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Old 2008-08-06, 08:19   Link #81
whitepearl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amray View Post
I used to enjoy planning out and writing stories, although eventually I gave up. It did prove a lot harder than what one would think. I did hear that it was hard to write books from the words of authors, but I did not expect t'would be as hard as the way I found it. Their is a lot more to it than what one would assume.

I started writing two stories that caught my main attention, although after some planning and starts to the chapters I found myself quite...stuck as it were. I also have two more ideas for novels although it is too hard to put what I think and the actions in which the people are to take, into words. Two wonderful storys that I imagine all the time, but cannot type out due to my struggling of thoughtful phrases and words. I ditched the previous two ideas that I posessed and thought of two new ones. Ones in which were influenced by many things and I imagined to be wonderful, yet I have not started to type up or plan properly. One in which is mainly based on war, betrayal, a little romance, a 'lot' of drama, and revolves around one certain individual, an adolescent male, that is living through these certain events. I am always thinking about new parts and chapters in which would be great and add to the story.

If anyone actually reads this then thankyou. If you have any ideas in ways in which to help me then that would be greatly appreciated too. I have the basic plot anyhow, of the one I like the idea of best.
Hey, Amray, I had the same problems you had. I'd come up with decent ideas, start writing, but then I would hit a rut and then I'd end up giving up because I had no idea how to go on further. I knew how to get from point A to point B but I could never build a bridge sturdy enough to get to point B

Best advice I can give is not to give up. Just keep writing and keep a journal/log handy to jot down ideas that come up. By keeping track of other ideas, I think you will have a better guide for your story.

One thing you could try to do is come up with briefs about each character. Give yourself an idea of what direction you want their development to go. What are their motivations? What role do they play? What relationships do they have with each other? Using that information could help you come up with a direction for the overall plot. You could do it mentally as well but it could be a benefit to have it written down so you don't forget anything.

Hope this advice helped.
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Old 2008-08-06, 08:37   Link #82
Amray
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitepearl View Post
Hey, Amray, I had the same problems you had. I'd come up with decent ideas, start writing, but then I would hit a rut and then I'd end up giving up because I had no idea how to go on further. I knew how to get from point A to point B but I could never build a bridge sturdy enough to get to point B

Best advice I can give is not to give up. Just keep writing and keep a journal/log handy to jot down ideas that come up. By keeping track of other ideas, I think you will have a better guide for your story.

One thing you could try to do is come up with briefs about each character. Give yourself an idea of what direction you want their development to go. What are their motivations? What role do they play? What relationships do they have with each other? Using that information could help you come up with a direction for the overall plot. You could do it mentally as well but it could be a benefit to have it written down so you don't forget anything.

Hope this advice helped.
Thankyou, you understood me well. ^_^

I have identified a little on most of the characters, their personality, and their relationship towards one another. I have also basically planned out the entire story, events, occurances, even the huge and dramatic twist at the end. As you said, I really desperately need to write/type the basic events down so that I do not foeget them.

The idea for this novel has been going through my head for a very long time now so I have thought up a lot of the story and what route it takes. I want it to be quite a dark-themed thriller that all takes place in one horrible place which is like a faction of some kind. Have you read George Orwell's "1984"? I planned it out to have a similar effect that novel had with the same certian themes, which is a dystopian [society is a state in which the conditions of life are extremely bad, characterized by human misery, poverty, oppression, violence, disease, and/or pollution] and political story which is quite a lot like my idea exept mine is more of a thriller. I was not influenced from this book although it has the same type of atmosphere.

Planning is one thing and then actually writing it is another. As you said, it is a case of going from point A to point B, which can prove difficult. Nontheless thankyou for you wonderful support! I shall not stop and give up on this decent and well thought into idea so that it will go unnoiticed.
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Old 2008-08-06, 08:46   Link #83
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Nervous Venus, the excerpt you posted reminded me of something Raymond Carver wrote, titled "So Much Water So Close To Home." There is a part of that story that kind of reads similarly to what you posted: a husband sits reading a newspaper in the kitchen while his wife does the chores. The husband and wife have some sort of distance between them, as it has much to do with the husband's past.

Is "Marsha" supposed to symbolize anything? Interesting that the guy wants her dead, even though she is a fictional character in a fictional story within a fictional story.
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Old 2008-08-06, 08:55   Link #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amray View Post
Thankyou, you understood me well. ^_^

I have identified a little on most of the characters, their personality, and their relationship towards one another. I have also basically planned out the entire story, events, occurances, even the huge and dramatic twist at the end. As you said, I really desperately need to write/type the basic events down so that I do not foeget them.

