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Old 2008-06-16, 00:56   Link #1261
Tk3997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Actually, realism is one of the problems. When miltaku's aren't carefull, their stories can end up being too realistic, removing the fantasy elements and filling with a lot of technobable or military bable the rest will be left scratching their heads at. Stuff that would happen in the anime doesn't, and what wouldn't happen does, because it's more realistic.

Now, this doesn't happen all the time, but it does ocasionally.
I’ll take a little technobabble over “Random character ‘trains’ really hard and now has (or had from the start) superpowers totally unheard of in the chosen setting or say suddenly appears in his super mecha that’s decades ahead of anything else in the series and probably violates a half dozen stated laws regarding it’s tech…” Basiclly IMO too little realism and logic will start damaging a story much more rapidly then too much will. Even if it’s fiction people simply expect a story to make sense and at least seem vaguely logical (unless the entire point is to be obtuse or it’s not meant to be taken seriously but that’s something else altogether). In a serious story though when things gets too outlandish disbelief starts to set in and you can begin losing the reader.

This tends to happen MUCH more quickly with crack then it dose with realism in fact any crack that morphs into a real story tends to quickly discard allot of the crackish elements and take on more logic and realism. Also trying to bring militarism into this isn’t even really what’s at issue this is more about logic and realism verses just doing whatever seems “cool” or some such. Militarism really only comes up at all because Nanoha has military elements that some people would prefer be handled more realistically.

Yeah too much of either is bad but drinking to much whiskey will kill you allot faster then too much water will.

Quote:
Oh, the irony...
You also know if it was the other way around there would be lawsuits ALL over... apparently discrimination is bad expect against young men we deserve it apparently.

Quote:
I myself hate driving cars. I don't know why, but I just can't get myself to like sitting in the drivers seat of one pasengers seat is fine, but when it comes to driving I'd rather take my bike anyday.
See I'm like the exact opposite I love driving I look for excuses to drive "need something from the store? Sure I'll get it!" I can drive like 500+ miles cross country no sweat, but put me in the passengers seat... I can barely make it 30 minutes. If I'm in the car I need to be driving.

Also the bike isn't much of an option when it's 20 miles too and from you school and five miles over hilly terrain to the nearest grocery store. On the plus side those lovely winding hilly roads have no houses on them and are pretty much empty after about 6 PM and the cops never come around them...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
At least there won't be hugeass half-baked 40k crossover port ideas. Or remember Kha's intentions to turn Voltaire into a mecha? Even a miltaku would look at Voltaire and go, "Okay, big dragon, how can Caro deploy Voltaire better for best usage?" and not "ZOMG VOLTAIRE IS A MECHADRAGON LULZ".
That was insane even for him though I would almost call it and outlier he's usually more reasonable then THAT.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Oh, you'll learn to love them like that. I've lost count how many people eventually said "I'd hit it."
Well there's no accounting for taste or people who'll hit anything that has at least one warm hole in it...


Quote:
It's a different form of stepping outside canon, but miltaku crack is just as bad. It's not mechadragon lulz, but 'military bable *yawn*' My point is that crack authors and miltaku are two sides of the same coin. If they're not carefull, their fics end up no longer being the series it is based upon.
I'm sorry I can't see the parallels that makes introducing more complex tactics and maybe some minor jargon worse or even tentatively connected to turning something clearly and repeatedly called dragon into a giant robot...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Nope, Aaron is right.

The funny thing is that it's a very rare name, so you can imagine my surprise when I found my name apearing on the screen.
I’ve had my name turn up a few times though never on anyone really cool that I can recall. My names not exactly rare though being consistently in the top 50 for newborns in like a half dozen countries. Still it's always a bit of fun to see your name pop up when looking at a piece of fiction. Well maybe not so much for my sister like the only place her name shows up is in one rather famous song title and she hates the tune.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron008R View Post


We've just been thru a lot.

Actually, to do a very quick summary, the OC Thread community has gone thru three major history arcs. Namely...

1. The Beginning. (No need to explain. ^^;

2. The Wild Blooming. (Where the HAXX levels were rather outta control. But still fun. Usually referred to as the Golden Days of Wild Abandon.[Okay, I made that up.] That phase lacked a bit in control.)

3. The Stringency Wars. (The previews era was wild? This era took control a little too seriously and cranked it to the other end of the rainbow. This is where the recent hissy fits ghaz mentioned were in full force. But lots of bad blood and dark suppressed emotions due to the extreme stringency against any points regarding HAXX caused the lack of motivation to write.)

And now, I would like to believe that we are all currently in Era #:

4. The Middle Ground Rebuilding Period. (Where the balance between creativity and basic groundwork rules is maintained. If too much lack of control is bad, too much control is just as bad. That's what we learned the hard way. But now, we're past that.)

If I must say so myself, you picked a decent time to enter. Have fun!
I'd have gone with five myself I personally think that just after the crack overload and before the crack down there was a period of balance... Then I took a month long vacation and everything just went to hell in a hand basket.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Oh yeah, and Ancient Belka will be needing MAJOR explanations. According to canon, there are only 3 AB users left: Hayate, Carim and Acous.

