUNS FASTER*
Oh, well played.

*joins Kagerou in running*

Quote:
Originally Posted by stormturmoil View Post
Strange...I've never listened, and I've never compromised either...and yet the haxbusters have always left me alone...

wait...that's because I'm not on enough, because my character is kept out in the dark not treading on toes, and because most of it gets retconned by myself even before it hits the board. But even more to the point, it's because I don't really care. Even so, I'll say this:

If any so-called 'haxxbuster' tried to BULLY me like you do in this post, I'd IGNORE them. If they kept trying, I'd keep ignoring them.

Remember, the power of Haxbusting only works if the person you're trying to help actually wants to listen. If not, all they have to do is ignore you, and then what will you do?

Answer: you won't do anything because you CAN'T. If they don't choose to listen, you CAN'T make them. worse, they might choose to leave, and that'd be the OC's loss, not theirs. Moreover, if people are being scared away, the mods might close the thread entirely, ending the whole Hax vs non-hax argument for good.

so tone down the attitude, Goose.

In my defence, I say this about the perils of HAXX, for the benefit of Comartemis and any other newcomers:

If you feel the need to write some HAXX plot or other, DO SO. Post it. Let everyone see it. AND THEREFORE GET IT OUT OF YOUR SYSTEM.

then go back and ask yourself: would I really like my character to have to deal with THIS?

and then alter it to how you feel you need to for you to feel happy putting another character up against it.

most of all, DON'T compromise UNLESS and UNTIL you're happy with the compromise...if you feel you need to fight for a concept that others don't like the sound of at first, by all means fight for it. Don't let yourself be bullied into watering down a feature you like just because some others don't think it fits. MAKE it fit. don't drop it just because it's easier than arguing over it...argue, and hash out a middle ground.

but don't abandon something just because the haxbusters don't like the sound of it.
And a voice of reason comes along...'bout time.

Alright, since you've taken the initiative here, I'm gonna try peacemaker again:

Goose, calm down. Coma, work with us here. The lot of us are supposed to be on the same side; last I looked the point of this whole thread is to toss ideas around and make then work. We're not a grandiose debating society, and something tells me this argument has gone way past the point of being useful.

Both of you, calm down and shape up. I got nothing personal against either of you, or anyone here, for that matter. My primary interest here is that we're around tomorrow so that we can keep working ideas out, and having an ego faceoff ain't the way to do it.

So, here's what I suggest: If you can't both agree on something, why don't you put up an idea, then if the other one of you thinks it's OPd, the other one of you says how you think it can be fixed. But if you keep this up, the mods might decide to step in here; and to be perfectly blunt I'm not gonna be happy if we get shut down.

So, can you guys at least agree to disagree?

Oh by the way, page get. :3
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Old 2008-04-15, 17:58   Link #23602
Evangelion Xgouki
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Originally Posted by Kagerou View Post
It will, in time. It involves me to do lots of nearly impossible things, but I'll do it, and when you see it, bricks will be shat.
Trying to figure out if that's a good thing or a bad thing...

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Originally Posted by Kagerou View Post
That doesn't explain your Vita fetish.

*RUNS FASTER*


Better run faster

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kagerou View Post
All in good time my dear Eva.
And also, yes, both Shamsel and Ryo got a few promotions. In Alphaverse, NERV has also expanded slightly.
Interesting...and then there's my new OC who's also in NERV if you wish to use her

*Rider Kicks all the pervs*

Quote:
Originally Posted by LimitedEternal View Post
And PF delivers his massively long BLUECHEESE!

That is a mighty impressive piece o' work, though. Nicely written. My head's still wobbling
Mmm...bluechessium :3

Quote:
Originally Posted by LimitedEternal View Post
You mean Rein Zwei, right? Can she even do that?
It was in one of the StrikerS Soundstages when RF6 heads to Earth. Her Full Form is about as tall as Caro if I remember.

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Originally Posted by LimitedEternal View Post
You and your trap tomfoolery.
And what's one of the things we love about Keroko
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Old 2008-04-15, 17:58   Link #23603
Keroko
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*short post before bed*

Joining in with Limited and Storm, we all should work on ideas how to make the world tick instead of just saying 'this is wrong, redo it.' If you point out something that you think is unbalanced, then point out a way to improve it. 'do it yourself' automatically makes you far les viable as a H4XXbuster.
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Old 2008-04-15, 18:56   Link #23604
Kha
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Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Yeah, anime fans aren't so hot with these acronyms.
We cook up our own acronyms, so RL acronyms leave us puzzled, or guessing off the mark. I missed the Pecular in SOPMOD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
OH HELL NO!!!