The idea for this novel has been going through my head for a very long time now so I have thought up a lot of the story and what route it takes. I want it to be quite a dark-themed thriller that all takes place in one horrible place which is like a faction of some kind. Have you read George Orwell's "1984"? I planned it out to have a similar effect that novel had with the same certian themes, which is a dystopian [society is a state in which the conditions of life are extremely bad, characterized by human misery, poverty, oppression, violence, disease, and/or pollution] and political story which is quite a lot like my idea exept mine is more of a thriller. I was not influenced from this book although it has the same type of atmosphere.

Planning is one thing and then actually writing it is another. As you said, it is a case of going from point A to point B, which can prove difficult. Nontheless thankyou for you wonderful support! I shall not stop and give up on this decent and well thought into idea so that it will go unnoiticed.
I haven't read "1984," though I did read "Animal Farm."

I had an idea of writing something set in a futuristic setting, though not quite in a dystopian society, but with similar themes of people living in an environment where one giant entity controls almost everything. I don't know if I'll ever write this, whether as a novel (light, heavy, or graphic) or even as a comic.

The story I'm working on now (an excerpt is posted somewhere on page 4) was something I had started writing last year (while being in a depressed state after my birthday—how ironic) but the concept was being composed mentally at least six months prior. It has evolved a lot since then, starting out as being a comedy (in the mental states) to a depressed/psycho-analytical piece, to being a crude story involving sexually-charged and perverted teenagers, to being what it is now: a coming-of-age (I think) story about a boy and whether or not love can truly be rushed and forced. It's still very much a work in progress and I pray there doesn't come a day where I just curse aloud and start all over yet again...

It does help to have a plan B in case things go awry during the writing process. Sometimes things look good on first viewing but inconsistencies and other shortcomings reveal themselves through more careful inspections of the work. At least that is what I've found from my experiences.
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Old 2008-08-06, 16:43   Link #85
Nervous Venus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitepearl View Post
Nervous Venus, the excerpt you posted reminded me of something Raymond Carver wrote, titled "So Much Water So Close To Home." There is a part of that story that kind of reads similarly to what you posted: a husband sits reading a newspaper in the kitchen while his wife does the chores. The husband and wife have some sort of distance between them, as it has much to do with the husband's past.

Is "Marsha" supposed to symbolize anything? Interesting that the guy wants her dead, even though she is a fictional character in a fictional story within a fictional story.
Raymond Carver? This is strange. I've never read Carver before, but oddly enough Haruki Murakami - who I read religiously - used to translate Carver's short stories into Japanese. Maybe I sieved some of Carver through Murakami?

I was actually basing this scene on something that I experienced while living with my sister ( who writes for a living also), who was considering divorce at the time. I suppose that peaks my interest in Raymond Carver even more, as he can write so realistically.

I'm actually not sure about Marsha yet. Something about her ticks Will off, and the MC doesn't know why. I suppose this will have to explored later on. Any suggestions could be helpful (maybe she reminds him of his mother? = a neglectful past? = would explain his childish behavior?), as this story is still in the process of fleshing out.

Thanks a lot for your kind words. I posted this on a writing forum and a reviewer got irate with me, so I was really discouraged with posting anything ever again. He had a problem with the "rice cooking". He feels that I didn't cook the rice correctly, that I introduced the rice into the story only to have it disappear and it should have been burning, and was angry when I pointed out that I had the MC jab at the rice (to show she was still at it) and then turn the gas off the stove in the story. I really didn't think that it was important, as I wasn't focusing on this in the story, but maybe he's right.

If you, or any readers, feel that it was a bit confusing, any suggestions on how to make it less confusing would be nice.
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Old 2008-08-06, 19:38   Link #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nervous Venus View Post
Raymond Carver? This is strange. I've never read Carver before, but oddly enough Haruki Murakami - who I read religiously - used to translate Carver's short stories into Japanese. Maybe I sieved some of Carver through Murakami?
www, quite possibly

I read a bunch of Carver's stuff (and watched a biography about him) for this online class about short stories that I took in college.