And I prefer Belka. Gives off Ace Combat vibes.
I like it much the same reason more so since some of my chars are fleshed out and modded Expies of Ace Combat Zero characters…

Quote:
As for the Stringency Wars, it's really a matter of what happens when one guy shows up, intends to changing the entire Kerokanon Sandbox to fit himself, and then has hissy fits when the established OC sandbox will not conform to his ideas, nor will he listen at all to anyone. The fact that certain perveyours of a certain substance named after them egged him on didn't help either.
Goose just drop it and let it go brother, let it GO.

Also welcome too the new guy saw you pop into IRC tonight, but you didn't get to hang around much and we seem to have confused you with our Call of Duty 4 discussion. The IRC will for lack of an actual topic related to Nanoha to discuss tend to drift rather rapidly onto anything that interests a majority of the people present. If you acutally pose such a topic we'll usually snap back... usually. As Aaron said though IRC can be a nice place to get some quick feedback but a typed up and cohesive post combing it all into something whole is also important.
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Old 2008-06-16, 03:10   Link #1262
Keroko
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Welcome to the OC-thread, Mirron. I hope you enjoy your stay here and have fun.

Well, everything that needs to be said has been said, but I would like to make one adition: IRC is not a requirement to join in on this thread. I myself have never gone to IRC, nor do I plan to, and I manage here just fine. Of course, if you want to go to IRC, then by all means go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tempest Dynasty View Post
Hmm.

Of that list...

The second one from the left wearing the red plaid is Nadeshiko Fujisaki from Shugo Chara. His real name is Nagihiko Fujisaki.

Next to him wearing the butler uniform is Chiharu Kiyohara from They Are My Noble Masters.
*scribble scribble* thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tshouryuu View Post
  1. As for explanation on magic system, there isn't much info either but in a nutshell, this is the info we got. * Steals Borrows Keroko's IS: Silver Retriever.
    Spoiler for IS:Silver Retriever!!:
*headlocks Tshou* My IS!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Not to mention that he's the only villian who can tank a physical impact with his Barrier Jacket, and have the BJ be so hard that he actually breaks the hand on the guy who tried to hit him with a stake launcher.
Do note that the debate regarding that has never reached a conclusion. I am still of the opinion that Barrier Jackets can take physical hits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Oh yeah, and Ancient Belka will be needing MAJOR explanations. According to canon, there are only 3 AB users left: Hayate, Carim and Acous.
Those three were referring to Rare Skill users, a bit of a difference.

On another note, I'm drawing a total blank on the source that stated Hayate, Carim and Acous are the only remaining Rare Skill users. Where was that stated again?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Also, regarding realism: Realism tends to waver in Nanoha. On one hand it's a Magical Girl show, so realism as per laws of physics is already bent, if not outright broken. On the other hand, human interactions remain the same - there's nothing to show that there's any difference between the humans of our reality and humans in Nanoverse, which means that, for example, the entire Bureau loving RF6, even the people who RF6 makes to look bad, would not be realistic - regardless of Keroko says.
Nya? I'm pretty sure I said Comar was exagerating. What I was poiting out back then was that your initial claim that people would hate an elite unit and nobody would be wowed was false, because RF6 definetely wowed people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron008R View Post
I couldn't wait anymore.

OC Material post! HASSHA!

Seven Years Before MSLN Nanoha...
A Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha prequel side story...

~MGLN RecollectionS~
~A glimpse into the past...~



A collection of OC-Centered pre-series stories, only to be seen now...

Starring:

-=The Spectral Enforcers=-

Spoiler for Spectrum 1: Granveil Lacetti:


Spoiler for Spectrum 2: Victoria Fairmont:


Spoiler for Spectrum 3: Aurion Dauer:


Spoiler for Spectrum 4: Almaria Corvette:


Spoiler for Spectrum 5: Glemy Grant:


Spoiler for Spectrum 6: Prairie Auster:



I'll build their profiles along the way. I think I'll alternate working between GenerationS and this to keep up the creative juices flowing without getting stuck as much. I'll also introduce some links between the two arcs later.
Granveil... Lacetti? Hooooh boy, a new piece of the puzzle falls into place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Also the bike isn't much of an option when it's 20 miles too and from you school and five miles over hilly terrain to the nearest grocery store. On the plus side those lovely winding hilly roads have no houses on them and are pretty much empty after about 6 PM and the cops never come around them...
Actually, I did drive 20 miles on my bike for a few weeks, though that was to work and not school, but small difference. 5 miles is nothing, even now I do a good 8 miles to school, and 8 miles back again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
That was insane even for him though I would almost call it and outlier he's usually more reasonable then THAT.
In Kha's defence, it was partially 7arcs fault for comming up with utter ridiculous idea to give the two summons mecha sounds. -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Well there's no accounting for taste or people who'll hit anything that has at least one warm hole in it...
One-track mind much?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
I'm sorry I can't see the parallels that makes introducing more complex tactics and maybe some minor jargon worse or even tentatively connected to turning something clearly and repeatedly called dragon into a giant robot...
That's not really a fair comparison, now is it? You compare a bit of miltaku crack to Kha's biggest crack project to date. A more accurate comparison would be to lay Kha's initial Rebuilt next to ATC's fics, especially his earlier ones. Those were so filled with jargon that they frankly became a task to read.
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Old 2008-06-16, 04:33   Link #1263
Kyral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
4th pic, 3rd row - Haku from Naruto
2nd pic, 4th row - Toru Kouno from Princess Princess
5th pic, 4th row - Yujiro Shihoudani from Princess princess
Gah! Can't belive I didn't remembere Haku!
Ok... it's been a while since I saw the first Naruto arcs...