TSAB SOCOM is one of Franz's pet projects, the other being the TSAB Marine Corps. Besides, there's already a SOCOM equivalent: TK's OC Jack O'Neil runs Special Operations & Private Contractor Command. Post-Alpha, SOPCC will be split into PCC and TSAB SOCOM.

LEAVE SOCOM ALONE!
*yawns away tinnitus from yell*

Hey I was just asking nicely.

Okay, so Steel Talons and SOPCC for the TSAB. Fitting, since I AM bringing in Jack O'Neil for Rebuilt.

Just too bad that O'Niel's Mammoth won't have railguns... >.>

Wait he has MARV.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:06   Link #23605
arkhangelsk
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Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
We must be watching two different versions then, because as far as I recall, the Droid Control ship got downed by a fighter, both Death Stars were downed by fighters (okay, so technically the second was downed by a freighter and a fighter), the Executor was downed by fighters. Even in the X-wing games it was usually a swarm of small ships that took out the ISD. The concept of TRD is not wrong, not at all. It is basically suported by all the canon we see.
Actually, the films show exactly how it is possible to square the circle, to give fighters a chance to show their worth w/o making them some kind of capship shield pummeler.

They sink ships both in novels and film, but the way they do so is Heaven and Earth. In the canon deck, it is made clear that fighters are in fact almost useless, and they do what they do under special circumstances like if the enemy is gracious enough to let you enter the innards of their ship. Or create special holes for you to hit. Or have the shields downed by other capships (made very clear in the novelization).

In the games, you just shoot protorps.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:08   Link #23606
Wild Goose
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Originally Posted by Kha View Post
We cook up our own acronyms, so RL acronyms leave us puzzled, or guessing off the mark. I missed the Pecular in SOPMOD.
Lawl, no wonder. To be honest I fomerly thought the O and P went to geter - Spec Ops Mod. The Wonders of Wiki.

Quote:
*yawns away tinnitus from yell*

Hey I was just asking nicely.
But it's so fun to make your eyes spin! XD (Besides this was a lot calmer than if TK unleashed his guns on you.)

Quote:
Okay, so Steel Talons and SOPCC for the TSAB. Fitting, since I AM bringing in Jack O'Neil for Rebuilt.

Just too bad that O'Niel's Mammoth won't have railguns... >.>

Wait he has MARV.
2 L. O'Neill with 2 l. There's another O'Neil with only 1 L, he has no sense of humor.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:14   Link #23607
Kha
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Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Lawl, no wonder. To be honest I fomerly thought the O and P went to geter - Spec Ops Mod. The Wonders of Wiki.
Yes indeed, though not so much for Nanoha. >.>

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
But it's so fun to make your eyes spin! XD (Besides this was a lot calmer than if TK unleashed his guns on you.)
Ah I see...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
2 L. O'Neill with 2 l. There's another O'Neil with only 1 L, he has no sense of humor.
But so much more GAR.

*runs*

Got it.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:19   Link #23608
Wild Goose
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It was a ref to a SG-1 ep. O'Neill, confronted by a reporter who intends to blow the SGC program wide open, says, "Just make sure you get my name right. It's O'Neill, with 2 Ls. There is another O'Neil with only 1 L. He has no sense of humor."

Will breaker later.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:22   Link #23609
Kha
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Oh I started SG-1 midway, so... But given this context I do believe this can go somewhere...

Oh btw, for MMO fans, check out what I found that would make Gordon Ramstead - Tauren's Kitchen proud.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:35   Link #23610
Comartemis
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Originally Posted by arkhangelsk View Post
Actually, the films show exactly how it is possible to square the circle, to give fighters a chance to show their worth w/o making them some kind of capship shield pummeler.

They sink ships both in novels and film, but the way they do so is Heaven and Earth. In the canon deck, it is made clear that fighters are in fact almost useless, and they do what they do under special circumstances like if the enemy is gracious enough to let you enter the innards of their ship.
Ark, you do know that there are bomber-type snubfighters, right? If starfighters were really so useless against capital ships, they wouldn't be in use; it would just be capital ships and other capital ships. Fighters have their uses because they can mount weapons like proton torpedoes, proton bombs, concussion missiles, and assault concussion missiles, which do have a significant impact on the well-being of enemy ships, while being too small for the main guns of a capital ship to target; you need either point-defense lasers or snubfighters of your own. True, lasers are pretty much useless against capital ships, but the solid munitions are a whole 'nother ball game. And don't get me started on assault fighters like the Skipray Blastboat.