A lot of his stories kinda have this grittiness to them...a lot of them feature every-day regular people...hardly anything with happy endings or with pleasant happiness...lots of his work was based on his personal experiences, iirc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nervous Venus View Post
I was actually basing this scene on something that I experienced while living with my sister ( who writes for a living also), who was considering divorce at the time. I suppose that peaks my interest in Raymond Carver even more, as he can write so realistically.
I think you'll like some of his writing, though it's no guarantee. As mentioned before, lots of his stuff features characters who don't have pleasant pasts or are going through tough times in the present.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nervous Venus View Post
I'm actually not sure about Marsha yet. Something about her ticks Will off, and the MC doesn't know why. I suppose this will have to explored later on. Any suggestions could be helpful (maybe she reminds him of his mother? = a neglectful past? = would explain his childish behavior?), as this story is still in the process of fleshing out.
There was something about her that kind of set off the light bulbs and switchboards in my head lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nervous Venus View Post
Thanks a lot for your kind words. I posted this on a writing forum and a reviewer got irate with me, so I was really discouraged with posting anything ever again. He had a problem with the "rice cooking". He feels that I didn't cook the rice correctly, that I introduced the rice into the story only to have it disappear and it should have been burning, and was angry when I pointed out that I had the MC jab at the rice (to show she was still at it) and then turn the gas off the stove in the story. I really didn't think that it was important, as I wasn't focusing on this in the story, but maybe he's right.

If you, or any readers, feel that it was a bit confusing, any suggestions on how to make it less confusing would be nice.
That other reader is picking at body hairs, imo.
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Old 2008-08-06, 21:39   Link #87
Nervous Venus
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Quote:
That other reader is picking at body hairs, imo.
He's a 40 years + culinary chef. He pulled out his credentials to prove that he knows his stuff about rice, lol, even though I'm asian and I cook it everyday. I guess he felt I was being really defensive by explaining to him why I wrote what I wrote. On the board they call that "debating with the reviewer", and I was warned against doing so. One mod called me arrogant and rude, and then two other mods stepped in to mediate (they both said that I meant no harm). You're supposed to thank them and say, " I will change that, " or " Thank you, but I think I'll go with what I have now," but you can't discuss why you wrote what you wrote because it sounds "defensive". It's like walking on egg shells.

It was just a really odd experience for me. So I backed out of the place immediately.

Quote:
As mentioned before, lots of his stuff features characters who don't have pleasant pasts or are going through tough times in the present.
Carver sounds even better. I don't want tragedies, though if it has to have a sad ending, I'd like to at least expect it, but this sounds like my cup of tea. Rarely do Haruki Murakami's characters have pleasant pasts and they are always going through difficult times in the present. They are also just everyday regular people, though some are, to his credit, very odd. I'll be looking in the bookshop online to find some of Raymond Carver's work
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Old 2008-08-31, 00:03   Link #88
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I guess we've all been so busy writing that no one's updated lol

After reading a fortune from a fortune cookie, I finally came up with a title for the story I've been working...hope whatever I write can mirror the theme I'll try to present...
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Old 2008-09-12, 12:14   Link #89
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Funny that people are talking about Raymond Carver, I just finished reading "Cathedral" by him (frankly, didn't think it was all that great, but...)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amray View Post
I used to enjoy planning out and writing stories, although eventually I gave up. It did prove a lot harder than what one would think. I did hear that it was hard to write books from the words of authors, but I did not expect t'would be as hard as the way I found it. Their is a lot more to it than what one would assume.

I started writing two stories that caught my main attention, although after some planning and starts to the chapters I found myself quite...stuck as it were. I also have two more ideas for novels although it is too hard to put what I think and the actions in which the people are to take, into words. Two wonderful storys that I imagine all the time, but cannot type out due to my struggling of thoughtful phrases and words. I ditched the previous two ideas that I posessed and thought of two new ones. Ones in which were influenced by many things and I imagined to be wonderful, yet I have not started to type up or plan properly. One in which is mainly based on war, betrayal, a little romance, a 'lot' of drama, and revolves around one certain individual, an adolescent male, that is living through these certain events. I am always thinking about new parts and chapters in which would be great and add to the story.