Ah! And those are from Princess Princess?
Now I know where I saw that one... my Brother and his Girlfriend where talking to me about that one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirron View Post
I'm primarily interesting in the Belka system, although I've also seen it typed Velka, so I may use that.
Hello there!

Can't add much to the stuff that already was said.

Ah yes... good old spelling. Back then Belka was Velka and Raising Heart was Raging Heart. :3

But more and more official sources proved me wrong.
You are still free to use Velka though.

Oh... and as you may find out, I am the official Belka Scriptor of the OC.
So if you ever need a translation into german for spells, I'm at your service.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kha View Post
1. Nope there isn't really a topic, but we do have multiple continuities, since various people have varying takes on what the canon timeline could be like. Take your pick, of the major continuities there's:

- Canon timeline: It used to be good, but then came StrikerS which when it tried to expand the universe seemed to have tripped up. Not many of us use this timeline

- the Kerokanon timeline: Essentially the canon timeline, but with 1 more Ace, Keroko, who is Nanoha's sister. Most people work in this timeline currently, though each work actually extends into its own sub-timeline based off Kerokanon as like I said, different people have different takes of the same thing.

- the Alpha timeline: Kerokanon, but evolved into a dark grim future, opting to focus on sense and militarism over the usual Mahou Shoujo fare. Depending on what you liked in Nanoha StrikerS, you might go for this timeline, but be prepared for angst.

- the Original Generations timeline: Kerokanon, but with more prominent OCs, and even more patches and fixes to canon facts and errors, as well as additional content like new magic systems, in-depth racial histories, device varieties and greater customization. It is built like an MMORPG, strives to achieve balance while cramming in as much content as possible, and at the same time keeping things open for others to come in and use it, or even have fun. As such, most of this "timeline" is essentially pages and pages of histories of the various races, racial abilities, playable classes available to each race... With my OCs built within this framework.
What!?
I thought we only have Kerokanon, Militaku and Khrack!


Oh and Mirron just to show how free you are in terms of setting.

I have a Dark Future Setting I call Nightfall wich takes place some years after StrikerS, everything is more or less destroyed and some of the main cast are dead or missing, an ancient evil has taken control over Midchilda and the remaining free people live underground.

Think of the Terminator future... only without Terminators but with more Deathknight like mages instead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
Off the top of my head, a few things to note: the Linker Core is - unlike what some other cadians would have you believe - an organ present only in mages that converts carbohydrates into mana.
Not really...

In A's there are those creatures that are big enough to have a Linker Core, but could not use magic.

Maybe they used mana for something different.
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Last edited by Kyral; 2008-06-16 at 06:47.
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Old 2008-06-16, 04:38   Link #1264
Keroko
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I'd say those creatures couldn't use magic simply because they lacked the knowledge how to do so. Having a Linker Core doesn't mean you automatically know how to cast magic, Nanoha would have lived just like any other person had she not encountered Yuuno.

So you could say those monsters were 'mages'
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Old 2008-06-16, 04:40   Link #1265
Sheba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyral View Post

I have a Dark Future Setting I call Midnight wich takes place some years after StrikerS and everything is more or less destroyed and some of the main cast are dead or missing, an ancient evil has taken control over Midchilda and the remaining free people live underground.

Think of the Terminator future... only without Terminators but with more Deathknight like mages instead.


Midnight? Like that Dungeons & Dragons 3 campaign setting based on the "Evil has won" premise?
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Old 2008-06-16, 04:49   Link #1266
Rayneing
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Originally Posted by Kha View Post
- Canon timeline

- the Kerokanon timeline

- the Alpha timeline

- the Original Generations timeline
Why does this all sound suspiciously like Super Robot Wars? Heheh.
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Old 2008-06-16, 04:50   Link #1267
Kyral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
I'd say those creatures couldn't use magic simply because they lacked the knowledge how to do so. Having a Linker Core doesn't mean you automatically know how to cast magic, Nanoha would have lived just like any other person had she not encountered Yuuno.

So you could say those monsters were 'mages'
Hm... alright you got me here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Midnight? Like that Dungeons & Dragons 3 campaign setting based on the "Evil has won" premise?
Ah... sorry I somehow was thinking about that D&D Setting and named it wrong...

My setting is namend Nightfall not Midnight

thanks for reminding me.

*changes in above post*
how embarrassing...
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Old 2008-06-16, 04:52   Link #1268
Sheba
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Originally Posted by Rayneing View Post
Why does this all sound suspiciously like Super Robot Wars? Heheh.
That's because Nanoha has quite a lot of mecha anime references not to mention that a good portion of OCers are big mecha geeks. (I am not one tho)
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Old 2008-06-16, 05:05   Link #1269
Kha
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron008R View Post
I couldn't wait anymore.