You know, the more I think of my characters as being part of a squadron, the easier it is for me to tone them down without feeling like I'm screwing them over. Twelve A, AA, and AAA-ranks is a force to be reckoned with by anyone's measure, now I just need to come up with balanced ideas and and fit them all together.
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Old 2008-04-15, 19:54   Link #23611
Kagerou
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Bahhhh

Er, that is.
MSLN Episode 3 has been released in its entirety. Find it here and here!
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Old 2008-04-15, 22:22   Link #23612
Wild Goose
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Don't forget the missile boat. It was entirely geared around the idea of missile bukakke.

Anyway, Comar, some suggestions:

Since homing rounds are more complex, you'll need a time hit. Fate whipped out Genocide Shift but not how long her prep time was, as well as she was using smaller bolts. If you want more bolts, you'll have to sacrifice on the homing.

Logically, less shots means more accurate homers.

And I can't really think of anything to say and maybe i'll reply in a while later and I'm sorry if i came across as bullying, but when I saw that you said you didn't want to compromise I had an overreaction.
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Old 2008-04-15, 22:23   Link #23613
tshouryuu
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Originally Posted by stormturmoil View Post
Strange...I've never listened, and I've never compromised either...and yet the haxbusters have always left me alone...

wait...that's because I'm not on enough, because my character is kept out in the dark not treading on toes, and because most of it gets retconned by myself even before it hits the board. But even more to the point, it's because I don't really care. Even so, I'll say this:

If any so-called 'haxxbuster' tried to BULLY me like you do in this post, I'd IGNORE them. If they kept trying, I'd keep ignoring them.

Remember, the power of Haxbusting only works if the person you're trying to help actually wants to listen. If not, all they have to do is ignore you, and then what will you do?

Answer: you won't do anything because you CAN'T. If they don't choose to listen, you CAN'T make them. worse, they might choose to leave, and that'd be the OC's loss, not theirs. Moreover, if people are being scared away, the mods might close the thread entirely, ending the whole Hax vs non-hax argument for good.

so tone down the attitude, Goose.

In my defence, I say this about the perils of HAXX, for the benefit of Comartemis and any other newcomers:

If you feel the need to write some HAXX plot or other, DO SO. Post it. Let everyone see it. AND THEREFORE GET IT OUT OF YOUR SYSTEM.

then go back and ask yourself: would I really like my character to have to deal with THIS?

and then alter it to how you feel you need to for you to feel happy putting another character up against it.

most of all, DON'T compromise UNLESS and UNTIL you're happy with the compromise...if you feel you need to fight for a concept that others don't like the sound of at first, by all means fight for it. Don't let yourself be bullied into watering down a feature you like just because some others don't think it fits. MAKE it fit. don't drop it just because it's easier than arguing over it...argue, and hash out a middle ground.

but don't abandon something just because the haxbusters don't like the sound of it.
This is a bad thing to do Storm. I happen to think this is very bad advice. While the haxxbusters did not bust your stuff, you may want to ask yourself this. Is it because your stuff is balanced or is it they are totally ignoring you because its so haxx that its not even worth the effort to try and that you're keeping such a low profile? This board is not your's alone and what you're saying is very selfish in my opinion and almost violating the guidelines stated here by Skyfall.

If you're writing a fic, then I will agree with you since if a person doesn't like the fic, he doesn't have to read it. But what we have here is a community and hence being stubborn will just create ill will against a lot of people. If you want to power wank by creating super characters, I suggest you visit another board like spacebattles for example.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Comartemis View Post
You know, the more I think of my characters as being part of a squadron, the easier it is for me to tone them down without feeling like I'm screwing them over. Twelve A, AA, and AAA-ranks is a force to be reckoned with by anyone's measure, now I just need to come up with balanced ideas and and fit them all together.
Do you mean 12 As, 12 AAs and 12 AAAs in a squadron or 12 mages that are either A, AA or AAA rank? I'm assuming the latter. If so you still have to tone it down since RF6 if I remember correctly, after limiters has about 5 AAs, 2 As, 4 Bs and 1 C rank mages. For your Squadron, the average mage ranks will be about B+ by my estimation.
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Old 2008-04-15, 22:30   Link #23614
Wild Goose
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OFM Assault Company, in comparison, has 36 mages. Of them, there is so far only 1 person above A-rank: Ivanovich. Leo Kozlov, Franz Jaeger and Chief are A-ranks and almost everyone else is B-rank (i think, need to check with Kagerou). Though I know for sure Smith, Wesson and Yuuno are above A-rank.