If anyone actually reads this then thankyou. If you have any ideas in ways in which to help me then that would be greatly appreciated too. I have the basic plot anyhow, of the one I like the idea of best.
It's amazing for me to read this because I have a very similar issue! I'm better at planning out then at actually writing it out. I plan out plot turns and twists, characters, and it seems just really wonderful in my head. It's more difficult to actually get it on paper. When I write it down, sometimes it's really great, sometimes I kind of lose the "magic". In a creative writing class I was told that many writers don't plan out at all, they just start writing. I think it depends on the kind of intelligence you have, some people are more 'big picture' others are more 'detail oriented'. I definitely would urge you to write these things out and not give up, because if you have the ideas in the first place, writing out is the kind of skill you get from practice. Having the ideas is the more difficult, original part, that can't be gotten from practice.
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Old 2008-09-12, 20:02   Link #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikoKikyo View Post
Funny that people are talking about Raymond Carver, I just finished reading "Cathedral" by him (frankly, didn't think it was all that great, but...)
Wow, I read that story for an online class. It was about this man's conversation with a blind guy his wife knows, right?

Our professor recommended we read the assigned stories at least twice—once to familiarize ourselves with it and repeated readings to pinpoint things we may have missed. A few of Carver's stories were three-read minimums for me...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikoKikyo View Post
It's amazing for me to read this because I have a very similar issue! I'm better at planning out then at actually writing it out. I plan out plot turns and twists, characters, and it seems just really wonderful in my head. It's more difficult to actually get it on paper. When I write it down, sometimes it's really great, sometimes I kind of lose the "magic". In a creative writing class I was told that many writers don't plan out at all, they just start writing. I think it depends on the kind of intelligence you have, some people are more 'big picture' others are more 'detail oriented'. I definitely would urge you to write these things out and not give up, because if you have the ideas in the first place, writing out is the kind of skill you get from practice. Having the ideas is the more difficult, original part, that can't be gotten from practice.
Too many times I've conceived of plot twists or story progression in my head that I thought were brilliant but the notions of brilliance wore off after a few days

I think I'm probably more of a detail-oriented writer; I always want to let people know what the characters look like, how they dress, what they do, what mannerisms they make, and so on.
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Old 2008-09-12, 23:51   Link #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitepearl View Post
Wow, I read that story for an online class. It was about this man's conversation with a blind guy his wife knows, right?
Yup, that's the one.

Quote:
Our professor recommended we read the assigned stories at least twice—once to familiarize ourselves with it and repeated readings to pinpoint things we may have missed. A few of Carver's stories were three-read minimums for me...
Did you read anything by him that you'd recommend? I have this giant anthology and it contains many of his stories...

Quote:
Too many times I've conceived of plot twists or story progression in my head that I thought were brilliant but the notions of brilliance wore off after a few days

I think I'm probably more of a detail-oriented writer; I always want to let people know what the characters look like, how they dress, what they do, what mannerisms they make, and so on.
Did you ever try writing down the plot twists/progressions before they wore off? (If so what happened?)
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Old 2008-09-13, 10:48   Link #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikoKikyo View Post
Did you read anything by him that you'd recommend? I have this giant anthology and it contains many of his stories...
I find Carver a bit too airy/vague/ abstract for me, even though a lot of people recommended him. I prefer Joyce Carol Oates, who is so-called the exact opposite in short story style.

That said though, I like some of his earlier stories like "Put Yourself in My Shoes", "Why Honey?" and a Chekhov-fronted story called "Errand".
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Old 2008-09-14, 06:29   Link #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikoKikyo View Post
Yup, that's the one.


Did you read anything by him that you'd recommend? I have this giant anthology and it contains many of his stories...
I though "So Much Water So Close To Home" was pretty good. I read two versions; one that was presumably the story Carver intended and another that was shorter and truncated. The two stories read differently, even though they are technically the same.

I guess what drew me to his writing was how the characters were everyday people—no fantasy elements or any deus-ex-machinae—but his stories aren't pleasant (not the kinds you want to read when you're feeling down) as his stories feature characters who either don't get along well with certain people ("Cathedral" or "A Small, Good Thing").

Do you have Where I'm Calling From or another anthology?

Quote:
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Did you ever try writing down the plot twists/progressions before they wore off? (If so what happened?)
I did write down potential twists and endings for stories I was working on but oftentimes I abandoned writing stories if they went in a direction I didn't like. It's probably because I'm too much of a perfectionist so whenever stories reached a point where I thought they were no longer good reads, I had a habit of just starting over. But I did have a notebook that had outlines of various characters, including notes about them.
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Old 2008-10-16, 12:33   Link #94
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Something I had written in 9th Grade : )

I seracheth Heaven, I seacheth Earth .

But I dont find thee anywhere.

Where shall I find thee I ask everyone, I get assured

I ask when,will I meet my wen

Is it today with the hopeful sunrise

Or shall it be tomorrow with dreamy sunset.