OC Material post! HASSHA!

Seven Years Before MSLN Nanoha...
A Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha prequel side story...

~MGLN RecollectionS~
~A glimpse into the past...~



A collection of OC-Centered pre-series stories, only to be seen now...

Starring:

-=The Spectral Enforcers=-

Spoiler for Spectrum 1: Granveil Lacetti:


Spoiler for Spectrum 2: Victoria Fairmont:


Spoiler for Spectrum 3: Aurion Dauer:


Spoiler for Spectrum 4: Almaria Corvette:


Spoiler for Spectrum 5: Glemy Grant:


Spoiler for Spectrum 6: Prairie Auster:



I'll build their profiles along the way. I think I'll alternate working between GenerationS and this to keep up the creative juices flowing without getting stuck as much. I'll also introduce some links between the two arcs later.
SO THIS is what you are talking about. And like Nanoha Keroko mentioned another puzzle falls into place... Need more details; this is practically their birth certificates (save AuIron Man and Almaria whom we have seen before)

Now to fight off Khrack of Nanoha/Zero, featuring loli-Precia, Quint, Megane, Kia, Lindy, Leti, Kyla and Momoko, oh baby Carym, and of course the harem hero, shouta Touareg.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayneing View Post
Why does this all sound suspiciously like Super Robot Wars? Heheh.
The references are endless, AND of course the mention of Original Generations

And hellow there Rayne! Like to join us in the fun?
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Old 2008-06-16, 06:44   Link #1270
Wild Goose
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Well, everything that needs to be said has been said, but I would like to make one adition: IRC is not a requirement to join in on this thread. I myself have never gone to IRC, nor do I plan to, and I manage here just fine. Of course, if you want to go to IRC, then by all means go.
No, but IRC is where you get quick, fast realtime discussion of ideas and concepts.

Quote:
Do note that the debate regarding that has never reached a conclusion. I am still of the opinion that Barrier Jackets can take physical hits.
Barrier Jackets have the strength of plot, end of story. Aces and high-level mages have thinner barrier jackets that provide less protection against penetration and stabbing because they're mobile, zipping all over the place, and can throw up barriers and shields with abandon. Lower ranks use BJs that are thicker because they're not as good with shields and barriers; the OFM embraced the ODST Jacket MkII enthusiastically because to them more protection was never a bad thing (as well as the fact that it's fucking badass).

Quote:
Those three were referring to Rare Skill users, a bit of a difference.

On another note, I'm drawing a total blank on the source that stated Hayate, Carim and Acous are the only remaining Rare Skill users. Where was that stated again?
I believe it's the A's to StrikerS manga.

Quote:
Nya? I'm pretty sure I said Comar was exagerating. What I was poiting out back then was that your initial claim that people would hate an elite unit and nobody would be wowed was false, because RF6 definetely wowed people.
...Keroko, you missed the goddamned point. The point I was making to him was that his idea of RF6 wowing everybody and everybody loving them was false, and I gave examples of two highly-respected military units who faced closure simply because they had their share of people who disliked them.

Hell look at Tiger Woods; he's the closest thing to an Ace in the real world, he has plenty of fans, loads of people at the grassroots are wowed by him (like the Forwards wowing the grunts)... and his peers cackle with glee every time he screws up, because he makes them all LOOK BAD. I will repeat what I posted on the previous page:

"Also, regarding realism: Realism tends to waver in Nanoha. On one hand it's a Magical Girl show, so realism as per laws of physics is already bent, if not outright broken. On the other hand, human interactions remain the same - there's nothing to show that there's any difference between the humans of our reality and humans in Nanoverse, which means that, for example, the entire Bureau loving RF6, even the people who RF6 makes to look bad, would not be realistic - regardless of Keroko says.

"I speak from experience: My Dad was in a similar position to the Aces in the church and enjoyed tremendous grassroots support, and was in the running to be the next Bishop of the Diocese - basically, the Boss. Almost everyone who he hadn't trained pretty much disliked him because he was an outsider who came in, did the job, got it done, and made them all look bad simply by doing a damn good job."

Quote:
That's not really a fair comparison, now is it? You compare a bit of miltaku crack to Kha's biggest crack project to date. A more accurate comparison would be to lay Kha's initial Rebuilt next to ATC's fics, especially his earlier ones. Those were so filled with jargon that they frankly became a task to read.
Read John Ringo. And Tom Clancy. And compare. And W.E.B. Griffin. Griffin is more charecter-based, Clancy writes with too much technobabble, and Ringo's admitted focus is on writing awesomeness. I blend all together.

Ringo's Paladin of Shadows series pwns. Even if it makes you headdesk and go OH JOHN RINGO NO.

Regards the linker core, clarification: In humans, the linker core only manifests in mages. It is not, as Kha said, some dormant organ lying in wait for activation amongst all mages. Then again I can't remember the last time Kha actually made sense (he called the refuelling probe on the JF-704 a "sidearm". Then again Beanbag is admittedly a poor soldier, which is why he's in a ceremonial outfit...)
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Old 2008-06-16, 06:47   Link #1271
Tk3997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyral View Post
Oh and Mirron just to show how free you are in terms of setting.