The Air Wing girls are a mix of A and B ranks simply because those who do mage interdiction and dogfighting have to be A-rank, while those who're ground support can afford to be B-rank.
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Old 2008-04-15, 22:57   Link #23615
Tk3997
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Just some random comments before I get back to the crap storm I seem to have accidentally stirred up. Keroko is asleep anyway and though I'm loath to give it I suppose Ark deserves a response, or I might just go to sleep myself (I only slept like six hours today).

First off on Haxx, there is such a thing as going too far. Trust me I know and a part of Haxx busting is to know when to give a guy a little slack to allow for an interesting idea to be attempted. An example is awhile ago I had a small debate with Jimmy, but after making some comments on the system I basiclly said "I have some reservations, but we'll see how it acutally works in practice and you should perhaps think about these points." it ended agreeably and I think we both got some interesting thoughts from the discussion.

Haxx busting shouldn't be about attacking the other guy or belittling his ideas that's not that point and breeds bad blood and if it disproportionately applied to newbies scares them off and running off newbies is a slow death for any shared universe. I'll admit I've been only tenuously tracking this entire mess (I'll perhaps look more closely now), and so can't clearly say whose right and wrong here, but as I've said before never take anything TOO seriously people including yourself.

The point of what I tried to do here wasn't necessarily ever aimed at reducing power levels (though that was a rather probable side effect) it was mostly trying to get people to stay inside the lines of canon a bit and THINK THROUGH what they were doing. Sometimes I can be blunt about it, but as I've said repeatedly I'm not out to get people I just want them to fully consider what they're doing and how it squares with the framework we all basiclly by default agree to operate under (namely Nanoha canon). I also try not to just destroy ideas without offering any alternative. (though sometimes an idea is just bad and frankly shouldn't be done, even good authors come up with bombs now and again.)

Above all though you HAVE to remain a bit detached from all this when you start getting personal it's easy to become overzealous and too aggressive with people; reprimand when they deserve, not just because you don't like them or based on past history. Sometimes blunt and a tad brutal tactics are called for, but these ought to be exception gentler persuasion and suggesting alternatives more in line with the thread and canons premise should be the first option.

Some Munchkins are simply Munchkins and they won't ever learn, but you must never confuse a good meaning but somewhat inexperienced player with the former. I think Coma is mostly the later although with some slightly Munchkinish properties, but that's not uncommon among newbies. He should be dissuaded of such tendencies yes, but I think the hostility level here might be a bit overdone. I'm rather proud of some of what we've managed to do in this thread, with help from many others, let's not ruin it by becoming... overzealous and start attacking our own shadows in some sort of Hax witch hunt. Above all this thread ought to be about telling interesting stories and if a charater in a good story happens to be a little Hax... Well nothing can ever be perfect.

Seriously guys calm down a bit, step back, and try to look at this objectively is what Coma is proposing REALLY so bad as to warrant this level of sometimes nitpicky attack?

*Tk get's off his soap box*


That said Corm your ideas on how the Nanoha multi-verse work are... flawed IMO. I'll admit I acutally did something kind of similar myself in the past, but I've acutally been trying to downplay it recently (Administered World 82 is a very thinly disguised take off of SG-1 Earth). Basically in my view and many others the other universe factor should not be used as cheap excuse for blantant shameless crossovers. This thread is about OCs in the Nanoha universe not crossovers. It's tempting to do I know, but I think that if you really want a huge straight up crossover you should consider taking your fic else where as that's really not going to get much support here.

Adaptations are perfectly acceptable, but straight out crossovers of other series canon characters are largely frowned upon now, and for good reason IMO not least of all because allot of universes would be WAY overpowered compared to Nanoha. I know it might seem a tad weak to preach "do as I say, not as I do." but really that's what I'm saying here straight up crossovers should just be avoided. That said this dosen't mean that many concepts and such can't be ported in a manner that makes them more viable inside Nanoha canon, which IS pretty flexible.

As and example I present you a profile of a planet I recently worked up, this is world is important in the back story of several of my OC who are loosely based on Ace Combat characters if you know the plot of that game this will be familiar, but you'll note that details and have been swapped about to make it fit the verse not the other way around. The theme is maintained as are many of the important events, but it also makes sense in canon.