I question everyone, now and then.
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Old 2008-10-16, 17:42   Link #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geta Boshi View Post
I seracheth Heaven, I seacheth Earth .

But I dont find thee anywhere.

Where shall I find thee I ask everyone, I get assured

I ask when,will I meet my wen

Is it today with the hopeful sunrise

Or shall it be tomorrow with dreamy sunset.

I question everyone, now and then.
That’s very good! I used to write a lot of poems myself once. The only one I can remember is this one...

To my love,
Today the roses awoke,
Under the sun it’s noble glory.
I dreamt of you, a love so dear,
Who’s loveliness is beyond mortal words.
I’ll think of you when times are hard,
So your face blows away my tears.
Until such time we meet again,
My dreams will burden the years.

Yeah, it is ridiculously sentimental, but I was a young teenager, lol.
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Old 2008-10-16, 19:39   Link #96
Mystique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geta Boshi View Post
I seracheth Heaven, I seacheth Earth .

But I dont find thee anywhere.

Where shall I find thee I ask everyone, I get assured

I ask when,will I meet my wen

Is it today with the hopeful sunrise

Or shall it be tomorrow with dreamy sunset.

I question everyone, now and then.
curious...
Did that need to have some kind of ole english theme, or it was from your own initiative?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xvoki View Post
That’s very good! I used to write a lot of poems myself once. The only one I can remember is this one...

To my love,
Today the roses awoke,
Under the sun it’s noble glory.
I dreamt of you, a love so dear,
Who’s loveliness is beyond mortal words.
I’ll think of you when times are hard,
So your face blows away my tears.
Until such time we meet again,
My dreams will burden the years.

Yeah, it is ridiculously sentimental, but I was a young teenager, lol.
Classic love poem, very poignant
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Old 2008-10-16, 19:53   Link #97
Xvoki
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Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
Classic love poem, very poignant
Thanks! I was young and in love at the time. My first love, actually. I sent her that poem, but I never did say it was from me, in fact we never spoke. I was very shy back then.
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Old 2008-10-17, 15:43   Link #98
Nervous Venus
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I've never understood poetry, so I wouldn't be able to comment much on it. Only poetry I wrote I erased all the lines except for:

ilovehislove his blueeyes hislips i love / the way his kisses taste so sweet bitter sweet.

Apparently, this was the kind of crap poetry I wrote, so I tend to stick to short stories

Xvoki, I think being a young teenager in love brings out the most touching words. I guess it's because you're experiencing for the first time (or second or third, lol). I enjoyed your poem.
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Old 2008-10-17, 17:50   Link #99
Xvoki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nervous Venus View Post
I've never understood poetry, so I wouldn't be able to comment much on it. Only poetry I wrote I erased all the lines except for:

ilovehislove his blueeyes hislips i love / the way his kisses taste so sweet bitter sweet.

Apparently, this was the kind of crap poetry I wrote, so I tend to stick to short stories

Xvoki, I think being a young teenager in love brings out the most touching words. I guess it's because you're experiencing for the first time (or second or third, lol). I enjoyed your poem.
It’s a pity you erased the other lines in your poem. I would have liked to have read the rest of it.

Thanks, I‘m glad you liked mine! Unfortunately I’m an unlucky romantic. Hmm, this has got my mind juices flowing, maybe I should take up writing again, lol.
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Old 2008-10-17, 20:38   Link #100
shelter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geta Boshi View Post
I seracheth Heaven, I seacheth Earth .

But I dont find thee anywhere.

Where shall I find thee I ask everyone, I get assured

I ask when,will I meet my wen

Is it today with the hopeful sunrise

Or shall it be tomorrow with dreamy sunset.

I question everyone, now and then.
I know it's supposed to be a poem with a love theme, but it feels like you're talking about helpless, hopeless love here. After reading it, I felt drawn to the "now & then" ending, because it seems there's no conclusion. Which is good, because its a complicated thing you're talking about in just a few lines

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xvoki View Post
To my love,
Today the roses awoke,
Under the sun it’s noble glory.
I dreamt of you, a love so dear,
Who’s loveliness is beyond mortal words.
I’ll think of you when times are hard,
So your face blows away my tears.
Until such time we meet again,
My dreams will burden the years.
Simple, but not simplistic, and straightforward. Seeing this poem makes me miss the time when I could write with plain honesty about things without making it sound so intense.

I especially like the last 3 lines. The images - face/ tears/ dreams/ years - does feel a bit over-sentimental, but it's still a very strong collection of meanings.
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