I have a Dark Future Setting I call Nightfall wich takes place some years after StrikerS, everything is more or less destroyed and some of the main cast are dead or missing, an ancient evil has taken control over Midchilda and the remaining free people live underground.
There’s also technically speaking the Unsung War-Generations-Guardians AKA the UGG timeline ). Which is supposedly is its own timeline (well they were linked last I checked starting out with KC, but going rapidly AU after Strikers, but is at this point more like three separate and only tenuously linked fan fics. But just give us like oh ten years though! Trust me it’s gonna be epic once we acutally get around to linking them together! Well assuming it doesn’t end up as a huge mess full of plot holes and contradictions instead…

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Welcome to the OC-thread, Mirron. I hope you enjoy your stay here and have fun.

Well, everything that needs to be said has been said, but I would like to make one adition: IRC is not a requirement to join in on this thread. I myself have never gone to IRC, nor do I plan to, and I manage here just fine. Of course, if you want to go to IRC, then by all means go.
Seriously don’t listen to him Keroko is like that old guy in any group that sits around and bitches about them youngins and there new fangled ways.

Quote:
Do note that the debate regarding that has never reached a conclusion. I am still of the opinion that Barrier Jackets can take physical hits.
ARMOR can take hits, BJ aren't armor canon pretty much says so. You want your guys clothes to take hits? Fine give him armor plates (which we know a jacket can include) and I won't cry foul, but the BJ we see most of the cast in are NOT going to provide any real protection against psychical weapons IMO. Those BJ are IMO designed to protect against magic damage which makes sense given that until very recently Belka had gone the way of the dinosaur and guns were totally outlawed so that was the most likely threat to be encountered. The jacket worked fine against that and didn't force you to deal with the bulk of proper armor, but it wouldn't stop the kinds of weapons real armor would either so it was a trade off.

Even so I was always willing to give the thicker portions of a BJ protection roughly in line with ballistic fibers IE they'd help a little, but they wouldn't stop high velocity bullets or serious edged weapons. Basically a good thick jacket over your torso would be about on par with a bullet resistant vest AND it would provide a hell of allot more protection from magic.

Quote:
Nya? I'm pretty sure I said Comar was exagerating. What I was poiting out back then was that your initial claim that people would hate an elite unit and nobody would be wowed was false, because RF6 definetely wowed people.
All we see them wowing are a bunch of low level grunts that's hardly astounding. Would everyone hate them? No, would plenty of people resent them? Oh hell yes.

Quote:
Actually, I did drive 20 miles on my bike for a few weeks, though that was to work and not school, but small difference. 5 miles is nothing, even now I do a good 8 miles to school, and 8 miles back again.
Well 20 miles on the interstate... I don't think I could ride my bike down that though. So we're looking at a notably longer distance on a bike and I'm sure my classmates would enjoy sitting next to my sweat soaked body for three hours in a small room. Then we factor in I take my classes at night so I'd be coming back at oh 9 PM... 20+ miles on a bike a large portion of that on unlit back roads yeah that sounds fun.

I'll stick to driving to the YMCA adjoining the school and hitting a treadmill for an hour or running with my dog for exercise and stick with the air conditioned car for getting where I want to go.

Quote:
In Kha's defence, it was partially 7arcs fault for comming up with utter ridiculous idea to give the two summons mecha sounds. -_-
This isn't really much of a defense by this logic we should also conclude that space in pretty much all visual fiction is acutally a fairly dense gas cloud since we can hear sound in it. (Though this would also help explain why spaceships seem to slow down when not thrusting and bank when they turn.) But I digress suffice to say ignoring visuals, dialogue, and sanity based on some silly sound effects to try and do some sort of whacked out Zoids crossover (least that the plan I vaugely recall) isn't really much of a defense at all.

Quote:
One-track mind much?
You seemed to purpose that people became attracted to the traps on there merits. I countered that you'll find people that would be attracted to a wooden board if they could have sex with it... My feelings on this are well subject are well know though traps do absolutely nothing for me.

Quote:
That's not really a fair comparison, now is it? You compare a bit of miltaku crack to Kha's biggest crack project to date. A more accurate comparison would be to lay Kha's initial Rebuilt next to ATC's fics, especially his earlier ones. Those were so filled with jargon that they frankly became a task to read.
That was the least of the issues with ATC early fics... ATCs mind blowingly haxx creation was what caused me to basiclly quit the thread for a month after all. The Issue with ATC IMO wasn't jargon it was a total lack of balance and disregard of the source material.

And at least he was using mostly established terms you could probably look up. Kha's crack sometimes only makes sense in his own head or if you know the plot of a half dozen different shows... He has this nasty habit of throwing out ideas or concepts without really explaining them properly which makes them nearly impossible to understand at times. He also has the habit of never making up his damn mind I've been in this thread for about ten months now and I STILL couldn't tell you straight up what the hell Kha's powers, or history, or role is becasue it seems to shift by the hour.