Spoiler for Adminstered World 273:

You might find some of our informal norms a bit chaffing at first, but IMO allot of them are for the best and based on our past experience and they still allow ALLOT of leeway if you get a bit creative instead of just trying to bum rush ahead with your original ideas refusing to change them.



Quote:
Originally Posted by LimitedEternal View Post
Now that you mention it, there isn't much real dogfighting in the series, is there?
Am I like the only person that noticed this fact or something?

Quote:
Somehow, I think getting Tesla drunk the honest way might be a better option...not that I'm eager to try.
You'd probably have to survive me too as I'm not big on guys that attempt to inebriate women to take advantage of them...

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Well, by your own admission, you're a fan of long-range combat.
I suppose, but seriously sometimes it seems like I'm the only guy that wants to do anything beisdes charge at the enemy with a mighty battle cry or stand still and spam beams... =/

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They're gonna be in trouble when the "fuck fair play" alien race comes along...
Well there is a chance they could run across someone with a more healthy doctrine that isn't a bunch of conquering dicks and adapt as well. After all there's no reason some other insetllar power has to be mad cackling conquers after all. I acutally use this approach in my crack verse basiclly a tech heavy (and magic poor) nter-dimensional power meets the TSAB and while both consider the others approach a tad odd being fairly reasonable sorts they don't just declare war on each other or something. Others aren't so nice, but exposure to other ways of doing things prepares both of them better for such things.

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Just keep slogging through it. It's the end of my semester here, so I'm busier than normal too.
like I said my classes this semester turned out to be pretty much no brainers I've acutally been kind of bored.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kha View Post
We cook up our own acronyms, so RL acronyms leave us puzzled, or guessing off the mark. I missed the Pecular in SOPMOD.

*yawns away tinnitus from yell*

Hey I was just asking nicely. Okay, so Steel Talons and SOPCC for the TSAB. Fitting, since I AM bringing in Jack O'Neil for Rebuilt.
Permission granted on that by the way and thanks for the heads up. But na like I've said before all my characters are open for use so long as they're kept reasonably IC in said use.

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Just too bad that O'Niel's Mammoth won't have railguns... >.>

Wait he has MARV.
He won't care what guns it has so long as they're big and Honkin'.

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Originally Posted by arkhangelsk View Post
Actually, the films show exactly how it is possible to square the circle, to give fighters a chance to show their worth w/o making them some kind of capship shield pummeler.

They sink ships both in novels and film, but the way they do so is Heaven and Earth. In the canon deck, it is made clear that fighters are in fact almost useless, and they do what they do under special circumstances like if the enemy is gracious enough to let you enter the innards of their ship. Or create special holes for you to hit. Or have the shields downed by other capships (made very clear in the novelization).

In the games, you just shoot protorps.
This much we can agree on the EU totally departed from the movies and wanked fighters to an insane degree. Just look at the Battle of Naboo they're pounding off torps all over and the Trade Fed ship is tanking them easily and those are converted freighters basically glorified Q-Ships. Star Wars in general has one of the weakest justification for Fighters in sci-fi. They seem to exist mainly to fly into insanely overpowered super weapons and blow them up and to fight each other and only survive because Caps ships are apparently forbidden by law from mounting effective AA guns...

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homep...space_fighters
That about sums it up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
But it's so fun to make your eyes spin! XD (Besides this was a lot calmer than if TK unleashed his guns on you.)
Acutally I should blast you too since you basiclly just said you're going to take one of my OC groups and split it apart without even asking. As above though yes you may do so.

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2 L. O'Neill with 2 l. There's another O'Neil with only 1 L, he has no sense of humor.
Acutally this one is back to one L in a lame attempt to make him "different" then the real SG-1 version.

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Originally Posted by Kha View Post
Yes indeed, though not so much for Nanoha. >.>

Ah I see...

But so much more GAR.

*runs*

Got it.
O'Neil isn't GAR nor is that where he draws his mad skillz from, no he has the power of SNARK.

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Originally Posted by Kagerou View Post
That doesn't explain your Vita fetish.

*RUNS FASTER*
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Originally Posted by LimitedEternal View Post
Oh, well played.

*joins Kagerou in running*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evangelion Xgouki


Better run faster
They shouldn't bother they'll only die tired.

And besides it's not like those two aspects are the only things that can make someone likable to me for instance...

Blatant Gratuitous Overkill is another thing I happen to enjoy.