It's part of why I don't really use him since if you put him in a fic chances are whatever you version you use will be retconned into oblivion within a month... He's on what the fifth version now? I really think Kha just needs to set his alter ego and start frikkin writing already.
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Old 2008-06-16, 07:26   Link #1272
dkellis
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Part of the problem with trying to make things "realistic" is that the canon is not realistic as such.

This matters if you're trying to make your story have the feel of the canon, and do this by rewatching the series to get into the right mindset.
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Old 2008-06-16, 09:35   Link #1273
Comartemis
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My folks have gotten it into their heads to remodel the office, so I'll be out of an internet connection for a while. Looks like I'll be whipping up a Backlog Breaker sometime in the future, but until then....

*Squints at Mirron*

....Uldihaa? Is that you?

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Originally Posted by Kha View Post
Welcome Mirron!

1. Nope there isn't really a topic, but we do have multiple continuities, since various people have varying takes on what the canon timeline could be like. Take your pick, of the major continuities there's:

- Canon timeline: It used to be good, but then came StrikerS which when it tried to expand the universe seemed to have tripped up. Not many of us use this timeline

- the Kerokanon timeline: Essentially the canon timeline, but with 1 more Ace, Keroko, who is Nanoha's sister. Most people work in this timeline currently, though each work actually extends into its own sub-timeline based off Kerokanon as like I said, different people have different takes of the same thing.

- the Alpha timeline: Kerokanon, but evolved into a dark grim future, opting to focus on sense and militarism over the usual Mahou Shoujo fare. Depending on what you liked in Nanoha StrikerS, you might go for this timeline, but be prepared for angst.

- the Original Generations timeline: Kerokanon, but with more prominent OCs, and even more patches and fixes to canon facts and errors, as well as additional content like new magic systems, in-depth racial histories, device varieties and greater customization. It is built like an MMORPG, strives to achieve balance while cramming in as much content as possible, and at the same time keeping things open for others to come in and use it, or even have fun. As such, most of this "timeline" is essentially pages and pages of histories of the various races, racial abilities, playable classes available to each race... With my OCs built within this framework.

Just my massive pet project.

At the forefront of this timeline is Rebuilt of StrikerS, which is the reconstruction of the original events set in this giant timeline. However, no one else works in this timeline because its too prone to changes, always in flux, and pretty much never gets written beyond loads of scrap paper scattered around my desk. My reputation of not giving things a good thinkover is killing it. Which is kinda ironic, considering that prior to coming to Asuki Nanoha forums, I was known in another writing circle for hiding multiple plotlines that ultimately come together Agatha Cristie style.

And there are even more works that don't exactly exist clearly in one timeline, like for Lowe's OCs, they can fit into any timeline.
I'd like to add one more to that list:

--the Comacanon timeline: A still-in-development timeline aimed at shaping post-A's canon into something completely different from the disappointment that was StrikerS by altering key events in the A's-to-StrikerS timeskip. While the details are still being sorted out, features being included for certain include an interdimension crime syndicate, the de-shafting of Hayate Yagami, two new Aces, a bigger, badder, and more psychotic Jail Scaglietti and an army of new Gadgets and a few new cyborgs to go with the deal, and a complete remaking of StrikerS canon. Plotted events include the halting of Jail's attack on the press conference, an event which has been included in order to prevent Jail from getting his hands on Vivio and launching the Cradle; both it and Vivio's relic will most likely be needed post-StrikerS.

This is done by an emphasis in the storyline on the Ground Forces version of the SAFA: Durandal, a special weapons and tactics group focused on creating counters to mass-based weapons, AMF technology, and improving the firepower available to the average army mage through the usage of experimental devices called Hardsuits. More details to come, but for now, anticipate a heaping helping of mecha musume in this crazy little division, especially where Subaru is concerned...
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Old 2008-06-16, 09:58   Link #1274
Keroko
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Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
No, but IRC is where you get quick, fast realtime discussion of ideas and concepts.
True.

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Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
I believe it's the A's to StrikerS manga.
Ah, now I remember. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
...Keroko, you missed the goddamned point. The point I was making to him was that his idea of RF6 wowing everybody and everybody loving them was false, and I gave examples of two highly-respected military units who faced closure simply because they had their share of people who disliked them.
True, but your words were misleading, sugesting that everyone would hate an elite unit like that. Not everyone was wowed by RF6, but a lot of people sure were.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Seriously don’t listen to him Keroko is like that old guy in any group that sits around and bitches about them youngins and there new fangled ways.
Even though I am younger then you and most likely a lot more experienced in many software programs?

Suuuure Tk. Keep dreaming.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
ARMOR can take hits, BJ aren't armor canon pretty much says so. You want your guys clothes to take hits? Fine give him armor plates (which we know a jacket can include) and I won't cry foul, but the BJ we see most of the cast in are NOT going to provide any real protection against psychical weapons IMO. Those BJ are IMO designed to protect against magic damage which makes sense given that until very recently Belka had gone the way of the dinosaur and guns were totally outlawed so that was the most likely threat to be encountered. The jacket worked fine against that and didn't force you to deal with the bulk of proper armor, but it wouldn't stop the kinds of weapons real armor would either so it was a trade off.