*Tk wanders up to the smoking remains of of LE and Kagerou and starts monologuing*
Spoiler for Tk rambles aimlessly about himself due to a lack of sleep:


Also if you read all that shit you can see I can and often do analyze ANYTHING in insane detail.
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Last edited by Tk3997; 2008-04-15 at 23:16.
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Old 2008-04-15, 23:19   Link #23616
Wild Goose
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 28
Just a quick thing: all mentions of splitting SOPCC are still unconfirmed at this moment...

But even if it splits into PCC and SOCOM, O'Neil will still be running it. ^^;;
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Old 2008-04-15, 23:28   Link #23617
Comartemis
He Who Smites Shippers
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Age: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Though I know for sure Smith, Wesson and Yuuno are above A-rank.
*Massive spittake*

Yuuno?! Mr. I-Can't-Even-Turn-On-A-Device is an A-rank?! Where's your evidence?

Quote:
Do you mean 12 As, 12 AAs and 12 AAAs in a squadron or 12 mages that are either A, AA or AAA rank? I'm assuming the latter. If so you still have to tone it down since RF6 if I remember correctly, after limiters has about 5 AAs, 2 As, 4 Bs and 1 C rank mages. For your Squadron, the average mage ranks will be about B+ by my estimation.
tshouryuu, this is supposed to be an elite squad, as in one made up of mages who have already reached "Striker" level as mages. B-ranks and below have no place in this squadron, and B+ would be the minimum acceptable rank; any lower than that and you'll be a liability to the team. As it is, Rena and Zero are the only mages in the squad who aren't flight capable, and Zero can at least imitate flight with Sky Waltz. Besides, the ranks you provided are the forwards prior to Nanoha's training regimen; by the end of StrikerS, they're supposedly AA-ranks all around. These characters I'm assembling have already been through the equivalent in their respective divisions; Rico was actually one of Nanoha's earlier students, a AAA when in unison with Nova, a AA- without her.

The squadron itself (let's call it Dragon Army, kudos if you get the reference) is composed of 4 melee specialists, 4 ranged specialists, and 4 hybrid fighters. The idea is that the melee and ranged specialists pair off and form a minister/magister relationship, with one tanking while the other bombards from range. The hybrids act as wild cards; if the shit hits the fan and a fight breaks out, they'll be all over the place acting as backup for the individual squads, usually on a one-per-unit basis, but moving around as needed.

In addition to the general specialties, however, most of the mages have a specific area of combat or noncombat operations that they specialize in. One of the ranged fighters is a sniper, one of the hybrids has support and healing magic, there's a catgirl familiar who specializes in demolition, Ciel is a hacker, etc. While the focus is on their combat abilities, these lesser traits allow them to fill a variety of rolls if the mission specs call for it.

Of particular note is a melee specialist with a new kind of device that I'd like the hackbusters to take a close look at, because I think it would make an interesting addition to OC canon; the Belkan Armored System, an experimental device setup designed to maximize the power of defensive and shield spells. It looks something like this:

Spoiler for Belkan Armored System:
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Old 2008-04-15, 23:50   Link #23618
ghazghkull
The Dang-meister
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: British Columbia, Canada
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Umm...Comartimes, there is an issue though about combining that many high-ranked mages into one unit. Just like how we're all trying to balance all the various characters here, the same applies to the unit.

It has even been specified in canon that with the gathering of that many mages of high rank, their overall powers must be reduced so that it meets a maximum quota. Therefore, all your characters would require to drop a rank or two by limiters, as per canon.

And as for Yuuno, despite the fact he can't use a device, there are other ways to be A Rank :3 He can easily be a A-Rank support-type fighter, which he most likely is, due to the fact that he's nutso with Support Spells, such as healing based spells, or even binding
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Old 2008-04-15, 23:58   Link #23619
Jimmy C
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Comartemis, how do you define what a "Striker" is?
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Old 2008-04-16, 00:10   Link #23620
Ottocycle
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Comartemis View Post
*Massive spittake*

Yuuno?! Mr. I-Can't-Even-Turn-On-A-Device is an A-rank?! Where's your evidence?
Tanking AAA+ Vita with Cartridge-Loaded-Raketen-Graf Eisen with one hand, when Nanoha failed with her vaunted AAA+. Yeah, he can't turn on a device, because he doesn't need one. :3

Sigh, how the ferret form misleads.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghazghkull View Post
And as for Yuuno, despite the fact he can't use a device, there are other ways to be A Rank :3 He can easily be a A-Rank support-type fighter, which he most likely is, due to the fact that he's nutso with Support Spells, such as healing based spells, or even binding
Not likely, but is.
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