Even so I was always willing to give the thicker portions of a BJ protection roughly in line with ballistic fibers IE they'd help a little, but they wouldn't stop high velocity bullets or serious edged weapons. Basically a good thick jacket over your torso would be about on par with a bullet resistant vest AND it would provide a hell of allot more protection from magic.
Uh-huh. Sure. Canon says its not armor. Then I suppose the fact that canon says that Subaru and Teana's Barrier Jackets are created for, and I quote, "high output and heavy armor" is all in my head then.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
All we see them wowing are a bunch of low level grunts that's hardly astounding. Would everyone hate them? No, would plenty of people resent them? Oh hell yes.
So far 'plenty of people' has been limited to Regius, whereas the 'apreciation' part (sounds a bit more tame then wowed) got support of pretty much every character that apeared on screen. This is one of the things I'm talking about, canonically only a single person has been shown hating them, while everyone else was either impressed, happy with them or wowed by them. And yet because its realistic, canon must be twisted that 'plenty of people' have to resent them.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Well 20 miles on the interstate... I don't think I could ride my bike down that though. So we're looking at a notably longer distance on a bike and I'm sure my classmates would enjoy sitting next to my sweat soaked body for three hours in a small room. Then we factor in I take my classes at night so I'd be coming back at oh 9 PM... 20+ miles on a bike a large portion of that on unlit back roads yeah that sounds fun.

I'll stick to driving to the YMCA adjoining the school and hitting a treadmill for an hour or running with my dog for exercise and stick with the air conditioned car for getting where I want to go.
Wuss.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
You seemed to purpose that people became attracted to the traps on there merits. I countered that you'll find people that would be attracted to a wooden board if they could have sex with it... My feelings on this are well subject are well know though traps do absolutely nothing for me.
Meh, can't disagree there. I know people who would, in fact, feel atracted to a wooden board if they could have sex with it. Coincidentally these people are also the stereotyical 'drink, smoke and sex' teenagers. Not exactly annoying company, but not the most pleasant either.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
That was the least of the issues with ATC early fics... ATCs mind blowingly haxx creation was what caused me to basiclly quit the thread for a month after all. The Issue with ATC IMO wasn't jargon it was a total lack of balance and disregard of the source material.
Hmm, for me it was, and still is, mostly the jargon. As someone with little to no knowledge of the subject, its far more easy for me to go about it.
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Old 2008-06-16, 10:43   Link #1275
Tk3997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
True, but your words were misleading, sugesting that everyone would hate an elite unit like that. Not everyone was wowed by RF6, but many people sure were.
Many but most of them are probably guys with little real power to help them fact is the people MOST likely to dislike them are also the guys with the power to screw them...

Quote:
Even though I am younger then you and most likely a lot more experienced in many software programs?

Suuuure Tk. Keep dreaming.
Not what I meant it's not a technical thing it's a "We've always done it this way and by god I'm going to keep doing it this way!" deal.

Quote:
Uh-huh. Sure. Canon says its not armor. Then I suppose the fact that canon says that Subaru and Teana's Barrier Jackets are created for, and I quote, "high output and heavy armor" is all in my head then.
We have the DVD Booklet flat out state that what the knights wear isn't armor, but is lighter and makes them more mobile. Now given that what wear see the Knight wearing is basiclly a BJ do the math. Actual armor clearly exists in Nanoha though it's fallen into disuse due to a lack of threats that warrant it.

To quote the passage:

"Ancient Belkan practitioners generally equip defensive attire known as “Knight Armor”, but the Guardian Knights wear “Knight’s Garb”, designed by Hayate. (Concerning this, details can be found in the “Book of Darkness Incident” data files) Similarly, the Unison Device Reinforce II dons Knight’s Garb when advancing to the front lines. As fitting the support-type Reinforce II, although it does not provide top-class protection, Knight’s Garb allows for more agile maneuvering."

That's a fucking Slam dunk as far as I'm concerned BJ are not the upper tier of defense and there main downsides are probably there vulnerability to physical weapons.

Quote:
So far 'plenty of people' has been limited to Regius, whereas the 'apreciation' part (sounds a bit more tame then wowed) got support of pretty much every character that apeared on screen. This is one of the things I'm talking about, canonically only a single person has been shown hating them, while everyone else was either impressed, happy with them or wowed by them. And yet because its realistic, canon must be twisted that 'plenty of people' have to resent them.
Which is who? Basically everyone besides Regius that gets screen time are long time acquaintances of theres or even family. Seriously name me a character that loves them that shows up in StrikerS that they haven't known for sometime.

Quote:
Wuss.
Luddite.

Quote:
Hmm, for me it was, and still is, mostly the jargon. As someone with little to no knowledge of the subject, its far more easy for me to go about it.
Meh I didn't think it was that bad certainly not as bad as I've seen some people go.
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Old 2008-06-16, 11:15   Link #1276
Kha
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Gah here we go again... ><

Anyway, Kha was pretty constant. In fact, I still draw heavily on the 3rd Ed Codex I made for him. Only problem was, it was made during the Khrack era, so some parts on hindsight made me facepalm and want to change things...

...then came all the Khrack being pedalled around here. >.>

All the hype you hear from me and around us, is all Alpha-testing and Play-Testing. Like an MMO, only the released version is official, as the alpha changes every weekend. A little habit of mine that I picked up from Blizzard. <.<

So let's put it this way: Until I get the next codex out, the 3rd Codex stands.

As for the 3rd Codex... Eat your heart out, all 44MB of it, for a limited time only.
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Old 2008-06-16, 11:19   Link #1277
Wild Goose
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True, but your words were misleading, sugesting that everyone would hate an elite unit like that. Not everyone was wowed by RF6, but a lot of people sure were.
... okay I'm not sure how you came up with the interpretation that everyone would hate an elite unit. I simply pointed out that elite units in the past have had their share of detractors and opponents for every person who supports them: SEAL Team Six for instance was heavily supported by the Special Operations Command and the Chief of Naval Operations (head of the US Navy) but the Navy SEAL community and the regular Navy both loved and hated them, so much so that they were eventually disbanded in 1991 (and reformed under another name).

I would like to point out, Keroko, that only you came up with the interpretation that I was saying that everyone would be hating RF6. You did not read my post fully. I said everyone who RF6 had made to look bad and who would be competing with RF6 would be hating them. Everybody else got the point except you, so IMO in this case it's your problem, not mine. I did not say that everybody would hate RF6, I was saying that everybody who RF6 made to look bad, or would be competing with, would hate them.

Quote:
Even though I am younger then you and most likely a lot more experienced in many software programs?

Suuuure Tk. Keep dreaming.
Chronological biological age being younger doesn't help the fact that you're the old maid of this group, Keroko.

Quote:
Uh-huh. Sure. Canon says its not armor. Then I suppose the fact that canon says that Subaru and Teana's Barrier Jackets are created for, and I quote, "high output and heavy armor" is all in my head then.
Depends on what it's meant by armor. Though IMO I think Subaru's "armor" would be more along the lines of magical protection; note that the drones are firing magical energy bolts, not physical attacks.

Quote:
So far 'plenty of people' has been limited to Regius, whereas the 'apreciation' part (sounds a bit more tame then wowed) got support of pretty much every character that apeared on screen. This is one of the things I'm talking about, canonically only a single person has been shown hating them, while everyone else was either impressed, happy with them or wowed by them. And yet because its realistic, canon must be twisted that 'plenty of people' have to resent them.
Keroko, again, LOOK UP AND READ MY EXAMPLES. We've only seen a fraction of people out there, and again, since in Comar's canon RF6 is taking on a lot of roles and responsibilities from other units, those units that have lost their missions are going to be very unhappy with RF6 stealing their jobs - it makes justifying their existence that much harder.

Quote:
Hmm, for me it was, and still is, mostly the jargon. As someone with little to no knowledge of the subject, its far more easy for me to go about it.
It's no different from the mentions of 40k making people who don't know anything about 40k going .

Edit:Wait, wait, wait, Comartemis. SAFA-like unit? Tactics and gear testing? DURANDAL?! TESTING?!

...there had BETTER be a hardsuit model called "Zenith". And you had better have a Belkan member named Hans Bosch! Maybe not Bosche, but you NEED the Zenith!
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Last edited by Wild Goose; 2008-06-16 at 11:34.
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Old 2008-06-16, 11:24   Link #1278
Kha
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Point to be made: we're mentally screening each other out, and so keep missing little details here and there, making communication almost pointless. I blame all the self-defence mechanisms acquired from battling trolls.

And it's taking 1 hr to load Kha's profile back online, so the link will come later...
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Old 2008-06-16, 11:27   Link #1279
Kagerou
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I like it much the same reason more so since some of my chars are fleshed out and modded Expies of Ace Combat Zero characters…
You just took the characters, TK; I took the whole fucking planet.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Also welcome too the new guy saw you pop into IRC tonight, but you didn't get to hang around much and we seem to have confused you with our Call of Duty 4 discussion. The IRC will for lack of an actual topic related to Nanoha to discuss tend to drift rather rapidly onto anything that interests a majority of the people present. If you acutally pose such a topic we'll usually snap back... usually. As Aaron said though IRC can be a nice place to get some quick feedback but a typed up and cohesive post combing it all into something whole is also important.
QFT. The IRC sometimes devolves into even more ridiculous topics.

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Originally Posted by Rayneing View Post
Why does this all sound suspiciously like Super Robot Wars? Heheh.
It's my fault for naming my fic Alpha?
If the standard is SRW, mine is SRWA, Kha's is SRWOG, and Kerokanon is... uh...

Kha, help?
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Old 2008-06-16, 11:37   Link #1280
Wild Goose
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Kerokanon is SRW K.

Also, heads up people, especially Kagerou: I predict the emergence of a hawt white-haired test pilot chick. Comar's bringing FM4's Durandal to his Comarcanon. We'll see how it goes...

Oh yeah, btw, there's a Front Mission 5 translation project ongoing. Interface is done, they're now working on story text and subtitles.

http://frontmission.info/wiki/pmwiki.../ProjectStatus

Ohya and if the hardsuits idea works out - though we need to see it in action, and comar needs to present it - I may in fact decided to bring in either Strike Wyverns or Barghest to his Comarcanon. We'll see. Olive branches are sprouting.
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